| LjL | just thought i'd paste a reminder every op should keep in mind | 00:41 |
|---|---|---|
| LjL | [01:41:20] <-- Keal has left this server (""Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity." -Hanlon's Razor"). | 00:41 |
| bazhang | hehe | 00:51 |
| Seeker` | I prefer nickspoons | 00:54 |
| Myrtti | LjL: I might do a crosstich home proverb on my wall from that | 00:55 |
| Myrtti | http://gingeranyhow.com/texts/text18.html | 00:57 |
| LjL | Seeker`: nickspoon's is just nickspoon's | 00:58 |
| LjL | Myrtti: the battery looks like it's got a bit of wear | 00:59 |
| Nafallo | and camels! | 01:01 |
| Myrtti | http://blog.craftzine.com/archive/2008/07/arkanoid_cross_stitch.html | 01:03 |
| J-_ | Hey :) | 01:48 |
| LjL | J-_: i don't know just which brands of routers are affected and which of them have firmware upgrades to fix it | 01:48 |
| LjL | J-_: but you can probably find it somewhere if you start from the links at the bottom of the wiki page about it | 01:48 |
| LjL | J-_: netgear i think mostly, but not really sure | 01:49 |
| J-_ | LjL: Ah, yeah. My firmware is uptodate. | 01:49 |
| LjL | J-_: anyway, the router tries to be too smart for its own good, and open ports when it thinks it's getting a DCC SEND request | 01:49 |
| LjL | J-_: except that if you're given a malformed request (even just in the form of a plain privmsg with dcc send in it), it crashes | 01:49 |
| J-_ | LjL: Ah okay. | 01:50 |
| LjL | J-_: since the router only cares about 6667, as that's where IRC is supposed to live, being on 8001 fixes it | 01:50 |
| J-_ | Nice | 01:50 |
| LjL | J-_: you'll see just what sort of strings trigger it when you ask the bots for your test | 01:50 |
| LjL | never repeat them. | 01:50 |
| J-_ | LjL: Cool. | 01:51 |
| J-_ | Thanks | 01:51 |
| LjL | np | 01:51 |
| Flannel | had you just pastebinned the stupid thing 20 minutes ago like I asked, we would've solved this issue then. | 02:14 |
| * Flannel grumbles. | 02:14 | |
| ubottu | FloodBot2 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (mass join) | 05:15 |
| ubottu | FloodBot3 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (mass join) | 05:15 |
| ubottu | FloodBot1 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (mass join) | 05:15 |
| ubottu | ziroday called the ops in #ubuntu-offtopic (thefeds) | 06:50 |
| Flannel | someone ought to ban that host post-part | 06:50 |
| Flannel | anyone? | 06:52 |
| elky | Flannel, which what where? | 07:15 |
| Flannel | elky: thefeds in -ot | 07:27 |
| elky | if he comes back again... you'll know by the belrs3.optusnet hostmask. there's only 2 others on freenode from the same area | 07:36 |
| elky | Flannel, libfprint sees and enrolls fine | 08:09 |
| elky | their gui sucks major eggs though | 08:10 |
| * jussi01 waves sleepily | 08:47 | |
| elky | Flannel, although, i havent figured how to use it still. i have fingers enrolled now, but it's not tied in with sudo etc yet... | 09:33 |
| Flannel | Really? | 09:33 |
| Flannel | I enrolled mine, and everything magically worked. | 09:33 |
| Flannel | Only thing I couldn't do without first typing my username was unlock the screen | 09:33 |
| elky | nope, not even sudo on cli works | 09:34 |
| elky | as i said, i used fprint instead of tf | 09:34 |
| Myrtti | mmmmm egg | 09:42 |
| Myrtti | I'm going to try to stay away from the computer today and clean | 09:43 |
| Tm_T | Myrtti: you can try... (;) | 09:43 |
| Myrtti | i got the work script to a fairly good condition so I'll use today to clean | 09:44 |
| Myrtti | and as Irc is fairly painful on this 770, --> | 09:45 |
| ubottu | In ubottu, ActionParsnip said: !jauntyrelease is For the release schedule of Jaunty Jackalopee, please visit https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JauntyReleaseSchedule Thanks. | 10:55 |
