[00:01] <ripps> pwnguin: how do I do that withing the installer?
[00:03] <burner> manual partitioning and don't format the partition you designate with the mount point /home
[00:24] <burner> cd /home/burner/Upload
[00:25] <burner> interesting... seems dolphin spams the channel when I use the terminal part of it and switch folders ;)
[00:48] <SiDi> anyone under xubuntu jaunty here ?
[01:00] <charlie-tca> yes
[01:01] <charlie-tca> I'm using 64-bit jaunty since alpha2
[01:11] <SiDi> What the hell happened to the menu ? Oo
[01:11] <SiDi> i gotta launch xfce-setting-show manually and cant find the menu editor
[01:12] <Ienorand> Equality, make a stand!!: echo "alias woman='man' >> ~/.bashrc
[01:13] <SiDi> i never read any womanual of my life, Ienorand :)
[01:14] <durt> RTFW?
[01:15] <SiDi> :)
[01:15] <Ienorand> :D
[01:16] <SiDi> Any idea how i can get the breathe icons ?
[01:16] <SiDi> i want a tarball with all the files :( don't know how to use that bzr thingy
[01:16] <SiDi> w/e, dl'ing bzr :)
[01:22] <charlie-tca> SiDi: you mean Applications menu went away?
[01:22] <charlie-tca> That was about Jaunty alpha4 release.
[01:22] <SiDi> Well, the "Xfce parameters" window in the menu
[01:22] <SiDi> its gone
[01:23] <SiDi> and i don't see the menu editor anywhere
[01:23] <SiDi> currently updating my packages tho
[01:23] <charlie-tca> You have to look through all the selections. In 4.6, everything got changed
[01:24] <SiDi> i don't see those new notification things tho
[01:24] <SiDi> but the os boots slightly faster :)
[01:25] <charlie-tca> You can always go to #xfce and ask them. They will know
[01:26] <charlie-tca> Or give xubuntu a day or two and see if it gets in there. Some of the items are still in work
[01:26] <SiDi> yeh i'll just wait
[01:26] <SiDi> anyways just having a look
[01:27] <SiDi> omg update failed :( 260 mb to download again
[01:27] <charlie-tca> ouch
[01:27] <SiDi> the last alpha i tested was more stable :p
[01:27] <SiDi> my xfce panels crashed too
[01:27] <SiDi> and i cant use shortcuts to launch a terminal :p
[01:27] <SiDi> brb ;D
[01:28] <SiDi> oh noes... they removed ctrl + alt + backspace
[01:32] <charlie-tca> alt+f2?
[01:32] <SiDi> back
[01:32] <SiDi> rebooted via shell + gdm restart
[01:33] <SiDi> alt+F2 wouldnt answer either :p
[01:33] <SiDi> and when i logged back half of my conf was dead :)
[01:33] <charlie-tca> Looks like your install is very unstable. What happened to it?
[01:34] <SiDi> dunno
[01:34] <SiDi> just did it an hour ago
[01:34] <SiDi> it ran well
[01:34] <SiDi> the alpha3 was getting my motherboard uber crazy tho so there is a progress
[01:34] <SiDi> (intrepid is perfectly stable - everything works out of the box !)
[01:34] <charlie-tca> Yeah, alpha3 was unstable.
[01:35] <SiDi> alpha3 scared me
[01:35] <SiDi> the motherboard was bipping till i shut the system down, continuously
[01:35] <charlie-tca> of course, I have lost the panels and menus once or twice. and had to update through the tty a couple of times, too
[01:35] <SiDi> well i knew what to expect :)
[01:36] <SiDi> but its not stable enough for university work (and diablo 2 lans) yet :P
[01:36] <charlie-tca> You think alpha3 scared you? you should have been here, with an installation that kept closing the windows I was working in
[01:37] <SiDi> well when its hardware related, its scary yeh
[01:37] <SiDi> rebooting, brb :)
[01:43] <SiDi> back :)
[01:52] <SiDi> Going bed, good night charlie-tca
[01:59] <legodude> the virtualbox kernel rebuild fails, any ideas?
[03:03] <jpedroza1> I just ran into a new issue with +1 and my laptop. I was at 91% battery and it said that there was no battery remaining and shut down.
[03:04] <maco> haha
[03:18] <hanasaki> what is th command that shows all th hardwar ?
[03:23] <Volkodav> dmesg
[03:38] <maco> Volkodav: dmesg?
[03:39] <maco> i think they were looking for lshw
[03:39] <Volkodav> maybe
[03:42] <TuTUXG> anyone got songbird working on 64 bit??
[03:50] <DanaG> Anyone happen to know if the radeon driver with the 2.6.29 kernel supports KMS?
[03:50] <DanaG> I know Jaunty won't have 2.6.29, but I can always compile my own.
[03:52] <RAOF> I _think_ the answer is 'yes', but you can always just build the modules from drm master, anyway.
[03:54] <Amaranth> no
[03:54] <Amaranth> last i heard only intwl got merged because the radeon one uses ttm
[03:54] <Amaranth> intel*
[04:12] <RAOF> Oh, yeah.  That's right.
[04:14] <DanaG> Ah.
[04:14] <DanaG> I'm wondering when radeon will get it, then.
[04:14] <ripps> I'm going to upgrade to Jaunty now. Anything I should know before I do it?
[04:14] <DanaG> (it's more of a curiosity than a "want it to come sooner" thing).
[04:18] <RAOF> I've heard .30 or .31 bandied about.
[04:18] <DanaG> Can't say I know what the current version is, actually.
[04:19] <DanaG> Timespan would be more helpful. =þ  Thanks.
[04:27] <ripps> Is EXA more stable with Xserver 1.6?
[04:30] <DanaG> Lovely quit message there.
[04:34] <RAOF> ripps: Has it been unstable?  It's (generally) a bit faster with 1.6, yes.
[04:34] <ripps> I tend to get freezing with my radeon driver with exa
[04:34] <ripps> RAOF: *
[04:34] <RAOF> ripps: But I think that pretty much all EXA crashes are the driver's fault (I've not had any problems with nouveau, for example), and so the Xserver version doesn't have much to do with it.
