LaserJocksbalneav: you might want to have a look at Fedora's patches to sabayon at some point: http://daniel.holba.ch/harvest/handler.py?pkg=sabayon01:31
primaryi just installed edubuntu and I am having trouble with fonts.  in some programs meny text does not appear.  How do I resolve this?16:01
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LaserJockhi all18:10
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nubaehi LaserJock19:42
LaserJockhi nubae19:42
nubaepresenting edubuntu to a pedagogical school of Graz tomorrow... they are the ones that decide what to implement in the rest of the country19:42
alkisgGood luck nubae! :)19:46
nubaethanks... have either of u tried the wiimote as whiteboard thing under ubuntu?19:47
alkisgNot me... don't have a wii....19:47
nubaeu can buy a controller for 30 €19:47
alkisg(neither a projector! :))19:47
nubaewhich is all one needs19:47
nubaeah :-)19:48
LaserJockI don't have much of anything, period :-)19:48
alkisgDid you want to show them the wiimote?19:48
LaserJockno wii, no projector, no classroom, no students ... ;-)19:49
nubaenot yet, no, but I thought its a pretty cool gadget to show19:49
nubaein sugar we have something called classroom presenter19:49
nubaewhere u put up slides and can draw on them collaboratively19:49
LaserJockwell, I guess I do have students, but no classroom, just a lab19:49
nubaeits totally something that would pair up with the wiimote thing19:49
alkisg...and maybe 10 remotes, one for each students? :D19:50
nubaewell u can do 4 light points per remote19:50
nubaeit works by putting an led in a pen end19:51
LaserJockso how exactly does this wiimote thing work?19:51
alkisgHm... nice! So for small classrooms, 2-3 wiimotes are enough...19:51
LaserJockyou hook the wiimote to a computer which then goes via projector to a witeboard?19:52
nubaewell, it gets put behing the projector19:52
nubaeand it picks up light sources by bouncing infrared off it19:52
nubaeso u use leds to do that19:52
nubaebecause the wii can do 4 remotes at once, u can use 4 concurrent pointers19:53
nubaeso then u basically open any program that has ability to draw19:53
nubaeand voila19:53
nubaeno need for the whiteboard19:54
nubaethats the expensive part19:54
LaserJockI guess I'm still not getting it19:54
LaserJockso it ends up projecting what you're drawing in the program?19:54
alkisgLaserJock: there are some nice videos in youtube that demonstrate it...19:54
nubaea projector projects teh image19:55
alkisgE.g. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QgKCrGvShZs19:55
nubaethe infra red wii remote picks up the led as a point in space and draws19:55
nubaeyeah u'll get it when u see it19:55
nubaebut for presenting sugar or edubuntu, it would be very neat19:57
alkisgnubae, is sugar still in development, or it's been halted?20:00
nubaeno its in development... sugarlabs has taken over everything20:00
nubaeolpc is no longer involved really... or maybe a little on the hardware side20:00
nubaebut like edubuntu, its a volunteer project now20:01
nubaeeducation just isn't important enough20:01
nubaeweapons first...20:01
LaserJockok, one question though, how does the wiimote attach to the computer?20:01
alkisgThat doesn't matter much, if it has something to offer, then people are going to work on it...20:02
nubaeusb I believe20:02
LaserJocknubae: coolio20:02
* LaserJock tries to think of what he'd do with a wiimote whiteboard20:07
nubaearen't u involved with chemistry classes or something like that?20:11
LaserJockkinda yeah20:12
LaserJockbut, in the lab20:12
LaserJockwe don't really use whiteboards much20:12
nubaewell imagine this scenario... u draw the molecules and formulas and all that on the board20:12
nubaeand then it gets automatically sent as a screenshot to all your students20:12
nubaethey then save that in their journal or whatever20:13
nubaeI can see lots of applications to the whiteboard20:13
LaserJockbut I don't see how that gains me a lot20:13
LaserJockright now I have a blackboard and my students have pens :-)20:13
nubaeteh blackboard cant really be distributed to every student afterwards20:13
LaserJockthat's why they have pens20:14
nubaebut then the better note takers have an advantage20:14
nubaelike this they can concentrate on what is going on at the board20:14
