| LaserJock | newz2000: ping | 17:16 |
|---|---|---|
| newz2000 | hey LaserJock | 17:16 |
| LaserJock | newz2000: how do I get corrections on ubuntu.com/education? can I file a bug or go through you or ...? | 17:16 |
| newz2000 | if it's a 2m fix just send them to me here on IRC | 17:17 |
| newz2000 | Hmm. Just realized that Rich is gone now. I wonder what will happen to that. | 17:17 |
| LaserJock | yeah | 17:17 |
| LaserJock | that's my concern | 17:17 |
| LaserJock | http://www.ubuntu.com/education/management#licence is waaaaay wrong | 17:18 |
| LaserJock | "All Ubuntu software is released under GPL, which means it is effectively licence free as opposed to free licence. " | 17:18 |
| LaserJock | I'm pretty sure you guys don't want ubuntu.com saying that | 17:18 |
| newz2000 | Yeah, should be "... released under an open source licesnse which means it's is freely available to use and share." How's that sound? | 17:20 |
| LaserJock | great if you fix "license" :-) | 17:20 |
| newz2000 | right | 17:21 |
| LaserJock | the link to that section on ubuntu.com/education also says "License Free" | 17:21 |
| newz2000 | Yeah, I think that's meant in a different light | 17:21 |
| newz2000 | and the context explains it | 17:21 |
| LaserJock | k | 17:21 |
| highvoltage | newz2000: are you going to make a bug report for that page that LaserJock told you about or should I? | 17:24 |
| newz2000 | no, it's fixed | 17:24 |
| newz2000 | just submitted | 17:24 |
| newz2000 | it will take a min or two to show live though | 17:25 |
| newz2000 | Hmm. lost the bold, gonna put that back in. | 17:25 |
| highvoltage | ok thanks | 17:26 |
| LaserJock | althought it's still not *strictly* true because of Multiverse, but close enough I think | 17:27 |
| boredandblogging | newz2000: question | 22:15 |
| newz2000 | hey boredandblogging | 22:15 |
| newz2000 | go for it | 22:15 |
| boredandblogging | newz2000: question about your tweet | 22:15 |
| boredandblogging | ubuntu.com based on 960 | 22:15 |
| boredandblogging | is that 960px? | 22:15 |
| newz2000 | there's a css framework called 960 that, coincidentally is 960px wide | 22:16 |
| boredandblogging | ooh interesting | 22:17 |
| newz2000 | The site will not really look much different except for that | 22:18 |
| boredandblogging | is the 960px generally accepted width? | 22:18 |
| newz2000 | Yeah, I did some looking and it seems to be | 22:18 |
| newz2000 | I can paste in my findings, it's a few lines long but there's not that many people here... | 22:19 |
| boredandblogging | yeah, that would be great | 22:19 |
| newz2000 | here it comes | 22:19 |
| newz2000 | abort | 22:20 |
| newz2000 | copy and paste from moin stinks... reformatting | 22:20 |
| newz2000 | Life Hacker Fixed at 1000px wide | 22:20 |
| newz2000 | Apple Fixed at about 980px wide | 22:20 |
| newz2000 | RedHat Fixed at about 760px wide | 22:20 |
| newz2000 | Microsoft Fixed at about 945px wide | 22:20 |
| newz2000 | Novell Fixed at about 950px wide | 22:20 |
| newz2000 | Mozilla Fixed at about 930px wide | 22:20 |
| newz2000 | Ajaxian Fixed at about 940px wide | 22:20 |
| newz2000 | A List Apart Fixed at about 930px wide | 22:20 |
| newz2000 | Yahoo! Fixed at about 970px wide | 22:20 |
| newz2000 | Adobe Fixed at about 1000px wide (except rhs logo is not fixed) | 22:21 |
| newz2000 | 37 Signals Fixed at about 850px wide | 22:21 |
| newz2000 | that's what I have so far | 22:21 |
| newz2000 | I don't often see too many attractive sites that are not fixed-width but I'm collecting data on that too | 22:21 |
| boredandblogging | very interesting | 22:22 |
| boredandblogging | i didn't realized so many people used fixed width | 22:22 |
| newz2000 | yeah. Have you heard of "the deck" (an advertising network)? | 22:23 |
| boredandblogging | yeah, they have a lot of big name sites | 22:23 |
| newz2000 | big name in web and design at least | 22:24 |
| boredandblogging | right | 22:24 |
| newz2000 | I plan to next look through them to see which are fixed-width. Of the first few I looked at all are. | 22:24 |
| boredandblogging | they have some real nice sites | 22:26 |
| boredandblogging | but I will say ze frank's site drives me up the wall | 22:27 |
| newz2000 | ugh. Never been there. | 22:28 |
| newz2000 | I'd have thought that was a link spam site | 22:28 |
| boredandblogging | he used to do a very good video podcast thing | 22:29 |
| newz2000 | boredandblogging: I'm not actually 100% sold on the 960 thing. I posted that specifically so I could get feedback. | 22:38 |
| knome | newz2000, simplebits.com | 22:39 |
