[00:09] Hello [00:09] nooooooooooooo [00:09] * Tm_T hides [00:09] I have done a clean install of 9.04 today over ext4 === siekaczx_ is now known as siekacz [00:10] I think Intel graphic drivers are bad, they have freeze my computer two times after X crash [00:12] tty consoles does not has the Ubuntu clear fonts, they have the traditional fat fonts === siekacz is now known as siekaczx_ === siekaczx_ is now known as siekacz [00:33] X sucks :) [00:35] This is shaping up to be a particularly poor release for Intel and X. #ubuntu-x is a better channel for X related issues. [00:36] well, take heart. at least Kubuntu doesn't have the audio headaches. [00:36] ScottK, no kidding. [00:36] or at least if it does, i'm saying lalalala [00:36] well currently I'm having visual headaches [00:36] KDE logs out before it starts [00:36] Well we certainly have fewer of them. jjesse was saying he was having trouble earlier. [00:37] jjesse and i keep playing identi.ca/irc tag [00:37] i still don't have a full description of his symptom [00:41] Right. All I know is "No sound". [00:45] * vorian spies many new fancy plasma widgets that will need to go in karmic asap [00:47] vorian: thanks for your assistance yesterday [00:47] dtchen: no problemo [00:47] there are _some_ things i can help with ;-) [00:47] wait, you're MOTU! [00:47] :-) [01:02] hey folks [01:02] does anyone use preload or prelink? [01:08] http://www.kubuntu.org/news/kde-4.2.2 [01:08] rock on Riddell :) [01:16] dtchen: identi.ca has an IRC plugin? [01:16] jad-pau: err? not that i'm aware. [01:16] what's identi.ca/irc tag ? [01:16] it means we keep missing each other on identi.ca and on irc [01:17] aka "phone tag" but on identi.ca and on irc [01:37] i dont know whats going on here, i recently reinstalled jaunty kubuntu, and kde is running super super slow [01:37] ive dist-upgraded too [01:39] wow this is really not cool [01:41] joshjtl: Intel graphics? [01:42] :-) [01:42] dtchen: ah slash eye arr cee [02:04] i've been seeing a lot of quassel users lately [02:07] yes people have been encouraging quassel use in #kubuntu [02:08] wasn't it even the default client in Jaunty? someone said so. [02:09] yes it is the default [02:09] the quassel devs did a lot of good work to get it ready for jaunty [02:12] still needs more [02:12] but it's quite usable now [02:12] hip hip hooray for quassel devs :) [02:19] well, it's not really a KDE app, but... [02:20] LjL: It tries [02:21] it has optional KDE integration. is that right seele ? [02:21] yes [02:21] yes [02:21] ok [02:21] close enough :) [02:21] better than OO.o :( [02:21] but - while i admit i don't know about it - adding "KDE integration" to code hardly makes something a KDE app [02:21] well, OO.o is pretty much a special case [02:21] (and then there is SpeedCrunch...) [02:21] how come KDE 4.2.2 was released today, but when I went to upgrade it, it was already done automatically just with the automatic upgrade set to "security only"? [02:23] LjL: it has the ability to make use a kde services such as the notification system.. otherwise it falls back on standard qt stuff [02:24] metellius: are you sure you don't have experimental enabled as a source? [02:24] seele: yeah, well for instance, if i want to DCC someone something, will i see a KDE file dialog and will i be able to use a kioslave address for the file? [02:24] LjL: i'm not sure dcc is working in quassel.. i know it was an issue a while ago dunno if it was fixed [02:25] seele: I do, I have a lot of sources, but they cannot possibly be meant to be for security updaes can they [02:25] metellius: i dunno, ask in the support channel, #kubuntu [02:25] alright - was just an example to show that serious "KDE integration" might be tricky to achieve, anyway [02:26] LjL: something like that would be easy now that it has notification integration [02:26] kde has a very standardized notifcation system [02:26] quassel has notifications for when your name is mentioned in a chat and the window is out of focus [02:26] and it would be the same kindof call for a notification about a file transfer [02:30] LjL: Sort of like Marble? [02:30] seele: Wrong discussion I think :) [02:39] jad-pau: ? [02:39] was he not talking about quassel? [02:40] seele: yes but not notifications [02:40] no, but kde integration. notifications in quassel are an example of kde integration [02:41] and the file download process monitor uses the same notification system as the name ping [02:41] how can i run a plasmoid from sources (in a personal directory) ? [02:42] i want to run the systemservices plasmoid, but i don't know some things :s [02:44] seele: No dcc in quassel. It's not implemented yet. [02:44] ScottK: right, i knew that from a month ago, but didnt know if they were working on it yet [02:45] It's not in 0.4.1. I don't think it's in their trunk yet either. [02:46] metellius: The security only updates bit only kicks in after release. 