[00:31] seele: is my power supply for my dell still there by you? [00:36] i think she is ignoring you [00:36] ignorning me [00:43] bug 226119 made me squirt my orange juice out of my nose [00:43] Launchpad bug 226119 in qt4-x11 "cannot start smplayer" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/226119 [00:44] which would have been a good thing except citric acid generally isn't nice to your nasal passage :( [00:44] (well, the last comment of said bug) [00:52] i want to know who the falks are. [00:52] or what. [00:54] Hobbsee: whit? [00:55] ;) [00:55] JontheEchidna: we've had that before, the qt with nessus doesn't have the same symbols as us [00:56] yeah, I've seen that too [01:15] sup guys! [01:52] i'm curious about how ubuntu checks upstream packages for security breaches. [01:52] for example, if we install chinese language support in ubuntu, "stardict" will be automatically installed. [01:53] stardict is maintained by someone in mainland china. he was my msn buddy and i know he is politically trustworthy, [01:53] Riddell: Would you mind doing binary New on mlt++. [01:53] but what if it's someone in china/russia we don't know? [01:54] <\sh> yao_ziyuan: who tells you that any dev/packager is political correct? Just because of the country he/she is living? [01:54] right [01:54] so is there any mechanism to check? [01:54] <\sh> yao_ziyuan: tbh, this thinking is so wrong... [01:55] tbh=? [01:55] to be honest [01:55] <\sh> to be honest [01:55] is there peer review of source code? [01:56] <\sh> the community [01:56] but it is possible that stardict's source code is never reviewed by someone else? [01:57] because it's not a standard component [01:57] it is only installed when chinese language support is enabled. [01:57] <\sh> yes...but that could happen to openoffice as well [01:58] yao_ziyuan: It's free software, the source is available so anyone can review it. [01:58] so it's easier to plant a backdoor in open source projects than in wikipedia [01:58] I don't think that follows. [01:58] *than to vandalize in wikipedia [01:59] Actually it's quite trivial to get false information into Wikipedia. It just needs to be on an obscure topic. [01:59] in wikipedia, if an article is of little interest to the public and is not watched by anyone, then it's very likely that vandalism to it is not caught. [01:59] <\sh> yao_ziyuan: yes and no...using windows, you already have backdoors you don't know...but [02:00] Right, commercial software vendors outsource coding to all kinds of places and there is no way to know or check. [02:00] <\sh> I don't know any source which was doing something nasty and wasn't revelead in no time [02:00] i do believe microsoft reviews every line of code [02:01] yao_ziyuan: Why do you believe that? [02:01] And how do you know what they review it for? [02:01] microsoft easily has money to hire people to do the review [02:01] Your definition and theirs of acceptable might be widely different. [02:01] Microsoft is in the business of making profits. [02:02] It's not in their interest to spend more on code than they need to. [02:02] ok [02:03] <\sh> yao_ziyuan: why do you think it's so difficult for the EU government to get hands on the source of MS Windows? (actually theyhave now for a good bunch of the code, but not all, especially the cryptographic stuff is problematic) [02:03] ok skip microsoft [02:04] Today almost all large commercial software development is done by doing the design and specifications in house and outsourcing the actual code to the lowest bidder. [02:04] I've done consulting work for one large anti-spam vendor that did all their coding in the Ukraine. [02:04] ok, let's focus on the original problem [02:05] <\sh> we hire nearshoring companies from romania [02:05] if we have a malicious author [02:05] who creates and maintains a package [02:05] the packages seems to work fine [02:05] and ubuntu includes it [02:05] and even installs it by default [02:05] But someone has to decide to include it. [02:06] If it's installed by