[00:00] <rickspencer3> you can thank pitti I suppose :)
[00:00] <robert_ancell> "thank" ;)
[00:00] <robert_ancell> I don't know if I've ever actually run ubiquity - always dist upgraded...
[00:00] <rickspencer3> well, I suppose you'll be running it today :)
[00:01] <seb128> what bug did you win today? ;-)
[00:02] <rickspencer3> 353090,(jaunty) Text hidden on Who are you? step,robert-ancell,Triaged,High,ubiquity (Ubuntu Jaunty),jaunty,,canonical-desktop-team,2009-04-01 12:39:21.873648+00:00
[00:02] <rickspencer3> bug 353090
[00:03] <Ampelbein> seb128: ok, bug 356614 updated
[00:03] <seb128> Ampelbein: thanks
[00:04] <Ampelbein> btw: seems that launchpad finally can connect to gnome-bugtracker again ;-)
[00:05] <seb128> Ampelbein: they did run a forced update on all watches and looked at it today on my request, let's see if that works regularly from now
[00:06] <Ampelbein> seb128: cool, thanks for the nagging there.
[00:07] <Ampelbein> that's a great help for updating packages.
[00:07] <seb128> you're welcome ;-)
[00:07] <seb128> indeed
[00:07] <seb128> and to know where there is some changes we might want to backport too
[00:07] <Ampelbein> right.
[00:12] <seb128> Ampelbein: the update is corret now thanks, I've uploaded it
[00:13] <Ampelbein> seb128: thanks for sponsoring. it was a good learning experience for me.
[00:13] <seb128> ;-)
[00:13] <seb128> what I said the other day, library updates are something to play with too ;-)
[00:15] <Ampelbein> yeah. and it seemed so simple at first glance...
[00:32]  * calc back, and looking at the g-s-d bug again
[00:32] <robert_ancell> seb128: thanks for the debdiff hint - I knew there was something I'd missed in the release process
[00:33] <seb128> robert_ancell: you're welcome, that should make things easier for you and for the reviewer ;-)
[00:49] <calc> asac: i updated the upstream bug report
[00:51] <calc> i wonder if this is an issue of xrdb being called for the old and new values and it just happening to overwrite the new value with the old
[00:51] <calc> it seems to be calling xrdb with both values at least, i can't tell which one completed first though
[00:52] <calc> since its async it seems that i wouldn't really know
[00:55] <james_w> thanks seb128
[00:55] <seb128> james_w: you're welcome, thank you for the good work ;-)
[00:57] <calc> seb128: can the async call cause the xrdb calls to be done out of original issue order?
[00:58] <seb128> calc: what do you call "issue order"?
[00:58] <seb128> it's building the description and doing one call
[00:58] <seb128> there is no real order there
[00:59] <calc> seb128: every time you change the setting it first calls xrdb with the old value, then calls it again (apparently sometimes multiple times?) with the new value
[00:59] <seb128> the calls are async they could arrive in the wrong order I guess
[00:59] <seb128> but having it called several time seems to be a bug
[01:00] <calc> seb128: i just changed from medium to full and saw it call xrdb twice for medium and then once for full
[01:00] <calc> for a single radio button change
[01:00] <seb128> that is a valid bug to report upstream and seems a better explanation than the one you had before
[01:02] <calc> yea
[01:02] <calc> still a race condition just not the way i originally thought it was caused
[01:03] <seb128> right
[01:04] <calc> so probably two bugs in that it shouldn't be able to execute out of order... but shouldn't be calling it with the old values to begin with
[01:04] <calc> and shouldn't be calling it multiple times either, so maybe three bugs
[01:06] <seb128> the order would not be an issue if there was one call as expected
[01:33] <YokoZar> Regarding newer iPods: it's sort of a race to see whether Wine + iTunes or Rhythmbox/Banshee will work with them first
[08:18] <didrocks> hi seb128
[08:19] <seb128> lut didrocks
[08:20] <didrocks> seb128: I repackaged nautilus-actions from svn finally (cherry picking the patch was awful as there were a lot of changes in the files). After having striked with "make distcheck" to create a tarball, it seems to works well. I will upload it tonight
[08:20] <seb128> didrocks: excellent, thanks!
[08:20] <didrocks> seb128: y/w
[08:21] <didrocks> seb128: bugs #355370 if you didn't see it
[08:21] <didrocks> they just want a menu in XFCE
[08:21] <didrocks> (but the debdiff is wrong as they took my Vcs-Bzr tag and didn't update it in Bzr :))
[08:22] <seb128> right
[08:23] <seb128> we have 2.26 in bzr already though?