'security updates only' means the main repo (which freezes at release) and security updates. [02:47] #quassel [02:48] Gon: #plasma can help you with your plasmoid from source question [02:49] !!!!! [02:49] thnx [03:02] ScottK: oh, I see. that makes sense. [03:03] metellius: You do ark development, right? [03:04] ScottK: yes [03:04] metellius: I'm loving tar.gz support in 4.2. Thank you. [03:05] ScottK: thanks :) [03:05] but is there something special about the tar.gz support? [03:05] It's just that we use tar.gz a lot. [03:06] most linux people do [03:06] Oh yeah that was painful in 4.0 [03:06] A .deb is essentially two tar.gz wrapped in .ar. When I need to inspect a .deb I like to open it with ark. [03:06] 4.0 ark was abandoned [03:07] In 4.1 we had a patch from you that allowed tar.gz to work in some cases, but not that one. [03:07] So with 4.2 I have everything I used ark for in 3.5 and am happy. [03:07] I see [03:08] With 4.1 I needed to (holds nose) use file-roller. [03:09] So I appreciate the work and the resulting progress. [03:38] hey [03:38] anyone know if there is a kde4 ftp client even if not fully released yet? [03:39] i presume you mean "more featureful than konqueror" [03:39] yeah, dolphin and konq will work fine for a lot of stuff [03:40] JontheEchidna: yeah i want something with more features though [03:41] hmm... kftpgrabber always served me well, but that's KDE3 [03:41] yeah... [03:41] just was hoping there was a kde4 app i could try [03:41] there isn't one that I know of :( [03:41] apparently kasablanca... but i dont like kasablanca one bit [03:57] was ext4 taken off of the beta release image? [03:58] no [03:58] hrmm, it isnt showing up on the cd [03:58] * nixternal wonders if he grabbed beta or a daily by accident [03:58] odd [03:59] nixternal: it should give you a choice. However i havn tried it yet, but will after Jaunty releas [03:59] my desktop is using ext4, but this cd doesn't have it on it [03:59] I must have grabbed the wrong iso === seele_ is now known as seele === jtechidna is now known as JontheEchidna [06:32] moin [06:33] after booting, a message pop ups, that a kontact instance is running, when the session is restored. If you answer with quit (or exit or don't run, cannot remember the label), the session is not respawned thus no kontact is running. Clicking on Run anyway leads to a running instance for kontact, but the tray icons (and notifications) are doubled [06:34] is this known? [06:34] kde 4.2.2 on jaunty :) [06:38] i noticed it once, after restarting the xserver, but I didn't think much about it, I'll check again later [06:38] ty [06:41] hm, plasma consumes about 390MB of RAM, isn't this kinda much? [06:42] however, x.org eats 25% of cpu.... [07:47] Riddell: are the UI debug message in the kde dist-upgrade like "pop widget QLabel label_status" still relevant? if not, I would like to comment them out [08:11] morning [08:11] hrm, we had to give out gnome ubuntu CDs as the ubuntu booth again [08:11] this has to change [08:11] always we get these freaking gnome CDs [08:11] and KDE people are handing them out [08:12] slightly odd [08:12] (talking about OpenExpo) [08:13] they usually send us like 80% gnome CDs === agateau_ is now known as agateau [09:43] any core-dev would do me a sponsor upload? thanks [09:45] debdiff is here: http://paste.ubuntu.org.cn/13745 === rraphink is now known as raphink [10:14] mvo: I don't see anything which says "pop" in DistUpgrade [10:17] Riddell: I see items like http://paste.ubuntu.com/143373/ in the logs [10:17] Riddell: if those are useful for you, I'm fine keeping them of course [10:17] Riddell: but if not, I would like to remove them to make the log less cluttered [10:20] mvo: if you find out what causes those feel free to remove it [10:21] Riddell: ok, thanks. its not high priority for me, but I wanted to ask before doing it :) [10:23] mvo: thanks for looking