steveireSo is deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/kubuntu-members-kde4/ubuntu hardy main the ppa for nightly ?00:00
steveireOh, or deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/project-neon/ubuntu hardy main00:01
Nightrosehardy is no longer supported00:02
Nightroseintrepid is current for neon00:02
apacheloggerstdin: nightly only gets built for latest stable kubuntu00:02
steveireRight, I'm just copy+pasting from links, http://forum.kde.org/-solved-kde4-beta-repository-t-6284.html00:02
steveireOk, that's cool.00:02
apacheloggersteveire: comes with headers built in00:02
apacheloggerand seperate -dbg packages00:02
apacheloggerupdated in a 3 day cycle (if nothing breaks ;-)00:03
apacheloggerdeploying new qt as necessary00:03
steveireapachelogger: OK, sounds cool. So for someone trying to get into kde development it could simplify things greatly right?00:03
apacheloggersteveire: at least one Amarok dev uses it ;-)00:04
apacheloggeralso since it sandboxes to .kde-neon it makes testing a lot easier00:04
steveire:) It's something that I think should get more coverage on techbase00:04
apacheloggerand there is a special build script to ensure everything gets built against the correct stack00:04
apacheloggersteveire: feel free to write something :P00:05
steveireOh, cool, that was going to be another question. Where does it install things? The standard kubuntu locations or somewhere different?00:05
apacheloggerit is designed to be used along a stable KDE installation00:05
steveireAnd I think I read somewhere that it is also available on other distros?00:05
apacheloggernope, only kubuntu due to lack of other maintainers00:06
apacheloggerbut the underlying script is designed to support more distros00:06
steveireOh, what makes it designed as so? Do you mean it won't conflict with another installation?00:06
steveireI *think* opensuse makes weeklys available.00:07
apacheloggeropensuse's replace a stable installation though :P00:07
steveireI wouldn't want to recommend that...00:07
apacheloggerme neither, opensuse's builds are mostly created to keep their distribution packaging up-to-date and thus decrease the amount of work they have to do when a KDE release becomes available00:08
steveireOK, so instead of pointing someone to http://techbase.kde.org/Getting_Started/Build/KDE4, I'll create a page for project neon and recommend that for new developers.00:09
steveireThey'll still have to do some setup, but probably don't have to set up a separate account as the config dir is different.00:10
steveireThey'll have to set some env vars to put /opt/kde-nightly/{include,lib} in front.00:11
apacheloggerneonmake takes care of this00:12
steveireapachelogger: In what way?00:12
apacheloggerit is a wrapper around cmake&&make&&make install00:12
apacheloggersetting env vars beforehand00:12
apacheloggercreating build dir etc.00:13
steveireAny other useful tools there?00:13
apacheloggerdon't think so, the others are amarok focused00:14
steveireWhere does it create a build dir? ./build?00:14
steveireSo, for someone who wanted to join the kdepim team and was just getting started, I could tell them to get kdebase etc from the ppa, then svn co kdepim and focus on that.00:16
steveireGrand. So it will be00:16
steveireWill you help writing the page, or reviewing my drafts?00:16
apacheloggerreviewing shouldn't be a problem00:16
steveireI understand :)00:17
apacheloggercan probably also help a bit ;-)00:17
steveirecool so.00:17
steveireapachelogger: Does it break often? Early in the release cycle I imagine if anything.00:19
steveireAnd does it have a homepage?00:19
apacheloggerbasically never breaks ;-)00:21
apacheloggerI only recommend updates once the stack is built on a new release00:22
apacheloggerafter that only file conflicts occur from time to time, which need to be corrected manually with a dpkg --force-overwrite FILETHATCONFLICTS00:22
steveire' I only recommend updates once the stack is built on a new release' Sorry, I don't understand this. Could you rephrase?00:23
steveiredont update every 3-4 days?00:23
apacheloggerexample: once 9.04 comes out project-neon might not be fully built/tested and thus 8.10 will continue to be supported until all (if any) issues are sorted out on 9.04, once it works on 9.04 the 8.10 building will be stopped and 9.04 becomes the supported release00:26
=== ubott2 is now known as ubottu
apacheloggerluckily build-deps don't bump that far most of the time ;-)00:32
steveireYeah, it's not too bad.00:32
steveireSo, if the package backports without much issue, it is installed to the regular kubuntu location, replacing the universe version?00:33
apacheloggerthough, TBH I only backported once (libmsn) and that wasn't available in 8.1000:34
apacheloggerI prefer the option where a new package gets created because it is saver and cleaner in general00:34
steveireYeah, I'd agree there. What about translations?00:35
steveireIs it English only?00:36
steveireOK, grand.00:37
steveireI don't know much about that kind of thing. If I install stable i18n packages for German, say, and project neon, will neon use available translated strings or not at all?00:38
apacheloggerhm, never tried00:40
apacheloggersteveire: nope00:40
apacheloggerbut a l10n tarball can be easy enough built and installed using neonmake00:40
steveireUser documentation?00:40
apacheloggeronly english00:41
steveireOnly english docs?00:41
apacheloggerstandard KDE documentation as shipped along the source00:41
apacheloggersteveire: docs would be part of l10n tarballs as well00:41
apacheloggerNightrose: KDE has a bogus mime spec implementation00:43
* apachelogger got lost 4 times before he found the stuff he was looking for00:43
* Nightrose is tired00:43
steveireme too.00:44
apacheloggerNightrose: btw, does amarok have a bug squad?00:44
Nightroseyes mark seb and me00:44
apacheloggeryou could cleanup the amarok ubuntu bugs00:45
apacheloggeramarok almost got as many bugs as kdepim00:45
Nightrosei certainly don't have time for that :(00:45
Nightroseand i doubt seb and mark do00:45
* apachelogger lets it rot further then00:46
apacheloggerI think JontheEchidna is closing all of it once amarok2 is imported anyway00:46
Nightrosefine with me00:46
crimsunsince i already triage a craptonne of bugs, i'm happy to help triage amarok bugs. just let me know any particular pointers.00:47
crimsunthe audio stack part is cakewalk, but anything above that into Qt-land and KDE-lands i appreciate pointers.00:47
apacheloggercrimsun: we better get amarok2 in the archives first00:48
apacheloggerthen we can pretty much close everything that is amarok1-only, since it is unmaintained upstream and we don't have the resources to fix the remaining issues anyway00:49
steveireAre the kdegames and kdeedu modules not available on neon?00:51
apacheloggersteveire: edu is since last week, games is still not00:51
steveireOK, cool. Not giving out, just documenting :).00:52
apacheloggerwell, I can add stuff easy enough upon request00:52
apacheloggerI just didn't want to have all of KDE built while some of the modules don't get used at all00:53
