[00:02] <sjefen6> Does anyone know how to open sda1 (ntfs) in xubuntu?
[00:26] <gamerchick02> sjefen6: you're trying to look at your NTFS drive in Xubuntu?
[00:27] <sjefen6> yes
[00:27] <gamerchick02> i'm trying to browse to mine...
[00:27] <gamerchick02> hold on a sec ;)
[00:30] <gamerchick02> it should show up in media, i think
[00:34] <gamerchick02> or mnt
[00:38] <gamerchick02> https://help.ubuntu.com/xubuntu/desktopguide/C/linux-basics.html
[00:38] <gamerchick02> according to that, it should show up in /mnt
[00:39] <gamerchick02> but it must not be mounted, if it's not showing up
[00:46] <dark_abyss0> can someone help me with xfce?
[00:54] <dark_abyss0> ill take that as a no
[01:12] <durt> dark_abyss0: just ask your question not for help in general
[01:14] <Stroganoff> durt: don't talk to absent people
[01:16] <durt> sorry, got join/part messages turned off on this channel.
[01:21] <Stroganoff> smart move
[01:21] <Stroganoff> i got it covered via query
[02:24] <dark_abyss0> how do I add things to my source list?
[02:25] <Genelyk> amm
[02:25] <Genelyk> sudo nano /etc/apt/sources.list  ?
[02:26] <tich> i have a bit of a dumb question but i can't seem to find the answer...  what is the hotkey combo for switching desktops?
[02:28] <dark_abyss0> ok...that was confusing
[02:28] <dark_abyss0> should have asked
[02:28] <dark_abyss0> how do I add universe to my source list?
[02:39] <Genelyk> system - origins of software-  check in universe  and  reload
[03:13] <petesejt_> hi everyone
[03:14] <petesejt_> may I ask a user question here?
[03:19] <dark_abyss0> can someone guide me through installing bittorrent?
[03:26] <rocko> dark_abyss0 install deluge
[03:26] <durt> dark_abyss0: open up applications>system tools>synaptic, enter password, search for bittorrent, pick a client, hit apply
[03:27] <durt> dark_abyss0: transmission comes with xubuntu
[03:27] <rocko> dark_abyss0 http://download.deluge-torrent.org/ubuntu/intrepid/1.1.2/deluge-torrent_1.1.2-1_i386.intrepid.deb
[03:27] <rocko> transmission sucks
[03:27] <rocko> deluge is better
[03:28] <durt> true I use a command line app called ctorrent
[03:28] <rocko> hmm
[03:28] <rocko> another one
[03:28] <rocko> is that better than rtorrent? durt
[03:28] <durt> never user rtorrent
[03:29] <rocko> CTorrent discontinued
[03:30] <durt> there's tons of torrent clients in the repos
[03:30] <rocko> CTorrent discontinued -- 2006-06-07 15:46:51
[03:31] <durt> could very well be, any negative to use it?
[03:31] <rocko> durt http://www.rahul.net/dholmes/ctorrent/
[03:31] <rocko> enhanced ctorrent
[03:32] <rocko> http://libtorrent.rakshasa.no/
[03:32] <rocko> durt I searched on web for best cli bittorrent client and rtorrent came up all the time
[03:32] <rocko> so I guess it is the best for cli
[03:35] <durt> I'll take a look at it, I'm using the latest ctorrent package for 8.10 which has a changelog entry of Aug 5th 2008, so it's still maintained
[03:35] <tich> is there a hotkey to switch desktops?
[03:35] <rocko> yes durt that is the enhanced ctorrent
[03:35] <rocko> not the old ctorrent
[03:35] <tich> i just looked in the keyboard settings but i didn't see one
[03:36] <rocko> you can make one tich
[03:36] <rocko> compiz has one tich
[03:36] <tich> i am using an eeepc so i am trying to avoid compiz
[03:37] <tich> but i really like the ones compiz has!
[03:37] <tich> when i tried to add something it wanted me to add a whole new theme instead of just one more hotkey
[03:37] <tich> and i don't know what the command would be to switch desktops
[03:38] <durt> tich: in xfce ctrl-Fx switches desktops in the panel, if thats what you mean
[03:39] <tich> i think that is what i mean.  what is Fx?
[03:39] <durt> F1,F2,F3 etc.
