[03:54] <nubae> LaserJock:
[03:54] <nubae> u wanted to talk to me yesterday I believe
[03:54] <LaserJock> nubae: yeah
[03:54] <LaserJock> nubae: wanted you to look at the new homepage we were working on
[03:54] <nubae> yeah I published it :-)
[03:55] <nubae> there are still a couple other pages that need the 'edubuntu is a distribution' parts taken out
[03:56] <LaserJock> ah, cool
[03:56] <nubae> that, and I need your help with the community and help pages
[03:56] <LaserJock> I did a quick triage of all the edubuntu.org pages
[03:56] <nubae> both have contacts that are probably out of date
[03:56] <LaserJock> yeah, I actually got an email from one of the contacts today asking for it to be updated :-)
[03:57] <nubae> ok, so what should we change there... I put you up there, since you weren't mentioned
[03:57] <nubae> starting with the help and support page..
[03:58] <nubae> teh education realm should probably be switched to Riched right?
[03:59] <nubae> Technical/General, to you?
[03:59] <LaserJock> I don't have time to work on it tonight
[03:59] <LaserJock> I think we can discuss that one via mailing list
[03:59] <nubae> ok no worries, shall we set a time?
[03:59] <LaserJock> since we're putting people's names down I think we should get broader discussion
[04:00] <nubae> I doubt anyone is going to answer on the mailing list :-)
[04:00] <nubae> but sure we can try...
[04:00] <LaserJock> I'm not sure if we even want to do a ton for specific contacts, especially since they often go away
[04:00] <LaserJock> well, even if it's me and you
[04:00] <nubae> and then set a time when me and you can go over specifics in the page
[04:00] <LaserJock> it's a little hard to work on lists, etc. on IRC
[04:00] <LaserJock> I do want to talk to you a little about the Download page
[04:01] <nubae> yup... ok yeah I agree, 3 contacts at most
[04:01] <LaserJock> specifically that there is 3 similar but different Download pages
[04:01] <nubae> hmmm, I only see 2
[04:02] <LaserJock> node 3, 47 and whatever node /Download is
[04:02] <nubae> but are they all published?
[04:03] <LaserJock> not sure, at least 2 are
[04:03] <nubae> on the front page, we have a link to downloads, and then the banner at the top brings you to a kind of download page too
[04:03] <nubae> I guess those 2 links could go to the same place
[04:03] <LaserJock> the link on the frontpage goes to a different node than 3 and 47
[04:03] <Ahmuck> good evening
[04:05] <nubae> it goes to 53
[04:05] <nubae> which seems to be the only active one
[04:05] <nubae> the other download-like page is the new release announcement
[04:06] <LaserJock> ok, let's come up with a syntax or naming scheme
[04:06] <LaserJock> 1) I'd like to archive release announcements and release notes for each release
[04:07] <LaserJock> 2) rather than updating the same page for each release we should just change the url aliases
[04:07] <nubae> ok, by archiving them, we take out the url rewrite, unpublish and leave as a node
[04:07] <nubae> yeah we normally do that
[04:07] <nubae> at least I've been doing that, like in the case of the homepage
[04:07] <nubae> problem is, that gets messy
[04:07] <nubae> there are a ton of unpublished pages that serve no purpose
[04:07] <LaserJock> well, for the homepage I don't think we really need to do that so much
[04:08] <LaserJock> right
[04:08] <LaserJock> I don't think we need to unpublish them either
[04:08] <nubae> ok so for which pages
[04:08] <nubae> well, the thing is the url changes to a node
[04:08] <nubae> so no one will find it anyway
[04:08] <LaserJock> google might
[04:08] <nubae> unless we link to old release announcements some how
[04:09] <LaserJock> and what I'm thinking is that we can make an archive page that links to them
[04:09] <nubae> ok
[04:09] <nubae> ok, so we do this for announcements and which other pages?