[04:35] <ripps> So, things shouldn't change much :/
[04:35] <RAOF> Pretty much.
[04:36] <RAOF> At least you don't have an Intel card :(
[04:36]  * DanaG has RV635.
[04:37] <ripps> I'm thinking of getting an nvidia card, but my system is so old that I just need to upgrade the whole thing. (Unfortunately, I don't have any money to do so)
[04:37] <DanaG> Try looking at OEM systems.
[04:37] <DanaG> Well, at least for me, if I had to go desktop again, I'd get an OEM one, rather than building my own.
[04:37] <DanaG> Going OEM gets you one big thing: warranty all from one place.
[04:39] <ripps> Still doesn't solve the lack of money issue :(
[06:18] <DanaG> Oh yeah, I hope the radeon driver gets better power management.
[06:18] <DanaG> That's actually a bigger deal to me than the lack of 3D support.
[06:18] <DanaG> ... because drawing 30 watts on battery is Not Cool.
[06:31] <DanaG> heh, no matter how many times I try changing my theme, I always come back to my orange Nodoka-based theme.
[06:32] <DanaG> ... sometimes with slight tweaking of that orange color.
[07:14] <Tekno> hello
[07:47] <scizzo-> moin
[08:12] <bullgard4> Does Jaunty presently show a GNOME menu item System > Control Center?
[08:18] <andersk> bullgard4: no, not for me.
[08:19] <bullgard4> andersk: Thank you for your information.
[09:33] <nite_johnboy> much new on the home front ? will there be support for ati- hdmi video support??
[09:58] <Q-FUNK> howdy!
[10:07] <Q-FUNK> whenever I click on the calendar applet, the whole gnome panel goes into freeze and the applet cannot be closed.  is there any known workaround?
[10:09] <RAOF_> Q-FUNK: 'killall gnome-panel'
[10:09] <Q-FUNK> RAOF_: how would I issue the command, without a terminal open?
[10:09] <RAOF_> By using gnome-do, of course!
[10:10] <Q-FUNK> ?!
[10:10] <RAOF_> Alternatively, from a VT.
[10:10] <Q-FUNK> you mean Alt-F2 ?
[10:10] <RAOF_> Ctrl+Alt-F1; log in, killall gnome-panel
[10:10] <RAOF_> No, I mean gnome-do.  Check it out :)
[10:11] <Q-FUNK> it did something nasty to gtk2
[10:11] <Q-FUNK> now, all apps have blank window conetnet
[10:13] <RAOF_> All white?  Using nvidia, and compiz?
[10:13] <RAOF_> All _new_ windows actually have contents? :)
[10:14] <Q-FUNK> using intel and compiz
[10:14] <Q-FUNK> yes, white
[10:14] <Q-FUNK> it came back after switchign back and forth between vcons and X
[10:17] <Q-FUNK> is the issue with the time/date/calendar issue already known?
[10:47] <ripps> hHheEelLlpPp!!!   mMmyYy   kKkeEeyYybBboOoaARaRdDRd   iIisSs   bBbrRroOokKkeEenNn
[10:48] <ripps> iIimMm   nNOnOotTt   dDdoOoiIinNngGg   tThHiIthisSs
[10:49] <fde> ripps: what did you do before this started happening?
[10:49] <ripps> jJjuUusStTst   uUupPpgGgrRraAadDdeEedDd
[10:50] <cwillu> missed one
[10:50] <fde> ripps: perhaps try looking in System > Preferences > Keyboard if you're using Gnome, and see if anything looks strange?
[10:50] <cwillu> sStTst should be sSstTt
[10:51] <fde> ripps: I am fully upgraded, and see nothing like that.
[10:51] <fde> cwillu: shouldn't assume he's making it up... I've seen similar things before
[10:51] <ripps> eEevVveEerRryYytThHthiIinNngGg   nNnoOorRrmMmaAalLl   iIinNn   >>>kKkeEeyYybBObOoaAarRrdDd
[10:51] <SiDi> ripps, indeed
[10:52] <fde> ripps: does it still happen if you hit ctrl + alt + f1 and type on a regular terminal?
[10:52] <ripps> cCcoOonNnsSsoOolLleEe   nNnoOotTt   eEefFffFfeEecCctTteEedDd
[10:53] <SiDi> ripps, then "sudo apt-get install irssi", and then "irssi", then "/server irc.freenode.net" then "/join #ubuntu"
[10:53] <fde> ripps: all X apps are though?
[10:54] <fde> dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg-input-kbd or xserver-xorg-input-evdev might fix it after a restart of X?
[10:55] <fde> (not sure if Ubuntu is still using -input-kbd?)
[10:58] <SiDi> i think he was fooling us :/
[10:58] <ripps> I FIXED IT!
[10:59] <ripps> I had a "AllowEmptyInput" "True" in my xorg.conf
[11:00] <fde> Oh, speaking of, what is that new GUI tool for configuring options of Xorg?
[11:05] <cwillu> gnome-display-properties?
[11:06] <fde> No... its something like XorgConfigEditor-gtk ... it might not be in the repos yet though, idk
[11:25] <cwillu> not displayconfig-gtk either presumably
[11:26] <crdlb> xorg-options-editor-gtk
[12:08] <fde> crdlb: yeah that
[12:13] <maxb> Anyone else getting spurious conffile prompting re checkbox?
[12:21] <hggdh> maxb, yay
[12:26] <fde> maxb: it asked two questions, yes... just hit 'y' and enter...
[12:26] <maxb> My point being that it should not have asked
[12:26] <fde> maxb: something in the configs changed, but unless you manually edited something, always hit y
[12:26] <fde> maxb: why not? you'd rather it replace your customizations?