steveireSure. I agree. Wait for the requests and then grab on to the requesters and draw them in :)00:54
steveireapachelogger: Does it change the $PATH at all? I mean if I don't install the kdebase nightly, but only the kdepim nightly, I'll want to run the stable version usually and the nightly version only when I choose to. I'll probably write some bash functions to switch around if neccesary.00:59
apacheloggerit's rpathed, thus /opt/kde-nightly/bin/kmail would be enough01:01
apacheloggerit might mess with some tmp/cache files though, there isn't much testing going on since it's major purpose is to run a complete session01:02
apacheloggersteveire: hardcoded library paths01:02
steveireOh, so it knows how to find the correct nighly libraries.01:02
seelebrr.. too much schnapps in this drink01:49
* Sput just had beer02:02
=== JontheEchidna changed the topic of #kubuntu-devel to: Wecome to #kubuntu-devel | https://wiki.kubuntu.org/KubuntuJauntySpecs | Merges! http://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html http://merges.ubuntu.com/main.html
JontheEchidnais lists.ubuntu.com down for any of you guys?03:03
nhandlerJontheEchidna: What are you trying to find there?03:09
JontheEchidnaOh, I use that to view all of the kubuntu-bugs bugmail so that I don't have to deal with a crapton of email in kmail every day03:10
JontheEchidnaI still do read all of it :P03:10
nhandlerJontheEchidna: Ok. That is one mailing list I don't subscribe to ;)03:10
ScottKJust tossed my "Notifications - please don't fix them for KDE" post to planet ....03:19
voriannixternal, have you tried choqok?03:19
nixternalcan't say that I have03:20
vorianit's in the new queue, it's ver niceish (twitter client)03:20
nixternallooks nice03:21
nixternalwish there was a client with both twitter and identi.ca, as I have different followers and some people who only use identi.ca03:21
vorianthe author is willing to adjust it to work with identi.ca as well03:22
vorianI think it'll turn out to be a nice client03:22
nixternallooks good, no doubt03:25
* nhandler is still waiting for a ncurses identi.ca client03:26
ScottKPersonally I don't get the whole micro-blogging thing.03:26
HobbseeScottK: it was useful at UDS03:26
voriani try to get into it every month or so03:26
Hobbseebut it's a bit odd outside of that, it seems.03:26
ScottKPosting - "Just finished a two hour blow-up with my 17 year-old step daughter and I'm tired" doesn't seem so useful.03:26
JontheEchidnamy life is too boring for micro-blogging03:27
ScottKHobbsee: That's kind of a special case.03:27
JontheEchidnaIRC is sufficient if anything of interest happens03:27
nixternalvorian: I am the same way03:27
HobbseeScottK: indeed.03:27
nixternalI have the accounts, but I rarely update or follow them unless I am at some event where everyone else is doing it and I get reminded again03:28
nhandlerScottK: I just read through your blog post03:29
ScottKnhandler: Comments?03:30
nhandlerScottK: I have a lot of the same feelings as you. Personally, queueing notifications seems like the most useless idea I have heard in a while. If I am hilighted in IRC, getting the notification, even a minute later means it is too late to respond (in most channels). I also think being able to click on them is natural, but annoying. I would prefer something that is easier and smoother than clicking on a tiny window in the corner of the scr03:33
voriani gotta try out quassel03:33
Hobbseecorner of the scr03:33
nhandlervorian: So do I. Although for the time being, irssi does meet my needs03:33
nhandlerHobbsee: ??? Did it get cut off?03:34
ScottKnhandler: Unless corner of the scr was then end of what you wrote, yes.03:35
Hobbseenhandler: yes03:35
* Hobbsee giggles at ScottK03:35
nhandlerScottK: Ok, I'll resend the rest of it. irssi didn't show it getting cut off03:35
Hobbseenhandler: splitlines.pl, or something similar.  find it.  use it.  ;)03:36
nhandler19:39 <+ibuclaw> !pwned > PriceChild03:36
nhandler(ignore that)03:36
JontheEchidna!pwned > JontheEchidna03:36
ubottuSorry, I don't know anything about pwned03:36
nhandlercorner of the screen. However, I am unable to think of a better idea right now. I also disagree with the way canonical is going about implementing this feature.03:36
nhandlerBring a team in to create it just seems wrong. I would probably be less against it if the team was open and available on irc to interact with, but a private team just seems to go against the ubuntu philosophy03:37
nhandlerJontheEchidna: It was a custom factoid in a bot I made for another channel03:37
JontheEchidnaah, lol03:37
Hobbseenhandler: are you sure it *is* a private team?03:37
Hobbseenhandler: a lot of them aren't, but aren't saying "we're inviting all FOSS people to participate either"03:38
ScottKHobbsee: It's not particularly public if is is brought up as discussed at UDS and yet there were no sessions on it.03:38
seelenhandler: i think the team is too new to know that they should have a public/online presence03:39
HobbseeScottK: i never said that canonical were doing the right thing in publicising it.  What i'm saying is that unless these things are marked ZOMGPRIVATE, (in which case, you probably wouldn't know of it's existance), they're probably open enough if you say you'd like to help03:39
seeleScottK: yes, and they also realised what a stupid mistake that was and hopefully they wont do it again03:39
nhandlerseele: The team was made by canonical, I don't think you can call canonical new03:39
HobbseeScottK: and also, they can be prodded into making things public, if they're private, and shouldn't be.03:39
seelenhandler: no, but a lot of the new people are new to the whole open source thing and how people work online03:40
ScottKRight.  Well that's why I asked if anyone was working on a KDE implemetation we'd really like to know.03:40
seeleScottK: dbus interface, the DX team is going to work with KDE on creating a "new" fdo spec03:40
seelewhich features such as interaction can be configured to be on or off03:41
seelenhandler: several of the new people were weeks and days new.  not six months new03:41
nhandlerseele: I guess I just feel that since it is a Canonical team, we shouldn't be having these "learning periods".03:42
ScottKseele: I don't buy that as an excuse.  For the individuals, sure, but not for Canonical as a whole.03:42
seelenhandler: why?  it isn't unreasonable that they have to train people in their corporate culture03:42
* Hobbsee notes that canonical has traditionally not gotten this right, in various cases.03:42
ScottKseele: My fear is they have.03:43
Hobbseelook at the release team, or archive teams, or various other of the ubuntu teams for eg, that are dominated by canonical people03:43
nhandlerseele: Training people is one thing. But establishing basic things like an irc channel, or even a mailing list is another thing03:43
ScottKRelease team seems to have gotten more open.03:43
seeleScottK: KDE and GNOME wont be forced to use it and it will be Canonical's fault for not involving them from the start and screwing it up03:43
