[00:10] Does it work under 8.04 or 8.10? === DanaG1 is now known as DanaG [01:02] was upgrading to 9.04 but it froze at Getting new packages...it says Fetching file 1595 of 1595..now its stock there for like an hour [01:02] do anyone know what i should do at this point? [01:03] admin_masu3701: well, if its just getting the packages, I think you could try just starting over [01:04] so just cancel it and restart? cause it not moving no more [01:05] yeah, and if it happens again, file a bug report [01:05] ok [01:06] so nothing was installed at this point right? [01:07] if you say so. I'm not totally sure [01:07] you could have to check some sort of log file, may /var/log/dpkg something [01:47] why is 'System setting' option grayed out in network manager? [01:47] ... in kubuntu [01:49] i mean disabled === JanC_ is now known as JanC [01:58] milos_: what i heard, network in kubuntu is broken. [02:00] Infecto: it runs perfectly fine in my case. Wifi was very bed before. [02:01] milos_: thats what i hear today [02:02] Does anyone happen to know if Ubiquity is broken on recent dailies? [02:03] It gets stuck after choosing the keyboard layout. [02:03] Infecto: i guess this option is disabled because there were some problems. [02:04] we will se :) [02:06] Oh, never mind, partitioner just took ages to start. [02:18] can somebody ping me? I need to test notifications. [02:18] milos__: Ping. [02:19] SeveredCross: thnx [02:19] No problem. [02:19] Now if only I could get notify-osd to notify me when I'm pinged in irssi in my terminal. [02:20] Unfortunately that would require notify-osd to somehow talk to a remote irssi. -_-' [02:21] ^_^ [02:23] I suppose it might be doable with some Perl magic and a local daemon running that knew how to speak to notify-osd...That would mean learning how to work with libnotify though. [02:26] or you could code some kind of irssi add-on that automatically notified you by some other means that someone had highlighted you [02:27] that's been done [02:27] haven't tried it, but: http://hohwie.com/blog/?p=8=1 [02:31] Oh, wow. [02:31] That's...perfet. [02:37] Though the scripts are a bit jumbled. I'll make it work. [02:42] I'm wondering about the deprecated md5 and sha modules in python. It keeps warning that we should use hashlib instead. This is really annoying as these are not my scripts that are causing this. [02:43] And if these modules still work in python 2.6, why do we need to be told that they are deprecated every time they are used? [02:43] victory747: because they don't in 3.0 [02:43] but there is a LOT that is deprecated in 3.0 [02:44] every script will need to be tested in 3.0, so why tell us about this one module? [02:44] indeed, but most of it can be fixed by the 2to3.py script [02:44] still, end users should not be seeing these warnings in ubuntu packages (like bzr-svn in my case) [02:45] jaunty hasn't been released [02:45] I expect they'll all be fixed; it's not exactly difficult to convert them [02:45] right, so that's why I'm here [02:45] you can file a bug if it hasn't already been done [02:45] python is dropping SHA1 ? [02:45] should I file bug reports against each one? [02:46] daftykins, no, just import sha - instead should use hashlib [02:46] ah [02:46] was curious, regarding all the recent website SSL certificate contents talk [02:46] i.e. how most still have MD5 sums inside, should totally be removed [02:47] So i just did the usual update process, which installed firefox 3.0.7; and still it has the same behavior as 3.0.6 of crashing when it gets shut down. [02:47] "shutdown" ? [02:47] the PC shutdown, or? [02:47] just closed? [02:47] ... click the cross in the right upper corner [02:47] oic, closing :P [02:48] yes ... shutdown ff [02:48] :-) [02:48] that's totally the wrong word to use in that context. [02:48] Oh ... :-) OK OK [02:48] ^_^ [02:48] that's pretty lame [02:48] Sorry .. then i mean Close [02:48] good dog, have a biscuit [02:49] Thanks :-( [02:49] *sigh* [02:49] i feel like a total newb for trying debian constantly [02:49] Slartibartfast, yep same here [02:49] and always coming back to ubuntu [02:50] debian is pure awesomeness packed into a nice tasty little package [02:51] not much really worked though :D [02:51] but then that's the same for Ubuntu [02:51] Debian's kernel seems to make it quiet problamatic on my PC /// something knubuntu, Opensuse, Mandriva, and Fedora doesn't do [02:51] i mean for the love of god when are they going to fix the delay on shutdown/reboot when fstab contains cifs/smb mounts O_O [02:52] daftykins, mounting samba shares in fstab is not a good idea period. [02:52] server goes down, network connectivity issues, samba share is left hanging [02:52] never reconnects, for me at least [02:53] nah they're cifs mounts [02:53] to my networked file server [02:53] which runs 24/7 [02:53] though yeah i do wonder how sensible it is if i do it on a laptop i travel with [02:53] 'cause it could quite easily give out my password on LAN when it tries to find it [02:56] ack! latest update breaks Revelation ... revelation: Depends: python (< 2.6) but 2.6.1-0ubuntu3 is to be installed [02:56] E: Broken packages === asac_ is now known as asac [03:05] ah https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/revelation/+bug/335854 [03:05] Ubuntu bug 335854 in revelation "Broken package : revelation depends: python (< 2.6) but 2.6.1-0ubuntu1 is to be installed" [High,Triaged] [03:07] ian1: that was announced [03:08] python 2.6 is becoming the default python [03:08] I have at least 30-40 packages held up like that ;) [03:10] actually, 43 [03:16] no 37 [03:18] Ahh much calmer in here =) Can someone check my backtrace... i don't think i did it properly [03:18] https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mesa/+bug/328870 [03:18] Ubuntu bug 328870 in mesa "Xlib: extension "GLX" missing on display ":0.0"." [Undecided,Incomplete] [03:20] hehe [03:20] "write" direction [03:20] like it [03:20] no idea here i'm afraid, was just looking [03:21] Rolle: well, there is no fglrx yet for jaunty [03:21] i'm newb =p so no fglrx explains all my graphic problems with this toshiba? [03:23] support for R600 and R700 is experimental at best with the open source radeon driver [03:23] my xorg.conf has nothing in the file---isn't that wrong? [03:23] nope [03:24] okay, so once it rolls out into beta all that will be added? [03:24] please pastebin your /var/log/Xorg.0.log [03:24] sur thing [03:24] unless I missed it in the bugreport [03:25] to upgrade to jaunty from intrepid, should i enable "backport" or "proposed" or both? [03:25] neither [03:25] e.g., use `sudo do-release-upgrade -d' [03:26] is it safe to upgrade now? [03:26] what are your working constraints? [03:26] any syntax highlightng i should use for pastebin crdlb ? [03:26] we're still amidst a serious Python 2.6 transition [03:26] i.e., many packages will be uninstallable [03:26] . [03:27] Rolle: plain text is fine unless you found one with an X log hilight :) [03:27] according to my crude grep-based approach, there are 256 packages that need changes for python 2.6 still ;) [03:29] heh not quite =p here's the pastebin (but lemme warn its over 1k lines http://pastebin.com/m4b6d7c62 [03:29] that's why you use a pastebin :) [03:30] i just hope the xorg.0.log doesn't show all the porn i watch =) [03:30] how do I get my nautilius desktop back? [03:31] I logged in today and crash, crash crash... I guess I need to dig though my .x* configs to see if I can find what starts the desktop [03:31] Rolle: ah, ok, I think the GLX failure is due to fglrx being installed [03:32] but uninstalling that wouldn't actually give you accelerated 3D [03:32] just working software glx [03:32] i didn't think i installed flgrx unless it carried over with the update to the jaunti [03:33] it was [03:33] that's the proprietary ATI driver if you didn't realize [03:33] hmm... [03:33] would removing it fix the ff3 scrolling prob? [03:33] hopefully, 9.3 will support xserver 1.6 (and therefore jaunty) [03:33] * jumpkick thinks his app crash reports