| newz2000 | quiet room lately | 15:24 |
|---|---|---|
| newz2000 | I went to a drupal training seminar last week and learned a lot | 15:24 |
| newz2000 | Canonical hired the person who is in charge of visual appearance (cf: mark's blog post about making Ubuntu prettier than OS X) | 15:25 |
| newz2000 | if you were at UDS you may have met him, his name is Julian (Hubbard may be his last name) | 15:25 |
| nand | I were at his presentation (like everyone else), *sounds* promising | 15:25 |
| nand | now I'm looking at the actual results | 15:26 |
| newz2000 | cool, I've hardly spoken with him so I'm eager to see action | 15:26 |
| newz2000 | there's a job post for my team for a web *designer* http://webapps.ubuntu.com/employment/canonical_WD/ | 15:26 |
| nand | I have always been a bit skeptical on designers speaking a lot too much :) | 15:26 |
| newz2000 | in London though :-/ | 15:26 |
| nand | designer I am not at all! | 15:27 |
| newz2000 | nand: the difference between Julian and most designers is that he's been given authority by Mark S | 15:27 |
| nand | that is why I'm now eagerly waiting for the results :) | 15:27 |
| newz2000 | We released the module for launchpad auth in drupal | 15:28 |
| newz2000 | (for Drupal 5, not ready for D6) | 15:28 |
| newz2000 | that was last monday | 15:28 |
| nand | yep, I have hacked it and submitted patches for a migration process | 15:28 |
| nand | that, we really need | 15:28 |
| nand | on the other side, the team plugin seems a bit broken, hadn't had the time to debug it yet | 15:29 |
| nand | got locked out of my admin rights as soon as I activated it ^_^ | 15:29 |
| newz2000 | oh? Interesting | 15:29 |
| newz2000 | I've been using it on two sites very nicely, but just yesterday I too got locked out. | 15:29 |
| nand | My guess is it just erases roles, not merge them | 15:29 |
| newz2000 | it does not modify the roles, yo uhave to map teams to roles | 15:30 |
| nand | temporary solution is to log in using user uid 1 or disable the module in DB | 15:30 |
| newz2000 | oh, maybe not the same prob, I can't even log in as uid 1 | 15:30 |
| nand | (not tested first solution, just a guess, used second solution :) ) | 15:30 |
| newz2000 | I do like the team/roles mapping a lot | 15:32 |
| nand | so will I! | 15:32 |
| nand | btw | 15:32 |
| nand | I heard you need to be marked on LP so that your website can receive these infos? | 15:32 |
| newz2000 | if you file a bug in ubuntu-website I get it | 15:33 |
| newz2000 | if it's outside of that project you may need to mark me | 15:33 |
| nand | ? | 15:33 |
| newz2000 | (I'm also default for canonical-website) | 15:33 |
| newz2000 | oh | 15:33 |
| newz2000 | sorry, mis-understood your question | 15:33 |
| newz2000 | do you mean you need group membership in launchpad? | 15:34 |
| nand | I mean, I heard that in order the team plugin to work, you need to register your website somewhere? | 15:34 |
| newz2000 | oh. I thought that was not necessary now, but here's how to tell... | 15:34 |
| nand | I just heard that, not checked myself | 15:34 |
| newz2000 | you try to login and the only data launchpad sends back is the openidurl. If lp tells you that it's sending your userid and/or email address that you're fine | 15:35 |
| nand | so far, I only get the login, not the email | 15:37 |
| newz2000 | so it sends 'nand' back to the website or only the openid url? | 15:37 |
| nand | 'nand' | 15:37 |
| newz2000 | then you're set I believe. Let me ask stuartm real quick. | 15:38 |
| nand | but ok, I know that you need to be registered somewhere to have mails too. The question is : do we need some similar case of registration for the LP teams plugin to work? | 15:38 |
| nand | boredandblogging: heya! | 15:39 |
| boredandblogging | nand: hey, how are you? | 15:40 |
| nand | still at work for now... | 15:40 |
| nand | just so that you can take time to critisize my quick mockup meanwhile : http://www.ndeschildre.net/downloads/UBnews.html | 15:41 |
| nand | newz2000: ^ | 15:41 |
| nand | very quick one, with a few of the ideas I had | 15:42 |
| newz2000 | ah, that was you | 15:42 |
| nand | please don't bite! :) | 15:42 |
| nand | me? | 15:42 |