default (in Main) there is at least some security audit done. [02:06] someone decides to include it because it seems useful and working [02:06] good to hear that [02:06] Gotta go put a kid to bed. Back in a bit. [02:06] gotta sleep [02:12] If I lived in China, I'd be nervous too. [02:12] ScottK-laptop: glad our little one finally sleeps more than 2 hours at night [02:13] ;-) [02:13] Our 'little one' is now 5, so it's a different set of excitments. [02:14] I know (:) [02:14] I'm more used to be with kids than babies [02:17] <\sh> don't make me nervous...I need my sleep...at least I won't get it in less then 5 months ,-) [02:20] Bawah-ha-ha-ha-ha! [02:20] ^^ is an evil laugh if you can't tell. [02:20] <\sh> hmm...I got that ,-) [02:20] kids... [02:21] <\sh> if my son will be born around the release time of jaunty...he will be nicknamed "jaunty" and it will be written in his identity card [02:22] Who's the Kubuntu person going to https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/ubuntu-hotkey-madness [02:22] \sh: as your grandmother/-father I don't approve that [02:22] <\sh> Tm_T: hehe [02:22] \sh: No Jackalope tatoos. [02:23] <\sh> ScottK: oh...no...but there will be a tatoo..on my arm..with the name of our offspring :) [02:25] I'm cool with that. [02:25] Just keep in mind you may have more than one, so consider room for expansion so the later ones don't feel left out. [02:26] Not kidding on that one, BTW. One of my wife's brothers didn't think that through very well. [02:27] <\sh> ScottK: my back has enough room for more then two or four ;) [02:28] <\sh> and oh...I did something right...my nfs filestores with drbd and heartbeat were surving a kernel update === _neversfelde is now known as neversfelde [04:15] can some one help with a question... I am trying to install mono on kubuntu and getting errors... [04:30] Not very patient these mono folks. [04:38] <\sh> grmpf...fcked up while working on cisco access lists... === vore is now known as erov [05:34] ScottK-laptop: mlt approved [05:35] Riddell: Thanks. I think I can do kdenlive up to a KDE4 version now. [05:36] awooga [05:36] hey Riddell [05:38] evening NCommander [05:38] NCommander: coming for a swim? [05:38] no swim trunks [05:38] nobody's looking [05:38] I'm mulling for sleep [05:41] a bit cold for a swim [05:41] the cold makes it nice [05:42] Riddell, who else is going to go swim? [05:43] Did Hobbsee get thrown in the pool yet? [05:43] Perhaps it's seele's turn this time. [05:43] no [05:43] on both counts [05:43] If Hobbsee is going to get thrown in the pool, I'll go down [05:43] That would be worth watching [05:44] I'm currently enjoying mythbusters [05:44] NCommander: Got some time for an FTBFS? It's even in Universe so you can upload it ... [05:44] Maybe [05:44] I'm kinda burnt at the moment, but I can add it to my queue [05:44] It's mlt. Seems to have died on quite a number of archs. [05:44] NCommander: she says she may put her feet in .. i dunno about the pool throwing bit though [05:45] Wait [05:45] Soemthing just authed as me ... [05:45] O_o; [05:46] o_o; [05:47] seele, Riddell, I'll be down in about ten minutes when I change and finish seeing if a radar can cook a turkey [05:47] NCommander: i'm not going down :) [05:48] seele, you don't even want to join us around the pool? [05:49] NCommander: not after i see you throw people in [05:49] I don't throw people in [05:49] I just watch and laugh [05:52] oh, so people are going swimming? [05:52] I was contemplating it, at some point [05:53] Hobbsee, it would be interesting to see [05:53] I just watched a turkey denotate [05:53] NCommander: what, me swimming? [05:53] er, why? [05:54] Hobbsee, no, just seeing people downstairs being social. Cause, you know, being social is cool [05:54] * NCommander is half-awake and fairly easy to confuse at the moment [05:54] as for exploding turkeys [05:54] Well, why not? [06:01] there is that [11:19] http://forum.kde.org/gwenview-save-as-problem-t-19263.html#pid24568 -- would be a bug? [12:24] hi there [12:58] aww crap kwin is using 80% cpu [12:59] i better reboot or something, the laptop's fan is going nuts [13:16] nice.. and now suspend to ram won't work in jaunty :( [13:16] cbr: You can sudo pm-suspend. That still works. [13:17] cbr: kpowersave does as well. Every other GUI seems to be broken though. [13:22] nope, sudo pm-suspend doesnt work [13:22] the screen goes black as if it's going to suspend [13:22] but then suddenly the picture reappears [13:25] i dont remember updating anything power-management related [13:25] ugh.. [13:27] this is rather frustrating.. will power management ever work fine on linux [13:27] cbr: Apparently ubuntu policy requires two power managment breakages per release. [13:28] lol [13:28] jtechidna: Three for Kubuntu. [13:28] i dont know, my mum has ubuntu on her laptop, seemed to look well, i think kde is the problem child [13:29] *seemed to work well [13:29] cbr: Well, ubuntu and kde do not really go well together IMHO. ubutu has a very gnomish base:-( [13:29] of course :P [13:30] well, i'd use debian but debian doesnt ship new kde packages as fast as kubuntu.. or puts them in the experimental repo which is somewhat annoying to use [13:31] altogether, debian gave me a more solid experience though.. maybe not shipping the new stuff, is why :p [13:31] why can't we have the good from both worlds [13:31] cbr: Yeap, I've been entertaining the thought of heading back to debian for a while now. [13:31] cbr: Just don't find the time to actually pull it through... [13:34] it sucks that no major distribution is behind kde [13:34] that would probably move things in the right direction a lot faster [13:35] but i guess i can understand their motives as well.. they need a stable system, nothing too fancy, kind of like winxp.. something they can develop for and not worry that their code will be redundant in two years time [13:35] and gnome is good for that [13:35] cbr: Which release are you one? [13:35] cbr: Sucks much more that the gnomes come up with lots of really bad interfaces all the time:-( [13:35] ScottK-laptop: jaunty [13:36] cbr: network-manager, pulseaudio and other useless stuff. [13:36] cbr: It's really not actually expected to work very well at the moment. If you want working, run Intrepid (or even Hardy). [13:36] ScottK-laptop: Those are no fun and all the packages are outdated anyway:-( [13:36] yeah, if i'd want something stable and productive, i'd use windows :p [13:36] i want the action :p [13:37] Apropos pulseaudio: Why is that started in kubuntu? Breaks phonon here... [13:37] dunno, network-manager seems to Just Work (tm) [13:37] they sodomized the kde interface though [13:37] so i'm using the gnome systray applet [13:37] which works fine [13:38] hunger: You can't have it both bleeding edge and stable. [13:38] cbr: nm has really *CRAPPY* interfaces. [13:38] you mean the user interface? [13:38] cbr: No, the programmers interfaces. D-Bus in that case. [13:38] oh, i don't care much for that :p [13:38] the gui is nice [13:39] ScottK-laptop: I am not complaining too loudly about something breaking. Just told cbr how I work around the problem he has as well. [13:39] OK. [13:39] cbr: Well, it is so ugly that the kde guys wrote solid so they had not to deal with it... [13:40] cbr: actually that is only part of the reason for solid of course. [13:40] uhuh.. but nothing uses solid to control it.. the only useful thing that has come of the solid nm thingy is that apps are aware when the network is up [13:40] but there's no control interface [13:40] which is kind of the point of nm [13:41] that's because suse doesn't need a nm interface until they release the next opensuse :P [13:41] (a nm interface for KDE4) [13:41] oh well, at least one will be ready for Jaunty [13:42] Well, there is a plasmoid in kde 4.2 for solid/nm AFAIK. [13:42] that's a bit sad if you start to think about it.. KDE4 was released in jan 2008, will it be functional by jan 2009? i wouldn't bet money on it? by jan 2010? i would bet like 5 bucks on it but then it