=== vorian is now known as awesome === awesome is now known as vorian [04:09] was there a kmail update recently? [04:15] 4:4.1.80-0ubuntu3 Superseded in jaunty-release on 2008-12-16 by 4:4.1.85-0ubuntu1 [04:19] seele: Do you get the usability theory behind this notifications thing sadbfl wants us to do? [04:20] ScottK: i haven't read his article but i've talked to him and other UX people about it. notifications for only ephemeral information makes sense [04:21] the problem is pushing the responsibility of actionable information on applications and relying on them handling it in a sane way [04:22] I can understand not requiring interaction. [04:22] It's the not allowing it that seems to me to be madness. [04:22] are ephemeral notifications really useful, though? do you really want to know that a cd-rom was just plugged in via an intrusive bubble? [04:22] GODDAMNIT KMAIL CRASHED AGAIN [04:22] excuse me [04:22] * seele sighs [04:22] crimsun: There's that too. [04:23] i imagine the level of notification can be configured [04:23] My cel phone beeps whenever it finds/loses the network. As a result, I leave the sound off. [04:23] i would hope so, but deciding what's sane would be a major point of contention in my book. perhaps most everyone else thinks differently. [04:24] yeah.. thats where the "user research" and "design" part comes in :P [04:24] seele: it seems counter-intuitive to me that if a notification pops up and I want to deal with it, that I can't click on it and get taken to whatever it's about. [04:25] ScottK: then the wrong type of information is being sent as a notification. if it is something that is likely actionable it should be handled otherwise [04:25] part of the problem is the existing system doesnt work with the new desig model so lots of people are confused how it will work [04:25] in theory it's a sound design. there just isn't a PoC yet to make everyone feel at ease about it [04:25] Then I'm not sure I understand what a notification would be. [04:27] * ScottK goes and looks at the video again. [04:27] the other problem with the design is that they expect the defaults to work for all users and all use cases [04:27] which different users use their computer differently so their notification needs will obviously be different [04:28] if you get hundreds of emails a day, you probably don't want notifications that a new email has arrived. but you might want to know when a coworker emails you vs. when you get a mailing list message [04:28] In there sample video they use IM messages as an example. I definitely might want to interact with those. [04:28] some users might not care when a friend is online via chat or not, but a college student might, etc. [04:29] the thing about the notifications is they don't last long, so by the time you notice the bubble and read it, it will be gone [04:29] seele: Were there really UDS sessions on this? [04:29] their solution is that when the bubble dissappears, it goes in to the IM clicky thing. You clicky the thing and you get your message [04:30] ScottK: no, these were mostly side discussions. a community problem with this design proposal was the way they unveiled it :P [04:30] OK. Well sabdfl's blog post led me to a different conclusion. [04:30] but back to the IM thing. so you see the bubble disappear in to X and so you go and click on X because that is the last location you saw the bubble go to [04:31] oh well maybe i misunderstood it and filled in the design gaps with my own ideas [04:31] like i said, i didn't read it yet, ive only talked about it with some of the design people [04:31] as a humble user, I generally dislike notifications, unless they are for a fairly rare occurance, or to differentiate an every-day event from an important one [04:31] That might at least make sense. His blog post explicitly says no clicking to followup. [04:31] wait, what don't you understand? about the bubble disappearing in to the chat button thing? [04:31] no.. not clicking the bubble [04:31] you click the chat icon in the panel thing [04:32] seele: I understand what you are saying, I'm just not sure it's consistent with what he said. [04:32] that somewhat makes sense... but why not just flash the IM system tray icon? [04:33] As long as it comes with a disable option, it's not such a big deal. My reaction was pretty much along the lines of what I read in asiego's blog. [04:33] nosrednaekim: the example is in gnome, not kde. they are trying to get rid of system tray icons and only use icons in the tray when they mean something [04:33] yech [04:33] I don't like that idea [04:33] Stick with KDE then. [04:33] ScottK: yes, the new fdo spec they are working on should support that [04:33] :P [04:33] i really abhor notifications [04:34] Actually quassel is a good example of it almost done right. [04:34] I get a nice ephemeral pop-up that I can dismiss early if I want to when I get highlighted. [04:34] ScottK: agreed, I appreciate those notifications [04:35] This is goo. What I really want then is the ability to click on it and go to the IRC channel in question. [04:35] seele: ^^^ Perhaps something for your review if you haven't turned it in already? [04:35] goo/good. [04:36] i didnt cover that in my review.. it's already like 80 slides [04:36] OK. One more for me please (especially since it relates to the notification thingy) [04:36] ? [04:37] it's not really *my* review anymore if people start asking me to put stuff in it [04:37] Only put it in if you agree. [05:08] seele: could you also add a notification when it is time to get my popcorn out of the microwave too please? :p [05:08] * nixternal runs and hides [05:09] how do you like that, we went from 2.5 feet of snow, and negative zero temps, to tornado watch and severe storms with 61+ degree weather today [05:09] god I love Chicago [05:09] I didn't hear about the tornado watch nixternal [05:09] ya, it was all day, they canceled it earlier though [05:10] hah.... global warming ;) [05:10] just for one day? I don't fall for that [05:10] You also can't forget about the flood warnings [05:10] ya, but they aren't as bad as they thought they would be at least [05:11] if anything, chicago has had global cooling, and extreme global cooling [05:11] isn't it just that the lakes are getting warmer and evaporating more? [05:11] * nosrednaekim stops playing the devil's advocate [05:11] hehe [05:12] this year wass the first time in a long time where the harbors actually froze over in lake michigan here [05:12] scrap that theory <_< [05:12] hehe [05:13] but we had a couple of weeks there where the temps were brutally cold [05:15] so where was the UDS a couple weeks ago? please don't tell me NYC [05:15] california [05:15] google once again [05:15] it was nice and warm there :) [05:16] whew :P if it was google-NYC I would have been mad, thats about a 15 minute train ride from school [05:16] hehe [05:16] google-nyc doesn't have google burritos, so I wouldn't have gone :p [05:16] haha [05:17] though I think an east coast event would have been better as it would have shaved about 8 hours off of most people's travel [05:18] * nosrednaekim hopes for NYC next year (and a less busy school schedule) [05:18] actually, someone (me) brought up austin texas for the next one...maybe at dell :) [05:19] that'd be a nice change [05:21] * ScottK ponders * Switch from cdbs to dephelper for debian/rules because cdbs just got too complicated. [05:21] ScottK: how so? [05:22] In this particular case a have a python package with a docs package and cdbs is convinced it needs setup.py for the docs package. [05:22] haha, nice === f4l3 is now known as flocati [10:38] nixternal: the concept of bitlbee scares me. I think I'm sticking to pidgin for now, it fits my workflow better :D === _JKHKBeJ is now known as LjL === LjL-Temp is now known as LjL [15:30] interesting [15:31] it took 5 hours to compile Qt just to find out I get some linking error, but no proper information what it was [15:50] Qt is a beast like that, and with qmake it's hard to compile only a small part of it [17:33] hi everybody [17:35] hi patxi [18:00] errrr... can anybody help me with connecting signal-slots in pyqt-pykde? [18:09] patxi: what's the problem? [18:09] oh [18:10] I'm practicing with the webkit widget example in techbase [18:11] and I want refresh addressBar QLineEdit with a link is clicked [18:11] with the link address [18:11] i connect signal and slot [18:12] QObject.connect(self.web, SIGNAL("linkClicked(QUrl)"), self.refreshUrl) [18:12] and slot method [18:12] def refreshUrl(self, nuevaUrl): [18:12] self.addressBar.setText(nuevaUrl().url().toString()) [18:12] do nothing xD [18:13] is it well coded? [18:13] you're using the static QObject.connect method, use the member one [18:13] self.connect(self.web, SIGNAL("linkClicked(QUrl)"), self.refreshUrl) [18:14] or you need to add self after the signal [18:15] ahm, thank you [18:15] I'll probe now [19:57] Riddell, and/or ScottK: anyone in the mood to sponsor? [20:30] NCommander: what do you need sponsored? [20:37] nixternal, kdegraphics [20:37] link me homeskillet [20:37] is it loaded with crack? [20:38] that is the question used to ask me a couple of years back [20:38] Hobbsee used to ask me that question I mean [20:38] if by patches for it to build on ARM [20:38] than no [20:38] woo arm, build it for the leg too [20:38] * NCommander whacks nixternal [22:27] seele: PING. just a quick follow up on the quassel evalution and recomendations? the lads are keen to get things happening [22:29] jussi01: yes i finished it but didn't get a chance to publish it before christmas.. i'll probably link it tonight or tomorrow. [22:29] ah thanks, good to know, I thought I maybe missed it due to our recent server hickups :) [22:29] take your time and don't get stressed out :) [22:30] seele: excellent :)