=== ember_ is now known as ember [10:04] anyone there ? [10:06] adityag: ? [10:07] randa: in here for a membership [10:09] @schedule berlin [10:09] Schedule for Europe/Berlin: 08 Jan 13:00: Ubuntu Mobile Team | 08 Jan 14:00: Desktop Team | 08 Jan 15:00: Ubuntu Java | 13 Jan 22:00: LoCo Council | 15 Jan 01:30: Forum Council | 19 Jan 23:00: IRC Council [10:09] adityag: it seems like there is no membership board meeting scheduled right now [10:10] adityag: which board did you apply with? [10:10] dholbach: Membership/RegionalBoards/AsiaOceania [10:10] but i still have to add my name there [10:10] 06-January-2009, 09:00 UTC was the last meeting [10:11] not sure when the next one is [10:11] adityag : you have to add your apply on the WiKi page for the next meeting [10:12] MaWaLe: i am just editing it, just below yours [10:14] ad affiliate to this wiki page so on every change you'll be notified [10:14] s/ad/and [10:14] MaWaLe: so did you attend it ? [10:14] yes adityag [10:14] MaWaLe: [10:14] ok good... [10:15] and and i'm delayed to the next meeting [10:15] MaWaLe: when is the next meeting ? [10:16] still not mentioned [10:16] but i think there will be one the next week [10:19] MaWaLe: ok, is this your profile ? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Wajih [10:20] adityag : you have to update your personal wiki page and to prepare a brief introduction to introduce yoursel during the meeting [10:20] yes : it's mine [10:20] MaWaLe: i have done it [10:20] but it's not the best example to have :) [10:23] good luck adityag [10:24] thanks.........same 2 u === popey_ is now known as popey === ubottu changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Current meeting: Ubuntu Mobile Team Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 08 Jan 13:00: Desktop Team | 08 Jan 14:00: Ubuntu Java | 13 Jan 21:00: LoCo Council | 15 Jan 00:30: Forum Council | 19 Jan 22:00: IRC Council [11:59] Hey [12:00] #startmeeting [12:00] Meeting started at 06:00. The chair is davidm. [12:00] Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE] [12:00] * ogra waves [12:00] * NCommander waves [12:00] hello, the Mobile Team Meeting is started. :) [12:01] * StevenK shores [12:01] heh [12:01] I read that as snores [12:01] anyway ... [12:01] welcome to the first meeting of 2009, I hope everyone had a good end of year. [12:01] Wow it's really late for StevenK [12:01] persia, ? [12:01] Meh, 11pm [12:01] ogra, ? [12:02] ah [12:02] It was the same time at the end of last year, too [12:02] To everybody I didn't have the occasion to wish a happy new year: happy new year [12:02] Yea, and it's 0600 where I'm sitting so no fair grumping, I'd much rather be up at 23:00 then 06:00 [12:03] * Hobbsee hands davidm a keg full of coffee. [12:03] Anyway on to the agenda at: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileTeam/Meeting/2009/20090108 [12:03] * StevenK isn't grumbling, just tired [12:03] Thank you Hobbsee, I'm needing that at the moment :) [12:03] :) [12:04] Actually we had actions from 2008 [12:04] lool, I was just about to ask that. [12:05] bah, thats so last year [12:05] I need to get mootbot a better home so logs can be reached easier [12:05] not on the wiki; need to dig log [12:06] [action] lool to grab the UMPC image and test. [12:06] I did that [12:06] specs by [12:06] EPASTE [12:06] [action] lool, StevenK, persia, ogra to update their specs by Jan 8th [12:06] I need to talk about the UMPC image, too [12:06] Ah found them [12:06] Sorry, back for a sec to UMPC image: I filed a bunch of bugs, there were a bunch of issues we need to address [12:06] meh, i havent finished the touchscreen one yet ... (will do so before the weekend) [12:06] log is http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2008/12/18/%23ubuntu-meeting.html [12:07] (teh BOF discussion was dumped in though, just needs proper formatting) [12:07] Concerning specs, I didn't work on them; I'm afraid I misplanned working on them over the holidays and was sick on Mon and Tues and didn't have time to do them this week; I expect I'll