[00:44] <cj> hurm, I wonder how many shells student022 had open...
[00:44]  * cj has been exhausting his PTY pool recently, too
[09:08] <huats> morning all
[09:21] <asac> huats: there?
[09:21] <asac> oh obviously ;)
[09:21]  * asac should look at least 2 lines back before posting
[09:21] <asac> huats: seahorse-plugins ... i uploaded a no-change bump yesterday for nss/nspr transition.
[09:21] <huats> hello asac :)
[09:22] <asac> huats: i saw you have a new version waiting for upload
[09:22] <asac> huats: whats the status on that?
[09:22] <huats> asac: let me check
[09:22] <asac> huats: (for whatever reason the no-change upload failed to build everywhere)
[09:23] <huats> asac: I have been working on that upload last week
[09:24] <asac> huats: the "old" package doesnt build because it doesnt fine the gnome.h header
[09:24] <huats> oh
[09:24] <asac> huats: i can probably fix that by hacking configure.in
[09:24] <huats> asac: let me check
[09:24] <huats> but 'mine' is building fine
[09:24] <asac> but wonder if its worth it ... or if just uploading new version would be a better option
[09:25] <asac> huats: still would be nice to know why it built in intrepid, but not now
[09:25] <huats> asac: yep
[09:25] <asac> seems some pkg-config provided gnome cflags previously, but doesnt do that now anymore
[09:26] <crevette> bonjour
[09:26] <crevette> mvo, hey
[09:26] <huats> asac: I will have a look in the next hour
[09:26] <huats> I'll let you know ok ?
[09:26] <crevette> I tends to think I succeed to do the bzr thingy for metacity
[09:27] <crevette> I pushed the changes in a branch on lp:~bmillemathias/metacity/ubuntu if you interested with
[09:27] <crevette> hello seb128
[09:28] <crevette> seb128, I wonder if latest brasero shouldn't conflict with nautilus-cd-burner because both of them install an extensions to burn CD in burn:// location
[09:30] <crevette> and it ends to a http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=567191
[09:30] <huats> asac: the package you uploaded builds fine on jaunty but not on intrepid right ?
[09:31] <asac> huats: no it fails to build on jaunty everywhere
[09:31] <huats> oh
[09:31] <huats> ok
[09:31] <huats> I'll have a look
[09:31] <asac> huats: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/seahorse-plugins/2.24.1-0ubuntu2
[09:32] <huats> and take that into account for my package once it is done
[09:32] <huats> fixed
[09:32] <huats> I'll have a look at yours
[09:34] <mvo> hey crevette
[09:34] <seb128> hello there
[09:34] <seb128> hey mvo crevette
[09:34] <mvo> hey seb128
[09:35] <didrocks> Hi huats seb128, mvo  & crevette :)
[09:35] <seb128> lut didrocks huats
[09:35] <seb128> didrocks: still looking for updates to do? ;-)
[09:35] <huats> hello didrocks
[09:35] <didrocks> seb128: can't do them tonight, but tomorrow night, yeah, for sure :)
[09:36] <huats> seb128: you see, didrocks refuses to work :P
[09:36] <seb128> didrocks: you are welcome to work on the gnome-games update whenever you want
[09:36] <didrocks> huats: some FOSS presentation tonight with framasoft :p
[09:36] <didrocks> seb128: ok, I schedule it for tomorrow so ;)
[09:36] <huats> didrocks: you say ;)
[09:36] <seb128> thanks
[09:38] <didrocks> huats: you know, some people have *real* job and can't do packaging during the day while they are supposed to do something else... ^^
[09:38]  * didrocks runs...
[09:38] <didrocks> why nobody believe me ? :(
[09:39] <seb128> didrocks: because you think doing packaging is not a real work?!
[09:39] <seb128> didrocks: are you calling me a slacker? ;-)
[09:39] <huats> seb128: I think he is :)
[09:39] <didrocks> seb128: that's the reason why there was "while they are supposed to do something else..."
[09:39] <didrocks> :)
[09:39] <seb128> ;-)
[09:39]  * didrocks takes some cautious in saying this ^^
[09:40] <didrocks> and I say huats gives no support to me. I appreciate :)
[09:40] <didrocks> s/say/see
[09:40] <huats> :)
[09:41] <seb128> huats: want an update to do? ;-)
[09:42] <huats> seb128: sure, but I wont be able to do it this morning...;
[09:42] <huats> just this afternoon
[09:42] <seb128> lol
[09:43] <huats> seb128: I am having a look at the seahorse-plugins pb that asactold me
[09:43] <slomo> seb128: are you aware of any new gstreamer bugs? :)
[09:43] <seb128> slomo: no, either the upgrades work correctly or not a lot of people are running jaunty yet ;-)
[09:44] <seb128> slomo: we get bugs on other packages so I guess updates are working correctly ;-)
[09:44] <seb128> huats: which one?
[09:44] <seb128> huats: otherwise http://download.gnome.org/sources/xchat-gnome/0.24/xchat-gnome-0.24.3.tar.gz
[09:44] <asac> seb128: fail to build everywhere
[09:44] <slomo> ok :)
[09:44] <huats> seb128: ok
[09:44] <asac> seb128: e.g. the no-change upload from esterday
[09:44] <huats> I'll take it
[09:44] <asac> seb128: seems like some pkg-config or something dropped gnome cflags (my guess as it cannot find gnome.h during build)
[09:46] <slomo> seb128: you want to sync jack-audio-connection-kit from experimental and afterwards sync gst-plugins-bad0.10 0.10.9.3-1 from debian/experimental :) the former fixes the build failure in gst-plugins-bad
[09:46] <seb128> asac: right, they are cleaning libgnomeui usage so that might show such bugs now
[09:46] <seb128> asac: looks like it should build-dep on libgnomeui-dev directly if it's using it
[09:47] <seb128> slomo: ok, I didn't sync those plugins yesterday because somebody did an ubuntu update and I need to look if the changes are required
[09:47] <slomo> seb128: oh, it was already merged... then just sync gst-plugins-bad0.10 :)
[09:47] <slomo> ah
[09:47] <seb128> "  * debian/build-deps.in
[09:47] <seb128>     - Add build dependency libsamplerate-dev. Fixes FTBFS."