| newz2000 | btw, stuart says you need to register the site's "trustroot" which is in the docs. | 15:43 |
| nand | trustroot... okay, I'll see that | 15:44 |
| newz2000 | so are we having our meeting now or are we doing it later? | 15:44 |
| * nand is still at work | 15:44 | |
| newz2000 | ok | 15:44 |
| nand | I'll much prefer having it once I'm back home | 15:44 |
| newz2000 | sure, do you have a time in mind? | 15:45 |
| nand | 19 UTC, still okay? | 15:45 |
| boredandblogging | 19 UTC is fine with me | 15:45 |
| newz2000 | sounds good to me | 15:45 |
| nand | good | 15:45 |
| newz2000 | I need to make a trip to the passport office, apparently mine looks tampered with. | 15:46 |
| newz2000 | it got wet. | 15:46 |
| newz2000 | -$100 | 15:46 |
| newz2000 | :-( | 15:46 |
| boredandblogging | newz2000: did you have trouble with it when travelling? | 15:46 |
| newz2000 | no, I was in the US so my driver's license worked | 15:46 |
| boredandblogging | right | 15:47 |
| newz2000 | but I may have to go to London at the start of the year which will be a problem. | 15:47 |
| boredandblogging | oooh | 15:47 |
| boredandblogging | newz2000: there was an email on -news-team yesterday started by james westby about the calendar stuff | 15:47 |
| boredandblogging | I added you to it | 15:48 |
| boredandblogging | can you reply to it? | 15:48 |
| boredandblogging | think I've got everyone thinking about it at this point :-P | 15:48 |
| * newz2000 looks for it | 15:48 | |
| newz2000 | oh, filed under fridge | 15:50 |
| * newz2000 replies | 15:50 | |
| boredandblogging | newz2000: thanks | 15:50 |
| boredandblogging | is it me or is it very hard to find well designed news sites? | 16:54 |
| nand | lemonde.fr ? france24.com ? | 16:59 |
| nand | okay, let's keep that for in two hours :) | 16:59 |
| boredandblogging | nand: I do like the layout of france24.com | 17:06 |
| nand | a problem common to lots of these news websites is : ads everywhere | 17:07 |
| newz2000 | well, instead of comparing to other news sites, ask what is the goal and who is the user | 17:08 |
| newz2000 | we may have different goals than other sites | 17:08 |
| * nand is going back home | 17:21 | |
| === Turl1 is now known as Turl | ||
| newz2000 | boredandblogging: I'm heading out the door a few min later than I expected, when nand comes back if I'm not back yet for our meeting I'll be only moments away | 18:00 |
| newz2000 | (passport office is 10m away and I have the paper work already) | 18:00 |
| newz2000 | cutting it close but should be back on time | 18:00 |
| nand | re! | 18:30 |
| nand | newz2000, boredandblogging: whenever you want | 18:30 |
| newz2000 | ok, I'm back earlier than I expected... fail on the passport :-( | 18:31 |
| nand | forgot some paper? | 18:31 |
| newz2000 | yeah | 18:31 |
| newz2000 | try again tomorrow | 18:31 |
| boredandblogging | i'm ready as well | 18:44 |
| newz2000 | ok boredandblogging, nand, lets go | 18:45 |
| newz2000 | who wants to start? | 18:45 |
| boredandblogging | nand: ping | 18:46 |
| nand | yep, I'm here! | 18:46 |
| boredandblogging | so let me start | 18:46 |
| boredandblogging | the audience for the website | 18:46 |
| boredandblogging | basically, cover inter, intra, and external communication | 18:47 |
| boredandblogging | I place for teams to post things that members of their own teams want/need to know | 18:47 |
| boredandblogging | a place for locos to share their experiences doing things | 18:47 |
| boredandblogging | and show off what they have been able to | 18:48 |
| boredandblogging | so it will help all locos | 18:48 |
| boredandblogging | and in general | 18:48 |
| boredandblogging | communication with the outside world | 18:48 |
| boredandblogging | fridge should be where "outsiders" come to find out the latest happenings in the Ubuntu community | 18:48 |
| boredandblogging | maybe I should say the scope is everything :-P | 18:49 |
| newz2000 | well | 18:49 |
| nand | Question: should we include external news, such as found in http://ubuntu-news.net/ ? | 18:49 |
| newz2000 | boredandblogging: lets start with persona | 18:49 |
| newz2000 | who is our user (or users) and what do they want? | 18:49 |
