[15:00] <barry> #startmeeting
[15:00] <MootBot> Meeting started at 09:00. The chair is barry.
[15:00] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[15:00] <barry> hello everyone and welcome to this week's ameu reviewers meeting.  who's here today?
[15:00] <gmb> me
[15:01] <intellectronica> me
[15:01] <flacoste> me (at sprint - so half here)
[15:01] <adeuring> me
[15:01] <sinzui> me
[15:01] <noodles775> and me
[15:01] <cprov> me
[15:01] <BjornT> me
[15:01] <barry> welcome noodles775 !
[15:01]  * noodles775 grins
[15:02] <allenap> me
[15:02] <barry> bac: ping
[15:02] <bac> me
[15:02] <barry> danilos: ping
[15:03] <barry> EdwinGrubbs: ping
[15:03] <barry> mars: ping
[15:03] <barry> rockstar: ping
[15:03] <barry> salgado: ping
[15:03] <salgado> me
[15:03] <barry> [TOPIC] agenda
[15:03] <MootBot> New Topic:  agenda
[15:03] <barry> pretty light day today!
[15:04] <barry> * Roll call
[15:04] <barry>  * Peanut gallery (anything not on the agenda)
[15:04] <barry>  * Mentoring update
[15:04] <barry>    * al-maisan graduates
[15:04] <barry>    * noodles to start js reviews this cycle, official mentat status next cycle
[15:04] <barry>  * Action items
[15:04] <barry> [TOPIC] peanut gallery
[15:04] <MootBot> New Topic:  peanut gallery
[15:04] <mars> me
[15:04] <barry> let's start off with this: does anyone have anything reviewish that they'd like to bring up?
[15:05] <barry> wow, nothing?
[15:06] <sinzui> js reviews
[15:06] <sinzui> can be difficult to organise when all the reviewers are sprinting
[15:07] <barry> mars: do we have a plan for mentoring more js reviewers?
[15:07] <sinzui> Do we want to consider a plan to train up js reviewers?
[15:07] <EdwinGrubbs> me
[15:07] <mars> barry, anyone can pick up a JS review, if they are comfortable doing so
[15:07] <intellectronica> ideally everyone should be able to review js
[15:08] <barry> sure, i'm just wondering if we need a mentoring program for those (like me) who feel less comfortable reviewing js.
[15:08] <adeuring> frankly, I think i need much more experience writing JS code before I would feel able to review JS code
[15:08] <mars> sinzui can't review his own JS code, but he can ask the OCR if they are comfortable doing so
[15:08] <mars> :)
[15:08] <mars> hmm
[15:09] <mars> the OCR/reviewer thing is the best we have for now - it spreads the knowledge pretty wide
[15:09] <mars> without having formal JS-Review training for all the other reviewers
[15:10] <barry> mars: i guess we just need backups then for stuff we're less experienced with?
[15:10] <sinzui> mars: Do we have updated standards and cheatsheet of common JS problems?
[15:10] <mars> barry, well, we do have 8 people who can review JS code
[15:10] <mars> sinzui, that's on my list to write today
[15:11]  * sinzui is thinking of the rule that zope3 does not make css3 valid ids, so Y.get() fails.
[15:11] <intellectronica> barry: in a way, reviewing is a great way to build confidence, because you _have_ to understand what the code does and why it's written the way it is, and you _should_ ask if you don't :)
[15:11] <barry> mars: i actually like the idea of throwing people into the deep end, getting the ocr to review the js, but with an experienced js'er reviewing the review
[15:11] <mars> sinzui, :)
[15:11] <barry> intellectronica: yep :)
[15:12] <mars> barry, if you were at the sprint, you may have rethought that...
[15:12] <barry> lol
[15:12] <mars> the deep end for browser scripting is... deep
[15:12] <mars> with sharks
[15:12] <cprov> :)
[15:13] <barry> mars: foundations will make it all better, right?
[15:13] <mars> that's why I feel it's best suited to a "volunteer" program
[15:13] <barry> mars: or are you fitting laser helmets right now?