[08:23] <didrocks> yes, you know, the "non-working on update"
[08:23] <didrocks> but we can overwrite it, if needed
[08:27] <seb128> didrocks: right
[08:27] <seb128> hey chrisccoulson
[08:27] <didrocks> hi chrisccoulson
[08:30] <chrisccoulson> hi seb128 & didrocks
[09:04] <asac> calc: ok .. i will look after reading mails et al
[09:06] <seb128> hey asac
[09:06] <asac> hey seb128
[09:10] <geser> tseliot: Hi, I've seen that your last upload of screen-resolution-extra FTBFS because of a missing --install-layout=deb in the setup.py install arguments. Either add it to your debian/rules or use the default from cdbs (the difference would be an extra -O0). Here is a patch for the second option: http://paste.ubuntu.com/146042/
[09:11] <tseliot> geser: ah, right, I didn't check that. Thanks a lot :-)
[09:24] <tseliot> geser: ok, I have updated my bzr branch and set the source to bryce for the upload
[09:36] <seb128> bah, those "this desktop file should be shown or not in xfce" bugs start being annoying
[09:46] <asac> seb128: yeah.
[09:46] <asac> seb128: please use NotShowIn=XFCE
[09:46] <asac> and dont exclude all other DE like the xcfe guys usually suggest
[09:47] <seb128> in this case the desktop has OnlyShowIn=GNOME
[09:47] <seb128> they want XFCE to be added there
[09:47] <asac> tse
[09:48] <seb128> bryce, tseliot: do you know what code in the xrandr capplet, gnome-desktop lib get the monitor names?
[09:48] <asac> seb128: yeah. mabe check whether its supposed to be NotShowIn=KDE
[09:48] <asac> i think a bunch of KDE folks suggest to use OnlyShowIN=GNOME if its actually something not Qt
[09:48] <seb128> asac: right
[09:48] <seb128> well, then you have xfce people who disagree on whether the application should be displayed or not when installed
[09:49] <asac> seb128: most gnome apps should be shown in xfve
[09:49] <seb128> that's ridiculous, we should display everything and let users clean ;-)
[09:49] <asac> its gtk
[09:49] <asac> xfce is gtk too
[09:49] <seb128> well they claim they have tools for those functions already
[09:49] <asac> they share almost everything from gnome from what i know
[09:49] <asac> seb128: then users shouldnt install it
[09:49] <seb128> so they don't want the xfce and the GNOME tools to be listed
[09:49] <asac> xubuntu should drop it from seed
[09:50] <asac> if users install it they want it to be shown
[09:50] <seb128> or they want to be able to start GNOME
[09:51] <bryce> seb128: see libgnome-desktop/display-name.c
[09:52] <bryce> seb128: vendors[] is a map of EDID vendor ID's to human readable names.
[09:52] <tseliot> seb128: yes, sure it involves decoding the EDID
[09:52] <tseliot> oh, ^^
[09:52] <seb128> thanks
[09:52] <tseliot> seb128: what's the problem?
[09:52] <tseliot> (just curious)
[09:52] <seb128> bug #356834
[09:52] <seb128> "$ grep "Monitor name" /var/log/Xorg.0.log
[09:52] <seb128> (II) fglrx(0): Monitor name: DELL 1907FP
[09:52] <seb128> (II) fglrx(0): Monitor name: ASUS MK241"
[09:52] <seb128> but those are displayed as "unknow"
[09:53] <tseliot> seb128: that's because the driver doesn't support RandR 1.2
[09:53] <tseliot> the same happens with nvidia
[09:53] <seb128> the capplet should not start in this case no?
[09:54] <tseliot> seb128: it still supports RandR 1.1 though
[09:54] <seb128> I though the capplet was 1.2 specific?
[09:54] <bryce> tseliot: fglrx *partially* supports xrandr 1.2.
[09:54] <seb128> and is there any reason why xrandr 1.1 couldn't get monitors names?
[09:55] <tseliot> but superm1 wrote a patch which suggests users to launch either ATI's panel or nvidia-settings when you open the capplet
[09:55] <seb128> the grep there seems to indicate that the xorg log has decent names
[09:55] <tseliot> bryce: partially?
[09:55] <bryce> tseliot: yep
[09:55] <tseliot> :-/
[09:55] <bryce> yep
[09:55] <tseliot> seb128: can I see the log
[09:55] <tseliot> ?
[09:56] <seb128> tseliot: I gave the bug number just before
[09:56] <seb128> tseliot: there is no log just the grep I copied
[09:56] <seb128> tseliot: but feel free to comment on the bug and ask details
[09:56] <bryce> night
[09:56] <tseliot> seb128: aah, my guess is that the driver doesn't support RandR properties such as EDID
[09:56] <seb128> 'nigh bryce
[09:56] <tseliot> night bryce
[09:56] <seb128> tseliot: can you add a comment asking for that on the bug?
[09:56] <tseliot> sure
[09:56] <seb128> thanks!
[10:04] <seb128> vuntz: hey
[10:04] <seb128> vuntz: still working on the gnome-session changes and aiming at 2.26.1 next week?