| Tm_T | !jaunty | 11:11 |
| ubottu | Jaunty Jackalope is the code for Ubuntu 9.04, due April 2009 - Lots of breakage between now and April - Please join #ubuntu+1 for discussion and support. | 11:11 |
| Tm_T | ubottu: no, jaunty is <reply> Jaunty Jackalope is the codename for Ubuntu 9.04, due April 2009, Schedule in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JauntyReleaseSchedule - Lots of breakage between now and April - Please join #ubuntu+1 for discussion and support. | 11:12 |
| ubottu | In #ubuntu-ops, Tm_T said: ubottu: no, jaunty is <reply> Jaunty Jackalope is the codename for Ubuntu 9.04, due April 2009, Schedule in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JauntyReleaseSchedule - Lots of breakage between now and April - Please join #ubuntu+1 for discussion and support. | 11:13 |
| Tm_T | bah | 11:13 |
| bazhang | heh | 11:13 |
| Tm_T | @login | 11:14 |
| ubottu | The operation succeeded. | 11:14 |
| Tm_T | ubottu: no, jaunty is <reply> Jaunty Jackalope is the codename for Ubuntu 9.04, due April 2009, Schedule in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JauntyReleaseSchedule - Lots of breakage between now and April - Please join #ubuntu+1 for discussion and support. | 11:14 |
| Tm_T | !jaunty | 11:15 |
| ubottu | Jaunty Jackalope is the code for Ubuntu 9.04, due April 2009 - Lots of breakage between now and April - Please join #ubuntu+1 for discussion and support. | 11:15 |
| Tm_T | nice... | 11:15 |
| Tm_T | I give up, food -> | 11:15 |
| bazhang | !-web | 11:17 |
| ubottu | web has no aliases - added by bazhang on 2009-03-14 16:44:06 | 11:17 |
| bazhang | !forget web | 11:17 |
| ubottu | I'll forget that, bazhang | 11:17 |
| bazhang | !no jaunty is <reply> Jaunty Jackalope is the codename for Ubuntu 9.04, due April 2009, Schedule in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JauntyReleaseSchedule - Lots of breakage between now and April - Please join #ubuntu+1 for discussion and support. | 11:18 |
| ubottu | I'll remember that bazhang | 11:18 |
| bazhang | !jaunty | 11:18 |
| ubottu | Jaunty Jackalope is the codename for Ubuntu 9.04, due April 2009, Schedule in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JauntyReleaseSchedule - Lots of breakage between now and April - Please join #ubuntu+1 for discussion and support. | 11:18 |
| bazhang | odd | 11:18 |
| Tm_T | bazhang: welcome to my reality (;) | 11:18 |
| * bazhang huggles Tm_T | 11:19 | |
| bazhang | Tm_T, no more problems with drostie, thanks | 11:23 |
| elky | i unplugged the dell about half an hour ago. it's now saying 5hrs 35mins of charge left | 11:24 |
| * elky <3's the 9hr battery | 11:24 | |
| bazhang | wow nice | 11:24 |
| elky | i run the screen on the lowest power setting of course | 11:25 |
| Tm_T | elky: I'm still waiting my ~15 hours battery to arrive | 11:25 |
| elky | Tm_T, oooh | 11:25 |
| bazhang | I am guessing grroovyorange and hynix will be behaving from now | 11:25 |
| elky | Tm_T, for which laptop | 11:25 |
| Tm_T | with rest of the laptop (:) | 11:25 |
| Tm_T | elky: I'm wanting AlwaysInnovating Touchbook, so I can modify it to my needs | 11:25 |
| elky | and what laptop is that? | 11:25 |
| elky | or does it not exist yet? | 11:26 |
| Tm_T | well coming in few months | 11:26 |
| elky | ooh | 11:26 |
| elky | errr.. i meant 9 cell not 9 hour | 11:26 |
| elky | i've been cleaning. slightly fumigated | 11:26 |
| Tm_T | heh | 11:27 |
| elky | but still, 6hrs is pretty good battery | 11:27 |
| * Tm_T really would like to get this one soon, so I can get my hardware tools out from boxes and make some smoke | 11:27 | |
