[00:00] <seb128> hum, I'm wondering why it's working before your change and not after though
[00:00] <seb128> does it fallback to something else when it doesn't find gnome-wm to use?
[00:01] <chrisccoulson> it probably started because it because it was in the autostart folder before
[00:02] <chrisccoulson> this change moves it away from the autostart folder, as gnome-session doesn't look there for the required services
[00:02] <seb128> ah right
[00:02] <chrisccoulson> the launchers for the panel and nautilus, which are required, are all in /usr/share/applications
[00:02] <seb128> right
[00:03] <seb128> what is weird is that setting this key to compiz doesn't work
[00:03] <seb128> but that's probably a compiz bug
[00:03] <chrisccoulson> compiz needs to ship a launcher with X-GNOME-Provides=windowmanager for it to work
[00:03] <seb128> it does
[00:03] <seb128> there is a /usr/share/applications/compiz.desktop
[00:04] <seb128> and it was working when I switched my config to use compiz
[00:04] <chrisccoulson> hmmm, not sure why that doesn't work
[00:04] <seb128> which was before gnome-wm.desktop in the intrepid cycle
[00:04] <seb128> there might be something in the .desktop that confuses gnome-session
[00:05] <chrisccoulson> possibly. setting that key to compiz on my intrepid machine seems to work ok
[00:05] <chrisccoulson> the problem is with that configuration is that both gnome-wm and compiz will be executed at some point
[00:05] <seb128> why?
[00:06] <seb128> it should run only what is in the required_component key no?
[00:06] <chrisccoulson> with the current setup, gnome-wm will always run as it ships in the autostart folder
[00:06] <seb128> ie, gnome-wm on a default install
[00:06] <seb128> but compiz if you change the key
[00:06] <seb128> right, I was speaking about your version
[00:06] <chrisccoulson> it runs regardless of the gconf key at the moment. or at least it should do i think
[00:06] <chrisccoulson> ah yeah, it shouldn't do that in the new version
[00:07] <seb128> I guess I'm one of the only one who changed that key
[00:07] <seb128> anyway it's getting late
[00:07] <seb128> I'll reset the key, restart my session and upload your revision if that works correctly
[00:07] <seb128> we can sort the buggy compiz case later
[00:07] <seb128> thanks for the work on that!
[00:07] <chrisccoulson> thanks. i'll try it again here as well just for sanity
[00:14] <seb128> chrisccoulson: ok, the desktop entries lacks a type= line
[00:14] <seb128> which breaks the compiz start
[00:15] <chrisccoulson> ah, that makes sense
[00:15] <seb128> that's a compiz bug, not a gnome-session one, I'll upload your change and enough work for today ;-)
[00:15] <seb128> and I'll get mvo to fix the compiz issue tomorrow
[00:15] <chrisccoulson> thanks for that:)
[00:15] <chrisccoulson> i've got something i need mvo to do tomorrow too
[00:19] <seb128> ok, uploaded and enough work for today, bye
[05:40] <cearle> After completing an upgrade from hardy to intrepid, the gnome Applications main menu is empty.  Suggestions welcome.
[05:56] <bluesmoke> cearle: rm ~/.config/menus/applications.menu
[06:08] <cearle> thx bluesmoke. will a restart of gnome recreate the file?
[06:09] <bluesmoke> no, running alacarte again will
[06:13] <cearle> aha, alacarte had errors, because there were two "</Menu> <!-- End Applications -->" tags.  Fixed. thx again bluesmoke
[06:14] <cearle> sorry, more specifically, in /etc/xdg/menues/applications.menu
[08:25] <slomo> seb128: please sync gstreamer0.10, gst-plugins-base0.10, gst0.10-python and gst-plugins-bad0.10 from debian/experimental later :)
[08:26] <seb128> slomo: ok
[08:40] <slomo> seb128: thanks for syncing vala :)
[08:40] <seb128> thank you for doing the update ;-)
[09:03] <huats> morning everyone
[09:03] <didrocks> monring huats, seb128 & slomo :)
[09:03] <seb128> lut huats didrocks
[09:03] <huats> morning seb128 and didrocks
[09:03] <didrocks> seb128: ok, will do the "new new" update tomorrow :)
[09:03] <seb128> huats: sorry about yesterday evening but my box crashed on vt switch
[09:04] <seb128> didrocks: you seem to be busy, you still want to do it or should I try to find something easier for you and give that one to somebody else?
[09:04] <huats> seb128: sorry for what ?
[09:05] <seb128> huats: dunno if you talked to me on IRC, we were speaking about updates and my box crashed and when I came back you had left, so in case you asked something and I didn't reply
[09:05] <huats> oh
[09:05] <huats> not a pb
[09:05] <huats> I think I just told you that I will do the gnome-system-monitor + deskbar-applet today
[09:06] <huats> (and I'll add the gnome-keyring too since there is a new available...)
[09:06] <seb128> ok
[09:06] <seb128> yes you can
[09:06] <huats> and that's all :)
[09:06] <huats> ;)
[09:07] <huats> seb128: may be I have added something like : and later on I'll tackle the anjuta update (but first the main things)
[09:08] <huats> and then I think I said good night :)
[09:08] <huats> so you haven't missed anything important :)
[09:08] <seb128> ok
[09:08] <didrocks> seb128: no no. I can handle it now that we discussed yesterday :)
[09:08] <seb128> I knew there was nothing important, I just didn't want to be rude ;-)
[09:08] <didrocks> seb128: that's just I have another dinner with framasoft tonight :)
[09:08] <seb128> didrocks: ok, just ask if you need help updating the lpi change, I'm not sure what I said yesterday was clear
[09:09] <didrocks> seb128: sorry for the delay :)
[09:09] <huats> seb128: don't start to be like didrocks please... One to stand if more than enough :)
[09:09] <seb128> didrocks: that's alright
[09:09] <didrocks> seb128: it was clear :)
[09:09] <seb128> huats: being what? slacking?
[09:09] <seb128> ;-)
[09:09]  * seb128 runs
[09:09] <didrocks> :p
[09:09] <huats> sarcastic :)
[09:15] <seb128> mvo: hey, your compiz.desktop is not correct, gnome-session refuses to use it because it has no type= key
[09:16] <mvo> seb128: oh? is that a regression in the jaunty version? or is gnome-session stricter about it now?
[09:17] <seb128> mvo: not sure, in intrepid gnome-wm.desktop was installed in the autostart directory and always used in fact and I doubt many users change their gconf key to use compiz rather than gnome-wm by default
[09:18] <seb128> mvo: we did fix this bug yesterday and now the gconf key is respect, and I had compiz set there for some reason (I think I changed it early in intrepid when we didn't have gnome-wm.desktop yet)
[09:18] <seb128> mvo: anyway setting compiz doesn't work, it complains about the desktop files not being correct due to the lack of type key
[09:19] <seb128> mvo: I'm too lazy to boot an intrepid box to check if that's gnome-session stricter or if we just didn't notice the bug before ;-)
[09:19] <vuntz> desktop-file-validate!