[03:39] <tich> right
[03:39] <tich> x being a variable.
[03:39] <tich> i was looking for the Fx key... sometimes i wonder what i am thinking about
[03:40] <tich> that is it!
[03:40] <durt> mapping to whatever desktop number you want
[03:40] <tich> durt, you have made my day
[03:40] <durt> np
[03:57] <Cerrdor> what sound converter is best for changing .oga audio files to mp3?
[04:02] <dark_abyss0> is there a way to make adobe my defult flash player?
[04:02] <durt> Cerrdor: Whats an .oga?
[04:03] <Cerrdor> its the file extension my cd's rip at
[04:03] <Cerrdor> ogg vorbis file
[04:03] <durt> dark_abyss0: uninstall the other ones is the simplest thing that I can think of
[04:04] <durt> Cerrdor: thought that was .ogg
[04:05] <Cerrdor> should be but for some reason mine are oga
[04:05] <Cerrdor> so im tryin to get them to be mp3s
[04:06] <durt> Cerrdor: if there the same as ogg then there are a number of apps in the repos that can do it. If they're alot of them a cli app would be best maybe mencoder?
[04:34] <dark_abyss0> damnit I forgot what the other flash player I downloaded what
[04:34] <dark_abyss0> *was
[04:34] <dark_abyss0> is there a way to figure it out?
[04:51] <wayStead> does xubuntu show any performance improvements over ubuntu running in VBOX ?
[04:59] <forces> wayStead, yes
[04:59] <forces> xubuntu use less memory
[04:59] <forces> cause xfce is lighter than gnome
[07:14] <ball> hello rocko
[07:21] <rocko> hello ball
[07:22] <rocko> what it goes ?
[07:22] <ball> rocko: not too bad.  I'm tired, but okay otherwise.  Yourself?
[07:23] <rocko> good thanks
[07:26] <rocko> where are you from ? ball
[07:29] <ball> rocko: I'm British, but I live in the U.S.
[07:29] <rocko> I see
[07:38] <likemindead> Good, simple, smaller than GIMP paint-type program(s)?
[07:39] <ball> likemindead: bitmap or vector?
[07:39] <likemindead> Bitmap would work.
[07:39] <likemindead> I'd try either.
[07:39] <ball> I forget.  xpaint?
[07:39] <likemindead> I'll look it up.
[07:40] <likemindead> Tuxpaint is awfully full of win. lawlz...
[07:40] <ball> ?
[07:41] <likemindead> http://www.tuxpaint.org/
[07:41] <likemindead> Ya know, for kids.
[07:42] <likemindead> A quick "sudo apt-get install xpaint" & Thank you very much! G'nite.
[07:42] <ball> Nice, I'll have to try that...o, he's gone.
[07:56] <ball> hello Hexus
[08:37] <Besogon> People, I have a problem with sound. Its dont work, I am not hearing sound from loudspeakers. But in gnome all work fine. Help me!
[08:39] <ball> Besogon: have you checked your mixer settings?
[08:41] <Besogon> People, I have a problem with sound. Its dont work, I am not hearing sound from loudspeakers. But in gnome all work fine. Help me!
[08:42] <ball> I think you should hit it with a hammer.
[08:45] <Besogon> hey! anybody home?
[08:47] <Besogon> zomby, zomby around.
[08:47] <chewit> are you using alsa, oss or pulse
[08:47] <chewit> might be worth checking between those
[08:51] <Besogon> OK. Its cemetery. Let dont touch corpses. And what am I doing there?
[08:55] <Besogon> Rise from dead men! Christ has arisen! Uuuuaaaaa!!
[08:59] <Besogon> People I havent been listening sound only in xfce. Help if you can
[09:00] <Reno`> everybody are dead :)
[09:01] <Besogon> I see it now. )
[09:01] <ablomen> Besogon, like ball said earlier, check your mixer settings (you might want to run alsa-mixer on the terminal and see if anything is muted or turned way down)
[09:01] <ablomen> without the dash that is (so alsamixer)
[09:02] <ablomen> master, pcm or front might be turned down and causing the problem
[09:02] <Besogon> ablomen, ok I wil try
[11:09] <slow-motion> hi
[11:15]  * jarnos got fed up with Firefox freezing; using Epiphany, instead.