for multiple apps are triggered but ungraceful shutdown of shutdown applet [03:34] Rolle: that's probably just due to using a driver without any acceleration [03:35] crdlb: you still speaking way over my head ;) i'm a person who can follow directions well but interpretting and making a jump from a to b is harder for me. So a driver without any acceleration... the ati driver is enabled---i tried disabling it a week ago but it wouldn't disable using gui method [03:36] *as i thought the driver may have been the problem as well [03:36] the proprietary ATI driver can't wor until it's updated for xserver 1.6, which is your problem [03:36] work* [03:36] so i should just updated it =p [03:37] * Rolle reads real quick how to be a coder [03:37] be quicker for you to sell your ATI card and get an nvidia one ;) [03:37] unfortunately, fglrx is a proprietary driver, so only ATI can do it :) [03:37] but i believe they're not supported either [03:37] hmmm coding for dummies didn't having any ideas :) [03:38] why can't drivers be open source [03:38] nvidia -173 and -180 are available, I believe (so FX and newer) [03:38] i hate them [03:38] that's what the radeon driver you're using is :) [03:38] but they _just_ started work on R600 and R700 support [03:38] ahh =) i thought i read that ati went more linux friendly [03:38] yes, by what I just said :) [03:39] apparently they;re still pants [03:39] but toshhiba should die... they give me atheros wifi card i hate them =) [03:39] they provided the hardware documentation and a few developers [03:39] so should i give ati a call? [03:39] atheros is better now that madwifi is finally dead [03:40] true crdlb my atheros card worked with 0 setup when i upgraded to 9.04 [03:40] but when going from hardy to 8.10 i still had to manipulate some shat [03:41] ath5k still needs some work for newer chipsets, but my old AR5212 works flawlessly [03:41] the problem is that i had to go through 5 dif things to try and get it to work [03:41] i still want to learn how to use the aircrack =p i'm such a noob i even find that hard to use =p [03:42] so should i purge my ati driver? [03:43] it's worth a shot to disable it [03:43] I don't think you'll get any 2d acceleration even without it interfering, but you could try :) [03:43] can you give me pointers on doing it @ the terminal level.. the gui wouldn't work when i tried it [03:43] sudo apt-get --purge remove xorg-driver-fglrx [03:43] i get 0 accelleration period [03:43] and reboot [03:46] okay it removed---i'll be back in hopefully a minute (booting isn't much quicker with 9.04 for me than 8.10 though) [03:46] oh wait [03:46] dpkg - warning: while removing xorg-driver-fglrx, directory `/etc/ati' not empty so not removed. [03:46] will that be removed upon reboot? [03:46] no [03:47] you probably used the ATI installer at some point? [03:47] i had cataylst on 8.04 [03:47] right, but if you ran the installer, that'd explain it [03:47] from ati.com [03:47] i think so i did [03:47] not on 9.04 but on a prev version [03:48] meh, you may need to run the uninstall option on that to really clean up [03:48] catalyst went missing now though =p [03:48] hmm, what's in /etc/ati right now? [03:49] 1 file: AMDPCSDB [03:49] but its in lowercase [03:50] 'AMD Persistent Configuration Store Database' lovely [03:50] i can pastebin it for you if it helps? [03:51] Does anyone know if there is a bug already for shutdown creating all kinds of app crashes? I'd like to subscribe to it [03:51] no, just leave it there [03:51] jumpkick---ihave 0 bugs when shutting down--just on hibernate or suspend [03:51] Rolle: if there's a problem with this residual fglrx install, you'll find out when you try to install the new fglrx that supports jaunty when it gets released [03:52] so we can just wait till then :) [03:52] Rolle: 32-bit or 64-bit? [03:52] 64 bit [03:52] me too... when I shutdown [03:52] I get app crashes from whatever was open [03:52] it starts asking me if I want to send all these reports, but the bugs are all dups [03:52] so