into bug 349725 [10:23] Launchpad bug 349725 in doc-base "8.04->9.04-beta updgrade: Could not install 'base-passwd'" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/349725 [10:23] Riddell: cheers, the SRU for those are uploaded, I'm waiting for accept/test now [10:24] Riddell: the python problem should also be dealt with (also its much harder than anticipated) [10:25] have I ever said you're a genius? [10:26] not sure, but if you do, that makes me happy [11:54] could we please, please get rid of that pulsaudio stuff? here comes another bug: 330797 [11:54] I don't understand why it has to be installed in the first place... [11:55] pulse would be great.. in case it did just work™ :/ [11:55] I have no sund on my system most of the time because pulseaudio gets itself on top of the Phonon list over and over again, even if I push it to the bottom [11:55] sound* [11:56] there is a packaging problem somewhere, I removed almost everything pulse-related, but can't get rid of libpulse0, it tries to remove half of KDE [11:56] we don't install pulseaudio in the first place [11:56] only gnome apps do [11:56] Riddell: well, then why can't I remove it withpout removing half of KDE? [11:57] -p [11:57] Riddell: you do not need to get rid of libpulse [11:57] sry, Mamarok [11:57] freinhard: I have to, it kills my sound [11:57] read what I said above [11:58] when I upgraded the kdegraphics package it installed like 10 something gnome packages with it, including language packages I just removed before [11:58] Mamarok: nope, you don't have to ;) got libpulse, got sound, can use phonon with sound even with my onw apps. [11:58] so somwhere there is a problem [11:59] freinhard: well, I don't have sound, and I find Pulseaudio on top of the phonon list everytime I log into KDE [11:59] that is more than weird! [12:00] and no way to get any sound back, without pusing pulseaudio back to the bottom, restart KDE [12:01] then start any app with sound like dragonplayer it works, start it a second time it doesn't find the soundcard anymore and pulseaudio is on top again [12:01] same behaviour with Amarok, VLC, etc... [12:02] and this is an Intel connexant that work fine in Intrepid and Jaunty Alpha, so I consider this a serious regression in Beta [12:02] worked* [12:08] hmm, I wish I understood this issue better [12:08] so do I [12:08] it seems to work well for me with or without pulseaudio === Quintasan_ is now known as Quintasan [12:09] Hello [12:09] if you don't have the pulseaudio server installed though, I can't see how it could be using pulseaudio [12:10] well, the only thing installed is libpulse0, but pulseaudio still shows in Phonon, so maybe this is a phonon problem? [12:11] Mamarok: did you try removing your phonon config? [12:11] i had a similar problem before with gstreamer [12:11] hm, let me try... [12:11] removing the phonon config helped [12:12] brb [12:23] sry, this might take more time, my X server crashed and I can't activate the display anymore... [12:23] there are days... [12:23] wibble [12:25] Mamarok: also check that pulseaudio is not just removed but purged ... seems to cause havoc just having it configured [12:26] it is (of course...) [12:28] what languages shall I put on the CDs? [12:30] ru overtaken it for fourth spot with intrepid installs [12:33] wow, langpacks are large these days [12:36] de and fr is about all we can fit [12:39] Riddell: update to kdemultimedia pushed to bzr ... the changes was in the 4.2.2 in the ninjas ppa at some point, but got lost somehow [12:41] * Riddell looks [12:43] a|wen: going to send these upstream? [12:43] apachelogger committed them to svn i believe [12:44] uploading to jaunty [12:45] thx [12:46] Riddell: what kmenu called now? [12:47] davmor2: kickoff is the applet [12:47] jtholmes: ^ [12:47] which is part of plasma which is from the kdebase-workspace source package [12:49] Riddell: just needed the name for jtholmes [12:49] I don't know what user documentation calls it though [12:54] new plasma-widget-network-manager in my PPA for testing https://edge.launchpad.net/~jr/+archive/ppa [12:55] horray [13:00] bug in kpackagekit, debfile.py, def open... self.pkgname => self.pkgName [13:01] back [13:01] Pulseaudio s [13:02] sry [13:02] Pulseaudio still shows on to of the list in Phonon, even after I removed .kde/share/config/phonondevicesrc [13:02] freinhard: that sounds like packagekit, kpk doesn't use python