[00:00] <dtchen> i've been tracking jaunty steadily, and i always regression test my changes on several machines, so i'm a bit perplexed at the consolekit error
[00:01] <dtchen> the only other instance of anything similar was FS corruption on the reporter's machine that hosed module-console-kit.so
[00:03] <fta> it's commented
[00:04] <BUGabundo_> asac: http://paste.ubuntu.com/117889
[00:04] <fta> the consolekit error is from my other desktop, at work, it occurs when i was not even in front of it, it was locked
[00:06] <asac> BUGabundo_: please not in here, but in the bugs
[00:06] <asac> in the appropriate please
[00:06] <asac> also include your ppp version
[00:06] <asac> if you havent done so yet
[00:06] <BUGabundo_> done too
[00:06] <BUGabundo_> i did
[00:07] <BUGabundo_> please look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+bug/329228
[00:07] <BUGabundo_> ppp:   Installed: 2.4.5~git20081126t100229-0ubuntu1~nm1
[00:07] <asac> BUGabundo_: can you try to downgrade?
[00:08] <BUGabundo_> sure
[00:08] <asac> to the jaunty or intrepid version
[00:08] <asac> BUGabundo_: /usr/sbin/pppd: invalid numeric parameter 'n' for kdebug option
[00:08] <asac> dont downgrade
[00:08] <BUGabundo_> downgrading now
[00:08] <asac> you probably have a syntax error in options
[00:08] <BUGabundo_> bagh
[00:09] <asac> look for kdebug or something
[00:09] <asac> you probably messed that up ;)
[00:09] <asac> BUGabundo_: #kdebug n
[00:09] <asac> thats the wrong option
[00:09] <BUGabundo_> line 184: kdebug n
[00:09] <BUGabundo_> let me comment it
[00:09] <asac> its just "debug"
[00:09] <asac> BUGabundo_: just use "debug"
[00:09] <BUGabundo_> okay
[00:09] <asac> without parameter
[00:09] <BUGabundo_> done
[00:10] <asac> its a few lines above
[00:10] <asac> BUGabundo_: get log again then
[00:10] <BUGabundo_> okay
[00:10] <asac> serial and syslog
[00:10] <BUGabundo_> upgradying ppp and nm-pptp again
[00:10] <asac> probably serial is in syslog too
[00:10] <asac> yeah
[00:11]  * BUGabundo_ bafles: he is on borrow 3G card with only 1GiBs bw
[00:11] <BUGabundo_> brb
[00:11] <BUGabundo_> time to debug
[00:11] <BUGabundo_> asac: i had to kill NM twice
[00:11] <BUGabundo_> the first didnt kill it
[00:11] <asac> BUGabundo_: better reboot then
[00:11] <asac> drivewr might be in bad state
[00:11] <fta> is there an applet to have more info about my connection? something more than the dumb n-m default applet
[00:11] <asac> if things lock up
[00:12] <BUGabundo_> rebooting
[00:12] <asac> fta: about 3g connection?
[00:12] <BUGabundo_> asac: with or wutout PIN?
[00:13] <asac> BUGabundo_: with PIN for now
[00:13] <asac> and without if that doesnt work
[00:13] <fta> asac, yes
[00:13] <asac> fta: well. drivers are different for things that go beyond basic features
[00:13] <asac> fta: thats why modemmanager was created
[00:14] <asac> it currently has signal strength feature
[00:14] <asac> but more can be added for each individual modem
[00:14] <BUGabundo_> wull nm08 be packed any time soon?
[00:14] <asac> fta: you need a modemmanager enabled build for that
[00:14] <asac> i have not yet decided if i do that next week or wait with mm for next cycle
[00:15] <BUGabundo_> on a new PPA or NM PPA with epoch?
[00:15] <fta> is it in a ppa ? something at least slightly tested ;)
[00:15] <BUGabundo_> oh great.... metacity just blew after reboot
[00:15] <asac> BUGabundo_: use ppa
[00:15] <BUGabundo_> should afect my debug
[00:16] <asac> fta: you can try the packages in ~modemmanager ppa
[00:16] <BUGabundo_> brb
[00:16]  * fta updating his laptop...
[00:16] <asac> fta: but but but
[00:16] <asac> those are a bit busted. bit give it a try. its the old snapshot from intrepid still
[00:16] <fta> Get:257 http://archive.ubuntu.com jaunty/universe openarena-data 0.8.1-1 [306MB] beuhhh
[00:16] <asac> yeah
[00:17] <fta> bad over 3G
[00:17] <fta> fortunately, it's wired now
[00:18] <fta> is archive.ubuntu.com rate limiting the connections?
[00:19] <asac> not sure ... tcp has constraints on its own
[00:19] <fta> I have a flat 830KB/s
[00:19] <asac> ask Nafallo maybe
[00:19] <asac> but i think its mirrored too
[00:19] <asac> and round-robin or something
[00:19] <fta> that's 6.9Mb/s, i can do a lot more
[00:19] <asac> well ... what ping do you have?
[00:20] <fta> during dl? probably bad
[00:20] <fta> 90ms
[00:21] <asac> no ... i mean in general
[00:21] <asac> i am not sure how the limit for tcp depending on ping, but there is a correlation
[00:21] <asac> try multiple connections
[00:21] <fta> let me finish my 680M upgrade
[00:22] <fta> asac, lol, you remember i'm a network engineer, right?
[00:23] <asac> so what is the max througput for tcp with ping 200ms with default settings on ubuntu jaunty ;)
[00:23] <BUGabundo_> back
[00:23] <BUGabundo_> uploading new logs to bug
[00:23] <fta> asac, I can do a lot more between home and my other boxes at work
[00:24] <asac> fta: how is the ping?