seeleScottK: but i think that is something they've learned and will be more careful about in the future03:43
ScottKI hope we won't be forced to use it.03:43
HobbseeScottK: oh, it has now.  But we won't mention how long it took, and how difficult it was (on both sides of the fence) to obtain that.03:44
* nhandler goes to finish up some work before his break ends tomorrow03:44
ScottKHobbsee: Agreed.03:44
seeleScottK: i am doubtful we will get a choice, especially since Canonical has pledge to support Kubuntu more seriously (such as hiring 1, maybe 2 KDE/Qt developers)03:45
HobbseeScottK: the teams certainly get better, but they don't seem to get it right from the start, a lot of the time03:45
* vorian notes that Scot.tK's notices must be going berzerk atm03:45
nixternaljeesh it is noisey in here04:06
Hobbseedid we wake the old vista-loving man up from his afternoon nap?  ;)04:07
nixternalit is 22:08 here, way past afternoon04:08
nixternalbut you just reminded me that I need to get off of my ass and go switch out my laundry :)04:08
Hobbseei guess i'ts afternoon here, so..04:09
seelethe internet has no time zone04:12
Hobbseeyes it does04:13
seelei was thinking "late at night. always"04:14
nixternaljeesh, with all the laundry I have, it is almost like the last time I did it was over a month ao04:17
ScottKseele: Until said developers are hired and working, it's all just theory.04:30
ScottKThat and if someone uploads a bunch of unspec'ed patches that change us away from upstream without discussion, I've got no compunction at all about reverting it.04:31
seeleScottK: have a little faith.  They will be hired.  it doesn't make sense to do it at this point in the cycle04:34
ScottKseele: Sure, but the notifications thing was pitched for this cycle.04:34
seeleand if patches get as far as uploaded then i'd say it is a bit too late to make a decision about04:34
seeleScottK: not for kubuntu.  only ubuntu04:34
ScottKOK.  I read it as for both.04:35
seelei'm 90% sure that it is only ubuntu, although it will probably be expected for kubuntu in jaunty+104:35
seeleScottK: there aren't resources to do it for kubuntu.  we don't have our developers yet, remember04:36
ScottKRight.  For once I'm glad we're left out.04:36
ScottKAlso, I've reverted bad uploads before.04:37
nixternaliirc, I thought one was getting offered a spot with the KDE side of Canonical while we were at UDS...JR said quite a few people applied too, which I was kind of fearing wouldn't happen04:37
seeleScottK: bad uploads directed by sabdfl?04:37
ScottKI even got a UDS session in my honor.04:37
ScottKseele: Sure.  He's not perfect.04:37
seelenixternal: i still don't think he would start right away.  david was saying there would be too much catch up with feature freeze so close, and then nothing to do04:38
nixternalis david the desktop track guy?04:39
nixternalI can't remember04:39
ScottKWe have a process for specs and such and if someone ignores it and uploads, then it's fair game no matter who told them to do it.04:39
seelenixternal: desktop experience.  rick is the desktop team04:39
nixternalahh rich04:39
nixternalrick spencer was in our meetings right?04:39
nixternalhe was doing the gobby stuff04:39
seelejulian is the use experience lead.. or whatever the thought bubble design group is called04:40
* ScottK pretty much writes the whole thing off to why I like KDE and not Gnome anyway.04:40
nixternaland running the camera and keeping us on track :)04:40
seeleyes, that was rick, david is the french guy.. he was in a lot of sessions too but he wasn't leading them04:40
seeleno kidding.  he must be the most effective project manager/meeting manager i've ever met04:40
* ScottK ponders the changelog entry.04:41
ScottK* Revery bad patch that broke notifications.04:41
seele* Rereverted notifications patch.  Works as coded.  Coded as intended04:42
* seele giggles. She's seen a repatch note like that before..04:42
ScottKWell I think Canonical has a lot of work to do with KDE upstream on the entire question.04:43
ScottKEven if I liked the idea, I'm not sure we should maintain it as a Kubuntu patch without some upstream support to integrate it at some point.04:44
seeleand they are working with upstream for the dbus part. the actual default configuration is left to be seen04:44
seeleif notifications matter enough to canonical, i dont think we'll have a choice in the end04:45
seeleit's not like ubuntu has a choice.  theyre getting it.04:45
ScottKRight, but Ubuntu is primarily developed by Canonical.04:45
seeleright, and canonical is soon to be supporting more kde development which will be expected to go in to kubuntu04:46
ScottKAlthough Canonical certainly supports Kubuntu development, I think it's primarily a community effort.04:46
ScottKMy immediate reaction is that they are welcome to expect that.04:46
ScottKIf it's any good, I'm sure it will.04:46
seelesure.. but at some point canonical could invest so much in to kubuntu that they get executive power over it04:46
seeleand it is a community project second04:46
seelewho knows if that will happen, but it is a possibility04:47
ScottKSure.  When that happens, it happens.04:47
seeledon't be surprised if it happens in jaunty+104:47
ScottKOnce they are primarily pulling the train, then it's reasonable they get to drive.04:49
seelenot much driving on one way tracks :)04:53
nixternalI am so glad you are going to be getting the obama bs now ScottK and seele04:55
nixternalhe has messed up chicago with his security details for to long..and being employed and working in the city, I am so happy to see him go!04:55
nixternalno more sitting on the train for 45 minues just so he can pass under a bridge in rush hour traffic04:56
ScottKHeh.  DC is pretty used to it.04:56
nixternalnot obama style they aren't04:56
nixternalremember his security detail is twice the size of any other former president04:56
seeleit will certainly be tighter than normal04:57
seelebut seriously, this is DC04:57
seelewe expect it04:57
seelewe get foreign nationals with more security than bush04:57
nixternaldid you see where they shut down the metra in dc today because he was coming in?04:57
nixternalwe laughed here in chicago04:57
seelethe inaguration is going to be insane04:57
seelei plan on stocking up on milk and bread before the weekend and hiding until it's all over04:58
seelei dont want to be anywhere near tourists04:59
seelethe cherry blossom festival and the summer are bad enough04:59
seeleand we're getting all of them ON THE SAME DAY04:59
seelei feel bad for anyone who has to go to work that day.  everyone i know is off though05:00
nixternalI actually enjoy the cherry blossom festival..the blossoms are beautiful05:00
seelethe city is going to be in a state of emergency, there will be just too many people05:00
seeleoh i do too05:00
nixternalmy grandmother had one in her yard when I was growing up, so I have always liked them05:00
seelewhat i hate are the fucking tourists who dont know how to get on and off the train05:00
nixternalI tried to keep one, but it kicked the bucket on me :(05:00
