[02:45] <Brad777> Hello everyone I am having some trouble... http://paste.ubuntu.com/138671/ is the error message... it was working fine yesterday and the only thing that has changed since then is that i turned off the computer
[02:46] <Brad777> i've googled but found no solution
[02:56] <n2diy> Brad777: what kind of video card?
[02:57] <Brad777> n2diy, NVIDIA9800GTX+ Superclocked edition
[02:57] <Brad777> using the 180.2x driver
[02:58] <n2diy> Brad777: I suspected a Nvidia, have you googled the card and Ubuntu? Or maybe someone in #ubuntu could help? GL
[03:03] <Brad777> n2diy, well i was confused because i've never had trouble b4
[04:31] <brandonban6> I feel xfce4-panel is really frustrating to work with. I would like to create a launcher, and the be able to move that launcher where ever I want to. I find I am unable to do that, is there another where to add items to the panel?
[04:39] <rocko> hello
[04:39] <rocko> saluton
[04:40] <rocko> hallo
[04:40] <rocko> moin moin
[04:40] <rocko> hola
[04:40] <rocko> how are is everyone?
[04:40] <rocko> kiel vi fartas?
[04:40] <rocko> was ist los?
[04:41] <forces> saluton
[04:42] <rocko> cxu vi  spektas  la esperantan lingvon? forces
[04:42] <forces> xD
[04:42] <forces> hola
[04:42] <forces> español mjor
[04:42] <forces> mejor*
[04:42] <rocko> you majored in espanol ?
[04:46] <forces> rocko, habla español o ingles
[04:47] <rocko> I do not speak Spanish forces
[04:48] <rocko> just English and Esperanto
[04:48] <forces> english
[04:49] <rocko> in English we capitalized specific things
[04:50] <rocko> also entire acronyms
[04:50] <rocko> like GNU, LASER, FBI....etc
[04:50] <forces> im an english learning
[04:50] <forces> and i always practice my english here
[04:52] <rocko> I see interesting forces
[04:53] <rocko> I am learning English.
[04:53] <rocko> would be the correct way to say it
[04:55] <forces> :P
[05:06] <rocko> where you from forces ?
[05:20] <forces> rocko, El Salvador
[05:20] <rocko> o
[05:20] <rocko> I see
[05:21] <rocko> where is that ?
[05:22] <rocko> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/El_Salvador
[05:22] <rocko> cool stuff
[05:22] <rocko> so how is the weather there?
[05:22] <rocko> forces ^
[05:24] <rocko> http://www.newint.org/features/2005/12/01/el-salvador-guerilla.jpg
[05:24] <rocko> crazy stuff
[05:25] <rocko> http://www.newint.org/features/2005/12/01/el-salvador-guerilla.jpg
[05:25] <rocko> whoops
[05:25] <rocko> A young guerilla cradles her automatic rifle a year before the end of El Salvador’s civil war in 1992. Photo: Martin Adler / Panos Pictures Photo: Martin Adler / Panos Pictures
[06:44] <linux> hey, I just installed xubuntu, how do I make it where I don't have to login on startup?
[06:46] <tavasti> linux, see http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=221302
[06:46] <tavasti> btw, your nick is not very suitable for newbie
[06:57] <freego> xubuntu 9.04 beta is now avaible
[06:57] <freego> you can testing if you want
[06:57] <freego> you can help and report bugs
[08:19] <goodbyeWindows> hi all
[08:20] <goodbyeWindows> just a newie here, installed xubuntu, looks nice, seem to find my way around ok..just finding it weird that my Ethernet doesn't seem to work properly. It's just a Marvell Yukon, nothing special. Any ideas?
[08:23] <dingding> somebody here?
[08:23] <ikonia> dingding: not here
[08:23] <ikonia> dingding: don't start again
[08:23] <ikonia> dingding: you're using ubuntu - this is for xubuntu support
[08:23] <dingding> im not starting again
[14:41] <steveccc> hi all - is there anyone here who used to be a sole gnome user who switched to xubuntu - i am interested to know any things that annoyed you and things that pleased you and generally your thoughts
[14:48] <TheSheep> windowmaker users don't count? :)
[14:48] <tavasti> and what about fvwm users?
[14:48] <steveccc> thesheep: is that directed to me?
[14:49] <kahrn> steveccc, I use gnome on my desktop and xfce on my laptop. XFCE just seems to be a little.. I dunno.. cleaner
[14:50] <kahrn> and I'm loving the xubuntu login screen in 9.04 beta
[14:50] <steveccc> i just wondered if it was a little raw and unpolished.  I havent used it for years but do fancy putting it on my laptop for sheer speed but thats why i was asking others opinions
[14:50] <genii> xfce needs a better menu editor
[14:50] <steveccc> kahrn: is the look and feel much different in 9.04
[14:51] <kahrn> hmm
[14:51] <kahrn> not amazingly different, but the login screen is
[14:52] <vinnl> That "cleaner" thing is exactly what I feel :)
[14:52] <charlie-tca> menu editor is coming in Xfce 4.8
[14:52] <vinnl> \o/
[14:52] <kahrn> also, I don't use xubuntu for speed
[14:53] <kahrn> I'm running a pentium M with 1.4ghz or so of power, but the differences between gnome and xfce tend to be negligible once you have all the services you require running, etc
[14:53] <vinnl> See http://gezeiten.org/post/2009/03/libxfce4menu-to-to-be-renamed-to-gdesktopmenu as for the menu editor :)
[14:55] <tomsdale> hi - I don't have xubuntu in front of me but need to help someone on the phone.
[14:55] <tomsdale> How can I change the keyboardlayout in xubuntu 8.10
[14:56] <sdf2> %alsa
[14:56] <sdf2> !alsa
[14:56] <J_Litewski> tomsdale, it should be in the settings manager
[14:57] <vinnl> tomsdale, in the Settings Manager, click "Keyboard", then the Layouts tab
[14:57] <sdf2> any clue how can i setup my mic in xubuntu 8.10?
[14:58] <J_Litewski> speaking of keyboards, does xubuntu still support the FN key for laptops?
[14:58] <sdf2> in ubuntu i have pulseaudio
[14:58] <tomsdale> c'est beau
[14:58] <vinnl> J_Litewski, last time I checked it did :)
[14:58] <tomsdale> thx, J_Litewski, vinnl. she found it.
[14:58] <vinnl> Which was with the next version that is yet to be released :P
[14:58] <J_Litewski> hmmm, it seems that it it doesn't work for the xfce-mixer then
[14:59] <vinnl> sdf2, I believe you can use Pulseaudio in Xubuntu as well
[14:59] <vinnl> !pulseaudio
[14:59] <J_Litewski> nor the brightness setings
[14:59] <sdf2> i don't wanna use it
[14:59] <vinnl> J_Litewski, well, it did for me... Which version are you using?
[14:59] <sdf2> i wanna use simple alsa in xubuntu
[14:59] <J_Litewski> right now, 9.04 Beta
[14:59] <J_Litewski> since 8.10 had some stability issues with my laptop
[15:00] <vinnl> Well, that one should definitely support it
[15:00] <J_Litewski> no go here then
[15:00] <vinnl> :(
[15:00] <J_Litewski> filing a bug report
[15:01] <sdf2> in alsamixer i set everyting to max in the capture tab
[15:01] <sdf2> and the audio recorder still doesn't recognize my mic
[15:01] <J_Litewski> also, when did launchpad bugs become private only?
[15:01] <charlie-tca> !mic
[15:01] <J_Litewski> i filed a bug yesterday about the gnmoe-app-install bug, and it got linked to a bug i can't view
[15:02] <J_Litewski> *gnome-app-install
[15:02] <charlie-tca> sdf2: Make sure the mic is turned on and the volume is turned up for it in the volume control.
[15:03] <charlie-tca> J_Litewski: when they are filed with apport
[15:03] <J_Litewski> ah
[15:03] <charlie-tca> Until a member of bugcontrol or apport team releases it
[15:03] <sdf2> i turned on my mic, and set everything to max in the alsamixer for capture
[15:07] <sdf2> can i set somehow whats my default device
[15:07] <sdf2> for capture and for playback
[15:07] <sdf2> like in gnome?