itself [13:03] where else could this be stored? I don't have pulseaudio installed... [13:03] Mamarok: is pulseaudio purged? [13:03] Riddell: sry, didn't look up where debfile.py comes from. kpackagekit gave me some errors on commandline. [13:03] yes, of course! [13:03] a|wen: ^^ [13:04] btw, error handling in kpackagekit isn't that nice yet? [13:04] hmm, good question then [13:06] i have pulseaudio in phonon as well ... just at lowest priority [13:07] I don't think that it's actually pulseaudio, since pulseaudio isn't actually installed on my system [13:10] libpulse0 != a working pulseaudio install, but maybe it's enough to fool phonon? [13:16] Riddell: what to do with that debfile bug? report upstream and wait till it's fixed or do a patch for debian/patches ? [13:17] jtechidna: well, if you followed the thread a bit earlier, updating kde to 4.2.2 reinstalled pulseaudio for me... [13:17] freinhard: if you have a patch send it to glatzor and ask if he wants you to patch the package or if he'll take care of it [13:17] o.O [13:17] somewhere there is a packaging error... [13:17] nah [13:17] nothing changed that much [13:17] in the KDE packages [13:18] it could be that pulseaudio was a recommends of something else that got updated [13:18] but that it's so easy to infect your computer with pa is annoying [13:19] hm, on first try, kdegraphics was hold back, when I selected it it came with a0+ gnome packages [13:19] 10+* [13:19] which package manager were you using? [13:20] there should be a way to dist-upgrade stuff without installing recommends for apt-get [13:20] --no-install-recommends for apt-get [13:20] synaptic [13:20] hmm... [13:20] does pa support intel-hda nowadays? [13:20] I wouldn't know how to do it with synaptic [13:21] which at least shows all the additional packages going to be installed, a thing kpackagekit doesn't... [13:21] or are they still trying to force something down our throats that doesn't support the most popular hardware? [13:21] Riddell: have you seen this? https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=188655 ... really a usability annoyance [13:21] KDE bug 188655 in general "kickoff menu doesn't get keyboard focus when opened (4 2 2 regression)" [Normal,New] [13:21] Mamarok: if an update wants to install new packages, kpackagekit can't do it at all :P [13:21] it whines about it being a blocked update and sits there and pouts [13:21] jtechidna: I haven't used it since some days, since I find it not really usable [13:22] I find myself either using the terminal or adept [13:22] but back then (about 2-3 weeks) it did install dependcies without telling me [13:23] well, synaptic really is good, and far more readable than apt-get [13:23] I'm just not used to synaptic tbh... scared of trying something new I guess [13:23] Adpet is not as bad as kpackagekit, a bit more usable, but still... [13:24] but apt-get + adept serves me, personally well enough, so.... [13:24] hm, aptitude is not bad neither, I'm simply not used to it [13:25] for me it's either synaptic or apt-get when I have errors in the former [13:25] a|wen: I have not [13:25] * a|wen uses aptitude exclusively [13:26] a|wen: although focus is in the search box when I open kickoff [13:26] Riddell: it doesn't work here [13:26] how is your focus-stealing prevention settings? [13:27] a|wen: I've no idea, I've not set anything [13:30] Riddell: just tested with a new user ... same problem, at least for me [13:32] a|wen: I believe you :) [13:34] * a|wen uploads a new kdebase-workspace to k-e with a fixed startkde script [13:34] mvo: Will the Python fix correct existing upgrades that were broken or just prevent the problem for future upgraders? [13:36] ScottK: just for future upgrades for now, I think for exisiting upgrades the fix might be as easy as running all the /usr/share/python/runtime.d/*.rtinstall scripts [13:37] ScottK: but I'm not the python maintainer, I'm just a fire fighter [13:37] Understand. Appreciate the effort. [13:40] i know this is more a #kubuntu question but real quick with the new networkmanager applet in jaunty how do i connect to a hidden wireles ? [13:41] according to the bug reports you can't :( [13:43] Hmm Shaman is indeed very good package manager, can't wait for packagekit frontend [13:45] ScottK: I will talk about it, I think we need to send out a mail at least to explain what happend and how affected people can fix their