[00:24] <asac> i mean i have 63ms to archive and get about the same
[00:24] <asac> the german mirror i use has 40-38ms and i get 1M
[00:24] <asac> (vs 800)
[00:25] <BUGabundo_> asac: bug 329228 updated
[00:25] <fta> asac, 8ms from work, and 30ms from home
[00:25] <asac> fta: see ;)
[00:25] <fta> but that's not enough to explain that
[00:25] <asac> so if you have 60 you might have double power 2 aka factor 4 ;) ;)
[00:26] <asac> Max. Throughput = TCP Window Size / Round-trip time.
[00:27] <BUGabundo_> my ping average with this 3G card, passing through a winXP box is 108ms
[00:27] <asac> he Max TCP Window size in the absence of window scaling is 65 535 bytes.
[00:27] <asac> Example: Max Bandwidth = 65535 bytes / 0.220 s = 297886.36 bytes/s = 2.38 Mbit/s.
[00:27] <asac> well ... but is the tcp window on over internet connections more like the mtu?
[00:27] <asac> e.g. 1500?
[00:27] <BUGabundo_> gogle's pings are way worse: 362ms
[00:29] <fta> wget http://ftp.debian.org/debian/pool/main/o/openarena-data/openarena-data_0.8.1-1_all.deb
[00:29] <fta> ~811K/s,
[00:31] <fta> it's 240ms away from works, and 45ms from home (!?? wtf)
[00:31] <fta> -s
[00:31] <fta>  8  surfnet-gw2.amd.cw.net (195.2.21.6)  18.631 ms  18.624 ms  18.594 ms
[00:31] <fta>  9  AE1.500.JNR01.Asd001A.surf.net (145.145.80.70)  240.634 ms  240.414 ms  240.630 ms
[00:31] <fta> booo
[00:31] <asac> 60 mS   8,658 Kbps
[00:32] <asac> http://www.babinszki.com/Networking/Max-Ethernet-and-TCP-Throughput.html
[00:33] <asac> this table seems to be a bit odd ;)
[00:33] <asac> but if its really for gigabit
[00:33] <fta> but i do 6.9Mb/s with 30ms
[00:33] <asac> then 69Ms seems to be 8.6 Mb/s
[00:33] <asac> fta: yes, but the window size in that table is optimal
[00:34] <asac> for 65k windows
[00:34] <asac> i dont think you get that on internet
[00:34] <asac> but the numbers look low still
[00:34] <asac> well ... the 0.1ms looks right
[00:34] <BUGabundo_> asac: do u need anything else?
[00:34] <asac> almost 1000 Mb
[00:34] <BUGabundo_> before i go to bed?
[00:34] <fta> apt-get fist-upgrade
[00:34] <fta> E: Invalid operation fist-upgrade
[00:34] <fta> :)
[00:34] <asac> BUGabundo_: lets loook
[00:35] <asac> hehe
[00:35] <asac> ;)
[00:35] <asac> BUGabundo_: why applet log? (what is that)
[00:35] <BUGabundo_> well for some reason it died when i killed NM
[00:36] <BUGabundo_> so i started it from cli
[00:36] <asac> BUGabundo_: hmm ... ppp isnt debug ?
[00:36] <BUGabundo_> humm i set the option
[00:36] <BUGabundo_> as u said
[00:36]  * BUGabundo_ checks
[00:37] <asac> BUGabundo_: oh
[00:37] <BUGabundo_> yep
[00:37] <BUGabundo_> debug is NOT comment
[00:37] <BUGabundo_> on /etc/ppp/options
[00:37] <asac> BUGabundo_: you didnt upgrade network-manager from ppa?
[00:37] <asac> BUGabundo_: thats jaunty?
[00:37] <BUGabundo_> i didnt change networ-manager
[00:37] <asac> BUGabundo_: your problem is that you have incompatible ppp plugin
[00:37] <BUGabundo_> just ppp and then again up
[00:38] <asac> BUGabundo_: you need to upgrade to everything you get on ppa
[00:38] <asac> thats network-manager and -pptp plugin and pppd
[00:38] <BUGabundo_> ppp is PPA
[00:38] <asac> yes
[00:38] <asac> all three are ppa
[00:38] <BUGabundo_> isnt
[00:38] <asac> they have to together
[00:38] <BUGabundo_> its from archive
[00:38] <BUGabundo_> PPA and arc have same version
[00:38] <BUGabundo_> so archive is prefered
[00:39] <asac> BUGabundo_: oh i forgot the main network-manager
[00:39] <asac> too bad
[00:39] <BUGabundo_> everything else _should_ be using PPA
[00:39] <asac> BUGabundo_: yeah thats my fault then finally ;)
[00:39] <asac> i think i forgot to push
[00:40] <BUGabundo_> humm
[00:40] <BUGabundo_> ok
[00:40] <asac> its ppp, -pptp and network-manager that needed a respin
[00:40] <BUGabundo_> humm those are all PPA
[00:40] <BUGabundo_> only NM is archive
[00:40] <asac> BUGabundo_: yeah. because i didnt bump in ppa ... which i thought i did
[00:40] <asac> BUGabundo_: i am uploading that now
[00:40] <BUGabundo_> np
[00:40] <asac> so tomorrow morngin it should work
[00:41]  * BUGabundo_ awan
[00:41] <asac> BUGabundo_: so you could downgrade ppp and -pptp
[00:41] <asac> or sleep and see tomorrow
[00:41] <BUGabundo_> please comment on the bug (maybe fix release?)
[00:41] <BUGabundo_> when pack have been build
[00:41] <BUGabundo_> ill see if i can hold on to the donge a few more hours
[00:42] <BUGabundo_> but have to get somewhere to do all this downloads
[00:42] <asac> BUGabundo_: i think 40 minutes till .debs are there
[00:42] <BUGabundo_> ok
[00:42] <BUGabundo_> then tomorrow should be fine
[00:42] <BUGabundo_> so should i go ALL PPA?
