[00:13] <karlp> having major issues with nvidia + jaunty + X
[00:14] <andersk> You need Option "IgnoreABI" "True" in the ServerFlags section of /etc/X11/xorg.conf.
[00:14] <karlp> okay i'll try that
[00:16] <karlp> why does mysql start up at boot now?
[00:17] <karlp> is it for akonadi or whatever?
[00:17] <karlp> i don't even use akonadi
[00:21] <x1250> karlp, mysql behaviour has not changed.
[00:21] <andersk> Try aptitude search '~Dmysql-server~i' to see what packages are installed that depend on mysql-server.
[00:23] <karlp> actually my nvidia problem is much deeper than an xorg fix
[00:23] <karlp> er, configuration fix
[00:23] <karlp> if i try to install nvidia-glx-177, i have to uninstall all of x?
[00:23] <karlp> wtf? who packages this stuff
[00:23] <andersk> If your hardware is new enough for the 180 drivers, try nvidia-glx-180 instead.
[00:23] <karlp> i tried that as well
[00:24] <karlp> i've got a 8300 gs
[00:24] <karlp> i don't think that's all that new (late 2007)
[00:24] <andersk> The 177 drivers haven’t been rebuilt against the new xorg.  180 has.
[00:25] <andersk> So what happens with nvidia-glx-180?
[00:25] <karlp> same
[00:25] <karlp> i don't understand why ubuntu is so complicated
[00:25] <andersk> It still tries to uninstall Xorg?  That should not be happening with 180.
[00:25] <karlp> it does
[00:26] <x1250> karlp, it seems complicated because yo haven't do your homework. Try reading a bit.
[00:26] <karlp> i'm actually afraid to update at this point because the only thing that's sure to work is not updating
[00:26] <karlp> x1250: hahaha, isn't the stated goal of ubuntu to be easy, user-friendly etc.?
[00:26] <andersk> (The reason it happens with 177 is that nvidia-glx-177 provides xserver-xorg-video-4, and xserver-xorg-core depends xserver-xorg-video-5 and conflicts xserver-xorg-video-4.)
[00:26] <karlp> yeah
[00:27] <andersk> You cannot expect a development release (Jaunty) to be as easy to use as a stable release (Intrepid).
[00:27] <karlp> that wasn't easy either
[00:27] <karlp> i always have to fight with ubuntu to get it to work
[00:27] <karlp> i've been using ubuntu since 5.10
[00:28] <karlp> been using gentoo since 2004 and even then, it had problems, but i've never had to diagnose anything for longer than 2 hours
[00:28] <karlp> ubuntu... i've deployed on several school labs back in high school and it was a huge mistake. huge uphill battle
[00:28] <karlp> i stuck with it because i figured it has the largest software repositories, but i'm wrong about that too
[00:28] <karlp> opera 9.5 is _still_ not in canonical repositories
[00:29] <hggdh> and will not be
[00:29] <karlp> i'll give it a go for another hour at most, but after that, i'm wiping ubuntu and putting arch on it
[00:29] <hggdh> but they provide builds for ubuntu
[00:29] <karlp> no ngspice for ubuntu either
[00:29] <karlp> hggdh: yeah, but that's not very user friendly
[00:29] <hggdh> the problem is the Opera licence
[00:29] <RAOF> In particular, the nvidia-glx-177 drivers will not work (properly) with the version of Xorg in Jaunty.  It just won't load.
[00:30] <karlp> hggdh: did it change between 9.2x and 9.5x?
[00:30] <karlp> hggdh: if it did, that's understandable that debian and ubuntu want to stay pure. but if not, then it's laziness
[00:31] <hggdh> karlp, if the source is provided, please feel free to contribute a build of Opera to Ubuntu
[00:31] <karlp> hggdh: source? opera's proprietary
[00:32] <hggdh> thank you. There you go
[00:32] <hggdh> how can we, then, provide it?
[00:32] <karlp> use the deb they have
[00:32]  * hggdh is running opera 9.63, BTW
[00:33] <hggdh> yes. This is what *I* do. But Ubuntu cannot provide a package this way, expect -- perhaps -- in multiverse,
[00:33] <hggdh> s/expect/except/
[00:33] <karlp> yeah, i'm talking about the canonical repository
[00:34] <karlp> ah, well there's an update, so if this works, great. if not, goodbye
[00:35] <hggdh> karlp, please propose it (I do not know the channel, though). I do remember, dimly, a discussion about opera some time (years?) ago.
[00:35] <RAOF> You mean, the partner repository?  AFAIK, it's up to Opera to update their stuff in there.
[00:35] <hggdh> thanks, RAOF
[00:36] <karlp> so what allows gentoo or arch from incorporating the latest opera into their repositories?
[00:37] <karlp> s/from incorporating/to incorporate/
[00:37] <hggdh> I do not know. Perhaps they provide a wrapper to the Opera binaries
[00:37] <hggdh> but, on Gentoo, this would be strange...
[00:37] <karlp> how would that bypass legal issues?
[00:37] <RAOF> It wouldn't.
[00:37] <hggdh> it does not.
[00:37] <karlp> and what legal issues anyway?
[00:37] <karlp> i've just heard you vaguely claim they exist
[00:38] <karlp> never heard that before
[00:38] <RAOF> You'd be surprised how much software people illegally redistribute ;)
[00:38] <RAOF> Anyway, I can't seem to find a license _at all_ on the Opera site.