[09:47] <crevette> hello mvo seb128 didrocks and other
[09:47] <seb128> slomo: is that something you know about?
[09:47] <asac> seb128: the build depend gets installed (e.g. libgnomeui-dev) ... whats missing is some PKG_CHECK_MODULES or something
[09:48] <slomo> seb128: yes, that's a jack-audio-connection-kit bug which was already fixed in jaunty/unstable ;)
[09:48] <seb128> slomo: ok good, will do the sync then
[09:48] <asac> or is there AC_GNOME_SOMETHING?
[09:48] <seb128> asac: http://download.gnome.org/sources/seahorse-plugins/2.25/seahorse-plugins-2.25.3.tar.gz
[09:48] <seb128> "* remove calls that pull in libgnomeui"
[09:48] <seb128> in the changes
[09:48] <asac> seb128: ah. the build failure was on the intrepid tarball
[09:49] <asac> but probably worth a try to just upgrade there then
[09:49] <asac> huats: ^^
[09:49] <seb128> asac: right, they fixed the bug already, we just need the update, I'll get huats to do it
[09:49] <seb128> I'm about to sponsor seahorse
[09:49] <asac> seb128: he already has the update in launchpad
[09:49] <asac> seb128: i can sponsor that ... ah ok. go ahead
[09:49] <seb128> ok good
[09:49] <huats> :)
[09:49] <seb128> asac: well, I'm doing the new seahorse sponsoring, you can do seahorse-plugins if you want
[09:49] <asac> kk
[09:49] <huats> asac: sorry I was just starting to look at the upstream changes ::(
[09:50] <asac> huats: nothing to be sorry about ;)
[09:50] <seb128> huats: not fast enough ;-)
[09:50] <huats> and once again seb128 is way more aster than me :(
[09:50] <seb128> ;-)
[09:50] <asac> after all seb128 is a machine ;)
[09:50] <seb128> I'm not!
[09:50] <asac> sorry to confuse you ... you are german then ;)
[09:50] <huats> asac: that is probably because I am eating too much, I am sure asac agrees ;)
[09:51] <asac> hehe
[09:51]  * huats remembers :)
[09:51] <huats> ;)
[09:51] <seb128> huats: ">= 0:2.25.4"
[09:51] <seb128> huats: "0:", why?
[09:51] <seb128> when there is no epoch no need to use 0
[09:51] <seb128> just write 2.25.4
[09:52] <huats> seb128:  that was my understanding of the policy
[09:52] <huats> ok
[09:52] <huats> that the soname was to be put there again
[09:52] <seb128> huats: I'm fixing that for you no need to update the bug
[09:52] <huats> ok
[09:52] <asac> huats: am i missing something? bug 316555 has no bits and so on?
[09:52] <seb128> huats: oh no, that's the package version there
[09:52] <huats> asac: I have removed the stuffs
[09:52] <asac> hmm
[09:52] <asac> ok let me know. seems like it should just work
[09:52] <huats> since I was wondering that something was to be done again
[09:53] <huats> I putting them back right now
[09:53] <asac> (from what seb128 said)
[09:53] <asac> thanks
[09:54] <huats> asac:  done
[10:02] <asac> seb128: http://paste.ubuntu.com/104303/ ... upstream committed tab indent ;)
[10:02] <asac> e.g. if (!g_option...) line has tab, while the rest of the code has spaces
[10:02] <seb128> easy to mix spaces and tabs ...
[10:03] <asac> yes, but shouldnt happen on review ;)
[10:03] <asac> in emacs there is this great invention where you can define code styile at the top of file
[10:03] <asac> i think vim has the same
[10:03] <asac> most likely gedit needs that feature ;9
[10:04] <seb128> asac: right, quite some GNOME softwares use that
[10:04] <seb128> but that's not standard
[10:04] <seb128> ie, if you use gedit to code that's not used
[10:04] <asac> seb128: does gedit honour that?
[10:04] <asac> yeah
[10:04] <seb128> and emacs doesn't display tab and spaces differently by default
[10:04] <seb128> asac: no
[10:04] <asac> probably a long-standing feature request ;)
[10:05] <seb128> the new gedit is cool
[10:05] <asac> seb128: true. but isnt necessary if emacs just does the right thing.
[10:05] <asac> seb128: really?
[10:05] <asac> seb128: do i have that yet here?
[10:05] <seb128> it has the "number of space for a tab" in the bar
[10:05] <asac> (jaunty updated yesterday)
[10:06] <seb128> and an "use space" checkbox
[10:06] <seb128> so you can select the 1 tab = n space easily
[10:06] <seb128> you also have an option to draw space and tabs
[10:06] <seb128> it uses dots for space and an arrow for tabs then
[10:07] <asac> nice
[10:07] <asac> what i need is "auto-indent" ;)
[10:07] <asac> e.g. when i hit tab ten times it shouldnt indent ten times ;)
[10:07] <asac> and should even indent backwards if thats required code wise when hitting tab ;)
[10:08] <asac> but maybe i am too emacs focussed no this one
[10:09] <seb128> yeah the emacs way is cool
[10:11] <asac> hmm seahorse-plugins doesnt even depend on any seahorse -dev package
[10:11] <asac> hmm seems seahorse doesnt have -dev packages ;)
[10:12] <seb128> mvo: btw did you have a chance to debug python-apt yet?