[00:42] <BUGabundo_> or archive?
[00:42] <BUGabundo_> i got lost
[00:43] <asac> BUGabundo_: just keep ppa in sources.list
[00:43] <asac> and run dist-upgrade
[00:43] <BUGabundo_> okay
[00:44] <asac> i will not upload stuff you shouldnt get to that archive
[00:44] <asac> so thats usually the safe way
[00:44] <BUGabundo_> did u check that kernel trace?
[00:44] <asac> (note: but just for this archive ... there might be other ppas that are maintained differently)
[00:44] <BUGabundo_> it mentioned comm something
[00:44] <BUGabundo_> not sure NM has something to do with it
[00:44] <asac> BUGabundo_: kernel trace is a dupe i think. dont have time to look up
[00:44] <asac> BUGabundo_: you should find a bug against linux if you search for "Tainted"
[00:44] <BUGabundo_> one more?
[00:45] <BUGabundo_> i filed 3 of those every release!
[00:45] <BUGabundo_> ehehe
[00:45] <asac> BUGabundo_: no ... read!
[00:45] <asac> "find" != "file" ;)
[00:45] <asac> BUGabundo_: oh so you know the other bugs
[00:45] <BUGabundo_> yep
[00:45] <asac> have those been closed?
[00:45] <BUGabundo_> thats what i'm saying
[00:45] <BUGabundo_> one at least was
[00:45] <BUGabundo_> with interpid backports
[00:46] <asac> well ... then look if the bug is still open
[00:46] <BUGabundo_> one from jaunty not sure... but have seen it in a whyle
[00:46] <asac> if not reassign the current one to linux and subscribe ogasawara
[00:46] <BUGabundo_> diferent stack
[00:46] <BUGabundo_> looks qute diferent from the previous
[00:46] <asac> ok
[00:46] <BUGabundo_> yean Leann seems to prefer diferent bugs
[00:46] <asac> i will look then at some point ;)
[00:46] <BUGabundo_> and not Dupes
[00:47] <BUGabundo_> one more thing
[00:47] <BUGabundo_> and did nt mention this on the bug
[00:47] <BUGabundo_> the new 3G assistant SUCKs
[00:47] <BUGabundo_> ibex version detect my Country
[00:47] <BUGabundo_> Jaunty shows the complete list, and i cant just start typeing
[00:48] <BUGabundo_> have to use mouse to scroll down
[00:49] <asac> BUGabundo_: is there a bug for that yet against libmbca0?
[00:49]  * BUGabundo_ heads to bed
[00:49] <asac> sure
[00:49] <BUGabundo_> didnt even new that package
[00:49] <BUGabundo_> let see if the respin of packages changes something
[00:49] <BUGabundo_> if not, i'll ping u back to get the package name, and i'll file it
[00:49] <asac> ok
[00:49]  * BUGabundo_ has lousy memory
[00:50] <BUGabundo_> i finished the test on ubufox
[00:50] <BUGabundo_> not sure if u read the comments
[00:50] <BUGabundo_> both 3.0 and 3.1 are fixed
[00:50] <BUGabundo_> and i can change my toolbar at will
[00:50] <BUGabundo_> but 2 new bugs were found
[00:50] <BUGabundo_> not on LP yet
[00:51] <BUGabundo_> need to test a bit more
[00:51] <BUGabundo_> anything else, ping me, email me, or dent me
[00:52] <BUGabundo_> good night guys
[00:54] <asac> thanks BUGabundo_
[00:54] <asac> good night
[00:58] <fta> asac, when i disconnect and unplug the usb key, n-m never realizes that the key is gone, so it remains in the list
[01:06] <fta> asac, http://paste.ubuntu.com/117894/
[01:38] <asac> fta: is that with ppp 2.4.5 ?
[01:38] <asac> oh right ;) ... not all bits are there yet
[01:38] <fta> jaunty
[01:38] <asac> maybe try the packages from nm ppa
[01:38] <asac> ppp had some issues that caused stability problems
[01:38] <fta> 2.4.4rel-10ubuntu3
[01:38] <asac> and a bunch are fixed in the package in ~network-manager ppa
[01:38] <asac> yes. 2.4.4 is two years old
[01:39] <fta> two SIMs, one is always fine, the other worked for a while and is now always broken
[01:39] <asac> but you need ppp and the respun nm and nm-pptp (if you use that)
[01:39] <asac> fta: different net provider?
[01:40] <fta> nope, same
[01:40] <fta> orange france for both
[01:40] <asac> fta: using broadband wizard?
[01:40] <fta> in the same usb key
[01:40] <fta> jsut switching sims
[01:41] <asac> fta: have you checked in serial log that NM sends correct pin?
[01:41] <asac> dont know how smart nm is about forgetting and detecting sim changes
[01:41] <fta> yes, it's 0000 on both, on purpose
[01:42] <fta> until i figure out what's wrong, that is
[01:43] <asac> fta: this looks like a problem at ppp negoation
[01:43] <asac> which happens after pin and so on
[01:43] <fta> yes
[01:43] <asac> not sure if you could get that far if you ignore errors up front
[01:43] <asac> trying new ppp might be worth it
[01:44] <asac> could be that one sim ends up on a different server
[01:44] <asac> and the protocol is differnt
[01:44] <asac> but you should check the serial output as on wiki
[01:44] <asac> to be sure there are no ignored issues up front
[01:45] <fta> serial output? wiki?