[00:38] <karlp> what's illegal about it? the branding?
[00:38] <hggdh> if a piece of software is proprietary, then the owner may impose restrictions to (re) distribution
[00:38] <karlp> what about ngspice?
[00:38] <hggdh> and usually they *do*
[00:38] <karlp> that's free. don't see why that's not in ubuntu yet
[00:38] <karlp> free as in cost and free as in freedom
[00:38]  * hggdh does not even know what is ngspice
[00:39] <karlp> circuit simulation tool
[00:39] <hggdh> in this case, all that is needed is someone to package it
[00:39] <karlp> it's already packaged
[00:39] <RAOF> karlp: Well, in the absence of an explicit license, they hold the copyright, and _any_ copy infringes it.
[00:39] <karlp> i don't know what is holding it up
[00:39] <hggdh> do you have a link?
[00:40] <karlp> hggdh: if you search launchpad's bug thing for ngspice it says needs packaging and that it's "fixed"
[00:40] <karlp> which is bullshit because i can't get ngspice on jaunty
[00:40] <karlp> oh, that's the other thing i absolutely hate about ubuntu. what happened to upstart and all that frenzy that edgy / feisty were supposed to generate?
[00:41] <karlp> instead, we're all stuck with that heinously useless update-rc.d and its ilk
[00:41] <karlp> networkmanager has never worked for me, but that's not an ubuntu specific complaint... never had it work on four or more separate machines running arch, gentoo, ubuntu, etc.
[00:42] <hggdh> karlp, are you talking about bug 2465-6?
[00:42] <hggdh> dammit
[00:42] <hggdh> bug 246506
[00:42] <karlp> hggdh: not the first one, but yes, the second one
[00:42] <hggdh> it is still open
[00:43] <karlp> i don't have x to view it in a proper browser, but i seem to remember it said fixed
[00:43] <karlp> there were two entries it looked strange
[00:43] <karlp> like blah blah --- confirmed fixed
[00:43] <karlp> and blah blah -- wishlist confirmed
[00:43] <karlp> or something like that
[00:43] <RAOF> Fix committed, in Debian.
[00:43] <karlp> ... so that doesn't instantenously trickle down to ubuntu?
[00:44] <hggdh> no, it does not
[00:44] <karlp> i thought debian was ubuntu's parent project
[00:44] <RAOF> The team working on it have something, but are waiting for upstream changes before they actually upload it to Debian.
[00:44] <RAOF> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=489768
[00:44] <karlp> what upstream changes? arch and gentoo both have r18 nicely packaged
[00:44] <hggdh> no, Ubuntu is based on Debian, but Debian is not Ubuntu's parent
[00:44] <karlp> i'm pretty sure debian's bug website is nicer on elinks so i'll check it out
[00:44] <RAOF> Licensing changes.
[00:45] <karlp> i mean parent as in for software sharing
[00:45] <RAOF> Can only be done upstream, and Debian is substantially more strict than gentoo or arch, I think.
[00:45] <karlp> okay, updated. about to see if X works, if not. i'm wiping this shit off
[00:45] <hggdh> sigh
[00:46] <RAOF> Eh.  Whatever works for him.
[00:46] <hggdh> karlp, perhaps you would be better off with another distribution. You seem to be full of complaints, and no real help
[00:49] <karlp> okay, goodbye
[00:49] <karlp> had enough of this
[00:50] <karlp> the latest update starts my X up and freezes control to my usb keyboard and usb mouse
[00:50] <karlp> nvidia-glx-180 and everything
[00:51] <karlp> oh, while i'm at it, another parting gift
[00:52] <karlp> all the spice user interfaces that ubuntu packages come with no simulator
[00:52] <karlp> so you get a fancy gui (that looks like crap imo) that can't do anything
[00:52] <karlp> you can take screenshots of your schematics and maybe export to eps but that's about it
[00:53] <karlp> gnucap is also a pathetic excuse for circuit simulation software and is pretty incompatible with spice even though they claim they are compatible
[00:53] <karlp> i guess for being critical i should say something nice too
[00:53] <karlp> ubuntu has a solid artwork department
[00:53] <karlp> wherever you get those people from... keep doing more of that
[00:54] <karlp> hey, hardware support in the latest ubuntu kernel has gotten better too
[00:54] <karlp> my usb stick is recognized
[00:55] <karlp> but, that's very little consolation when X doesn't work, and i have to constantly rmmod forcedeth && modprobe forcedeth && /etc/init.d/networking restart on boot because of some stupid issue that i can't figure out (but didn't exist in intrepid, hardy, etc.)
[00:57] <hggdh> karlp, you are running an alpha version of Ubuntu. You should know that this can break and break bad.