[12:26] <maxb> fde: I do understand the concept of conffiles quite thoroughly
[12:27] <maxb> I'm pointing out that I believe there's a bug in the package maintainer scripts causes false prompting
[12:27]  * fde would by thoroughly annoyed if apt went around randomly removing his conffile edits
[12:27] <fde> maxb: no
[12:28] <maxb> fde would also be thoroughly annoyed if apt prompted him every time a conffile he had not edited, changed
[12:28] <fde> maxb: remove ucf then?
[12:29] <fde> (or maybe there is a way to set it to always override if the file hasn't changed? I haven't delved into it)
[12:29] <cwillu> but why is it asking if the file hasn't changed?
[12:30] <fde> It definitely has changed... but its due to a change in the packages default rather than user configuration...
[12:31] <fde> I guess its mostly to say "do you like the old way, or would you like this new way?"
[12:31] <cwillu> I meant the original file
[12:31] <fde> The file changed between the two package versions
[12:32] <cwillu> the installed /etc file hasn't been modified by the user, so installing the next config file without complaints would seem to be appropriate, at least to me
[12:32] <hggdh> maxb, I agree. The checkbox config I had was the one installed originally by the package. I did not change it in any way, and I still got asked for
[12:33] <cwillu> I really don't need to be informed about how the line breaking in some explanatory comments in a config file has been updated, thanks
[13:02] <idorock89> ppl who r using jaunty can anyone pls tell whether the buggy archive mounter has been fixed? in intrepid if i mount isos using it then the files all have a ;1 after their names and this renders
[13:03] <idorock89> them completely useless . pls anyone on the latest release can confirm what is the situation in jaunty? as this is a really annoying bug
[13:03] <idorock89> and makes iso usage really very painful
[13:06] <cwillu> wow, it's a good thing I didn't just spend time trying to duplicate his problem
[13:35] <maxb> I was rather surprised at lunch today to discover our canteen has started stocking "Ubuntu Cola"
[13:36] <TuTUXG> lol
[13:36] <TuTUXG> where r u?
[13:36] <maxb> London
[13:38] <TuTUXG> free?
[13:40] <maxb> Well, as in Fairtrade
[14:18] <fde> cwillu: well, if you did, you could at least file bugs
[14:19] <cwillu> fde, wasn't able to dupe it on my intrepid box, and I'm not in front of my jaunty machine right now
[14:19] <cwillu> more specifically, I get nautilus crashes on intrepid, which is probably due to some other muckery I did on gvfs
[14:20] <cwillu> I do recall something about that though, I'd be very surprised if there wasn't a bug filed already
[14:42] <jpedroza> Is there any way to install nvidia-glx-180 and nvidia-glx-180-dev without removing the entire xorg server?
[14:44] <BUGabundo> guud afternoon everyone
[14:44] <BUGabundo> is hibernate broken again?
[14:44] <maxb> jpedroza: This should not be a problem if you are using current jaunty
[14:44] <BUGabundo>   p, li { white-space: pre-wrap; }  > Gostava de falar contigo sobre os Hands-on, quando é que podes?
[14:45] <BUGabundo> Feb 17 01:18:07 blubug kernel: [15077.963758] s2disk[16798]: segfault at 0 ip 0000000000000000 sp 00007fff2ae66fd8 error 14 in s2disk[400000+8000]
[14:45] <jpedroza> maxb: What should I be looking for in my apt repositories, because when I try and add nvidia it wants to remove my xorg.
[14:45] <jpedroza> !pastebin
[14:45] <BUGabundo> http://paste.ubuntu.com/119227/
[14:46] <BUGabundo> where is the rest
[14:46] <BUGabundo> jpedroza: that's is now fix
[14:46] <BUGabundo> for a long time
[14:46] <BUGabundo> bah maxb ^^
[14:47] <maxb> jpedroza: Be sure you've updated and upgraded to latest of what you've got installed already (using a mirror you're sure is up to date), and then try again to install nvidia
[14:49] <jpedroza> maxb: I have run apt-get update and upgrade many times, without luck. My apt sources.list is here: http://paste.ubuntu.com/119228/
[14:49] <jpedroza> maxb: All coming from us.archive.ubuntu.com
[14:50] <maxb> jpedroza: you appear to be using intrepid
[14:50] <BUGabundo> jpedroza: run update-manager -d
[14:50] <jpedroza> maxb: see line 56 jaunty main universe
[14:50] <BUGabundo> jpedroza: don't mix branchs
[14:51] <maxb> jpedroza: Mixing distributions is NOT SUPPORTED (capitals intentional)
[14:51] <BUGabundo> it can and will lead to disaster
[14:51] <maxb> Also, nvidia 180 is available in intrepid-backports
[14:51] <BUGabundo> I once forgot a line while distupgrading
[14:51] <maxb> or intrepid-updates
[14:51] <BUGabundo> and in a few weeks most of my apt cache was wacked
[14:51] <jpedroza> maxb: update-namager command not found. I am under kubuntu.
[14:51] <maxb> intrepid-something, anyway
[14:51] <jpedroza> adept?
[14:51] <maxb> ewww
[14:51] <BUGabundo> jpedroza: run update-manager -d
[14:51] <maxb> and you have hardy-backports as well
[14:52] <BUGabundo> it should be cross WM
[14:52] <maxb> jpedroza: Do *nothing* until you've made your sources.list sane
[14:52] <BUGabundo> or do-release-upgrade
[14:52] <jpedroza> maxb: So what do I need to remove?
[14:52] <BUGabundo> maxb: UM will upgrade his repos
[14:52] <BUGabundo> if not, then it's a bug on UM
[14:53] <maxb> BUGabundo: well, yeah, but I'm not convinced he ought to be on jaunty! :-)
[14:53] <jpedroza> BUGabundo: update-manager: command not found
[14:53] <BUGabundo> ahh ok maxb
[14:53] <BUGabundo> I was under the idea jpedroza wanted to be on jaunty
[14:54] <jpedroza> maxb: If my apt sources are fragged, it is because of the update process to Jaunty. I performed the dist upgrade as outlined at kubuntu.org
[14:54] <maxb> erm, really? Well, yes, they're pretty nonsensical
[14:55] <jpedroza> maxb: I had assumed that it would remove the old repos, like a good upgrade...