[01:45] <asac> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingNetworkManager#Serial Log (Mobile Broadband)
[01:45] <asac> there you see the modem commands
[01:45] <asac> and replies from modem
[01:46] <fta> that's what i did
[01:47] <asac> yes then check the serial output ... that should be before what you posted
[01:48] <asac> e.g. is correct APN set ... is correct PIN set ... are there any complains and NM just continues with ppp
[01:48] <asac> but well. try new packages from ~network-manager PPA first
[01:48] <asac> ppp caused many issues for lots of users... which is why i rebased all those patches
[01:48] <asac> for me it made stuff more reliable too ;)
[01:49] <asac> i mean, i got similar issues with the old ppp ... not just 100% of time
[01:49] <asac> but sometimes it was really really hard to connect at all
[01:49] <asac> while at other times it just worked
[01:50] <asac> hmm ... probably have to wait till  network-manager - 0.7-0ubuntu2~nm1  is finished in ppa
[01:50] <asac> then you can just upgrade to that
[01:50] <asac> ppa
[01:50] <asac> with ppp new
[01:50] <fta> all the same for both, everything's fine, OK everywhere, nothing unexpected
[01:51] <asac> yeah. this sounds like ppp then
[01:51] <asac> also if you ever touched /etc/ppp/options for anything else than the debug flag
[01:51] <asac> revert those changes
[01:52] <fta> nothing, just debug
[01:52] <asac> yeah wait for 2.4.5 then
[01:53] <asac> sleep a few hours and upgrade to ~network-manager PPA
[01:53] <fta> i should probably call my isp (my own company btw) but if i say linux or ubuntu, i'll get nowhere
[01:54] <fta> and i have no windows or mac to test with
[01:54] <asac> well ... give the new ppp a try ;)
[01:55] <asac> as i said there are bugs fixed that we couldnt get fixed through individual cherry picks in intrepid
[01:55] <fta> let me know when something is ready then
[01:56] <asac> fta: its ready when the current build is done ;)
[01:56] <asac> https://edge.launchpad.net/~network-manager/+archive/ppa just upgrade in the morning ;)
[01:56] <asac> i just forgot to upload the NM ;) ... ppp and -pptp are done since 3 days
[01:57] <asac> sleep for a bit
[01:58] <asac> cu tomoroow ... hopefully i find the time to see whats going on with tbird
[01:59] <fta> ok, thanks. g'night
[02:42] <fta> no change, looks exactly the same, even after a reboot
[11:58] <BUGabundo> guud morning
[12:00] <gnomefreak> good morning
[12:00] <gnomefreak> mozilla 77811
[12:01] <gnomefreak> hmmmmmmm
[12:06] <gnomefreak> holy crap thats alot of people
[12:16] <gnomefreak> why do i get the feeling that it doesnt work with tb3 betas as it says but under long des. it states tb3 beta
[12:16] <gnomefreak> betas
[12:17] <gnomefreak> https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/thunderbird/addon/4433
[13:13] <fta> asac, debian bug 497701
[13:21] <gnomefreak> would i use DEBIAN_DATE to pull in SM 1.1.15 tarball? Its not been released yet but would like to work on it so once released just update it
[13:22] <gnomefreak> example ./debian/rules get-orig-source DEBIAN_DATE=dateinchangelog  or is m-d not been updated for pre-release 1.1.x
[13:24] <fta> sm1 is not using m-d, iirc, it has its own rules in the package
[13:25] <gnomefreak> ah ok thanks
[14:35] <asac> fta: didn you know that RFP bug? i am quite sure I suggested to take it as an ITP ;)
[14:36] <asac> retitle 497701 ITP: libv8 -- Google V8 JavaScript Engine
[14:36] <asac> owner 497701 !
[14:36] <asac> thanks
[14:36] <asac> that was what made him the owner
[14:36] <asac> 1st feb
[14:38] <fta> well
[14:38] <fta> he even said he used my patch
[14:40] <asac> fta: yes, but why not
[14:41] <asac> you didnt care about that bug so he took it ... i will send a mail to it now ;)
[14:41] <asac> fta: i mean: if you dont want that debian uses a complete different approach you have to join forces in debian ... i will suggest to make a debian team for that. you can of course object on that mail ;) ... its for now my idea
[14:43] <fta> i don't mind either way. i feel it will end-up like nss & nspr
[14:44] <asac> fta: please whatever you can do join the debian folks
[14:44] <asac> otherwise its a single point of failure
[14:44] <asac> and people will ask when you are on holiday: why not merge from debian ... why duplicate efforts.
[14:44] <asac> the problem is too often that folks on debian side dont want that
[14:44] <asac> the work for you is the same ... maintain it in dbian and get it synched here
[14:45] <asac> if they are strict against such a team or turn out to be not-cooperative then it makes sense to look diverging downstream in ubuntu
[14:46]  * asac off for travel
[14:46] <fta> it seems to late now, everything is different, either i give up or we diverge
[14:46] <asac> fta: its definitly not too late. i think they should go for your work
[14:47] <asac> but one has to make compromises for the sake of not diverging the whole stack imo
[14:47] <fta> let's wait for his answer then
[14:47] <asac> at least you have to try
[14:47] <asac> you didnt try in the bug imo
[14:47] <asac> but yeah. lets see
[14:48] <asac> who knows maybe he is not even a DD
[14:48] <asac> often folks claim ITPs and then get nothing done
[14:49] <asac> ok travelling a bit ... cu later
[14:50] <asac> oh shit the preview of the notification thing now pops up dialogs instead of actionful notifications
[14:50] <asac> guess that means i am supposed to fix annoyances
[14:50] <asac> now gone
[14:50] <fta> cu
[14:50] <fta> gone too
[16:00] <asac> now on GSM
[16:00] <asac> thats _SLOW_
[16:00] <asac> but i can still type over ssh in screen
[16:07] <asac> quite stable still ...  nice i survived the same place where i usually got disconnect
[16:07] <asac> with staying online
[16:07] <asac> and even logged into ssh
[16:07] <asac> well ... not even, but yes.