[10:15] <asac> huats: ok uploaded.
[10:15] <huats> asac: ok thanks
[10:15] <mvo> seb128: not yet, sorry
[10:16] <asac> huats: let me know if things go bad ;) (not sure if i get the email too)
[10:16] <huats> ok
[10:16] <huats> sure
[10:18] <seb128> mvo: that's alright, no hurry
[10:19] <asac> seb128: can you bin NEW lightning-sunbird stuff
[10:20] <seb128> asac: let me look
[10:22] <asac> thanks
[10:25] <seb128> asac: done
[10:25] <asac> greawt
[10:26] <seb128> mvo: btw there is a vte sponsoring request it's probably for you since you are the one which knows vte better there ;-)
[10:27] <asac> seb128: oh. more important libnm-util1 seems to be still in NEW too
[10:27] <asac> hat definitly needs to get in before the alpha
[10:27] <crevette> mvo, ah you updated the metacity branch as well for 2.24.89 ?
[10:27] <asac> and promoted to main obviously
[10:27] <seb128> asac: ok, will new that too
[10:27] <mvo> crevette: not really, I played with it but didn't do it properly (got distracted by other stuff)
[10:27] <seb128> brb testing the seahorse update
[10:27] <mvo> crevette: so the update is still there to take :)
[10:28] <asac> seb128: can you promote that or do i need to ask cjwatson?
[10:28] <asac> i think pitti isnt here this week
[10:28] <asac> its just ABI bump
[10:28] <crevette> mvo, should I propose merging my branch to ~ubuntu-core-dev/metacity/ubuntu ?
[10:28] <asac> of libnm-util0
[10:29] <crevette> I'm not already fluent with the process
[10:29] <crevette> ah damn I forgot to commit
[10:29] <crevette> stupid me
[10:29] <mvo> crevette: yes, but I can do that now too
[10:30] <crevette> I'm sot stupid
[10:36] <mvo> crevette: what is the branch name? I will merge
[10:37] <crevette> mvo, I forgot to commit, and I can't do it now
[10:39] <seb128> asac: ok, those have been newed too now
[10:39] <mvo> crevette: that happens, no problme. just ping me when its there
[10:39] <seb128> huats: the seahorse update seems to work correctly I've uploaded it
[10:39] <crevette> mvo, won't happen before tonight
[10:39] <huats> seb128: ok
[10:39] <huats> I have tested it too :)
[10:39] <mvo> crevette: I will be here until ~19:00 european time (maybe longer)
[10:39] <crevette> mvo, or I can ask my gf to do hte commit
[10:39] <huats> seb128: thanks
[10:39] <crevette> :)
[10:39] <seb128> huats: thank you for doing the update ;-)
[10:40] <huats> ;)
[10:46] <asac> seb128: thanks. to main?
[10:46] <seb128> asac: yes
[10:46] <asac> great.... rock on
[10:46]  * asac hugs seb128 
[10:47]  * seb128 hugs asac
[11:42] <crevette> mvo, my gf did the bzr commit and pushed the revision to https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~bmillemathias/metacity/ubuntu
[11:42] <mvo> crevette: thanks, I will review/merge after lunch
[11:43] <crevette> the only problem is the commit message, I couldn't help her remotly to deal with gvim
[11:43] <crevette> mvo, you're welcome, I'm pleased to learn bzr
[11:43] <crevette> I'm not sure I did the right things though
[12:02] <mvo> crevette: looks good so far :)
[12:03] <slomo> mvo: does ubuntu already use the new codec installation infrastructure? :)
[12:04] <mvo> slomo: not yet, but almost everything is in place (the missing bit is that I don't like the GtkLabel)
[12:05] <mvo> slomo: but because there is no "GtkTextView.set_markup" (or anything like this) I need to chagne the code there a bit to use a textview
[12:05]  * mvo wants GtkTextView.set_markup()
[12:09] <slomo> mvo: hm, that's the reason why i didn't use GtkTextView :P
[12:10] <seb128> what reason?
[12:10] <mvo> slomo: yeah, its freaking anoying :/
[12:10] <slomo> seb128: no GtkTextView.set_markup()
[12:10] <mvo> slomo: I can show you the diff when its there or just commit, whatever you prefer
[12:11] <slomo> mvo: commit it unless it looks ugly ;)
[12:11] <mvo> slomo: I will do my best
[12:11] <mvo> (to not make it look ugly)
[12:11] <mvo> thanks slomo
[12:11] <racarr> You can sort of use gtk_text_buffer_insert_with_tags
[12:11] <racarr> to make it a bit less annoying
[12:12] <racarr> compared to insert + apply
[12:12] <racarr> or I guess insert_with_tags_by_name is even more convenient.
[12:13] <mvo> racarr: thanks, I think i will use the later
[12:14] <racarr> The whole GtkText API is not fun to use at all :/
[12:14] <mvo> absolutely, especially in python where I'm used to more convinience :)
[12:14] <racarr> It's very powerful, but I think maybe there could be a rationale for a more convenient one
[12:14] <racarr> on top of it
[12:14] <mvo> yeah, agreeed
[12:15] <mvo> qt had some nice stuff there last I looked (/me trolls  a bit)
[12:17] <racarr> Aha. It has been a long time since I last played with Qt...
[12:20] <asac> seb128: http://paste.ubuntu.com/104342/ ... also fixed in new tarball i guess, right?
[12:21] <seb128> asac: I didn't try but the changes list would indicate so
[12:22] <asac> ok i will check that after lunch then
[12:31] <Nilesh> hi
[12:32] <Nilesh> anyone here to help me
[12:32] <Nilesh> ?