[04:09] <LaserJock> I think the application lists, any release-specific documentation, release notes, and release announcements should be done this way
[04:10] <nubae> k I'll jot that down in a tomboy note
[04:10] <LaserJock> the thing is I want to keep info on there
[04:11] <LaserJock> so that the site is not only useful for people getting the very latest release
[04:11] <LaserJock> for instance, a lot of people will be using 8.04 for a while
[04:12] <nubae> well, the release notes from 8.04 hardly changed to 8.19
[04:12] <nubae> 8.10
[04:12] <LaserJock> i know
[04:12] <LaserJock> but that may not always be the case
[04:12] <nubae> only the release name was changed, which of course is something that should be remedied... we should mention what is new with the releases
[04:12] <nubae> so people have a feeling that the thing is growing
[04:13] <nubae> not just cloning itself
[04:13] <LaserJock> sure
[04:13] <LaserJock> it's just that nobody did it for 8.10
[04:13] <nubae> ok, so back downloads, what should we do?
[04:14] <nubae> in the release annoncement we could point to the download pages instead of repeating the full instructions there
[04:14] <LaserJock> well  so do we have duplicates or are a couple actually release announcements?
[04:15] <nubae> the places where instructions for downloading are is in the release notes (/news/8.10-release) and the downloads page (/Download)
[04:16] <nubae> my thinking is we can keep release notes just about that, and point them to the download page for full instructions
[04:16] <LaserJock> I think so
[04:16] <LaserJock> because I want to keep the actual release notes and announcments
[04:16] <LaserJock> but if they include download instructions that gets oudated
[04:17] <LaserJock> so /Download should be basically the only place with downloading instructions
[04:17] <nubae> kewl
[04:18] <LaserJock> I renamed a few pages
[04:18] <LaserJock> but I think we should go through and make sure that the release-specific pages have the release in them
[04:18] <LaserJock> perhaps using 8.10: <whatever>  etc.
[04:19] <nubae> also, the edubuntu wiki is a bit of a mess
[04:20] <nubae> pointing to there is like going to an outside source that is very out of date
[04:20] <nubae> I think it does more damage than good at this point
[04:23] <nubae> apart from the develop part, the rest is duplication of what is already on or should be on the edubuntu.org page
[04:24] <nubae> the wiki should really be about how to get stuff working, describing and rating the apps, projects being undertaken by us...
[04:24] <nubae> etc
[04:26] <nubae> whatcha think?
[04:27] <Ahmuck> nn
[04:27] <LaserJock> well
[04:27] <LaserJock> there's points both ways
[04:28] <LaserJock> many fewer people have access to edubuntu.org
[04:28] <nubae> well from a maintenance point of view, we shouldnt be duplicating data
[04:28] <LaserJock> so it's often been more outdated than the wiki
[04:28] <nubae> well, thats not the case now
[04:28] <nubae> right now the wiki is far more outdated, and duplicate
[04:29] <LaserJock> how duplicative?
[04:31] <nubae> communication, participate, teams, contact us, faq
[04:32] <nubae> anyway I have to go, but its an idea to think about what exactly we want to do with the wiki.... It shouldnt just be another edubuntu.org with some extra material
[04:33] <nubae> oh b4 I forget
[04:33] <nubae> there was  a bug report about moodle... its related to postrgres and permission
[04:34] <LaserJock> yes
[04:34] <nubae> I suggest making moodle depend on mysql instead, its far more common
[04:34] <LaserJock> it does
[04:34] <nubae> and easier to auto install
[04:34] <nubae> anyone wanting to use postrgres, will more than likely know how to install that manually
[04:35] <LaserJock> our package does either, but default so mysql
[04:35] <nubae> and will want to too, postgres isnt something u should be installing unless you know what u are doing
[04:35] <LaserJock> ^to
[04:35] <nubae> hmmm, last I checked it defaulted to postgres
[04:35] <nubae> and it would seem from that error report that his did too
[04:36] <nubae> I'll try it on a fresh ubuntu vm
[04:36] <LaserJock> oh, you're right
[04:36] <LaserJock> you can just check the package
[04:36] <LaserJock> apt-cache show moodle
[04:36] <LaserJock> postgresql-client |mysql-client
[04:36] <nubae> yah right :-) ok so if we switch to mysql, we'll get far fewer problems and be able to strike that bug away
[04:37] <LaserJock> there was a reason for doing postgresql but I can't remember it
[04:37] <nubae> well, its a better db for sure, for scaling...