it doesn't attach my dumps [03:53] when I click on them [03:53] i don't get those crashes [03:53] Rolle, do you use the shutdown appliet with the light switch? [03:53] i only get crashed on the hibernate and suspend--- thanks for the help crdlb i'll just be patient =) [03:53] bah, something that evolution uses is borked [03:53] I use that one and usually let it time out after 60 seconds [03:53] i try to help and report [03:54] and i figure its a way for me to better know my computer =) [03:54] if ATI is working with linux--why are they having their drivers as proprietary? [03:55] couldn't the linux community fix their errors quicker than them? [03:55] they can't release the code in fglrx and nobody really wants them too [03:55] to* [03:56] and I suspect seahorse-agent... [03:56] patients and contracts problem, they didn't write it all or don't own all the copyrights to release it [03:56] lol---so because they are usuing code that doesn't belong to them they don't want to release it [03:57] beautiful---copyright on math seems stupid to me [03:57] so with a crashing Nautilus desktop explorer gnome is now like kde4... [03:57] that one would crash with no way to restart the desktop filemanager too [03:58] My biggest single gripe with the OSS radeon: it sucks power like crazy. [03:58] [03:58] crdlb: I'm sure many people want them to release the code... [03:59] DanaG: now that fglrx is dead for so are ati users at the total whimm of proprietary peeps? [03:59] JanC: none of the radeon developers [03:59] * DanaG is on R600, actually. [03:59] And fglrx was broken for me even on Intrepid, oddly enough. [03:59] DanaG: right, but it'll still apply [03:59] i imagine my card is built in so its not like i could replace it [03:59] crdlb: the radeon developers are < 10 people I guess :P [03:59] just updated to latest packages in Jaunty-- Evolution couldn't send IMAP to GMail using TLS, but when I changed it to SSL it worked [04:00] https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fglrx-installer/+bug/314600 [04:00] fglrx's code is crap and even if it weren't, it'd need to be completely reworked to be a viable open source driver [04:00] Ubuntu bug 314600 in fglrx-installer "fglrx versions newer than 8.543 cause system hang and panic" [Undecided,Confirmed] [04:00] though it's not as bad as nvidia in that respect [04:00] but it includes valuable information about how to drive the hardware [04:01] so why don't people make it uncrappy? [04:01] they have specs and people working at AMD now :) [04:01] they don't have specs about the 3D engine AFAIK [04:01] or not all of it [04:01] amd=good for linux? [04:01] Right now I can't use linux on battery for very long... 30 watts == ouch. [04:01] well, they're certainly coming if they don't have them [04:01] Idle on battery in Windows is ~20 watts. [04:02] damned firefox keeps losing history and favorites. [04:02] my amd runs hot as fk [04:02] i guess all amd's do [04:02] It won't keep its grubby little hands off the files... so if you get a crash on FAT32... goodbye, places.sqlite. [04:02] DanaG: I get ~20 W on my Intel-based laptop in linux [04:03] actually if I put the LCD backlight at the lowest I get 15W or such [04:03] but my computer shuts down because of overheating in ubuntu...it never crashes because of overheating in vista [04:04] and the screen doesn't even shut off with closed lid---it just gives a "black" background [04:04] Yeah, my laptop runs hot under Ubuntu, because it leaves the GPU running full-bore, it seems. [04:04] Or downclocks it.. without downvolting it. [04:05] Rolle: that's bad, it should at least put the backlight off === defcon is now known as Guest24557 [04:05] because that's a large part of power consumption [04:05] Rolle: just now or with fglrx too? [04:05] it did with fglrx---ever since i started linux on here. [04:06] i haven't rebooted yet.... but i know the touchpad is hot as fck when i open the lid meaning power wasn't reduced [04:07] i think the problem is not a lot of the developers use