[14:16] <hggdh> seb128, hi... question: has evo 2.24.3 been already posted to the repositories? I know EDS has, and I can see evolution-common, but no other evolution files
[14:17] <seb128> hggdh: on what architecture? i386 should be available, could be a bit slower on amd64
[14:18] <hggdh> seb128, ah OK. I wonder about two new bugs already opened against Evo on 2.24.3... perhaps they are mixing versions
[14:19] <seb128> could be indeed
[14:20] <seb128> the text copy one seems weird though, I'm not sure how the libs update would change that
[14:22] <hggdh> seb128, there are two things new on 2.24.3: (1) trash and junk counters may go bonkers on some situations; (2) you may be greeted with a 'no such column: dirty' when starting it after upgrade
[14:23] <hggdh> but it recovers from this
[14:23] <seb128> counts are being wrong in many cases since 2.24 anyway
[14:23] <seb128> I didn't get the error on upgrade
[14:24] <seb128> good to know but doesn't seem enough reason to block the upgrade, let's see what the user feedback is on those to start
[14:25] <hggdh> I agree
[14:26] <hggdh> after all, this is why they are in -proposed ...
[14:27] <hggdh> seb128, one more question -- are you also publishing evo-exchange?
[14:27] <seb128> they will be copied to jaunty when the binaries are available everywhere
[14:27] <seb128> I didn't plan to, the changes list didn't seem so interesting, do you think it should be updated?
[14:28] <hggdh> let me check... the other bug is on -exchange
[14:32] <mvo> seb128: could you please sync gnome-codec-install from debian/experimental?
[14:32] <seb128> mvo: ok
[14:32] <seb128> mvo: incoming rather I guess right now?
[14:35] <mvo> seb128: probably
[15:32] <hggdh> seb128, indeed it does not seem like we need e-e 2.24.3. There is only one fix, but I cannot access bugzilla.novell.com to see what it was about
[15:33] <pochu> UTSL :)
[15:54] <hggdh> seb128, a thread on evolution-list is suggesting e-e depends on the new evo/eds. I am querying about that
[15:55] <seb128> hggdh: depends in the sense of "the current version is broken after upgrade"? ie they broke abi in a stable update?
[15:56] <hggdh> seb128, I do not know yet, I am finding out... I am looking at the diff, but (right now) I cannot find a reason
[15:57] <seb128> did you try to ping srag about that?
[15:59] <awalton__> seb128, alex just fixed the popular scroll-bars-disappear-in-tabs bug
[15:59] <awalton__> if you want to backport the patch, looks straightforward.
[15:59] <seb128> awalton__: the patch tseliot did was not correct?
[15:59] <awalton__> seb128, not really
[15:59] <awalton__> you can't just stomp the adjustments like that
[15:59] <seb128> at least it motived alex to look at the bug and fix it apparently which is something ;-)
[15:59] <awalton__> lose scroll position, etc.
[16:00] <hggdh> trying it now
[16:00] <tseliot> seb128: right ;)
[16:00] <awalton__> seb128, that is a good thing, very few people in the world know the voodoo to make that code wor
[16:00] <awalton__> *work.
[16:03] <hggdh> seb128, luckybharath states there is a dependency for e-e on updated eds and evo. This seems, then, to have been overlooked on 2.24.3 (it should have been updated)
[16:04] <seb128> hggdh: the question is the other way around
[16:05] <seb128> hggdh: does the old e-e still work using an updated e-d-s
[16:08] <hggdh> seb128, please see http://paste.ubuntu.com/104408/
[16:08] <hggdh> not really helpful :-(
[16:09] <seb128> hggdh: I'm on the channel
[16:09] <hggdh> ah
[16:09] <hggdh> heh, sorry
[16:09] <seb128> that's alright ;-)
[16:09] <seb128> would be nice to find somebody to confirm if e-e is still working or not
[16:10] <seb128> I can upgrade e-e to 2.24.3 tomorrow that's probably a good idea anyway
[16:11] <hggdh> unfortunately, I do not have an exchange account. But there are at least two confirmed failures, one in the LP bug, and one on evolution-list
[16:29] <asac> hi!
[16:29] <ArneGoetje> hi
[16:29] <rickspencer3> is Till here?
[16:30] <calc> hi
[16:30] <rickspencer3> are we ready for the desktop team meeting?
[16:31] <seb128> hey
[16:31] <seb128> I'm ready ;-)
[16:31] <rickspencer3> Martin is on Holiday
[16:31] <rickspencer3> so I think we're all here
[16:31] <Riddell> hi
[16:32] <rickspencer3> First - Review action items from last week
[16:33] <rickspencer3> For everything regarding tracking of packages that Dx team plans to touch -> see updated status on the wiki
[16:33] <asac> rickspencer3: do you know whether that's on wiki.ubuntu.com now? or still in private?
[16:33] <seb128> do you have the page name or url?
[16:33] <rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-01-13
[16:34] <rickspencer3> asac: the table is still private, but David is working on it
[16:34] <asac> thanks
[16:34] <rickspencer3> I think it's only private because dbarth hasn't had a chance to finish.
[16:34] <asac> yes. whats the URL again?
[16:35] <asac> https://wiki.canonical.com/UbuntuPlatform/Desktop/JauntyDxComponents ?
[16:35] <rickspencer3> https://wiki.canonical.com/UbuntuPlatform/Desktop/JauntyDxComponents
[16:35] <asac> ah. ok
[16:35] <asac> hmm. not much on it
[16:36] <davidbarth> rickspencer3, asac: which is not up to date; i'm still catching up to restore the content; i'm on it
[16:36] <rickspencer3> asac: yeah, there was a web-based wiki tragedy that blew away david's edits :,(
[16:36] <asac> ouch
[16:36] <rickspencer3> for Specify back up plan for unpatched applications that use actions/timeouts ...