[10:07] <vuntz> seb128: yes. But please don't run away after asking a question :-)
[10:08] <seb128_> ok, there is something buggy there
[10:08]  * seb128_ kicks gnome-keyring
[10:08] <vuntz> 11:07 < vuntz> seb128: yes. But please don't run away after asking a question :-)
[10:09] <seb128> vuntz: sorry got some gnome-keyring issues and session restarts
[10:09] <seb128> should be stable again now
[10:09] <seb128> I got 3 gnome-keyring-daemon process running though, not sure that's right
[10:10] <seb128> ok, it crashed again, back in 5 minutes rather than doing a lot of IRC restarts ;-)
[10:45] <asac> seb128: could you look at the patch i attached to openoffice font bug 271283
[10:46] <asac> if you say its ok to try that still for a few days, i can upload
[10:46] <asac> e.g. i think we still do the .1 upload round?
[10:46] <asac> so we could back it out while doing that if we see regressions
[10:47] <seb128> asac: that's fine with me yes
[10:47] <seb128> we should get 2.26.1
[10:47] <asac> ok i will upload that now then
[10:47] <asac> let me check if there i sbzr
[10:48] <seb128> there is!
[10:50] <asac> seb128: heh. you forgot to push your last commit ;)
[10:50] <asac> ididnt get ubuntu3
[10:50] <seb128> hum
[10:51] <seb128> I'm not on my laptop right now, will fix that in 15 minutes or so just let me finish something there
[10:51] <asac> its ok
[10:51] <seb128> feel free to upload without pushing to bzr for now
[10:51] <asac> yeah
[11:30] <hyperair> has anyone noticed that after returning from suspend/hibernate, the window icons are messed up in compiz's scale plugin?
[11:31] <hyperair> restarting compiz fixes the issue =\
[12:19] <mpt> YokoZar, hi, did you register a blueprint about the autorun stuff?
[12:20] <YokoZar> mpt: not on blueprint specifically, though there is an autorun section on the better integrated wine blueprint
[12:21] <mpt> ok
[12:22] <YokoZar> mpt: do you think a blueprint would help?
[12:22] <mpt> YokoZar, I have no idea, but I'm guessing the window that comes up wouldn't be powered by Wine
[12:22] <mpt> (the combined window, I mean)
[12:22] <mpt> so, your call :-)
[12:23] <YokoZar> Well the Ubuntu CD Dialog certainly wouldn't, yeah.  It does seem like it could benefit from further discussion (eg what it should say when you put a cd in for a running Ubuntu version)
[12:23] <YokoZar> or, for that matter, a non-official CD
[12:23] <seb128> what about autorun?
[12:23] <seb128> I disabled autorun in nautilus in jaunty
[12:24] <mpt> Ok, so is there any example where autorun ever *should* work in Ubuntu?
[12:24] <YokoZar> seb128: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-desktop/2009-April/002059.html
[12:24] <mpt> (in a future version)
[12:25] <YokoZar> Yeah, when you put in a Windows Application CD with autorun on it
[12:25] <YokoZar> Then you should get the prompt (and the prompt should work)
[12:25] <seb128> or you should get no prompt which is what we have now
[12:26] <YokoZar> seb128: what about when I double click the CD
[12:27] <seb128> it browse it
[12:27] <YokoZar> Right.  But a user might expect autorun there, especially if that's the same CD they took from Windows.  So we should at least offer it
[12:28] <seb128> those autorun don't work under linux
[12:38] <YokoZar> seb128: they can if Wine is installed though, which is why "fixing the prompt" means "making it call Wine in a way that isn't broken"
[12:38] <YokoZar> eg with winepath
[12:39] <seb128> YokoZar: I'm probably not the best person to talk with about wine, I'm not for giving the false impression that running microsoft code under linux works correctly
[12:39] <seb128> my experience is that things are slow, ugly and buggy
[12:40] <YokoZar> Microsoft API. 100% non-microsoft code ;)
[12:40] <seb128> but I will not stop you if you want to work on that, we don't install wine by default anyway so as long as it's not showing in the default install
[12:40] <seb128> right, same difference ;-)
[12:40] <YokoZar> seb128: your experience is very common.  And one reason why I want to work on that ;)
[12:41] <seb128> nautilus will have proper code next cycle
[12:41] <YokoZar> One of the things I'll be demoing at UDS are the various ways we can lower the user expectation about Wine while still making it easy to try and use it
[12:41] <seb128> there is a shared-mime-info pending patch to detect unix and w32 autoruns
[12:41] <seb128> once they have different mimetype we can have different handlers
[12:42] <YokoZar> good good.  After that it's just a matter of using winepath to point at the cd drive (something like wine `winepath /media/cdrom/foo.exe`)
[12:44] <seb128> https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20562 is the corresponding shared-mime-info bug
[13:38] <mpt> mvo, yesterday I came across the report of bug 356152, which would be Critical if it was confirmed
[13:38] <mpt> mvo, can you suggest a way to reproduce that? For example, would (1) installing the beta, then (2) setting the clock forward more than a week, and (3) restarting, be a good test?
[13:40] <mvo> mpt: let me check the report
[13:44] <mvo> mpt: the method of setting the clock forward should work
[13:44] <mpt> ok, I'll try that, thanks
[13:45] <seb128> what is the issue there?