[11:24] <chewit> is anyone here using Xfce power manager instead of Gnome's version
[11:26] <slow-motion> does someone get dvb-t working under xubuntu?
[11:28] <slow-motion> i have installed the gstreamer pakets as shown under http://projects.gnome.org/totem/ and the paket xubuntu-restricted-extras
[11:29] <slow-motion> totem loads the channels in the playlist, but wont show me something
[11:33] <dvdm> chewit: I am...
[11:34] <chewit> dvdm, is it stable. I want to get rid of as many gnome apps as possible.
[11:35] <dvdm> chewit: only using it on my laptop (which I do not use 24/7) and have not had any issue with it
[11:35] <chewit> ok
[11:35] <chewit> i suppose i could await until Xfce 4.6, which the xfce power manager will feature in
[12:29] <S0210> Hi! I have a multipage TIFF (3 pages of 200x200) that I want to convert into a sinle page JPG (1 page of 600x200). Is there a simple(!) way to do it? Maybe "convert"?
[12:30] <TheSheep> close
[12:30] <TheSheep> merge, elso from ImageMagick
[12:30] <TheSheep> no, wait
[12:31] <TheSheep> montage
[12:32] <S0210> -adjoin?
[12:33] <S0210> no -adjoin
[12:37] <S0210> I have no idea what option I should use
[12:38] <S0210> -coalesce?
[13:25] <G-Blunted> whoo hoo!
[13:25] <G-Blunted> Xubuntu + Dell Inspiron 8500 = Perfect Match
[13:59] <sunshine> Hey, on ubuntu there is too much traffic ;-)
[14:00] <sunshine> I want to know how to disable the gnome-keyring? Unfortunately i gave a password as I wanted to establish a wireless connection. Now it is asking the password everytime i want to connect
[14:01] <sunshine> Could not uninstall due to huge dependencies. How to get rid off the password. I read that it is possible to leave it blank and it will never bother again.
[14:01] <sunshine> I'm aware of the security concerns, but the computer should only be easy to use.
[14:03] <TheSheep> sunshine: right-click on the network icon, delete that connection and set it up again
[14:04] <sunshine> This worked so far without prompting for the gnome-keyring at all
[14:06] <sunshine> have to try it on a restart
[14:06] <sunshine> thanx so far
[14:07] <knome> hello Sheepie.
[14:09] <sunshine> unfortunately not working
[14:10] <sunshine> It again asks for the keyring password before starting networkmanager at all
[14:11] <sunshine> Oh i got it!
[14:12] <sunshine> Preferences of Passwords and Encryption keys
[16:41] <Ben_Cs> hello
[16:41] <Ben_Cs> how do i know if cksum return value is ok?
[16:45] <Ben_Cs> never mind, i used md5sum
[17:00]  * jarnos got fed up with Epiphany and is looking for a non-freezing web browser.
[17:02] <Ben_Cs> hello
[17:02] <Ben_Cs> i tried to install xubuntu 8.10 several times and it always fails on:  select and install software.  md5sum is OK and verifying disk contents is ok. please help!
[17:03] <chewit> is it during the live cd install
[17:07] <TheSheep> Ben_Cs: do you check the disk on the same computer on which you are trying to install?
[17:08] <Ben_Cs> TheSheep: the md5sum no, the disk checking-yes
[17:08] <Ben_Cs> chewit: alternate install cd
[17:08] <chewit> ok
[17:09] <TheSheep> Ben_Cs: no messages?
[17:09] <TheSheep> Ben_Cs: how about in the install log?
[17:09] <Ben_Cs> TheSheep: it says the cd is fine
[17:10] <Ben_Cs> TheSheep: you mean alt_ctrl_f4?
[17:10] <TheSheep> it should be somewhere in /var/log
[17:10] <Ben_Cs> TheSheep: but it never finishes install
[17:11] <TheSheep> then you will see why in the log
[17:12] <TheSheep> switch to second console with alt+f2 and do  less /var/log/install<tab>
[17:14] <Ben_Cs> TheSheep: i'm trying to install again. when it'll fail, i'll check
[17:49] <dvdm> my screensaver stopped working (this is on 8.10)
[17:50] <dvdm> it just stays on the "random"
[17:50] <dvdm> even after I reconfigure it again to a specific one, it just does the random
[17:50] <dvdm> where is the actual config file whree I can see this config setting?