[17:50] <Cruster> is network manager supposed to connect to a configured wireless WPA secured network before login?
[17:54] <Cruster> asac: can I ask you something about networkmanager (they pointed me to you...)
[17:54] <BUGabundo> Cruster: I think it can do so, IF the option System is on
[17:55] <Cruster> BUGabundo: this option is grayed out for me...even if I run as root
[17:55]  * BUGabundo check local system
[17:56] <BUGabundo> bah its not even here anymore
[17:56] <BUGabundo> on the PPA version of NM
[17:56] <Cruster> BUGabundo: ok...I'll have to wait then...
[17:58] <BUGabundo> Cruster: you will have to wait for asac to come back, to be sure
[18:01] <asac> Cruster: its supposed to do that if you configure your connection as a system connection
[18:01] <asac> Cruster: never run as root
[18:01] <asac> that doesnt change a hing
[18:01] <asac> thing
[18:01] <asac> it could even create hazard
[18:02] <Cruster> asac: thanks for answering. This option is grayed out for me...
[18:02] <BUGabundo> is it UP ?
[18:02]  * asac wonders why its still common to think one can achieve anything with running root
[18:02] <BUGabundo> are you using it right now, ie is it connected?
[18:02] <asac> never ever run anything as root :)
[18:02] <BUGabundo> asac: sudo cow powers
[18:03] <Cruster> i was too desperate :P yes connection works uppon login
[18:03] <asac> Cruster: not sure what you mean by greyed out
[18:03] <Cruster> asac: I cannot tick the option "system connection"
[18:04] <asac> Cruster: what kind of connection are you trying to change?
[18:04] <asac> Cruster: what version are you running?
[18:04] <BUGabundo> asac: I don't have that option on ANY of my connections
[18:04] <BUGabundo> with NM from PPA
[18:04] <asac> Cruster: do you have the keyfile plugin enabled
[18:04] <Cruster> yes it is enabled
[18:04] <asac> BUGabundo: it was renamed in 0.7 final to "allow all users"
[18:04] <asac> or seomthing
[18:05] <asac> Cruster: dont try to change auto connections. create new ones and directly tick that instead
[18:05]  * BUGabundo remembers the time where wifi would even connect BEFORE X (misses wifi-radar)
[18:05] <BUGabundo> ahh
[18:05] <BUGabundo> can that be put on Release Notes?
[18:05] <Cruster> it does it for any connection, even for new ones
[18:05] <BUGabundo> should I file a bug and tag it to release notes?
[18:05] <asac> BUGabundo: not sure why ;)
[18:05] <BUGabundo> 'cause upgrading users will be looking for it!
[18:05] <asac> BUGabundo: i dont think that makes sense
[18:06] <asac> BUGabundo: UI regularly changes on new ubuntu version
[18:06] <BUGabundo> I was having that discussion with crisum on ubuntu-devel-discuss the other day
[18:06] <BUGabundo> devs change stuff and leave user to "discover"
[18:06] <Cruster> ops, forgot to tell you that I'm talking about KDE...
[18:06] <asac> Cruster: thats not my business then
[18:06] <asac> the knetworkmanager applet is major unfinished
[18:07] <asac> use the gnome nm-applet instead
[18:07] <asac> if you want proper networkmanager support on kde in intrepid
[18:07] <Cruster> i'm not even on intrepid, it's jaunty here...
[18:07] <asac> Cruster: plasmaoid network-manager?
[18:07] <asac> Cruster: file a bug
[18:07] <asac> but i will probably not deal with it
[18:07] <Cruster> i'll do it, thanks
[18:08] <Cruster> for everything
[18:08] <asac> i think there are now three different versions of kde network-manager applet
[18:08] <asac> and none is finished
[18:08] <asac> sorry. i can only suggest to use the gnome one
[18:08] <Cruster> i can accept that, it's alpha ;)
[18:08] <asac> for now
[18:08] <asac> and file bugs and bug folks in #kubuntu-devel maybe
[18:08] <asac> Cruster: alpha? i mean they use that in the distro
[18:09] <asac> you mean jaunty is alpha yes ... but unless something really good happens i dont think there will be much improvements in this area
[18:09] <asac> in the past the kde folks made really slow progress on their nm applets
[18:09] <asac> and instead of finishing one they just start writing yet another one
[18:09] <Cruster> well, for me it's kinda acceptable
[18:10] <asac> Cruster: anyway. you can still start the nm-applet
[18:10] <asac> create your system connection
[18:10] <asac> then use the kde one i guess
[18:10] <Cruster> nice then
[18:10] <asac> at least that should help in getting a connection before startup
[18:10] <asac> bug #326571
[18:10] <Cruster> what's the name of the ubuntu packet?
[18:11] <asac> Cruster: network-manager-gnome
[18:11] <Cruster> ty
[18:11] <asac> np
[18:12] <asac> Nafallo: so you are not alone: bug 326571
[18:12] <asac> whats going on
[18:12] <asac> Nafallo: can you please help to track that down?
[18:12] <asac> i cannot reproduce it unfortunately
[18:12] <asac> i need to get a clue whether its a regression in dhclient or what
[18:13] <Nafallo> asac: you have those weird rfc lines in dhclient.conf?
[18:13] <asac> Nafallo: do we need them or not?
[18:14] <Nafallo> I commented them and it works again.
[18:14] <asac> Nafallo: i have that line and it didnet hurt:
[18:14] <asac> option rfc3442-classless-static-routes code 121 = array of unsigned integer 8;
[18:14] <Nafallo> asac: got avahi-autoipd installed?