systems [13:46] mvo: That sounds sensible. [13:46] * ScottK has one sitting here unfixed waiting to test the procedure. [13:47] ScottK: if you have a test machine, that is execellent, I perpare instrcutions and ask you to test. thanks [13:47] Great. [13:59] ScottK: for s in /usr/share/python/runtime.d/*.rtinstall; do if [ -x $s ]; then $s rtinstall python2.6; fi; done - should is the fix I think will work [13:59] * ScottK tries [14:00] * Quintasan got into Polish translators team [14:02] hi there [14:02] Riddell: just received your email, I'll investigate this WE... === Tiono_ is now known as Tonio_ [14:06] mvo: It ran without error, but I still don't have /var/lib/python-support/python2.6/dbus/mainloop/qt.so. [14:08] hahahaha [14:08] agateau: hey :) dodn't got time to come and see you during SL2009.... sorry for that :) [14:08] s/dod/did/ [14:09] Riddell: the kubuntu-members-kde4 PPA seems down [14:09] ScottK: hm, thats bad [14:10] Agreed/ [14:10] /. [14:14] * vorian pats his 1.6 million karma [14:14] jefferai: what's down with it? [14:15] https://launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members-kde4/+archive/ppa [14:15] and in apt-get I get a 404 [14:15] jefferai: do you have apt-transport-https installed? [14:16] does that affect the website? :-) [14:16] but yes, I do [14:16] it's not an https archive [14:16] jefferai: works here, what's in your sources.list ? [14:16] jefferai: sorry, ignore me. I'm just a rodeo clown [14:17] deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/kubuntu-members-kde4/ubuntu jaunty main [14:17] deb-src http://ppa.launchpad.net/kubuntu-members-kde4/ubuntu jaunty main [14:17] although it appears (now that the website is working) that there is no jaunty [14:17] * jefferai pokes Nightrose [14:17] You said there was jaunty! [14:18] * Nightrose hides [14:18] :D [14:18] Riddell: I was looking for e.g. the taglib-extras package you said was available to jaunty users [14:19] jefferai: that's in the main archive https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/taglib-extras [14:19] Hm. I just did an apt-get update and it's not showing up for me [14:20] jefferai: oh it's still in New, needs an archive admin to approve it [14:20] ah [14:20] OK [14:21] jefferai: did you release a new version? [14:21] Yes [14:21] are you not on amarok-packagers? [14:21] I updated the license text for clarity [14:21] and some build fixes for (mainly non-linux) people [14:21] ScottK: does /usr/sbin/update-python-modules -v -a help? [14:21] jefferai: I see it. really must get round to reading my e-mail sometime [14:22] :-) [14:22] * ScottK tries [14:25] mvo: Nope. It didn't even touch python-qt-dbus. [14:26] Riddell: It seems kde3bindings source is still in Main. Would you please demote it. [14:27] mvo: That seems to only touch .py -> .pyc. I didn't see any .so in the output. [14:29] nixternal: ping [14:29] ScottK: :( sorry, I need to investigate in more detail then [14:29] mvo: No problem. I appreciate you working on it. === seezer_ is now known as seezer [14:57] hey guys [14:57] how's it running down to final freeze next week? [14:59] For me everything seems pretty good except for X + Intel is exremely unpleasant. [15:00] exremely/extremely [15:00] ScottK: bummer [15:00] did you see that bryce has some mitigations for 8x5 chipsets? [15:00] I did. [15:00] I know he still has some hope for 9x5 perf, but it seems like we're going to have stable, but not fast by default :( [15:01] I can be understanding about older stuff, but my 965 laptop is not happy either. [15:01] ScottK: yeah, that's an intel thing [15:01] they are targeting that to run off of uxa, but uxa is crashy [15:01] I'm using uxa and that's what I'm experiencing. [15:02] I'm seriously reconsidering future purchase decisions at this point. [15:02] ScottK: I kind of feel responsible, in a way' [15:02] I have all Intel here and I'm paying for it. [15:02] I'm kinda new to the job, and I didn't realize ... [15:02] We need to do better in the future. [15:02] that I could have engaged Intel earlier and directly on the problem :( [15:03] OK. Fair enough. [15:03] yeah, I'm hoping that it goes better in Karmic, if we're working together [15:03] because Intel does do their work in the open [15:03] From my perspective Gutsy was the last release where all the pieces came together. [15:03] for x, you mean? [15:03] Overall. [15:03] hmm [15:04] gutsy was the