[12:06] <dholbach> HEYA!
[12:06] <dholbach> sorry for being ... a bit late :)
[12:06]  * dholbach hugs y'all
[12:06] <dholbach> thanks bac for reminding me
[12:06] <dholbach> who's here for some bug jam loving?
[12:06] <bac> me
[12:06]  * pedro_ waves
[12:07] <dholbach> hey pedro_
[12:07] <dholbach> I just pinged the folks in #ubuntu-locoteams
[12:07] <dholbach> let's wait another 2-3 minutes
[12:07] <dholbach> hi somaunn
[12:07] <dholbach> hiya mnemo
[12:08] <mnemo> howdy :)
[12:08]  * Rafik_ is here
[12:08] <dholbach> alrighty... shall we start with a quick round of introductions?
[12:09] <dholbach> who's who and which loco are you from?
[12:09]  * dholbach is Daniel Holbach and from the Berlin team, Germany
[12:10]  * bac is brad crittenden from the North Carolina, US loco
[12:10]  * pedro_ is Pedro Villavicencio from the Chilean LoCo team
[12:10] <dholbach> hiya _marx_
[12:10]  * Rafik is Rafik Ouerchefani, from Tunisia.
[12:11] <dholbach> come on guys... don't be shy :)
[12:11]  * _marx_ Mark Cox US-NC team
[12:12] <mnemo> martin olsson from gothenburg, sweden originally.. living in copenhagen though..
[12:12]  * _marx_ has to go to work so I'm logging this session
[12:12] <dholbach> hiya barcc_
[12:12] <dholbach> alrighty...
[12:12]  * _marx_ is away: at  work
[12:12] <dholbach> how far have you guys got with organising your global bug jam session?
[12:14] <dholbach> fortunately in Berlin we have a venue we can use for this kind of events, we just need to still pick a day (saturday or sunday) and announce it properly
[12:14] <dholbach> how are you guys doing?
[12:15] <bac> we've got an excellent venue and about 8-10 people coming
[12:15] <bac> all first timers, including me
[12:15] <dholbach> bac: wow, nice - did you have any trouble organising it?
[12:16] <bac> no.  we have a local for-profit "co-working" site that let's sprint, etc use the space.  large conference room, projector, free wifi, lots of power outlets.  it rocks.
[12:16] <dholbach> hi emmajane
[12:17] <dholbach> bac: cool - how did you go about announcing it and reaching out?
[12:17] <emmajane> dholbach, hello :)
[12:17] <bac> so far just on the mailing list and IRC chats
[12:18] <dholbach> cool
[12:18] <dholbach> I was interested because I know that in the past a few teams have talked to LUGs in the area or even put up posters in book shops
[12:19] <dholbach> how about everybody else?
[12:20] <dholbach> does anybody have questions already?
[12:21] <dholbach> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RunningBugJam#Material has a good bunch of material about how to run bug jams, but I realise that it might not be "everything" :)
[12:21] <dholbach> so... ask :)
[12:22] <bac> dholbach: how about if you start at the beginning.  what should be the goal for a loco group bugjam?
[12:23]  * bac hasn't read through the materials yet. sorry.
[12:23] <dholbach> right
[12:23] <dholbach> the goal for the bug jam should only be: bring people together and have fun working directly on Ubuntu
[12:24] <dholbach> even if you guys don't get to "fixing bugs" a few clever questions or reassigning some bugs is a good start
[12:24] <dholbach> if you have a lot of fun together, even better
[12:24] <dholbach> there's always a few things you need to organise: a venue, have a good announcement and preparing the session itself
[12:25] <dholbach> if you can't find a venue and you're just a few people, you can even do it at your house, just ask everybody to bring a few snacks :-)
[12:26] <dholbach> pedro_: want to talk a bit about how we can help newcomers to have a good start with bug triage?
[12:26] <pedro_> sure
[12:27] <pedro_> one of the issues that we have encounter here while organizing the bug jams
[12:27] <pedro_> is that new triagers doesn't really know where to start
[12:28] <pedro_> ok we have launchpad accounts, bugs, internet connection, etc so where to next?
[12:29] <pedro_> what you can do first is a little talk about bug status
[12:30] <pedro_> what triaged means, what's the difference between fix released and fix committed, etc
[12:30] <pedro_> you're probably going to have a few questions regarding that
[12:30] <dholbach> ther material section I talked about earlier has a presentation in English (and Spanish) that can help you with that
[12:31] <pedro_> and it's pretty important to get to know those things before doing any change on the reports ;-)
[12:31] <dholbach> hehe :)
[12:31] <pedro_> yes there's a pretty good presentation about it, so please review it and if you have comments from the audience take some notes and then add them as a feedback to the page
[12:31] <pedro_> or send them to us
[12:32] <dholbach> one point that's really important about it is: try to make it all about people doing good work together and actually themselves trying to learn the ropes
[12:32] <dholbach> it might be boring to stand 3-5 hours in front of an audience who is expecting a demo / talk, etc.
[12:32] <dholbach> it help if you prepared a list of bugs you want the team to look at or something
[12:32] <dholbach> and let them try
[12:33] <dholbach> so move away from the front of the audience early :)
[12:33] <pedro_> yes yes
[12:34] <pedro_> well regarding targets what'd i suggest for start doing some triage is start with the bugs without a package
[12:34] <pedro_> trust me we have *quite* a lot of that
[12:34] <dholbach> hehe
[12:34] <dholbach> do we have any questions about that already?
