[01:13] <Myrtti> right
[01:13] <Seeker`> left
[01:13] <Myrtti> piccies tagged and renamed, ankle rewrapped
[01:13] <Seeker`> piccies?
[01:13] <Myrtti> chatted with Duncan
[01:14] <Myrtti> Seeker`: http://flickr.com/search/?q=fosdem&w=78835633%40N00 or so
[01:15] <Seeker`> cool
[01:15] <Myrtti> or perhaps http://flickr.com/photos/myrtti/archives/date-posted/2009/02/ is better
[01:15] <Myrtti> anyway
[01:15] <Myrtti> I'm off.
[01:15] <Seeker`> nn
[01:16] <Myrtti> tata kids.
[04:08] <Flannel> Anyone alive with -ot?
[04:08] <Flannel> GuruDrew could use a kick
[04:11] <tritium> Flannel: say the word
[04:19] <vVvHACKERvVv> blah
[04:19] <seam0nster1> *gets popcorn*
[04:19] <weternal> seam0nster1 me too
[04:19] <tritium> seam0nster1: please see the /topic
[04:20] <vVvHACKERvVv> listen people
[04:20] <Flannel> weternal: This isn't a place for spectators.  Please leave.
[04:20] <vVvHACKERvVv> stop nagging everyone
[04:20] <vVvHACKERvVv> thats all
[04:20] <seam0nster1> yeah sorry about that, you carry on doing what you like doing, i will shut up
[04:20] <vVvHACKERvVv> people just wnat to talk without you throwing rules in their face all the time
[04:21] <Flannel> vVvHACKERvVv: The rules are in place to make #ubuntu usable.  Without them, it wouldn't be useful to anyone.  We have places to chat, #ubuntu is not that place.
[04:21] <tritium> seam0nster1, weternal: is there something you need?
[04:21] <weternal> nope
[04:21] <vVvHACKERvVv> Flannel: that is not why you are posting them
[04:21] <vVvHACKERvVv> you are because you dislike me 
[04:21] <seam0nster1> you entered a room name in the man chat
[04:21] <seam0nster1> main
[04:22] <seam0nster1> people will join
[04:22] <seam0nster1> lr2 pm
[04:22] <Flannel> seam0nster1: Please don't force us to remove you from this room.
[04:22] <tritium> ryanprior: and you?
[04:22] <ryanprior> I wanted to ask something, I can wait until you guys are done.
[04:23] <vVvHACKERvVv> man 
[04:23] <vVvHACKERvVv> unreal
[04:23] <seam0nster1> yeah, i have a `uestion
[04:23] <vVvHACKERvVv> this is like children with big sticks
[04:23] <seam0nster1> for the ops
[04:23] <Flannel> vVvHACKERvVv: Again, those rules are the same for everyone.  Not just you.
[04:23] <Flannel> seam0nster1: How can we help you?
[04:23] <seam0nster1> why so serious ?
[04:23] <vVvHACKERvVv> Flannel: you really need to understand the reality of society
[04:23] <tritium> Life is serious.  I don't have time for nonsense.
[04:24] <vVvHACKERvVv> nonsense is censoring people becuase you dont like them
[04:24] <tritium> seam0nster1: please leave
[04:24] <Flannel> vVvHACKERvVv: This isn't a philosphical discussion.  #ubuntu as rules, we expect you to follow them.  They're publically posted, and you were warned a few times.
[04:24] <seam0nster1> lol k
[04:24] <seam0nster1> just lighten up guise srsly
[04:24] <vVvHACKERvVv> Flannel: you ar enot god
[04:25] <vVvHACKERvVv> the sooner you realize this the better
[04:25] <Flannel> vVvHACKERvVv: If you can't follow them, we ask you take leave of #ubuntu
[04:25] <vVvHACKERvVv> I do follow them
[04:25] <vVvHACKERvVv> I dont follow you
[04:25] <vVvHACKERvVv> and you hate it
[04:25] <Flannel> vVvHACKERvVv: I could care less if you 'follow me', as long as you obey the rules of the channel.