| boredandblogging | nand no, not unless its very high quality | 18:50 |
| nand | newz2000: My opinion is : all. Technically involved contributors, developers, and average non-technical users | 18:51 |
| newz2000 | instead of all, lets define them. We can't please everyone and we don't want to become a yahoo-like portal | 18:51 |
| boredandblogging | newz2000: what nand said, does that sound too big of a scope? | 18:51 |
| newz2000 | yes | 18:51 |
| newz2000 | :-) | 18:51 |
| boredandblogging | ok | 18:51 |
| newz2000 | Lets figure out three persona that we can cater to | 18:51 |
| newz2000 | and we'll make the focus of them... | 18:51 |
| nand | persona? | 18:52 |
| newz2000 | (not counting the admins or peopel who post events (necessarily)) | 18:52 |
| boredandblogging | right, lets start with technical/developers | 18:52 |
| newz2000 | for example, a loco team user who wants to know when and where the next loco team meeting | 18:52 |
| boredandblogging | thats not the use case I'm sure we are going for | 18:53 |
| nand | agree | 18:53 |
| newz2000 | ok, go ahead, lets create the proper persona then | 18:54 |
| boredandblogging | its more like the LoCo had a release party, this is what they did to get it going, this is what happened, this is what they learned, etc | 18:54 |
| boredandblogging | and throw in some pictures and videos | 18:54 |
| nand | yep | 18:55 |
| nand | we could include the planning part, but that would be a secondary optional goal | 18:55 |
| newz2000 | ok, so one persona is a team that wants to brag about an event that happened in the past, possibly uploading pictures or videos | 18:56 |
| boredandblogging | newz2000: correct | 18:56 |
| newz2000 | so that may not even be the right track | 18:56 |
| newz2000 | because that's focusing on the people who are publishing events, and they'll benefit little from a redesign. | 18:57 |
| newz2000 | It's the people who are interested in reading about that event that need to be defined. | 18:57 |
| newz2000 | And maybe those people aren't even a good target, it's the people who come to the fridge to get some kind of information that we need to identify. | 18:57 |
| newz2000 | Once we do that then we can decide how best to meet their needs with the design. | 18:57 |
| boredandblogging | ah right, I see | 18:58 |
| boredandblogging | how about this... | 18:58 |
| boredandblogging | loco members who are trying to find out what other locos are doing? | 18:58 |
| nand | and want to gain experience, tricks and tips from them? | 18:59 |
| newz2000 | ok, that sounds good | 18:59 |
| nand | (how did the french do to gather 4000 people?? :) ) | 18:59 |
| boredandblogging | right | 18:59 |
| nand | next: Ubuntu teams members, contributors ? | 19:00 |
| nand | people in the loop, technically advanced | 19:00 |
| boredandblogging | one of the things james westby talked about was how sometimes developers fall off the map | 19:01 |
| boredandblogging | they go away for a while and then come back | 19:01 |
| boredandblogging | since MOTU stuff moves pretty fast, there is no way for them to keep track of what has changed | 19:01 |
| nand | and that's why they were talking about this Developer News | 19:02 |
| boredandblogging | right | 19:02 |
| boredandblogging | this applies to non-MOTU related activities as well | 19:02 |
| boredandblogging | say Xubuntu needs a new ISO tested | 19:02 |
| boredandblogging | the reader might be anyone looking to help out | 19:03 |
| boredandblogging | or looking for a way to participate | 19:03 |
| boredandblogging | is that vague? | 19:03 |
| nand | in this case, it is a third kind of person : potential contributor | 19:03 |
| newz2000 | it is a bit vague | 19:04 |
| newz2000 | so these are people who are in the community but need to stay in touch with what's happening? | 19:04 |
| boredandblogging | right | 19:05 |
| nand | yes | 19:05 |
| newz2000 | that sounds good enough | 19:05 |
| boredandblogging | and maybe a separate persona of people who want to find ways to participate | 19:05 |
| newz2000 | let me make a sugegstion for another... | 19:05 |
| newz2000 | people who are not yet sold on Ubuntu and want to find out what's going on or hear the buzz | 19:05 |