[13:46] <seb128> mvo: btw I tried to trigger the "update-manager starts after using synaptic" for a week without luck, it's probably fixed in the current version
[13:46] <mvo> mpt: I followed up in the report
[13:47] <mvo> seb128: thanks
[13:47] <mpt> thanks mvo
[13:48] <mvo> mpt: I'm running u-m with a 1 day setting and it frequently auto-opens for me (e.g. after the weekend). this does not mean that there might be bugs hidding of cours
[13:49] <seb128> I'm running it with 1 day too now for debug purpose and it opens regularly
[13:49] <mvo> thanks seb128
[13:49] <mpt> cool
[13:49] <mvo> good to hear :)
[13:49] <mvo> too many fires currently to put out, I really hope its something else in janes case (like elmo sneakily applying some updates or something)
[14:35] <seb128> hey tedg
[14:36] <seb128> tedg: apparently your evolution-indicator translation change breaks evolution's translations
[14:36] <tedg> seb128: Hmm, that's no good.
[14:36] <seb128> tedg: it probably overwritte the translation domain for evolution code or something
[14:36] <tedg> seb128: It must change the default... yeah.
[14:37] <seb128> tedg: bug #352657 has some details
[14:37] <tedg> Okay, so I guess every message needs to have the domain explicitly set on it then.
[14:39] <tedg> Kinda funny, the second screenshot is much more readable to me! ;)
[14:40] <seb128> lol
[15:05] <calc> asac: there appears to be a bug in firefox that if you kill it (using kill) and restart it after an upgrade it still thinks you need to restart
[15:05] <asac> calc: kill -KILL or normal kill?
[15:06] <asac> calc: we have a bug about that
[15:06] <asac> calc: its even in the milestoned section of our weekly meetings ;)
[15:06] <asac> bug 270303
[15:07] <rickspencer3> heh
[15:07] <seb128> hey rickspencer3
[15:07] <rickspencer3> hey seb128
[15:07] <seb128> did we sort the weekly meeting time for this week btw? ;-)
[15:07] <calc> asac: ah ok sorry :)
[15:07] <seb128> still 16:30utc?
[15:08] <calc> asac: yea normal kill pid, i got used to having to do that so my tabs wouldn't go away
[15:08] <asac> calc: no prob
[15:08] <calc> asac: i imagine the restart button that is now there will probably work as well :)
[15:08] <asac> calc: interesting that you use that as a workaround
[15:08] <asac> for me hitting ctrl+Q works ;)
[15:08] <calc> asac: in the past (hardy/intrepid timeframe i think) quiting caused me to lose my tabs from what i recall
[15:09] <asac> calc: yes. verifying that restart button keeps tabs would be nice ... so if you next get that suggestion give it a try ;)
[15:09] <calc> heh ok
[15:10] <calc> i do recall what i did in the past was attempt to just quit (not restart) which did not work back then
[15:13] <eeejay> hey mvo
[15:34] <seb128> pedro_: do you think that bug #356989 is an important issue?
[15:39] <pedro_> seb128: well not "important" as if we don't ship that the application doesn't work but worth to fix before the release on the default photo app
[15:39] <pitti> Good morning
[15:39] <pedro_> i wonder why that wasn't included on the 0.5.3 release btw...
[15:39] <seb128> pedro_: ok, the font in the screenshot didn't seem to be normal use one ;-)
[15:39] <seb128> hey pitti
[15:39]  * seb128 hugs pitti
[15:39]  * pitti hugs the team
[15:39] <pedro_> hello pitti
[15:40] <kenvandine_wk> hey pitti!
[15:40] <seb128> pitti: how are you?
[15:40] <kenvandine_wk> having fun in SF I hope?
[15:40] <pitti> I'm pretty good, just got up
[15:41] <pitti> the collab summit didn't start yet, had some hacking sessions with Jon and some informal discussions
[15:41] <rickspencer3> pitti!
[15:41] <pitti> and on the weekend I enjoyed SF a lot
[15:41] <pitti> hey rickspencer3!
[15:41] <dobey> oh you are in SF?
[15:41] <seb128> good ;-)
[15:41] <dobey> i was going to say
[15:42] <rickspencer3> pitti: how is the weather?
[15:42] <kenvandine_wk> i heard it was rainy last night
[15:42] <pitti> was splendid on the weekend and yesterday, today it's cloudy
[15:43] <rickspencer3> (the weather in conference centers is always the same I suppose ;) )
[15:43]  * pitti curses at those retracers, what do they have now...
[15:43] <kenvandine_wk> hehe
[15:43] <seb128> pitti: cf #distro
[15:43] <pitti> rickspencer3: yeah, same artificial light and high geek concentration :)
[16:12] <mvo> eeejay: hi (sorry, missed your earlier hello)
[16:26] <tedg> So when I use g_dgettext do I still need to have the string with a _() around it?
[16:29] <seb128> tedg: what string?