do them by next week or earlier along with other tasks [12:08] persia: I think you reviewed a bunch of specs; do you mind if I ask you for help in finding which ones I still need to look at? [12:08] Oh right, there was [action] persia to grab unclaimed specs and update those. [12:08] Might be why [12:08] lool, Not at all. I'm nearly done with the overview review, and would be happy to send you a list of things to do, although probably in 15-18 hours. [12:08] * ogra would be grateful for something like that as well ... the only one i can clearly say it's mine is the touchscreen thing [12:09] * persia accepts action to task all open specs [12:10] HA found mootbot log updated agenda [12:10] As an aside, all the specs that were discussed during UDS have now been drafted [12:11] At least initially. I know I haven't completed at least 10 of the ones I wrote. [12:11] NCommander, all ? [12:11] I added actions at the top of the current meeting [12:11] s/all/the mobile ones/g [12:11] davidm: Ah seems we were two :à) [12:11] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JauntyTouchscreenHandling is definately not done [12:11] (i would know that :) ) [12:12] * NCommander inserts foot in mouth and turns left [12:12] [action] persia to send reminders to all on spec issues. [12:12] ACTION received: persia to send reminders to all on spec issues. [12:12] Wow we wrote exactly the same text [12:12] [ACTION] ogra to finish the touchscreen spec ... (will do so before the weekend) [12:12] ACTION received: ogra to finish the touchscreen spec ... (will do so before the weekend) [12:12] thanks [12:13] persia: Cool thanks; 15-18 hours is fine [12:13] OK [12:13] persia: I'll block on that and sit idle until I get it [12:13] let me set a belated topic [12:13] [topic] Action Items from Dec 18th, 2008 [12:13] New Topic: Action Items from Dec 18th, 2008 [12:14] lool, Erm. Don't do that. I was planning to sleep some of those 15-18 hours. [12:14] [topic] lool to move UNR text to wiki page. [12:14] New Topic: lool to move UNR text to wiki page. [12:14] * ogra guesses lool was joking [12:14] I'm searching for the URL, but it's done [12:14] lool, great [12:14] ogra: Ah you can see the plans in the plans [12:14] heh [12:15] It was https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UNR/jaunty-integration and was merged in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Specs/JauntyUNR [12:15] eeek [12:15] (I actually only had to poke bfiller who had already done the work of listing work items on a wiki page) [12:15] DVD ??? ! [12:15] [link] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UNR/jaunty-integration [12:15] LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UNR/jaunty-integration [12:15] areally evil [12:15] [link] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Specs/JauntyUNR [12:15] LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Specs/JauntyUNR [12:16] ogra, DVDs are good, because they contain *lots* of langpacks. [12:16] ogra: i'd skip to Modification Details for the list of things we'll actually work on right now [12:16] OK lool are you happy with the pages? [12:16] persia, DVDs are the most horrid to test [12:16] davidm: It's a good start; we'll update it / discuss it during implementation [12:16] I suppose. [12:16] ogra: I think they meant .iso [12:16] simply because tehy are so huge [12:16] OK [12:17] lool, i dont care about the image format, but about the size [12:17] ogra: We can build both of a DVD and an ISO [12:17] and a CDROM sized ISO I mean [12:17] ah, good [12:17] Can we? [12:17] Who was going to break this news to me? [12:17] :-P [12:17] Anyway, there are handy ways to test DVDs: the testing team has some automation that can be leveraged. [12:17] lool just did [12:17] That so doesn't count [12:17] StevenK, ^^ [12:17] You chickens [12:17] persia, doesnt make them smaller [12:17] It's an option; these requirements were set by OEM folks; we can go back to them and tell them we're building a CD ISO for now, and would like to discuss the option of a DVD with them [12:18] ogra, Actually, they use rsync, which makes the download smaller, but we're digressing. [12:18] yeah [12:18] As in: is it a typo, do you really need it, why etc. [12:18] And "who will be testing it?" [12:18] right [12:18] yes we are digressing [12:18] any actions from this right now? [12:18] the initial plan was to just modify the umpc image to be unr [12:19] I'm working on it [12:19] ogra: And that's how we will start; at some point we need to reconcile OEM's expectations with our implementation [12:19] It's how I have started [12:19] davidm: Don't think so, apart of implementation of the UNR spec [12:19] i'd like us to stick with that since all other stuff will put a lot extra work up we dont have the manpower for [12:19] (Which doesn't need an action) [12:19] OK then lets move on [12:19] The seeds, the meta packages and the tasks have all changed [12:19] [topic] StevenK to sort out seed changes [12:19] New Topic: StevenK to sort out seed changes [12:19] It has a spec. Specs will become actions, once I assign them :) [12:19] StevenK, ogra: Let's bring up DVD with bfiller and others and see whether it's a firm option [12:20] davidm: You could action that [12:20] Next is livecd-rootfs and cdimage scripts [12:20] Since there's a lot of contention on the DVD issue [12:20] [action] lool to bring up DVD with bfiller and others and see whether it's a firm need [12:20] ACTION received: lool to bring up DVD with bfiller and others and see whether it's a firm need [12:20] lool, i dont see us having the manpower to do any DVD work, but well [12:20] Ah I knew it would fall on my head [12:20] StevenK, ogra: i'll make sure you're in this discussion though [12:20] thanks [12:20] ogra, we can ask for help from OEM if DVD is critical for them for some reason [12:21] ogra: let's not discuss this until we're sure we do one or why we need one [12:21] StevenK, are you happy with seeds at this point? [12:21] davidm: At this point, yes. [12:21] OK moving on then [12:21] the packages need proper autostart files etc ... [12:22] davidm: As soon as we have a installable image, I'll become unhappy, since I'll have to change them a lot [12:22] but thast for "until FF" [12:22] [topic] persia -> I'll move the mobile-applications to a wiki page, and send email expecting people to update it for the next meeting [12:22] * NCommander has some info on d-i's status on ARM [12:22] New Topic: persia -> I'll move the mobile-applications to a wiki page, and send email expecting people to update it for the next meeting [12:22] * persia was an abject failure [12:22] carry over that action then persia ? [12:22] I put it on the agenda for today though, hoping we could assign people to each app. [12:23] Ah [12:23] OK [12:23] I'm worried about this whole thing, even more so with one person per app [12:23] Why more so with one person per app? [12:23] what would you suggest instead ? [12:24] Well we'll do a frankenstein thing with random apps [12:24] We each test the alternatives over the next week, and we have the answer at the next meeting? [12:24] we do have one already [12:24] So we call Ubuntu Frankenstein and Ubuntu Frankensmaller [12:24] I'll make the seed changes now [12:24] hehe [12:25] haha [12:25] I think we need one guy to do a 5000 foot view [12:25] If you ask people here what mail app they prefer you'll get 4/5 different responses, same for photo viewing or text edition; I expect it will be somewhat the same in the MID case, even if everybody knows we're not biased [12:26] Since we're basically not investing as much time on the MID image this cycle, why do we want to reconsider all apps this cycle? [12:26] I believe the solution is "just use emacs for everything, and save space" [12:26] (sorry for asking fundamental questions on this spec :-/) [12:26] lool, that is a valid poing [12:26] lool, that is a valid point that is [12:26] lool, I'm not happy with my MID. I'd like to have a reasonable set of apps, and be happy. [12:27] * ogra agrees with lool [12:27] persia: I'm not happy with it either, and I can see that