[14:55] <maxb> update-manager does
[14:55] <maxb> Don't know about kubuntu
[14:59] <X-722> jaunty stable enough to use for a main desktop machine?
[15:00] <Tekno> no
[15:00] <X-722> thanks
[15:00] <BUGabundo> duh
[15:00] <Tekno> it's truth
[15:00] <BUGabundo> someone who asks that and then leaves SHOULD NOT be usign it anyway
[15:03] <savvas> Don't be so absolute :) I believe that sometimes, whining results in massive hysteria and usually in bug fixing :P
[15:03] <savvas> I mean the whining of such people
[15:08]  * fde thinks the topic of this channel should be "if you have to ask, don't install development software" ... nothing more, nothing less...
[15:08]  * BUGabundo nods and agrees with fde
[15:09] <BUGabundo> still we should mention that stable versions get their help on #ubuntu
[15:09] <fde> "If you have to ask, go back to #ubuntu" ?  :P
[15:10] <savvas> that sort of insults the interest of new users
[15:10] <BUGabundo> eheheheheheheh
[15:10] <fde> (that's what I was going to say first anyways, but it looked kinda rude)
[15:10] <jpedroza> yes, because heaven forbid anyone should want to learn more than they know about pre-repease FOSS software and operating systems.
[15:10] <BUGabundo> savvas: if they are so unsure, they should only test betas
[15:10] <BUGabundo> I know the more the merrier
[15:10] <BUGabundo> but then we get
[15:11] <fde> savvas: Not entirely sure that's a bad thing... obviously if they are that interested, they ought to know what this channel is about.
[15:11] <savvas> well, I wouldn't suggest to test it as a main desktop operating system, but perhaps as a virtual machine
[15:11] <BUGabundo> users complaining it empty their drive, when they choose the wrong option
[15:11] <BUGabundo> savvas: if user is going to run VM, then they don't ask this
[15:13] <savvas> true, but "If you have to ask..." means "If you have to ask any questions regarding anything" :)
[15:13] <savvas> ah, I won't debate about it, everyone has their own opinion
[15:13] <BUGabundo> sure
[15:14] <BUGabundo> I'll help any new or previous users anyway
[15:14] <BUGabundo> spent yesterday afternoon debuging an laptop
[15:14] <BUGabundo> and it seems it will take today too
[15:14] <fde> savvas: well, pretty much, if its not related to confirming bugs and the like, why is it even in here? this isn't really about user support.
[15:16] <savvas> I can't disagree to that
[15:39] <BUGabundo> is there a channel for wubi?
[16:13] <dyf> hello
[16:15] <BUGabundo> ola dyf
[16:16] <dyf> hi BUGabundo
[16:16] <dyf> after the latest update, my computer went too slow
[16:16] <dyf> i'm running fluxbox
[16:17] <dyf> everything takes forever to respond
[16:18] <dyf> i also reported this bug and someone replied to it https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nvidia-graphics-drivers-180/+bug/324443
[16:18] <dyf> i don't know what the "nv" driver is or where to get it
[16:22] <BUGabundo> dyf: simply disable proprietary driver from nvidia
[16:23] <BUGabundo> not sure if flubox has something like hardward drivers on System meny
[16:23] <BUGabundo> *menu
[16:24] <dyf> it doesn't but i can get it
[16:24] <BUGabundo> do it
[16:25] <BUGabundo> or just run dpgk --reconfigure -phigh xorg.xserve
[16:26] <dyf> i have a few updates downloading.. i'll do it once they're done
[16:26] <dyf> few updates = 86 package updates
[16:26] <dyf> they release dozens every single day
[16:27]  * maxb raises an eyebrow at the i386 build queue
[16:27] <maxb> 617 builds waiting in queue
[16:27] <BUGabundo> eheheh
[16:27] <maxb> "impressive"
[16:29] <fde> BUGabundo: dpkg-reconfigure -phigh xserver-xorg ...
[16:29] <dyf> is that the same as disabling it from the restricted drivers manager?
[16:29] <BUGabundo> LOL
[16:29] <BUGabundo> what ever
[16:29] <BUGabundo> typing from head
[16:29] <BUGabundo> I just use the reconvery console option XFIX
[16:29] <BUGabundo> yes dyf
[16:30] <dyf> ok cool
[16:30] <fde> BUGabundo: you make is sound like I wasn't going from memory?  :P
[16:30] <fde> I still haven't bothered to use the recovery tool... cuz the only thing I'd need it for it can't do - restoring sudo screwups
[16:31] <BUGabundo> dunno.... were you ?
[16:31] <fde> yes
[16:36] <Adys> i set Alt+F1 to run a terminal in keyboard shortcuts.. was working well until some update a couple of days ago, and now it constantly just opens the gnome-panel application meny
[16:36] <Adys> menu even
[16:36] <Adys> tried setting it again, anything.. not working, any idea?
[16:39] <BUGabundo> Adys: can you check the shortcuts?
[16:39] <BUGabundo> are you using compiz or metacity?
[16:39] <Adys> both
[16:39] <Adys> doesnt work on either
[16:40] <Adys> compiz atm though, and yeah i checked the shortcuts
[16:40] <BUGabundo> 'cause compiz has it own set of shortcuts
[16:40] <Adys> yeah but Ive always opened a terminal with alt-f1 even with compiz
[16:41] <BUGabundo> on gnome alt-f1 is set to the menu
[16:42] <Adys> yeah by default
[16:42] <Adys> but thats set in the keyboard shortcuts
[16:42] <BUGabundo> yep
[16:42] <BUGabundo> for metacity
[16:42] <Adys> um
[16:43] <dyf> Adys: install tilda ;)
[17:23] <unixdawg> ok jaunty on this laptop kicks ass
[17:23] <unixdawg> I love it and I use to hate linux
[17:24] <TuTUXG> what laptop?
[17:25] <dyf> unixdawg hats linux.. wtf?
[17:25] <dyf> hates*
[17:26] <unixdawg> i am a bsd guy at heart
[17:26] <unixdawg> but jaunty makes using linux fun
[17:26] <dyf> how so?