[00:57] <hggdh> I run it, but I know what to expect, and have indeed recovered from nasty situations
[00:58] <karlp> hggdh: i do know that. but that's not even the issue. software that i require to a greater extent is increasingly more difficult to find and setup on ubuntu and is much easier on arch
[00:58] <karlp> hggdh: i've seriously tried for at least 3+ years (close to 4 now) to convince myself that i like ubuntu
[00:58] <karlp> hggdh: i just absolutely hate the way most of the system is handled. booting always takes much longer than any other distribution i've used
[00:59] <hggdh> well, then, I guess you should either help improve it, or move to arch
[00:59] <karlp> hggdh: i hate the way the runlevels work. i hate the way building stuff from source is complicated (much more so than on arch with it's abs + pkgbuild)
[00:59] <karlp> hggdh: exactly, and i don't have the time to do the former
[00:59] <hggdh> on the other hand, I tried a LOT of dists, since 1995, before stopping at Ubuntu
[01:00] <karlp> that's really strange. i've never recommended ubuntu to anyone who wasn't just starting to play around with linux distributions
[01:00] <karlp> in other words, if i knew the person had some experience, i'd point them to something that i knew would fit them better
[01:00] <karlp> that begs the question... why am i still on it
[01:00] <hggdh> insteresting the source build issue. I find it simple (but -- probably -- I have been doing it for a while, so it is already ingrained)
[01:01] <karlp> and the answer is that i (falsely) assumed when i started with ubuntu that it had the most software packages available
[01:01] <karlp> eh, it's much easier in arch
[01:01] <karlp> i rather not use gentoo because building from source takes forever
[01:01] <karlp> but i'm stuck with it on my desktop back home
[01:01] <karlp> i would have had the same situation with ubuntu on this system, but i'm going to suck it up and fix it before it gets on my nerves
[01:02] <karlp> i have too many things on my gentoo desktop to bother installing anything else on it, so it remains :(
[01:02] <hggdh> heh
[01:04] <karlp> i think it's a common thread with me and open source software
[01:04] <karlp> i start out intensely liking something and end up really hating it
[01:04] <karlp> like firefox
[01:04] <karlp> started out before the 1.0 series
[01:04] <karlp> loved it, but then it was filled with bloat by 1.5
[01:05] <karlp> now hardware is cheaper, better, etc. so it's not as noticeable, but 3.0 is still not nearly as fast as i remember the 0.x series
[01:05] <hggdh> I know... I keep jumping between ffox, opera, Empathy, and Konqueror
[01:05] <karlp> and what's strange is i started out intensely hating arch
[01:05] <Melik> hey guys ugh anyone know what this apache2 module is called? >> http://dev.gentoo.org/~omp/
[01:06] <karlp> but it's gotten so much better from 2004-2006 that i'm finding myself replacing everything (except my openbsd boxes) with it
[01:06] <hggdh> Melik, I do not
[01:06] <karlp> directory listing?
[01:06] <Melik> yeah
[01:06] <karlp> i know that's a module in lighttpd. been awhile since i've used apache
[01:07] <Melik> it generates directory listing when a index file isnt present
[01:07] <Melik> hmm thanks, im guna go ask in #apache
[01:09] <karlp> i think it's an option/directive though. i don't think it's a module. of course, i could be wrong
[01:10] <hggdh> if I remember correctly, it's a standard module (dir listing, that is)
[01:18] <karlp> okay, bye
[01:18] <karlp> reinstalling then class
[01:38] <legodude__> how is jaunty on intel graphics?
[01:38] <legodude__> and overall, is it stable?
[02:37] <BotLobsta> can anyone help me with my /etc/apt/preferences file?
[02:57] <x1250> BotLobsta, try the apt howto: http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/apt-howto/
[02:58] <BotLobsta> x1250, i read that, and i thought i was doing it right, but it doesnt seem to work
[03:02] <x1250> BotLobsta, is this related to jaunty?
[03:02] <x1250> if not, try #ubuntu
[03:02] <BotLobsta> x1250, well im trying to keep apt-get from upgrading to nvidia-glx-180 version 180.22 which i believe is only in the jaunty repos
[03:04] <BotLobsta> but ive tried there a few times too
[03:05] <RAOF> aptitude forbid-version will prevent aptitude from installing that version; but that _only_ works with aptitude
[03:10] <x1250> BotLobsta, are you in intrepid? whats your apt_preferences file?
[03:10] <x1250> s/_/\//
[03:12] <BotLobsta> x1250, im running jaunty. and its http://pastebin.com/f722170fb
[03:13] <x1250> BotLobsta, I don't understand what you want to do. Thats the version available in jaunty, so why use pinning?
[03:14] <BotLobsta> x1250, because I dont want it to be installed.  I tried it and it didnt work
[03:14] <x1250> you don't want _that_ version upgraded anymore?
[03:15] <x1250> BotLobsta, what version are you using?
[03:15] <BotLobsta> x1250, I currently have 180.11-0ubuntu1 and i dont want it to install a 180.22 version of it
[03:16] <x1250> BotLobsta, then you're doing it the wrong way. You have to ping down 180.11, not 180.22
[03:16] <x1250> pin not ping :P
[03:17] <BotLobsta> but I still want it to install a 180.25 version or something like that when the next release comes out
[03:19] <x1250> and what prevents you from deleting the pin in the future? :)
[03:19] <BotLobsta> true
[03:19] <BotLobsta> but i wont necessarily see when a new version comes out
[03:20] <x1250> if you wonder someday, try apt-cache policy yourpackage
[03:21] <x1250> that will give you the installed and latest version available
[03:23] <BotLobsta> ok
[03:23] <BotLobsta> thanks
[03:36] <x1250> uhm, launchpad is so slow these days :(
[04:03] <bullgard4> x1250: If you mean by 'these days' the year 2009, then you are wrong. It has been slow in the second half of 2008 also.