| boredandblogging | definitely | 19:06 |
| nand | the outsider category | 19:06 |
| boredandblogging | media folks who are looking for something to write about | 19:06 |
| nand | so summing all, we end up by targeting all people :) | 19:06 |
| newz2000 | well, not really | 19:06 |
| nand | or let's say : who are we not targetting? | 19:06 |
| newz2000 | not yet | 19:06 |
| newz2000 | but we will | 19:07 |
| newz2000 | we have three maybe four personas now we want to cater to | 19:07 |
| nand | who do we don't want to target? | 19:07 |
| newz2000 | wait | 19:07 |
| newz2000 | :-) | 19:07 |
| newz2000 | let's restate our personas and ensure we agree | 19:07 |
| newz2000 | locos - want to know what other locos are doing | 19:07 |
| newz2000 | insiders - trying to stay in touch with what's going on | 19:08 |
| newz2000 | outsiders / press - looking for use cases or success stories about Ubuntu | 19:08 |
| boredandblogging | yeah, looks right | 19:08 |
| newz2000 | you started to mention a fourth... | 19:08 |
| newz2000 | people who want to participate | 19:08 |
| nand | and we mentionned people wanting to contribute | 19:08 |
| nand | yeah | 19:08 |
| newz2000 | is the fridge the best place for those? Do we currently help them? | 19:09 |
| boredandblogging | that maybe more of a ubuntu wanted thing | 19:09 |
| boredandblogging | or the Partipcate page | 19:09 |
| boredandblogging | Participate | 19:09 |
| nand | they may be inter related | 19:09 |
| nand | e.g. "Call for testing" : you need people fast | 19:10 |
| nand | you may want to put it in front page for a while | 19:10 |
| newz2000 | ok, so that may be a good persona then | 19:10 |
| nand | but on the overall, yeah, wanted | 19:10 |
| nand | we don't want all help request on the news website. But a few once in a while would not hurt | 19:11 |
| boredandblogging | yeah, depending on what it is | 19:11 |
| nand | and concerning the Fridge, for outsiders, its visibility is very bad | 19:11 |
| nand | http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=988278 | 19:11 |
| nand | insiders : I'm not aware of any of us reading the fridge | 19:12 |
| nand | since its content can be found on the planet | 19:12 |
| boredandblogging | which we've discussed is a bad place to announce anything | 19:13 |
| boredandblogging | thats why we need to revive the fridge :-) | 19:14 |
| nand | oh, new numbers on the poll! It was worse before | 19:14 |
| boredandblogging | newz2000: so what do you think? | 19:14 |
| nand | and locos: basically they is very few content for them. | 19:15 |
| newz2000 | I was wondering if we need to revise our persona, or do you think the original three are OK (considering the comment about "insiders") | 19:15 |
| nand | still ok for me | 19:16 |
| newz2000 | ok, so we have our three persona | 19:17 |
| newz2000 | who is not going to be best served by the fridge? | 19:17 |
| nand | why should one of these category be badly served? | 19:17 |
| newz2000 | no, I mean who have we not discussed yet | 19:18 |
| newz2000 | those that we are not catering to | 19:18 |
| boredandblogging | anyone who has no clue about Ubuntu | 19:18 |
| boredandblogging | which is ok | 19:19 |
| nand | for this, we need a good inter-website navigation, so that they can easily find ubuntu.com | 19:19 |
| newz2000 | anyone else? | 19:19 |
| boredandblogging | not that I can think of | 19:20 |
| newz2000 | ok, so we need to decide how to attract and serve our target users and how to deflect the others | 19:21 |
| newz2000 | how can we make the target users happiest? | 19:21 |
| * newz2000 is putting this on the wiki btw | 19:21 | |
| nand | lots of news | 19:21 |
| nand | and well organized | 19:21 |
| newz2000 | do all three persona care about the same news or do they each want something different? | 19:21 |
| nand | different | 19:22 |
| newz2000 | ok, for each, what do they want? | 19:22 |
| boredandblogging | i think at a high level most would be interested in knowing some of the same thing | 19:22 |
| boredandblogging | s | 19:22 |
| boredandblogging | for example, the 4000 people french release party | 19:22 |