nubaeand u can go at whatever pace u like20:14
LaserJockbut aren't we trying to get better note taking skills?20:15
nubaeI'm sure they get enough of that in the classes where that is warranted20:15
nubaelike English, foreign languages, etc20:15
nubaeLearning should be made easier, no?20:16
LaserJockwell, yes and no20:16
LaserJockyes, learning what you're supposed to learn should be as easy as possible20:16
LaserJockbut  you should still learn what you need to learn20:16
LaserJockand as a chemist still one of the biggest things I have to teach students is how to write and take notes20:16
nubaedotn u think u get that better being collaborative in teh classroom?20:17
nubaeasking students to take over whatever u are teaching on the board...20:17
nubaeor even from their computer terminal20:17
nubaethere is no need really for pens... I just dont see that... every kid with a laptop is the way forward20:18
LaserJockwell, frankly I think they just need to pay attention and try a little20:18
nubaein a controlled environment of course20:18
LaserJockfor the stuff I do I really don't think laptops are going to replace pens any time soon20:18
LaserJockno doubt in some future time20:18
nubaemy kids always paid attention when they knew they'd have to come up to the board and write something themselves20:18
LaserJockpresently I don't have time for that20:19
LaserJockI write, they write, I ask questions, we move on :-)20:19
LaserJockbut my "teaching" situation is not the norm for sure20:19
LaserJockmy environment is a laboratory and my "teaching" is mostly "hands-on"20:20
nubaeah right...20:21
LaserJockI'd like to get some netbooks to try out with a couple things20:21
LaserJockso far the students hate the computers20:21
nubaeI'm sure u are not short of ideas...20:21
LaserJockthey're rather do anything but use the computer20:21
LaserJockthere are 2 computer-based labs that I think the wiimote thing might be cool20:21
nubaeI think for maths it would be great20:22
LaserJockright now we just all go up to the computer lab and all 20+ students just struggle through a set of instructions in their little cubicle-like space20:22
nubaeyeah, the non collaborative experience20:23
LaserJockI end up running around for 4 hrs helping people with the same problems20:23
LaserJockand I don't exactly teach them anything other than computers suck :-)20:23
nubaeyeah I know that one too... I had the same showing how to use program X or program Y, until we started having collaborative sessions20:24
nubaevia italc or projector20:24
LaserJockbut one thing is that chemistry is *very* visual20:25
LaserJockit's the most geometric and visual of the natural/physical sciences20:25
LaserJockIMO at least20:25
LaserJockso one of the struggles is always trying to represent 3D via a whiteboard :-)20:25
nubaewell.... one thing that is VERY cool with that technology20:26
nubaeis being able to move 2 or 3 points at once20:26
nubaeso u can rotate a 3d object in space very easily20:26
nubaezoom in, zoom out20:26
LaserJockI can see how this stuff could be cool20:26
LaserJockI just know that it would be a real struggle to get it going and to get people to use it20:27
nubaewell, using it, I dont see so hard, making it work flawlessly, harder20:27
LaserJockI think most of the teachers would just turn it off and write on a whiteboard20:27
LaserJockwe'd have to do quite a bit of training, which is something we're not very good at20:28
LaserJocktrying to take a chemist and turn them into a teacher is hard enough, getting thing proficient with a computer is going to be tough :-)20:29
nubaeyeah, guess so20:30
LaserJockit's getting the teachers who teach the teachers on board that's the trick :-)20:31
nubaeright... thats what I'm doing now too20:32
LaserJockbut maybe I can work on some demo's20:32
LaserJockI think this spring we'll have our linux lab maybe working20:32
LaserJockwe need to upgrade ~15 machines to Intrepid first though :(20:32
LaserJockcomputers are such a pain ;-)20:33
nubaetry clonezilla20:33
nubaeit will upgrade all 15 at once in about an hour20:33
LaserJockI'm not sure if they're fresh installs or dist-upgrades20:34
LaserJocklogging in to 15 computers and running update manager shouldn't take too long, it's just that it's gotta get done20:34
LaserJockthen we fix AD authentication20:35