[04:05] <x1250> bullgard4, I didn't notice. I didn't really used launchpad untill recently :)
[04:06] <bullgard4> x1250: Yes, I see. I am using it for 2 years now. --
[06:10] <moj0rising> hi. I just upgraded to kubuntu jaunty andam getting a blank white screen after KDM loads the desktop. Some googling and forum searching indicates this might be an issue with proprietary drivers but I'm not sure how I can uninstall them since there's a ton of packages for the proprietary drivers....
[06:11] <moj0rising> ...anyone have any ideas on how I can fix it? I can actually use keyboard shortcuts to get the process manager up but that's about all.
[06:53] <pwnguin> RAOF: is linux-nouveau modules gonna make it into the archive soon?
[07:09] <RAOF> pwnguin: It's waiting in NEW now.
[07:09] <RAOF> Or it should be.  Let me check.
[07:10] <DanaG> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/311716
[07:10] <DanaG> yay, gotta' love when one thing breaks another thing!
[07:10] <RAOF> pwnguin: Yup, there it is.  Sitting in source NEW.
[07:10] <DanaG> (last two comments.)
[07:11] <RAOF> I see someone's processed the new queue recently, too.
[07:12] <DanaG> So, now I have no brightness control.
[07:13] <DanaG> "* SAUCE: don't use buggy _BCL/_BCM/_BQC for backlight control"
[07:13]  * DanaG returns this SAUCE to the store as defective.  =þ
[07:13] <DanaG> Why do they call it "sauce", anyway?  Was somebody _hungry_ when naming it?
[07:13] <Amaranth> DanaG: I think that means they got it from upstream?
[07:14] <DanaG> My backlight controls worked fine until that change.  Note my comments.
[07:14] <DanaG> Why blacklist it entirely?  That's silly.
[07:14] <DanaG> Instead, it should prefer vendor drivers over the 'video' module, perhaps.
[07:21] <DanaG> http://www.hp.com/sbso/special/computing/closeout-desktops.html
[07:21] <DanaG> Is it bad that, despite having what some would describe as a "horrible" experience with their support, I'd actually still consider buying their stuff?
[07:21] <DanaG> I take the attitude that, now that I know what to expect, I can deal with it better.
[07:23] <Amaranth> man i paid extra for 3 years of warranty with 1 week turnaround and had to fight with them for 4 days to get my laptop repair started then it took 3 weeks to get it back
[07:24] <DanaG> I learned something: the online chat people may say they're going to send a box... but in reality, you'd better call in the day after to be sure of it.
[07:24] <DanaG> Oh yeah, and because they didn't offer the webcam at my time of purchase... there's no reasonable way to add the built-in one now.
[07:25] <DanaG> I still do think my EliteBook is awesome.
[07:26] <DanaG> And if need be, I could defend myself with it... as a blunt object, I mean.  I hope I never need that sort of thing, though.  =þ
[07:26] <DanaG> Academic Purchase Program has the Windows-Free "MI" Mini-1000 netbook for $310.
[07:27] <DanaG> "command line interface is disabled" -- do you think they mean they disabled vt-switch?  I wonder if you could just alt-f2 or ctrl-alt-backspace or something -- or just go "single" at grub.
[07:31] <DanaG> Another bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fglrx-installer/+bug/314600
[07:32] <DanaG> And look at that nice, long stacktrace.  =þ
[07:33] <DanaG> Note to self: don't buy non-AMT computer ever again, unless AMD adds their own Serial-over-LAN feature.  =þ
[09:01] <pwnguin> i always feel shafted when i see python-uno has an update
[09:31] <robin0800> Firefox Problem http://paste.ubuntu.com:80/104767/
[09:32] <toki_> hey guys im looking for 8.10 support
[09:39] <lemonade> toki_: try #ubuntu instead
[10:17] <Tekno> how do you restart x in jaunty?
[10:18] <Tekno> i dont have login manager
[10:18] <x1250> Tekno, ending the session, or restarting gdm, or enabling CTRL+ALT+BCK_SPACE on xorg.conf :)
[10:18] <Tekno> i dont have gdm
[10:19] <x1250> Section "ServerFlags"
[10:19] <x1250>         Option          "DontZap" "False"
[10:19] <x1250> EndSection
[10:19] <Tekno> okay thanks
[10:19] <x1250> try that on xorg.conf
[10:33] <vega> "DontZap" "False" ... i'd vote for "Zap" "True"
[10:34] <nippz> zomg - help on geting sound working again in jaunty?
[10:34] <nippz> xubuntu / upgraded from intrepid
[10:43] <x1250> vega, your vote is wrong :P
[10:44] <x1250> oh, Zap, I thought you used DontZap. Does it work?
[10:47] <vega> ah, so there is a Zap option also? :)
[10:48] <x1250> Don't know, first time I hear Zap, but haven't look that hard, so... maybe :)
[13:20] <TheInfinity> !daily
[14:13] <Volkodav> why are images oversized ? what is it that does not fit on standard CD ?
[14:13] <TheInfinity> Volkodav: look at size.
[14:13] <Volkodav> is nvidia driver fixed btw ?