[04:25] <tritium> ryanprior: what's up?
[04:26] <Flannel> If I'm clarifying a rule for you, I expect you to listen to that portion of what I'm saying.
[04:26] <vVvHACKERvVv> Man you ar elost
[04:26] <ryanprior> tritium: In what ways, if any, do the Ubuntu code of conduct and the IRC guidelines intersect?
[04:26] <Flannel> but regarding the rest of what I say, I could care less.
[04:26] <vVvHACKERvVv> People are here because it makes them feel more freedom, freedom from microsoft
[04:27] <vVvHACKERvVv> and you go right ahead and do the same thing with your nonsense
[04:27] <vVvHACKERvVv> attempt to censor and take that away
[04:27] <Flannel> ryanprior: Theoretically, the Code of Conduct + Common Sense encompasses everything in the IRC guidelines.
[04:27] <vVvHACKERvVv> you are the primary reason why chats fail
[04:27] <tritium> vVvHACKERvVv: give it a rest
[04:27] <Flannel> ryanprior: but, its safer to spell things out, since some people aren't familiar with IRCs etiquette, etc.
[04:27] <vVvHACKERvVv> dont invite me in here and tell me to give it a rest
[04:28] <tritium> vVvHACKERvVv: I didn't
[04:28] <tritium> I only did the latter
[04:28] <vVvHACKERvVv> Flannel did
[04:28] <tritium> No, he did the former
[04:28] <Flannel> vVvHACKERvVv: We invited you here so that we can talk to you without putting this in #ubuntu
[04:28] <ryanprior> Flannel: Relatedly, if something is approved as an Ubottu factoid, does that make it law, or are many of those just suggestions?
[04:28] <Flannel> ryanprior: Are you familiar with roberts rules?
[04:28] <tritium> ryanprior: depends on if it's conduct related, or suggestions for installing apps, etc.
[04:29] <ryanprior> Flannel: I'm not familiar with them by that name. Should I paste that into Google?
[04:29] <Flannel> ryanprior: Nah.
[04:30] <ryanprior> tritium: I mean the conduct-related ones specifically.
[04:30] <tritium> ryanprior: do you have one in particular that is in question?
[04:31] <ryanprior> tritium: My big one is !enter, which people abuse pretty frequently. I don't want to be mean to anybody, and I know it's common in IM, but it bugs me in a big way when people do it in IRC.
[04:31] <Flannel> ryanprior: The code of conduct + IRC guideines are rules, and the factoids are generally an application of those rules.  (regarding Roberts Rules:) CoC could be seen as a Constitution, with the IRCguidelines as Bylaws, and factoids as standing rules.  At least, that's how... I'd do it, if I absolutely had to make such an analogy.  Obviously in real life, its not that cut and dry
[04:31] <ryanprior> Furthermore, it goes along with the general principals of good communication in the Ubuntu COC, etc.
[04:31] <tritium> ryanprior: me too
[04:31] <Flannel> ryanprior: that's a rule, etc.  The factoids generally spell out good etiquette, because people are unfamiliar with IRC, etc.
[04:32] <Flannel> ryanprior: It doesn't make sense to put that in the IRC guidelines as itself, because there's a few parts of the IRCG that cover it (Don't flood, don't be annoying, etc)
[04:33] <tritium> What is it with people tonight?
[04:33] <Flannel> tritium: full moon
[04:33] <tritium> I guess.
[04:33] <ryanprior> I can't help my gut feeling that people need it spelled out a little more explicitly, though. I'd put it in the topic. =P
[04:33] <tritium> ryanprior: that's a good suggestions, actually
[04:33] <Flannel> er.  If anyone read the topics, they'd get to it eventually.
[04:34] <Flannel> Hmm
[04:34] <Flannel> They used to... where is guidelines in it right now?
[04:34] <Flannel> It used to be in the topic!