[15:16] <jatt> how do I activate desktop effects with xubuntu?
[15:17] <vinnl> jatt, you mean the desktop effects that come with Xfce or those you also see in Ubuntu?
[15:18] <dingding> compiz will work in xubuntu?
[15:18] <jatt> like compiz in gnome
[15:18] <jatt> does xfce has  new desktop effects?
[15:18] <jatt> have
[15:18] <vinnl> dingding, yes it will
[15:18] <jatt> how do I activate it?
[15:18] <vinnl> jatt, yeah, a little more limited than Compiz but more stable
[15:18] <J_Litewski> whats a CIDSupplement?
[15:19] <jatt> in gnome you can select advanced desktop effects
[15:19] <vinnl> jatt, you can enable Xfce's effects under "Window Manager Tweaks" in the settings manager, "enable compositing or something"
[15:19] <jatt> ok I see
[15:19] <vinnl> jatt, for Compiz, I wrote a blog post on that, wait a sec
[15:19] <vinnl> (It happens to be the first result when you Google for "xubuntu compiz", btw :P)
[15:19] <jatt> compositor
[15:19] <jatt> they should call it compiz :)
[15:20] <vinnl> Here, shameless plug: http://xubuntublog.wordpress.com/2007/12/09/xubuntu-compiz-pretty-pretty-xubuntu/
[15:20] <vinnl> jatt, yeah that would _not_ be confusing :P
[15:20] <jatt> ok thanks
[15:20] <jatt> I will read it
[15:50] <sdf2> re
[15:50] <sdf2> mic is still not working any tisp?
[15:50] <sdf2> *tips?
[15:51] <J_Litewski> common sense question, is it plugged into the mic port?
[15:56] <J_Litewski> i can't test to see if I get the same problem sdf2, my laptop doesn't have a built in mic
[16:06] <sdf2> its not a laptop
[16:06] <sdf2> its my desktop pc
[16:06] <sdf2> its plugged in my soundcard
[16:06] <sdf2> and i can hear myself if i turn up amic
[16:06] <sdf2> i managed to make it work with ubuntu
[16:07] <sdf2> i use alsa now instead of pulseaudio
[16:07] <sdf2> i had pulseaudio when i had ubuntu installed
[16:07] <sdf2> i don't wanna install pulseaudio back
[16:07] <sdf2> is there a way i can set the default capturing device?
[16:08] <TheSheep> yes, each application has a setting for it
[16:09] <sdf2> !alsa
[16:09] <sdf2> change device(alsa mixer)
[16:09] <sdf2> where can i find it in xfce?
[16:09] <sdf2> or in terminal?
[16:10] <TheSheep> xfce doesn't have it
[16:10] <TheSheep> it doesn't do "one to rule them all" sound system, each application does it by itself
[16:11] <sdf2> aham
[16:11] <sdf2> i just opened up gnome-sound recorder
[16:11] <sdf2> which is installed basically
[16:11] <sdf2> i set capture to mic
[16:11] <sdf2> and it doesn't recognize any voice
[16:12] <TheSheep> well, gnome-sound-recorder will use the gnome settings, obviously
[16:12] <sdf2> i just installed xubuntu
[16:13] <TheSheep> sdf2: the xfce4-mixer doesn't show the mike as muted?
[16:13] <mestmagaer> xubuntu change resolution monitor
[16:14] <mestmagaer> i would put 1024x768 but is not available
[16:14] <TheSheep> xubuntu doesn't have a resolution monitor, and there are no plans to change it
[16:14] <TheSheep> no, wait
[16:15] <sdf2> TheSheep: xfce4-mixer shows no mute?
[16:15] <sdf2> i just see the sliders
[16:15] <TheSheep> sdf2: and they are not at the bottom for the mike?
[16:15] <sdf2> nop
[16:15] <sdf2> i made it to the max
[16:15] <TheSheep> sdf2: if you go to options, does it show more than one device?
[16:16] <TheSheep> file->options
[16:16] <sdf2> TheSheep: i set pcm to max, now mic is recognizing, but its capturing my output sound
[16:17] <TheSheep> sdf2: set mic boost to something higher
[16:17] <TheSheep> sdf2: also, make sure to select the microphone in the 'input source'
[16:17] <TheSheep> you can enable that control in options if it's not displayed
[16:18] <sdf2> i selected mci1 in xfce4-mixer
[16:18] <sdf2> it was on mic1 in gnomemixer too with this pc
[16:18] <sdf2> in gnome recorder i set it to microphone
[16:18] <sdf2> the input
[16:18] <sdf2> but its recording the video i play
[16:18] <sdf2> i turned on mic boost
[16:18] <sdf2> same
[16:19] <TheSheep> maybe try alsamixer in terminal :/
[16:19] <TheSheep> it might show more controls
[16:19] <sdf2> the first was i tried
[16:19] <sdf2> i try again
[16:19] <sdf2> btw what is PCM?
[16:20] <TheSheep> sdf2: the main output channel
[16:20] <sdf2> if its at max it records my output otherwise nothing :S
[16:20] <sdf2> it looks like no mic is the default for capture
[16:21] <TheSheep> it looks to me more like the mic is working, just very quiet
[16:21] <TheSheep> so you don't hear it until you make output very loud
[16:21] <TheSheep> your microphone doesn't have any mute buttons?
[16:21] <sdf2> nop
[16:22] <sdf2> when i play a video
[16:22] <sdf2> soung recorder records the video's sound
[16:22] <TheSheep> hmm.. are the otehr options in the xfce4-mixer's 'input' control?
[16:23] <sdf2> what should i look for?
[16:23] <TheSheep> mic2 or anything, really -- it may be misnamed
[16:23] <TheSheep> the drivers sometimes guess channe lnames wrong
[16:24] <sdf2> if i set to mic1
[16:24] <sdf2> and i slide amic to max
[16:24] <sdf2> i can hear myself
[16:24] <sdf2> in the speakers
[16:25] <TheSheep> mestmagaer: probably your monitor is not detected properly. Try setting horizontal and vertical refresh rates in your xorg.conf
[16:26] <mestmagaer> mi xorg is this
[16:26] <sdf2> if i slide down PCM
[16:26] <TheSheep> mestmagaer: please don't paste to the channel
[16:26] <mestmagaer> Section "Device"
[16:26] <mestmagaer> 	Identifier	"Configured Video Device"
[16:26] <sdf2> its still recording from my output
[16:26] <mestmagaer> EndSection
[16:26] <mestmagaer> Section "Monitor"
[16:26] <mestmagaer> 	Identifier	"Configured Monitor"
[16:26] <mestmagaer> EndSection
[16:27] <sdf2> somehow in the recorder program, even if i set it to mic, it still uses my pcm
[16:28] <TheSheep> I really don't know the gnome-sound-recorder
[16:28] <sdf2> anyhow i set it
[16:28] <sdf2> it still uses pcm for input
[16:28] <sdf2> i tried every 20 option
[16:28] <sdf2> for input device
[16:29] <sdf2> and the lol is, i muted everything in alsamixer for capture
[16:29] <sdf2> but not my mic
[16:31] <sdf2> lol
[16:31] <sdf2> now it says audio capture settings are invalid
[16:32] <sdf2> something died cause it doesn't even recognize my output for capture
[16:32] <TheSheep> there is no 'sound daemon' or anything
[16:32] <TheSheep> maybe some program is holding onto the device now?
[16:33] <sdf2> emm i turned pcm to top now its same again
[16:33] <sdf2> like i turn down pcm
[16:33] <sdf2> it can't record
[16:33] <sdf2> if its up
[16:33] <sdf2> it records from pcm
[16:33] <TheSheep> madness
[16:33] <sdf2> lmao
[16:34] <sdf2> i recorded some sound xD
[16:34] <TheSheep> how?
[16:34] <sdf2> madness
[16:34] <sdf2> i set analog mixer to max
[16:34] <TheSheep> so it confused channel names
[16:34] <sdf2> i know it must be max like with my previous linux isntall...