| boredandblogging | it may be not technical, but it would surely interest everyone | 19:23 |
| nand | yeah | 19:23 |
| nand | the most interesting piece of news understandable by all categories of people | 19:23 |
| nand | pieces | 19:24 |
| newz2000 | ok, so what do the loco users want to know? | 19:24 |
| boredandblogging | events, bug james | 19:25 |
| boredandblogging | jams | 19:25 |
| nand | events on the LoCo team ("new locos database", ...) | 19:25 |
| boredandblogging | i have a side question | 19:26 |
| boredandblogging | are their not categories of news that cross all personas? | 19:26 |
| newz2000 | yes, there probably are | 19:27 |
| boredandblogging | for example, the Ubuntu Hall of Fame | 19:27 |
| nand | big pieces of news | 19:27 |
| boredandblogging | thats not loco or developmental specific | 19:27 |
| boredandblogging | free culture showcase, etc | 19:27 |
| newz2000 | What's going to happen is that by identifying the needs of our users we'll create a homepage where everyone who is a target user gets satisfaction | 19:27 |
| boredandblogging | so all three personas find something for themselves on the homepage? | 19:28 |
| newz2000 | yes | 19:28 |
| boredandblogging | makes perfectly good sense | 19:28 |
| boredandblogging | back to locos | 19:29 |
| newz2000 | Events and bug jams so far | 19:29 |
| boredandblogging | think they would like to know the high level things | 19:29 |
| boredandblogging | free culture showcase | 19:29 |
| boredandblogging | open week | 19:29 |
| newz2000 | maybe we should also identify what they don't want to see... is there something that would either turn them off or waste their time | 19:30 |
| boredandblogging | too much technical stuff :-P | 19:30 |
| boredandblogging | low level technical discussions or topics | 19:31 |
| newz2000 | good | 19:31 |
| newz2000 | here's what i have so far: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Fridge/Persona | 19:31 |
| newz2000 | we can revise this at any time so lets move on to the next persona, insiders | 19:32 |
| boredandblogging | interested in MOTU, docs, testing | 19:33 |
| nand | they will like news from their team | 19:33 |
| boredandblogging | or maybe they are just subpersonas of insiders | 19:33 |
| nand | and also getting the headlines from others teams | 19:34 |
| newz2000 | nand, those last two combined == 'everything' | 19:34 |
| newz2000 | :-D | 19:34 |
| nand | eheh | 19:35 |
| newz2000 | What will turn the insiders off? | 19:35 |
| boredandblogging | hmm | 19:36 |
| nand | average users tip and tricks... well, any newbie related stuff | 19:36 |
| boredandblogging | which I doubt we will have much of | 19:37 |
| newz2000 | ok | 19:37 |
| newz2000 | Outsiders | 19:37 |
| nand | If we let people submit posts... :) | 19:37 |
| boredandblogging | nand: thats a whole different issue | 19:37 |
| boredandblogging | :-P | 19:37 |
| nand | Outsiders, we can see it in Brainstorm, want to know what's going on in the development of Ubuntu! | 19:38 |
| newz2000 | I've made a note of it | 19:38 |
| nand | and while being technically accessible | 19:38 |
| boredandblogging | right, no one wants to join IRC or mailing lists to find out | 19:38 |
| nand | it's just out of question for them | 19:38 |
| nand | oh, and | 19:39 |
| nand | for the average user, Ubuntu is... everything. No upstream conception | 19:39 |
| nand | so they will expect news related to... every area | 19:40 |
| nand | Xorg, kernel, ... | 19:40 |
| newz2000 | good observation nand, I think I agree | 19:40 |
| nand | they'll want to know when a new ATI hardware is supported, they'll want to know when a new big feature has finally landed on gnome, and so on... | 19:41 |
| boredandblogging | its fine if we can tell them, but can point them upstream if needed | 19:43 |
| newz2000 | here's what I ahve so far: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Fridge/Persona | 19:43 |
| nand | if they do have some kind of news items, of course. | 19:43 |
| nand | (and non technical ones) | 19:43 |
| nand | okay | 19:44 |
| boredandblogging | looks good | 19:44 |
| newz2000 | so you're starting to see the kinds of things that would make a good homepage for our users | 19:44 |