this is generally needed, but also a lot of work; I also think splitting it amongst various people will result in a different but almost equally bad result [12:27] lool: well, won't it be somewhat limited by the fact that various of the options won't fit on the screen anyway? [12:28] Hobbsee: Sure [12:28] lool, It's just testing the candidates to see how they work in jaunty, and whether they fit on the screen. [12:28] I'm not suggesting people go and recode stuff or anything. [12:29] It's some "research" of possible apps [12:29] AIUI [12:29] For most of them we have a list of 3-4 candidates from UDS. It's just testing those. [12:29] Ok; is there a list of things to check / test for them as well? [12:29] e.g. finger-friendly [12:30] lool, I agree and I don't want to invest too much time on this, we don't have the cycles, but I'm willing to invest some amount of time. [12:30] lool, There's a short "requirements" list, yes. [12:30] I think a couple of hours of everybody's time to try out apps is fine, as long as we keep it documented in a safe place [12:31] My personal fear is that a better solution would be to package new stuff which isn't in the archive, or improve some existing stuff [12:31] ++ [12:31] Say, what if there's a cool maemo.org project of a new foo app and it would be the winner would it be in our archive [12:31] we should not lose the overview [12:31] but surely not invest to much time [12:31] Well, let's document stuff at least [12:31] I don't want new stuff. Just testing. Some of the stuff we have doesn't work at all well, and we can just toss it out. [12:32] it's really late in cycle to import anything, but documenting things it OK with me. [12:32] Ok, let's start with this research of in-archive apps as a first step then [12:32] persia, can you take the action to drive this, ie: list of things to check for each category? [12:32] I agree it's useful, albeit probably not enough to chose the best apps for MID [12:33] Sure. It will be in the spec tomorrow. [12:33] What I want now is people to volunteer for each class. I'll name a class, and someone say "Me". First always wins. [12:33] Browser. [12:33] We're talking of 14 categories; I expect some 20-30 apps to test and we're 7 not counting davidm [12:33] Some probably longer than others [12:33] RIght. So everyone gets two. [12:33] [action] persia to pull together a list of things to check for MID Application Selection. [12:33] ACTION received: persia to pull together a list of things to check for MID Application Selection. [12:34] I'll take calendar [12:34] Heh [12:34] I'll take the ones nobody else wants. [12:34] and text editor [12:34] [action] lool to look at calendar [12:34] I'll look at file managers [12:34] ACTION received: lool to look at calendar [12:34] and ... instant messager [12:34] I don't remember the categories [12:34] [action] lool to look at text editor [12:34] ACTION received: lool to look at text editor [12:34] StevenK: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileTeam/Meeting/2009/20090108 [12:34] [action] NCommander to look at file managers [12:34] ACTION received: NCommander to look at file managers [12:34] Disclaimer: I don't actually have a device that can run MID, so all my testing will be in a KVM image [12:34] * ogra takes on screen kbd [12:34] [action] NCommander to look at instant messager [12:34] ACTION received: NCommander to look at instant messager [12:35] Feed Reader [12:35] Book Reader [12:35] [action] ogra to look at on screen kbd [12:35] ACTION received: ogra to look at on screen kbd [12:35] and alarm clock [12:35] [action] StevenK to look at Feed Reader [12:35] [action] StevenK to look at Book Reader [12:35] ACTION received: StevenK to look at Book Reader [12:35] the uglyness bothers me since a while [12:35] StevenK, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileTeam/Meeting/2009/20090108 has the categories [12:35] NCommander: Needs to be davidm saying it [12:35] [action] ogra to look at alarm clock [12:35] ACTION received: ogra to look at alarm clock [12:35] Argh we're not 