[16:34] <sdf2> but
[16:34] <sdf2> when i opened xfce4-columecontrol thing
[16:35] <sdf2> it was on mute
[16:35] <sdf2> -.-'
[16:35] <sdf2> i set it to max in alsamixer
[16:35] <sdf2> now i'm confused
[16:35] <sdf2> if i set sound recorder to master
[16:35] <sdf2> it still records from mic
[16:35] <sdf2> :D
[16:35] <sdf2> crazy
[16:36] <sdf2> now i turned down analog mixer in alsamixer
[16:36] <sdf2> for playback
[16:37] <sdf2> and its still working oO
[16:37] <sdf2> nor anymore
[16:37] <sdf2> *t
[16:38] <UKGent> j/ #xubuntu offtopic
[16:38] <sdf2> its bad again cry...
[16:38] <TheSheep> UKGent: with a dash and without the space in front
[16:39] <TheSheep> oh and it's /j
[16:39] <sdf2> linux need newbies like me too...
[16:39] <TheSheep> sdf2: linux needs newbies teh most
[16:39] <sdf2> or it never going to be used by more people
[16:39] <TheSheep> yup
[16:39] <sdf2> its really annoying, that its bad again :S
[16:39] <UKGent> lmao  you must think I am a right 'dumbass'   I like to say 'absent minded professor'  ...
[16:40] <TheSheep> UKGent: nah, I make typos all the time
[16:40]  * charlie-tca thinks more like "Got to do it right! even when it's wrong"
[16:40] <UKGent> TheSheep You are being too kind...
[16:41] <vinnl> You're still not in -offtopic ;-)
[16:41] <UKGent> Roll of drumbs - to be fair - I am working in another workspace on something else as well lol
[16:42] <sdf2> if i set recorder to microphone its not recording
[16:42] <sdf2> if i set to master
[16:42] <sdf2> its recording
[16:43] <TheSheep> sdf2: don't pay attention to the names, they are wrong obviously
[16:43] <sdf2> yes
[16:43] <TheSheep> sdf2: just find a combination that works
[16:43] <sdf2> that was my only problem...
[16:43] <sdf2> i set everything correctly and ...
[16:43] <sdf2> going nuts again cause just this little missnamed thing
[16:44] <TheSheep> include the make and model of your sound card in teh bug report
[16:44] <sdf2> where can i do this bugreport?
[16:44] <TheSheep> !bugs
[16:44] <sdf2> i should check the channel's topic
[16:45] <TheSheep> unfortunately you have to register :(
[16:45] <sdf2> i hate that i have to register everywhere :P
[16:46] <TheSheep> yeah
[16:46] <sdf2> but some bots can kill a forum/site in a sec
[16:46] <vinnl> Launchpad needs to become an OpenID client as well :)
[16:48] <charlie-tca> It is, isn't it. It used the same name and password for me as the wikis
[16:48] <vinnl> It's only a provider, AFAIK
[16:48] <vinnl> And the wiki is a client, I believe
[16:48] <vinnl> Thought it might be the case that it only allows LP-OpenID's
[16:48] <charlie-tca> Weird.
[16:49] <sdf2> emm
[16:49] <UKGent> I am making the first tentative steps towards daring to open a terminal and have a 'bash' at 'BASH'  So if I disappear for a few days... the worst has happened!
[16:49] <sdf2> no bug
[16:49] <sdf2> it was some glitch i think
[16:49] <sdf2> now its working with mic set for capture
[16:49] <sdf2> funny
[16:50] <sdf2> i go do a restart and start reading the biblic
[16:50] <sdf2> :)
[16:51] <Slonkie> Anyone in here using Maple 11 for linux?
[16:53] <UKGent> Slonkie not for Linux - I do have a Windows Maple 10 but have not used it for ages. Maple is a big bloated Application IMHO but with a powerful Math Engine
[16:53] <Slonkie> yeah well, as you mentioned it's a powerful math engine and we use it at my school
[16:54] <Slonkie> but when i'm installing it, it dosn't show up in the applications :/
[16:55] <UKGent> Slonkie - well I am a Linux rookie but I know that applications like that often don't show up on the Menus
[16:55] <sdf2> i rebooted my system
[16:55] <UKGent> Linux seems to be able to put stuff just about anywhere
[16:55] <sdf2> now it says audio capture devices are invalid
[16:55] <sdf2> -.-'
[16:55] <Slonkie> Then i looked trough the maple folder i installed in, and i chouldn't find how to run the application..
[16:55] <sdf2> and mic is bad again
[16:56] <UKGent> Ask TheSheep He knows everything !
[16:56] <sdf2> can u try, and not be a kid?
[16:56] <vinnl> UKGent, it depends... When an application provides an installer for Ubuntu and Xubuntu and the likes (i.e. a file that ends in .deb), it will get a menu entry just fine
[16:56] <Slonkie> this is a .bin
[16:57] <UKGent> vinnl Thanks - yes. It depends on the installer as you say
[16:58] <vinnl> Slonkie, then you can blame the application creator for not creating a menu file for the application ;-)
[16:58] <UKGent> Some downloads come in these Tarball archive things don't they?   They seem to get auto extracted and then you can often just click the exec
[16:58] <vinnl> Well, yeah, some do, but that's kind of bad practice
[16:58] <sdf2> now this is crazy, mic isn't working again...
[16:58] <Slonkie> But i should be able to use it even tho it doesn't create a menu entry ;)
[16:58] <sdf2> every setup i made disappeared...
[16:59] <vinnl> On the other hand, if you want to support many different Linux distributions, creating an appropriate package for each is a lot of work
[16:59] <UKGent> vinnl I am glad you said that because I intuitively thought that it is not good somehow
[16:59] <vinnl> Slonkie, yes, of course... I don't really know the application so I don't really know where to look... Is it a free download?
[16:59] <Slonkie> No it's expensive :(
[16:59] <vinnl> Well, then I can only suggest you try typing 'maple' in a terminal window
[17:00] <UKGent> Maple is very expensive ! I know - I bought Maple 10
[17:00] <Slonkie> I tried, diden't work :(
[17:00] <Slonkie> I'm glad my school is paying, UKGent :P
[17:00] <vinnl> Slonkie, and if you type 'map', then press Tab, what do you see?
[17:00] <UKGent> Slonkie - lucky you - can you not use Search to find the location ?
[17:00] <Slonkie> hmm i'm gonna try that, first i have to install it agian :)
[17:01] <sdf2> is there anyway i can save my alsamixer config?
[17:01] <sdf2> or where does xubuntu store it?
[17:01] <vinnl> Slonkie, or perhaps 'xmaple', as this page mentions: http://wiki.netbsd.se/How_to_run_Maple_on_NetBSD/i386
[17:02] <vinnl> Ah, Slonkie, did you pick a directory to install Maple in?
[17:02] <UKGent> vinnl would it not usually put it in the bin directory ?
[17:02] <Slonkie> Yes, vinnl.
[17:02] <vinnl> Slonkie, then there's a folder named 'bin' inside, that contains a maple or xmaple file, which you can double-click to run it
[17:03] <vinnl> UKGent, all depends on the developer, but apparently Maple's did so ;-)
[17:05] <Slonkie> heh i tried that vinnl.. maple doesn't start
[17:06] <vinnl> Slonkie, both maple and xmaple?
[17:06] <Slonkie> oh now it works
[17:06] <vinnl> Ah good :)
[17:06] <Slonkie> xmaple did the trick, thanks vinnl :)
[17:06] <vinnl> yw :)
[17:07] <UKGent> vinnl so if you get a choice of installation downloads - it is best to choose the Deb one ?
[17:07] <vinnl> UKGent, yep, always
[17:07] <vinnl> In fact, usually when a .deb is not available, I don't install it
[17:08] <vinnl> UKGent, by the way, when you install files using the "Add/Remove..." or "Synaptic Package Manager" options from the menu, that's also fine (it downloads and installs .deb files in the background)
[17:09] <vinnl> In fact, that's the best option because those .deb files are provided by the Ubuntu developers and thus checked for not being malicious and for adhering to such things as providing menu files ;-)
[17:10] <Slonkie> Would i be able to add Maple to the Office menu in the Applications menu?
[17:10] <UKGent> vinnl and is it best to use the terminal to install a freshly downloaded deb application ? If the Add/Remove or Synaptic do not list it ?