seelei'm so glad i dont work in town anymore05:01
nixternalshit, in chicago, if you don't know how to get off a train, they will show you05:01
nixternalI mean shove you :)05:01
seeleyou have all the suits running effecient metro traffic05:01
seelethen all these fat old people in shorts and hats not letting the people OUT of the train before they get in05:01
seeleseriously, how do you think we're going to make room for you if you dont let us OFF THE TRAIN05:01
seeledont stand in a group on a really fucking long escalator and make someone ten minutes late because they had to ride the entire way up05:02
nixternalya, I see that every morning getting on the train...and I talk trash to the people doing it too...let them know I think they are stupid05:03
ScottKThe main thing I remember about the train in Chicago is asking directions.05:03
nixternalI know it isn't nice, btu you have to05:03
nixternalasking directions?05:03
nixternalthe train only goes in one direction :p05:03
seelejesus fucking christ.. DC is a CITY. we WALK all over the place.  if you don't want hit by a FUCKING car. USE THE CROSSWALK05:03
ScottKI was told, "That way is South.  Don't go south.  If you go south, you won't come back."05:03
ScottKTechnically this was the El.05:04
seelei dont mind giving directions.. it keeps people going in the right direction instead of stopping in the middle of a swarm of people and trying to paddle upstream05:04
seelenixternal: you've been on the metro during rush hour, you know how metro center and gallery place operate05:04
seeleif you get swept up in the wrong crowd going in the wrong direction, you aint getting nowhere05:04
nixternalhahaha, so true05:04
nixternalthe same thing with union station if you don't kow your way out of the tunnels05:05
seelelike i said.  milk. bread. locked doors.05:05
crimsunactually, i experienced a worse one a couple nights ago during the caps game05:34
crimsungal pl, metro center, even mt vernon sq/7th st conv center were jammed05:35
nixternalheh, I just finished reading through the comments on sabdfl's post about the notification stuff...it seems the old osx users like the idea, whereas everyone else doesn't05:35
crimsunand yeah, inauguration weekend is going to be even worse. i can't believe metro is pulling its "don't stay open 24 hours" mess05:36
nixternalI take it growl is an osx thing?05:36
nixternalalso, someone posted mumbles which *looks* nice05:36
nixternalcrimsun: chicago has been doing the "you have to close at 9pm" thing here, so get ready for it!05:36
crimsunwell, there's rumor of bars staying open til 4 or 5 am that week05:37
nixternalwhich is funny, considering all of the security that has been in the loop, the crime down there has risen05:37
Hobbseehmm.  it's certainly interesting to see how opensuse does kde4.06:31
=== _neversfelde is now known as neversfelde
Tonio_hi and happy new year everyone :)10:15
Tonio_Riddell: finally moved to the appartment ;) but still no internet at home for about 10 days10:16
Hobbseehey Tonio_!10:31
apacheloggerTonio_: heya, when do you plan to import kpackagekit into jaunty?10:36
apacheloggerwould be good to have it on the CD for next release10:36
Tonio_apachelogger: soon :) as soon as I have internet at home10:45
apacheloggeroh kay ^_^10:45
apacheloggerNightrose: is lfranchi worth 8 sloc?10:47
Nightroseprobably yes10:47
apacheloggerNightrose: multiple tars10:51
apacheloggerbut actually it is more than 810:51
* Nightrose hugs apachelogger10:51
apacheloggerunless you want to rename the tars yourself10:51
apacheloggerthen it would be 8 lines10:51
* Nightrose goes back to some wii fit10:52
apacheloggerI am working my arse off and you are doing casual gaming :P10:53
Nightrosehey this is also working your ass off...11:04
Nightrosein the true meaning of the words11:04
SputNightrose: stop lying to yourself :)11:39
apacheloggerNightrose: that release stuff is non-trivial12:23
apacheloggerit probably makes most sense to hack around it12:24
apacheloggeradd a new argument to the script12:24
apacheloggerthat requires you to run the script twice to get 2 tarballs, but hax0ring this bares a high possability of bugs12:25
apacheloggerJontheEchidna: is bug 296666 caused by that xrendr patch?13:46
ubottuLaunchpad bug 296666 in kdebase "Xorg log keeps growing during live session" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/29666613:46
JontheEchidnayus, there's a master bug in workspace that that is duplicate of13:46
JontheEchidna*that it is duplicate of13:47
apacheloggerplease duplicate :P13:47
apacheloggerand comment on the 3gib kdm.log bug13:47
* apachelogger needs to take the dog for a walk before it gets dark13:47
ScottK2ScottK-laptop: Ping.14:46
etretyakHi guys! Is there any other page like this one https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/UbuntuFeatureParity which contains features implemented in Ubuntu and not yet implemented in Kubuntu? Because I think this list should be much bigger... :(15:09
etretyakAlso is there any news about new Notifications represented an USD? As I understand Canonical has hired some developers to implement this functionality both for Ubuntu and Kubuntu.15:15
ScottKetretyak: There is also https://wiki.kubuntu.org/KubuntuJauntyGapAnalysis15:15
jjesse-dell9etretyak: i know there has not been a KDE hire yet and there is some progress being made not quite sure how much is getting done15:15
jjesse-dell9there might be a mailing list or something for the DX team to discuss on but dont know for sure15:15
etretyakScottK: so do we need to update KubuntuJauntyGapAnalysis? For example knetworkmanager doesn't have VPN pptp configuration. And it is fully works in Ubuntu.15:20
etretyakjjesse-dell9: were you able to setup VPN connection in Kubuntu? i've read your blog :)15:20
jjesse-dell9etretyak: pptp VPN works fine in Ubuntu with network manager?  i havent gotten mine to work yet :(15:20
seeletechnically the gap analysis is Kubuntu Intrepid to Kubuntu Jaunty, not Kubuntu to Ubuntu.15:20
jjesse-dell9i get a message from netowk manager and no logs yet15:21
seelepractically it is a list of anything we might need in Jaunty15:21
ScottKseele: It's a bit of both (e.g. Guest Session).15:21
seeleright.. the practically part.  we didn't go through a list of haves and have nots between kubuntu and ubuntu during the session15:22
ScottK-desktopScottK-laptop: Ping15:25
ScottK-desktopScottK-laptop: Ping again15:25
etretyakWhat about DX team? Are they responsible to patch all KDE specific apps to be able to handle new Notifications?15:26
etretyakAnd what about DesktopTeam? Are they working only on Ubuntu improvements?15:26
jjesse-dell9etretyak: i think there are still a lot of un answered questions a lot of people still have15:27
ScottKetretyak: Desktop Team == Ubuntu Desktop (e.g. Gnome).15:28
etretyakScottK: i see. so we still follow our own way.. ;)15:30
JontheEchidnaapachelogger, ScottK, Riddell: could somebody review/sponsor the debdiff for bug 211839?15:31
ubottuLaunchpad bug 211839 in gtk-qt-engine "gtk-qt-engine-kde4 doesn't use Oxygen backwards/forwards buttons with Firefox 3" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/21183915:31