[14:13] <Volkodav> 797 mb
[14:15] <TheInfinity> aand now look at the size of a standard cd-r :)
[14:16] <BUGabundo_work> Volkodav: during alpha and specially dailies
[14:16] <BUGabundo_work> devs and archive admins don't care!
[14:16] <BUGabundo_work> it would be too much work
[14:16] <BUGabundo_work> most people just test them on VM or use a dvd or a Pendrive
[14:17] <BUGabundo_work> like I'm doing right now
[14:17] <BUGabundo_work> but there is a bug in the installer!
[14:17] <BUGabundo_work> and I can't proceed! :((((
[14:17] <BUGabundo_work> Volkodav: no nv fix yet either
[14:17] <TheInfinity> BUGabundo_work: in daily or in alpha installer?
[14:17] <Pici> The 'final' alpha 3 isos won't be oversized.
[14:18] <BUGabundo_work> yesterday daily
[14:18] <Volkodav> ok
[14:18] <Volkodav> will wait
[14:18] <Volkodav> or boot from from flash
[14:18] <BUGabundo_work> I guess I'll have to make the disk partiions by hand
[15:12] <delicowa> what major featurs are we to expect from jaunting jackalope
[15:13] <fosco_> delicowa: http://www.ubuntu.com/testing/jaunty/alpha2
[15:14] <charlie-tca> and let us not forget ext4 formatting
[15:19] <delicowa> wow!!! come to think of it
[15:19] <BUGabundo_work> fosco_: charlie-tca I just filed a bug about the installer
[15:19] <BUGabundo_work> its failing to set partitions manually
[15:20] <BUGabundo_work> and without it you won't be able to choose ext4
[15:20] <fosco_> i saw that on alpha2
[15:20] <BUGabundo_work> bug 317124
[15:20] <delicowa> if ubuntu uses animal names for naming releases every six months. what happens when they run out of names
[15:20] <delicowa> if ubuntu uses animal names for naming releases every six months. what happens when they run out of names?
[15:20] <BUGabundo_work> cjwatson said he would port the patch for the installer
[15:20]  * BUGabundo_work slaps ubottu
[15:20] <fosco_> delicowa: well, more than 10 years for that to happen :)
[15:21] <Kuaera> I have a question; what are the plans for the KDE PIM suite [kontact]? I notice a lot of changes, and it seems to be getting more solid, but I'm not certain if they're willing to hear bugreports regarding it.
[15:21] <delicowa> i have a launchpad account how do i join the testing team
[15:21] <delicowa> and what version of gnome and kde should we expect
[15:22] <Kuaera> KDE 4.2 with Qt4.5, IIRC
[15:22] <delicowa> ***sorry i already found that out
[15:46] <Skiessi> !info mysql-common
[15:46] <Skiessi> some program didn't like 5.1.30?
[16:00] <emorris> anyone seen problems with the arrow keys not working on the boot screen of the desktop cd?
[16:26] <tretle> Hi, I was wondering whether its currently safe to upgrade to 9.04, I tried a few days ago but after the upgrade nm disappeared from the panel and I had no networking?
[16:27] <fosco__> tretle, not safe, only for testing
[16:27] <tretle> are their alot of packages being held back? and could I have had this issue from upgrading straight from an 8.10 fresh install to 9.04 withought first installing the 204 updates for 8.10?
[16:28] <charlie-tca> tretle: perfectly possible, since it is always advised to fully update before upgrading
[16:28] <BUGabundo_work> tretle: the proper way to dist-upgrade is using update-manager -d
[16:28] <BUGabundo_work> but you will lose 3D
[16:29] <BUGabundo_work> kdelibs is also broken due to new snapshot of kde 4.2 RC1
[16:29] <tretle> fosco_ I usually use ubuntu dev alpha 2's onwords, I keep everything important on an external disk so I do a lot of reinstalling. I dont mind usually but the bug I have recently encountered is a show stopper one. I dont mind a buggy system as long as I have networking to troublshoot and fix the problems
[16:30] <tretle> bugabundo_work I always use update-manager -d, but when it gets to 99% installing xulrunner fails and it continues for a bit and then kills the installation before it goes onto the clean up system stage
[16:31] <BUGabundo_work> talk to asac or fta on #ubuntu-mozillateam
[16:31] <mvo_> tretle: does it kill itself? or do you see a message box?
[16:31] <mvo_> tretle: saying that the upgrade failed etc
[16:31] <tretle> bugabundo_work, My gfx cards been broken for the last 8months so I have been using metacity-compositing with the vesa graphics driver :)
[16:32] <tretle> mvo_ it says the upgrade failed
[16:32] <mvo_> tretle: the bug itself got fixed today
[16:32] <mvo_> tretle: ok, thanks
[16:32] <tretle> niiiiice :D
[16:32] <mvo_> :)
[16:32] <mvo_> hugs asac
[16:32] <tretle> I was wondering whether the bug on gnome-keyring blogged on planet.ubuntu could have been it
[16:32]  * BUGabundo_work waits for cjwatson to fix the installer so I can get ext4
[16:34] <tretle> anyone have any idea what the current state of metacity compositing on jaunty is, I saw on cimi's italian blog a post which I think was referring to a new feature regarding window transparency and fading transitions in svn but I cant speak italian so cant be sure :D
[16:35] <tretle> bugabundo_work have you seen the ext3 -> ext4 performance comparison yet
[16:35] <tretle> ?