[17:26] <unixdawg> dell Latitude cpx 650
[17:28] <unixdawg> in a min
[17:28] <unixdawg> sorry wrong win
[17:29] <unixdawg> but jaunty runs smooth on this laptop
[17:30] <tretle> is jaunty going to be switching to packagekit any time soon?
[17:36] <fosco__> don't think so
[17:44] <TuTUXG> kernel bump
[18:08] <tretle> does anyone else have a problem with fonts being extremely large, I changed them so that they are smaller but the xchat chat window did not seem to update with the changes so I have horribly large text :(
[18:08] <Amaranth> tretle: It's because we're actually paying attention to your screen's DPI now
[18:08] <maco> tretle: for once, ubuntu finally uses your sceen's physical dpi instead of forcing 96dpi on everybody
[18:09] <tretle> well I dont like it
[18:09] <Amaranth> maco: Although we forced 96 dpi before because some screens didn't report the right thing
[18:09] <Amaranth> They probably still don't but the drivers handle it a bit better and we don't care anymore :P
[18:09] <maco> Amaranth: right...some screens still report the wrong size
[18:09] <maco> Amaranth: well, and we ough to fix the drivers :P
[18:10] <Amaranth> It's not up to the drivers
[18:10] <tretle> the text is freakishly large, sorta makes it pointless having a 1080i 15" laptop screen
[18:10] <maco> also, the thing where font sizes change all wrong and inconsistently between different apps is a problem on gnome
[18:10] <tretle> I have good eye sight and like small text :D
[18:10] <Amaranth> Windows doesn't honor your screen's DPI so some screens don't have a working method of getting it
[18:10] <Amaranth> tretle: So make the font size smaller
[18:10] <tretle> I did but xchat doesnt listen
[18:11] <maco> some apps try to force a certain font size and ignore what you set in gnome :(  even some gnome apps
[18:11] <maco> file a bug on xchat for being stupid and not listening to gnome
[18:11] <tretle> and I spend alot of time in irc so its annoying having large text
[18:11] <maco> does xchat have a font size setting built-in too?
[18:11] <maco> i thought xchat had like a billion settings
[18:11] <BUGabundo> tretle: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-intel/+bug/324518
[18:12] <BUGabundo> and a few others
[18:12] <BUGabundo> also its on the release note
[18:12] <Amaranth> maco: X-Chat has it's own setting, yes
[18:12] <tretle> I have an ati card
[18:12] <Amaranth> I know xchat-gnome has an option to use the GNOME settings but I dunno about xchat
[18:13] <Amaranth> tretle: Notice the bug is for xorg-server
[18:13] <Amaranth> Although it really isn't a bug
[18:13] <tretle> also not able to view video cause gstreamer keeps crashing?
[18:14] <tretle> and lastly, are the new volume controls going to come back at some point?
[18:14] <maco> no
[18:14] <maco> the new volume control was a regression, effectively
[18:14] <BUGabundo> tretle: NO
[18:14] <maco> since it didnt allow adjusting individual channels like the old one, and it required pulseaudio
[18:15] <BUGabundo> some canonical client didn't like it, and asked Desktop team to remove it
[18:15] <tretle> lol, couldnt they just fix it?
[18:15] <maco> seriously?
[18:15] <maco> not in time
[18:15] <maco> the ball's been kicked back up to gnome
[18:16] <maco> probably with a note to not remove so many features at once :P
[18:16] <Amaranth> BUGabundo: I'm guessing Dell :P
[18:16] <tretle> so hopefully jaunty+1 will include packagekit, volume control and new upstart replacement?
[18:16] <BUGabundo> tretle: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg-server/+bug/325868
[18:16] <Amaranth> upstart replacement?
[18:16] <Amaranth> nothing is replacing upstart
[18:16] <BUGabundo> Amaranth: no idea. ask audio guys or desktop team
[18:16] <maco> tretle: jaunty includes kpackagekit
[18:16] <tretle> not for gnome
[18:16] <BUGabundo> tretle: see if there are specs for it, if not, open new ones
[18:16] <maco> right
[18:16] <tretle> kde has made the move already
[18:17] <maco> we've actually got *both* kpackagekit and adept in kubuntu right now
[18:17] <maco> i think they're still indecisive...
[18:17] <Amaranth> packagekit is still a regression from what we have now in ubuntu
[18:17] <tretle> dont agree there
[18:17] <tretle> it makes developers jobs easier
[18:17] <maco> Amaranth: really? why?
[18:18] <Amaranth> last time I checked it wasn't as nice as gnome-app-install and didn't support all apt/dpkg features needed
[18:18] <tretle> codec installation without the need for app specific code is brilliant, also new plugins like the anjuta project manager one will be great.
[18:18] <Amaranth> and to work as effectively as gnome-app-install it seems to need a modification to packages
[18:18] <Amaranth> or at least to package metadata
[18:45] <maxb> So, why does synaptic want to install python3, but aptitude not? :-/
[18:46] <maxb> It's a little discomforting when what you get as a result of an update depends on which tool you use
[18:47] <TuTUXG> should check update-manager
[18:56] <tretle> getting an error trying to install gstreamer-bad-multiverse
[18:56] <tretle> gstreamer0.10-plugins-bad-multiverse:
[18:56] <tretle>  Depends: libmjpegtools0c2a (>=1:1.8.0) but it is not installable
[18:56] <tretle>  Depends: libx264-59 (>=1:0.svn20080408) but it is not installable
[18:57] <TuTUXG> tretle, u need to install libx264-59 from intrepid's repo
[18:57] <tretle> im running jaunty
[18:58] <TuTUXG> i know
[18:58] <TuTUXG> that's the workaround for that bug
[18:58] <Amaranth> It just needs to be rebuilt
[18:59] <TuTUXG> still a bug
[18:59] <Amaranth> Sure, but this is a fairly common thing in a development period
[19:00] <Amaranth> apt-get -b source gstreamer0.10-plugins-bad-multiverse would most likely fix it too :P
[19:03] <tretle> still getting tall itan error trying to ins
[19:04] <tretle> [19:03] <tretle> still getting tall itan error trying to ins
[19:04] <tretle> Depends: libmjpegtools0c2a (>=1:1.8.0) but it is not installabl
[20:51] <billybigrigger> hi all
[20:51] <billybigrigger> if i go ahead and install alpha4 will i be able to dist-upgrade to alpha5 to do i have to reinstall via cd/dvd?