| newz2000 | knome: is that a 960 site? | 22:40 |
| knome | newz2000, nope. | 22:40 |
| knome | newz2000, it's a site of a fluid-width/flexible/bulletproof sites "father" | 22:40 |
| knome | newz2000, at least he has written two books on the subject... | 22:41 |
| knome | newz2000, still he has fixed. | 22:41 |
| newz2000 | fixed at 965 or so | 22:41 |
| knome | i think it's something that's very tightly tied with the content you're going to present. | 22:41 |
| knome | (being fixed or not) | 22:41 |
| newz2000 | The trend I'm seeing is that sites going for a visual presentation are often fixed. Sites that are filled with content are more likely fluid. | 22:42 |
| newz2000 | wikipedia and scads of blog sites are examples of fluid | 22:42 |
| knome | true. | 22:43 |
| knome | also with fluid width you can expect that somebody will see the site as not-so-appealing. | 22:44 |
| knome | for example very big or very small resoutions | 22:44 |
| knome | of course min- and max-width can stop that, but IE... | 22:44 |
| newz2000 | yeah, I'm not sure that min and max width fluid sites are worth the extra design effort | 22:45 |
| newz2000 | ubuntu.com (not the homepage) use that now | 22:45 |
| knome | i think it's really important. | 22:45 |
| newz2000 | creating the graphics for the site is much much harder though. It makes the css and html far more complex | 22:45 |
| knome | yeah, i know. | 22:45 |
| knome | you don't want your site to be to wide | 22:46 |
| knome | because then every content will look bad. | 22:46 |
| knome | one paragraph per line for example | 22:46 |
| knome | and if you've reserved and designed some amount of vertical space to be used by an element, that will be largely different with "normal" resolution and big resolution | 22:47 |
| newz2000 | I'm pretty much sold on fixed-width for ubuntu.com but I'm not yet sold on the actual width to use. | 22:47 |
| knome | supposedly 1024 is the "standard minimum resolution" anyway | 22:48 |
| newz2000 | 1024 and 1280 width's account for most of the traffic to ubuntu.com | 22:48 |
| knome | then just substract the width of scrollbars. | 22:48 |
| knome | i usually go with 990 | 22:48 |
| newz2000 | google analytics however doesn't say what people's browse widths are. A lot of people like to have a sidebar open or two windows side-by-side. | 22:48 |
| knome | true. | 22:49 |
| knome | 770 is the absolute minimum i'm willing to with any site ususally | 22:49 |
| newz2000 | yeah, that's too narrow | 22:49 |
| newz2000 | lately I've been using about 850 or so | 22:50 |
| knome | if there is no good rationale for supporting smaller screens | 22:50 |
| newz2000 | this 960 framework is getting a lot of buzz and maybe the future for the default drupal theme | 22:50 |
| knome | there's no advantage for 850 over 900+, because there is no "normal" resolutions betwwen | 22:51 |
| knome | the only issue is padding in the sides of the actual content | 22:51 |
| knome | and maybe 50 px can be "reserved" for the browser window being smaller | 22:51 |
| knome | or max. to 100px | 22:51 |
| newz2000 | my thought process was that if a user has only 800px wide they'd be able to center the screen to cut off the padding and see the content without scrolling | 22:51 |
| knome | so that about 900 anyway | 22:52 |
| knome | mmh. | 22:52 |
| knome | but then you have to make sure you *have* that 50+px padding | 22:52 |
| newz2000 | true | 22:52 |
| newz2000 | I'm not sure that's even worth it though | 22:52 |
| knome | i think not. | 22:53 |
| newz2000 | if I use 960 which has a content area of 940 and 240px of that is navigation | 22:53 |
| newz2000 | then an 800px wide user could see the content area just fine | 22:53 |
| knome | if javascript is an option, see this: http://www.themaninblue.com/writing/perspective/2006/01/19/ | 22:53 |
| newz2000 | Ah yes, I've seen that. I'm actually working on a theme like that for my own blog. | 22:54 |
| knome | yep. | 22:54 |
| knome | that is worth thinking | 22:54 |
| knome | because then you could even support 640x480 | 22:54 |
| knome | it's a lot of extra work but for ubuntu.com i think it might just be worth it. | 22:54 |
| newz2000 | for this iteration of ubuntu.com we won't do that but when we redesign later this year we may. | 22:55 |
| knome | yeah. | 22:55 |
| newz2000 | This is only a very minor change in order to get us onto drupal 6 and to fix some problems that have been bugging me for the last two years. | 22:55 |
| knome | i see | 22:56 |
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