[16:37] <rickspencer3>  Plan is to patch existing notification daemon so that it only responds to the new notification daemon. Then when the new daemon receives a notification it can't handle, it passes the notification along to the old daemon to handle.
[16:37] <asac> so i guess we have to carry the Dx actions forward due to technical hazard ;)
[16:37] <rickspencer3> For specify support for Kubuntu and/or KDE apps running in GNOME expected for Jaunty -
[16:38] <asac> oh ... interesting approach. thanks. is that fallback documented on the to-be-resurrected wiki too?
[16:38] <seb128> which means we will have the old and the new daemon running?
[16:38] <rickspencer3> see the wiki
[16:38] <rickspencer3> I'm not sure how Dx plans to document the details
[16:39] <rickspencer3> seb128: it might be worth following up with Dx for details
[16:39] <seb128> ok
[16:39] <rickspencer3> I think we should see it in a code drop soonish
[16:39] <rickspencer3> for asac to initiate major change process for libnotify and get patch on track for upstream inclusion ->
[16:39] <asac> yes, i can report on that
[16:39] <rickspencer3> asac: any comments on that?
[16:40] <davidbarth> seb128: the point is to tell us if you would be happy to maintain such a hack for now, or if we need to find something else
[16:40] <asac> patch landed upstream; firefox-3.2 package with that feature is in ~fta PPA for initial consumption/testing for Dx team
[16:40] <davidbarth> seb128: knowing that it would be the safest path, ie relying on the existing implementation for things we intend not to support directly
[16:40] <seb128> davidbarth: that seems reasonable
[16:40] <rickspencer3> davidbarth: good point. I shouldn't have presented it as such a push.
[16:40] <asac> next: backport to "old" branches (e.g. firefox 3.1, 3.0) and once we have samples for that send the major change process
[16:40] <davidbarth> seb128: cool
[16:40] <asac> mail
[16:40] <davidbarth> rickspencer3: ;)
[16:41] <davidbarth> asac: yes, tested this morning, that's great
[16:41] <rickspencer3> asac: that's very cool
[16:41] <asac> davidbarth: rickspencer3: i will send weekly updates on the progress so you stay on top
[16:41] <davidbarth> asac: the intrepid build though, but i assume the jaunty one is sane too
[16:41] <asac> davidbarth: i only tested jaunty ;) ... good to know that it works on older relases too
[16:42] <davidbarth> asac: super cool; in particular when you get some official feedback from mozilla as part of the change request
[16:42] <asac> davidbarth: yes. i will try to be as transparent as glass on this ;)
[16:42] <tkamppeter> hi, sorry for entering late
[16:42] <rickspencer3> Till!
[16:42] <asac> davidbarth: one thing: currently notifications are clickable i think and they open the download manager
[16:42] <rickspencer3> tkamppeter: welcome to desktop team meeting
[16:43] <asac> davidbarth: maybe you could make suggestions for how to improve that in future (doesnt need to be implemented right now=
[16:43] <davidbarth> asac: errr... not test that; thanks for pointing this out
[16:43] <asac> davidbarth: its not a bad regression. but i think we could provide helpful input on mozilla on how to do that better in the long run
[16:43] <asac> (e.g. maybe display an icon in the ffox status bar and so on - lets user experience experts come up with something)
[16:44] <davidbarth> asac: right right; that's an important point; michael mentionned that they would drop that behaviour last time we discussed; i think you have the last meeting minutes in an email
[16:44] <asac> good point. i think i didnt get last weeks minutes. did that get stuck somewhere? or is that a technical issue on my side?
[16:45] <rickspencer3> move on?
[16:45] <davidbarth> asac: to clarify; michael was ok to drop the "actionable" part of the notifications; but he does not represent the whole mozilla organization, so it's worth double checking with them as part of the change request
[16:45] <davidbarth> rickspencer3: sure, i'll follow up by email with asac on this particular point
[16:45] <asac> davidbarth: right, michael is an internee. we should open a bug and suggest how to do it better if possible to track that.
[16:46] <asac> ok lets go on ;)
[16:46] <rickspencer3> I didn't mean to rush you guys, sorry
[16:46] <rickspencer3> I wanted everyone to know that tkamppeter will be joining for our desktop meetings
[16:46]  * asac waves at tkamppeter 
[16:46] <rickspencer3> I'm sure everyone knows that he has a contract to work on printing support in Ubuntu
[16:47] <rickspencer3> and he's done a great job with that in that past
[16:47] <rickspencer3> so
[16:47] <rickspencer3> all specs should be drafted by end of this week
[16:47] <rickspencer3> I see that there are some not quite complete
[16:48] <seele> has the new weekly meeting time been decided?
[16:48] <rickspencer3> seele: not yet, but it's on the agenda
[16:49] <seele> should i assume an email will go out on the desktop list?
[16:49] <rickspencer3> so, about the specs, what should we do to get the last ones into "Approved"?
[16:49] <rickspencer3> seele: Yes, it will be included with the minutes. I can call it out on top if it would help.
[16:49] <asac> rickspencer3: you have a link so we can take a look at which are still left?
[16:49] <seele> (oh youre in a meeting now? sorry)
[16:49] <rickspencer3> https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/jaunty
[16:49] <rickspencer3> seele: n/p
[16:49] <rickspencer3> welcome
[16:50] <rickspencer3> seele: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-01-13
[16:50] <ArneGoetje> rickspencer3: I'm in the process of fleshing out the GUI details and mockups with mpt.
[16:50] <rickspencer3> ArneGoetje: is that the only thing blocking you from completing now?
[16:51] <ArneGoetje> rickspencer3: basically, yes.