| elky | ikonia, around? | 11:28 |
| ikonia | just | 11:29 |
| Tm_T | more food -> | 11:29 |
| ikonia | I'd just logged in to check my email | 11:29 |
| ikonia | elky: what's up | 11:29 |
| * elky wants to know what the good google calendar app he mentioned is | 11:30 | |
| ikonia | ?? | 11:30 |
| ikonia | I'm trying to find a way to sync my E71 against a calander server that's not google calander | 11:31 |
| elky | ikonia, what's the google calendar app called? | 11:31 |
| ikonia | which one ? I don't use google calander | 11:31 |
| ikonia | do you mean the one for syncing google calander with your E71 ? | 11:32 |
| elky | you mentioned one got released last week or something | 11:32 |
| elky | yeah | 11:32 |
| ikonia | http://blog.lanthaler.org/2009/02/nokia-e71-contacts-and-calendar-sync.html | 11:32 |
| ikonia | yup, syncml can now do it nativly | 11:32 |
| ikonia | must dash, back later | 11:33 |
| elky | it doesnt work for me :( | 12:02 |
| topyli | i've been syncing via scheduleworld.com, works perfectly | 12:10 |
| topyli | my-funambol.com should work too, and mobilcal.com | 12:12 |
| elky | that means giving my gmail details to someone else | 12:12 |
| topyli | mobical.net even | 12:12 |
| topyli | elky: oh google. i don't use it, i just sync my phone and evolution | 12:13 |
| elky | google seems to have dropped the ball on it. apparently it doesn't work for anyone anymore | 12:14 |
| elky | laptop has 4hrs 35 mins left now | 12:18 |
| elky | it was 5hrs 35 mins about an hour ago. this is awesome | 12:18 |
| topyli | accurate power-manager readings? stop the press! | 12:19 |
| elky | i know! | 12:20 |
| elky | although, in it's credit, i've only had it for 2 days, and the machine itself was probably built around a week ago. | 12:21 |
| bazhang | metbsd (banned in #ubuntu for trolling) was doing same in #k though quiet for now | 12:23 |
| jussi01 | if bots are slow, its my fault. Im moving quassel off that server for better performance | 12:56 |
| Seeker` | jussi01: :O | 13:05 |
| stdin | !bothelp is <reply> For ubottu usage instructions see http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBots | For help with ubottu plugins for supybot, please ask in #ubuntu-bots | 13:32 |
| ubottu | I'll remember that, stdin | 13:32 |
| stdin | !no bothelp is <reply> For ubottu usage instructions see http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBots | For help with ubottu plugins for supybot, please ask in #ubuntu-bots | 13:32 |
| ubottu | I'll remember that stdin | 13:32 |
| stdin | !supybot-#ubuntu-bots | for those of us fed-up with saying it | 13:36 |
| ubottu | for those of us fed-up with saying it: ubottu is a supybot with custom plugins, for help with other supybot plugins ask in #supybot | 13:36 |
| Myrtti | !gender | 15:26 |
| ubottu | yes, I can confirm I am a female bot :) | 15:26 |
| LjL | tssss | 15:26 |
| LjL | well, at least that explains why she's such a bore. | 15:27 |
| Myrtti | erm | 15:32 |
| Myrtti | !uuid | 15:32 |
| ubottu | To see a list of your devices/partitions and their corresponding UUID's, run this command in a !shell: « sudo blkid » (see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LibAtaForAtaDisks for the rationale behind the transition to UUID) | 15:32 |
| Myrtti | what difference does it make if it's run as root vs non-root? | 15:33 |
| LjL | Myrtti: uhm, not sure right now, but i vaguely seem to remember there was a reason | 15:35 |
| jussi01 | LjL: you be nice to her now... | 15:36 |
| * jussi01 eyes LjL | 15:36 | |
| LjL | and the reason is that MYRTTI IS MAD | 15:36 |
| LjL | Myrtti: ok it doesn't need root, *now*. but it used to. | 15:37 |
| LjL | https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/e2fsprogs/+bug/220275 | 15:37 |