[09:19] <vuntz> (sorry for the interruption :-))
[09:20] <seb128> vuntz: indeed ;-)
[09:20] <crevette> hey vuntz
[09:20] <crevette> hello seb128  didrocks huats  pitti and slomo
[09:21] <pitti> hey crevette
[09:21] <huats> hey crevette and vuntz
[09:21] <seb128> lut crevette
[09:29]  * seb128 kicks xorg
[09:29] <seb128> jaunty crashes on user switching, really annoying
[09:33] <seb128> crevette: btw do you plan to update your nautilus-sendto upgrade to not use universe?
[09:43] <crevette> seb128, oh yeah I will, sorry, I totally forgot
[09:44] <seb128> hate hate hate
[09:44] <seb128> mvo: there? I need your bzr clues ;-)
[09:45] <mvo> seb128: yes
[09:46] <mvo> seb128: sorry, I was distracted a bit
[09:46] <seb128> mvo: $ bzr push
[09:46] <seb128> bzr: ERROR: No push location known or specified.
[09:46] <seb128> I did bzr get using the command apt-get source suggested
[09:46] <seb128> did bzr commit
[09:46] <seb128> and now try to push the change
[09:46] <seb128> what is the magic url to get that working again? ;-)
[09:47] <seb128> couldn't we try to get that working out of the box? ;-)
[09:47] <crevette> lp:~seb128/yourpackage/ubuntu ?
[09:47]  * crevette does fumb guess
[09:47] <mvo> seb128: best is "bzr bind lp:~seb127/../.."
[09:47] <crevette> dumb
[09:47] <seb128> crevette: no, I don't own this packaging so it's not on my username space
[09:47] <seb128> hum
[09:47] <mvo> (or put it under any ~ you like
[09:48] <seb128> mvo: that's gnome-desktop that you put under bzr
[09:48] <mvo> the bzr bind will make it behave like a checkout
[09:48] <seb128> $ bzr push lp:~ubuntu-core-dev/gnome-desktop/ubuntu
[09:48] <seb128> Pushed up to revision 7.
[09:49] <seb128> ok, that apparently worked
[09:49] <seb128> mvo: can you verify you get that commit on your side?
[09:50] <mvo> seb128: sure, give me sec
[09:50] <mvo> $ bzr log|head
[09:50] <mvo> ------------------------------------------------------------
[09:50] <mvo> revno: 7
[09:50] <mvo> committer: seb128 <seb128@seb128-laptop>
[09:50] <mvo> yeah!
[09:50] <seb128> mvo: ok thanks
[09:50]  * mvo hugs seb128
[09:51] <seb128> would be nice to be able to bzr get and bzr commit and bzr push without having to figure what url to use though
[09:51]  * seb128 hugs mvo
[09:51] <seb128> any idea how we could fix that?
[09:52] <seb128> mvo: ok, next I need to cdbs-edit-patch a patch in this directory, any magic command to do that?
[09:52] <seb128> or do I need to unpack the source somewhere, work there and copy the patch back?
[09:54] <mvo> there is now "bzr bd-do"
[09:54] <mvo> so you run "bzr bd-do 'cdbs-edit-patch patchname'"
[09:54] <mvo> and it will do all the magic for you
[09:54] <mvo> you just need to remember when it created a new patch to bzr add it when you are finished
[09:55] <mvo> seb128: about the url figuring etc> yeah - if we have a standard for this (we are close I think) we can make use of it
[09:55] <huats> pitti: hello
[09:55] <huats> thanks for your comment on the gcalctool SRU I asked
[09:56] <seb128> mvo: ok
[09:56] <huats> but your last comment isn't very clear to me :( can you explain it to me ?
[10:16] <pitti> huats: are any/all of the fixed bugs regressions in intrepid, compared to hardy?
[10:18] <huats> oh, you mean if the bug fixed there were regression from hardy.
[10:18] <huats> honneslty I don't know now... I can try to investigate...
[10:20] <huats> pitti: I'll let you know...
[10:27] <mvo> seb128: compiz fixed
[10:27] <seb128> mvo: danke
[10:28] <seb128> mvo: ok, I updated gnome-desktop using bzr, that works but disturbe my workflow a lot, it cleans the build directory which breaks my check abi change thing, I've to untar the source somewhere to read the NEWS and diff the configure to see depends change before starting, etc
[10:29] <seb128> I'll try to think about how make those tasks easier
[10:30] <mvo> bzr bd-do (without further arguments) give you a shell
[10:30] <seb128> lool: is there several xorg locations in debian? wouldn't it be easier to just patch to use the xorg server location in debian rather than build-depending on xorg only for that?
[10:30] <mvo> in the unpacked tree
[10:30] <seb128> oh!
[10:30] <lool> seb128: This is what I noted in the changelog
[10:30] <lool> seb128: We should patch it to take an AC_ARG_WITH
[10:30] <mvo> you don't even need to download the tarfile manually, it gets it from the watch file (I love this feature :)
[10:30] <lool> But I'd rather do this after the move to newer gdm
[10:31] <seb128> lool: ah, ok, right
[10:31] <seb128> lool: for ubuntu I just tweaked the configure
[10:32] <mvo> seb128: it does support hooks too, so you could make the abi checker part of the regular build
[10:32] <seb128> mvo: right, I noticed, the bd-do trick is a good one ;-)
[10:32] <mvo> seb128: i.e. you run bzr-builddeb and it does the check automatically
[10:33] <lool> mvo: What about git?
[10:33] <mvo> *cough*
[10:33] <lool> Sorry just kidding
[10:33] <mvo> g-what?
[10:34] <mvo> seb128: [HOOKS]
[10:34] <mvo> pre-build = ./pre-build.sh
[10:34] <seb128> btw if some people want to give an hand on desktop sponsoring today feel free to grab items on the sponsoring page, I did a bunch but there is still some there
[10:34] <seb128> mvo: ok, thanks
[10:34] <seb128> mvo: I'll try to come with an optimized workflow for desktop packages so it's easier to work on those
[10:35] <mvo> (that can be any command, it supports pre-build, post-build and pre-export hooks
[10:35] <seb128> mvo: it's not too difficult right now but having to figure what url to use to push changes, how to edit patches, etc is a bit annoying, we should have a clear wiki page about that
[10:35] <mvo> agreed
[10:36] <mvo> the nice thing about the hook and integrating stuff like the abi checker into them is that this way they would be run by anyone messing around^W^Wupdating the package
[10:37] <mvo> but its true, its another tool on top of "debhelper, cdbs, quilt, dpatch" that makes packaging more complex :/
[10:38] <seb128> having bd-do is a good thing
[10:38] <seb128> I was copying directories around before
[10:41] <mvo> seb128: yep, give jame_w a hug if you see him, I love it too
[10:41] <Tm_T> I think James_w is still sleeping after yesterday
[10:42] <seb128> what happened yesterday?
[10:43] <Tm_T> developerweek opening day
[11:47] <ember> hey
[11:53] <pochu> hi ember
[11:53] <pochu> ember: did you read my review?