[16:51] <rickspencer3> k
[16:51] <rickspencer3> seb128: for GDM, it looks like you are blocking on pitti
[16:52] <seb128> rickspencer3: no, he sent it back to drafting with some comments, technically tedg is the drafter but he seems to not draft so I'll do that this week
[16:52] <asac> seb128: do you need help on drafting https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/jaunty-desktop-network-changing ?
[16:52] <rickspencer3> seb128: sounds fine. I don't think there is too much urgency
[16:53] <seb128> ok
[16:53] <tedg> seb128: Oh, I didn't realize I was the drafter.  Sorry about that.
[16:53] <seb128> asac: I didn't notice I was supposed to draft that one
[16:53] <seb128> asac: if you want to do it you are welcome ;-)
[16:53] <seb128> tedg: that's alright
[16:53] <asac> seb128: what i could do is go through the current wiki page, clean it up and write down the expected behaviour for each app (asking around what is wanted); also add test cases so we can verify and derive actions from it
[16:53] <seb128> tedg: I thought I was the drafter to be honest, I just noticed your name was there after writting the wiki page ;-)
[16:54] <seb128> asac: that would be nice, thanks!
[16:54] <rickspencer3> asac: thanks for that
[16:54] <rickspencer3> that would be very cool
[16:54] <asac> ok . i will do that this week then. ... can someone reassign the "drafter" to me?
[16:55] <tkamppeter> rickspencer3, biff
[16:55] <rickspencer3> asac: I would if I knew how :P
[16:55] <rickspencer3> we can follow up later
[16:56] <asac> ACTION asac to clean up jaunty-desktop-network-changing wiki; draft expected behaviour and test cases
[16:56] <asac> rickspencer3: sure. if you have permissions you can change the drafter there. maybe seb can change that?
[16:56] <rickspencer3> maybe I don't have permissions
[16:56] <rickspencer3> tkamppeter: what's up?
[16:56] <asac> anyway, not important as long as the action gets in the meeting report i will remember ;)
[16:56] <rickspencer3> asac: k
[16:57] <rickspencer3> moving along ...
[16:57] <rickspencer3> everyone to add some pet-bugs by next meeting
[16:57] <seb128> asac: you are drafter now
[16:57] <rickspencer3> Has everyone done this?
[16:58] <seb128> I've started looking through bugs but still have to do some work on that
[16:58] <asac> seb128: thx
[16:58] <calc> i still have more work to do in this area as well
[16:59] <ArneGoetje> not yet. language-packs and Rosetta kept me busy :( need some time to look through the tons of bugs I'm subscribed to...
[16:59] <rickspencer3> is everyone using the pet-bug tag?
[16:59] <tkamppeter> rickspencer3: The "rickspencer3: biff" means that you have got mail. This is IRCish.
[17:00] <rickspencer3> tkamppeter: thanks
[17:00] <seb128> I'll use "pet-bug" when I tag, didn't tag yet
[17:00] <rickspencer3> so, I'm taking it from the cricket sounds, and the limited list here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=pet-bug
[17:01] <rickspencer3> that we could make more progress on this this week
[17:01] <seb128> yes
[17:01] <rickspencer3> I think it would help Martin out very much if everyone got this done before he returns from holiday on Monday
[17:01] <rickspencer3> so, please carry that action over
[17:01] <asac> ok
[17:02] <rickspencer3> moving on ...
[17:02] <rickspencer3> I got an activity report from everyone, so thanks for that.
[17:02] <rickspencer3> Next ... Maria needs a list of people who will be doing a presentation somewhere in 2009
[17:02] <rickspencer3> anyone here doing a presentation in 2009?
[17:03] <ArneGoetje> not me
[17:03] <seb128> I don't plan to
[17:03] <rickspencer3> next is meeting time
[17:03] <calc> rickspencer3: i'm going to have a discussion at Sun but not sure that it would qualify as a presentation
[17:03] <rickspencer3> please vote: should we move it back to 16:00 UTC?
[17:04] <rickspencer3> calc: okay
[17:04] <asac> rickspencer3: is that possible from your side (i think we moved it because you had a conflict)?
[17:04] <rickspencer3> I'll ask Maria to clarify what she needs there
[17:04] <seb128> 16:00 or 16:30 is fine for european time so I don't care either way
[17:04] <rickspencer3> asac: yes, but I moved the conflict
[17:04] <asac> cool. i dont care though
[17:04] <calc> i don't care time wise 16:00 or 16:30
[17:05] <asac> i think its ArneGoetje's say as he is in a "late" timezone
[17:05] <tkamppeter> for me both 16:00 and 16:30 UTC work, too
[17:05] <rickspencer3> okay - I still have an occasional conflict with a manager meeting, so I would prefer to leave it at 16:30
[17:05] <rickspencer3> ArneGoetje: how bad is it to have it at 16:30?
[17:06] <rickspencer3> zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
[17:06] <rickspencer3> :)
[17:06] <ArneGoetje> I just adjusted my core working hours, so that I work until 01:00 (17:00 UTC) and get up later in exchange. So, it's fine for me to keep it at 16:30
[17:06] <rickspencer3> great
[17:06] <rickspencer3> 16:30 it is
[17:06] <rickspencer3> bryce: good morning :)
[17:07] <rickspencer3> any other business?
[17:07] <bryce> rickspencer3: sorry I'm late
[17:07] <rickspencer3> bryce: n/p. We did assign you quite a few actions though
[17:07] <rickspencer3> j/k
[17:07] <bryce> of course
[17:08] <rickspencer3> ACTION: everyone tag 10 pet bugs by Friday
[17:08] <rickspencer3> anything else?