[16:29] <seb128> asac: g-s-d changes pushed btw
[16:30] <tedg> seb128:  Basically are these the same:  _("foo") and g_dgettext(domain, "foo")  or should it be g_dgettext(domain, _("foo")) ?
[16:30] <mclasen> they are not the same, but the last one makes no sense
[16:31] <tedg> Not the same with regards to the domain, but if the domain was the default domain they'd be the same.
[16:31] <tedg> mclasen: right?
[16:32] <mclasen> g_dgettext has some difference in behaviour to dgettext, but in first order, yes, they are equivalent
[16:32] <mclasen> you need to fix your xgettext invocation to extract those strings, of course
[16:33] <tedg> mclasen: I'm not sure what you're saying there.
[16:35] <mclasen> if you call xgettext you tell it what patterns to look for in the source
[16:35] <mclasen> and it won't look for g_dgettext() unless you tell it to
[16:35] <tedg> I guess I'm using intltool -- do you know if that configures it to look fro g_dgettext?
[16:36] <mclasen> no I don't
[16:36] <mclasen> but you have the right experts onboard for that question...
[16:37] <tedg> Hmm, seems that it doesn't :(
[16:38] <tedg> dobey: ^  Do you know this one?
[16:38] <calc> tedg: ArneGoetje may know if you can't find anyone else around that does
[16:38]  * calc doesn't know himself
[16:38]  * dobey reads backlog
[16:40] <dobey> tedg: why wouldn't you just be doing _("foo")?
[16:40] <tedg> dobey: Because this is a plugin for Evolution, so I can't change the default domain, or it seems I change the domain for all of evolution.
[16:40] <dobey> or you are wanting to use a different domain?
[16:41]  * tedg is happy with it all being in English, but it seems others are not :)
[16:42] <dobey> though intltool itself doesn't do anything with C files, other than check for strings marked with the _,Q_,etc... macros, and complain if the files aren't in POTFILES.in
[16:42] <dobey> it just relies on the standard gettext bits to extract strings from C
[16:43] <tedg> So then how do I configure my intltoolized setup to pull from the glib functions vs. the standard GNU ones?
[16:46] <asac> seb128: ok. i will forward the patch upstream tomorrow morning if nobody shouted ;)
[16:46] <asac> not sure they will want it though. but we should try ;)
[16:46] <dobey> tedg: i think you need to add --keyword=g_dgettext to XGETTEXT_OPTIONS in po/Makevars
[16:47] <njpatel> tedg: have you looked at glib/gi18n-lib.h?
[16:48] <dobey> tedg: or alternatively, simply redefine _ to pass in your domain instead
[16:48] <njpatel> tedg: it seems to rely on #define-ing GETTEXT_PACKAGE to do the right thing
[16:48] <dobey> though i don't see how simply using _ in a plug-in would screw up the rest of evolution
[16:48] <njpatel> tedg: basically what dobey said (defining _), but done in glib instead
[16:50]  * tedg is looking
[16:52] <tedg> So I guess I don't understand the difference between gi18n.h and gi18n-lib.h
[16:52] <tedg> Is that the difference?
[16:53] <njpatel> tedg: -lib is meant for libraries, hence passes in the domain, where gi18n.h just uses gettext normally
[16:53] <njpatel> (and inherits the application domain)
[16:53] <tedg> Ah, okay.  That sounds like it's for us then!
[16:53] <njpatel> yep
[16:53] <tedg> Thanks!
[16:56] <dobey> yeah
[17:13] <james_w> hmm, that's a bit silly, I just got a pinentry window for my GPG key, but I wasn't able to interact with anything else, so I couldn't find out what triggereed it
[17:20] <pitti> james_w: that was an intermediate bug in libgpgsm; you should just purge gnupg2, gnupg-agent, and pinentry
[17:20] <james_w> ooh
[17:22] <seb128> vuntz: what is the recommend way to test if a session is a GNOME one?
[17:25] <Riddell> seb128: there's no great way to do it but see detectDE in /usr/bin/xdg-open
[17:25] <seb128> ok, that's what I though
[17:25] <seb128> those are mostly hacks but that should work
[17:26] <rickspencer3> desktop team meeting in 4 minutes
[17:26] <bryce> morning
[17:26] <seb128> hello
[17:26] <rickspencer3> bryce!
[17:26] <seb128> bryce: user switching works again on my laptop, good work!
[17:27] <rickspencer3> I updated this morning, and the cover flow effect seems much faster!
[17:27] <calc> hi
[17:28] <bryce> seb128: yep, good to hear
[17:28]  * calc found that two single serve tea bags aren't quite enough for 2L of tea
[17:28] <rickspencer3> pitti: are  you here for the team meeting?
[17:29] <rickspencer3> ArneGoetje: asac bryce calc kenvandine_wk pitti Riddell seb128 pedro_
[17:29] <rickspencer3> ready?
[17:29] <bryce> yep
[17:29] <ArneGoetje> here
[17:30] <Riddell> aye
[17:30] <calc> yes
[17:30] <pitti> rickspencer3: doing some firefighting with the retracers, and I'm doing some conf stuff, but I'm lurking
[17:30] <rickspencer3> pitti: ack
[17:30] <asac> hi
[17:30] <seb128> yes
[17:30] <seb128> there!