7 but 6, I counted amitk on the agenda [12:35] StevenK, I thought action was a general command, oh well. [12:36] [action] StevenK to look at Feed Reader [12:36] ACTION received: StevenK to look at Feed Reader [12:36] What''s left? [12:36] i was planning to look into fennec ... [12:36] amitk is not here [12:36] I'm removing amitk from the agenda; he's only invited here and not present these weeks anyway [12:36] so i might take web browser as well [12:36] [action] ogra to look at web browsers [12:36] ACTION received: ogra to look at web browsers [12:37] I'll take address book as well then [12:37] ogra, I'm interested in just how good fennec is, please let me know what you think as you play with it. :-) [12:37] There might be some overlap with email or instant messenger obviously [12:37] [action] lool to look at address book [12:37] ACTION received: lool to look at address book [12:37] Leftovers are Document viewer, Photo Viewer, Media Player, and Onscreen Keyboard? [12:37] * lool long week ahead [12:37] i tried eth recent release on maemo and it still sucks a bit but improved [12:37] Could someone else take one of those? [12:38] persia, ogra took Onscreen Keyboard [12:38] persia: onscreen was taken by ogra [12:38] right [12:38] ogra has Onscreen Keyboard? [12:38] s/?// [12:38] NCommander: You need to say it too [12:38] :) [12:38] so persia are you willing to take on: Document viewer, Photo Viewer, Media Player? [12:38] ogra, has the onscreen keyboard? ohnos! [12:38] :-P [12:38] ;) [12:38] Great. I get Document Viewer, Photo Viewer, and Media Player then. Lots of books and movies. Hurrah! [12:39] persia, and i have the onscreen keyboard [12:39] [action] persia to review Document viewer [12:39] ACTION received: persia to review Document viewer [12:39] [action] persia to review Photo Viewer [12:39] ACTION received: persia to review Photo Viewer [12:39] [action] persia to review Media Player [12:39] ACTION received: persia to review Media Player [12:40] At least persia won't ask me to look at elisa [12:40] OK are we done with this topic for now? [12:40] Yes. That was it. Thanks. [12:40] * davidm can't wait to see the mootbot log for this one ;-) [12:40] heh [12:41] I think my poor Q1 is still cooling down from trying to run it [12:41] OK then on to current business [12:41] [topic] status [12:41] New Topic: status [12:41] [topic] StevenK's status [12:41] New Topic: StevenK's status [12:42] asleep ? [12:42] apparently we have terminally overheated StevenK's Q1 [12:43] Let's go back to him later; we'll soon get his AR too [12:43] ogra: looks like it. [12:43] [topic] lool's status [12:43] New Topic: lool's status [12:43] sitting [12:43] * davidm grins [12:44] General catchup done; finishing a SRU and then will be done for intrepid stuff [12:44] Currently high on the TODO are specs and some canonical work items [12:45] That's about it; I have a good overview of tasks to accomplish; let me know if you need something urgently from me and I didn't ack it [12:45] OK thanks lool [12:45] [topic] ogra's status [12:45] New Topic: ogra's status [12:45] dumped BOF notes into the touchscreen spec, no further mobile related work, did hardware enablement for some specific arm HW which doesnt belong into this meeting ... [12:45] and sitting as well :) [12:46] * davidm 10k people out of work and we have ogra for humor [12:46] ;-) [12:46] heh [12:46] StevenK has some connectivity issues with freenode, will be back shortly we hope [12:47] tahts it for this week from my side :) [12:47] I'm here [12:47] Ah OK [12:47] [topic] StevenK's status [12:47] New Topic: StevenK's status [12:47] bringing back StevenK status [12:48] I did armel stuff after UDS before breaking up, I've mostly been working on moving UMPC to UNR [12:49] StevenK, thanks, anything else to add? [12:49] Nope [12:50] [topic] NCommander's status [12:50] New Topic: NCommander's status [12:50] ENOCOFFEE, EBROKENCOFFEEMAKER, ENOSLEEP, EXRANDRISEVIL, WLOWCOKE, WLOWCAFFIENE, WCOLD, ISITTING [12:50] I drafted a couple of the UDS specs for the mobile, which I'm