[04:38] <nubae> but anyone that is going to be doing 1000s of users will need to know what they are doing
[04:38] <nubae> so its kinda moot... mysql is easy enough for everyone
[04:39] <LaserJock> well we can discuss that
[04:39] <nubae> oh, there is another server side app we can look at, that links into moodle a bit... its an e-portfolio type software... very powerful, like a school based facebook, but geared totally towards learning
[04:39] <nubae> its called Mahara
[04:40] <nubae> maybe u've heard of it
[04:40] <LaserJock> i have
[04:40] <nubae> I wrote an article about it a while back: http://www.nubae.com/mahara-e-portfolio-for-moodle
[04:41] <nubae> its in universe
[04:41] <LaserJock> cool
[04:41] <nubae> oh, u wanna check out a live mahara, I have one here on my server?
[04:42] <LaserJock> sure
[04:42] <nubae> http://nubae.selfip.com/mahara/htdocs/
[04:44] <nubae> ok, created a user for u: laserjoch
[04:44] <nubae> laserjock even
[04:44] <nubae> with pass mahara5
[04:46] <nubae> its actually really neat... its like a common place for students to store their data, post resumes, interact, grab posted files for whatever reason, etc
[04:53] <nubae> needs some more research but could be a good addition to the edubuntu server packages
[04:53] <LaserJock> yeah, i'd like to beef that up
[04:53] <nubae> oh, its totally modular
[04:54] <nubae> can be easily adjusted to whatever we want
[04:54] <nubae> so from a server side we have php mysql ejabberd, moodle right now
[04:55] <nubae> and possibly mahara and schooltool+
[04:55] <nubae> right?
[04:55] <LaserJock> I don't know about schooltool
[04:55] <LaserJock> we don't have ejabberd right now, but it'd be nice to add it
[04:55] <nubae> well, what do u mean we don't gave
[04:55] <nubae> have
[04:56] <nubae> I've installed it just fine
[04:56] <LaserJock> in Edubuntu
[04:56] <nubae> oh k
[04:56] <nubae> is it in uni?
[04:57] <LaserJock> I guess
[04:57] <nubae> and with schooltool I really think it would be a good idea to talk to tom hoffman
[04:57] <LaserJock> apt-cache madison ejabberd
[04:57] <nubae> ok so that requires an MIR
[04:58] <nubae> shall I do that?
[04:58] <LaserJock> yeah, you can start working on that
[04:59] <nubae> ok cool, there is also the case with kolourpaint 4
[04:59] <nubae> vs gpaint
[04:59] <nubae> both are in main
[04:59] <LaserJock> I've been thinking about that
[04:59] <nubae> so it should just be an agreement to push that through
[04:59] <LaserJock> and a little about the role of KDE in Edubuntu
[05:00]  * nubae listens
[05:01] <LaserJock> well, it does seem like KDE is more edu-minded
[05:02] <LaserJock> I think making ubuntu-desktop-kde more of a priority might be useful
[05:03] <LaserJock> there aren't that many Gnome edu apps left
[05:04] <nubae> u mean focus on kde apps
[05:04] <nubae> or make it kde4?