[17:30] <rickspencer3> let's go then
[17:31] <rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-04-07
[17:31] <rickspencer3> actions from last meeting:
[17:31] <rickspencer3> ACTION: All - If you've got a blog, blog about X Hug day ACTION: Contact pitti if there are people at Linux Foundations that you want him to meet on your behalf
[17:31] <rickspencer3> both moot points now
[17:31] <kenvandine_wk> done though :)
[17:31] <rickspencer3> however, it seems that the bug day went very very well
[17:31] <rickspencer3> kenvandine_wk: thanks
[17:31] <pedro_> yep that's true ;-)
[17:31] <pedro_> thanks everybody
[17:32] <rickspencer3> so great work all (esp. pedro_ and bryce)
[17:32] <rickspencer3> thanks pedro_
[17:32] <rickspencer3> next
[17:32] <rickspencer3> Desktop Summit: Deadline to submit is this Friday
[17:32] <rickspencer3> if you want to go, please submit
[17:33] <rickspencer3> if anyone has any questions or concerns, please follow up with me directly
[17:33] <pitti> rickspencer3: do you want many people from desktop team to go, or just e. g. Seb, Robert, and Jonathan?
[17:33] <rickspencer3> pitti: I want everyone who wants to go to go
[17:34] <rickspencer3> as I mentioned last week, it will be easier to get sponsorship, etc... if you have a talk
[17:34] <rickspencer3> however, if you submit, and don't get accepted, please talk to me
[17:34] <rickspencer3> or if you don't want to submit, but want to go, please talk to me
[17:34] <rickspencer3> I understand that the timing of the deadline is unfortunate
[17:34] <rickspencer3> make sense?
[17:34] <Riddell> do we know if people from other teams are submitting talks?
[17:35] <Riddell> mobile team or OEM team probably have stuff that would be interesting for the conference
[17:35] <tedg> I will be :)
[17:35] <Riddell> oh aye, DX too
[17:35] <seb128> and dxteam and online team too
[17:35] <rickspencer3> the dx team is submitting ... a lot of interesting stuff
[17:35] <tedg> Assuming of course, you people stop assigning me bugs ;)
[17:35] <pROCKrammer> hello
[17:36] <rickspencer3> OLS team has the contacts store stuff
[17:36] <pROCKrammer> is there Desktop team?
[17:36] <kenvandine_wk> i would love the mobile guys to present stuff
[17:36] <seb128> tedg: start writting bug-free code? ;-)
[17:36] <Riddell> agateau: you going to submit a talk?
[17:36] <kenvandine_wk> tedg: there are no bugs... just undocumented features
[17:36] <Riddell> pROCKrammer: we're in a meeting just now
[17:36] <pROCKrammer> cooolllll ))
[17:36] <pROCKrammer> Riddell: can other users participate ?
[17:37] <rickspencer3> so I'll be expecting to hear from each person individual if they are interested
[17:37] <rickspencer3> certain people may be hearing from me :)
[17:38] <Riddell> pROCKrammer: yes, stay around a watch, but don't disturb unless you are on topic
[17:38] <rickspencer3> moving on ...
[17:38] <rickspencer3> Meeting time: Everyone has updated MeetingTime wiki
[17:38] <rickspencer3> thanks
[17:38] <rickspencer3> no single slot came out as good for everyone
[17:38] <rickspencer3> I propose that we discuss how to set up team meetings in emails
[17:38] <rickspencer3> If we're agreeable, I'll kick it off with an email
[17:39] <rickspencer3> sounds okay, or would folks rather discuss on irc?
[17:39] <asac> okay
[17:39] <ArneGoetje> fine for me
[17:39] <kenvandine_wk> +1 for email
[17:39] <rickspencer3> ok
[17:39] <rickspencer3> moving on
[17:39] <rickspencer3> we have some release critical bugs
[17:39] <rickspencer3> I'd like to check in on those briefly now
[17:40] <rickspencer3>  353924     Offline home page always English (browser language hard-coded to en-US)
[17:40] <asac> discuss with community and investigate regression LP: #353924; thinking
[17:40] <asac> * about solutions better than "just" backing out the fix that triggered this.
[17:40] <asac> (from activity)
[17:40] <rickspencer3> asac: is it really importance = High?
[17:40] <seb128> bug #353924
[17:40] <asac> i am on it. most likely will be the "backing" out
[17:41] <asac> rickspencer3: i would think its high. it basically means that websites always see en-US as language
[17:41] <rickspencer3> asac: ack
[17:41] <bryce> hrm, do release critical bugs keep being added?  seems this list never shortens...