[16:35] <BUGabundo_work> no
[16:36] <BUGabundo_work> just read about it on kernel ML
[16:37] <tretle> http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=ubuntu_ext4&num=1
[16:37] <tretle> its an interesting result
[16:47] <tretle> by  the way is the new gnome-volume-manager supposed to show more than one mixer for the output tab?
[16:47] <tretle> I have a 7.1 system yet before it only showed one mixer
[16:47] <tretle> about a week ago
[16:48] <x1250> tretle, try gnome-alsamixer
[16:49] <tretle> ah, yeah well isnt gnome-volume-manager using pulseaudio as default now nor not?
[16:49] <tretle> nor - or
[16:51] <x1250> tretle, you mean gnome-volume-control?
[16:51] <tretle> ah, whoops.... yes
[16:51] <x1250> yes it is, but pulseaudio uses alsa, so...
[16:51] <tretle> shouldnt pulse audio replace alsa?
[16:52] <x1250> no, pulseaudio is a wrapper
[16:55] <tretle> and how should you be able to control the mixer for each speaker in the gnome-volume-control applet? If i right click and choose preferences it shows all of the speakers an inputs but in the gnome-volume control there is the one mixer for output
[16:57] <x1250> tretle, do it with gnome-alsamixer, or alsamixer -c 0
[17:00] <tretle> Is it currently available but unusable due to a bug with the new volume-control or is there an update planned to support multiple input/outputs in a future update, using alsamixer is a bit of a regression if you ask me
[17:01] <x1250> tretle, you can do it with pulseaudio volume control, but its a pain in the *ss. Go to the preferences window.
[17:05] <tretle> x120 - so u dont know whether you should be able to do it with gnome-volume-control?
[17:05] <tretle> even before the final build
[17:06] <x1250> how could i know? AFAIK, it depends on the fedora guys.
[17:06] <tretle> I can see allot of people getting annoyed that they can no longer set the volume for all of their outputs in the replacement gnome-volume-control
[17:08] <x1250> tretle, I totally sympathize with that, the old volume control was way better. But well, things are just the way they are :(
[17:08] <tretle> oh, sorry.... I came onto irc a few days ago and someone told me that the new gnome-volume-control was originally working with multiple outputs but that their was a bug
[17:11] <x1250> tretle, as I said, you can do it, but in a very stupid way, go to the preferences window and select other option to control
[18:28] <tretle> looks like the gnome-keyring definately was the bug holding me back from upgrading, now i plan to reinstall once more when alpha 3 is released for ext4 support
[18:31] <Lukian> Using the 2.6.28 kernel, I receive the message "Unable to read/access /etc/udev/rules.d" at kernel boot with a repeating pcspeaker beep. 2.6.27 works fine
[18:41] <ethana2> does Jaunty use initrd-less boot with fallback from installed instances of the OS?
[18:50] <uffo> currently like i understand that EXT4 can be used only with manual mode installation in Kubuntu 9.04 final???
[18:50] <uffo> news said that ext4 wont be in by default does that mean that
[18:51] <fosco__> uffo, automated installations will use ext3
[18:51] <uffo> fosco__: and with manual i can use ext4 right?
[18:51] <uffo> fosco__: in final version
[18:52] <fosco__> it is supposed to be present in tomorrow's alpha3
[18:53] <uffo> fosco__: i tried to install todays live cd kubuntu and ext4 choise was in but when i selected it and after i pressed next it still was ext3, does alpha3 tomorrow will fix that
[18:56] <fosco__> hope so
[18:59] <uffo> fosco__: thanks i feel myself better now that ext4 can be used manually, btw i never use guided install anyway.
[19:10] <l337ingDisorder> anyone here have experience with remote X?
[19:11] <l337ingDisorder> I made changes to gdm.conf (on a fresh Ubuntu 8.04 installation) to set DisallowTCP=False and [xdmcp] Enable=True and I was able to connect remotely last night. I ran the Update Manager overnight, it finished, I clicked the "Restart now" button, and now I can't connect remotely - it just shows a black screen with the X cursor
[19:46] <nacho> Hi
[19:47] <nacho> do you guys knows how to add the -ignoreABI option to the xserver, as now with latest xorg I can't run nvidia without that option
[19:48] <Pici> nacho: In xorg.conf, I think all you need to do is add    Option IgnoreABI "True"     to your device section.
[19:48] <nacho> Pici, ok thanks
[19:49] <nacho> Pici, and do you have any solution for gnome-settings-daemon that seems to be crashing all time?
[19:50] <nacho> if not, I'll wait it is not something critical to me
[19:51] <Pici> nacho: Not off the top of my head
[19:51] <nacho> Pici, thanks anyway I am going to restart the X server now
[19:51] <nacho> bye
[19:55] <emorris> anyone else had any problems where the arrow keys don't work? running 9.04 in VMWare, not sure if this is a guest or host issue
[19:57] <emorris> hang on a minute, this was the same thing i had in hardy. half of them don't work and the other half do odd things (like up is prntscrn)
[19:57] <emorris> s/hardy/intrepid/
[20:01] <iamarockstar> is alpha 3 out?