has been out for 2 years already.. that's like a lifetime [13:43] not that it wasn't a welcome development and a necessary step and kde4 looks awesome an all [13:44] and* [13:44] cbr: Will would have made much better progress if NM wouldn't suck so hard:-) [13:45] cbr: NM-applet only works since it is the demo app the NM guys keep up to date IMHO. [13:45] Well, don't take me too seriously... I am stuck over my head in gnome "technology" and hate it. So my outlook is a bit negative at this time:-) [13:46] cbr: Put it a different way ... KDE4 has been being developed for ~ 3 years and is already a big step forward. MS took 5 years to make Vista and take a step back. [13:46] In the scheme of things, I think KDE does pretty good. [13:47] yes, but some of the developments are rather peculiar.. [13:48] for example strigi, nepomuk etc.. oh goodie, i can rank my files (dont know why i would want to do that but i can) but i can't connect to a wireless network nor control my display power management properly (up until 4.2) [13:49] Oddly enough, both those things work pretty much fine for me. [13:50] to be fair that's a narrow view of the purposes of those two frameworks are. Most of what they are purposed to do still hasn't been fully implemented yet ( [13:50] see also: semantic desktop) [13:50] is that all the tagging stuff? [13:51] yeah, the base framework is there but there's not really any useful way to use the info [13:51] e.g. search integration into kfind or semantic browsing in dolphin [13:51] that's another thing i dont get.. i know all the computer scientists like to play around with tags, rdf etc.. but i have never ever seen anybody actually tag their files.. except on youtube or flickr where it makes sense [13:52] when I have a load of papers to read, I tag them as 'read' after I'm done, so at least one person does :) [13:53] it is also assuming that developers are absolutely fungible resources. The nepomuk dev is working on grant money to develop semantic/rdf technologies, and is by no means an expert in developing network manager type interfaces (not that he couldn't be if he wanted to) [13:53] he is pursuing his hobby/job by developing nepomuk, and he probably wouldn't be working on nm even if he wasn't working on nepomuk [13:54] though he probably would be working on the KDE4 k3b port :P [13:54] (since he's k3b's author also) [13:55] So yes, it's a bit frustrating when some areas are overlooked, but there's no simple solution or cause for blame [13:55] yeah, a lot of thought was put to get the frameworks there.. but the apps on them were kind of completely forgotten [13:56] not to blame the developers who did hard work, but that's how it is, there's no denying that [13:56] and i really like kde, so that saddens me a bit [13:57] cbr: You're judging the building half built and complaining the top half isn't built yet. [13:59] hey, i was handed an apartment in that building and allowed to move in [13:59] aren't i kind of entitled then? :p [13:59] are you paying rent? :P [14:00] no, does that mean instead of stairs i should be happy with a nailon rope? ;) [14:00] cbr: It means if you don't like the nylon rope you shouldn't have moved in. [14:00] *nylon probably [14:00] KDE3 is around and still quite usable. [14:01] We updated Kubuntu Hardy to 3.5.10 post release exactly because not everyone will want to be on KDE4 yet. [14:01] but my real estate agent said it was ready so i was happy to move into a modern house from the rather tasteless one i was living in [14:02] We rather explicitly said KDE 4 is not for everyone yet, so I don't buy that analogy. [14:04] well, to be honest, that was said after the first disappointing reviews of the soon-to-be-released 4.0 were coming out.. and nobody said that about 4.1 [14:04] i'm not blaming again, i just feel like arguing at the moment :p [14:07] cbr: I disagree. [14:08] cbr: Our release announcement explicitly says you may not want to upgrade: http://www.kubuntu.org/month/2008/10 [14:09] yeah, i know kubuntu did, i