| newz2000 | and what to avoid | 19:44 |
| nand | A kind of three main subportal may be a good idea | 19:45 |
| newz2000 | maybe, but as you noted, some of the things are interesting to multiple target users | 19:46 |
| newz2000 | so I wouldn't do one-column per persona | 19:46 |
| nand | oh nono I was not thinking of that | 19:46 |
| newz2000 | instead focus on ways to get interesting data for each above the fold | 19:46 |
| nand | but roughly that: http://www.ndeschildre.net/downloads/UBnews.html | 19:46 |
| nand | (the big tabs) | 19:47 |
| nand | (roughly :) ) | 19:47 |
| newz2000 | sure | 19:47 |
| nand | First page combine a little of all, but no to almost no technical stuff at all | 19:47 |
| newz2000 | nand, are you good at theming? | 19:47 |
| nand | I'm not really a designer. I can get some stuff done, but that takes me much longer than a designer would do :) | 19:48 |
| newz2000 | if I give you my html and images can you make it into a theme? | 19:48 |
| nand | no problem | 19:48 |
| newz2000 | ok, I have a working html template but it's not a drupal theme | 19:49 |
| boredandblogging | would now be a good time to talk about LP integration and videos? | 19:49 |
| newz2000 | almost | 19:49 |
| nand | and language support? :) | 19:49 |
| newz2000 | nand: it looks like yours but has better typography, simpler layout code and is fixed width (and we can adjust the width) | 19:49 |
| boredandblogging | oh yeah, I was gonna mention the width thing | 19:49 |
| newz2000 | go for it | 19:50 |
| nand | yeah, do we want fixed or not? | 19:50 |
| newz2000 | What I have is fixed but we don't have to use fixed | 19:50 |
| newz2000 | if we do, I think the fridge can support a wide fixed-width | 19:50 |
| boredandblogging | if not fixed width, something that doesn't go all the way across | 19:50 |
| nand | pb with fixed is that it sucks on big screen. Pb with non-fixed is that it's harder to make a good theme of it | 19:50 |
| newz2000 | yeah | 19:51 |
| newz2000 | why don't we start with what I have | 19:51 |
| nand | what do you have? | 19:51 |
| nand | Oh | 19:51 |
| newz2000 | it's pretty good and if we make it 950px wide it will work nicely | 19:51 |
| nand | and I forgot | 19:51 |
| newz2000 | for most people | 19:51 |
| newz2000 | (can be seen on shipit currently) | 19:51 |
| nand | by theme, you mean the outside of the page? | 19:52 |
| newz2000 | yes | 19:52 |
| newz2000 | just the shell, the brown part with the rounded corners | 19:53 |
| nand | ok | 19:53 |
| newz2000 | I also have the graphic I made for the fridge currently if that helps (in svg format) | 19:53 |
| nand | we should maybe keep the design part for later and first see about languages, LP integration and videos? | 19:53 |
| newz2000 | ok | 19:54 |
| nand | Concerning languages, why not make this available in several languages? Drupal offer the infrastructure to translate existing nodes | 19:55 |
| nand | that could be managed by community members | 19:56 |
| nand | a real life example is http://observers.france24.com/en/, http://observers.france24.com/fr/, http://observers.france24.com/ar/ | 19:57 |
| newz2000 | So where do people who want non-english ubuntu news go now? | 19:57 |
| nand | in their local loco team website, if it exists (rare), or... nothing | 19:58 |
| boredandblogging | yeah, depends on the locos who speak that language | 19:58 |
| newz2000 | Ubuntu.com is english only and depends (and in the future will explicitly refer people to) localized sites. | 19:59 |
| newz2000 | not saying same has to be for fridge | 20:01 |
| boredandblogging | the thing is, I'm not sure how much of the fridge would get translated if the option was available | 20:01 |
| newz2000 | especially considering how fast news can change | 20:01 |
| newz2000 | what about lp integration? | 20:01 |
| nand | we can let the local members decide what to put on their frontpage | 20:01 |
| nand | LP integration : tested locally on Brainstorm, works great. | 20:02 |
| nand | LP teams binding needs some bugs fixes | 20:02 |
| boredandblogging | i wanted this specifically for comments (can be used for other things if needed) | 20:02 |