[17:41] <asac> which is bad given that a bunch of websites do localization using javascript navigator.language
[17:41] <rickspencer3> "on it" sounds like a good response :)
[17:41] <rickspencer3> bryce: yes, as far as I can tell
[17:41] <bryce> :-/
[17:41] <rickspencer3> furthermore, I'm not sure how some of them get there
[17:41] <calc> bryce: bugs everywhere, as soon as you squash one, another comes out of the woodwork ;-)
[17:42] <asac> bryce: release critical bugs often get discovered after beta ;)
[17:42] <rickspencer3> so bryce, you have three 945 bugs on the list
[17:42] <rickspencer3> are you working on these? because I know you're working on others
[17:42] <pitti> QA keeps tossing them, but feel free to ct-rev if you think that they aren't really critical
[17:42] <rickspencer3> bug 337608
[17:42] <bryce> calc, indeed
[17:42] <pitti> QA errs on the safe side, so it is absolutely appropriate to reject some
[17:42] <bryce> rickspencer3: yes all three I've looked at recently
[17:42] <rickspencer3> pitti: does qa target them as well?
[17:43] <bryce> rickspencer3: they're all new to the list though so not resolved yet
[17:43] <pitti> rickspencer3: no, just assigns to us
[17:43] <rickspencer3> I ask about this last one, because pitti comments: Taking off the Jaunty RC radar, this looks more like a corner case.
[17:43] <bryce> rickspencer3: the a17 one might help with performance
[17:43] <rickspencer3> but it's still targeted, and it doesn't say why in the bug
[17:43] <calc> pitti: i think the fact we keep seeing so many bugs isn't necessarily a bad thing, just perhaps bugs are just better triaged now than in the past
[17:44] <bryce> rickspencer3: yeah dunno
[17:44] <asac> is the eeepc bug reproducible?
[17:44] <pitti> rickspencer3, bryce: I re-targetted to Jaunty because mdz said that it wasn't a corner case after all
[17:44] <rickspencer3> ok
[17:44] <pitti> but happens on certified laptops, and is quite important for customers as well
[17:44] <rickspencer3> in any case, I wanted to ensure that bryce was aware that he had these RC bugs
[17:45] <rickspencer3> and to see if there was anything we should be doing to help
[17:45] <rickspencer3> it looks like bryce would need the actual hardware to work on that one, no?
[17:46] <bryce> rickspencer3: these three don't feel like ones that will be especially easy to solve, but who knows.  Personally I think we have a number of crasher bugs that are probably more problematic for people, and easier to solve
[17:46] <rickspencer3> bryce: ok
[17:46] <bryce> rickspencer3: so I'll be balancing my time between these rc bugs and the crashers
[17:46] <rickspencer3> I think that needs to be made explicit
[17:46] <pitti> bryce: if we get them upstream and triaged, that's fine
[17:46] <pitti> bryce: part of mdz's request was to get a feeling how much hw is affected
[17:46] <calc> i have access to a 945 if you need help with debugging, i can see if the systme is affected by the issue
[17:46] <rickspencer3> if these aren't truly blockers, they shouldn't be tagged as such
[17:46] <bryce> pitti: that's done already
[17:47] <rickspencer3> bryce: should any of these three be targeted, in your opinion?
[17:47] <pitti> bryce: if you think that it's not affecting many people, then we can still do an SRU later, or just shrug at it as "too hard"
[17:47] <bryce> rickspencer3: no
[17:48] <rickspencer3> bryce:do you have other bugs that should be?
[17:48] <bryce> yes
[17:48] <rickspencer3> okay
[17:48] <bryce> 356264 - VERY widely reported, but maybe not X's fault.  needs sorted in any case
[17:49] <Riddell> bug 356264
[17:49] <bryce> 349535
[17:49] <asac> bug 349535
[17:49] <rickspencer3> ok
[17:49] <rickspencer3> I'll talk to steve about how to get the right bugs tracked
[17:49] <rickspencer3> move on?
[17:49] <bryce> probably others but don't know offhand
[17:49] <rickspencer3> bug #353090
[17:50] <agateau> Riddell: don't think so
[17:50] <rickspencer3> Fix Committed, so "yeah Robert"
[17:50] <rickspencer3> asac: this one is Importance = Medium
[17:50] <rickspencer3> 145716
[17:50] <rickspencer3> bug 145716
[17:51] <asac> rickspencer3: easy fix. not critical imo, because its an old upgrade issue
[17:51] <asac> e.g. not new in jaunty
[17:51] <asac> but i will fix it for release
[17:51] <asac> either keep it on targetted list or add milestone only
[17:51] <asac> ;)
[17:52] <rickspencer3> asac: would be good to fix, since it's a bit old, but I understand if there are more important bugs to fix on the destkop
[17:52] <rickspencer3> or even the desktop
[17:52] <asac> heh
[17:52] <asac> ;)
[17:52] <rickspencer3> there are also some un-targeted highs that have been milestoned for Jaunty
[17:52] <rickspencer3> but those are bugs that you all put there yourselves as personally goals
[17:52] <rickspencer3> I put them on the wiki as a reminder, but no need to discuss here
[17:53] <asac> yes.