[20:01] <Pici> No.
[20:01] <BUGabundo1> no
[20:02] <BUGabundo1> should be tomorrow night
[20:02] <BUGabundo1> late as usual
[20:02] <iamarockstar> hmm ok by the way anything new expected in it?
[20:03] <BUGabundo1> some fixes in the installer
[20:03] <BUGabundo1> and new kde 4.2 rc1 snapshot
[20:04] <BUGabundo1> and the size should allow it to fit in a CD
[20:04] <BUGabundo1> not that I care!
[20:04] <BUGabundo1> I just put it on a 8GiBs pendrive
[20:05] <iamarockstar> ok thx
[20:13] <Alexia_Death> after recent updates mysqld does not start any more
[20:13] <Alexia_Death> nd log says: operation="inode_permission" requested_mask="r::" denied_mask="r::" fsuid=0 name="/sys/devices/system/cpu/" pid=5574 profile="/usr/sbin/mysqld"
[20:13] <Alexia_Death> any clues?
[20:15] <iamarockstar> i am not sure but i think it will get fixed in alpha 3
[20:15] <iamarockstar> tommorow releasing
[20:18] <Alexia_Death> so it should be in the next set of updated...
[20:18]  * Alexia_Death is permanently running alpha:P
[20:23] <nacho> Hi again
[20:24] <nacho> now I have everything working except the sound, seems that there is a new sound control, do you guys had problems with the sound?
[20:25] <nacho> with this new sound control system I can't configurate all things I had in the previous one
[20:26] <Alexia_Death> nacho: yes
[20:26] <Alexia_Death> everybody do
[20:26] <Alexia_Death> thers a problem with alsa.
[20:26] <nacho> ah! ok great
[20:26] <Alexia_Death> searrch the launchpad, but basically your sound starts muted.
[20:27] <Alexia_Death> do alsamixer -Dhw
[20:27] <Alexia_Death> unmute and volume up all
[20:27] <Alexia_Death> to fix it muting at startup you need to link /etc/init.d/alsa-utils to rc.2
[20:27] <Alexia_Death> theres a boug about that
[20:27] <nacho> oh! great, thanks
[20:28] <nacho> Alexia_Death, I have sound now
[20:28] <nacho> thanks a lot
[20:28] <Alexia_Death> Welcome ;)
[20:29] <nacho> Alexia_Death, another thing that I realized is that when gnome-power-manager lows the brithness, the system gets hang a bit
[20:29] <nacho> known issue?
[20:30] <Alexia_Death> dont know anything about that
[20:30] <Alexia_Death> But you know anything about mysql not starting=
[20:30] <Alexia_Death> ?
[20:31] <nacho> mmm, I didn't see the mysql yet
[20:32] <nacho> Alexia_Death, phpmyadmin seems to work fine here
[20:34] <x1250> mysql can't be installed in here, dpkg dies :/
[20:40] <hggdh> Alexia_Death, are you running mysql 5.1?
[20:40] <Alexia_Death> hggdh: arent running it...
[20:40] <Alexia_Death> but yes, its 5.1
[20:40] <Alexia_Death> it sjust broke now.
[20:40] <hggdh> the problem there is a bad parameter in /etc/mysql/my.cnf
[20:40] <Alexia_Death> IT seems that trying to remove it removes amarok too...
[20:41] <Alexia_Death> witch one?
[20:41] <hggdh> all you need to do to bypass it is comment out skip-bdb in my.cnf
[20:43] <hggdh> this was a valid parameter up to 5.0x, not anymore
[20:44] <hggdh> and it is a bug in LP... bug 316849
[20:46] <Alexia_Death> hggdh: thanks. figured it would be
[20:46] <Alexia_Death> My X just died unexplicably but that worked.
[20:47] <hggdh> BTW -- the "inode_permission..." thingy... on the update, it seems the apparmour profile for MySQL got deleted, and apparmour has not been restarted
[20:49] <hggdh> if you reboot, or 'sudo invoke-rc.d apparmor restart', these messages will stop
[20:50] <Alexia_Death> thanks:)
[21:21] <ethana2> The OS doesn't store any vital hardware configuration data in ~/, right?
[21:21] <ethana2> ..hope not.
[21:21] <RAOF> The OS doesn't really store vital hardware information _anywhere_
[21:38] <Amaranth> RAOF: well, there are the udev rules
[21:38] <Amaranth> RAOF: wipe those out and try to boot all the way to a desktop :)
[21:39] <RAOF> But that's not really hardware information.  That's a way of mapping whatever hardware is there to well-known names.
[21:39] <RAOF> Perhaps what I meant was: there's no hardware-specific configuration pretty much anywhere.
[21:45] <Alexia_Death> RAOF: Hal has
[21:45] <Alexia_Death> RAOF: thats the point of hal-info
[21:45] <RAOF> Alexia_Death: Again, not really specific to _your_ hardware.
[21:46] <RAOF> What I mean is: take the hard drive out, plug it into an different machine.  Barring possibly xorg.conf, everything should work.
[22:03] <hggdh> Alexia_Death, if you mean like Windows (where you can only really boot on the installed machine), then no hardware-specific data is saved either under ~/ or / itself
[22:03] <Alexia_Death> or anywhwere on the system :P
[22:04] <hggdh> of course, your X install may be unhappy if you change to a different card
[22:04] <hggdh> etc, but linux will still boot
[22:04] <hggdh> hum
[22:04] <hggdh> what about uuid?