toshiba =p [04:08] Toshiba seems to like doing odd stuff. [04:08] on my other computer---it runs the 8.04 it shuts down the monitor and all [04:08] this thing apparently uses ~13 W with the backlight all the way down [04:08] which means either your laptop is too new or toshiba doesn't support linux well [04:08] I have an old Toshiba around here that calls itself 966x768. [04:08] toshiba doens't support linux well--ever [04:08] yes, 966. [04:08] and my laptop is semi-new [04:08] picked it up last august [04:09] we have a new low-end toshiba that doesn't resume from suspend when you open the lid [04:09] except once in a while when it does [04:09] Heh, 3D graphics is currently set as a higher priority for the radeon developers than power management. [04:10] For me, power management would be top priority. [04:10] i have toshiba satelite m305d-s4830 [04:10] not everybody has a laptop :) [04:10] for better linux support, go with dell or lenovo or even hp [04:10] i went with the most bang for the buck [04:10] something odd on Toshiba laptops (at least the one I have): fn-ANYTHING gives an ACPI event, so you have practically limitless bindable keys with acpid. [04:10] fn-space. fn-q. fn-any-letter-you-wish [04:11] that's nice [04:11] 4g of ram with good processor for 700 bucks [04:11] i couldn't pass it up [04:11] That's handy. [04:12] * crdlb has .5g [04:12] well my fn works for a few keys---the dimming settings work [04:12] actually, I know that several people inside Toshiba & Sony want support for linux/Ubuntu [04:12] * DanaG has an HP EliteBook 8530w. [04:12] that's good [04:12] my old computer has 386 gb its running 8.04 without problems---just very slow [04:12] Kickass, but expensive. [04:12] i hate sony laptops [04:12] err [04:12] mb [04:12] it's just that they aren't the ones to make final decisions about budget ;) [04:13] they mainly just need to stop making buggy bioses with workarounds in the windows drivers :) [04:13] vista works like a charm minus the bloatedness of it and the asking you everytime youw ant to do something which is a pain in the ass [04:14] i tried to test vista 7 but it wouldnt load in the virtualbox [04:14] crdlb: that would help a lot, but unfortunately most manufacturers have this flaw :-( [04:15] and shit---i'm not going to pay microsoft to give me a service pack that fixes their mistakes in vista [04:15] DanaG: how do you capture those acpi events I woudl like to do some fun stuff there [04:15] stop the acpi daemon, and then sudo cat /proc/acpi/event [04:15] stopping the daemon: sudo invoke-rc.d acpid stop [04:15] Then you can fiddle with the files in /etc/acpi/events/ [04:16] DanaG: sweet~ learning is happening [04:16] ^^ [04:17] crdlb: can you close my bugreport? its not needed cause fglrx isn't activated right? [04:17] i don't know how to close it [04:18] Rolle: mark the status as invalid (with explanation)? [04:20] the explanation would be: I'm stupid. I didn't realize fglrx wasn't enabled yet hence why it didn't work. ? [04:20] that's fine ;) [04:22] =p you ass [04:22] i was looking for an explanation that didn't call me a dumbass [04:22] =p [04:56] major fail: www.csc.calpoly.edu/~dgoyette/safari4.png [05:01] http://users.csc.calpoly.edu/~dgoyette/safari4_2.png [05:01] lol are those buttons meant to be safari's ones? [05:01] are you a webdev or something? [05:01] The tabs are in the titlebar. Yes, that's Safari 4. [05:01] safari's such a bag [05:02] I just installed it specifically so I can mock it. =P [05:02] ic [05:02] out of interest can you test something for me? [05:02] Sure. [05:02] anyone notice their syslog not rotating? [05:02] if you go to the compatibility tab of the safari shortcut, and disable desktop compositing and the other one relating to aero, so aero turns off when safari runs, does it cure it? [05:02] I'll check. [05:03] and thus run and appear normally sort of "classic'd" [05:03] thanks [05:03] Oh yeah, note that I have it set to DPI scaling, 145DPI. [05:03] s [05:04] brb.. if you have info on the syslog