apacheloggeretretyak: current information suggest that DX team will try to reach consesus with gnome and kde to get stuff implemented upstream ... if that is not possible DX team will maintain patches15:32
apacheloggerso there isn't much change for us, just that eventually there should be a couple of monster patches appearing15:33
ScottK-desktopScottK-laptop: Ping15:34
ScottK-desktopScottK-laptop: Ping again15:35
ScottK-desktopScottK-laptop: Ping again15:35
ScottKTesting done.  Sorry for the noise.15:37
apacheloggerJontheEchidna: no commits in upstream svn since 20080816?15:46
JontheEchidnadunno, but it's been at r145 for forever. If anything there may have been a few translation updates15:47
* JontheEchidna thinks it's better to use svn number in the version string15:48
apacheloggerthey both have advantages15:48
apacheloggerusing the date you know how hold it is without consulting upstream svn15:48
JontheEchidnaEasier to find the date of the svn number than the svn number that corresponds to that date, imo15:49
JontheEchidnaas long as there's a web-browsable svn repo :P15:49
apacheloggerJontheEchidna: usually svn number wouldn't matter15:52
apacheloggerusually project have at least one commit in 6 months ;-)15:52
vorianI noticed we have no sessions at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperWeek/Prep :o15:57
ScottKAnyone volunteer to do one?15:57
apacheloggerI did want to talk about something15:58
apacheloggerJontheEchidna: what was it?15:58
apacheloggerJontheEchidna: devweek15:58
apacheloggerrapid package deployment using ruby?15:58
apacheloggerI think there was something else as well15:58
apacheloggerpbuild hookers?15:59
ScottK"Never have to relibtoolize again by using Cmake"?15:59
JontheEchidnaapachelogger: something like that15:59
* ScottK recalls jpds is a big fan of relibtoolize.15:59
apachelogger"CMake - What else?"16:00
apachelogger"How to fix half your translations 5 days before release"16:01
ScottK"KDE4 - It's not your Grandma's DE any more"16:01
ScottKapachelogger: If only they'd done that.16:01
apacheloggeradd a not to the topic title then16:01
vorianKDE4 packaging would be a good one16:01
ScottKThe translations we had at release were still worse than upstream's.16:02
apacheloggervorian: what to talk about?16:02
apacheloggeradd that cdbs include16:02
apacheloggerupload to review16:02
voriangood point16:02
apacheloggerhand apachelogger a cookie16:02
* vorian hands apachelogger a cookie16:02
apacheloggerwatch him reject the package because it is too high quality16:02
apacheloggerScottK: but better than they were a week before release16:02
ScottKapachelogger: True.  But anything that makes stuff worse is broken beyond belief.16:03
vorianPushing out KDE to Tens of users16:04
ScottKapachelogger: I did you see I added Jaunty to the Debian experimental kde.mk so we should be able to sync future KDE4 uploads from Experimental.16:04
apacheloggerthat said ... kdt will get QA beyond belief soon16:04
ScottKNo need to set THIS_SHOULD_GO_IN_UNSTABLE anymore.16:05
apacheloggerScottK: kde4.mk is different16:05
apacheloggertranslation stuff16:05
ScottKWhichever one it is that has that.16:06
apacheloggerScottK: kde.mk in debian is still imported to debian/cdbs?16:06
apacheloggerwell, can't sync then16:07
ScottKWhy not?  There's no harm in using that one.16:07
apachelogger#Kubuntu specific, Launchpad translations support, create .pot translation templates16:07
apacheloggerScottK: we wouldn't get the pots16:07
apacheloggerif debian had the .mk in cdbs or pkg-kde-tools we could sync16:08
ScottKI think pkg-kde-tools is their plan.16:08
apacheloggerso, what do we talk about @devweek?16:20
voriangetting involved with kubuntu-devel (ninja's/bugs/testing)?16:22
apacheloggervorian: are you going to do that?16:23
vorianI like a team approach :)16:24
* apachelogger thinks all those topics can be indvidual slots ;-)16:24
apachelogger"Holding back KDE releases from millions of users" :D16:25
apachelogger...Kubuntu Ninja secrets16:26
apacheloggervorian: how about we do a talk about ninja work together?16:28
vorianit seems they would like some hand's on stuff16:29
apacheloggerJontheEchidna could talk about how I close bugs by fixing them and he does by marking them invalid :P16:29
voriananything that can be learned instantly16:29
JontheEchidnaapachelogger: but who has the higer karma? :D16:29
apacheloggervorian: Pushing out GNOME releases to millions of users -- is not exactly something that can be any more learned instantly16:30
JontheEchidna(just kidding)16:30
apacheloggerJontheEchidna: I must have higher karma because I am a bzr user :P16:30
apacheloggerbzr users get load of karma for doing nothing16:30
voriandholbach said we could have two slots16:30
apacheloggerI want 316:30
vorianyou talk to him then16:30
apacheloggersince we are talking about bazaar :P16:31
vorianthat's not kubuntu specific, so i'm sure _you_ could do it :)16:31
JontheEchidnaLP karma system is out of control16:31
apachelogger"How to cheat your way all to the top of LP karama"16:32
JontheEchidnayus :D16:32
JontheEchidnamy favorite search: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.searchtext=kde&orderby=date_last_updated&search=Search&field.status:list=INCOMPLETE_WITH_RESPONSE&field.status:list=INCOMPLETE_WITHOUT_RESPONSE&field.assignee=&field.bug_reporter=&field.omit_dupes=on&field.has_patch=&field.has_no_package=&start=016:32
apachelogger"How to make LP servers go down by accessing the Ubuntu bug page"16:33
apacheloggerjust imagine all those tags and millions of users accessing it at the same time because a new gnome release was pushed :P16:33
apacheloggerJontheEchidna: there are false incompletes16:34
* apachelogger is loosing focus again16:36
vorian1) ninja16:36
vorian2) bugs16:36
apacheloggervorian and moi talk about the ninja and JontheEchidna about cheating16:36
vorianalrighty, i'll add it to the schedule16:36
JontheEchidnawhen is devweek?16:36
vorianlet's make a big deal of it too16:37
apacheloggerloads of promotion16:37
apachelogger...a whole marketing campaign16:37
apacheloggerJontheEchidna: 19-2316:37
JontheEchidnaah, I should be able to make it then16:37
JontheEchidnaso should I do a repeat of my openweek talk? :D16:38
apacheloggerwith more emotion, more cheating, more cookies16:38
vorianwhat time slot do you want apachelogger?16:38
vorianIt will need to be thursday for me16:39
vorianso, 1900 or 2000?16:39
apacheloggerdoesn't matter16:40
vorianok, 1900 it is! \o/16:40
vorianJontheEchidna: any time work for you?16:40
voriando you want to do the 2000?16:40
apachelogger19 = 20 CET = perfect market penetration in germany :P16:40
JontheEchidnavorian: 1900 would be better I think16:40
apacheloggeraloha Riddell16:40
JontheEchidnabut 2000 would work too16:40
apacheloggerJontheEchidna: I suppose you did runtime QA on your gtk changes?16:41
JontheEchidnaapachelogger: yus16:41
apacheloggerup we go16:41
JontheEchidnanow gtk-qt-engine sucks less! :P16:41
vorianJontheEchidna: i'll switch them around then16:42