| ubottu | Ubuntu bug 220275 in e2fsprogs "blkid shouldn't need root privileges" [Undecided,Fix released] | 15:37 |
| LjL | i'd say leave it like that until those are all EOL | 15:37 |
| ubottu | FloodBot1 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (mass join) | 17:14 |
| * LjL is not sure whether that might have been real | 17:20 | |
| Myrtti | ubottu: tell snuxoll about exploit | 20:45 |
| Flannel | What's with #ubuntu annoying people with "please register to speak" stuff? | 20:51 |
| Tm_T | log? | 20:52 |
| Flannel | 13:48 <sebsebseb> [20:47] [506] #ubuntu Please register with services and use the IDENTIFY command (/msg nickserv help) to speak in this channel | 20:52 |
| Flannel | That's sebsebseb telling me the message in a query, obviously | 20:52 |
| jussi01 | is there a reason snux is +v? | 20:53 |
| Myrtti | jussi01: LjL's madness | 20:53 |
| Myrtti | jussi01: next question | 20:53 |
| Flannel | jussi01: mock the voiced | 20:53 |
| Flannel | But, he can still talk, even without identifying | 20:53 |
| Flannel | Tm_T: as can you | 20:53 |
| Flannel | erm, except you're identified | 20:53 |
| jussi01 | oh meh | 20:53 |
| Tm_T | what, I can be unidentified too? | 20:54 |
| jussi01 | !modes | Tm_T | 20:54 |
| ubottu | Tm_T: There are many different channel and user modes on !freenode. Here's a list: http://freenode.net/using_the_network.shtml | 20:54 |
| Tm_T | jussi01: I know | 20:54 |
| jussi01 | particurly +R iirc | 20:54 |
| Tm_T | jussi01: didn't notice the modes when joining, thought there were spamming bot or so | 20:54 |
| jussi01 | +R (quiet unidentified) This mode prevents users who are not identified with NickServ from speaking in the channel. Users will receive a server notice explaining this if they try to speak. | 20:56 |
| Tm_T | sebsebseb isn't server? | 20:56 |
| Flannel | No? | 20:57 |
| jussi01 | Tm_T: oh? I thought he came to you with a complaint | 20:57 |
| Flannel | just a guy | 20:57 |
| Flannel | he was telling me about it. | 20:57 |
| Tm_T | aaa | 20:58 |
| Tm_T | roger roger | 20:59 |
| Tm_T | now I'm gone, sleep -> | 20:59 |
| Myrtti | erhem | 21:01 |
| Myrtti | [23:00] < Kingsy101> man o man, can someone help, i cant find anything on google on how to add eclipse PDT to the repos... anyone have any ideas?? | 21:01 |
| * Myrtti facepalms | 21:01 | |
| jussi01 | anyone seen ikonia? | 21:05 |
| LjL | meh, the whole "please register to speak" thing lasted about 30 seconds | 21:06 |
| Seeker` | last saw him in here 10 hours ago "ikonia+: must dash, back later" | 21:06 |
| LjL | i guess sebsebseb didn't notice that the same thing just stopped some couple hundreds bots from joining the day before yesterday? | 21:06 |
| LjL | although i'm not sure why people are still joining -unregged | 21:08 |
| LjL | wait a moment | 21:08 |
| LjL | !ops | does any of you CURRENTL see #ubuntu as +rR on the server you're on? | 21:08 |
| ubottu | does any of you CURRENTL see #ubuntu as +rR on the server you're on?: Help! Channel emergency! (ONLY use this trigger in emergencies) - Mez, LjL, elkbuntu, imbrandon, DBO, gnomefreak, Hobbsee, rob, Madpilot, CarlK, crimsun, ajmitch, tritium, Nalioth, thoreauputic, apokryphos, tonyyarusso, PriceChild, Amaranth, jrib, jenda, nixternal, Myrtti, mneptok, Pici, Jack_Sparrow, nickrud, jpds, bazhang, jussi01, Flannel or ikonia! | 21:08 |
| ubottu | LjL called the ops in #ubuntu-ops (does any of you CURRENTL see #ubuntu as +rR on the server you're on?) | 21:08 |
| jussi01 | not here | 21:08 |
| LjL | the joining to -unregged isn't normal | 21:08 |
| Seeker` | LjL: no | 21:08 |
| Myrtti | LjL: no | 21:09 |
| nalioth | LjL: nope | 21:09 |
| LjL | what's the +J set to? | 21:09 |