[17:58] <Ben_Cs> TheSheep: i get the message: menu item 'pkgsel' failed
[18:03] <Ben_Cs> help please. pretty please?
[18:18] <atgarsis> hello
[18:19] <atgarsis> i got a strange sound problem. it plays through the headphones when they're pluged-in, though when i unplug them, my computer speakers remain silent as well as my loudspeakers which i plug externally. any idea what might be wrong?
[18:31] <atgarsis> ?
[18:49] <G-Bleezy> when i boot it says:   Kernel panic - not syncing: VFS: Unable to mount root fs on unknown wn-block(0,0)
[18:49] <G-Bleezy> anyone know if i can fix this or i gotta reinstall?
[18:54] <G-Bleezy> i figured it out!
[18:54] <G-Bleezy> but i dont know how to fix it...there is an extra option when i boot...another kernel version or something and when i choose that new kernel to boot it gives me that error
[19:01] <knome> G-Bleezy, you can set the item to load from /boot/grub/menu.lst
[19:02] <knome> G-Bleezy, if everything works with an old kernel, there's no big reason to try to get the newer working. things will most probably be fixed soon anyway.
[19:04] <G-Bleezy> k
[19:05] <G-Bleezy> i think what happened was i just did this fresh install right? And i just had it go through and update everything...and that's when that new kernel option on the boot menu showed up...and when i choose that it gives me that error...
[19:05] <G-Bleezy> but the old one (which is still on the list) works fine...
[19:06] <Mood> Anyone know how to autoconnect when your wifi disconnects?
[19:07] <G-Bleezy> mine just autoconnects by itself...
[19:07] <Mood> G-Bleezy: xubuntu 8.10?
[19:07] <G-Bleezy> yea
[19:07] <Mood> G-Bleezy: you have NetworkManager Applet 0.7.0?
[19:08] <G-Bleezy> that, i dont' actually know...
[19:08] <G-Bleezy> how u find out?
[19:08] <Mood> G-Bleezy: upper right, choose your network icon, go to About
[19:08] <G-Bleezy> oh ya
[19:08] <G-Bleezy> i got it
[19:08] <G-Bleezy> 0.7.0
[19:09] <Mood> do you use ndiswrapper for your wifi card driver?
[19:09] <knome> G-Bleezy, i don't know why that happened. :)
[19:09] <G-Bleezy> ya i just turn my computer on and it tries to connect to all the wireless networks until it connects to the only one that's not encrypted around here
[19:09] <G-Bleezy> knome: its okay i don't either
[19:09] <G-Bleezy> what gives that boot menu?
[19:09] <Mood> G-Bleezy: hmm... ok
[19:09] <knome> G-Bleezy, /boot/grub/menu.lst
[19:09] <G-Bleezy> ok
[19:11] <knome> Mood, did you search the forums? i suppose there would be quite many threads about autoreconnecting.
[19:11] <Mood> knome: only dead ends
[19:11] <Mood> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=934499
[19:12] <knome> ok.
[19:13] <G-Bleezy> what is update-grub?
[19:14] <G-Bleezy> Ubuntu 8.10. kernel 2.6.27-11-generic  <---this is what was added...and if i boot that option i get kernel panic...whats the best way to undo this and remove this kernel/option or to fix this menu file so it boots right??
[19:18] <knome> G-Bleezy, see row 14 on /boot/grub/menu.lst
[19:18] <knome> G-Bleezy, default    0
[19:18] <knome> G-Bleezy, set that 0 to any item on the list you want to boot. the numbers start from 0 and increase from top to bottom. so the third from top would be 2.
[19:18] <dark_abyss0> is there a command to download Wbar?
[19:19] <knome> dark_abyss0, what is wbar?
[19:19] <G-Bleezy> ya i did that, set it to 2 which is the right option
[19:19] <G-Bleezy> but...still got stuff layin around broken i think :(
[19:19] <knome> if you can boot correctly from the third option, this should work when you next reboot.
[19:20] <dark_abyss0> its a launch bar
[19:20] <G-Bleezy> Kernel panic - not syncing: VFS: Unable to mount root fs on unknown wn-block(0,0)  <---somethin to do with /dev/initrd i think
[19:21] <knome> dark_abyss0, looking at its fresmeat.net page, it says it's last updated 1 year, 4 months ago. i doubt it will be added to ubuntu repositories if it's not active.