[04:35] <ryanprior>  IRC info: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC
[04:35] <ryanprior> It's in there.
[04:35] <ryanprior> But not directly linked.
[04:35] <Flannel> Ah ha
[04:35] <ryanprior> And here we are, using enter as punctuation. =D  It's so darn easy.
[04:36] <Flannel> ryanprior: It's habit for a lot of people.  It takes a lot of people a lot of time to not hit enter at every period, since that's what they've done with IM for so long.
[04:36] <Flannel> Well, except they don't even use punctuation in instant messaging.
[04:37] <ryanprior> Well, thanks for the info, and +1 usability points to y'all for putting a direct link to the IRC guielines, or COC, or note about "enter" in the topic.
[04:38] <Flannel> Yay ban evasion!
[04:39] <Flannel> I don't think adding guidelines to the topic is a bad idea
[04:39] <Flannel> I just don't know if it ought to be at the end or the middle, with install at the end:
[04:39] <Flannel> Official Ubuntu Support Channel Be patient and read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FAQ | Support options: http://www.ubuntu.com/support | IRC info: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC | Pastes to http://paste.ubuntu.com | Install Ubuntu: http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/download | Channel Guidelines: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IrcGuidelines
[04:41] <Flannel> Sigh.
[04:41] <Flannel> Anyone have better suggestions than whack a mole?
[04:42] <Flannel> tritium: seamonster is back too.
[04:42] <tritium> Flannel: sorry, stepped away to do laundry
[04:42] <Flannel> No worries
[04:44] <tritium> Flannel: under a new nick?
[04:44] <Flannel> tritium: 20:41 -!- seam0nster1 [n=an0nym0u@212.183.134.130] has joined #ubuntu
[04:44] <Flannel> Isn't that the same guy?
[04:44] <tritium> yes
[04:47] <seam0nster1> hay
[04:47] <Flannel> Hi seam0nster1
[04:47] <seam0nster1> sup ?
[04:48] <Flannel> seam0nster1: you know ban evasion isn't the best thing to do.
[04:48] <seam0nster1> it's either that or recive no futher help
[04:48] <seam0nster1> i need this room, as im new to ubuntu
[04:48] <Flannel> seam0nster1: Alright, I'll put it another way:  ban evasion only lengthens your ban
[04:48] <tritium> seam0nster1: if you need help, I will allow you back in.
[04:49] <seam0nster1> but.. i will just evade again..
[04:49] <Flannel> seam0nster1: I strongly suggest you part #ubuntu right now, and then come here to discuss your ban
[04:49] <tritium> Please, however, don't spam the channel with smart-aleck remarks.
[04:49] <tritium> You'll evade again?  Not what I was looking for...
[04:49] <seam0nster1> wait
[04:49] <seam0nster1> inb4 b&
[04:49] <tritium> Especialyl after I offer to allow you to stay.
[04:49] <tritium> Especially*
[04:50] <seam0nster1> whats the point, we don't see eye to eye, i will stfu in future
[04:50] <Flannel> yeah.  That's... not really the right way to go looking at this.  This isn't a forum of idiots
[04:50] <seam0nster1> i know, and i DO need help
[04:50] <seam0nster1> but i just got sucked into the thing
[04:51] <seam0nster1> i have a problem with authority
[04:51] <Flannel> seam0nster1: Do you understand why you were banned?
[04:51] <tritium> seam0nster1: you seem to be good at heart.
[04:51] <seam0nster1> i am, and yes i do
[04:51] <seam0nster1> ^_^
[04:51] <tritium> It just doens't help to be egging on trolls, spamming the channel with unnecessary offtopic comments.
[04:52] <seam0nster1> alright, i understand that.. i just can't help myself sometimes
[04:52] <Flannel> Because it just makes the channel unusable for those who actually need help (such as yourself)
[04:52] <tritium> seam0nster1: I'd like to give you the chance to get the support/help you need
[04:52] <seam0nster1> it was kinda lulzy
[04:52] <seam0nster1> thnx
[04:52] <tritium> Please don't make me regret it, ok?