[17:10] <vinnl> Slonkie, you can, wait a sec
[17:10] <vinnl> UKGent, well, you can install a downloaded deb application by just double-clicking on it ;-). If Add/Remove or Synaptic doesn't list it or the version provided there is too old, you can do that
[17:11] <UKGent> vinnl  shows how much I know - I was doing the opposite and avoiding debian - the name has such a legendary (Robin Hood) reputation lol
[17:12] <vinnl> Haha, well, Xubuntu is based on Ubuntu which is based on Debian, so... ;-)
[17:12] <vinnl> Though you should take care to download .deb packages made for Ubuntu
[17:12] <vinnl> (Or Xubuntu, of course)
[17:12] <UKGent> vinnl I was messing around with RPM (which I really don't understand) or Tarballs, which I sort of partially understand ...
[17:14] <vinnl> UKGent, .rpm's are what distributions like Fedora use instead of .deb files, tarballs are just archives (like .zip's, e.g.) that often contain the source-code or distribution-independent (but unintegrated) executable files)
[17:14] <vinnl> *-)
[17:14] <vinnl> Slonkie, what's the folder the xmaple file is in?
[17:14] <UKGent> vinnl so it is just like Windows exec files - you just have to ask yourself 'do I trust the originator of this application' before double clicking ?
[17:14] <vinnl> UKGent, yes
[17:15] <vinnl> (And yeah, it's a complicated story, but that's the way it is...)
[17:16] <UKGent> vinnl thanks for explaining all of that - it is confusing for 'newbies' because you get the impression that most apps are delivered via archive files and that there will always be an exec to click onto, to activate the installation
[17:17] <Slonkie> /root/maple11/bin/ vinnl :)
[17:17] <vinnl> UKGent, yeah well, the main confusion stems from the fact that in Windows, you download files and execute them, while in Xubuntu, you mostly install stuff from the Add/Remove... application
[17:17] <Slonkie> which is even easier than in windows!
[17:18] <Slonkie> too many people thinks the opposite
[17:18] <vinnl> Yeah it is, and you even get automatic updates :)
[17:18] <UKGent> vinnl So you are better off learning about configuring your repositories and mirrors , rather than messing around with 'one off' downloads via websites ?
[17:18] <vinnl> Slonkie, ehm... I created a menu file for you, shall I explain where to save it or do you just want a command that saves it to the right location? ;-)
[17:19] <UKGent> vinnl that is, if you are interested in an app that is not in the main (default) lists
[17:19] <vinnl> UKGent, well, if you run Xubuntu, most application you'll want are available with the default repositories, so there's most of the time not even a need to configure that
[17:19] <Slonkie> Well i guess you chould just tell me where to put it
[17:19] <vinnl> UKGent, yep
[17:19] <vinnl> Slonkie, OK, wait, I'll upload it somewhere
[17:20] <vinnl> Slonkie, OK, this is it: http://paste.ubuntu.com/139090/plain/
[17:20] <Slonkie> Cool
[17:20] <vinnl> Slonkie, you'll want to save that to .local/share/applications in your home directory
[17:21] <Slonkie> with what name?
[17:21] <vinnl> Ehm, doesn't really matter as long as it ends in .desktop... I'd say maple.desktop :)
[17:21] <Slonkie> Cool, many thanks :)
[17:22] <UKGent> vinnl one thing I have learned is that you can basically save things anywhere convenient but don't put them in the root folder !
[17:22] <vinnl> After it's saved it should appear in your menu... You can force reloading the menu with sudo update-desktop-database
[17:22] <UKGent> Unless they have to be run as 'root'  - I suppose
[17:23] <vinnl> UKGent, well... You can save it anywhere if you're logged in as root, but you'll mostly want to save your files in your home directory
[17:23] <Slonkie> Thanks great vinnl. i can't say how much i appriciate this :)
[17:23] <J_Litewski> does ubuntu support MP4?
[17:23] <UKGent> vinnl yes - but I assume that it is bad security to place anything in the root directory?
[17:24] <vinnl> J_Litewski, yes, though you might need to install something for that (I believe you're asked to install it when you double-click an MP4 file)
[17:24] <vinnl> Slonkie, you're welcome :)
[17:24] <vinnl> UKGent, yeah, well, it's bad practice to place anything outside your home directory manually
[17:25] <UKGent> vinnl - right
[17:26] <J_Litewski> kk, ty vinnl. I'm trying to bypass the fact that all the flash plugins for Ubuntu don't work
[17:26] <vinnl> Hmm, that's odd... How do they not work?
[17:27] <J_Litewski> with streaming video, it doesn't connect, and with other movies, it's hit and miss with bad quality
[17:27] <vinnl> J_Litewski, which plugin are you using?
[17:27] <UKGent> Litewski - mine seem to - I always test everything against the NASA Home Site - even Chrome had trouble coping with some of their peculiarities - I just used the gstreamer additions
[17:28] <J_Litewski> right now, Gnash
[17:28] <vinnl> J_Litewski, well, that's expected with that one, as that only supports Flash v.7, while the newest is 9
[17:29] <vinnl> J_Litewski, you might want to install "Xubuntu Restricted Extras", which adds support for a whole lot of things like Java, Flash, MP4, etc.
[17:29] <J_Litewski> i also have swfdec and adobe flash, even though adobe doesn't come up on firefox's plug-in list
[17:29] <vinnl> I'd recommend you to remove them all and then install the restricted extras package, which should install Adobe's, and then see what's wrong
[17:29] <J_Litewski> kk
[17:29] <UKGent> And you can always just install flash anyway - if you don't mind using non-free ?
[17:30] <J_Litewski> how do you remove a plugin? disable it?
[17:30] <vinnl> No just uninstall them
[17:31] <J_Litewski> in a package manager?
[17:31] <vinnl> J_Litewski, yeah, Add/Remove... should do
[17:33] <UKGent> vinnl I had trouble with Flash and just ended up finding the main Adobe package in Add/Remove and installed it. It makes you agree to the terms & conditions and just installs it same as you would on a windows sys.
[17:33] <vinnl> Yeah I know, that's what we're going to do now :)
[17:34] <UKGent> vinnl - I feel a traitor to the 'free' cause doing it ... but you need flash for many sites these days - in my case NASA
[17:35] <J_Litewski> I have xubuntu restricted extras installed
[17:35] <vinnl> Yeah well, I like telling myself how I care for free software and such, but in the end, I just want to use quality software free of charge ;-)
[17:35] <vinnl> J_Litewski, OK... And what do you get if you visit a Flash website now?
[17:35] <J_Litewski> i had it installed
[17:36] <J_Litewski> i may uninstall it and reinstall it
[17:36] <vinnl> Oh OK... And now that you removed all the Flash plugins, is it still installed?
[17:36] <UKGent> vinnl I take what I call the 'idealistic/pragmatic view. You champion Free Software but don't 'cut your nose off to spite your face'  !
[17:37] <J_Litewski> the only flash plugin was the adobe one
[17:38] <J_Litewski> i have a bunch of GStreamer plugins installed too
[17:38] <vinnl> J_Litewski, ah... Did you select "All available applications" in the drop-down menu next to "Show:" in Add/Remove...?
[17:38] <vinnl> Oh wait, obviously you have
[17:38] <UKGent> and then there is the MS version of 'flash'  ... 'silverlight'   what a load of rubbish but I suppose we will end up accommodating it...
[17:38] <vinnl> But were Gnash and Swfdec not mentioned at all?
[17:38] <J_Litewski> nope, i installed thouse through firefox's plugin manager
[17:39] <vinnl> J_Litewski, which version of Xubuntu are you using?
[17:39] <J_Litewski> 9.04 Beta
[17:39] <UKGent> Litewski yes - the gstreamer set was the only set which got the NASA site fully working for me.. video that is.
[17:40] <vinnl> J_Litewski, hmm, that really is odd.... Could you check in Synaptic Package Manager whether they're listed there?
[17:40] <J_Litewski> yep
[17:42] <J_Litewski> in firefpx's plugin manager, i got Three flash plugins, the offical one that doesn't work, Gnash, and another one that says its Flash 9.0 r999
[17:43] <UKGent> Time for tea/dinner here in the UK - best of luck with your 'Flash' Litewski   bfn
[17:43] <J_Litewski> ty
[17:43] <UKGent> by vinnl
[17:43] <vinnl> Bye UKGent
[17:43] <vinnl> J_Litewski, and are they listed in Synaptic?