[18:15] <asac> Nafallo: yes have it
[18:15] <Nafallo> asac: I don't :-)
[18:15]  * Nafallo ponders where changelogs live those days
[18:16] <asac> Nafallo: please check whether it helps to have it installed
[18:16]  * Nafallo found them on changelogs.ubuntu.com
[18:16] <BUGabundo> Nafallo: you mean changelogs.ubuntu.com
[18:16] <BUGabundo> and on LP ?
[18:16] <asac> Nafallo: and join the bug 326571
[18:17] <BUGabundo> ubottu: is getting lazy today
[18:17] <BUGabundo> or LP is SLOWWWWW
[18:18] <Nafallo>   * Added hook to dhclient to support RFC3442 (classless static route option)
[18:18] <Nafallo>     and add rfc3442-classless-static-routes to the options requested (closes:
[18:18] <Nafallo>     #396545)
[18:19] <asac> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dhcp3/3.1.1-5ubuntu3
[18:19] <asac> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dhcp3/3.1.1-5ubuntu3
[18:19] <asac> hmm
[18:19] <asac> Nafallo: but i had that since ever as it seems
[18:20] <Nafallo> debian bug 396545
[18:20] <asac> Nafallo: can you check if avahi-autoipd installing helps
[18:20] <Q-FUNK> asac: here
[18:21] <asac> Q-FUNK: pleaes look at bug
[18:21] <Q-FUNK> the debian one?
[18:21] <asac> Q-FUNK: no at your bug
[18:21] <Q-FUNK> ah
[18:21] <Q-FUNK> just a sec
[18:22] <Q-FUNK> asac: ok.  I'll reply to that.  thanks.
[18:23] <Q-FUNK> can you already tell me, what would be the difference between with and without avahi-autoipd ?
[18:23] <Q-FUNK> i.e. is it supposed to introduce a regression if it's installed?
[18:23] <asac> Nafallo: when was that feature introduced?
[18:23] <asac> can you give a can you drop that info in the ubuntu bug?
[18:25] <Nafallo> asac: dhcp3 (3.1.1-2) unstable; urgency=low
[18:25] <Q-FUNK> I personally don't need that auoipd feature since I don't use rendez-vous, so if that can be a temporary workaround, I'd simply remove it for now.
[18:25] <BUGabundo> asac: xubuntu 8.10 full update (nm from archive I think) 3G not working
[18:25] <BUGabundo> will get serial logs when I get home, and hand them to you
[18:26] <Nafallo> Q-FUNK: I have it uninstalled (since I don't use it either) and that bug still occurs. I was taking a stab in the dark I'm afraid.
[18:26] <BUGabundo> asac: using PPA NM can help fix that too?
[18:26] <BUGabundo> I still haven't tried last night fix on my machine either
[18:28] <Nafallo> asac: first step should be to try and find out what that hook is supposed to do.
[18:29] <Q-FUNK> Nafallo: ok, that at least rules that one out
[18:31] <Nafallo> Q-FUNK: our of interest. what's your wifi card and ap?
[18:32] <Q-FUNK> USB dongle with the zd1211rw driver
[18:32] <Q-FUNK> ap are different ones
[18:33] <Nafallo> that rules b0rked hardware out
[18:33] <Nafallo> well. hardware revisions
[18:38] <Q-FUNK> Nafallo: you?
[18:38] <Nafallo> Q-FUNK: me?
[18:38] <plun> hello all !
[18:38] <plun> Any Thunderbird 3 guru ?     (ftas repo)
[18:39] <plun> Mozilla-teams repo... sorry !
[18:40] <BUGabundo> plun: ping fta
[18:40] <BUGabundo> not here right now AFAIK
[18:40] <BUGabundo> asac: ping are you here?
[18:41] <asac> Nafallo: finding out what it means comes second imo. first we should track down the facts. e.g. does avahi help, does downgrading dhclient help.
[18:41] <plun> OK... I always ping fta...  must be more then Fabien which knows  ;)
[18:41] <plun> Is TB3 broken within ppa ?  Works fine with nightly build for me
[18:41] <Nafallo> asac: downgrade to intrepid?
[18:41] <asac> plun: current dailies are a bit broken
[18:42] <plun> asac:  OK thanks !
[18:42] <asac> Nafallo: nto sure i guess the first jaunty version shoujld be ok to test too
[18:42] <asac> plun: downgrade to the build from 9th feb
[18:42] <asac> pick the bits manually from -daily
[18:42] <asac> i think they should be available there still
[18:42] <plun> asac: OK thanks !
[18:43] <Nafallo> asac: dhcp3 (3.1.1-5ubuntu1) jaunty; urgency=low
[18:43] <Nafallo>   * Merge from Debian unstable. Remaining Ubuntu changes
[18:43] <Nafallo> that one?
[18:43] <asac> plun: we will fix asap
[18:43] <asac> Nafallo: you found a changelog entry that sounded suspicious
[18:43] <asac> Nafallo: try the package before and the package after that
[18:43] <plun> asac:  superb service   ;)
[18:43] <Nafallo> asac: cause this was merged in from Debian unstable (3.1.1-2)
[18:44] <BUGabundo> brb... kiling PA, so pidgin will crash
[18:44] <asac> plun: i think fta has disabled the build for now ... so if a new -daily build appears in ppa its probably fixed
[18:45] <plun> asac: no problem.... nightly works OK, I just prefer running a Ubuntu build ;)
[18:45] <Nafallo> asac: hence why intrepid is the lastest version without it.