[11:54] <ember> yes i did, thanks
[12:01] <huats> pochu: so that you know, I'll take care of the anjuta update
[12:01] <huats> I am just doing before some main stuffs (as recommended by seb)
[12:01] <pochu> huats: alright, let me know if you need anything
[12:01] <huats> pochu: sure :)
[12:01] <pochu> (including sponsorship) ;)
[12:01] <huats> thanks
[12:02] <huats> ;)
[12:02] <pochu> yw :)
[13:11] <huats> seb128: I just gave a look at the libgda update (needed for the anjuta one...), and it requires sqlite >= 3.6.0 (the last stable availble upstream is 3.6.10), while on ubuntu/debian we are stuck no 3.5.9... do you know if it will be updated ?
[13:12] <seb128> no idea about that one
[13:12] <seb128> I think fta was looking at that too some time ago maybe try asking him about the update
[13:12] <huats> because I fear that it is blocking...
[13:12] <huats> fta: hey :)
[13:13] <huats> fta: any idea of the status of the sqlite3 toward the 3.6 branch ?
[13:50] <kagou> Hi, I'm testing beta of bibble5. Bibble5 is not compiled for 64bits, so I'v installed ia32 and bibble5 is ok. In the last beta libuuid1 is needed, but libuuid1 installed is for x86-64 architecture.
[13:51] <kagou> I can not find an elegant way to install the 32bit version of this lib
[13:51] <kagou> I'v manually downloaded and manually extracted lib in /lib32 but it's dirty
[13:51] <kagou> is there a way to simplify this ?
[13:52] <seb128> kagou: hi, wrong channel, you want #ubuntu-devel
[13:52] <kagou> seb128, oh
[13:52] <seb128> kagou: the desktop team doesn't work on this package and ia32 and libuuid1 are not desktop things either
[13:52] <kagou> ok
[13:52] <seb128> ie, I've no clue about all that and you will probably get better reply on #ubuntu-devel
[15:17] <didrocks> seb128: I set up a pbuilder and devtools on my server and worked on gnome-games. It builds successfully now :)
[15:18] <seb128> didrocks: excellent ;-)
[15:18] <didrocks> (what a mess to update a configure script in a pbuilder chroot using quilt)
[15:18] <didrocks> I think I will wrote a little thing about it
[15:18] <didrocks> seb128: I will report the changes on my bzr branches, look for correct bugs and then test it on my vm
[15:18] <seb128> ok
[15:19] <didrocks> (but not sure to have the time tonight)
[15:19] <didrocks> and also, I will update the desktop team wiki for using bzr (when working on this packaging, I wrote a step by step how-to)
[15:19] <didrocks> package*
[15:20] <didrocks> have a good evening, I have to go to work for... ubuntu-fr now :p
[15:22] <seb128> didrocks: you too, thanks!
[15:23] <didrocks> lastlog gtk
[15:23] <didrocks> oupss :)
[15:32] <tedg> Has anyone packaged up parasite for Ubuntu?  The screencast looks pretty sweet.
[15:36] <ember> parasite looks cool, but they still haven't release a tarball
[15:39] <tedg> ember: tarballs are for wimps ;)  Hopefully shortly then.
[16:15] <fta> huats, no progress i'm afraid. didn't have time to track all the rdeps so i'm using in-source sqlite in all mozilla products, which happens to be what upstream recommends.
[16:15] <huats> fta: ok
[16:16] <huats> fta: if you want we can work together on the rdeps...
[16:16] <huats> it might be a great thing...
[16:16] <huats> and I am sure we can find some people to help out...
[16:20] <rickspencer3> Desktop team meeting in 10 minutes
[16:21] <rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-01-20
[16:25] <fta> huats, i was secretly expecting debian to work on this, as we alway get the package from them
[16:25] <fta> +s
[16:26] <huats> fta: I see your point :)
[16:26] <huats> but I think we can wait long for that...
[16:27] <huats> may be we can work with them together... to fasten a bit the process
[16:28] <Ng> tedg: thanks for the pointers yesterday, turned out to be less than three dozen lines of python to listen to NM state changes :)
[16:28] <Ng> tedg: now I just need to tackle python threading horror to make it do something useful ;)
[16:28] <tedg> Ng, heh cool.  I wouldn't use python threading though.  Just use async stuff in Glib.  It'll make your life easier and most users won't notice.
[16:29] <Ng> tedg: the idea is that you run this in a terminal and when NM is connected, it runs ssh for you, so I kinda need to spawn stuff and keep track of NM state. I wouldn't have thought I could do that with glib async stuff
[16:30] <asac> hi
[16:30] <ArneGoetje> hi
[16:30] <rickspencer3> hi all
[16:30] <rickspencer3> ready to meet?
[16:31] <tkamppeter> hi
[16:31] <pitti> hi all
[16:31] <rickspencer3> here's the link again
[16:31] <rickspencer3> bryce sends apologies
[16:31] <seb128> hey rickspencer3
[16:32] <calc> hi
[16:32] <tedg> Ng: You can :)  The GIO async stuff is magic :)
[16:32] <rickspencer3> I guess we're all accounted for
[16:32] <Ng> orly
[16:33] <rickspencer3> first up is outstanding actions from last meeting
[16:33] <rickspencer3> asac to clean up jaunty-desktop-network-changing wiki; draft expected behavior and test cases
[16:33] <tedg> Ng: We actualy use the GIO async stuff for spawning external processes in Inkscape. :)
[16:33] <asac> i did most parts. left out KDE and waiting for more details from mvo on the update- manager things
[16:33]  * tedg 'll be quiet for the meeting, sorry.
[16:33] <asac> now i am going through the apps and file bugs for those that misbehave
[16:33] <mvo> asac: uh, sorry. I was not aware that the deadline for this was today
[16:34] <rickspencer3> asac: great
[16:34] <asac> mvo: no problem ;)
[16:34] <rickspencer3> we might want to discuss more when we get to the sprint topic
[16:34] <Ng> tedg: thanks for the hint, I'll check it out :)
[16:34] <rickspencer3> next item: everyone tag 10 pet bugs by Friday
[16:34] <pitti> I checked specs this morning, and there were no "pending approval" or "review" ones, just lots of "drafting"; this becomes a bit urgent no
[16:34] <rickspencer3> pitti: yes
[16:34] <rickspencer3> I understood that everyone was ready to get them approved now
[16:35] <rickspencer3> ArneGoetje: are you still blocking on anything?
[16:35] <rickspencer3> in terms of spec approval?
[16:35] <ArneGoetje> just had some last minute discussion with mvo about the implementation of language selector improvements
[16:36] <pitti> @all: if you have your spec ready, please set it to "pending approval"
[16:36] <pitti> (sorry, got disconnected
[16:36] <pitti> I WON'T look at specs which are "drafting"
[16:36] <rickspencer3> in a similar vein, has everyone tagged 10 pet bugs?
[16:37] <pitti> http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/ogasawara/pet-buglist.html
[16:37] <ArneGoetje> rickspencer3: will need to make some small changes to the spec. BUt then it's ready.