running through Steve [12:51] Before Christmas, I also managed to get MID semi-working on ARM (I think the issue with gnome-settings-manager has been resolved, so it probably will work should I take another stab at it) [12:52] That's all I got. [12:52] oh wait [12:52] haha [12:53] I would also like to join the ubuntu-mobile team :-) [12:53] Ah, we need to vote on that I think, correct persia? [12:53] Denied. Next! [12:53] * StevenK grins evilly [12:53] * persia digs up the records for the policy [12:54] Right. Applicants need to have contributed some stuff, and then need to get votes from current team members. [12:54] I think you need a couple more months as a MOTU before joining the mobile team -- nahh just kidding, I'm +1 [12:54] So, votes from current team members (LP: ~ubuntu-mobile) [12:55] Ooooh. [12:55] + [12:55] That could draw blood, lool [12:55] 1 [12:55] davidm, +1 [12:55] +1 [12:55] +1 from me: the architecture-neutral stuff was great. [12:55] ogra is writing vertically now [12:56] y [12:56] e [12:56] a [12:56] h [12:56] xrandr to the rescue [12:56] : [12:56] ) [12:56] Oh, sigh [12:56] lool, that's an improvement, last night my LCDs were upside down to make my world right side up [12:56] * StevenK retroactively slaughters ogra [12:56] * ogra bleeds on the floor [12:56] So I think we have enough +1s [12:56] At least he didn't do /\nm\ne\n [12:56] And still two status reports to fit in 4 minutes [12:56] OK works for me, NCommander welcome to the team [12:57] [topic] persia's status [12:57] New Topic: persia's status [12:57] INEWLPBADGE,IWOO [12:57] * StevenK shifts NCommander out of Zope context [12:58] Oh, I've just been reading specs, determining what needs to be done, and who's likely to care. I fixed a couple specs that people whined about specifically. === ubottu changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Current meeting: Desktop Team Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 08 Jan 14:00: Ubuntu Java | 13 Jan 21:00: LoCo Council | 15 Jan 00:30: Forum Council | 19 Jan 22:00: IRC Council [12:58] persia, anything else? [12:59] Nope. [12:59] [topic] davidm's status [12:59] New Topic: davidm's status [12:59] I've been reading specs and in meeting with other teams to update specs [12:59] getting ready to present Ubuntu Mobile at LCA [12:59] and that's it for now' [13:00] OK [13:00] we are out of time [13:00] #endmeeting [13:00] Meeting finished at 07:00. [13:00] thanks everyone [13:01] davidm: thanks for chairing [13:02] thanks === ubottu changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Current meeting: Ubuntu Java Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 13 Jan 21:00: LoCo Council | 15 Jan 00:30: Forum Council | 19 Jan 22:00: IRC Council [14:03] Anyone here for the Java Meeting? [14:04] persia: yup. :-) [14:04] yes [14:05] OK. No special agenda this week (see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JavaTeam/Meeting) [14:06] Roadmap then. [14:06] robilad isn't here, so we'll skip that part (really not expecting much progress until the Maven stuff is complete anyway). [14:06] slytherin, How is MoveToUniverse going? [14:07] I'm working on the Maven stuff ;-) [14:07] persia: not much to do there except jboss for which I have logged the bug already. [14:07] slytherin, So we're basically caught up with Debian at this point, and to get further requires real research on the copyright state of things? [14:08] persia: we are almost caught up with Debian. Whatever packages are remaining are not high profile packages. [14:09] OK. Are you expecting to move ahead of Debian, or work with Debian on MoveToMain, and then keep up-to-date? [14:11] As of now I just plan to get in sync with Debian. [14:11] OK. Anything blocking? Need any help? [14:12] nothing blocking. I will bug some archive admin for jboss bug. But that's it. [14:12] OK. Next, is Maven. [14:12] ludovicc, As Koon is away today, could you give us a quick precis of status on that effort? [14:13] I'm working with Debian (Torsten Werner) to build Maven projects in Debian [14:14]