[18:45] <Nafallo> +spelling
[18:45] <Nafallo> ✁☹
[18:45] <asac> Nafallo: go to launchpad ... download the debs in reverse order till its fixed
[18:45] <asac> oops ;)
[18:45] <asac> sorry read an old message
[18:45] <Nafallo> asac: stop reading old messages damnit! :-P
[18:45] <asac> Nafallo: if thats the latest version without it verify that its broken in first jaunty uploda
[18:46] <asac> and that its fixed in last intrepid
[18:46] <BUGabundo> back
[18:46] <Nafallo> asac: looking at the changelog it won't be fixed :-P
[18:46] <Nafallo> (in jaunty)
[18:47] <asac> Nafallo: you never know
[18:47] <Nafallo> asac: look... we already know which hook it troublesome :-)
[18:47] <Q-FUNK> ah, the culprit change has been found?
[18:47] <asac> Nafallo: still ... please verify that thats the real cause.
[18:47] <asac> Nafallo: then we need to think what to do
[18:47] <Nafallo> asac: in my opinion it's much better to spend time in finding out WHY it's broken :-)
[18:47]  * Q-FUNK watches magic happen
[18:47] <BUGabundo> asac: xubuntu 8.10 full update (nm from archive I think) 3G not working
[18:47] <BUGabundo> will get serial logs when I get home, and hand them to you
[18:47] <BUGabundo> I still haven't tried last night fix on my machine either
[18:48] <Nafallo> asac: also... we know it worked in intrepid. I didn't dist-upgrade this machine when jaunty opened :-)_
[18:48] <Q-FUNK> Nafallo: checking packages before and after will enable that to happen.  after you spotted which package introduced the bug, a run of 'diff' should help us narrow down the exact cause
[18:48] <asac> Nafallo: well. i just want to be sure its not a red herring ;)
[18:49] <asac> testing the intrepid package must be _easy_
[18:49] <asac> compared to finding the bug or sorting out what to do if we have to accept that the stateless option breaks this
[18:50] <Nafallo> asac: ooh. ii  dhcp3-client   3.1.1-1ubuntu2
[18:50] <asac> Q-FUNK: can you check the dhcp3-client packages and see if its fixed in intrepid?
[18:51] <Nafallo> asac: that means intrepid is the version right before the DD added that hook
[18:51] <asac> Nafallo: see ;)
[18:51] <Q-FUNK> asac: come again?
[18:51] <asac> Nafallo: that works?
[18:51] <Nafallo> asac: worked on intrepid
[18:51] <asac> Nafallo: now we need to find the diff he used to add the hook
[18:51] <asac> Nafallo: yes, but will it work with intrepid package in jaunty
[18:51] <asac> ?
[18:51] <Q-FUNK> yes, intrepid worked fine
[18:51] <Nafallo> asac: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=396545
[18:52] <asac> do what you want
[18:52] <asac> i cannot investigate before knowning that its really that hook. for me it woks with that config
[18:52] <asac> it could be that the same merge or a later merge regressed this
[18:52] <Q-FUNK> asac: do you have multiple network interfaces on your hardware?
[18:52] <Nafallo> asac: I commented out the option and the request. and it works now.
[18:53] <Nafallo> asac: what possibly more info could you need?
[18:53] <asac> Nafallo: that only says that you uncover the bug with that option
[18:53] <asac> but doesnt really say that its the option in general that caused this
[18:53] <asac> maybe first jaunty package worked with that option
[18:53] <asac> and current one is broken because someone else broke it during merge
[18:54] <Nafallo> that was the merge... but okay.
[18:54] <Q-FUNK> erm.  the diff attached to that bug already hints at major moronism:  trying to backport a dhcp4 feature to a dhcp3 client.
[18:54]  * BUGabundo feels ignored
[18:54] <asac> Nafallo: i still dont know which merge it is
[18:54] <asac> Nafallo: post that to the bug ;)
[18:55] <asac> also there were multiple uploads in jaunty
[18:56] <Nafallo> asac: yes. three apparently. kees playing with MTU and jamie playing with apparmor.
[18:56] <Nafallo> ouch!
[18:56] <Nafallo> I just walked into a door
[18:57] <asac> Nafallo: sorry ;)
[18:57] <asac> Nafallo: could you at least test whether avahi-autoipd has something to do with this at all?
[18:58] <Nafallo> asac: Q-FUNK having it installed isn't evidence enough? :-)
[18:58]  * Nafallo have to head off to the shower or he'll be late.
[18:59] <Nafallo> and no asac. you can't watch on cam ;-)
[18:59] <asac> heh
[19:00] <Q-FUNK> ok, let's say that I can try something crazy, even though I don't have my jaunty host on hand.  I can temporarily upgrade another host...
[19:00] <Q-FUNK> Nafallo: bummer!  you almost brought the valentine spirit to the channel! :-P
[19:05] <Q-FUNK> asac:  ok, I seem to have avahi-autoipd on this laptop. let's try a temporary upgrade to jaunty and see whether disabling that RFC3442 option in dhcp3-client.conf fixes it here too.
[19:06]  * Q-FUNK launches a dist-upgrade
[19:07] <Q-FUNK> asac: the main thing to compare was whether having avahi-autoipd installed made anhy difference, in addition to disabling that 3442 option?
[19:07] <Q-FUNK> ok. cannot dist-upgrade using update-manager.  it barfs over a unfulfilable dependencies for ubuntu-desktop...
[19:10] <asac> Q-FUNK: well. so if rfc option helps you
[19:10] <asac> Q-FUNK: just check whether avahi-autoipd would help too
[19:10] <asac> i dont think it makes a difference
[19:10] <Q-FUNK> erm... you meant if disabling that rfc option helps, with or without avahi-autoipd ?