[19:22] <knome> dark_abyss0, and no, there is no single/definitive way to install it if it's not in the repositories.
[19:22] <dark_abyss0> its cool I got iit
[19:22] <dark_abyss0> well got it downloaded
[19:22] <dark_abyss0> now I hav e ot figure out how to install it
[19:23] <knome> dark_abyss0, if you downloaded the source, most probably './configure' 'make' and 'sudo make install'
[19:24] <knome> (+ looks like the project has moved to google code.)
[19:24] <knome> there is a .deb package: http://code.google.com/p/wbar/downloads/list
[19:24] <G-Bleezy> how do i make this file?  /boot/initrd.img-2.6.27-7-generic  <---i need to make one of these for my new kernel...how i do that?
[19:24] <dark_abyss0> heh thanks
[19:24] <knome> !kernel
[19:25] <knome> G-Bleezy, it's not something you want to do if you don't know how to do it.
[19:25] <G-Bleezy> thats what that is? a compiled kernel?
[19:26] <knome> well simply yes.
[19:26] <knome> if you want to make one of those, you need to compile a kernel
[19:27] <knome> i don't know the details though.
[19:27] <G-Bleezy> damn..there's no like...'compile_kernel_plz' command? :p
[19:28] <G-Blunted> .
[19:28] <knome> G-Blunted, G-Bleezy: no
[19:28] <G-Blunted> :)
[19:28] <G-Blunted> k
[19:28] <knome> G-Blunted, as i said, you don't want to do that.
[19:28] <G-Blunted> <--- this is the box with the screwy boot options
[19:29] <G-Blunted> weird watchin myself type, almost 0 lag from one screen to the other :p
[19:30] <G-Blunted> is there any way to see what options were used to compile my working kernel?
[19:30] <G-Blunted> or is there any way to 'uninstall' the new kernel that got half way installed??
[19:31] <knome> uhh.... maybe ask #ubuntu-devel or something. :)
[19:31] <knome> (you don't want to do that either)
[19:31] <knome> (you just want to twaek you menu.lst ;))
[19:32] <G-Blunted> hrm...ya but i don't like all that broken stuff just lying around...
[19:32] <G-Blunted> i gotta figure somethin out ;)
[20:26] <dark_abyss0> can someone walk me though adding repositories?
[20:48] <Ish2> hai gais
[20:53] <Ish2> who wants questions? raise your hand
[21:00] <Mood> How can i auto connect to my wifi? I'm using Xubuntu 8.10
[21:01] <Mood> every time my connection drops, i get a dialog that forces me to manually connect
[21:02] <Mood> i have "connect automatically" set, but still no dive
[21:02] <Mood> dice*
[21:27] <SliM1> hello
[21:27] <SliM1> how can I sort the windows in the task list?
[21:29] <G-Bleezy> Will the memory test just run forever if you let it??
[21:41] <Mood> .
[21:47] <Mood> What is "System Setting" in Network-Manager?
[21:49] <Mood> i think i found the answer: https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+question/48283
[21:49] <Mood> thank you xubuntu
[21:56] <Ish2> this room is great, i found my own answer
[21:56] <G-Bleezy> i like xubuntu
[21:57] <Ish2> i like xubuntu
[21:57] <G-Bleezy> me too
[21:57] <Ish2> quelle coincedence!
[21:57] <Mood> fou francais
[21:57] <Stroganoff> i like os/2
[21:57] <Ish2> :(
[21:57] <Ish2> ca va?
[21:57] <Mood> ;-)
[21:57] <Mood> ca va bien
[21:58] <Mood> i like apple//c
[21:58] <Ish2> steve jobs has HIV
[21:58] <Stroganoff> O.o
[21:58] <Ish2> it's true, the internet told me so
[21:58] <Mood> living with HIV is like living with diabetes now
[21:59] <G-Bleezy> http://list.ubuntu.com/  <---this work for anyone?