[16:38] <rickspencer3> ArneGoetje: okay, please set to pending approval asap
[16:38] <calc> looks like bryce needs to mark his still but the rest are done?
[16:38] <ArneGoetje> rickspencer3: will do
[16:38] <rickspencer3> bryce is out for a few days
[16:38] <pitti> now let the games begin :)
[16:38] <rickspencer3> heh
[16:38] <calc> rickspencer3: ok
[16:38] <rickspencer3> next topic
[16:39] <seb128> I think I'm still one or two bug short, there is some thousand desktop bugs and I still have to pick some in the list ;-)
[16:39] <pitti> as said, those should be the ones which would be intersting for you to work on
[16:39] <pitti> which aren't urgent, require some work, but will do lots of good
[16:39] <rickspencer3> rickspencer3 to follow up with Maria regarding info for presenters
[16:40] <rickspencer3> Mark would like to encourage us to speak and contribute at conferences and such
[16:40] <rickspencer3> so please be thinking if there is something like this that you want to do
[16:40] <rickspencer3> we can discuss 1-1 in our phone calls
[16:40] <rickspencer3> ready to move on to the agenda?
[16:41] <pitti> wrt conferences
[16:41] <pitti> I think we collected the "want to go to" list a while ago
[16:41] <rickspencer3> pitti: understood
[16:41] <pitti> I'm not sure whether we need ack from Matt or anyone else for this
[16:41] <rickspencer3> hmmm
[16:41] <rickspencer3> good point
[16:41] <rickspencer3> I'll follow up on that
[16:42] <Riddell> we should get acks on gran canaria summit soon, air fairs will go up in peak tourist season
[16:42] <pitti> the ConferenceAttendance wiki page looks fairly filled
[16:42] <pitti> Riddell: :-)
[16:43] <pitti> I'll give a speech at the beach cocktail bar
[16:43] <rickspencer3> pitti: could you please paste link
[16:43] <pitti> rickspencer3: /msged
[16:43] <rickspencer3> tx
[16:43] <rickspencer3> moving on ...
[16:43] <rickspencer3> Changing the Add/Remove ...
[16:44] <rickspencer3> this was brought up by Jane and Chris originally, then discussed on the desktop list
[16:44] <rickspencer3> any other thoughts?
[16:44] <pitti> interestingly, the tooltip says "install or remove applications"
[16:44] <seele> was there a conclusion?
[16:45] <pitti> which explains it pretty well IMHO
[16:45] <rickspencer3> seele: no conclusion, this is still in discussion phase
[16:45] <rickspencer3> pitti: yeah, there is a "sizzle" and "steak" question ehre
[16:45] <pitti> maybe it should just say "Install/Remove", to unconfuse it with a menu editor?
[16:45] <seb128> I've no real opinion about that, let the design team decide?
[16:45] <rickspencer3> I think the feeling is that the usable labels aren't very buzz worthy, and we are not getting credit for a great function because of hte naming
[16:46] <pitti> personally I like the location of the menu item, it's exactly where it should be
[16:46] <pitti> it just has always looked a bit like menu editor to me
[16:46] <rickspencer3> I'm neutral to the whole question, if the design/marketing team comes up with something with some sizzle that makes sense to users, I would support it
[16:46]  * seele mumbles something about a lot of people don't realise how important labels are and think they are "preference"...
[16:46] <rickspencer3> I think we need some usability data, we should watch some actual users
[16:47] <asac> buzz worthy? so they dont want a functional name, but something like "software center"?
[16:47] <seb128> seele: do you think add,remove is a good label? and softwares library? and why? ;-)
[16:47] <rickspencer3> asac: that's one of the better suggestions I've heard so far ;)
[16:47] <seb128> asac: "Software Library" what the one suggest on the list which is similar to yours
[16:48] <seele> seb128: rickspencer3 had a point that it didnt follow with the other types of "places" available in that menu
[16:48] <asac> yeah. but Center sounds more complete ;)
[16:48] <seele> how well does something like "Center" translate?
[16:49]  * pitti would favor "Add remove software" or "Install/remove"
[16:49] <asac> seele: in german it would be "Software Center" ;)
[16:49] <||sico||> no problem for spanish...
[16:49] <davidbarth> according to google (if that's an indicator of how people could name such a thing), "software catalog" gets the highest number of results
[16:49] <rickspencer3> pitti: I think they want something that says: there is a world of cool apps here
[16:49] <seb128> pitti: "add remove software" is a no go, too long in some locale (german probably being one of those), the menu becomes quickly ugly because it scales to the label
[16:50] <rickspencer3> so it seems to me that we are generally supportive of the change *if* they can come up with a name that is:
[16:50] <rickspencer3> 1. understandible
[16:50] <rickspencer3> 2. translatable
[16:50] <rickspencer3> 3. cooler than what we already have
[16:50] <rickspencer3> sound about right?
[16:50] <rickspencer3> "they" being design and or marketing
[16:50] <asac> davidbarth: software catalog doesnt really imply that you go there to get something :) ... only that you go there to look stuff up.
[16:50] <seb128> and short enough to not make the menu look ugly because it will scale to the label
[16:51] <asac> rickspencer3: ack
[16:51] <rickspencer3> 4. doesn't make the label look ugly due to length or other issues
[16:51] <pitti> rickspencer3: I wouldn't exactly measure "coolness", but the percentage of users who understand what this menu item means
[16:51] <davidbarth> davidbarth: sorry, that's software *library*, then *catalog* then software center (using double quotes in the queries)
[16:51] <rickspencer3> pitti: yeah, that's the "steak" part of the equation, it has to be usable
[16:51] <seb128> "you should try that, really"
[16:52] <seb128> what about that? ;-)
[16:52] <rickspencer3> so we don't want to sacrifice the steak for the sizzle
[16:52] <rickspencer3> seb128: perfect
[16:52] <pitti> "Get more stuff"
[16:52] <davidbarth> asac: i'm providing some cheap to collect user data
[16:52] <rickspencer3> I still think we should test any changes empirically, and Berlin may be a good opportunity for that
[16:52] <rickspencer3> move on?
[16:52] <asac> "Extend Ubuntu ..." ;)
[16:52] <asac> yes lets move on
[16:53] <seb128> rickspencer3: no need to wait the sprint, if you want to try a change let me know and I'll do the upload
[16:53] <rickspencer3> seb128: will do
[16:53] <rickspencer3> thanks
[16:53] <rickspencer3> there is a section for sponsoring on the agenda template
[16:53] <pitti> so on whose plate is that now?
[16:53] <seb128> it'll take time before we get translations back though since it'll require translator work and language pack updates
[16:54] <rickspencer3> pitti: I'll feedback to Jane and Chris this discussion, and then work with Julian to see if we want to move any ideas forward
[16:54] <asac> seb128: maybe inject all suggestions to some po template so we get all translations and can more easily switch to what we want
[16:54] <rickspencer3> so, sponsoring?
[16:55] <asac> i did a bunch this week
[16:55] <asac> more to come ;)
[16:55] <seb128> I did a bunch too ;-)
[16:55] <pitti> still have to do some, was on vac; on this week's TODO, though
[16:55] <seb128> rickspencer3: anything specific to discuss about sponsoring?