was talking about upstream [14:09] kubuntu made the best of the situation, i imagine [14:09] Unless you're installing from their tarballs, I don't think that's really relevant. [14:11] i tend to think of distributions as binary repositories.. the thought of them actually being separate OSes with release cycles etc is kind of strange to me [14:12] Well we do a lot of integration work here that gives a more polished product. [14:12] maybe that's because i started off with gentoo and that pretty much didnt have releases, they were basically just snapshots of the current tree.. i'm a spoilt child :p [14:13] anyway, i'm hungry, i hope the shop has some of that delicious tuna salad [14:13] bye [14:19] So the bottom line of that conversation was, "Like wow, you guys actually do stuff"? [14:22] i think it was "why isn't jaunty released yet?" [14:25] I want the very latest and I want it to be polished, stable, and complete. [14:26] i blame google [14:27] they broke the meaning of the word "beta", causing people to expect pre-release code to be complete & polished [14:27] I think we're very lucky that KDE3 got to the point where an svn snapshot could be considered polished, stable, and complete in the first place [14:32] I recall about 10 years ago being in a meeting where we were reviewing the status of a program. [14:33] I mentioned to the program manager that there is an old program management saying, "Better, cheaper, faster: Pick two" and I thought he just had (cheaper, faster). [14:33] He told me that no, he'd figured out how to do all three. [14:33] About a year later the program was cancelled because there was no way it could meet its objectives. [14:35] Heh, [14:36] Riddell: what was i pinging pinotree for again? [15:01] jtechidna: Got time to look at a Cmake problem for me? [15:03] If you do, please grab http://debian-multimedia.org/pool/main/k/kdenlive/kdenlive_0.7-0.0.dsc (You'll have to adjust the libavcodec-dev and libavformat-dev versions for our ffmpeg versioning) and tell me why it can't find MLT? [15:03] Good morning NCommander. [15:04] Morning Scottk [15:04] * NCommander is dry from yesterday! [15:04] Got time for a bit of revu hackery? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/?archive=4208 [15:04] sure [15:04] REVU just gave me a traceback ... [15:05] Right. That's the problem. [15:05] Oh, I thought it required reviewing [15:05] I don't have a REVU installation locally [15:06] Well it's apparently broken'ish and RainCT isn't around, so I'm looking at you. [15:06] * ScottK-laptop gets more coffee .... [15:11] * hunger hates debugging kparts. [15:11] coffee.. [15:15] seele: okular window opens in alternate sizes [15:15] Riddell: kde4 beta? [15:16] yes [15:16] beta 1 or beta 2? [15:16] beta 1 [15:16] worth checking on a computer that isn't me though [15:16] hmm.. tonio has it installed, we can look on it [15:17] i can't risk running beta on my work laptop.. i wish there was a way to create an additional kde installation like neon [15:17] chroot [15:18] what's that? [15:19] seele: chroot moves / into some subdir. [15:20] seele: You can install e.g. a new ubuntu with kde 4.2 into /home/test and then chroot into that dir. [15:20] waiting until i get home and use my test machine sounds easier [15:21] seele: tse, tse, tse. All those young people don't know their unix anymore and don't want to learn it either;-) [15:22] seele, do you use vm's? as you can install a test image into a vm via virtualbox (its quite easy) [15:23] rgreening: Why a VM when a chroot is enough? VMs are much slower. [15:23] rgreening: ah, yeah.. i guess i can do that.. can you install just from an iso file isntead of burning it to CD? [15:24] hunger: because clicking VirtualBox is easier than sysasmin black magic [15:24] hunger: vm isn't actually that much slower, and allows saving states to test and rollback, etc [15:24] *sysadmin [15:24] seele: yes [15:24] seele: Yes, you can ask virtualbox to mount a iso image and to present it as a CD. [15:25] * rgreening likes