[05:04] <nubae> which I all up for
[05:05] <LaserJock> there's a few thing
[05:05] <LaserJock> s
[05:05] <LaserJock> with the app bundles there's much less lock-in to the DE
[05:05] <LaserJock> we're mostly just after educational stuff, regardless
[05:06] <LaserJock> but there are little things we wrap around the purely eductional apps
[05:06] <LaserJock> like gpaint vs kolourpaint
[05:07] <LaserJock> and then there are issues like Gnome's user admin tool being kinda dead and buggy
[05:07] <LaserJock> so I'm not saying drop gnome or replace it with KDE
[05:07] <LaserJock> but just having a stronger KDE option in edubuntu-desktop-kde
[05:12] <nubae> ok sounds good
[05:12] <nubae> kdefy it
[05:12] <nubae> so how do we do that?
[05:12] <nubae> it would be nice too, because the look and feel would have a nice change
[05:12] <LaserJock> essentially just pay attention to edubuntu-desktop-kde metapackage
[05:12] <LaserJock> and work with Kubuntu folks
[05:12] <nubae> cool
[05:13] <nubae> so can we user their widget based approach at all?
[05:13] <LaserJock> I wonder how many edu people use KDE though
[05:13] <nubae> or does that reuiquiren kd4 outright
[05:13] <nubae> hmm, at least 10%
[05:14] <LaserJock> how do you mean?
[05:14] <LaserJock> we have KDE4
[05:14] <nubae> yes, but more integrated into the gui
[05:14] <LaserJock> just bits of it in KDE Edu and Kolourpaint4
[05:14] <nubae> i know
[05:14] <nubae> I'm talking look and fee
[05:15] <LaserJock> right, what I'm saying is that edubuntu-desktop-kde would be installed on top of Kubuntu
[05:15] <nubae> be able to us some of their plasma and widget stuff
[05:15] <nubae> ok
[05:15] <LaserJock> so whatever we do in there we can use KDE 4 to our hearts content
[05:15] <nubae> ,so maintiain 32 version then
[05:15] <LaserJock> so yeah, we could write plasmoids or whatever
[05:16] <nubae> well, who do we talk to at kde?
[05:16] <LaserJock> I don't know that we need to exactly talk to kde
[05:16] <LaserJock> we can just start doing things
[05:17] <LaserJock> 1 task is to get the edubuntu-desktop-kde metapackage in shape in the seeds
[05:17] <LaserJock> I have an idea about that that I'll try to get going shortly
[05:18] <nubae> but that would mean installing on top of a kubuntu, right=
[05:18] <LaserJock> yeah
[05:18] <LaserJock> so say on our download page we could have
[05:18] <LaserJock> for Ubuntu users:
[05:18] <LaserJock> blah blah
[05:18] <LaserJock> for Kubuntu users:
[05:18] <LaserJock> bla blah
[05:20] <nubae> would the apps all still be the same
[05:20] <nubae> or woudl we put something different in gnome than in kde
[05:20] <LaserJock> right
[05:22] <nubae> ok, so shall we open a discussion on the lists concerning this?
[05:23] <LaserJock> I don't think we need to right away
[05:23] <LaserJock> we can see where it takes us
[05:23] <nubae> ok a possible future roadmap
[05:24] <nubae> ok, I gotta go
[05:24] <nubae> anything else?
[05:24] <LaserJock> I think we could put it in the Jaunty announcment/release notes
[05:24] <LaserJock> nah
[05:24] <LaserJock> I gotta go too
[05:25] <nubae> ye we can start, and maybe at next weeting we know enough to write something
[05:25] <nubae> anyway bye
[06:59] <highvoltage> ogra: ouch, this is running windows: http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/10/video-intels-convertible-classmate-pc-hands-on/
[08:24] <Meshezabeel> always good to have a weeting
[08:27] <Meshezabeel> Well, it was nice talking to you HedgeMage, cya next time.
[08:27] <HedgeMage> ??
[08:28] <Meshezabeel> ??
[08:28] <HedgeMage> I just got here... I'm not leaving yet. :)
[08:29] <Meshezabeel> yeah, it was nice talking to you with the double question marks at least :)
[08:30] <Meshezabeel> I'm the one leaving :)
[08:31] <HedgeMage> ahh
[21:40] <LaserJock> afternoon
[21:43] <stgraber> hey LaserJock