| Myrtti | I'm on simak | 21:09 |
| LjL | it should be 2,5 | 21:09 |
| LjL | (i can't see it from my client) | 21:09 |
| jussi01 | 2,5 here | 21:09 |
| LjL | ... just more channel joins than normal? | 21:10 |
| LjL | but jaunty isn't *so* near | 21:10 |
| Myrtti | it is 2,5 | 21:10 |
| * vorian is not an op, but it does not show +r or +R | 21:10 | |
| Seeker` | /lastlog +J shows it being set to 2,5 by floodbot2 almost 24 hours ago | 21:10 |
| LjL | it's after they set +rR believing there was an attack | 21:10 |
| Flannel | LjL: I don't | 21:10 |
| LjL | people kept joining -unregged even after they unset that | 21:10 |
| LjL | and that happened four hours ago | 21:11 |
| mneptok | LjL: negative | 21:13 |
| LjL | ok | 21:14 |
| LjL | verne.freenode.net is desynched | 21:14 |
| LjL | +rR have remained set on it | 21:14 |
| LjL | oh christ, i should have known mikem would have spotted it and started complaining | 21:17 |
| LjL | does he just notice *anything* that goes on with *any* channel modes? | 21:17 |
| LjL | certainly when i wrote the floodbots i *thought* that having *three* of them sync modes would prevent desync in most circumstances... | 21:21 |
| LjL | *sigh* | 21:21 |
| jrib | oh | 21:28 |
| jrib | someone was complaining about that a few hours ago | 21:28 |
| jrib | I sent him away... | 21:28 |
| jussi01 | ubottu: join #ubuntu-offtopic | 21:33 |
| ubottu | Error: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :) | 21:33 |
| * Myrtti looks at the kids play | 22:06 | |
| === bazhang_ is now known as bazhang | ||
| Shizuo | Why I am forwarded to here? | 22:56 |
| Seeker` | @btlogin | 22:56 |
| LjL | you mean why aren't you just banned? | 22:57 |
| LjL | probably because i felt nice that day | 22:57 |
| Shizuo | I can't understand your questio | 22:57 |
| Shizuo | n | 22:57 |
| LjL | Shizuo: you've been removed from #ubuntu several times | 22:58 |
| LjL | how do you explain that? | 22:58 |
| Shizuo | Being a nuisance? | 22:58 |
| LjL | to put it mildly | 22:58 |
| LjL | but, how do you explain being removed *several times*? | 22:58 |
| Shizuo | I am mild | 22:58 |
| Shizuo | Several? | 22:58 |
| Shizuo | Persecution? | 22:59 |
| LjL | wrong answer | 22:59 |
| Shizuo | Racism? | 22:59 |
| LjL | wrong answer | 22:59 |
| Shizuo | Cookies? | 22:59 |
| LjL | wrong answer | 22:59 |
| Shizuo | Trolling? | 22:59 |
| LjL | RIGHT ANSWER! | 22:59 |
| Shizuo | OH YES | 22:59 |
| Shizuo | ONE MILLION DOLLARS | 22:59 |
| Shizuo | THX | 22:59 |
| LjL | so... | 23:01 |
| LjL | what ought to make me thing such trolling won't happen again in the future? | 23:01 |
| Shizuo | That's a tough question | 23:01 |
| Shizuo | LjL: Are you a full time ubuntu do-stuff-person? | 23:05 |
| LjL | hey, i asked a question first | 23:06 |
| LjL | wait your turn | 23:06 |
| Shizuo | =[ | 23:06 |
| Shizuo | I don't know what makes you "thing" | 23:06 |
| Shizuo | I'll pass ;/ | 23:06 |
| LjL | yes, it was tough | 23:06 |
| LjL | but now pretend that i said "think" | 23:06 |
| LjL | and try answering that one | 23:06 |
| Shizuo | Oh | 23:07 |
| Shizuo | Well, as with anything on life | 23:07 |
| Shizuo | You will never be certain about this | 23:08 |
| Shizuo | There will always be a risk | 23:08 |
| Shizuo | Tough, hug? | 23:08 |
| Shizuo | Hug plz | 23:08 |
| LjL | no thanks, i've had hugs already today | 23:08 |
| LjL | i'm of slow digestion | 23:08 |
| Shizuo | Oh, ok | 23:08 |
| Shizuo | LjL: Are you a full time ubuntu do-stuff-person? | 23:08 |
| Myrtti | what does that mean? | 23:09 |
| LjL | Shizuo: tough question | 23:09 |
| Myrtti | full time? ubuntu? do-stuff-person? | 23:09 |
| Shizuo | Myrtti: Does he have a job? | 23:09 |