[19:11] <asac> Q-FUNK: no a) does isabling rfc help
[19:11] <asac> b) does avahi-autoipd help to not need a)
[19:12] <Q-FUNK> ok
[19:13] <Q-FUNK> afaik, I have avahi-autoipd on that test host (not located in this house, so I cannot chekc now), since local-link exists and did not solve anything.  at least, I remember that I had routes for both local-link and my AP
[19:14] <asac> thats goodenough
[19:16] <Q-FUNK> but no default route
[19:17] <asac> its a bit strange since i have the same option on and didnt see any issues
[19:17] <asac> but maybe its a buggy dhcp server
[19:17] <Q-FUNK> asac: but do you have multiple network interfaces?
[19:17] <asac> you know which dhcp server you have? maybe it supports classless static routes and doesnt deliver default route
[19:18] <asac> Q-FUNK: i have .... and the syslog nafallow showed me looked like its just that dhclient doesnt get any gateway info
[19:18] <Q-FUNK> asac: no idea.  the dhcp server is whatever is in the wireless AP.
[19:20] <asac> meaning: eithe rits a bug in server ... or its a bug in dhclient in that it doesnt properly guess the right gateway
[19:20] <asac> what AP is that?
[19:22] <Q-FUNK> speedswitch ... something
[19:23] <Q-FUNK> I'm not currently at the location where my test host is located.  however, IIRC I had the same problem here at home with my wrt54gl running white russian.
[19:25] <asac> Nafallo: Q-FUNK: so is anyone able to reproduce it _right_ now?
[19:25] <asac> if so, please keep the option enabled and move the exit hook
[19:26] <asac> to some other place
[19:26] <Q-FUNK> asac: I'm currently dist-upgrading this laptop to try the same test as on my usual test host.
[19:26] <asac> Q-FUNK: e.g. sudo su; mv /etc/dhcp3/dhclient-exit-hooks.d/rfc3442-classless-routes ~
[19:26] <asac> k
[19:26] <asac> thanks
[19:28] <Q-FUNK> yup
[19:28] <Q-FUNK> erm... wait... you want me to move it away from the exit hook directory?
[19:29] <asac> Q-FUNK: first check whether its reproducible ... then move it away. yes
[19:29] <asac> that exit hook looks bogus
[19:29] <asac> well .. at least hacky
[19:31] <Q-FUNK> it definitely looks so
[19:43] <asac> so i picked a bunch  of neighbour APs
[19:43] <asac> none has this problem
[19:43] <asac> unfortunately
[19:44] <Cruster> you need any help in testing?
[19:45] <asac> Cruster: if you se the bug try to remove the exit hook from above
[19:46] <Cruster> i am just wondering if you need a bug confirmation
[19:48] <asac> Cruster: well. if thats a question unrelated to the rfc344... issue from above, i always need help in bug triaging
[19:48] <asac> Cruster: going through new/incomplete/confirmed bug against firefox-3.0
[19:48] <asac> and checking wehther enough informatoin is there
[19:49] <asac> and bringing the bug in the normalized form like:
[19:49] <asac> see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MozillaTeam/NormalizedBugFormat
[19:49] <asac> and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MozillaTeam/Bugs/TriagersHandbook
[19:49] <asac> Cruster: ^^
[19:50] <Cruster> brb dinner time, i'll look them l8er
[19:50] <Nafallo> asac: not in the shower, no :-)
[20:28] <Q-FUNK> asac: about 40 minutes to completion of dist-upgrade on this laptop.
[20:29] <asac> Nafallo: now out of shower?
[20:29] <asac> ;)
[20:29] <Q-FUNK> heh
[20:31] <Nafallo> asac: yea. and in half hour out of the building as well.
[20:49] <asac> Nafallo: ok all fine. i think i know what to take
[20:50] <Nafallo> god damn IRC. I got stuck again :-/
[20:51] <asac> heh
[20:51] <asac> Nafallo: go partying now ;)
[20:52] <Nafallo> need to make the bed, clean up a bit and might consider putting a bit more than my robe on.
[20:52] <Nafallo> :-P
[22:27] <BUGabundo> asac: ping
[23:21] <fta> asac, i didn't deactive tb3 in my bot
[23:21] <BUGabundo> hi fta
[23:21] <fta> i thought the issue would be fixed quickly :(
[23:22] <fta> BUGabundo, hi
[23:22] <fta> ohoh, new pulseaudio
[23:22] <fta> ~test2 :)
[23:23] <BUGabundo> yep
[23:23] <BUGabundo> fixed 3 bugs I had with test1
[23:23] <BUGabundo> \0/
[23:25] <fta> and new deluge, let's hope it fixes some of my bugs too
[23:26] <BUGabundo> didn had any big bugs
[23:26] <BUGabundo> but I think I was already using upstream deb
[23:26] <BUGabundo> or 0.11
[23:27] <BUGabundo> not sure
[23:27] <fta> 0.11?
[23:27] <BUGabundo> or what ever was before
[23:28] <BUGabundo> 1.1.1
[23:29] <fta> Preparing to replace deluge 1.0.7.dfsg-3 (using .../deluge_1.1.2.dfsg-1_all.deb) ...
[23:30] <BUGabundo> humm
[23:30] <BUGabundo> really old version
[23:30] <BUGabundo> weren't you using the PPA?
[23:30] <fta> no
[23:31] <BUGabundo> asac: do you have any idea of whom is network-config upstream? do they reply/active?
[23:31] <fta> this ppa looks ugly and weak
[23:31] <fta> boom http://paste.ubuntu.com/118204/
[23:44] <fta> hm, no more opengl, wtf?
[23:52] <BUGabundo1> asac: can we have NM NOT prefer wired ?
[23:52] <BUGabundo1> I can't share my 3G net
[23:52] <BUGabundo1> I know its not a common use
[23:52] <BUGabundo1> but I'm not even able to use firestater to change that
[23:53] <BUGabundo1> everytime I have both 3g and eth0, nm defaults to using wired
[23:53] <BUGabundo1> and I loose my internet connection