| newz2000 | ok, so to comment must have a launchpad id? | 20:03 |
| boredandblogging | if a reader is already logged into LP, use their name, maybe their profile pic | 20:03 |
| nand | sound ok. Avoid spam pbs | 20:03 |
| boredandblogging | newz2000: thats a tricky question | 20:03 |
| boredandblogging | would like it to be open, but I'm afraid of spam | 20:03 |
| boredandblogging | maybe some captcha could help | 20:04 |
| newz2000 | there is spam blocking plugins like mollum and etc | 20:04 |
| nand | okay, one or the other | 20:04 |
| nand | if LP data available, display img and stuff | 20:04 |
| nand | otherwise too bad | 20:04 |
| nand | Videos? | 20:05 |
| newz2000 | go for it | 20:05 |
| boredandblogging | yes | 20:06 |
| boredandblogging | this is my big thing | 20:06 |
| boredandblogging | i think the front page should always have a nice picture or video | 20:06 |
| boredandblogging | the content from UDS alone gives us material for a couple of months | 20:07 |
| newz2000 | ok, would that be self hosted or on youtube/etc? | 20:07 |
| nand | I do agree, as much as possible, videos/imgs | 20:07 |
| boredandblogging | and I don't think we should be hosting any of the videos either | 20:07 |
| boredandblogging | youtube is being used for the UDS stuff | 20:07 |
| boredandblogging | we just embed | 20:08 |
| newz2000 | I saw a good demo last week of how to add videos to your website when they're hosted elsewhere | 20:08 |
| nand | CCK and stuff | 20:08 |
| newz2000 | piece of cake, though I don't know about the security/firewall concerns (with that server being able to ping youtube) | 20:08 |
| boredandblogging | i'm a bit worried about the different sizes that all the different sites use | 20:08 |
| newz2000 | yes | 20:08 |
| boredandblogging | i tried embedding on the current fridge, and it let me | 20:09 |
| boredandblogging | at least when previewing, didn't actually submit it | 20:09 |
| nand | depend on the filter in use | 20:09 |
| nand | but the size of the player can be given to the player | 20:10 |
| nand | anything more on videos? | 20:10 |
| newz2000 | http://youdrup.com/ youtube clone done in drupal | 20:10 |
| newz2000 | :-) | 20:10 |
| boredandblogging | nie | 20:11 |
| boredandblogging | nice | 20:11 |
| Turl | newz2000: is there an ubuntu download page in other lang than english? you should make one if there isn't, or promote it if there is | 20:11 |
| newz2000 | there is not, but one of my hopeful plans for next release is to make a syndicatable download iframe that can be localized | 20:12 |
| newz2000 | that's an unofficial goal currently. :-) | 20:12 |
| Turl | great :) | 20:12 |
| nand | Now I'd like to see the frontpage: | 20:12 |
| Turl | and how's that automatic mirror selection going? | 20:12 |
| nand | it should not be in a blog format, where the latest comes first. Instead, items would be ordered by the editors | 20:12 |
| newz2000 | Turl: good, I got approval for geoip but I'm going to have a meeting with #is this week or next to discuss it in details | 20:13 |
| nand | so that important pieces of news stay longer on top | 20:13 |
| Turl | #is? what's that? | 20:13 |
| newz2000 | information systems | 20:13 |
| newz2000 | the people who make the servers work | 20:13 |
| Turl | oh great :) | 20:13 |
| newz2000 | performance is going to be a concern so we'll be playign with it some after the new year (tentatively) | 20:14 |
| Turl | I don't think you'll have performance issues | 20:14 |
| newz2000 | yeah, the download page is currently proxied but not cached (so I hear) | 20:14 |
| Turl | how many simultaneous users use the download page? 500? | 20:14 |
| newz2000 | geoip should not add much at all to that | 20:15 |
| newz2000 | good question, I dont' know, but a lot | 20:15 |
| newz2000 | but because it is proxied getting the correct IP can be a challenge sometimes | 20:15 |
| boredandblogging | do we need to discuss the front page more? | 20:15 |
| * newz2000 isn't worried though | 20:15 | |
| newz2000 | I'm ok with whatever you want to do on the front page | 20:16 |
| nand | ok, anything else? | 20:16 |
| Turl | a cheap VPS server can handle 500+ users on a forum (vBulletin) with the correct caching & webserver, I don't think you'll have any problems | 20:16 |