[20:54] <siegie> billybigrigger: no, just upgrade.
[20:55] <billybigrigger> k
[20:56] <billybigrigger> have been trying debian etch and the "new" lenny the last couple weeks, lol what a joke, i love using apps that are behind the times haha, enough debian on my desktop
[20:56] <billybigrigger> can't even get OO 3.0 without using experimental repos
[20:56] <billybigrigger> dont know why i even tried to go back to debian
[20:57] <Amaranth> lenny is like hardy wrt software versions
[20:57] <billybigrigger> lenny = gey
[20:57] <Amaranth> ...
[20:57] <Amaranth> billybigrigger: Please try to act like an adult
[20:57] <billybigrigger> cdimage is slooooow...is there another mirror i can grab 9.04 from?
[20:58] <billybigrigger> Amaranth, roger
[20:58] <Amaranth> afaik alphas are not mirrored
[21:00] <billybigrigger> that sucks, i have an x86 9.04 server cd here...wish i didnt have to download a 64bit cd
[21:02] <siegie> billybigrigger: if you want to use debian and up to date software, try testing  or unstable
[21:04] <Amaranth> I'd say testing is close to Ubuntu levels of stability but in a rolling release style
[21:04] <Amaranth> unstable is like always using ubuntu+1 :)
[21:05] <tretle> Im having video issues with jaunty, it refuses to play videos(crashing totem). When i try installing any multiverse gstreamer packages they also fail.
[21:06] <maco> testing right now should be insane
[21:06] <maco> lenny just dropped
[21:12] <syockit> wait, which is more unstable, testing or unstable?
[21:13] <TuTUXG> testing i guess
[21:15] <genii> release..stable..unstable..testing/experimental
[21:16] <maxb> uhm no
[21:17] <maxb> syockit: unstable is more unstable
[21:17] <maxb> The reason why testing is especially turbulent right now is because it has *just* unfrozen
[21:18] <maxb> hence anything which was blocked from migrating into testing by the freeze will have done so all at once
[21:20] <genii> maxb: Ah, I just read the explanantions off the main Debian page now, which makes it clearr
[21:21] <syockit> ah, that means unstable is the rolling release?
[21:22] <maco> yes
[22:07] <billybigrigger> k
[22:07] <billybigrigger> im installing 9.04 amd64
[22:07] <billybigrigger> i get to the parition page
[22:07] <billybigrigger> its detecting my 500gb storage disk as sda
[22:07] <billybigrigger> and my 200gb OS disk (the one i want to install to) as sdb
[22:08] <billybigrigger> is there anyway i can have my OS hdd sda and my storage disk sdb? so switch the device names around?
[22:08] <billybigrigger> i could always unplug the 500gb storage disk for the install, but thats kinda not what im looking for
[22:14] <maco> billybigrigger: why does it matter what the device names are...?
[22:15] <billybigrigger> just easier to remember sda is my / and sdb is my storage device
[22:15] <billybigrigger> always have setup my machines like that
[22:15] <TheInfinity> billybigrigger: plug off your storage device?
[22:15] <billybigrigger> already unplugged it
[22:16] <billybigrigger> just a pain in the ass having to open the case to do something simple
[22:16] <billybigrigger> half way done installing already :P lol thanks for the quick replies :P
[22:23] <fujimitsu> eog is acting up
[22:24] <fujimitsu> there was a compiz crash that didnt do anything (?) from nontechnical point
[22:25] <billybigrigger> which mirror does apt scan on install?
[22:25] <billybigrigger> im stuck here @ 82 percent
[22:25] <billybigrigger> been sitting here long enough for the screen to go black
[22:26] <fujimitsu> update took a little longer than usual for me today
[22:33] <CosmiChaos> does anyone got nested paging working in vbox 2.1.4 for in jaunty? :(
[22:41] <billybigrigger> wow 412 packages updated
[22:41] <billybigrigger> 330mb of updates w00t
[22:43] <fujimitsu> i updated yesterday and it still was over 100 updates
[22:43] <billybigrigger> i just did a fresh install today
[22:44] <fujimitsu> to be expected
[22:44] <billybigrigger> glad i have a decent connection, 1300kb/sec aint bad for 412 pkgs :P
[22:44] <billybigrigger> couldnt imaging updating on 56k or dsl
[22:44] <billybigrigger> ooooh its zingin now, 1800k/sec
[22:46] <billybigrigger> now time to see how long it takes to crunch out 412 updates :P
[22:47] <billybigrigger> hmm thats wierd
[22:48] <billybigrigger> i unplugged my 500gb sata storage drive from my desktop on install
[22:48] <billybigrigger> i installed 9.04 to sda (200gb ide disk), now i was hoping when i plugged the sata drive back in, that it would be named sdb, but its sda, and my / is sdb
[22:48] <billybigrigger> does ubuntu give priority or something to sata disks?