[17:43] <J_Litewski> loading that now
[17:44] <vinnl> Oh, and what's that other one called?
[17:44] <vinnl> I was wrong earlier, btw, the latest version of Flash is not 9 but 10
[17:45] <genii> vinnl: No, 10 is out
[17:45] <J_Litewski> it's Shockwave Flash 9.0 r115 (offical), Shockwave Flash 9.0 r999 (Gnash is in the discription), and Shockwave Flash 9.0 r999 (no discription)
[17:45] <vinnl> genii, yeah that's what I said :)
[17:46] <vinnl> Hmm, strange... Perhaps because you're running an unreleased version of Xubuntu or something
[17:46] <genii> vinnl: Mis-read, apologies :)
[17:46] <vinnl> np ;-)
[17:46] <J_Litewski> it didn't work with any version of XubuntuI used
[17:46] <vinnl> Yeah, I'm referring to the odd Flash entries
[17:47] <J_Litewski> found it in the package manager
[17:47] <vinnl> J_Litewski, OK, could you remove gnash and swfdec?
[17:48] <J_Litewski> kk
[17:49] <J_Litewski> what is kipi?
[17:50] <vinnl> It says "KDE Image Plugin Interface" in the description. Why?
[17:50] <knome> !info kipi
[17:50] <knome> right. :P
[17:51] <vinnl> !info kipi-plugins
[17:51] <J_Litewski> ah, the package manager said something about it
[17:51] <J_Litewski> that it wasn't going to be removed
[17:51] <sdf2> is there any way to browse my home lan with xubuntu?
[17:51] <vinnl> Hmm...
[17:51] <sdf2> with thunar maybe?
[17:51] <J_Litewski> do you want me to remove the offical flash plugin too?
[17:52] <vinnl> sdf2, I believe you had to look at pyneighborhood for that
[17:52] <vinnl> J_Litewski, perhaps reinstall that, just to be sure
[17:52] <vinnl> knome, could you take it from here? Dinner's ready here :P
[17:52] <sdf2> ok i try
[17:52] <knome> vinnl, sorry, no time :/
[17:53] <sdf2> and with this i can see my 2nd harddrive?
[17:53] <sdf2> or how can  i see that?
[17:53] <vinnl> Hmm, TheSheep? :)
[17:53] <vinnl> You should be able to see that with Thunar
[17:53] <J_Litewski> ok, reinstalled
[17:54] <sdf2> in which folder?
[17:54] <sdf2> or like a seperate device?
[17:54] <vinnl> J_Litewski, OK, and you removed Gnash and swfdec?
[17:54] <J_Litewski> yep
[17:54] <vinnl> sdf2, it should be listed on the left, if it's not, it's probably a bug
[17:54] <TheSheep> vinnl: yes?
[17:54] <sdf2> its not listed
[17:54] <vinnl> J_Litewski, and what does it say if you visit a Flash-based website now?
[17:55] <J_Litewski> not sure, let me start firefox
[17:55] <vinnl> TheSheep, if you could take J_Litewski  through making Flash work, I need to get to dinner ;-)
[17:55] <TheSheep> J_Litewski: where are we now?
[17:55] <vinnl> TheSheep, he just reinstalled Adobe's Flash and removed swfdec and Gnash
[17:55] <TheSheep> !ntfs | sdf2
[17:56] <J_Litewski> nothing
[17:56] <TheSheep> J_Litewski: try renaming the .mozilla directory in your home directory (it's hidden, you have to enable displaying hidden files in view menu in thunar)
[17:56] <TheSheep> J_Litewski: and starting firefox again
[17:56] <J_Litewski> no plugins listed in firefox's plugin manager
[17:57] <vinnl> OK, then I'm off for dinner, good luck J_Litewski and TheSheep, and sdf2  ;-)
[17:57] <J_Litewski> how do i display hidden files?
[17:57] <TheSheep> J_Litewski: ctrl+h or view->show hidden files
[17:57] <sdf2> btw, my machine doesn't see my 2nd harddrive
[17:57] <sdf2> i checked it with: df -h
[17:57] <TheSheep> sdf2: does fdisk -l list it?
[17:58] <sdf2> ye
[17:58] <TheSheep> sdf2: df only shows mounted drives
[17:58] <sdf2> that one sees
[17:58] <TheSheep> sdf2: try mounting it manually
[17:58] <TheSheep> !mount
[17:58] <sdf2> ubottu don't like u :D
[17:59] <sdf2> poor bot...
[17:59] <TheSheep> he's helpful
[17:59] <J_Litewski> there we go
[17:59] <TheSheep> (she? it?)
[18:00] <knome> !gender
[18:00] <J_Litewski> ty TheSheep
[18:00] <TheSheep> J_Litewski: it works?
[18:00] <J_Litewski> seems to be working now
[18:00] <TheSheep> great :)
[18:01] <TheSheep> I didn't expect it to mbe so easy :P
[18:01] <J_Litewski> lol
[18:01] <J_Litewski> firefox once freaked out on me in windows when i had a conflicting add-on installed
[18:02] <J_Litewski> it wouldn't display CSS2 properties correctly
[18:02] <TheSheep> browsers are becoming too complicated to my tastes
[18:03] <TheSheep> I'm almost afraid the next browser will be called Skynet
[18:03] <J_Litewski> eh, just as long as I can watch my movies and play my games im all good
[18:03] <J_Litewski> the next-gen web browser will be Cloud-capible, i know it
[18:05] <sdf2> i installed pyneighborhood
[18:05] <sdf2> and click on the home workgroup
[18:06] <sdf2> and it says failed to scan
[18:06] <J_Litewski> now, what would cause xubuntu not to automount a drive, even if you tell it too
[18:06] <tdn> How do I make a bootable USB thumb drive with the new 9.04 Beta Xubuntu ISO? I have just downloaded the desktop i386 version iso.
[18:08] <sdf2> i opened pyneighborhood as root
[18:09] <sdf2> and now i see my lan but
[18:09] <sdf2> i can't mount any drives
[18:09] <sdf2> any clue?
[18:11] <J_Litewski> sdf2, does xubuntu automount a CD if you put one in your CD drive?
[18:12] <sdf2> yes
[18:13] <J_Litewski> hmm, ok
[18:13] <sdf2> k i did it...
[18:14] <sdf2> its ok now
[18:26] <Slonkie> is it possible to make a shell script that automaticly logs into my server using ssh?
[18:34] <J_Litewski> stupid middle click
[18:35] <sdf2> why?
[18:35] <sdf2> i didn't clicked it in te last 5 years
[18:35] <J_Litewski> sometimes I do because my left clicker is broken somewhat
[18:35] <sdf2> :S
[18:36] <J_Litewski> only the edge by the right click button works
[18:36] <sdf2> i understand what u feel, my middle click is on the wheel
[18:37] <J_Litewski> where do you go to see what monitor your using in xubuntu?
[18:38] <sdf2> maybe in graphics card driver?
[18:38] <J_Litewski> ah
[18:38] <J_Litewski> didn't think to check there
[18:39] <sdf2> i can set this in nvidia x server settings
[18:39] <sdf2> don't know what if other card
[18:40] <J_Litewski> where is the graphics card window at?
[18:40] <sdf2> applications/system/
[18:41] <sdf2> in the menu
[18:41] <J_Litewski> nope
[18:41] <sdf2> etc/X11/xorg.conf
[18:42] <sdf2> stores the graphics settings if i'm right
[18:42] <TheSheep> Slonkie: yes, you can make it authenticate with a key
[18:42] <sdf2> at least my driver saves everything there
[18:42] <Slonkie> ehm.. i want it to start the ssh tunnel
[18:43] <TheSheep> Slonkie: sure
[18:43] <Slonkie> Running my proxy trough the tunnel, and i hate to type it in everytime
[18:43] <TheSheep> J_Litewski: try xrandr in terminal
[18:44] <TheSheep> J_Litewski: or xdpyinfo
[18:44] <J_Litewski> is there any way to see what driver it's using?
