[01:31] sbalneav: you might want to have a look at Fedora's patches to sabayon at some point: http://daniel.holba.ch/harvest/handler.py?pkg=sabayon [16:01] i just installed edubuntu and I am having trouble with fonts. in some programs meny text does not appear. How do I resolve this? === primary is now known as BttleStarJesus === BttleStarJesus is now known as BattleStarJesus === primary is now known as BattleStarJesus [18:10] hi all === primary is now known as BattleStarJesus [19:42] hi LaserJock [19:42] hi nubae [19:42] presenting edubuntu to a pedagogical school of Graz tomorrow... they are the ones that decide what to implement in the rest of the country [19:45] cool [19:46] Good luck nubae! :) [19:47] thanks... have either of u tried the wiimote as whiteboard thing under ubuntu? [19:47] Not me... don't have a wii.... [19:47] u can buy a controller for 30 € [19:47] (neither a projector! :)) [19:47] which is all one needs [19:48] ah :-) [19:48] I don't have much of anything, period :-) [19:48] Did you want to show them the wiimote? [19:49] no wii, no projector, no classroom, no students ... ;-) [19:49] not yet, no, but I thought its a pretty cool gadget to show [19:49] lol [19:49] in sugar we have something called classroom presenter [19:49] where u put up slides and can draw on them collaboratively [19:49] well, I guess I do have students, but no classroom, just a lab [19:49] its totally something that would pair up with the wiimote thing [19:50] ...and maybe 10 remotes, one for each students? :D [19:50] well u can do 4 light points per remote [19:51] it works by putting an led in a pen end [19:51] so how exactly does this wiimote thing work? [19:51] Hm... nice! So for small classrooms, 2-3 wiimotes are enough... [19:52] you hook the wiimote to a computer which then goes via projector to a witeboard? [19:52] well, it gets put behing the projector [19:52] behind [19:52] and it picks up light sources by bouncing infrared off it [19:52] so u use leds to do that [19:53] because the wii can do 4 remotes at once, u can use 4 concurrent pointers [19:53] so then u basically open any program that has ability to draw [19:53] and voila [19:54] no need for the whiteboard [19:54] thats the expensive part [19:54] I guess I'm still not getting it [19:54] so it ends up projecting what you're drawing in the program? [19:54] LaserJock: there are some nice videos in youtube that demonstrate it... [19:55] a projector projects teh image [19:55] E.g. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QgKCrGvShZs [19:55] the infra red wii remote picks up the led as a point in space and draws [19:55] yeah u'll get it when u see it [19:57] but for presenting sugar or edubuntu, it would be very neat [19:58] http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Image:Cpxo_beta1_ss_nav.jpg [20:00] nubae, is sugar still in development, or it's been halted? [20:00] no its in development... sugarlabs has taken over everything [20:00] olpc is no longer involved really... or maybe a little on the hardware side [20:01] but like edubuntu, its a volunteer project now [20:01] education just isn't important enough [20:01] weapons first... [20:01] ok, one question though, how does the wiimote attach to the computer? [20:02] That doesn't matter much, if it has something to offer, then people are going to work on it... [20:02] usb I believe [20:02] nubae: coolio [20:07] * LaserJock tries to think of what he'd do with a wiimote whiteboard [20:11] aren't u involved with chemistry classes or something like that? [20:12] kinda yeah [20:12] but, in the lab [20:12] we don't really use whiteboards much [20:12] well imagine this scenario... u draw the molecules and formulas and all that on the board [20:12] ok [20:12] and then it gets automatically sent as a screenshot to all your students [20:13] they then save that in their journal or whatever [20:13] I can see lots of applications to the whiteboard [20:13] hmm [20:13] but I don't see how that gains me a lot [20:13] right now I have a blackboard and my students have pens :-) [20:13] teh blackboard cant really be distributed to every student afterwards [20:14] that's why they have pens [20:14] but then the better note takers have an advantage [20:14] like this they can concentrate on what is going on at the board [20:14] hmm [20:14] and u can go at whatever pace u like [20:15] but aren't we trying to get better note taking skills? [20:15] I'm sure they get enough of that in the classes where that is warranted [20:15] like English, foreign languages, etc [20:16] Learning should be made easier, no? [20:16] well, yes and no [20:16] yes, learning what you're supposed to learn should be as easy as possible [20:16] but you should still learn what you need to learn [20:16] and as a chemist still one of the biggest things I have to teach students is how to write and take notes [20:17] dotn u think u get that better being collaborative in teh classroom? [20:17] asking students to take over whatever u are teaching on the board... [20:17] or even from their computer terminal [20:18] there is no need really for pens... I just dont see that... every kid with a laptop is the way forward [20:18] well, frankly I think they just need to pay attention and try a little [20:18] in a controlled environment of course [20:18] for the stuff I do I really don't think laptops are going to replace pens any time soon [20:18] no doubt in some future time [20:18] my kids always paid attention when they knew they'd have to come up to the board and write something themselves [20:18] fear [20:19] presently I don't have time for that [20:19] I write, they write, I ask questions, we move on :-) [20:19] but my "teaching" situation is not the norm for sure [20:20] my environment is a laboratory and my "teaching" is mostly "hands-on" [20:21] ah right... [20:21] I'd like to get some netbooks to try out with a couple things [20:21] so far the students hate the computers [20:21] I'm sure u are not short of ideas... [20:21] they're rather do anything but use the computer [20:21] there are 2 computer-based labs that I think the wiimote thing might be cool [20:22] I think for maths it would be great [20:22] right now we just