[17:09] <seb128> no
[17:09] <asac> yes. i am unlikely to have 10 pet bugs. i mean if i have a pet bug i usually work on weekends to get that fixed. otherwise its not a pet bug ;)
[17:09] <asac> but i can see
[17:10] <rickspencer3> asac: we can discuss offline
[17:10] <asac> sure
[17:10] <rickspencer3> I think the idea was to limit feature work slightly so that there was extra time during the development cycle to address issues which in a normal cycle would be hard to get to
[17:11] <Riddell> Main Inclusion Requests are blocking me again
[17:11] <asac> Riddell: ping me
[17:11] <rickspencer3> If this doesn't apply to you (or anyone else) we can deal
[17:11] <asac> Riddell: if you have something urgent
[17:11] <asac> Riddell: you have a list of outstanding MIRs you are waiting for?
[17:12] <davidbarth> rickspencer3: i've updated the JauntyDxComponents page
[17:12] <Riddell> nothing urgent, just gets in my way a bit that I get blocked on them.  qzion, qedje and google-gadgets currently (also libmsn needs a security review)
[17:13] <asac> Riddell: ah. did you figure out the questions i had about gadgets?
[17:13] <asac> (or did i forget to hit the sent button ;))=
[17:13] <rickspencer3> davidbarth: sweet. can you let us know when you move it to the Ubuntu wiki?
[17:13] <Riddell> asac: missed that, will review
[17:14] <asac> Riddell: ok will take a look at qzion and qedje
[17:16] <asac> davidbarth: also, not sure if you still have that as an ACTION on your list, but could you also give us timeline for delivery of the individual parts? at best mark that in the wiki
[17:16] <asac> (doesnt need to be a "hard" milestone; just so we know when we can expect things to move)
[17:17] <davidbarth> asac: yep, i've discussed the planned code drops with rick but will add that to the page
[17:17] <asac> davidbarth: great.
[17:19] <rickspencer3> good week everyone
[17:19] <rickspencer3> lots of progress, it seems
[17:19] <asac> thanks all
[17:19] <ArneGoetje> thanks
[17:19] <calc> ttyl
[17:20] <bryce> thanks
[17:20] <asac> davidbarth: do you have more content about the vision of notifications which i could attach to the major change request? one resource will definitly be marks post; just wonder if there are other details/specs i should attach (so mozilla understands our vision)
[17:21] <asac> (fwiw, thats off the record/out of meeting question ;))
[17:22] <seb128> jcastro: hey, could you create a nautilus-sendto product on launchpad?
[17:37] <jcastro> seb128: sure!
[17:37] <jcastro> seb128: nautilus-sendto is the upstream module name I assume?
[17:37] <jcastro> seb128: nautilus-sendto is the upstream module name I assume?
[17:37] <seb128> jcastro: thanks
[17:37] <crevette> jcastro, yes
[17:37] <seb128> jcastro: yes
[17:38] <jcastro> https://edge.launchpad.net/nautilus-sendto
[17:38] <jcastro> already exists
[17:38] <crevette> wow I 2nd just behind the seb
[17:38] <seb128> jcastro: hum, I'm wondering why we can't add upstream task to nautilus-sendto ubuntu bugs then
[17:39] <jcastro> ah, let me check, which bug?
[17:39] <jcastro> sometimes the info in the project is wrong and you have to "relink" it
[17:39] <seb128> jcastro: try on any nautilus-sendto bug
[17:39] <jcastro> ok
[17:40] <seb128> jcastro: no, typing nautilus-sendto in the entry to search on component names doesn't match anything
[17:40] <jcastro> I was able to find it
[17:40] <jcastro> but I'm on edge
[17:40] <seb128> hum
[17:40] <jcastro> let me have gmb check it out
[17:41] <seb128> let me try again
[17:41] <seb128> jcastro: wait
[17:41] <jcastro> ok
[17:41] <seb128> arg, that's me being stupid
[17:41] <jcastro> the search result is kind of dumb though, it wasn't in alphabetical order
[17:41] <seb128> there is already an open task on the bug I was trying
[17:42] <jcastro> ah, I see
[17:42] <seb128> jcastro: sorry about the noise
[17:42] <jcastro> no worries
[17:42] <jcastro> seb128: we are discussing "open upstream task" by default
[17:42] <seb128> ah good
[17:43] <awalton__> seb128, do you know if ubuntu is going to continue shipping n-c-b?
[17:43] <awalton__> right now we have a plugin clash between n-c-b and brasero registering the same plugin for nautilus
[17:43] <awalton__> ("same" as in type-name, not in function necessarily)
[17:44] <seb128> awalton__: we discussed dropping it previous cycle and decided against that, need to try again now that they implemented the burn location
[17:44] <seb128> awalton__: does it crash nautilus or just displays a warning?
[17:44] <seb128> I read a warning about that in a bug
[17:44] <awalton__> just warnings
[17:44] <seb128> ok
[17:44] <awalton__> and I think some users are actually seeing two bars, which is bizarre
[17:46] <seb128> awalton__: not sure what is the best course of action there
[17:46] <seb128> having nautilus-cd-burner and brasero conflicting?
[17:46] <awalton__> that's the only thing I can think of
[17:46] <crevette> seb128, this is the bug I show you this morning if you recall
[17:46] <seb128> or maybe the brasero burn location thing should be binary splitted and that one should conflict
[17:46] <awalton__> or just kicking n-c-b to the curb, since brasero basically reimplemented it.
[17:46] <seb128> that would still allow people to use n-c-b and brasero
[17:47] <seb128> crevette: which one?
[17:47] <crevette> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=567191
[17:47] <crevette> I asked to you if we should pyut a conflict in the packages
[17:48] <awalton__> if you can split the plugin out that would work
[17:48]  * awalton__ just had to check to be sure.
[17:49] <seb128> crevette: I didn't read that
[17:49] <seb128> maybe I closed IRC when restarting my session to try some update and didn't notice
[17:50] <seb128> awalton__: that can be done, not sure if that's worth it, ie if any brasero user will prefer to still have n-c-b used for those tasks
[17:50] <crevette> seb128, yep no problem :)
[17:50] <awalton__> maybe it's time to fire another mail to the list and ask?