[16:56] <rickspencer3> seb128: no, it looks like it's part of the template for the meeting, and I didn't know what it was for
[16:56] <seb128> or that's just a reminder that everybody should be doing some?
[16:56] <asac> lets whip those that didnt include any in their activity ;)
[16:57] <rickspencer3> I'll follow up with someone after the meeting about the agenda item in general
[16:57] <seb128> rickspencer3: scott used to review during the meeting desktop sponsor request which were waiting for a while
[16:57] <rickspencer3> seb128: thanks, I'll do that next time
[16:58] <rickspencer3> let's move on to release status ... I'd like to briefly discuss status on a few items
[16:58] <rickspencer3> first, Dx Support
[16:58] <rickspencer3> davidbarth: anything to add here?
[16:58] <davidbarth> rickspencer3: sure
[16:59] <davidbarth> so first we're getting great support from mozilla, thanks to asac
[16:59] <rickspencer3> yeah
[16:59] <davidbarth> then, we're reviewing all apps from main *and* universe
[16:59] <davidbarth> i've made a big list with mpt for patches we need to provide
[17:00] <pitti> do we have some public packages for testing in a PPA?
[17:00] <davidbarth> including an initial recommendations for the infamous actions
[17:00] <davidbarth> pitti: not yet, that will be for our code drop
[17:00] <davidbarth> we're progressing with the implementation
[17:01] <davidbarth> we should have something nice by the time of the sprint when entering the beta cycle
[17:01] <asac> davidbarth: maybe you can drop the apps one by one (when done) instead of one huge code drop?
[17:01] <asac> or is that the plan?
[17:01] <davidbarth> asac: yes, that's the plan
[17:02] <davidbarth> asac: the patches may land even before the daemon is there, but that should not be a problem
[17:03] <rickspencer3> thanks davidbarth
[17:03] <davidbarth> i hope to provide more on the message indicator next week btw, ted has made great progresses
[17:04] <davidbarth> he should blog to present his thoughts about the API sometime this week
[17:04] <davidbarth> and i think that's it
[17:04] <rickspencer3> thanks
[17:04] <rickspencer3> next item, which is related ..
[17:04] <rickspencer3> New GDM (PPA and Migration)
[17:04] <pitti> thanks for the update
[17:04] <rickspencer3> seb128: is the PPA ready?
[17:05] <seb128> rickspencer3: ppa? I've started looking at the update again, I plan to get it uploaded to universe this week rather than using a ppa though
[17:05] <rickspencer3> seb128: right
[17:05] <seb128> not yet but will be uploaded during the week
[17:06] <rickspencer3> thanks
[17:06] <rickspencer3> next, Device kit?
[17:07] <pitti> so first packaging it, and then work on the migration code?
[17:07] <asac> migration code?
[17:07]  * asac scared that NM breaks
[17:07] <rickspencer3> pitti: yes
[17:07] <pitti> asac: to carry over old gdm's autologin settings into new gdm's gconf
[17:07] <asac> pitti: oh. thought that was on devicekit ;)
[17:07] <pitti> rickspencer3: latest DK and DK-power are in universe
[17:07] <asac> nevermind then
[17:07] <rickspencer3> pitti: so done?
[17:07] <rickspencer3> sweet
[17:07] <pitti> rickspencer3: well, the spec is about that plus packaging the new gpm in a PPA
[17:08] <pitti> but AFAIK tedg wanted to do that?
[17:08] <pitti> tedg: if not, shall one of us do it?
[17:08] <davidbarth> rickspencer3: is device kit in the scope of 9.04?
[17:08] <rickspencer3> davidbarth: no
[17:08] <davidbarth> ok
[17:08] <pitti> davidbarth: no, just for playing with it
[17:08] <pitti> 9.04 -> universe
[17:08] <pitti> and using current gpm
[17:08] <pitti> 9.10 -> probably switch to new gpm and DK
[17:08] <davidbarth> ok, same as gdm
[17:09] <tedg> pitti: I can do it, I just really messed up my GPM packaging branch :(  I just need to fix it.
[17:09] <pitti> tedg: ok, please let me know if you need help with it
[17:09] <pitti> I guess it depends on how many patches to old gpm we have to port to the new one
[17:09] <tedg> pitti: I just need to figure out what revisions to un-merge.  Not help, just a lot of stupid mistake work.
[17:09] <pitti> I wouldn't dare to touch fusa, but if gpm just has a couple which went upstream, I can probably do it as well
[17:10] <seb128> tedg: speaking about that, you are going to do the 2.25 update in jaunty?
[17:10] <tedg> Many of the GPM patches are for LTSP, which should be handled by DKp, so they shouldn't be GPM patches anymore.
[17:11] <tedg> seb128: No.  We're not going to do 25 in Jaunty as it requires DKp.
[17:11] <seb128> tedg: 2.24.3 then?
[17:11] <tedg> seb128: yes.
[17:11] <seb128> ok good
[17:11] <pitti> 2.25 was for a PPA, depending on dk-p?
[17:11] <seb128> are you sure that 2.25 requires that new thing?
[17:11] <tedg> pitti: ys.
[17:11] <tedg> yes.
[17:11] <seb128> vuntz: ^ do you know about that? is that a GNOME requirement now?
[17:12] <tedg> seb128: I'm pretty sure that's what hughsie's e-mail to GNOME-devel said.
[17:12] <pitti> seb128: AFAIK Richard explicitly sanctioned distros using 2.24 for the moment, for that very reason
[17:12] <seb128> tedg: that's weird that GNOME accepted a 2.26 requirement on that
[17:13] <rickspencer3> ready to move on?
[17:13] <seb128> yes
[17:13] <rickspencer3> we should discuss the Berlin sprint
[17:13] <rickspencer3> it starts in less than two weeks
[17:13] <pitti> my ideas which would greatly benefit from being together: fix (1) hotkey, (2) beamer, (3) suspend/resume for everyone's laptop
[17:13] <tkamppeter> Yes, I live in Berlin and it would be nice if the sprint really takes place there.
[17:14] <pitti> tkamppeter: that's settled already :)
[17:14] <tkamppeter> Is there any Wiki page about the Sprint?
[17:14] <asac> hehe
[17:14] <rickspencer3> tkamppeter: let's talk seperately, I'll bring you up to speed
[17:15] <rickspencer3> pitti: good ideas
[17:15] <rickspencer3> others?
[17:15] <ArneGoetje> pitti: fix the intel driver in xorg for i855, 915 and 945 first
[17:15] <vuntz> seb128: we're discussing the dk-p dep on the r-t mailing list right now, but it'll likely be accepted, yes
[17:15] <pitti> ArneGoetje: outside my competency, so I can't judge whether that's feasible :)
[17:15] <seb128> I should try to get somebody to fix my machine crashing on user switching ;-)
[17:15] <asac> pitti: those three sound more like foundation topics ;)
[17:15] <pitti> asac: true that, but that's quite inherent to hardware specific problems :)
[17:16] <seb128> vuntz: GNOME starts being disappointing on the crack level ;-)
[17:16] <pitti> well, it's not crack, it's just kind of a nuisance to have to support both hal and dk at the same time
[17:16] <rickspencer3> pitti: seb128: I'd like to propose a session on efficient bug management
[17:16] <seb128> pitti: they are hurrying too fast on rewrites recently and that leads to the recent issue we had for gdm, gnome-session, etc
[17:17] <seb128> rickspencer3: good idea yes
[17:17] <pitti> rickspencer3: sounds very similar to my UDS talk?