[04:52] <seam0nster1> okay.
[04:53] <tritium> Thanks.  I appreciate it.
[04:53] <tritium> Please re-join #ubuntu.
[04:53] <tritium> I will remove the previous ban.
[04:53] <tritium> @login
[04:53] <tritium> @btlogin
[04:53] <seam0nster1> yea me too, would of sucked if i was perma b&
[04:53] <seam0nster1> thnx
[04:53] <tritium> You're most welcome.
[04:54] <seam0nster1> should i leave here ?
[04:55] <Flannel> seam0nster1: Please do, yes.  Thanks again.
[04:56] <seam0nster1> :)
[06:31] <Flannel> Whoever codes floodbots : Make them comment regarding automated mibbit bans in the BT
[06:31] <Flannel> since many of those aren't necessary as bans (and need to be cleaned out after a few months, etc), and it'd make it easier if they had something to search on.
[06:32] <tritium> Flannel: how was your LoCo meeting?  And, was scale this weekend?  How did that go?
[06:33] <Flannel> tritium: It's in two weeks.  Same weekend as GBJ (and we're actually participating all weekend!)
[06:34] <tritium> Flannel: oh, ok.
[06:34] <Flannel> In addition to our booth, we're going to be running a room with bug jamming going on, with two presentations, one on how to bug jam, and the other on how to do bugwork itself (what normally happens at a bug jam).  We figure some of the people would find the former much more useful, given the audience.
[06:34] <tritium> GBJ = Global Bug Jam?
[06:34] <Flannel> Yeah
[06:34] <tritium> Sweet.
[06:35] <tritium> Sounds like something I would like to attend.
[06:35] <Flannel> We're not exactly a large team.  I'm pleasantly surprised at how its turning out.  Since when we heard GBJ was that weekend, we figured we'd just write it off.  And then Jorge volunteered us, heh.  But it should all be good.
[06:36] <tritium> :)
[06:36] <tritium> Jorge the Gnome developer?
[06:37] <Flannel> Mr Castro, one of the key evangelists of the GBJ (the others being mumbach and jono)
[06:37] <tritium> Ah, yes.
[06:38] <tritium> Bed time.  Have a good night, Flannel.
[06:39] <Flannel> night tritium
[07:59] <Myrtti> good morning
[08:35] <jussi01> no, no, its not a good morning. grrrrrrr
[08:36] <Nafallo> morning
[08:37] <Myrtti> jussi01: my ankle doesn't feel *that* bad, so it's fairly good one
[08:38] <Myrtti> I managed to walk to the bathroom without too much cussing
[08:38] <jussi01> :)
[09:00] <Tm_T> hrrr
[09:02] <elky> Myrtti, whaddidyado?
[09:03] <Myrtti> I just fell on my face in Brussels, didn't look where I was going
[09:03] <Myrtti> my right knee is all scabby and my left ankle swollen
[09:03] <Myrtti> http://www.flickr.com/photos/myrtti/3263950771/
[09:03] <tonyyarusso> Flannel: last I checked LjL was behind the floodbots.
[09:17]  * elky cuddles Myrtti's owies better
[09:46] <prince_jammys> banisterfiend in #ubuntu, being an ass, sexually propositioning women
[09:46] <prince_jammys> adios.
[10:11] <ikonia> panarchy in #ubuntu offtopic
[10:12] <ikonia> @bansearch panarchy
[11:05] <bazhang> gordon just does not get it
[11:10] <topyli> looks like his mind is all made up
[11:11] <bazhang> I was talking about the legal authorities, not people's parents.
[11:13] <topyli> i don't think he cares, the point is to prove elky wrong. that's the whole mission, the discussion itself is rather moot
[11:13] <Myrtti> gordonjcp is an old regular user, been gone for quite a while on other channels and complained there about our rules etc...
