nandnewz2000: hey, thanks for your tips!20:25
nandI'll take that into account during my second mockups20:26
newz2000my pleasure nand, hope it didn't sound too critical, I think it's good work.20:31
nandtips are always welcome!20:31
nandnow I just need to find time to go on...20:31
newz2000the first 90% is so easy compared to the last 10%20:32
nandthe top bar?20:32
FlawHi, newz200020:48
nandnewz2000: btw, any experience with advanced Drupal caching?20:50
newz2000hey Flaw20:50
newz2000nand: no, it conflicted with our squid proxies so we have it disabled20:50
newz2000yeah, the double caching caused problems20:51
newz2000I don't remember what they were now20:51
newz2000I think we have the basic caching turned on20:51
nandRight now I'm having non logged in pages being served to logged people, so I guess I have the same pb...20:53
newz2000nand: what percentage of your traffic is anonymous users?20:53
nandI'm considering things like http://2bits.com/articles/increasing-drupals-speed-squid-caching-reverse-proxy.html20:53
newz2000so I learned some tricks...20:53
newz2000hang on, let me get details...20:54
newz2000boost module20:54
newz2000turn on query caching for mysql20:54
newz2000use memcached if you have enough ram20:54
newz2000the boost module basically serves your site as static content20:55
nandwhat's the difference with drupal built in cache?20:56
newz2000I don't know20:56
newz2000I was at a drupal conference in Dec and they suggested that20:56
newz2000also using memcached for the sessions table since it can be highly contentious on busy sites with a lot of anonymous traffic20:56
newz2000I have not tried any of this, just told about it20:57
newz2000however I was told this by the buy who wrote the book Professional Drupal Developement. :-)20:57
nandmemcached is available for postgres?20:57
newz2000oh, you're using postgres?20:57
newz2000(but yes, memcache is not database dependent)20:57
nandahh, I see the difference :20:57
nand"Once Boost has been installed and enabled, page requests by anonymous20:57
nandvisitors will be cached as static HTML pages on the server's file system."20:57
nandDrupal cache stores cached pages... in database.20:58
nandthat's less efficient20:58
newz2000ah, that would be a big difference20:58
newz2000why are you using postgres (out of curiosity)?20:58
nandbecause all QA websites used it, and I'm on the same instance :)20:59
nandBesides that, it has a very powerfull fulltext search20:59
nandget 20ms results in all the brainstorm database20:59
nandunlike the 300ms with standard SQL20:59
newz2000I'm a big postgres fan, I'm surprised you find the pg full text better than mysql's21:00
newz2000the prob with postgres wtih drupal is that it gets far less optimization and attention21:00
newz2000you may want to turn on query logging to see if you have queries taking too long and then manually optimize them (with indexes or whatever) and suggest patches to the devs21:00
newz2000considering your modest system you will likely notice problems others might not see21:01
nandthe biggest part of SQL comes from brainstorm itself, and I have already fought a lot to reduce them...21:01
nandStill, I have some 300ms queries I wasn't able to reduce21:01
nand(one per page, of course)21:01
nandI'm thinking : A squid plus a patched Drupal would do the job of the Boost module.21:02
nand(patched so that it removes the "nocache" when not logged in)21:03
newz2000we have done the same thing for ubuntu.com21:03
newz2000yes it would, though squid works best when you give it plenty of ram though (so I hear)21:03
nandthese are equivalent solutions, so I'd rather go with the first one21:03
newz2000give it a shot21:03
nandyeah, I'll see with Ng tomorrow21:03
nandI'll also ask him about memcached.21:04
nandbrainstorm.ubuntu.com is _really_ slow right now21:04
newz2000I noticed actually21:04
newz2000do you know how to use query logging?21:05
nandwith the devel module?21:05
newz2000no, in postgres configuration21:05
nandno. Won't that slow down things?21:05
newz2000I think you can set it to only log queries that take a certain amount of time21:06
newz2000I think you can set it in ms, so choose 500ms or something21:06
newz2000then optimize those queries21:06
newz2000check the sessions table especially since it gets a lot of traffic from anonymous users21:07
newz2000regarding performance, you can probably just leave logging on for a little while and geet plenty of useful data. maybe 15 min would be enough.21:09
nandproblem is, I don't have direct access to the production server, so that's not easy for me to interact with it21:10
nandI can of course turn that on on the staging one, but that's not the same thing21:10
newz2000yeah, tell me about it21:10
nandat least, I'll try to ask for some load graphes && slow queries tables21:10
nandwell, some basic stuff21:11
nandOk, that gives me a lot to experiment with tomorrow. Thanks for the tips!21:12
newz2000any time. ;-)21:15
Flawnewz2000: I will be joining the website team soon, hopefully.21:18
FlawOnce I get round to reading the Wiki, and actually joining.21:18
newz2000Don't wait, just join the email list and introduce yourself21:19
newz2000we'll be starting fresh with a new round of projects soon21:19
FlawAh, awesome! I have no idea how I am going to get involved (I'm sure there are numerous ways I can contribute), but I will pick something up no doubt.21:19
newz2000what do you like to do Flaw?21:20
FlawI'm sure there are a few things, -website isn't too specific is it?21:20
Flaw(not like -artwork, for example).21:20
newz2000yeah, we have a variety of tasks and skills. art, icons, javascript, php, python, drupal, content, usability21:22
Flawnewz2000: I'll be sure to take a look on the Wiki.21:40
FlawHow many members does your team consist of?21:40
newz2000Flaw: depends, there are about a dozen people who were active during the heavy dev period for last release21:45
newz2000a lot of people chime in for discussion and brainstorming21:45
newz2000I think there are over a hundred subscribed to the list though21:45
FlawAh, I see!21:46
newz2000we're kind of on hold for various reasons21:46
FlawSo you actually have access to the website, or is this just a small part, forwarded to another group?21:46
newz2000I'm a canonical employee, the ubuntu webmaster21:46
FlawAh, that's cool!21:46
newz2000the team members don't have access to the website yet21:46
FlawI see.21:46
newz2000maybe for jaunty + 1 they will21:46
FlawIt might be a good idea, to test giving access out, even in small portions to start with!21:47
newz2000I've got several projects I want to accomplish but there's some reorganizing going on inside canonical so I'm waiting to see who goes where before finalizing my plans for this release21:47
newz2000I'm pretty sure we'll do at least these three things:21:47
newz2000 * start page (new folder structure, better translation)21:47
newz2000 * Uprade to Drupal 621:48
newz2000 * GeoIP for download page21:48
newz2000I've got a few other things I'd also like to do21:48
FlawThey sound good!21:48
nandnewz2000: by curiosity, is there the project going on of redesigning ubuntu.com?22:06
newz2000nand: not yet22:06
nandokay. If it is the case, I'd really like to see that inter website navigation bar happen.22:07
newz2000nand: yeah, me too22:08
newz2000there is a job opening in London for someone to head up that task22:08
nandwhich task?22:08
newz2000redesign of ubuntu.com and related22:08
nanddidn't saw it on ubuntu.com22:08
nanddidn't see22:09
nandoh yeah, that's mainly design. The area where I'm weak :)22:09
newz2000me too (which is why they're hiring someone ;-) )22:10
newz2000it will be part of Julian's team, the same team who will be making Ubuntu desktop as beautiful as mac os22:10
nandJulian sounded like he knew what he was talking about at UDS :)22:11
newz2000I can't wait to meet him22:11
newz2000(in person)22:11
nandand I'm eager to see the actual results!22:12

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