[17:17] <davidbarth> rickspencer3: +1
[17:17] <rickspencer3> pitti: yes, but more and hands on
[17:17] <pitti> or do you mean something else?
[17:17] <asac> maybe we should do a one day trip to hamburg and visit the pulseaudio lennart
[17:17] <asac> ;)
[17:17] <asac> just kiddin
[17:17] <rickspencer3> :)
[17:17] <pitti> asac: -ECITY, he lives in Boston now?
[17:17] <asac> pitti: shit ;)
[17:18] <rickspencer3> how about some time with the Dx team making sure their new stuff works on all of our laptops?
[17:18] <asac> rickspencer3: efficient bug management -> only thing that can help me is the launcpad plugin getting deployed in bugzillas.
[17:18] <pitti> I think at the sprint we should focus on squashing hardware related bugs and working with the Dx team
[17:18] <rickspencer3> asac: yes, not necessarily useful for everyone, but very useful for some
[17:18] <pitti> and otherwise just continue fixing bugs, picking the ones where we need to pick the brains from colleagues
[17:18] <rickspencer3> pitti: += design team
[17:18] <seb128> asac: what would that change? I'm not convinced about that
[17:18] <asac> rickspencer3: i think its useful for all software that has a bugzilla tracker
[17:19] <asac> seb128: it will resolve the "proxy" problem. e.g. at the moment you file bug upstreawm
[17:19] <asac> and from then on have to proxy discussion for launchpad reporter
[17:19]  * pitti never found that to be a major blocker
[17:19] <rickspencer3> ArneGoetje: what would you like to get out of the sprint?
[17:20] <asac> with plugin you just file upstream against proper component and then monitor and help out when necessary
[17:20] <davidbarth> rickspencer3: we've added that as part of our sprint, on Monday, Wednesday and Friday; the rest of the time is for coding
[17:20] <pitti> the time I need to create an fd.o bug is insignificant compared to the time it takes me to write an upstream-ish bug description
[17:20] <seb128> asac: the proxy thing is a feature, without that we would send crack bugs upstream and they would start ignoring those
[17:20] <asac> seb128: well. we do the initial forwarding. so we still filter
[17:20] <ArneGoetje> rickspencer3: finish a great deal of language selector
[17:20] <rickspencer3> ArneGoetje: is that something that will benefit from being together with everyone?
[17:20] <seb128> asac: well, what does that would change then? You need to clean the bug description before sending the bug anyway
[17:20] <seb128> not really a meeting topic though
[17:21] <seb128> let's discuss that later ;-)
[17:21] <ArneGoetje> rickspencer3: mostly with mvo
[17:21] <vuntz> seb128: well, you can stay with gpm 2.24
[17:21] <vuntz> seb128: that's hughsie's plan, and he's maintaining 2.24 for people who wants to stay with hal
[17:21] <pitti> vuntz: do you happen to know when GNOME will switch everything to DK away from hal?
[17:21] <vuntz> pitti: I asked a few weeks ago. It won't happen for 2.26
[17:22] <rickspencer3> ok, no other ideas regarding the sprint?
[17:22] <pitti> vuntz: no, didn't expect that :)
[17:22] <vuntz> pitti: maybe 2.28. I don't think we have that many things directly using hal, actually
[17:22] <asac> rickspencer3: fixing bugs in apps that dont behave properly on network changes
[17:22] <rickspencer3> Riddell: any thoughts regarding the sprint?
[17:22] <pitti> vuntz: primarily gvfs and nautilus, I guess
[17:22] <rickspencer3> asac: yes, good one
[17:22] <Riddell> rickspencer3: making sure our mysql changes get agreed and in
[17:22] <seb128> vuntz: right, we will do that
[17:23] <vuntz> pitti: nautilus doesn't depend on hal at all. It's pure gio love :-)
[17:23] <Riddell> need to talk to server team people for that
[17:23] <rickspencer3> Riddell: sounds good
[17:23] <rickspencer3> all: I'll put together a list of topics and send out for review
[17:24] <rickspencer3> I have some details from some other teams that I can include
[17:24] <pitti> vuntz: indeed :) so gpm (done), gvfs, network-manager, and system-config-printer primarily
[17:24] <asac> network-manager will go for devicekit for 0.8
[17:24] <asac> but that will take a bit
[17:24] <rickspencer3> moving on in the agenda
[17:24] <rickspencer3> Activity Reports: all done and on the wiki, so thanks for that
[17:25] <pitti> asac: (just would be nice to have the migration for next LTS)
[17:25] <rickspencer3> any other business?
[17:25] <asac> pitti: i hope we can get a quicker release cycle from now on
[17:25]  * rickspencer3 tries desperately to stick to agenda
[17:25]  * rickspencer3 but has already lost control
[17:25] <pitti> rickspencer3: well done
[17:25] <seb128> one thing
[17:25] <pitti> sorry for the side discussions
[17:25] <vuntz> pitti: system-config-printer doesn't depend on hal either, I think :-) But there's a hal backend for cups
[17:26] <seb128> slangasek was needing cd space for the alpha some days ago, I told him to move nautilus-cd-burner deskbar-applet tracker to supported
[17:26] <pitti> vuntz: yes, I mean that hal-cups-utils, it calls s-c-p for autoconfig love
[17:26] <seb128> just to let know everybody if somebody has comments on the change
[17:26] <rickspencer3> seb128: tracker makes sense, but CD burner?
[17:26] <pitti> brasero?
[17:26] <seb128> brasero implements the nautilus-cd-burner features now
[17:27] <seb128> ie, burn: location in nautilus, libraries to be used by rhythmbox, etc
[17:27] <rickspencer3> I guess it makes sense, I'll check it out
[17:27] <pitti> oh, it indeed looks quite nice
[17:27] <seb128> deskbar-applet and tracker where not used in the default configuration, they are not that useful and quite buggy
[17:28] <pitti> burnign an iso has a nice and small UI now, not the full brasero one
[17:28] <rickspencer3> seb128: thanks for the update
[17:28] <rickspencer3> any other business?
[17:28] <asac> i didnt find brasero in accessories ;) ... then found it in sound & video ... hmmm
[17:28] <seb128> one other small thing
[17:28] <pitti> rickspencer3: oh, sprint idea: measure everyone's desktop startup speed and work on making them faster
[17:28] <seb128> somebody raised a question about the dpi setting we use some time ago on the channel
[17:29] <seele> rickspencer3: unrelated but i am still waiting for MPT to get me the bib for Ubuntu's notification design
[17:29]  * calc notes jaunty a3 takes ~ 18s on his desktop
[17:29] <asac> seb128: font dpi?