vorian1900 for JontheEchidna16:42
apacheloggerJontheEchidna: by 0.01%16:42
JontheEchidnahaha, yeah...16:42
apacheloggervorian: why not do it on 2 days?16:42
apacheloggervorian: we'd be reaching more people I guess16:43
vorianJontheEchidna: any day work for you looks like wednesday is open at 190016:43
apacheloggerbug 31141516:46
ubottuLaunchpad bug 311415 in kubuntu-meta "Add the droid fonts and make it the default for Kubuntu" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/31141516:46
vorianok apachelogger JontheEchidna, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperWeek/Prep16:47
apacheloggeroh dear16:47
apacheloggerark can't copy to fonts:/ -.-16:47
JontheEchidnaI hate default fonts bus16:47
apacheloggervorian: our name sux16:48
apacheloggerwe need something magic16:48
vorianCreating Kubuntu Magic16:48
vorianMagic Kubuntu Spells16:48
vorianKubuntu Magic: Revealed16:49
vorianFree iPods16:49
apacheloggerKubuntu Ninja's - The Kubuntu SWAT unit16:49
vorianthere is a ubuntu SWAT team though16:50
apacheloggerKubuntu Ninja's - The Kubuntu SWAT unit with cool name16:50
apacheloggerKubuntu Ninja's - The art of magic16:50
vorianI like it!16:50
* vorian changes16:50
apacheloggerKubuntu Ninja's - free ponies16:50
voriannot so much16:51
apacheloggeroh my pony!16:51
JontheEchidnaI think it's hilarious16:51
apacheloggervorian: either we are serious and use the art of magic or we ar hilarious and use free ponies16:51
apacheloggeror - Blue ponies16:52
apacheloggerup to you16:52
vorianblue ponies16:52
vorianI can live with that16:52
apacheloggeror unicorn16:52
vorianah, that's a magical pony16:52
vorianKubuntu Ninja's - Free Unicorns16:52
vorianKubuntu Ninja's - free ponies16:53
apacheloggerKubuntu Ninja's - Packagers in Unicorn mode16:53
apacheloggerthat makes us magic packagers16:53
vorianok, Packagers in Unicorn mode it is16:54
=== jjardon is now known as torkiano
apacheloggerdoes someone see a graphical advantage over dejavu?16:59
apacheloggerRiddell: are you still around?17:00
smarterapachelogger: I don't like the rendering at 817:02
Riddellhi apachelogger17:02
smarteris the aliasing disabled for <= 8 or something?17:02
smarterhey Riddell17:02
apacheloggerRiddell: what do you think?17:02
apacheloggerbug 31141517:02
ubottuLaunchpad bug 311415 in kubuntu-meta "Add the droid fonts and make it the default for Kubuntu" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/31141517:03
* apachelogger is pretty sure droid doesn't support as many languages as dejavu does17:03
smarterthe bold font looks a bit blurry17:03
smarterbut I really like déjà vu, so I'm a bit partial :p17:03
apacheloggerdroid uses less space17:04
apacheloggerwhich might in return make it less readable for people with visual impairment17:04
Riddellapachelogger: extra things on the CD aren't really an option currently17:05
apacheloggerRiddell: it is meant to be default font17:05
seeleit looks a bit narrower than nimbus17:06
seeleand dejavu17:06
seelereminds me of tahoma17:06
torkianohello all, I update this spec: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/kubuntu-voip-solution what do you think about?17:07
apacheloggerseele: http://aplg.kollide.net/images/osiris/snapshot003.png http://aplg.kollide.net/images/osiris/snapshot004.png17:08
seeleyeah, i dunno.  is there a benefit besides that it looks different?17:09
Riddelltorkiano: so wait until kopete supports it via telepathy?17:09
seeleit looks like droid has some serifs even though it is a sans serif font, heh17:09
torkianorideUbuntu/Gnome has a very good VoIP support now... (ekiga & empathy) and for jaunty was good to be a solution for kubuntu17:11
apacheloggerseele: I'll wontfix the bug17:12
torkianoRiddell: that works until kopete developerd finish the port17:12
torkianoonly a suggestion ;-)17:13
seeleapachelogger: why is there a bug? or are wishes bugs in launchpad?17:13
apacheloggerseele: wishes are in launchpad17:13
seelehuh. you could ask nuno if he likes the font17:14
seelei just dont see the benefit os switching to it.17:14
apacheloggerwell, I am quite worrid about how readable it is and how complete17:15
vorianthere is a fella in -motu trying to package droid17:16
torkianoRiddell: currently there is 2 solutions that may work (I think): Kcall and qutecom17:17
apacheloggerkcall needs too much configuration IIRC17:17
Riddelltorkiano: kcall at least has been around for a long time, I wonder why it hasn't been packaged17:18
torkianoi requested it: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/25291317:18
ubottuLaunchpad bug 252913 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] KCall" [Wishlist,Confirmed]17:18
torkianoand there is a ppa for qutecom: https://edge.launchpad.net/~cavedon/+archive17:20
apacheloggertorkiano: is kcall ported to KDE 4?17:21
torkianofrom webpage :KCall was successfully ported to the KDE4 environment, incl. Decibel.17:22
apacheloggerwell, KDE decided against adding decibel to KDE 4.217:23
torkianoI think it would be interesting to package KCall or make avaliable in a PPA at least for testing17:25
Riddellwe still have decibel packaged17:25
torkianoand kcall is in KDE repository: http://websvn.kde.org/trunk/playground/pim/kcall/17:28
Riddelltorkiano: have you tried either to see if they work?17:31
torkianoRiddell:  sorry, I'm a begginer, (I'm still trying to install an environment for KDE4 development)17:35
Riddelltorkiano: something we should look into then.  hunger would be a good person to ask for advice too since he's into decibel et al but doesn't seem to be around today17:47
torkianoRiddell: yes, the coders of Kcall and decibel are the same17:49
torkianoin https://www.ohloh.net/p/kcall you can see all te contributors17:50
torkianoand for https://www.ohloh.net/p/kcall/analyses/latest the development seems stopped17:52
torkianobut I think the major issue with VoIP are the protocols, and that is decibel/telepathy17:54
apacheloggerRiddell: do you think bug 285831 qualify for SRU?18:05
ubottuLaunchpad bug 285831 in shared-mime-info "icon for ms-word file *.doc is "?" instead of ooo-word" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/28583118:05
apacheloggerdfaure removed the magic portion from the msi mimetype18:05
ScottKapachelogger: It's a regression, right?18:08
apachelogger0.51 introduced that new mimetype with a too generic magic18:10
ScottKapachelogger: Regression is one of the criteria, so if it's a small, low risk patch, I think it'd sell.18:11
Riddellapachelogger: I wouldn't thin6k 0~it 0~worth the hassle18:11
Riddellhmm, 0~I 0~thin6k the cat peein6g on6 this keyb5oard might have don6e somethin6g b5ad18:11
apacheloggerScottK, Riddell: not only the icon is wrong but .doc/.dot/whateverelsemightbeaffected will not be associated with the correct application18:13
torkianoRiddell: This may be important to include webkit in Kubuntu: flash support for webkitkde: http://cia.vc/stats/project/kde/webkitkde/.message/2767018:13
apacheloggerthis will not work without Qt 4.5 I guess18:16
apacheloggeryeah, qwebkit only supports this in 4.518:16
torkianoups, ok apachelogger18:19