[12:35] <pedro_> from where do you get the list of those bugs? :-)
[12:37] <pedro_> at the GBJ page there's a list of easy tasks if you go there you'll see at the top of the list the one for the bugs without a package with even an example
[12:37] <dholbach> Rafik, pedro_, bac, _marx_: do you have any tips you can share?
[12:39] <pedro_> well here what we do is create bug lists (with bugnumbers) for people to work on based on the ones from the easy tasks page
[12:39] <pedro_> and we work on them like announcing the bug number in which you're working on so other people can skip that one
[12:40] <pedro_> that works fine for us at least
[12:40] <Rafik> [Question] if we don't have a really experienced person in the team, where to ask for help if we unsure about something ? (#ubuntu-bugs, find a mentor on videoconf, ..)
[12:41] <dholbach> #ubuntu-bugs is definitely a good answer there
[12:42] <dholbach> if you can help people to ask their own questions in the bigger team you help them a lot already
[12:43] <dholbach> any other questions=?
[12:44] <bac> i have a question from reading https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs about package organization in LP
[12:45] <bac> it says each package in ubuntu has a bugs page in LP
[12:45] <bac> but, looking for bugs for 'initscript' for a friend, i see it doesn't exist.
[12:46] <bac> er, 'initscripts', i mean
[12:46] <pedro_> isn't that sysvinit ?
[12:47] <bac> pedro, yes, but the package name, as shown by dpkg, is initscripts.  so is there not a 1:1 matching?
[12:47] <soren> bac: All *source* packages have a bug page. Each source package might generate multiple (differently named) binary packages.
[12:47] <bac> soren: ah, right.  thanks
[12:48] <soren> sysvinit, for instance, generates all of these: sysvinit, sysvinit-utils, sysv-rc, initscripts, sysvutils
[12:48] <bac> soren: and how does one find the source package for a given binary package?
[12:49] <soren> bac: "apt-cache show initscripts" shows info about the binary package.
[12:49] <bac> excellent
[12:49] <soren> Among other things, it has a "Source: " field.
[12:49] <soren> That's what you want.
[12:50] <bac> dholbach: i think the materials on the wiki are very thorough and will be a great primer for our loco to do our first bug jam.
[12:51] <dholbach> super
[12:51] <dholbach> maybe you can ask the guys if they have interest in doing another one
[12:51] <dholbach> I'm going to write up my experiences with the regular bug jams in berlin later today and send it to loco-contacts
[12:53] <dholbach> do we have any open questions? everybody clear on how to proceed?
[12:53] <dholbach> everybody added themselves and their teams to  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/GlobalBugJam ?
[12:53] <dholbach> all friends invited?
[12:53] <dholbach> poked a few people from other locos already? :)
[12:54] <bac> dholbach: how often does the berlin loco do bugjams?  what kind of turnout do you have?
[12:54] <dholbach> bac: every two weeks
[12:54] <dholbach> it's very different every time :)
[12:54] <dholbach> we had events with 15 people, we have jams with 4
[12:55] <dholbach> we sometimes had really new people who had never heard of launchpad before
[12:55] <dholbach> we sometimes even manage to patch packages
[12:55] <dholbach> I promise to write up my experiences later today :)
[12:55] <dholbach> the most important thing is really making only very little about giving talks
[12:56] <bac> dholbach: how long do you generally meet?
[12:57] <dholbach> ~3h
[12:57] <dholbach> some people wanted to extend it and we're thinking about it
[12:58] <bac> thanks for the chat dholbach and pedro_.  it was helpful.
[12:59] <dholbach> great :)
[12:59] <dholbach> I so look forward to Global Bug Jam
[12:59] <dholbach> it's going ot be great
[12:59] <dholbach> Rafik: do you have everything planned yourself already?
[12:59] <pedro_> yeah can't wait ;-)
[13:02] <Rafik> dholbach> I tried to talk to friends and people around here. Many are very interested but don't know what bug triage is. I hope that this first experience will a least let the people know about how it works
[13:02] <dholbach> Rafik: sounds good - so you have everything set up already?
[13:03] <Rafik> I hope so. There is also a talk about having some people from others cities over internet
[13:04] <pleia2> Rafik: that's not a bad idea :) I think I'll suggest that here too
[13:05] <dholbach> nice
[13:07] <Rafik> There is also an idea : If we ensure a good number of attendees, we'll maybe ask in #ubuntu-bugs if someone with more experience could assist us
[13:07] <dholbach> sure... do ask!
[13:07] <dholbach> shall we continue in #ubuntu-locoteams?
[13:08] <Rafik> ok
[13:09] <dholbach> thanks everybody!
[13:09] <pedro_> thanks you
[13:10] <Rafik> thank you
[14:06] <YoBoY> hi, i missed the classroom :( (again)
[23:44] <jcastro> 15 minutes warning!
[23:47] <nhandler> I'm ready
[23:51] <jacob> what a great way to start the UNIX new year: bugjam! :P
[23:58] <jcastro> Happy 1234567890 everyone!
[23:58] <jcastro> we'll give it a few more minutes just in case people are running late