[21:59] <Mood> mais non
[22:00] <Stroganoff> G-Bleezy: https://lists.ubuntu.com/
[22:00] <Ish2> i couldn't believe that it autoruns an apache server
[22:00] <Ish2> with php support
[22:01] <G-Bleezy> k
[22:01] <G-Bleezy> http://xubuntu.com/contribute/advocacy_support_documentation  <---the link is wrong on this page...it uses http://list.ubuntu.com
[22:18] <john_> hello all
[22:19] <john_>  ok I have a simple question I have that 22" screen could it be giving me trouble with the p3 on a VGA monitor
[22:46] <pkodon> Anybody home?
[22:50] <pkodon> Umm, try again. Anybody home?
[22:51] <pkodon> Guess not.
[22:53] <G-Blunted> i am home
[22:53]  * G-Blunted is home
[22:53] <pkodon> Okay.
[22:54] <pkodon> I've got a question that I don't know if it's related to Wine or XFCE.
[22:56] <pkodon> I have installed some games using Wine, checked them out, decided I needed to run them in real Windows, so uninstalled them. Now, though I've looked around and gotten rid of the directories they were in and everything else I can find, I still can't get rid of the icons in the XFCE menu (listed under "Other"), and I can't find a file to edit or where it's getting the graphics.
[22:57] <pkodon> As I'm new to Linux, this is taking me a lot of time to go through my HD looking for graphics files and xml (which I guess the menus are written in), and editing the menu doesn't show that part, nor any of the system menus.
[22:58] <TheSheep> pkodon: .local/share/applications/wine/
[22:59] <pkodon> Okay, just a minute (I think I looked there, but will look again)....
[22:59] <G-Blunted> Where can i find a list of really useful hotkeys for xubuntu?
[22:59] <G-Blunted> like how do you switch workspaces and stuff with keyboard?
[23:00] <TheSheep> G-Blunted: system->setting manager->window manager
[23:00] <TheSheep> G-Blunted: sorry, that's settings->
[23:00] <pkodon> Umm, there's no /wine/ directory in /usr/share/applications/
[23:01] <TheSheep> pkodon: ~/.local/share/applications/wine
[23:01] <G-Blunted> thanks these look fun :)
[23:01] <TheSheep> pkodon: in your home directory
[23:03] <pkodon> TheSheep: Ahh, thanks, that's where they are. I guess I just need to delete two directories to get rid of them, though I'll check any xml out in there to see where it's getting the graphics first (as I want to get rid of those, too).
[23:03] <TheSheep> pkodon: it's not xml, they are .desktop files
[23:03] <G-Blunted> omg mouse roller + workspaces = so freakin sweet
[23:04] <TheSheep> pkodon: probably from .local/share/icons/hicolor/
[23:04] <TheSheep> G-Blunted: you can also have it working over the desktop
[23:04] <pkodon> TheSheep: Okay, the menu editor in XFCE (right-click on the menu button) uses xml files, or so it seems, but has lines that include other stuff, I guess.
[23:05] <TheSheep> pkodon: yeah, and that other stuff is generated from files in /usr/share/applications and .local/share/applications
[23:05] <TheSheep> pkodon: the latter override the former
[23:05] <pkodon> TheSheep: I do know that I can load the .desktop files in mousepad, so I know I can look at them.
[23:05] <TheSheep> sure, they are just normal text .ini files
[23:06] <G-Blunted> Ya i checked that...but with everything full screen i dont' see desktop much....but when you roll over the workspaces in the bottom right it works just fine...thats sweet...
[23:06] <pkodon> Anyway, thanks a lot. Learning where things are in Linux is quite the adventure, but as I learn, I also try to help others.
[23:18] <pkodon> TheSheep: Okay, got rid of the stuff I didn'
[23:18] <pkodon> t want
[23:18] <TheSheep> :)
[23:19] <pkodon> TheSheep: But, now what do I do to put the stuff I do want into a separate menu under Other (it puts every uninstall/readme/etc. in /Programs/Other in the menu)?
[23:20] <pkodon> In other words, how do I get it to show as /Programs/Other/Whatever/...
[23:21] <TheSheep> pkodon: you can add your own entries with the menu editor
[23:22] <pkodon> TheSheep: I understand that, but how can I make the entries that have shown up because of these .desktop files be organized into sub-menues? I don't understand why they aren't in the first place, since they are in sub-directories.
[23:23] <TheSheep> pkodon: the submenu in which they appear depends on the category they are in
[23:24] <pkodon> TheSheep: And, how do I edit that?