Riddellapachelogger: hmm, that seems more importan6t18:20
Riddelltorkiano: I saw that, sounds quite promising18:20
nixternalanyone going to SCALE next month?18:41
* apachelogger has a new workout plan, so he should scale down :P18:42
Nightroseapachelogger: current status of the release script?18:46
* Riddell hugs apachelogger for updating the akonadi package18:59
Riddellhas anyone been packaging the new digikam betas?19:07
LaserJockis there a knetworkmanager guru about?19:21
ScottKseele: CALug (Columbia, MD Area Linux User's Group) is looking for a presentation topic for January 14.  Maybe you could do a Kubuntu is wonderful, come join us bit ....19:21
RiddellLaserJock: you are making an assumption that such a thing exists :)19:26
LaserJockRiddell: well, I did say "is there a" not "is the"19:27
LaserJockI just installed Kubuntu Jaunty and I can't for the life of me get Knetworkmanager to work19:29
RiddellLaserJock: works for me, just upgraded from intrepid.  it won't work if you have anything fancy like pptp19:29
LaserJockwell, I just have 2 connections. One is a static IP eth0 and the other is a WPA wifi19:30
LaserJockbut neither seem to be able to connect19:30
Riddellthat should work19:30
LaserJockhmm, wonder what I did wrong19:30
LaserJock\o/, got the wifi working19:33
LaserJockok, so now what'd I do with eth019:33
=== faled_ is now known as faled
LaserJockRiddell: have you tried a static IP with knetworkmanager? there seems to be quite a few open bugs about it not working19:43
* ScottK-laptop tries kvirc now.19:46
LaserJockRiddell: found my problem, bug #279409 , I had to use instead of as my netmask19:49
ubottuLaunchpad bug 279409 in knetworkmanager "unable to configure a fixed ip on wired interface on knetworkmanager (intrepid)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/27940919:49
LaserJockRiddell: the bug report has a fix in it19:49
* ScottK looks around for a core-dev to upload the fix....19:49
* ScottK spies LaserJock....19:49
ScottK-laptopseele: I've got a working kvirc for kde4 package in my PPA if you have time to look at it too (It's the only alternative to quassel I know of for KDE4) - https://launchpad.net/~kitterman/+archive19:52
LaserJockScottK: is there any decent knetworkmanager upstream?19:55
jtechidnathere is work on a plasma frontend for networkmanager19:56
jtechidnabut the kde3 version is pretty much teh sux19:56
jtechidnain fact fedora uses the gnome nm applet19:56
LaserJockI can work up an upload based on this bug report, not sure I should just upload it though ;-)19:59
ScottK-laptopLaserJock: I haven't done any work with upstream on knetworkmanager.  Riddell is generally the one, IIRC.20:05
* jtechidna is listening to Smells Like Teen Spirit by Nirvana on Best of [Amarok2]20:24
=== jtechidna is now known as JontheEchidna
jjesse-dell9question:  if i delete something in dolphin shouldnt i be able to restore it through the trash plasmoid?20:27
jjesse-dell9cause i could only find the files in .local/share/Trash20:28
JontheEchidnajjesse-dell9: if you moved it to the trash rather than using the "delete" command, then yes20:28
jjesse-dell9if i used the delete button on my keyboar?20:28
JontheEchidnathat'll send it to the trash20:28
jjesse-dell9the files werent in the trash20:29
jjesse-dell9found them in ~/.local/share/Trash20:29
JontheEchidnathat's where kde's trash should point o20:29
jjesse-dell9there were some folders like 00 01 02 03 etc20:29
jjesse-dell9should i file a bug?20:29
jjesse-dell9and if so where should i go to?20:30
JontheEchidnadunno, sounds to me like it could be one of those obscure-type config related issues that end up rotting up in the bt untouched for a few years :P20:30
JontheEchidnainside the /share/Trash folder there should be 2 subdirs20:31
JontheEchidnafiles and info20:31
JontheEchidna~/.local/share/Trash, rather20:31
jjesse-dell9correct the files were in the files folder20:32
JontheEchidnabut they're not showing up in dolphin?20:32
jjesse-dell9in dolphin i saw some folders named 00, 01, 02, 03, 04, 05, 0620:32
jjesse-dell9but they were in empty20:32
JontheEchidnaweird, I guess the files never made it to the trash then?20:33
jjesse-dell9i could open up ~/.local/share/Trash/files in dolphin and see them but couldnt access them from trash20:33
jjesse-dell9will have to test on non critical files20:33
=== rdieter is now known as rdieter_away
Riddellapachelogger: http://techbase.kde.org/Getting_Started/Using_Project_Neon_to_contribute_to_KDE just got posted to kde-devel20:47
RiddellLaserJock: that fix for knm looks like something we want to investigate20:55
LaserJockRiddell: I've created a .patch for it20:56
=== LaserRock is now known as LaserJock
Riddellhaving no up key is very annoying, I guess keyboard don't survive being washed very well21:31
LaserJockwhat's the current situation with Amarok in Jaunty? kubuntu-desktop has no dep on it, is it waiting for Amarok 2?21:44
JontheEchidnayeah, and amarok2 is waiting on mysql 5.121:46
LaserJockJontheEchidna: oh right, the mysql 5.0 vs 5.1 stuff, etc.21:48
seeleScottK-laptop: a Kubuntu is wonderful talk huh?  You don't want to give that? :)21:57
seeleScottK-laptop: is it worth me looking at kvirc? quassel seems pretty dedicated21:58
ScottK-laptopseele: I think we don't know if quassel is going to make it or not.  I think kvirc is worth at least a quick look.22:22
ScottK-laptopseele: I could give the talk, but unfortunately I'm not available that day.22:23
seelewhat day was it again?22:25
seeleoh.. jan 14th22:25
seeleyeah, i'll have to pass.  i have a redeye from SFO that morning.  i'll be dead tired22:25
Riddellwhat's happening in SFO?22:26
seelebusiness trip22:27
seeleflying all the way out there for a two day conference for a client22:27
seelealthough that's not as bad as the day trip to LA i did last year.  THAT was rediculous.  morning flight west, red eye that same day back east22:28
seeleRiddell: how was jury duty?22:31
seelei hope you sat in on something interesting instead of sitting in the waiting room all day22:31
ScottKseele: That is ridiculous.  I once had to go to Hawaii for a two hour meeting.22:32
ScottKI stayed a 2nd day anyway.22:32
seeleScottK: THAT is rediculous.  you should have stayed longer than the 2nd day :)22:32
ScottK-laptopWell I was a single parent at the time and didn't want to be away from home longer than needed.22:33
seeleah true.  and three kids are a bit many to take to hawaii with you :)22:33
ScottK-laptopWell it was one at the time, but yes.22:35
Riddellseele: a bit scary.  the guy pled guilty after some hours of discussions so we heard his crimes and that was it22:35
seeleRiddell: yikes.. was there show and tell?22:36
Riddelljust the procurator fiscal reading out in technical details his sexual misdemeanors22:38
seelehow does it work in your courts?  innocent before proven guilty?  or convince the state otherwise?22:38
Riddellinnocent until proven of course, we're not yet a police state!22:39
seelenot -- yet?22:39
seelehey.. we're not a police state!22:40
seelethe state has the burden, not the defendant22:40