[15:13] <mars> barry, we're working on it - tools should help
[15:13] <mars> barry, yes, tools will help
[15:14] <mars> in a few cycles we should be to the point where the reviewer can just trust the tests
[15:14] <mars> but we're not there yet
[15:14] <barry> mars: i think coding guidelines will help a lot, even if they're incomplete
[15:14] <barry> mars: something a reviewer can read and point to
[15:14] <mars> agreed
[15:14] <barry> mars: that we fill up as questions arise
[15:15] <barry> mars: so i guess the recommendation is: ocr should try to review, and ask if you're not sure
[15:15] <mars> barry, true - the JS review then becomes more of a style and conformance review, but it still has value
[15:15] <mars> also agreed
[15:16] <barry> mars: i think that's the best way to start, since those are easier to get a handle on
[15:16] <barry> oh, i also want to point out that mars updated https://dev.launchpad.net/ReviewerSchedule
[15:16] <barry> this now includes a "specialties" column so you have a better idea of who can help out with js
[15:16] <barry> sinzui: thanks.  did you have anything else on this topic?
[15:16] <sinzui> no
[15:17] <mars> s/specialties/mentoring offered/ ?
[15:17] <barry> cool, anybody have anything else on any topic not on the agenda?
[15:17] <barry> mars: sup to the reviewer i guess
[15:18] <barry> [TOPIC] mentoring update
[15:18] <MootBot> New Topic:  mentoring update
[15:18] <barry>    * al-maisan graduates
[15:18] <barry> but he's not here :)
[15:18] <adeuring> congart al-maisan!
[15:19] <barry>    * noodles to start js reviews this cycle, official mentat status next cycle
[15:19] <barry> noodles775: we'll figure out a mentor/ocr for you next cycle.  welcome aboard!
[15:19] <noodles775> Thanks!
[15:20] <barry> [TOPIC] action items
[15:20] <MootBot> New Topic:  action items
[15:20] <barry>  * gary to add `getStore()` as an alias for `_get_store()`
[15:20] <barry> gary's not here though.  does anybody know if this happened?
[15:21] <barry>  * flacoste to look into storm/sqlobject result set compatibility
[15:21] <flacoste> barry: gary still needs to do this, he's on a sprint so has an excuse
[15:21] <barry> cool :)
[15:21] <flacoste> barry: i replied with a possible solution to gavin yesterday
[15:21] <flacoste> barry: he can tell if it works or not :-)
[15:22] <barry> excellent, thanks!
[15:22] <allenap> flacoste: I'll be putting that in my branch later today.
[15:22] <allenap> Thank you :)
[15:22] <barry> allenap: great, let us know how it works
[15:22] <flacoste> allenap: if it works, i'd suggest you add it to storm itself
[15:22] <allenap> Will do.
[15:22] <barry> well, *if* it works :)
[15:22] <allenap> flacoste: Good idea!
[15:23] <barry>  * gary will check to see if there's a bug open for adding a hook to `bzr send`, and submit one if there isn't
[15:23] <barry> gary's sprinting so we won't worry about this one
[15:23] <barry>  * bigjools to take crack at helper functions for backpatching schemas to avoid circular imports
[15:23] <barry> and bigjools isn't here (sprinting?)
[15:23] <barry>  * abentley to experiment on storm base class
[15:23] <barry> nor is abentley, but does anybody know what the status of his sugarstorm branch is?
[15:24] <barry> i have not done my three action items, but now i have access to to the old wiki again, so i'm going to try to find some time to migrate/update
[15:25] <barry>  * flacoste to work on API reviewer cheat sheet
[15:25]  * flacoste hides
[15:25] <barry> no worries hoover :)  keep it on the list?
[15:26] <cprov> barry: bigjools is off (vacations) this week
[15:26] <barry> cprov: cool, thanks
[15:26] <barry> well.  that's everything that i have.  if there's nothing more we can break early
[15:26] <barry> 5
[15:27] <barry> 4
[15:27] <barry> 2
[15:27] <barry> 1
[15:27] <barry> #endmeeting
[15:27] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 09:27.
[15:27] <barry> thanks everyone!  record time
[15:27] <mars> thanks barry
[15:27] <allenap> Woo, thanks.
[15:28] <intellectronica> thanks, barry
[15:28] <noodles775> taa barry
[15:28] <barry> bye