[17:29] <seb128> gnome-settings-daemon still force the value to 96 dpi rather than using the xorg value
[17:29] <asac> yeah
[17:29] <seb128> we did that because we had too many buggy cases when we trying to not force the value in gutsy
[17:29] <asac> i think bryce has to comment on that .... afaik it was because of a X bug or something
[17:29] <pitti> calc: 62 seconds for me :(
[17:29] <seb128> this user was arguing that nowadays that break many setups though
[17:29] <seb128> and that we should drop the forced value
[17:29] <rickspencer3> seele: have you been in contact with MPT directly regarding this?
[17:29] <calc> pitti: on a fresh install? i didn't have anything else loaded on mine
[17:29] <pitti> seb128: another good sprint material, I think
[17:30] <seb128> does anybody has an opinion about that?
[17:30] <seele> rickspencer3: yep, no rely though
[17:30] <davidbarth> seele: i'm seeing him tomorrow, i'll pass on the message
[17:30] <calc> pitti: and that was from grub to gdm login prompt for me
[17:30] <seele> *reply
[17:30] <seele> davidbarth: ok thanks
[17:30] <asac> seb128: many setups?
[17:30] <seb128> should we try not forcing the value for a while and get user feedback during this cycle?
[17:30] <pitti> calc: ah, I mean gdm until the desktop is ready to use
[17:30] <calc> pitti: ah ok
[17:30] <pitti> seb128: *nod*
[17:30] <pitti> seb128: and on the sprint we have plenty of people and hardware to try it out on
[17:30] <asac> seb128: i think we should try
[17:31] <seb128> asac: lot of screen have higher dpi resolutions now and 96 makes those look really wrong where letting xorg get the value would work better
[17:31] <seb128> asac, pitti: ok
[17:31] <bluesmoke> mvo: Do you have any idea what http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~compiz/compiz/ubuntu/annotate/head%3A/debian/patches/010-disable-child-window-clipping.patch is even for?
[17:31] <rickspencer3> meeting adjourned?
[17:31] <mpt> rickspencer3, yes she has
[17:31] <seb128> thanks rickspencer3
[17:31] <asac> thanks
[17:31] <pitti> rickspencer3: I think we should start adding those to the sprint wiki page
[17:31] <ArneGoetje> thanks
[17:31] <bluesmoke> mvo: I think it's for that hack to enable XaaNoOffscreenPixmaps on the fly? Do we need that?
[17:31] <pitti> thanks everyone
[17:31] <rickspencer3> pitti: agreed
[17:32] <mpt> but I'm still ~1 month behind on non-urgent stuff
[17:32]  * calc wonders if displays should be a focus for 9.10 wrt dpi, working better on netbooks, etc
[17:32] <tkamppeter> I have something, WDYT about a foomatic-filters SRU: bug 318816, bug 318818, bug 299918, bug 303691
[17:32] <pitti> tkamppeter: we can discuss that in #u-devel IMHO
[17:32] <tkamppeter> pitti, OK
[17:33] <tkamppeter> Yes, this is the server side of the printing stack and not desktop.
[17:33] <seb128> is launchpad not working today?
[17:33] <calc> seb128: works for me
[17:33]  * seb128 got almost no bug mail this afternoon, that's weird
[17:33] <Amaranth> mvo: Other than that we have 4 patches that aren't for settings or from upstream and I think we should be able to get at least 2 of them upstream
[17:34] <seb128> pedro_: did you triage bug this afternoon? I don't get my usual bug mail flood today ;-)
[17:34] <pedro_> seb128: it's being slow here but it's working
[17:35] <pedro_> seb128: just returning from lunch :-P
[17:35] <calc> seb128: i'm getting email from LP
[17:35] <seb128> ok, must just be a calm day for desktop bugs
[17:35] <calc> seb128: i think it might be delayed a bit (< 1hr though)
[17:36] <calc> oh hmm i just an email for a change 7m ago so maybe not delayed so much
[17:38] <seele> rickspencer3: davidbarth: mpt: i'm going to write up my notes on notifications so we can begin discussing them in terms of KDE.
[17:38] <rickspencer3> seele: thank you
[17:40] <pedro_> is anybody having cracking sounds with pulseaudio?
[17:40] <davidbarth> seele: yes, thanks, you'd better start, i'm still paddling in gnome code, that will help me switch to kde
[17:40] <asac> pedro_: cracking?
[17:41] <calc> pedro_: i hear that on my laptop but no sound other than the cracking
[17:41] <asac> for me pulse is definitly on crack ;) ... but indeed
[17:41] <asac> if i go to gstreamer-properties and run the test sound i get a crack shortly after it starts
[17:41] <pedro_> asac: well, like.. not being so good, you know little jumps between music
[17:41] <asac> but otherwise no
[17:41] <asac> hmm
[17:41] <calc> PA is known to have issues with among other things all hda-intel realtek codecs :-\
[17:42] <asac> pedro_: for me it happened when my ati graphics driver was running EXA
[17:42] <calc> not sure what kind of issues those happen to be
[17:42] <asac> which slowed down things to death
[17:42] <asac> pedro_: i forced Xaa and all is fine now ... so wasnt a pulse issue ... more a general system load thing caused by buggy exa accell method
[17:43] <pedro_> I have an intel card but i'm having issues with xorg being slow at the beginning of the session
[17:43] <asac> my line in isnt working on hda-intel realtek  though :(
[17:43] <asac> pedro_: also EXA?
[17:43] <pedro_> asac: yeah
[17:43] <asac> i think intel uses exa for quite some time
[17:44] <asac> but still worth a try ... if xaa works at all
[17:44] <asac> on intel
[17:45] <pedro_> yup will try that otherwise will fill a bug
[17:46] <crevette> hey
[17:46] <crevette> seb128: I updated nautilus-sendto
[17:46] <seb128> crevette: good, I'll review that later
[18:21] <mvo> Amaranth: no idea about 010_ - its there since the dawn of time (i.e. nice before I merged it into bzr)
[18:22] <Amaranth> mvo: Yeah, it's been there since 0.3.6
[18:22] <Amaranth> I remember mjg59 added it
[18:22] <Amaranth> All it does is create that atom, I'm pretty sure it's for the XAA workaround
[18:23] <mvo> Amaranth: ok
[18:24] <Amaranth> also, it's kind of neat running compiz without LIBGL_ALWAYS_INDIRECT now :)
[18:24] <Amaranth> and seeing compiz-manager handle that correctly
[18:32] <chrisccoulson> hi seb128 - i notice gnome-session didn't build on 1 arch
[18:50] <chrisccoulson> hi mvo - i did the work on bug 302326 that we spoke about last week. the change is in bzr. would you mind taking a look at it?
[18:51] <mvo> chrisccoulson: sure, I misread the last comment when I looked at it the other day, I missed the bit that the patch is already commited :)
[18:51] <mvo> chrisccoulson: what is the bzr lp url?