[18:45] <TheSheep> you can see in /var/log/Xorg.0.log
[18:45] <J_Litewski> since two days ago, I need to press Fn+F3 to get the screen to display correctly
[18:46] <J_Litewski> and Xubuntu also doesn't save my settings for the display eighter
[18:47] <TheSheep> ah, got it, xvinfo
[18:47] <J_Litewski> it just says screen #0
[18:48] <TheSheep> check the log then
[18:52] <J_Litewski> i didn't see anything
[20:17] <slow-motion> hi
[20:38] <J_Litewski> does anyone recommend the ext4 filesystem? i'm trying to liven up my system a bit
[20:39] <forces> im using ext4 right now
[20:39] <forces> i have no had any problem
[20:39] <UKGent> Hi everyone
[20:40] <J_Litewski> hi UKGent
[20:41] <J_Litewski> problem is, i'm not sure I can switch over to the ext4 filesystem without a LiveCD
[20:41] <UKGent> Just trying out my first few commands on BASH - found out that if you put a space within your Directory Names, BASH cannot identify them. Took the space out and then you can do cd and stuff like that
[20:41] <UKGent> Is that right?
[20:41] <pleia2> UKGent: just escape the spaces with a \
[20:41] <pleia2> so "Directory Name" is "Directory\ Name"
[20:42] <pleia2> same with other characters that are have other meanings in bash (like !)
[20:42] <UKGent> Ah ....  when all else fails , ask the experts ! I am going to try that out ...
[20:43] <UKGent> I know it is probably bad practise to put spaces in Dir names but it is more intuitive
[20:44] <TheSheep> no, it's ok, Linux is civilized :)
[20:44] <UKGent> I know this is boring but I want to start at absolute 'ground zero'
[20:45] <TheSheep> it's probably a bad idea to put a dash at the begining of a file name though
[20:45] <TheSheep> because then most programs will treat them as options
[20:45] <UKGent> TheSheep point taken - it is the spaces I like to use, for obvious reasons
[20:46] <TheSheep> and *never* leave a file called '-delete' in your directory :)
[20:46] <UKGent> TheSheep lol I try to avoid anything that looks like a reserved word anyhow
[20:46] <TheSheep> 'find *'  might get it worng then...
[20:47] <TheSheep> of course, to avoid that you should ude 'find - *' in scripts
[20:47] <TheSheep> but nobody ever does that
[20:47] <knome> TheSheep, krhm
[20:47] <UKGent> I have got the hang of using ls and its various parameters, like -a -t etc
[20:48] <knome> UKGent, command --help
[20:48] <TheSheep> in practice only -l and -a are useful
[20:48] <knome> UKGent, or man command
[20:48] <UKGent> and .. to go up a level seems good
[20:48] <UKGent> is man manual?
[20:48] <TheSheep> yes
[20:48] <UKGent> good guess lol
[20:48] <TheSheep> man 'command' will tell you about the command
[20:48] <UKGent> that is useful
[20:48] <TheSheep> 'man woman': no entry
[20:49] <TheSheep> ;)
[20:49] <UKGent> or man mountain ?
[20:49] <knome> !woman
[20:49] <knome> d'oh!
[20:49] <TheSheep> knome: you know zsh?
[20:49] <UKGent> or man idontreallyknowwhatiamdoing
[20:50] <TheSheep> UKGent: there is also 'apropos' that searches the manual
[20:50] <knome> TheSheep, not really.
[20:50] <UKGent> that sounds almost classical
[20:50] <TheSheep> knome: try running zsh and typing 'fire?' in the prompt
[20:50] <TheSheep> knome: without the ''
[20:51] <knome> i haven't got zsh installed :P
[20:51] <TheSheep> % fire?
[20:51] <TheSheep> zsh: no matches found
[20:52] <knome> right...
[20:52] <UKGent> that was a mistake - just tried man gnome2    I don't think I have that much time tonight !
[20:52] <TheSheep> come on, it's funny :P
[20:52] <TheSheep> UKGent: yeah, you can learn perl tomorrow
[20:53] <slow-motion> n8
[20:53] <TheSheep> one language a day
[20:53] <TheSheep> slow-motion: sleep well
[20:53] <UKGent> call me old fashioned but I love just operating with text sometimes - it is so quick and powerful
[20:54] <UKGent> I like the way it gives you the percentage as well as the line no
[20:55] <UKGent> how do you get out of the manual ?
[20:55] <knome> q
[20:55] <TheSheep> and ? gives you a reminder of different keys available
[20:55] <UKGent> knome thanks
[20:55] <UKGent> TheSheep thanks
[20:56] <TheSheep> sorry, that's h
[20:56] <TheSheep> for help
[20:56] <UKGent> lol I wondered why nothing happened
[20:56] <TheSheep> ? is for backward search
[20:57] <UKGent> Linux is really quite intuitive in the way it 'talks' to you - not what I was expecting at all
[20:57] <TheSheep> I like the word "consistent"
[20:57] <TheSheep> the only intuitive interface is the nipple
[20:58] <UKGent> TheSheep Perhaps that was the wrong word... what I meant was , it uses fairly natural language
[20:58] <TheSheep> for an English speaker :)
[20:58] <UKGent> TheSheep lol well yes
[20:58] <TheSheep> verb noun and all that
[20:59] <TheSheep> although many modern programs use 'noun verb adjective'
[21:00] <UKGent> TheSheep maybe we should look at that. Maybe programming languages are too influenced by our habitual grammatical structures. Maybe a Chinese person could devise a totally different sort of logical structure ?   Veering 'off topic' again !
[21:01] <TheSheep> UKGent: they sure are. Have you heard about teh language 'Ruby'?
[21:01] <TheSheep> UKGent: 'Ruby on Rails' and such
[21:01] <TheSheep> it's a language developed by the Japanese, completely wicked
[21:02] <UKGent> TheSheep I have heard of it yes - it is listed on the packages on synaptic I think
[21:02] <UKGent> I would be really interested in that, if it is what you are describing
[21:02] <TheSheep> in western languages you do soemthign like "for variable in list do command"
[21:03] <TheSheep> in Ruby you do "list.each(command)"
[21:03] <UKGent> TheSheep That sounds 'totally cool' to use a modern expression !
[21:04] <UKGent> I also hear that LISP is pretty special  Is that what emacs is built around ?
[21:04] <TheSheep> yes
[21:04] <TheSheep> lisp doesn't have grammar
[21:04] <TheSheep> you write a parsing tree directly
[21:04] <UKGent> TheSheep Yes - you can more or less write your own language as you go along , sort of
[21:05] <TheSheep> but you can also write 'macros' that will act as commands, replaced by fragments of the parsing tree -- so you build your own grammar in fact
[21:05] <TheSheep> from the grammatical point of view TeX is also interesting
[21:05] <TheSheep> it's a language for typesetting text
[21:06] <UKGent> TheSheep that sounds amazing - Stallman himself originated emacs, so I understand - he is a legend
[21:06] <TheSheep> but it has full power of programming languages
[21:06] <UKGent> TheSheep Tex is used in mathematics ?
[21:06] <UKGent> I think there is an editor you can download
[21:07] <TheSheep> it's used for typesetting any text, but it's liked by mathematicians because it makes typesetting formulas easy
[21:07] <TheSheep> actually, mathematicians usually use LaTeX, which is a set of macros, a library, so to say, over TeX
[21:08] <TheSheep> there is another set of macros called 'beamer' that lets you make beatiful pdf slideshows easily
[21:08] <UKGent> I am going to get the editor on here - I already have emacs 22 I think. Only got to the stage of learning how to navigate the text but it has a turuorial.  Ah yes LaTex that is what I had heard of
[21:08] <UKGent> sorry 'tutorial' lol
[21:09] <TheSheep> emacs also has a psychiatrist :)
[21:09] <TheSheep> under 'help' menu :)
[21:09] <TheSheep> I've heard it became necessary at certain stage
[21:09] <UKGent> TheSheep what ? !!   You mean emacs sort of gets psychologically disturbed lol
[21:10] <UKGent> I can see that it is a very powerful bit of kit - I am not fooled by the slightly ungainly, old fashioned exterior ...