voodoo black magic and black magic chocolates [15:25] rgreening: snapshots are indeed a good reason to prefer VMs:-) [15:25] :P [15:26] rgreening: Of course you can do the same at least on FS level with a bit of LVM magic for chroots:-) [15:26] hunger: if you have lots of time to waste [15:26] But keep in mind you're talking to a usability engineer, not a professional sysadmin. [15:27] * rgreening likes quick and simple [15:27] ScottK: Actually most professional sysadmins I know don't know how to do LVM snapshots either:-( [15:29] rgreening: Would you do me a favor and go through https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-sru/+bugs?field.bug_reporter=jr and tag them all verification-done instead of verification needed? [15:29] rgreening: Since I did the 'works for me' comment, I think someone else should tag them. [15:29] Once that's done, I'll lean on pitti to copy them to -updates. [15:30] * rgreening looks [15:31] * seele packs up and heads to breakfast [15:31] MM BREAKFAST [15:31] sorry for the caps [15:31] ScottK: you mean update to Fix Committed? in the status? [15:32] rgreening: No. Change the tag from verification-needed to verification-done. [15:32] hmm... I dont see where to change the tag. [15:32] https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kdeaccessibility/+bug/299498/+edit [15:32] Launchpad bug 299498 in kdeaccessibility "4.1.3 SRU" [Undecided,Fix committed] [15:33] Click where it says Update description/tags right below the description. [15:33] ah.. now I see [15:34] * ScottK notes that he's filed bugs about that being obscure. [15:34] ScottK: I'll take care of it [15:34] yes, it is obscure [15:34] rgreening: Thanks. Let me know when you're done and I'll chase after pitti. [15:34] * rgreening off for food [15:34] ScottK: np [15:37] * Jucato powerpokes Hobbsee, jjesse-dell9, and nixternal >:) [15:38] hello, anyone knows where to find a kde4 python api description? [15:38] oh wait, sorry Hobbsee, you shoujld be asleep :P [15:38] sikor_sxe: api.kde.org [15:39] Riddell: well, that's the c++ api :/ [15:40] Riddell: ahh [15:40] found it, thx [15:56] i have problems connecting a kio::job's signal with a slot in python [15:56] http://pastebin.com/m1f8f4df1 [15:58] what could be missing [15:58] sikor_sxe: How about http://www.riverbankcomputing.co.uk/software/pykde/intro [15:58] See the links on that page. [15:59] i know the page, it does not cover kde tho [15:59] kde4 [15:59] Right. Sorry. Just KDE3 there. [16:00] * jtechidna was at the dentist's office [16:00] * Jucato sees clones and waves :) [16:00] ScottK: I can't take a look at it for a while, I'm on a Fedora machine atm [16:01] Sysinfo for 'lockjaw': Linux 2.6.22.5-76.fc7 running KDE 3.5.7-21.fc7 Fedora, CPU: Intel(R) Pentium(R) M processor 1.60GHz at 1600 MHz (3190 bogomips), HD: 72/145GB, RAM: 1235/1264MB, 137 proc's, 2.44h up [17:00] Nightrose: ping [17:02] hmm since 8.10 the stuff installed via build-dep is put on the autoremove list [17:06] Riddell and seele: it has been requested that I let you both know that you need to do an interview...I finished mine, now it is your turn! [17:07] Nightrose: hmm? [17:08] er.. [17:08] nixternal: hmm? [17:08] nixternal: doc team needed in albor [17:11] seele: my flight is 10PM, and wondering if 7:30 - 7:45 pickup time is appropriate fore schedule super shuttle [17:12] rgreening: sure.. fine with me [17:13] k [17:14] is that going to be enough time for you? [17:25] seele, booked and confirmed for 7-7:15PM Friday. [17:25] Riddell: on my way over to albor now [17:25] talk to evan if he's still there [17:26] rgreening: kk, sounds good [17:26] yeah, hes still here [17:26] rgreening: Are you leaving Sunday? [17:26] * Riddell spots "Make Rosetta attractive for upstreams", would a lynch mob be un-quakerly? [17:27] * seele raises an eyebrow [17:29] upstreams want to lynch us for using rosetta ourselves [17:29] exactly [17:30] All we need now is a track of every single KDe developer laughing their asses off [17:33] rgreening: Nevermind, should have read that better. [17:43] seele: pong [17:47] seele: having dinner now - back in an hour or so [17:52] Riddell: talking about font config and theyre asking me questions about what kde does.. dunno if you should be here instead :P [17:54] seele: kcmshell4 fonts [17:54] for being Google, their public wireless stinks! [17:54] that's deliberate [17:54] Nightrose: ah.. i was asking if you know about how to fix the kickoff menu in neon it's empty [17:55] Riddell: mvo is hoping for a Kubuntu person in foundations to talk automatic codec install. [17:55] Riddell: uhm.. [17:55] everyone wants me [17:55] * seele tries to pay attention [17:56] Send rgreening. [17:58] kde rev 895766 [17:58] ubottu: bot!!! [17:58] Sorry, I don't know anything about bot!!! [17:58] -.- [17:59] stdin: the revision stuff is b0rked :( [18:05] aha, so that's what the problem with iPod support was [18:05] ScottK: when I update the tag, should I add a comment? [18:05] always [18:06] nixternal: that directed to me? [18:06] rgreening: Make some generic comment about it being verified. [18:06] kk [18:06] Try to make it at least slightly different from mine. [18:07] rgreening: yes [18:12] !vistalover [18:12] Sorry, I don't know anything about vistalover [18:12] !visternal [18:12] Oh no! The pointy-clicky Vista lover has arrived! He's rumoured to be giving out free money, too! [18:12] he's back to using KDE, too... [18:12] Is his month of purgatory over? [18:13] I HAVE ALWAYS USED KDE!!! [18:13] ScottK-laptop: no, it seems he's violated it. [18:13] You only react so strongly because it's true. [18:13] Hobbsee: you are sitting next to me, talking vista trash, yet you are stickless...I think that is even scarrier since I think you could fit inside of one of my shoes :p [18:14] no, my stick is just hidden.... [18:14] !vistalover is nixternal [18:14] I'll remember that, Hobbsee [18:14] oh man [18:14] :P [18:14] * ScottK-laptop tries. [18:14] nixternal. [18:15] !nixternal [18:15] Oh no! The pointy-clicky Vista lover has arrived! He's rumoured to be giving out free money, too! [18:15] * ScottK-laptop was hoping she'd aranged it to go off every time his nick was mentioned. [18:15] ha [18:15] crimsun: when I come in to MD/DC in the next month or so, remind me not to let ScottK-laptop know :p [18:15] now there's an idea... [18:16] nixternal: youre coming to visit? whoo [18:16] nixternal: why the hell are you coming when it's cold? [18:16] ya, probably spend a few days out east [18:16] seele: He's in Chicago, so it's warmer here. [18:16] hahaha [18:16] ScottK-laptop: actually we found out DC was colder than Chicago earlier this week [18:16] ScottK-laptop: it was warmer there last week :) [18:16] though we have over a foot of snow now [18:16] yeah.. you win [18:17] Rain here today. [18:17] Riddell: so theyre talking about removing the fontselector defaults and requiring the user to config hinting, etc. [18:17] because i guess there is a bug they cant find and they have users complaining about the defaults [18:18] there is also a problem with firefox in gnome because gnome uses pango and ff uses fontselector and there is some bug they couldnt find that changes the hinting in firefox [18:19] what do you mean by fontselector defaults? [18:19] seele: funny you say that...with my gnome desktop at home, I have to admit, the fonts really suck...I totally love my font control in KDE 4...that is one thing I get the most compliments on at work actually...the KDE 4 fonts looking secksi [18:19] uhhh [18:19] Riddell: i guess there are some default set for the different types of hinting and stuff? [18:19] Riddell: this is why you should have been here :P [18:19] Qt4 font hinting is supposed to be broken :P [18:20] (and fixed for Qt 4.5 or so) [18:20] Riddell: please tell cprov that a "delete all packages" feature would be very appreciated for PPAs, makes loads of sense for updates-testing [18:20] compared to windows fonts on my laptop, qt is doing excelent ;) [18:20] i get rainbow effect in windows [18:20]