[11:13] <bazhang> yep
[11:13] <Myrtti> I don't know what has brought him back
[11:14] <elky> he's peeved because i have something to back up what i say. 
[11:14] <elky> Myrtti, step inside that certain Other Channel for a bit. you'll understand all too quickly
[11:14] <Myrtti> elky: you mean That Other Channel? I've not been there, I've been #elsewhere and seen him complain there
[11:15] <Myrtti> I've not been #elsewhere since September myself
[11:16] <Myrtti> but I need to get my laptop packed and go to a meeting at the clients
[11:17] <elky> much hugs. dont break or bruise any new parts
[11:18] <Myrtti> I'll try not to. The roads are slippery :-/
[11:39] <Tm_T> hugs, kids
[11:41] <bazhang>  [kewlsaltyfries] (n=hamburge@59.183.57.130): FAIL TROLL TROLL TROL FAIL FAIL FAIL FAIL TROLL <-- wonder who that could be
[13:24] <jussi01> tonyyarusso: that failvid is _so_ wrong...
[17:17] <Myrtti> OMG I AM SO TIRED
[17:18] <Myrtti> I'm borderlining hysteria
[17:20] <Pici> :(
[17:28] <Myrtti> opinions about the offtopic blabber at #u?
[17:48] <Myrtti> ok, I can't babysit #ubuntu now
[17:48] <Myrtti> am too tired
[17:48] <Pici> I'll try to keep an eye on it, but I need to run to a meeting in 15 minutes -_-
[19:07]  * Pici sighs
[19:13] <topyli> maybe i'll just remove it before the younglings get too excited
[19:13] <topyli> our youngsters, that is
[19:16] <Pici> I was concidering muting mikem for feeding earlier.
[19:17] <topyli> oh i don't even know what to do with him
[19:18] <topyli> he's so paranoid i'm beginning to be afraid it's specifically me that's haunting him
[19:27] <Pici> Gotta run to another -_- meeting. 
[20:20] <jpds> OK; who fell asleep on the power button?
[20:30]  * Seeker` points to jussi01!!
[20:34] <stefg> someone watch Oni in #ubuntu please... he's asking for a kickban
[21:10] <Jack_Sparrow> @login
[21:10] <Jack_Sparrow> @btlogin
[21:40] <nickrud_> new high in generic questions:  "I can't use this OS"
[21:43] <Seeker`> nickrud_: I'll think you'll find that isn't a question
[21:43] <nickrud_> was in response to what !ask
[21:43] <nickrud_> that's one reason it ranks so very highly ;)
[22:10] <nickrud_> I wish stefg was right; just by longevity I'd have probably a few tens of thousand dollar bills
[22:10] <ikonia> @mark #ubuntu ^hashbang% being a bit noisey with random chatter, has an attitude in pm
[22:11] <ikonia> @mark #ubuntu ^hashbang^ being a bit noisey with random chatter, has an attitude in pm
[22:13] <Myrtti> I already mentioned his chatter earlier to him
[22:13] <ikonia> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/116215/
[22:13] <ikonia> quite frustrating
[22:14] <ikonia> reply to everything "chill out"
[22:14] <ikonia> in channel and in pm
[22:17] <ikonia> also could I remind everyone who's active to cast a glance over these old / uncommented bans in BT I'm planning to clear them out unless people recognise any and say "stop", they are all old and a lot dynamic ranges
[22:17] <ikonia> http://alesi.projecthugo.co.uk/banlist.txt
[22:17] <nickrud_> ikonia, I have none that I haven't dealt with
[22:17] <Myrtti> two first, don't take off
[22:18] <Myrtti> *!*@martha.stuart.is.gonna.innovateyour.com either
[22:18] <ikonia> Myrtti: removing from the list
[22:18] <ikonia> thank you
[22:18] <nickrud_> now that sounds like an interesting person
[22:18] <Myrtti> how do I get the feeling that minicity*!*@* might be good to keep on the list as well
[22:18] <Myrtti> didn't we have those minicity spammers sometime in the past
[22:18] <ikonia> Myrtti: any doubt - I'll leave it alone
[22:19] <Myrtti> I somehow also get the idea smallfoot is a repeated offender
[22:19] <nickrud_> interesting that bullgard4 is on a ban list; I see him regularly.