| Shizuo | Myrtti: At ubuntu-related operations? | 23:09 |
| LjL | that's none of your business! | 23:09 |
| LjL | oh. | 23:09 |
| Shizuo | Is he a part-time voluntary? | 23:09 |
| Shizuo | Is he a full time voluntary? | 23:09 |
| Myrtti | Shizuo: what significance would it have to you? | 23:09 |
| Shizuo | Myrtti: Curiosity | 23:09 |
| Myrtti | ie. what are you aiming at? | 23:09 |
| Myrtti | lets take an example | 23:10 |
| Shizuo | Lots of people here at freenet are employees of distribs/projects/etc | 23:10 |
| * LjL grabs the popcorn | 23:10 | |
| Seeker` | I wish I could have popcorn | 23:10 |
| Shizuo | Seeker`: Africa? | 23:10 |
| Seeker` | Shizuo: what? | 23:11 |
| Myrtti | I'm not employed by Canonical or any other distribution, but I do have a job in a company that does its operations around open source | 23:11 |
| Shizuo | Seeker`: Why can't you? | 23:11 |
| Shizuo | Myrtti: That's interesting | 23:11 |
| Myrtti | *still* I waste most of my waking time in IRC doing voluntary work | 23:11 |
| Myrtti | in *addition* to my paid work | 23:11 |
| Seeker` | Shizuo: various reasons | 23:11 |
| Myrtti | so I'm wondering, what significance would anyones job/volunteer status have to you | 23:12 |
| Myrtti | since it obviously shouldn't | 23:12 |
| LjL | Shizuo: i really need to do me a favor | 23:12 |
| LjL | before i might answer your very tough questions | 23:12 |
| LjL | will you? | 23:12 |
| Shizuo | Myrtti: No need to have two stones in hand, ok? | 23:12 |
| Shizuo | Myrtti: It was just curiosity | 23:13 |
| Shizuo | LjL: Hi | 23:13 |
| LjL | oh Shizuo, hello! | 23:13 |
| Myrtti | oh my, aren't we distracted today | 23:13 |
| Seeker` | wow, its today already? | 23:13 |
| LjL | Shizuo: i bet you can't count backwards from three to one, using words rather than digits, on three separate lines | 23:14 |
| Shizuo | LjL: Oh, you kill me | 23:15 |
| LjL | Shizuo: prove me wrong | 23:15 |
| Shizuo | That was impervious | 23:15 |
| Seeker` | Balrog_: how can we help you? | 23:16 |
| LjL | Shizuo: quick, we've got other guests in! | 23:16 |
| Balrog_ | I think I clicked in the wrong place. | 23:16 |
| Shizuo | LjL: I won't troll, sorry | 23:16 |
| Shizuo | LjL: Not by accident, that's for sure :D | 23:16 |
| LjL | Shizuo: pity | 23:17 |
| Shizuo | =[ | 23:17 |
| Shizuo | Anyway, I asked about your connection to Ubuntu just out of curiosity, as you're zealous | 23:17 |
| Shizuo | It wasn't an attempt do judge you, as mywhatever suggested | 23:17 |
| LjL | Shizuo: a mixture of boredom, brain damage and addiction to arguing with trolls | 23:18 |
| LjL | now, the answer to my question? | 23:18 |
| Shizuo | What question? | 23:18 |
| LjL | why ought i to think you won't be trolling in the future | 23:18 |
| Shizuo | It depends on the definition of what trolling really is | 23:19 |
| Shizuo | It's an overused word these days | 23:19 |
| Seeker` | being deliberately annoying is a good starting point | 23:19 |
| Shizuo | Some people call others trolls for not adhering to their ideological principles | 23:19 |
| Shizuo | That's very common these days | 23:19 |
| LjL | Shizuo, a troll as we are concerned is someone who doesn't follow | 23:20 |
| LjL | !etiquette > Shizuo (Shizuo, see the private message from ubottu) this | 23:20 |
| LjL | of course you're familiar with it? | 23:20 |
| Shizuo | LjL: Lots of "respectable" regulars fail to adhere to !Attitudes, !Language, !CoC | 23:21 |
| LjL | Shizuo: hey, you might be right | 23:21 |
| Myrtti | I call a troll someone who believes IRC is a democracy and rules are subject to voting at the Athens forum or in this case any of official Ubuntu channels | 23:21 |
| LjL | actually | 23:21 |
| LjL | i think even ops... | 23:21 |