[18:52] <chrisccoulson> 1 second
[18:52] <chrisccoulson> it is lp:~chrisccoulson/update-notifier/bug302326
[18:54] <chrisccoulson> i had to bring the branch in sync with what was in the archive, which just involved moving a changelog entry (for a change that went in after the last release)
[18:58] <mvo> thanks chrisccoulson
[18:58] <chrisccoulson> you're welcome
[20:25] <seb128> re
[20:25] <seb128> chrisccoulson: sorry I was just running for dinner when you ask your question
[20:26] <seb128> chrisccoulson: the build was on ia64? that seems to be a buildd issue
[20:45] <jlamsens> Anyone already has Compiz 0.7.8 running on Ubuntu 8.04 ? I have the problem: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/242735
[20:46] <jlamsens> Apparently, compiz 0.7.8 is only available for Intrepid, not for hardy. No backuport exists. Latest Compiz version for hardy: 0.7.6
[20:47] <jlamsens> Anyone ?
[21:07] <chrisccoulson> hi seb128, sorry i had to disappear as well. yeah, i was referring to the ia64 build of gnome-session. i wasn't sure what the problem was with it
[21:07] <chrisccoulson> it's just a transient error is it?
[21:08] <seb128> chrisccoulson: it seems, let me build retry this one
[21:08] <chrisccoulson> thanks
[21:08] <seb128> chrisccoulson: you're welcome, thank you for the work you are doing
[21:09] <chrisccoulson> you're welcome too:)
[21:09] <seb128> chrisccoulson: not sure if you are interested by doing some other GNOME updates but let me know if you are there is still some tarballs to update ;-)
[21:10] <chrisccoulson> no problem. i can't do any this evening as i've got some other stuff to do, but just give me a shout if you see me on here
[21:10] <chrisccoulson> i'm around most evenings
[21:10] <seb128> ok
[21:10] <seb128> we really should update the workflow this cycle, there was some work started on that
[21:11] <seb128> having a public system listing updates that are waiting and letting anybody claim any of those
[21:12] <chrisccoulson> that would be quite useful
[21:39] <asomething> seb128: http://norsetto.890m.com/desktop_packages.php is nice but it doesn't seem to look for 2.25.* packages
[21:47] <seb128> asomething: right, it needs to be updated
[21:48] <asomething> seb128: tools like that are important, they show people (like me) good places to jump in
[21:49] <seb128> asomething: right, we need some server to run the tools and some organisation though
[21:50] <seb128> asomething: the "whoever is the fast to grab an upgrade" system is not the best one
[21:50] <seb128> some people are working on a regular base on the same components and should be prefered upgrader if they are around
[21:50] <seb128> and we try to balance the tasks between contributors
[21:50] <seb128> we tend to attribute work on IRC right now but that has limitation
[21:51] <seb128> we could use a summary and a list of tasks though
[21:51] <asomething> seb128: exactly, if a page like that were kept up to date, it would make things easier to know
[21:52] <seb128> if you are looking for something to do just ask there though ;-)
[21:52] <seb128> do you have some special interest in some component?
[21:53] <asomething> seb128: i often have a hard time figuring where my efforts are best needed
[21:53] <seb128> the question should rather be what is interesting you the most because that's where you should start
[21:53] <asomething> seb128: nothing too specific, I mostly keep to working on gnome/gtk desktop stuff
[21:54] <seb128> you can do bug triage, bug fixing, updates
[21:54] <seb128> is there any GNOME component you already worked on? or that you use often and have special interest in?
[21:56] <asomething> seb128: i've done a few uploads of cheese and (not gnome but ubuntu-desktop) transmission
[21:58] <asomething> i maintain file-browser-applet and parcellite in debian
[22:01] <dobey> file-browser-applet?
[22:01] <dobey> like the thing that shows a menu of the file system in the gnome panel?
[22:01] <asomething> dobey: it's a gnome panel applet, in universe for Ubuntu
[22:02] <asomething> upstrea home: http://code.google.com/p/gnome-menu-file-browser-applet/
[22:03] <dobey> interesting
[22:03] <asomething> though, the upstream dev is probably moving to LP soon, with my help
[22:09] <seb128> asomething: nobody seems to be actively working on cheese, you are welcome to do the updates when they are available if you want
[22:09] <seb128> asomething: just ask on the channel if you are not sure or have any question
[22:10] <asomething> seb128: if there are any other gnome 2.25.* packages that still need to be done, feel free to delegate something to me, i'd love to help more
[22:13]  * dobey still needs to make 2.25.x releases of a few things
[22:15] <didrocks> seb128: you are working late these days
[22:15] <didrocks> :)
[22:16] <seb128> didrocks: no
[22:16] <seb128> didrocks: I stop early and sometime come back later
[22:17] <seb128> "early", ie at a reasonable work hour ;-)
[22:17] <didrocks> seb128: oki :-) I am building my changes again (on my laptop this time) and test on my vm
[22:17] <seb128> didrocks: time to update your laptop to jaunty!
[22:18] <didrocks> seb128: indeed :-)
[22:18] <didrocks> hum, taking a tour on LP to see which bugs can be closed with this release
[22:20] <seb128> asomething: there is not too many updates to do right now in fact but when one tarball is available I will let you know
[22:20] <seb128> didrocks: good
[22:20] <asomething> =)
[22:21] <seb128> asomething: not sure how much you know about packaging, evolution-mapi is a new thing to package but that's not really a beginner task though
[22:24] <asomething> seb128: not a beginner but not exactly a vet yet either. but i wouldn't really be able to test it. it's for interacting with an exchange server right?
[22:32] <seb128> asomething: the server team can do the testing
[22:36] <seb128> asomething: they don't seem to be that interested in packaging it and technically that's a GNOME component so we sort of agreed on having the desktop team doing the packaging and they will do the testing
[22:36] <asomething> seb128: i can take a crack at it, is there already a needs-packaging bug?
[22:38] <ember> btw seb128 is there any update free?
[22:38] <seb128> asomething: not that I know
[22:38] <seb128> ember: no, that's what I was saying to asomething just before
[22:38] <ember> pochu reminder, take a another look at gtk-css sitting on revu when you have time
[22:39] <ember> ok i didn't read the backlog i was just asking
[22:39] <seb128> ember: it would be nice if you could stop doing updates without asking there before, some of those you did are not useful they only have translation updates and since jaunty language packs are not updated yet they just give extra sponsoring work for nothing
[22:39] <seb128> ember: you also did some which were assigned to other people who asked on the channel
[22:40] <ember> oh sorry didn't know about the translations, were just trivial ones
[22:41] <ember> which one? i can invalid it
[22:41] <seb128> ember: that's ok, better to ask on the channel until there is a better way to list updates to do though
[22:42] <seb128> ember: don't bother now that they are done, they are quick to sponsor too, but there is no real need to do those
[22:43] <seb128> gnome-menus and libwnck were not really required, there is some minor changes there and version will be uptodate this way
[22:44] <asomething> seb128: I'll get a package on REVU in the next couple days, bug 319400
[23:17] <seb128> ok, enough work for today now