[17:50] <seb128> awalton__: they are actively discussing it on desktop-devel-list on the 2.26 thread
[17:51] <awalton__> seb128, ah, that's good.
[18:29] <jbarnes> bryce: ping
[18:36] <bryce> heya jbarnes
[18:38] <bryce> jbarnes: brb (pulseaudio issue requiring reboot...)
[18:43] <jbarnes> bryce: just wanted to update you on the dell issue
[18:43] <jbarnes> bryce: I have a patch that works for me now (just set up the machine yesterday) and wanted some more testers to confirm
[18:43] <jbarnes> bryce: I updated the upstream bug with the patch
[18:44] <bryce> jbarnes: great, which was the bug #?  (Sorry, juggling too many)
[18:44] <jbarnes> um
[18:44] <jbarnes> 18342 was the bug #, I duped it to 17292 though
[18:44] <bryce> oh was this that busted lvds one?
[18:47] <bryce> ah yes that one
[18:47] <jbarnes> yeah
[18:47] <jbarnes> the patch also helps some sony machines
[18:47] <jbarnes> sucks that such a simple bug was open for so long
[18:48] <jbarnes> turned out to just be a bad mode like we thought in the beginning...
[18:48] <jbarnes> I guess if you want testing done it's best to do it yourself :)
[18:48] <jbarnes> once I had the hw it only took a few minutes to find & fix the bug
[18:49] <bryce> jbarnes: ok cool, patch https://bugs.freedesktop.org/attachment.cgi?id=21910 looks simple enough, I can roll that into jaunty today I think, that should give adequate testing
[18:49] <jbarnes> thanks
[18:49] <bryce> jbarnes: yeah isn't that the truth...
[18:50] <bryce> we're hoping to up to 2.5.99 soonish (I think timo tried last night but ran into build problems), I'm going to give it a shot myself today
[18:50] <jbarnes> cool
[18:50] <jbarnes> it has quite a few good fixes
[18:50] <jbarnes> as does libdrm
[18:50] <jbarnes> fixes for compiz vt switch hangs in particular
[18:51] <bryce> kewl
[18:51] <jbarnes> and lots of GL fixes (in the q4 mesa release)
[18:51] <bryce> how's the 945 stuff coming along?  I recall you were concerned about some issues at uds
[18:52] <tjaalton> jbarnes: our current -intel fails miserably with libdrm 2.4.3..
[18:52] <jbarnes> bryce: some people say the crashes have gone away for them
[18:52] <jbarnes> bryce: but we do have one guy who can fairly easily reproduce the hang, and it seems render related
[18:52] <jbarnes> tjaalton: what happens?
[18:53] <tjaalton> jbarnes: let me boot it up in failsafe..
[18:53] <tjaalton> the machine hangs, and the log has some drm related messages
[18:54] <tjaalton> [drm] mapped front/back/depth buffer
[18:54] <tjaalton> then
[18:54] <tjaalton> [drm] mapped classic textures at ...
[18:55] <tjaalton> and there it hangs
[18:55] <jbarnes> hm, can you get a backtrace?
[18:55] <tjaalton> maybe, I need to fire up the network first
[19:02] <tjaalton> jbarnes: here's the build error.. mesa is too old (a snapshot of master ~month ago)? http://pastebin.com/m3a90934c
[19:03] <jbarnes> iirc that's a drm problem?
[19:03] <jbarnes> libdrm I mean
[19:03] <jbarnes> since i830_dri pulls in some stuff from there to figure out how to handle flip_t
[19:03] <tjaalton> ok, building against the headers from 2.6.28
[19:04] <tjaalton> so something missing then
[19:06] <tjaalton> jbarnes: the hang: http://pastebin.com/m1be4dea0
[19:06] <tjaalton> (should probably install some dbg syms)
[19:07] <jbarnes> ah yeah, I've actually seen that too; only intermittently though
[19:07] <jbarnes> you should probably file a bug for it
[19:08] <tjaalton> heh :)
[19:08] <tjaalton> jbarnes: is that enough or do you need a better bt?
[19:08] <tjaalton> I'm not sure what I'm missing
[19:09] <jbarnes> if you can get a full bt using gdb and putting a breakpoint before that assert it would be even better
[19:09] <jbarnes> or something like that
[19:09] <tjaalton> ok
[19:12] <tjaalton> jbarnes: something like this? http://pastebin.com/m1c3b057a
[19:12] <jbarnes> yeah that helps
[19:13] <tjaalton> the machine doesn't hang, ssh works if the network is up
[19:20] <tjaalton> jbarnes: ok, filed bug 19542
[19:20] <tjaalton> grr
[19:20] <tjaalton> fdo bug 19542
[19:23] <Amaranth> fdo 19542
[19:23] <Amaranth> hmm
[19:23] <jbarnes> tjaalton: cool thanks
[19:23] <tjaalton> freedesktop bug 19542 :)
[19:24] <tjaalton> there
[19:24] <jbarnes> cool
[19:24] <mvo> Amaranth: hey, nice to see you here again :)
[19:24] <jbarnes> we do triage every week so someone will look at it tonight probably
[19:24] <Amaranth> mvo: I've been here awhile :P
[19:24] <mvo> Amaranth: with your secret identify ;) ?
[19:25] <Amaranth> upgrading to jaunty right now, then looking into compiz++
[19:25] <mvo> awsome!
[19:25] <Amaranth> I'm going to try to learn how it works by implementing some Windows 7 features in a new plugin :P
[19:26] <mvo> heh :)
[20:36] <Amaranth> so much for testing compiz++
[20:37] <Amaranth> jaunty exploded