| LjL | even ops, sometimes, fail to adhere to some sane principles they most likely ought to | 23:21 |
| Shizuo | Yes, that's correct | 23:21 |
| LjL | like not ban people randomly in the middle of a conversation, for instance | 23:21 |
| Seeker` | hmm, not the best dismount ever | 23:22 |
| LjL | *shrug* | 23:22 |
| Myrtti | could we add to the channel rules that the rules aren't open to discussion at any given channel at any given time by any given people? I find it a bit tiresome that trolls come to discuss the rules at, say, #ubuntu | 23:23 |
| Myrtti | at, say, the day of $RELEASE | 23:23 |
| Myrtti | there's place, time and opportunity for that discussion | 23:23 |
| LjL | Myrtti: they're open to discussion here | 23:24 |
| Myrtti | usually, it's not #ubuntu | 23:24 |
| Myrtti | LjL: sure | 23:24 |
| LjL | it's never #ubuntu | 23:24 |
| LjL | don't we have that in the rules to begin with? | 23:24 |
| Myrtti | I really doubt it | 23:24 |
| Seeker` | Do we really need meta-rules? | 23:24 |
| LjL | then you can most certainly blame me for not adding it when we revamped them | 23:24 |
| LjL | Seeker`: yes, not discussing bans and rules aside from in this channel is pretty basic really | 23:25 |
| Myrtti | Seeker`: there should be a disclaimer on them about where to address the possible requests of editing and change | 23:25 |
| Seeker` | if you try and make the rules all-encompassing then people will just argue that anything not stated in the rules is allowed | 23:25 |
| Myrtti | hm | 23:26 |
| LjL | that's not trying to make them all-encompassing though | 23:26 |
| Seeker` | because it isn't explicitly disallowed | 23:26 |
| LjL | although | 23:26 |
| Seeker` | LjL: it seems to be heading that way | 23:26 |
| LjL | it's probably worth adding it as rule for -offtopic but not for #ubuntu | 23:26 |
| LjL | in #ubuntu it's already implicitely a rule | 23:26 |
| LjL | since anything that's not support is disallowed | 23:26 |
| Seeker` | the only rule that should be needed is "Don't be stupid" | 23:26 |
| Myrtti | "DON'T BE A DICK" | 23:26 |
| Seeker` | or "Don't do anything the ops do not consider to be appropriate behaviour for this channel" | 23:27 |
| Seeker` | then if someone does something wrong, it is automatically covered by the rules | 23:27 |
| LjL | that's almost in there | 23:28 |
| Myrtti | the content suitable for this channel is on operator discretion (whatever the word is) and not necessarily limited by or to the rules | 23:28 |
| LjL | we added something very much like that during the revamping | 23:28 |
| Seeker` | but you shouldn't really need anything extra | 23:28 |
| Seeker` | common sense should work | 23:29 |
| LjL | Seeker`: wake up, you're dreaming | 23:29 |
| Myrtti | Seeker`: show me a troll with common sense, and I'll show you a flying cow | 23:29 |
| Seeker` | I mean common sense on our part | 23:29 |
| LjL | Seeker`: wake up, you're dreaming | 23:29 |
| Myrtti | lol | 23:29 |
| Myrtti | common sense | 23:29 |
| Myrtti | I think I left mine at the door when Umakant first appeared | 23:29 |
| Myrtti | or atleast my sensibilities | 23:30 |
| LjL | i gave my common sense to this fellow - out of pity | 23:30 |
| LjL | [00:29:24] --> bosco_ has joined this channel (n=bosco@12.109.75.188). | 23:30 |
| LjL | [00:29:39] <bosco_> bestbot | 23:30 |
| LjL | [00:29:39] <BestBot> I don't understand you, bosco_. Try asking me what's the best X, or telling me that X is the best Y | 23:30 |
| LjL | [00:29:50] <bosco_> best x | 23:30 |
| LjL | [00:29:54] <bosco_> best X | 23:30 |
| LjL | [00:30:05] <bosco_> BestBot, best X | 23:30 |
| LjL | [00:30:06] <BestBot> I don't understand you, bosco_. Try asking me what's the best X, or telling me that X is the best Y | 23:30 |