[22:51] <maxb> It's entirely possible that the kernel scans the sata bus before the pata bus
[22:51] <maxb> (conjecture, I'm not an expert)
[22:52] <billybigrigger> must be something in the new 2.6.27+ kernel
[22:53] <billybigrigger> i just had debian lenny running on this machine earlier today and i had it the way i wanted, i installed on the PATA as hda, and installed the SATA drive later as sda, and iirc lenny come withs 2.6.26
[22:58] <billybigrigger> did anyone else have a problem updating the package 'checkbox'??\
[22:58] <billybigrigger> my update has been stuck here on configuring checkbox for the last ~5 mins
[22:58] <billybigrigger> doing nothing
[22:58] <billybigrigger> and im stuck in 800x600 so i cant scroll down and see whats goin on
[22:58] <ianm_> hey just wanted to report a fun fact: on Jaunty with the plug-and-play wacom support, yesterday we successfully used *4* wacom tablets concurrently on one laptop
[22:59] <billybigrigger> bah
[22:59] <ianm_> billybigrigger: you may be able to hold Alt and drag the window around
[23:00] <billybigrigger> i can scroll down far enough to see What would you like to do about it? Your options are:
[23:00] <billybigrigger> lol
[23:00] <billybigrigger> i cant see the options
[23:00] <ianm_> try Alt-dragging
[23:00] <billybigrigger> nothing
[23:00] <billybigrigger> ahh
[23:00] <billybigrigger> there we are
[23:00] <billybigrigger> ianm_, thnkx
[23:02] <billybigrigger> hmm, what should i do? install package maintainer's version or keep currently-installed version?  its saying something about ucf was run from a maintainer script that uses debconf, but the script did not pass --debconf-ok to ucf, the maintainer script should be fixed to not stop debconf before calling ucf, and pass it this parameter. for now ucf will revert to using old-style non debconf prompting...
[23:02] <billybigrigger> please inform the package maintainer about this problem
[23:02] <billybigrigger> and then my options...
[23:03] <billybigrigger> should i go ahead and update or keep the currently installed package?
[23:03] <ianm_> I usually update / use new version, then deal with any problems later ;)
[23:04] <billybigrigger> how do i notify the maintainer of checkbox checkbox-gtk?
[23:04] <billybigrigger> email him/her?
[23:04] <billybigrigger> better yet, how do i find out WHO the maintainer is
[23:05]  * DanaG wishes radeon had some power management support... because draining 30 watsts from battery is Not Good.
[23:06] <DanaG> In fact, I'd dare guess that it can actually wear out the battery prematurely.
[23:07]  * billybigrigger diggs the quick bootup time in 9.04
[23:08] <DanaG> 37 seconds for me.  Spiffy.
[23:09] <billybigrigger> what hardware?
[23:09] <DanaG> HP EliteBook 8530w.
[23:09] <DanaG> I have lots of stuff installed, though.
[23:09] <billybigrigger> hp so intel core 2 duo
[23:09] <billybigrigger> ram?
[23:10] <DanaG> 4 gigs DDR2-800.
[23:10] <billybigrigger> restricted drivers needs a restart, will time this one :P\
[23:10] <DanaG> hard drive is 250GB Seagate 7200RPM.
[23:11] <billybigrigger> i just built this desktop, amd x2 2.6ghz, 2gb ddr2-800 kingston, seagate 200gb pata and 500gb sata, booting ubuntu from the pata disk though :(
[23:11]  * billybigrigger needs a stop watch
[23:11] <DanaG> CPU is 2.4GHz.
[23:11] <DanaG> www.csc.calpoly.edu/~dgoyette/bootchart
[23:13] <FFForever> how do i remove the alt + click shortcut?
[23:13] <billybigrigger> 1m10sec
[23:14] <billybigrigger> from shutdown to back to logged into gnome
[23:14] <billybigrigger> not bad
[23:14] <billybigrigger> :P\
[23:14] <DanaG> I'm on ext4.
[23:14] <billybigrigger> ooooh
[23:14] <DanaG> I have backups, so the possible risk of data loss doesn't bother me too much.
[23:14] <billybigrigger> you notice many/any differences?
[23:14] <DanaG> It seems to help the booting.
[23:14] <DanaG> Not much else changes, subjectively.
[23:15] <billybigrigger> hehe
[23:15]  * billybigrigger LOVES ubuntu's rendering...
[23:15] <DanaG> Font rendering is awesome.
[23:15] <billybigrigger> i just came from debian etch and lenny for the last couple of weeks
[23:15] <DanaG> With subpixel rendering.
[23:15] <DanaG> And on a 147DPI display -- sweetness.
[23:16] <billybigrigger> just updated drivers and this looks amazing compared to debian
[23:16] <billybigrigger> i just have a 3 year old LG 19" LCD
[23:16] <billybigrigger> nothing fancy
[23:16]  * DanaG is on ATI video (by choice, to save power and because I like the ATI Windows drivers better than the NV windows drivers).
[23:16] <billybigrigger> not even using dvi-d
[23:16] <Volkodav> anybody has multiple instances of xfdesktop loading at startup eating up memory in xfce 4.6 ?
[23:16] <DanaG> Want custom resolution on NV in Vista?  Good luck... it makes you test it, and then invariably fails.
[23:17] <DanaG> Want custom resolution on ATI?  No problem: just find the DALNonstandardModesBCD key.
[23:17] <billybigrigger> hehe
[23:17] <billybigrigger> how is ati coming along in linux drivers?
[23:17] <FFForever> no one?
[23:17] <billybigrigger> FFForever, what is the alt-click shortcut?
[23:18] <FFForever> billybigrigger, it moves the current focused window....
[23:18] <DanaG> fglrx is broken for me even on Intrepid, oddly enough.
[23:18] <crdlb> FFForever: system -> preferences -> windows
[23:18] <DanaG> Radeon works better than nv or nouveau ever have for me (on old hardware where I had to use it), but lacks 3D support and power-management support.
[23:20] <DanaG> I don't mind the lack of 3D... but having it drain 30 watts on battery is bad.
[23:20] <DanaG> Bad for the battery run-time... and bad for its health, too.
[23:22] <billybigrigger> ya
[23:22] <billybigrigger> my battery doesn't seem to run for too long in ubuntu 8.10
[23:23] <billybigrigger> hp pavillion dv9000
[23:23] <DanaG> I'd tweaked my system with a custom laptop-mode-tools package (the Ubuntu one is broken).
[23:26] <billybigrigger> ahh much better
[23:26]  * DanaG wonders what Jaunty+1 will be called.