LaserJockthen maybe we figure out printing20:35
nubaeyeah but they need to download packages for each one20:35
nubaeheh, printing should be plug and play20:35
LaserJockwe have lots of bandwidth20:35
LaserJockwe have huge amounts of printing problems with the windows machines20:36
nubaeyeah.... I had one of these big massive industrial photocopiers that is also a printer20:36
LaserJockI'm hoping it just works in Xubuntu and it'll be a "hmm, the Windows machines never can print but the Linux ones work all the time"20:36
nubaethink it was canon...20:36
nubaehad to manually install the postscript drivers..20:37
nubaeman was that a pain20:37
LaserJockright now in Windows you have to re-setup the printer every time the machine is rebooted20:37
LaserJockand it's not a trivial setup20:37
LaserJockif I could just find an LTSP server I could try that20:38
LaserJockbut honestly I'm not sure if it's that great of an idea for us20:38
LaserJockas my feeling is that LTSP takes some work to setup and keep maintained20:38
LaserJockand I know when I leave there really isn't going to be much of anybody to maintain it20:39
nubaeIts improved a lot... intrepid is pretty maintenance free20:41
ballIf I want to install Edubuntu stand-alone, without ltsp, can I use the ordinary Xubuntu install CD instead of the alternate?22:19
LaserJockwell, kinda22:20
LaserJockthe Edubuntu CD is an addon to Ubuntu so it assumes ubuntu-desktop is installed22:20
LaserJockso you might have to pull dependencies off the net to install some stuff22:21
LaserJockalso edubuntu-desktop depends on ubuntu-desktop so you probably don't want to install that22:21
LaserJockbut say if you wanted Edubuntu without ltsp you could use the Ubuntu Desktop CD just fine22:22
ballHmm... perhaps I should install (Gnome) Ubuntu then instead of Xubuntu22:22
LaserJockkind of depends on what you're trying to do22:22
ballIs that what you suggest?22:22
ballLaserJock: I'm preparing a laptop that's going to Haiti22:23
LaserJockball: not a very big hard drive?22:23
ballLaserJock: I don't know yet, I haven't booted it.22:23
ballProbably not tiny though, it comes with a FireWire port22:23
LaserJockbecause if you have plenty of diskspace you can install both22:23
LaserJockand then the user can log into either Gnome or Xfce depending how well it performs22:24
LaserJockor you could install Kubuntu and just install selected educational apps22:24
ballbrb, I have to switch seats.22:26
ballDoes the Edubuntu CD differ much from edubuntu-desktop?22:38
LaserJockwell, the CD has all the stuff that's in edubuntu-desktop and a little bit more22:44
LaserJockbut the CD itself lets you also pick individual apps in the GUI that pops up22:44
LaserJockso either way (CD or apt-get) will get you stuff22:45
ballIt's a shame I have to install Ubuntu: that means two user interfaces to support instead of one.22:49
LaserJockwell, you can do xubuntu22:51
LaserJockand then apt-get the apps you want22:52
ballWhat do the Edubuntu CD and edubuntu-desktop offer over and above the applications?22:52
LaserJockwe'll they're meant to pull things together22:53
LaserJockmake it easier to install on an Ubuntu desktop22:53
LaserJockthe CD lets people in low-bandwith countries share the educational apps22:54
ballThat's a good idea, I should send install CDs with the machine.22:56
LaserJockbut we sort of have to make some assumption on what's already installed on the user's machine23:00
LaserJockotherwise we'd have to include *everything*23:00
* ball nods23:02
ballI'll try Ubuntu on the laptop, though I know it's more heavyweight than Xubuntu23:14
LaserJockit is, but it if it runs ok it's more featureful, IMO23:17
ballI'll try to convince myself that's a good thing ;-)\23:21
LaserJockwell, I think for kidos it's maybe easier to use23:24
ball"more featureful" usually means less easy to use in my experience.23:27
calimersandbox did it!!!!23:33
calimertop 100 at moddb for mod/game of the year!!23:33
calimerout of 9k!!!23:33
ballI'll give it a try anyway.23:36
ballThanks a lot for your help LaserJock23:36
calimerand oh yeah LaserJock cool article23:37
LaserJockcalimer: thanks23:50
LaserJockcalimer: and congrats!23:51
calimernow we just need votes for top 10 :D23:51

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