| Seeker` | if someone wants to be irritating they will, no matter what the rules are; by explicitly stating some things are against the rules, you are implicity allowing everything else (which is how most legal systems seem to work) | 23:30 |
| Seeker` | whereas on IRC this isn't the case | 23:31 |
| LjL | ya know what yer probblim ish | 23:31 |
| LjL | i was having FUN with that troll | 23:31 |
| LjL | now you're taking it seriously! | 23:31 |
| Seeker` | LjL: you may have been having fun with that troll | 23:32 |
| Seeker` | but in general, people get too angry in this channel with trolls | 23:32 |
| Seeker` | and spend waaaaaaaay too much time going round in circles with them | 23:32 |
| Seeker` | I dont think that Shizuo seriously thought they would be unbanned | 23:33 |
| LjL | i hope not | 23:33 |
| LjL | he seemed smarter than that | 23:33 |
| Seeker` | exactly | 23:34 |
| Seeker` | most trolls aren't | 23:34 |
| Myrtti | he was just playing around and LjL played with him | 23:34 |
| LjL | you see Seeker` | 23:34 |
| Myrtti | but I know what you refer with spending time going round in circles | 23:34 |
| LjL | when a troll comes to this channel | 23:34 |
| LjL | either you ignore them, if you're sane | 23:34 |
| Myrtti | and in my opinion, we cannot just tell them to GTFO | 23:34 |
| LjL | or you play with them, if you're insane | 23:34 |
| LjL | or you get angry at them, if you're a normal person | 23:34 |
| LjL | because it's an outlet | 23:35 |
| Seeker` | but in here people don't get angry | 23:35 |
| Seeker` | they just fume | 23:35 |
| Seeker` | because they aren't really allowed to get properly angry | 23:35 |
| LjL | that's why i attempt to get them to say "three, two, one" and then ban them. | 23:36 |
| Seeker` | because ops can't be seen to be getting angry like that | 23:36 |
| Seeker` | LjL: fine, you may play with them, treat it as a joke, but not everyone does | 23:36 |
| * Myrtti huggles LjL | 23:36 | |
| LjL | Seeker`: discussing this is useless really | 23:37 |
| LjL | there's only one way not to make that happen | 23:37 |
| LjL | do like nalioth does, ban them. | 23:37 |
| LjL | when you think you've had enough of a no-point conversation between an op and someone, ban them. | 23:37 |
| LjL | (the op, or the someone? that's up to you i guess) | 23:37 |
| Seeker` | I would if I could | 23:37 |
| LjL | (both if you're unsure) | 23:37 |
| LjL | Seeker`: then just say "quit it or i'll show you a photo of mneptok" | 23:38 |
| LjL | it works | 23:38 |
| Myrtti | right, I think I'm done for today | 23:39 |
| Myrtti | nini kids | 23:39 |
| Seeker` | nini Myrtti | 23:39 |
| Seeker` | have a good flight if i don't catch you before you go | 23:39 |
| Seeker` | LjL: :P Not entirely convinced | 23:40 |
| LjL | Seeker`: i'm just saying that i believe ops will keep arguing with trolls no matter how much you might keep saying it's not good | 23:41 |
| LjL | Seeker`: and if you want to stop that, say so while it's happening | 23:42 |
| LjL | though you probably won't be liked if you do | 23:42 |
| Seeker` | I have mentioned several times in discussions that I think they have gone past the point of being useful | 23:42 |
| Seeker` | and it just gets ignored | 23:42 |
| Seeker` | LjL: it doesn't work when the only people that can do anything are the ones that are currently having the argument | 23:47 |
| LjL | that's the funny part innit | 23:47 |
| Seeker` | because by the time it gets in here the person they are discussing it with already has a "history" with the person in question | 23:48 |
| Seeker` | I just reckon there is a better way of doing things | 23:49 |
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