rotating.. Priv msg me is ok [05:04] http://users.csc.calpoly.edu/~dgoyette/safari_noaero.png [05:04] No matter how you slice it, that's one ugly beast. [05:04] Still looks mildly retared. [05:04] Those tabs are idiotic. [05:04] s/beast/fruit/ [05:05] ouch [05:05] thanks DanaG [05:05] So many non-Microsoft things seem to make assumptions that size X font == Y pixels. Not true, if DPI != 96. [05:05] Note that this is Win7. [05:06] "XP Style" dpi scaling, 150%. [05:06] Linux does far, far far better with high-DPI. [05:06] And Apple... doesn't even try. At all. [05:06] oic [05:06] Even on OS X. [05:06] =P [05:06] sometimes sites in safari on OS X look bigger than ones in a browser on Windows though [05:06] 'tis odd [05:07] * DanaG has a 147dpi display... makes for gloriously smooth fonts in Linux. [05:07] Now if only that *fglrx*ing radeon had power management. [05:07] * DanaG is using *fglrx* to replace *frig* [05:07] =P [05:07] haha === DanaG1 is now known as DanaG [05:18] I really don't think highly of Apple. =P [05:19] neither do i [05:20] i run 2 x Dell 2408's [05:20] 24" 1920x1200 LCDs [05:20] * DanaG has an HP EliteBook laptop. [05:20] kickass, but some things don't work quite right with Linux. [05:21] https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/284319 [05:21] Ubuntu bug 284319 in linux "mute, brightness buttons on new HP 6930p laptop" [Undecided,New] [05:21] I have the 15" one, with ATI (by choice, instead of NV). [05:27] you actually actively chose ATI? O_O [05:27] mind you i suppose nvidia chips in laptops have been dying a lot lately [05:27] bit sketchy [05:28] i have had two friends with bad nvidia graphics in their laptops [05:28] very strange symptoms occur [05:28] * crdlb would probably choose intel over either [05:28] probably an R500 for a desktop though [05:28] i have a sony ultra portable laptop, compiz on intrepid runs nicely on the intel GMA950 gfx it has [05:30] ATI chip is also lower power, when in Windows -- gives longer battery life. [05:31] Choice was essentially HD3650 versus 8600-series. [05:31] ah [05:31] tbh if you want battery you should use an ultra-portable :D [05:31] though sadly my sony is best off in Windows for good battery [05:31] not quite right... there's a bell curve. [05:31] 6-7hrs vs. 4hrs in ubuntu [05:32] At least with this EliteBook line, the 14" one has a higher max time, given optimum specs, than the 12 or the 15. [05:33] One thing bugs me in Windows: it can never seem to leave the friggin' hard drive alone! [05:33] I have never, ever, ever seen a Windows box let the main system drive spin down. Ever. [05:36] I do like having a hardware mute, too. [05:42] oh i definitely have [05:42] doesn't last long though :D [05:42] drive power saving like that is bad though, induces extra wear on them [05:43] Not if you tweak it correctly. [05:44] I have my ext4 set to data=journal, with a 15-minute commit time. [05:44] no, it's a hardware thing [05:44] drives can only survive x number of spin ups/down in their lifetime [05:44] It's a moot point when the gpu is sucking so much power, though. [05:48] hrmm [05:51] is there a way to list what files in /lib32/ and /usr/lib32/ don't belong to any package? [05:59] So,...anyone know a good audio fix for 9.04? [05:59] ye [05:59] wait for beta [05:59] 8D [05:59] =/ [05:59] or better still, release [06:00] Erm....anything before that? [06:00] * DanaG has audio working fine. =P [06:00] what's your issue? [06:00] Doesn't work at all.... [06:00] Just, no sound. [06:01] I tried changing everything to ALSA...but that made the whole system unstable...so it's back to autodetect. [06:02] ah. try in gnome-terminal: alsamixer -c0 [06:02] check for muting. [06:03] How can I tell? I'd assume if "" is red, it's muted? [06:03] Wait, I see how it works now...Yea, nothing seems to be muted. [06:06] hmm, I wonder if you have multiple audio devices, and PulseAudio is using the wrong one, or something. [06:06] try aplay -l (lowercase L) [06:06] **** List of PLAYBACK Hardware Devices **** [06:06]