LaserJockanybody have a recommendation for/against installing koffice 2.0?22:40
seeleLaserJock: depends.. does your life depend on delivered documents?22:41
LaserJockseele: not strictly, but it'd be nice to have something that generally works22:42
seelewell if your life doesnt depend on it, i'm sure they would appreciate the testing and bug reports22:42
seelehas anyone installed the kpackagekit packages from Tonio's ppa?  it installs but it doesnt interface with apt which makes it pretty useless22:45
LaserJockdpkg: error processing /var/cache/apt/archives/koffice-data-kde4_1%3a1.9.98.4-0ubuntu1_all.deb (--unpack):22:45
LaserJock trying to overwrite `/usr/share/icons/oxygen/16x16/actions/object-order-back.png', which is also in package kde-icons-oxygen22:45
nhandlerNCommander: ping22:51
seeleScottK-laptop: crimsun: interested in a KDE4 party later this month?22:51
NCommandernhandler, pong22:51
crimsunseele: surely22:52
ScottKAlthough both kids I brought to the Intrepid release party were not entirely thrilled.22:52
nhandlerNCommander: Is a full GPL License header required for the package to get uploaded to Debian? Or is a line saying "This program is released under the GPL (http://www.gnu.org/copyleft/gpl.html)" fine?22:52
nhandlerScottK: I wish my parents were like you22:52
seeleScottK: kde people are way cooler than those ubunteros22:52
ScottKnhandler: You need a full copy of the license in the tarball.22:52
ScottKseele: ;-)22:52
nhandlerScottK: It has one22:53
NCommanderScottK, there is one, the files themselves have no license and the copyright was wrong.22:53
nhandlerScottK: I'm talking about the individual scripts in the source22:53
nhandlerNCommander: So would that line suffice? Or should I get a full header?22:53
seeleScottK: i'm thinking a pirate restaurant bar.  would they be interested in that?  it is family friendly22:53
ScottKI don't think that's essential.  Pretty much as in Ubuntu, although it depends on who reviews it.22:53
seeleScottK: http://piratztavern.com/ (warning.. lots of flash)22:53
seelecrimsun: ^^22:53
nhandlerScottK: Ok, I thought Debian was more strict about the licensing things22:54
ScottKseele: Well my 5 year old was trying to talk like a pirate on the way home today without prompting.22:54
NCommanderScottK, I'd disagree, I'm suprised this package flew through NEW (although old versions are GPL vs. LGPL)22:54
Riddellnhandler: stuff like that mostly depends on that attitude of the archive admin on dity22:54
Riddellnhandler: if the tar contains a full copy of the licence that should be fine22:55
ScottKseele: The Flash even works on my Konqueror ....22:55
nhandlerOk, so I'll modify debian/copyright NCommander, and then you can hopefully sponsor it ;)22:56
ScottKThat should be fine.22:56
seeleScottK: it must be old flash then, hehe22:56
NCommanderRiddell, generally, I would REJECT on that22:56
NCommanderRiddell, if it were up to me22:56
seeleScottK: it's pretty fun.  the wait staff dress up and talk funny22:56
RiddellNCommander: on what?22:56
NCommanderRiddell, not having headers in files.22:56
NCommanderRiddell, its was a requirement when I was a FSF Savannah Admin22:56
ScottKNCommander: A LOT of stuff that's not rejected would get rejected on that basis.22:56
* seele starts on dinner22:57
nhandlerNCommander: All of the scriptsmention the license, it is just not a formal copyright header22:57
NCommanderScottK, sorry, the FSF skrewed my ability to parse licenses22:57
ScottKseele: Please pick a day that's not a Thursday.22:57
RiddellNCommander: as an upstream FSF should have a clear policy but as downstreams we need to look at what we get and judge if it's clear what it means, putting in a full copy of the licence in the tar seems like pretty clear intent that everything in that tar can be copied with that licence22:58
nhandlerSince the files don't have the normal copyright header, in debian/copyright, should I just list it as gplv2 like the COPYING file says, or should I do gplv2 (or at your option) any later version?23:04
seeleScottK: that's fine with me.  is Friday night (~7) OK or would you rather do Saturday afternoon?23:05
seelecrimsun: ^^23:05
ScottKseele: Either should be fine.  The youngest can pass out in the car on the way home if it's in the evening.23:06
Riddellnhandler: put whatever is in the file headers23:07
nhandlerRiddell: The file headers just say "This program is released under the GPL (http://www.gnu.org/copyleft/gpl.html)" (and they aren't really headers, they are 60 down the script)23:08
nhandlers/60/60 lines/23:09
crimsunseele: Friday night is probably better; i'll ping maco23:10
Riddellnhandler: copy the relevant parts out of the COPYING file then23:10
seeleScottK: crimsun: awesome.. i'll send a notice out to the different lugs etc.23:10
macohi, what about meeting at piratz?23:11
crimsunmaco: we already decided without you. you're too late!23:11
macowell *which* friday at 7 or is it saturday?23:11
seelemaco: Jan 30 is KDE release party23:12
seelemaco: sunday Jan 18 is linux chix23:12
macoso i'll see you twice in two weeks when i havent seen you twice in the last year? :P23:13
macoi think thats my fault for missing so many linuxchix meetings though23:13
macoalright, well ill put those on the calendar23:14
macoand then there's the global bug jam in feb23:15
macoi still need to figure out why kubuntu doesn't work with my user's home directory :(23:15
macoseele: you interested in bug jam?23:15
* ScottK prefers strawberry.23:16
macoScottK: are you in the DC area too?23:17
seelemaco: doesn't that require coding of some sort?23:17
macoseele: no, just triaging23:17
ScottKmaco: More west of Baltimore, but yes.23:18
macoseele: you can set the importance of usability bugs23:18
seelemaco: i think i'll pass.  i spend enough of my non-working waking hours on oss as it is23:18
macoor confirm or ask questions or whatever23:18
macoheh ok23:18
ScottKseele, crimsun, and maco: BACON-PIG is on the 19th.23:18
macobacon? ew23:18
macoi mean um....yummy! meat! er...everybody loves bacon! er...i give up23:19
ScottKThat's Baltimore, Annapolis, Columbia, and Other Northern suburbs - Python Interest Group.23:19
ScottKMeets at Goddard Space Flight Centet in Greenbelt.23:19
macoah ok see explanations help23:20
seeleScottK: is Goddard where they have the Yuri space party every year?23:20
macoeh, i usually avoid python so i dont think ill be going23:20
seelehrm.. dinner is done.  now where is my other half23:20
ScottKBarry Warsaw (LP developer in real life) is doing a session on porting to Python 3.23:20
ScottKseele: Dunno.23:20
macooh so you're saying this is a chance to meet up and talk about bass IRL :P23:21
maco(i'm talking to him about playing bass right now)23:21
ScottKThat's between you and him.23:21
* ScottK prefers to eat the fish and not play with them himself.23:21
* seele blinks23:21
* maco wonders if seele figured it out23:32
nhandlerNCommander: I just uploaded a new version with an updated debian/copyright file23:52
NCommanderI'll take a look at it later23:53

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