[21:10] <TheSheep> who knows, it always looks to me like it's secretely planning to kill me
[21:11] <TheSheep> I feel safer with vim
[21:12] <UKGent> TheSheep I feel drawn to emacs - something to do with Stallman - if he devised it, it is probably capable of a lot more than people think !
[21:12] <UKGent> he seems a very smart man to me
[21:14] <TheSheep> the BSD guys weren't dumb either
[21:15] <UKGent> 'the chief GNU'isance
[21:16] <TheSheep> he's become a celebrity, and I don't really like it, although I do understand why he needs to do that
[21:17] <UKGent> Yes - as our Ian Drury once put it in one of his lyrics   'they're ain't half bin some clever ba****ds'
[21:18] <UKGent> TheSheep I know what you mean - he can come across as being egotistical as well but I do not believe that he is really. As you say, it is all part of the strategy ...
[21:19] <TheSheep> I don't like all that scheming, I just want to write code :)
[21:20] <UKGent> TheSheep I know - I just want to learn and be free to do what I want with my own box. Unfortunately, without people like him, we would probably not be able to.
[21:21] <UKGent> I absolutely hate the way MS hide things and try to make out you can do stuff but really just want you to do what they want you to do and not find out too much
[21:22] <UKGent> I am naturally nosey !
[21:24] <UKGent> but my Nephew, who is 17, is just not interested. He has the ability but got quite annoyed at my interest in computers. He told me that he is happy to be dumb and just use them as presented to him. More or less told me to get lost. So I told him to get lost! Petty but i chucked him off my lists and said that I have not the time to waste with lazy, negative people lol  oh dear....
[21:25] <brandonban6> I just like free stuff :)
[21:25] <brandonban6> so I'll force myself to learn it..........because its nerdy and because its free.
[21:25] <UKGent> brandon - he does not even care about that !
[21:26] <brandonban6> UKGent, is he one of those that call paying for a mac "worth it"?
[21:26] <UKGent> brandon but there you are 'because it's nerdy'  lol that is good enough for me
[21:29] <UKGent> brandonban6 No - he is disparaging about anyone who does not use Windows. He thinks we are a bunch of posers. What annoys me is that that is not my motive at all. I am 50 with heart disease. I gave up posing a long time ago. It is honestly just curiosity with me.
[21:30] <UKGent> I like Macs but I would not pay the price for one when there is Linux - after all, it is virtually the same sort of OS
[21:32] <brandonban6> UKGent, agreed
[21:33] <Slonkie> + Linux is so much more fun that OSX
[21:33] <Slonkie> :D
[21:35] <UKGent> Slonkie brandonban6 The thing is - he has a girlfriend over in the US and wants to go back to work. He need a 'Green Card' which is difficult to obtain from the UK (despite the fact that we are one of your most loyal allies !) He is good at IT and I was trying to get him going on Linux as a way of gaining proficiency....   In the end I wished him the best of luck with his Microsoft job interview.. that went down well lol
[21:37] <brandonban6> The American economy is a slump right now, it is hard for anyone to find a job. Good luck to him indeed.
[21:38] <TheSheep> I actually got a mac at work, I couldn't use macosx, it's very different from linux
[21:38] <TheSheep> 2 hours of looking for the console :)
[21:38] <TheSheep> so I installed xubuntu on it :)
[21:38] <brandonban6> Lol @ TheSheep , what do you do ?
[21:39] <UKGent> brandonban6 and that is why you need to learn to 'patch' the existing systems and servers. So learning Linux or LAMP is the way to go but he just is not interested... such is youth sometimes (apologies to present company)  lol installed ubunto on a MAC lol
[21:40] <TheSheep> brandonban6: sysop
[21:40] <TheSheep> UKGent: it's a pretty good computer, once you connect normal, full keyboard and a two-button mouse, really
[21:41] <brandonban6> <--24 years old. Madly in love with Linux.......just got my linux+ not to long ago, aiming for more security field job (sec+, gsec and CISSP are on the roadmap for next certs).
[21:42] <UKGent> TheSheep lol that is so funny IMHO  Apple would not be impressed with that - you ought to do a Utube Video on what you did and annoy them with it !
[21:42] <TheSheep> UKGent: meh, I don't care, I just want to get my work done
[21:44] <UKGent> TheSheep I want to get 'back to basics' I can see myself just disappearing into pure text space via the emacs ...   I am probably going through a mid-life crisis of some sort !
[21:44] <TheSheep> UKGent: let me know when you start playing rogue or nethack
[21:46] <UKGent> The thing is - I know nothing at present ... but I like that - sort of 'Zen Mind'  a blank page to write on , tabula Rasa (or whatever the Latin is)
[21:47] <UKGent> and my short term memory is terrible but I don't care - my comp has a lot of memory lol
[21:47] <TheSheep> you should make notes in zim :)
[21:48] <UKGent> TheSheep is that an Xubuntu app. or BASH, emacs or what ?
[21:49] <Slonkie> is it possible to make xubuntu lock the computer on the "windows button+L" ?
[21:50] <TheSheep> UKGent: xubuntu application, kind of a notepad, very convenient for notes
[21:50] <TheSheep> Slonkie: yes
[21:50] <TheSheep> Slonkie: just remap it from the default alt+ctrl+del
[21:50] <Slonkie> where would i be able to do that
[21:50] <TheSheep> UKGent: not installed by default
[21:50] <Slonkie> ?
[21:50] <UKGent> TheSheep I will have a look - and thanks for steering me back on topic !
[21:50] <TheSheep> Slonkie: in the keyboard settings
[21:51] <UKGent> TheSheep won't be long before I just do it on the terminal .... is that this apt-get thing?
[21:51] <TheSheep> sudo apt-get install zim
[21:52] <TheSheep> that's one of those 'noun verb noun' modern apps ;)
[21:53] <UKGent> TheSheep I got that right !  sudo - that is like going root only not using su -l   ?
[21:53] <TheSheep> yes
[21:53] <TheSheep> it does a single command as root
[21:54] <UKGent> right
[21:54] <TheSheep> "super user do"
[21:54] <TheSheep> "super user, do [ask] apt-get [to] install zim [please]"
[21:55] <tavasti> su = set user
[21:56] <tavasti> sudo = set user do ...
[21:56] <UKGent> TheSheep that was quick ! and no mouse   just had to do a cd ~ to get up the tree
[21:56] <TheSheep> actually most commands work anywhere you are in the tree
[21:57] <UKGent> Great watching it all load in the terminal whilst still in chat
[21:57] <UKGent> TheSheep this seemed to want me to be some place else - for some reason. Didn't know what to do so I found myself pressing cd ~
[21:59] <UKGent> and it has placed the app in Accessories ..
[21:59] <TheSheep> btw, 'cd' alone is equivalent to 'cd ~'
[21:59] <gorgut> is there a way to list all groups on a system?
[21:59] <gorgut> (in the command line)
[21:59] <TheSheep> gorgut: cat /etc/groups
[21:59] <TheSheep> sorry
[21:59] <TheSheep> gorgut: cat /etc/group
[22:00] <TheSheep> gorgut: cat /etc/group | cut -d: -f1   if you only want the names
[22:02] <UKGent> TheSheep so zim is a desktop wiki ? interesting
[22:03] <TheSheep> UKGent: I like it, because it doesn't have a save button, and I can make links between notes
[22:04] <gorgut> TheSheep,  whenever jaunty goes final, to upgrade my intrepid system, what do I have to do to upgrade? just add the repos to sources.list and do apt-get dist-upgrade?
[22:04] <TheSheep> UKGent: I usually make one page per day with kind a log of what I did or learned, then move larger stuff to separate pages, leaving a link and linking from other days
[22:04] <TheSheep> !upgrade | gorgut
[22:04] <UKGent> brb got to attend to my elderly mother - whom I help to look after (true)  TheSheep yes - I like that idea , I shall have a play with it later. That is why it is described as a Wiki ?
[22:05] <TheSheep> gorgut: apt-get update in the middle, that's what I usually do, although it's not the recommended way, I think
[22:05] <TheSheep> UKGent: well, it's similar to a wiki from a technical point of view
[22:06] <UKGent> TheSheep yes - I can see that - looks good back later
[22:06] <brandonban6> I'm going to do a backup, reformat my HDD to ext4, then install the upgrade
[22:06] <TheSheep> brandonban6: you know you can upgrade ext3 to ext4?