[22:05] <hggdh> grub now uses to point to an uuid-mapped disk
[22:05] <RAOF> Won't change, right?  That's a property of the partition, not the system.
[22:05] <hggdh> darnit, of course :-(
[22:05] <RAOF> hggdh: X won't be unhappy if you don't have an xorg.conf :)
[22:06] <hggdh> well, there is that. But I, for one, am forced to use a xorg.conf, or I get the wrong card configured
[22:06] <JanC> hggdh: Xorg in Ubuntu should use a "safe config" if the hard-configured X graphics driver in Xorg.conf doesn't work
[22:07] <hggdh> JanC, it does. It is just terrible, and I would still want my 1900x1200
[22:07] <x1250> could someone please review this mysql-server installation? is broken: http://paste.ubuntu.com/104986/
[22:08] <JanC> the "safe default" allows you to get to your 1900x1200  ツ
[22:08] <hggdh> x1250, which mysql do you have installed?
[22:08] <hggdh> with 5.1 and 5.0 available, things can get confused
[22:08] <hggdh> JanC, not in my case. I am restricted to 1600xwhatever
[22:09] <hggdh> and, actually, it is time to test again...
[22:09] <hggdh> hopefully I can get out of radeonhd and back into fglrx
[22:09] <JanC> you can use the "safe default" to change to another driver (without having to know the commandline etc.)
[22:09] <x1250> hggdh, I'm not upgrading, I had no mysql-server installed before that
[22:10] <hggdh> JanC, indeed. And this is what I usually do on every test
[22:11] <hggdh> x1250,  --> Aborting downgrade from (at least) 5.1 to 5.0.
[22:11] <hggdh> run a dpkg -l mysql\* | grep ii
[22:16] <x1250> hggdh, you're right, there is some hand work to do.
[22:34] <rbrunhuber> Can anyone confirm that linux-image-2.6.28-4-generic does not boot into encrypted lvm?
[22:35]  * RAOF is running that setup right now.
[22:35] <RAOF> Although it's true that I have to manually run cryptsetup from the busybox prompt, first ;)
[22:36] <rbrunhuber> RAOF: So you are confirming this more or less indirect ;-)
[22:36] <RAOF> Well, no.  It's not the kernel, its the initramfs
[22:37] <rbrunhuber> Maybe, did not investigate this further. Just saw that booting the -4 kernel does not bring up the system while -3 does.
[22:38] <rbrunhuber> RAOF: see above
[22:39] <RAOF> rbrunhuber: That's because the -3 kernel probably hasn't had its initramfs updated.
[22:41] <rbrunhuber> RAOF: I'll try to contact the devs directly, I do not want to write a bug report and wait while it gets attention while others are pushed over the cliff.
[22:42] <RAOF> Writing a bug report _is_ the correct way of contacting the devs directly!
[22:54] <DanaG> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/311716 --- yay for breaking ACPI video backlight control!
[22:58] <tretle> hi, I as wondering whether the new gdm is supposed to be in jaunty or not
[22:59] <tretle> according to https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/gdm-upgrade its already in but according to synaptic its not
[23:02] <DanaG> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fglrx-installer/+bug/314600
[23:06] <astromme-laptop> Anyone else having plasma crashes (4.2RC, 4.1.96) on amd64?
[23:18] <david__> how do i get proprietary drivers for an AYI graphics card?
[23:19] <david__> ATI
[23:20] <RAOF> You don't, not for Jaunty.
[23:20] <RAOF> There isn't a version of fglrx that supports our X server.
[23:21] <david__> ah so no graphics card usage
[23:21] <RAOF> Well, you can almost certainly use one of the open-source dirvers.
[23:21] <RAOF> What card?
[23:22] <david__> ATI radeon 1650 pro
[23:22] <RAOF> That should have full support, including 3d, with the "ati" driver.
[23:22] <RAOF> IIRC.
[23:23] <JanC> well, "full" as in some 3D support at least
[23:23] <david__> how do i get the driver?
[23:23] <JanC> thye 'ati' driver is included
[23:24] <JanC> the*
[23:24] <RAOF> It's the driver you'll be using when you haven't deliberately set a different driver.
[23:24] <david__> so when i booted jaunty onto my hard drive it was installed?
[23:25] <RAOF> Yes
[23:25] <david__> cool thnks
[23:25] <RAOF> You're _probably_ using it now, unless you've done some fiddling.
[23:26] <david__> other thav a few crashes jaunty seems like it will be a great distro!
[23:37] <DanaG> Ugh, stupid broken backlight control.
[23:38] <DanaG> Oh, and every time I boot, I find my hda-intel card's PCM muted.
[23:39] <DanaG> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/311716
[23:39] <DanaG> I sure hope it doesn't get released with that "fix" that actually BREAKS things.
[23:49] <david__> i look at it this way even a broken linux is better than microsoft!
[23:51]  * DanaG would disagree with that.
[23:53] <david__> well i guess if you have allot of money to give away to buy a license you really dont own then yes
[23:57] <DanaG> Good point.
[23:58] <david__> long time windows user but times are tight and linux is looking very good to me!