[23:27] <DanaG> oh yeah, random: HP netbook theme: www.csc.calpoly.edu/~dgoyette/screenshot-glassybleu.png
[23:27] <DanaG> My theme: www.csc.calpoly.edu/~dgoyette/screenshot-orange.png
[23:28] <billybigrigger> i like that netbook theme, the first one
[23:28] <billybigrigger> what window border theme is it using?
[23:28]  * billybigrigger is searching ubuntu-art.org for some good stuff right now
[23:28] <DanaG> It's on Canonical's HP repo.
[23:28] <DanaG> You have to add the deb-src lines to sources.list, and then apt-get source the packages.
[23:29] <billybigrigger> ooh, thats the default theme?
[23:29] <DanaG> From their MIE netbook, yes.
[23:30] <billybigrigger> nice
[23:30] <DanaG> http://h30434.www3.hp.com/psg/board/message?board.id=OS&message.id=4194
[23:30] <DanaG> Take only the deb-src lines, though.
[23:30] <billybigrigger> i dont have a netbook
[23:30] <billybigrigger> 17" pavillionm
[23:31] <billybigrigger> whats the package name for compiz config? like theme manager
[23:32] <DanaG> compizconfig-settings-manager
[23:32] <billybigrigger> man this is confusing, whats the difference between compiz and emerald?
[23:33] <billybigrigger> both are part of compiz or emerald is something totally different?
[23:33] <DanaG> Emerald is only a window decorator -- the thingy that draws the borders.
[23:33] <DanaG> If you don't use emerald, it uses the Metacity border theme.
[23:33] <billybigrigger> so for "the best looking" desktop, compiz+emerald
[23:33] <billybigrigger> ?
[23:33] <DanaG> I prefer without emerald, actually.
[23:33] <DanaG> Because Emerald draws itself separately, it's a royal pain to find matching themes.
[23:34] <billybigrigger> ahh
[23:34] <DanaG> Ugh, laptop using 36 watts on battery.  That's lame.
[23:34] <billybigrigger> makes sense
[23:34] <DanaG> On battery in Windows is 19 watts.
[23:35] <SwedeMike> hmm... so, the past 6-10 days or so, after I wake up my Thinkpad X200 after suspend, I'm logged out and at the gdm screen. it doesn't happen all the time, just sometimes. Anyone else seeing this?
[23:36] <SwedeMike> it's like doing ctrl-alt-backspace
[23:36] <SwedeMike> last says "gone - no logout" in my session
[23:37]  * DanaG goes off now.  Will be back later.
[23:37] <DanaG> At least Radeon does suspend.  Nouveau and NV don't -- or at least, not reliably.
[23:37] <billybigrigger> DanaG, lazer
[23:37]  * DanaG ducks
[23:37] <DanaG> =þ
[23:37] <DanaG> OOps, can't dodge light.
[23:38] <DanaG> =þ
[23:38] <billybigrigger> hah
[23:38] <billybigrigger> k, lemme rephrase so your not hitting the deck
[23:38] <billybigrigger> later
[23:38]  * DanaG hits sleep button and wonders when Freenode will notice.
[23:38] <DanaG> bye.
[23:47] <ian1> are there any (debug?) settings when running Jaunty Alpha that would make things run slower?
[23:50] <billybigrigger> hah
[23:51] <billybigrigger> was just about to ask how to install OO.org 3
[23:51] <billybigrigger> already installed by default
[23:51]  * billybigrigger sits on his Debian 5.0 "Lenny" install disk, then snaps it in half
[23:52] <SwedeMike> debian and ubuntu complements each other. I wouldn't want either to stop doing what they're doing.
[23:53] <billybigrigger> yes but im sick of trying to run newer versions of apps on debian's old ass
[23:53] <billybigrigger> like wine, OO, anything reallly
[23:53] <billybigrigger> debian calls them expiremental, or unstable packages, and they are about 2 years behind everything
[23:53] <billybigrigger> just not what im used to
[23:54] <SwedeMike> billybigrigger: well, then you should obviously run ubuntu and keep upgrading.
[23:55] <SwedeMike> billybigrigger: which is the good thing about debian vs ubuntu, you can choose what works best
[23:55] <SwedeMike> I run debian on my servers and ubuntu on my laptops.
[23:56] <billybigrigger> SwedeMike, i tried running debian etch and lenny both on this new desktop i built for the last couple of weeks
[23:56] <SwedeMike> billybigrigger: and it's not true debian is 2 years behind on everything, lenny is 3-9 months back in most aspects, and you can always choose backports repository to keep recent
[23:56] <billybigrigger> as a home server, with ftp, apapche, mysql, php, wordpress...just some stuff to play around with
[23:56] <billybigrigger> i can do all the same things, with newer software on ubuntu
[23:56] <Voltron_> Anyone notice VERY poor network performance while running Jaunty?
[23:57] <billybigrigger> etch was released in 07, lenny 09, 2 years apart between releases...not what im looking for...mind you every 6 months for ubuntu is kinda a pain in the arse too...
[23:57] <billybigrigger> Voltron, not yet..
[23:57] <billybigrigger> everything seems snappy here, in all aspects
[23:58] <SwedeMike> billybigrigger: yes, if that's what you're after, then ubuntu us what you want.
[23:58] <SwedeMike> billybigrigger: I know people who achieve the same by running debian unstable
[23:58] <Voltron_> What is a good IRC client for ubuntu? I am using Quassel and it kind of sucks
[23:58] <Voltron_> What does everyone else use?
[23:58] <SwedeMike> irssi
[23:58] <billybigrigger> xchat
[23:58] <billybigrigger> not xchat-gnome, but xchat
[23:59] <RAOF> Voltron_: irssi is pretty good, particularly if you've got a server somewhere you can ssh into.
[23:59] <SwedeMike> irssi is the only way to go if you're serious about irc
[23:59] <RAOF> Voltron_: Since my server went up in smoke, I've been using smuxi, which is pretty nice.
[23:59] <Voltron_> What do you mean? I have a server in my basement that I can ssh into...
[23:59] <SwedeMike> I have 330 windows in my irssi, I know others who have 500+
[23:59] <Voltron_> !irssi