[22:07] <TheSheep> brandonban6: ext4 is backwards compatible
[22:07] <UKGent> See ya later folks and thanks to everyone who has helped, had a chat or commented !
[22:07] <brandonban6> TheSheep, really, w/o formatting???
[22:07] <brandonban6> later UKGent
[22:07] <TheSheep> brandonban6: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=973701
[22:08] <brandonban6> TheSheep, s EXPERIMENTAL and ENTIRELY UNSUPPORTED haha
[22:08] <TheSheep> brandonban6: so a backup is a good idea anyways
[22:08] <brandonban6> :D
[22:08] <gorgut> what is this new filesystem that is supposed to replace the ext series of filesystems?
[22:08] <stegel> i am working with a mythbuntu install of xubuntu and a siig soundwave 5.1 soundcard
[22:09] <gorgut> Btr or something?
[22:09] <TheSheep> brandonban6: you know, there are two kinds of users: those who make backups and those who will be making backups
[22:09] <stegel> aplay -l shows the card, but i get no audio out
[22:09] <brandonban6> TheSheep,  probably good practice most of the times.
[22:09] <brandonban6> agreed
[22:09] <gorgut> BtrFS, maybe?
[22:09] <TheSheep> stegel: alsamixer and unmute it
[22:10] <stegel> TheSHeep
[22:10] <stegel> done that
[22:12] <TheSheep> no improvement? :(
[22:12] <stegel> nope
[22:25] <gorgut> grrr... setting up ssh is not going well...
[22:30] <Jampiter> I have both kdm and gdm installed. Kdm is active. How do I change this to gdm?
[22:32] <TheSheep> Jampiter: with update-alternatives
[22:33] <TheSheep> gorgut: what's difficulet in that? it's a single command
[22:33] <Jampiter> TheSheep: How do I do that?
[22:34] <gorgut> TheSheep, my router isn't cooperating. i can ssh fine on the lan, just not from away
[22:34] <TheSheep> Jampiter: I just do 'sudo upadte-alternatives --all' and do all the choices, there is a better way if you remember the name...
[22:35] <TheSheep> gorgut: you need to forward port 22
[22:35] <TheSheep> gorgut: and ssh to the address of your router
[22:36] <J_Litewski> what are some good ext3 tweaks that I can do to improve xubuntu?
[22:36] <gorgut> TheSheep, did that, thought AT&T might be blocking 22 for some odd reason, so I tried changing it to 8888 (just picked a number) still no dice
[22:36] <TheSheep> J_Litewski: it comes with relatively good defaults
[22:36] <J_Litewski> TheSheep, it's an older Lappy
[22:37] <J_Litewski> it is suposta run win2k, even though it was running xp craptaskular
[22:37] <TheSheep> J_Litewski: noatime maybe
[22:37] <J_Litewski> did that
[22:38] <Jampiter> Thanks TheSheep
[22:39] <J_Litewski> i did some googling, did the noatime and some other tweak
[22:39] <J_Litewski> just wondering if there was more
[22:39] <TheSheep> it's usually not worth it
[22:40] <TheSheep> you will get better improvements compiling own kernel
[22:40] <TheSheep> but that's a little inconvenient
[22:40] <J_Litewski> maybe that'll fix my display problems
[22:41] <TheSheep> kernel doesn't do display, not yet
[22:41] <J_Litewski> ah
[22:41] <TheSheep> it only gives access to the device to X drivers
[22:41] <TheSheep> there are plans to move that into kernel
[22:42] <J_Litewski> and the X drivers control the display?
[22:42] <TheSheep> yes
[22:42] <TheSheep> at least in graphics mode
[22:42] <TheSheep> intext mode it's kernel
[22:43] <J_Litewski> so if my dispaly keeps reverting to 12xx by something, it's the X drivers fault?
[22:43] <TheSheep> they probably fail do detect your monitor properly
[22:44] <TheSheep> specifying the vertical and horizontal refresh rates may help
[22:44] <J_Litewski> how the hell do i fix that? because resetting my display is getting old
[22:44] <TheSheep> ^^
[22:45] <TheSheep> in xorg.conf
[22:45] <J_Litewski> ah
[22:45] <TheSheep> google should have examples
[22:45] <J_Litewski> kk, ty TheSheep
[22:45] <TheSheep> HorizRefresh
[22:46] <J_Litewski> if i run into any problems, i'll ask
[22:46] <TheSheep> you can try which values work for your screen with xvidtune
[22:49] <J_Litewski> is it a problem if the terminal says that there isn't a xorg.conf file in /ect/X11/?
[22:50] <Brad450> anyone know how to update a kernel?
[22:50] <TheSheep> !kernel
[22:51] <TheSheep> Brad450: it's updated with all other packages
[23:03] <J_Litewski> found my problem, it's still configured to use my desktop monitor
[23:03] <dasTexasNoob> howdy: how can I have a vfat partition show on Win XP?
[23:05] <TheSheep> dasTexasNoob: ask in ##windows
[23:05] <CloseYetFar> im pretty sure a vfat partition should work automatically on WinXP
[23:05] <CloseYetFar> What are you trying to do?
[23:06] <J_Litewski> where can I find the data to change the settings from my Sony SMD-M51 to my Dell Inspiron 1000 screen
[23:07] <dasTexasNoob> well, I created a vfat partition in xubuntu using fdisk and formatted it using mkfs.vfat. but it won't show up in my win xp
[23:07] <CloseYetFar> what does it say when you go to disk management
[23:08] <CloseYetFar> under windows
[23:11] <dasTexasNoob> CloseYetFar: this might sound stupid but where is disk mgmt in win xp?
[23:12] <UKGent> Playing around with Zim
[23:13] <UKGent> I like the little arrow on the RHS of the Xfce Windows - you can pull down the windows from anywhere on the Canvas - useful
[23:15] <CloseYetFar> right click on My computer and select manage, then look for disk management
[23:16] <dasTexasNoob> CloseYetFar: LOl, found it but I can't seem to add it
[23:16] <J_Litewski> TheSheep, how do i reset myxorg.conf file?
[23:16] <dasTexasNoob> CloseYetFar: kind of stupid to ask win questions here. sorry everybody
[23:17] <TheSheep> J_Litewski: rename it and make an empty one
[23:17] <J_Litewski> and when I restart, it'll reset it?
[23:18] <TheSheep> J_Litewski: no need to restart
[23:18] <TheSheep> J_Litewski: just kill X with alt+ctrl+backspace
[23:18] <TheSheep> J_Litewski: it will autodetect settings when xorg.conf is empty
[23:18] <dasTexasNoob> CYF thank you. have a good one
[23:18] <J_Litewski> ah, sweet, ty
[23:19] <J_Litewski> will it kill all of my graphical processes too?
[23:21] <J_Litewski> ctrl+alt+backspace didn't kill X
[23:31] <J_Litewski> well, that fixed it
[23:31] <J_Litewski> X would not die
[23:33] <TheSheep> J_Litewski: that's strange, is it Jaunty?
[23:44] <J_Litewski> TheSheep: yep
[23:44] <TheSheep> J_Litewski: they disable it in there, no idea why
[23:45] <J_Litewski> it would be a nice feature to have
[23:46] <J_Litewski> now I just have to reconfigure everything back to what it was
[23:48] <J_Litewski> ok, this is interesting, xorg.conf is o bytes
[23:48] <J_Litewski> *0 bytes
[23:55] <J_Litewski> TheSheep, aperently, the newest Jaunty kernel supports graphics
[23:55] <TheSheep> why?
[23:55] <J_Litewski> so xorg.conf isn't used anymore
[23:56] <J_Litewski> if it's there, it's used instead of the kernel, but other than that, it's old as of Jaunty's release
[23:58] <TheSheep> no
[23:58] <TheSheep> that's not like this
[23:58] <TheSheep> if there is no xorg.conf, X does autodetection
[23:58] <J_Litewski> my xorg.conf file is 0 byes
[23:58] <TheSheep> but still loads drivers that are separate from kernel
[23:59] <TheSheep> X is the program that displays your windows and graphics