[22:20] <ikonia> some of them are known problems, but I checked a lot with chanserv and some haven't been active for 6 months
[22:20] <ikonia> nickrud_: he's been banned in ubuntu and OT a few times
[22:20] <ikonia> nickrud_: nothing major, he just can't grasp ubuntu is not "linux" support
[22:20] <ikonia> he seems to have gotten a lot better
[22:21] <nickrud_> strange. he's odd, true. I would hesitate to diagnose by net, but I've dealt with him for years and never saw bad behavior
[22:21] <ikonia> nickrud_: it's not bad behaviour
[22:21] <ikonia> nickrud_: he just thinks #ubuntu is "linux" 
[22:21] <ikonia> nickrud_: eg: the header blah blah, is built into X, why does X use this header
[22:22] <ikonia> nickrud_: or why does the kernel contain blah, I don't see a need for it
[22:22] <ikonia> but normally a lot of questions of that nature
[22:22] <ikonia> his behaviour is certainly not bad, just on occasion can be distruptive
[22:23] <nickrud_> I guess I started with him when things weren't quite so busy and the channel tightened up. Sorta like the frog in the water on the stove
[22:23] <ikonia> nickrud_: he's really gotten on top of it, I think he just gets frustrated when ##linux doesn't answer quick enough for him so comes to here where he knows there will be X people active and more odds of someone having a clue
[22:23] <nickrud_> you're right about the general trend of his questions though
[22:24] <ikonia> Myrtti: removed from the list, thank you
[22:24] <nickrud_> for me it's usually a pleasure to see him: his questions are phrased well, and he researches the answer you give :)
[22:25] <ikonia> nickrud_: yes, he certainly listens, I enjoy some of the discussions in ##linux with him
[22:25] <ikonia> just really can't start letting "linux support" become his core resource for ubuntu
[22:25] <ikonia> opens the gates for everyeone
[22:25] <ikonia> at the start he had a problem getting his head around it, but seems fine now
[22:25] <ikonia> (I've not seen him do it for a long time)
[22:25] <nickrud_> not arguing with that. Just a matter of 'used to' for me and him
[22:25] <nickrud_> 'gotten used to'
[22:26] <ikonia> if the channels dead, I don't normally pick up on it, but normally it's when it's full flow
[22:27] <nickrud_> that's not as easy as it used to be, that's for sure. Seldom slows down now
[22:27] <ikonia> yes, very rare
[22:27] <ikonia> it's nice that it's busy more than not though
[22:28] <nickrud_> so, does that count as a ban evasion (which is where I was intending to go, but got sidetracked)
[22:28] <ikonia> @bansearch bullgard4
[22:28] <ikonia> nickrud_: I think I may have pasted a mark 
[22:28] <ikonia> rather than a ban for him
[22:28] <ikonia> or a ban that was removed
[22:28] <ikonia> nickrud_: I'm far from a perfect copier
[22:29] <nickrud_> ah, that's good :)
[23:40] <genii> Jack_Sparrow: I'm not quite sure if the car PC guy is trolling
[23:41] <Jack_Sparrow> yes. trolling and about to get the boot
[23:46] <nickrud_> we should keep a couple pet trolls around, so we have a scale to kick by
[23:46] <bazhang> hehe
[23:46]  * nickrud_ trolls ;)
[23:46] <bazhang> one sken = ??
[23:46] <nickrud_> is that measurable?
[23:47] <bazhang> true
[23:48] <nickrud_> interesting, xchat actually crashed
[23:48] <genii> Maybe it has anti-trolling protection
[23:49] <nickrud_> heh. a useful addition. Should have a toggle though