[23:24] <TheSheep> you can change the .desktop files in /usr/share/applications by copying them into .local/share/applications and changing them there
[23:24] <TheSheep> for example, changing their categories
[23:24] <TheSheep> or adding hidden=True
[23:29] <pkodon> Hmm, guess I need to go look for some docs on this stuff, so I don'
[23:29] <pkodon> t put something I shouldn't in there.
[23:29]  * forces is listening to: Limp Bizkit - The Chocolate Starfish - My Way - (0:42/4:32)
[23:30] <TheSheep> forces: can you please disable that?
[23:30] <TheSheep> pkodon: look for the menu spec on freedesktop.org
[23:32] <pkodon> TheSheep: Okay, thanks. The menu editor shows no entry for Wine or Other, just an include for "system", and I have no idea where to look for the entries "system" uses, but I assume Wine's stuff is included in there.
[23:33] <TheSheep> pkodon: think of it as of two separate menus: one is made with menu editor, the other one is generated from .desktop files, then they are merged
[23:34] <pkodon> Okay, so somewhere there is a system.desktop or a /system/... set of directories.
[23:34] <pkodon> I had been looking for a system.xml file.
[23:34] <TheSheep> pkodon: no, the subdirectories are created automatically when there is a .desktop file for the particular directory
[23:35] <TheSheep> pkodon: most of the System menu is made of xfce4*.desktop files
[23:36] <pkodon> Hmm, okay, so, let me try this... Perhaps the reason why it's bunching all the icons for all my windows games in one directory is because the directories the .desktop files are in, don't have a .desktop file for the directory itself?
[23:38] <pkodon> If I can find those xfce4*.desktop files, I might be able to figgure out how it structures menus from them, but will look on that website first....
[23:39] <TheSheep> there is no .desktop file for the directory
[23:39] <TheSheep> there is just the category name *inside* every of those .desktop files
[23:43] <pkodon> Well, the category is "Application" for those windows files, but they show up under "Other" in the menu, so there's something else going on here.
[23:46] <TheSheep> pkodon: no, there is an xml file mapping the categories to subdirectories
[23:46] <TheSheep> pkodon: /etc/xdg/xfce4/desktop/menu.xml
[23:51] <pkodon> TheSheep: Ahh, that's the missing piece of the puzzle. That still won't help me put those things in separate menu entries in the menu, unless every time I install a program I go in and give it a new category and put that category in that menu.xml.
[23:51] <TheSheep> pkodon: I suppose Wine would have some way of setting up how it creates the .desktop files
[23:51] <pkodon> And if that's the case, it doesn't make for a very good promotion for moving from Windows to Linux.
[23:52] <TheSheep> pkodon: it doesn't make much sense to move to linux and still use windows software
[23:53] <pkodon> TheSheep: Well, let's see - older versions of their O/S they no longer support, the games I want to play are mostly older games, I don't trust a Windows machine connected to the internet, need I say more?
[23:53] <TheSheep> pkodon: if they are really old, try dosbox
[23:54] <pkodon> TheSheep: Well, I've got that for Linux, but many I have are Win95/98 games, as well.
[23:55] <TheSheep> you can drag-and-drop the .desktop files to the menu editor, and then move them around how you like
[23:56] <TheSheep> provided it's a one-time thing, of course
[23:56] <TheSheep> otherwise it's too much work
[23:56] <pkodon> Plus, I'm trying to learn this Linux O/S, so this is a good way to learn. Besides, if I end up recommending Linux to any future business customers, and they happen to have need of running a Windows app, I'll know how to set it up.
[23:57] <TheSheep> pkodon: this thing is specific to xfce, gnome and kde handle it differently
[23:57] <pkodon> Thanks for all the help, I'm going exploring on that website now.
[23:57] <TheSheep> pkodon: and xfce 4.6 that comes out in April will handle it differently too
[23:58] <pkodon> I understand that, but right now I'm focussing on PC/OS. If they upgrade in the next version to XFCE 4.6, I'll learn that when it comes.
[23:58] <pkodon> That release is not till next month, I believe (PC/OS's next release).
[23:59] <pkodon> In the mean time, I can figgure out how to customize my desktop and menus, even if it's changed, the experience should help.