all go up to the computer lab and all 20+ students just struggle through a set of instructions in their little cubicle-like space [20:23] yeah, the non collaborative experience [20:23] I end up running around for 4 hrs helping people with the same problems [20:23] and I don't exactly teach them anything other than computers suck :-) [20:24] yeah I know that one too... I had the same showing how to use program X or program Y, until we started having collaborative sessions [20:24] via italc or projector [20:25] but one thing is that chemistry is *very* visual [20:25] it's the most geometric and visual of the natural/physical sciences [20:25] IMO at least [20:25] so one of the struggles is always trying to represent 3D via a whiteboard :-) [20:26] well.... one thing that is VERY cool with that technology [20:26] is being able to move 2 or 3 points at once [20:26] yeah [20:26] so u can rotate a 3d object in space very easily [20:26] zoom in, zoom out [20:26] I can see how this stuff could be cool [20:27] I just know that it would be a real struggle to get it going and to get people to use it [20:27] well, using it, I dont see so hard, making it work flawlessly, harder [20:27] I think most of the teachers would just turn it off and write on a whiteboard [20:28] we'd have to do quite a bit of training, which is something we're not very good at [20:29] trying to take a chemist and turn them into a teacher is hard enough, getting thing proficient with a computer is going to be tough :-) [20:30] yeah, guess so [20:31] it's getting the teachers who teach the teachers on board that's the trick :-) [20:32] right... thats what I'm doing now too [20:32] but maybe I can work on some demo's [20:32] I think this spring we'll have our linux lab maybe working [20:32] we need to upgrade ~15 machines to Intrepid first though :( [20:33] computers are such a pain ;-) [20:33] try clonezilla [20:33] it will upgrade all 15 at once in about an hour [20:34] I'm not sure if they're fresh installs or dist-upgrades [20:34] logging in to 15 computers and running update manager shouldn't take too long, it's just that it's gotta get done [20:35] then we fix AD authentication [20:35] then maybe we figure out printing [20:35] yeah but they need to download packages for each one [20:35] heh, printing should be plug and play [20:35] we have lots of bandwidth [20:35] "should" [20:36] we have huge amounts of printing problems with the windows machines [20:36] yeah.... I had one of these big massive industrial photocopiers that is also a printer [20:36] I'm hoping it just works in Xubuntu and it'll be a "hmm, the Windows machines never can print but the Linux ones work all the time" [20:36] think it was canon... [20:37] had to manually install the postscript drivers.. [20:37] man was that a pain [20:37] right now in Windows you have to re-setup the printer every time the machine is rebooted [20:37] gosh [20:37] and it's not a trivial setup [20:38] if I could just find an LTSP server I could try that [20:38] but honestly I'm not sure if it's that great of an idea for us [20:38] as my feeling is that LTSP takes some work to setup and keep maintained [20:39] and I know when I leave there really isn't going to be much of anybody to maintain it [20:41] Its improved a lot... intrepid is pretty maintenance free [22:19] If I want to install Edubuntu stand-alone, without ltsp, can I use the ordinary Xubuntu install CD instead of the alternate? [22:20] well, kinda [22:20] the Edubuntu CD is an addon to Ubuntu so it assumes ubuntu-desktop is installed [22:21] so you might have to pull dependencies off the net to install some stuff [22:21] also edubuntu-desktop depends on ubuntu-desktop so you probably don't want to install that [22:22] but say if you wanted Edubuntu without ltsp you could use the Ubuntu Desktop CD just fine [22:22] Hmm... perhaps I should install (Gnome) Ubuntu then instead of Xubuntu [22:22] kind of depends on what you're trying to do [22:22] Is that what you suggest? [22:23] LaserJock: I'm preparing a laptop that's going to Haiti [22:23] ball: not a very big hard drive? [22:23] LaserJock: I don't know yet, I haven't booted it. [22:23] Probably not tiny though, it comes with a FireWire port [22:23] because if you have plenty of diskspace you can install both [22:24] and then the user can log into either Gnome or Xfce depending how well it performs [22:24] or you could install Kubuntu and just install selected educational apps [22:26] brb, I have to switch seats. [22:38] Does the Edubuntu CD differ much from edubuntu-desktop? [22:44] well, the CD has all the stuff that's in edubuntu-desktop and a little bit more [22:44] but the CD itself lets you also pick individual apps in the GUI that pops up [22:45] so either way (CD or apt-get) will get you stuff [22:49] It's a shame I have to install Ubuntu: that means two user interfaces to support instead of one. [22:51] well, you can do xubuntu [22:52] and then apt-get the apps you want [22:52] What do the Edubuntu CD and edubuntu-desktop offer over and above the applications? [22:53] we'll they're meant to pull things together [22:53] make it easier to install on an Ubuntu desktop [22:54] the CD lets people in low-bandwith countries share the educational apps [22:56] That's a good idea, I should send install CDs with the machine. [23:00] but we sort of have to make some assumption on what's already installed on the user's machine [23:00] otherwise we'd have to include *everything* [23:02] * ball nods [23:14] I'll try Ubuntu on the laptop, though I know it's more heavyweight than Xubuntu [23:17] it is, but it if it runs ok it's more featureful, IMO [23:21] I'll try to convince myself that's a good thing ;-)\ [23:24] well, I think for kidos it's maybe easier to use [23:27] "more featureful" usually means less easy to use in my experience. [23:29] perhaps [23:33] sandbox did it!!!! [23:33] top 100 at moddb for mod/game of the year!! [23:33] out of 9k!!! [23:36] I'll give it a try anyway. [23:36] Thanks a lot for your help LaserJock [23:37] and oh yeah LaserJock cool article [23:50] calimer: thanks [23:51] calimer: and congrats! [23:51] thanks!! [23:51] now we just need votes for top 10 :D