| newz2000 | I can help with suggestions or technical difficulties but if you and nand want to head it up I'm fine with that | 20:16 |
| newz2000 | Turl: ubuntu.com gets far far far more than that | 20:16 |
| newz2000 | people litterally sit on the homepage and press refresh over and over again | 20:17 |
| Turl | yeah, but I don't think 100+ users at the same sec will enter the dl page, will them? | 20:17 |
| newz2000 | yes | 20:17 |
| Turl | :O | 20:17 |
| newz2000 | at times, like on release day for example. :-) | 20:17 |
| boredandblogging | nand: do you want to try creating a real theme and testing it out? | 20:17 |
| boredandblogging | then we can go over it and discuss? | 20:18 |
| Turl | well, you can have more than one vps server I imagine :p no problem either | 20:18 |
| newz2000 | nand: why don't you draw it first | 20:18 |
| nand | boredandblogging: I'll try to refine the one I started | 20:18 |
| boredandblogging | you know, release early, release often :-) | 20:18 |
| nand | but that will take some time... I'm quite tired of working all day on a news website already ;) | 20:18 |
| newz2000 | nand: I'll send you the the theme I started and you cn use it if you like | 20:19 |
| nand | ok thx | 20:19 |
| Turl | btw newz2000, I fixed the IE issue I had yesterday, with the help of css's top: | 20:20 |
| boredandblogging | nand: do we want to set a timetable for the first iteration? | 20:20 |
| boredandblogging | I don't know whats a good time estimate | 20:21 |
| nand | I may have something early January... | 20:22 |
| nand | I don't promise anything! | 20:22 |
| boredandblogging | nand: how about we say January 15th? | 20:23 |
| newz2000 | nand: two emails sent, one with theme, one with fridge graphics | 20:23 |
| newz2000 | cc'd boredandblogging | 20:23 |
| nand | newz2000: thx | 20:23 |
| nand | boredandblogging: I don't like fixed deadlines, that gives me extra pressure :) | 20:24 |
| nand | I'll let you know once I have something | 20:24 |
| boredandblogging | lol, ok | 20:24 |
| newz2000 | every time you say that boredandblogging moves the date one day closer | 20:24 |
| boredandblogging | :-P | 20:24 |
| nand | boredandblogging: could you send me a little bit of the fridge DB? | 20:25 |
| nand | or even the whole DB | 20:25 |
| boredandblogging | newz2000: can you do that? | 20:26 |
| newz2000 | I can get a dump of everything but the users table for you | 20:26 |
| nand | just need the node table, if my assumption that you're not using CCK is right | 20:28 |
| newz2000 | sorry, you get it all. :-) | 20:29 |
| boredandblogging | heh | 20:30 |
| nand | :p | 20:30 |
| newz2000 | hmm... maybe should have ignored sessoins table too | 20:30 |
| nand | yeahh, takes hundreds of Mb in brainstorm | 20:32 |
| newz2000 | anonymous users | 20:32 |
| newz2000 | learned a performance trick, using memcached for sessions helps a bunch | 20:32 |
| newz2000 | haven't used it yet | 20:32 |
| newz2000 | nand: can I give you a link to an 80m file for you to download and then let me know when finished, or would you rather do it tomorrow? | 20:33 |
| nand | newz2000: you can do it right now | 20:34 |
| boredandblogging | can't everything from the session table just get cleared occasionally? | 20:34 |
| newz2000 | nand: ping me when you have it and I'll delete it | 20:34 |
| newz2000 | boredandblogging: yes, cron.php clears out old stuff automatically | 20:35 |
| nand | newz2000: thanks | 20:35 |
| nand | newz2000: by default, it does not clear the session table | 20:35 |
| newz2000 | oh, really? that explains a lot. | 20:35 |
| newz2000 | the problem with sessions table is that it uses MyISAM table format by default and therefore locks the whole table for updates and deletes | 20:36 |
| newz2000 | causing serious contention issues | 20:36 |
| newz2000 | (basically site goes offline for long operations) | 20:36 |
| newz2000 | I've got a script somewhere that clears it 1000 records at a time to avoid contention | 20:36 |
| nand | newz2000: okay, finished, thx | 20:42 |
| newz2000 | my pleasure | 20:42 |
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