worst release for me regarding suspend/resume [15:04] do you mean for Kubuntu specifically [15:04] For me, Intrepid was good for X, but seriously broken in the kernel [15:04] lol [15:04] Hardy was good kernel and good X, but none of the tools worked with X, so stuff like trying to give a presenation using my laptop was totally out. [15:05] * a|wen doesn't like to shut down his laptop [15:05] yeah, I'm still running a hardy kernel... [15:05] I saw a ton of change mails for Kubuntu a couple of nights ago, so it looks like the Kubuntu team has been really productive [15:05] Riddell: kudos ^^^^^ [15:05] * ScottK would like for us to really have a release where all the pieces come together. [15:05] \o/ [15:05] :) [15:06] ScottK: I don't think that will ever be possible with the segmentation *buntu has now [15:06] I hope that's wrong. It'll take work, but it's work needs doing. [15:06] vorian: nhandler's pimpi- er, MCin' hand is strong, you say? :D === jtechidna is now known as JontheEchidna [15:07] JontheEchidna: hehe [15:07] * Mamarok want's her sound back :( [15:07] never let's an MOTU get out of line ;-P [15:07] Mamarok: did you try a new user? [15:08] oh, nice idea, let's see... [15:09] scottK: I've been thinking about "all the pieces coming together" [15:09] it's an interesting problem, because *buntu is all about shipping the latest and coolest features in FOSS [15:10] one of those features being "it actually all works together" [15:10] which is a paradox [15:10] if you really want things to be totally integrated and solid, you stop updating and just bake and test, bake and test [15:11] I suppose you could always stay a version or two behind though [15:11] rickspencer3: this sounds so like Debian :) [15:12] you mean "stable" versus "unstable"? [15:12] yes [15:12] hmm [15:13] Still, I think Kubuntu would be less interesting of a distro if the Kubuntu team wasn't always pushing the envelope wrt latest and greatest [15:13] * Mamarok tries another user [15:15] rickspencer3: I agree, but there's a balance and I think in some respects we've either tipped to far or we aren't expending enough effort on making sure it all comes together at the end. [15:16] well, I'm still new on the team, but as a user it seemed like there was some oscilation ... [15:16] some releases would be too aggressive, and some seemed to conservative [15:16] Yes. I think, as an example, the kernel team leaned too far forward in Intrepid and so backed off for Jaunty. [15:17] freinhard: no sound neither, and still Pulseaudio showing up [15:17] It'd be good to get some distro wide agreement on which ones are agressive and which ones should work. [15:18] Phonon bug? [15:18] Kubuntu doesn't use pulseaudio [15:18] ScottK: I have *no* pulseaudio installed!!! [15:19] Odd then. [15:19] it has been installed by the KDE 4.2.2 update in Jaunty and I can't remove it without removing half of KDE, and my sound is gone :( [15:20] Mamarok: What does aptitude why pulseaudio tell you? [15:20] actually, I have removed pulseaudio, the only thing remaining is libpulse0 [15:20] and I purged it too [15:20] ScottK: I have been over this with others earlier today already [15:20] OK. then why on that one. [15:20] * Quintasan was wondering why whole Kubuntu depends on libpulse0 [15:21] it's just driving me mad that there is pulseaudio even showing up [15:21] It's libxine1-misc-plugins [15:22] can't remove that neither, it removes half of KDE [15:22] and that definitely is not normal [15:24] Agreed. [15:24] * ScottK waves his arms and announces 'someone' should look into that. [15:26] * Mamarok waves too [15:27] bbl [15:31] rickspencer3: Speaking of synchronization .... It may be that the Dx folks are going to be working on the wrong cycle (by the current plan) for KDE. KDE 4.3 is right now entering feature freeze. It seems to optimize upstream collaboration, the schedule for Dx with Karmic and KDE 4.3 is out of sync. [15:32] Mamarok: i have no sound in jaunty kubuntu as well with no pulseaudio installed [15:33] i had sound in intrepdi lost it in the upgrade [15:33] ScottK: okay [15:33] rickspencer3: Just a thought. [15:34] I know they're 110% consumed with Jaunty right now, but I'll make sure they synch up with you guys regarding Kubuntu and KDE version in Karmic [15:38] They did have time for a Karmic planning sprint. It'd be nice to have some information on what's already been decided. [15:53]