[17:53] <rickspencer3> everyone submitted an activity report, so thanks for that
[17:53] <rickspencer3> any other business?
[17:53] <seb128> rickspencer3: do you prefer to get the activity reports by emails on directly on the wiki btw?
[17:53] <kenvandine_wk> i have a few bugs that need sponsoring
[17:53] <rickspencer3> seb128: thanks for asking
[17:54] <kenvandine_wk> all listed in my activity report
[17:54] <rickspencer3> I would say, do what is easiest for you
[17:54] <seb128> alright
[17:54] <rickspencer3> however, if you have NDA stuff, I would ask that you send it separately, as I've tended to copy and paste to the wiki before reading
[17:54] <asac> kenvandine_wk: was indicate python sponsored? with or without my comments?
[17:55] <kenvandine_wk> almost ready
[17:55]  * rickspencer3 tick tick tick
[17:55] <seb128> kenvandine_wk: did you subscribe ubuntu-main-sponsors to those bugs?
[17:55] <pitti> I reviewed it again on sunday or so
[17:55] <kenvandine_wk> pitti had some feedback, it is done except the python versions thing
[17:55] <kenvandine_wk> seb128: i did
[17:55] <seb128> kenvandine_wk: I've been watching the sponsoring list daily and I don't think I've seen waiting things there
[17:55] <kenvandine_wk> pitti: i am converting it to setuptools
[17:55] <kenvandine_wk> should be done soon
[17:55] <seb128> hum, ok, so maybe those didn't strike me as changed for jaunty ;-)
[17:55] <pitti> kenvandine_wk: I hope upstream will take that :)
[17:55] <kenvandine_wk> easier than figuring out how to make it build right
[17:55]  * seb128 looks on the wiki
[17:55] <kenvandine_wk> pitti: i think i can convince them
[17:56] <rickspencer3> before we break, I'd like to call out bryce
[17:56] <rickspencer3> he's been working his a** off on X, and made some really ...
[17:56] <bryce> rickspencer3: btw 349535 seems to be an Intrepid-only bug, mnemo pointed out.  Sounded familiar, perhaps one fixed earlier in jaunty.  so not a blocker after all
[17:56] <rickspencer3> noticible improvements over the last week or so
[17:57] <seb128> bryce: good work, thanks again for fixing user switching on my d630 ;-)
[17:57] <bryce> hopefully noticeable in the good way ;-)
[17:57] <rickspencer3> our users will really benefit from the dedication
[17:57] <rickspencer3> lol
[17:57] <rickspencer3> yes
[17:57]  * calc hugs bryce :-)
[17:57] <rickspencer3> as I said, cover flow works, that's all I care about :)
[17:57] <rickspencer3> j/k
[17:57] <bryce> what's cover flow?
[17:57] <bryce> compiz effect?
[17:57] <rickspencer3> yes
[17:57]  * pitti hugs bryce; that was an awesome work!
[17:57] <kenvandine_wk> bryce: great work!
[17:58] <rickspencer3> home key (or windows key) and tab
[17:58] <bryce> don't worry, in a few weeks we'll be breaking X all over again I'm sure ;-)
[17:58] <kenvandine_wk> hehe
[17:58] <rickspencer3> we should sell little ubuntu stickers for the home key
[17:58] <kenvandine_wk> X is hard to fix... and easy to break
[17:58] <rickspencer3> once again, thanks bryce!
[17:58] <rickspencer3> any other business?
[17:58] <bryce> no prob, glad everything's coming together.
[17:58] <rickspencer3> Sounds good
[17:59] <rickspencer3> Final Freeze is Thursday ... so time is running out on your changes
[17:59] <rickspencer3> please contact me if you see something risky or concerning so we can get it settled by then
[17:59] <bryce> for anyone curious about the remaining performance problems, I've documented at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Troubleshooting/Performance
[18:00] <seb128> bryce: incorrect page name?
[18:00] <seb128> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Troubleshooting/IntelPerformance you mean?
[18:01] <Riddell> rickspencer3: I have something risky and concerning
[18:01] <Riddell> someone decided to remove all translations from .desktop files
[18:01] <Riddell> Kubuntu wasn't ready for this to happen
[18:01] <seb128> urg
[18:01] <Riddell> I'm working on fixing that now so it should be ok
[18:02] <Riddell> but I'd really rather have been told about this when it happened, and it really shouldn't have happened post-beta
[18:02] <seb128> the somebody is pitti there
[18:02] <bryce> seb128: thanks yes that's right
[18:02] <seb128> well he did when we noticed that we still had issue on ubuntu packages
[18:02] <Riddell> chances are it'll introduce regressions, launchpad translations usually do
[18:02] <pitti> I just moved it from cdbs to pkgstriptranslations
[18:02] <seb128> if translations are not stripped on ubuntu the language packs are not used
[18:03] <pitti> Riddell: urgh, sorry; I thought kdelibs has used x-ubuntu-gettext-domain for ages?
[18:03] <seb128> pitti: it was in gnome.mk only before though? ie not touching non GNOME packages?
[18:03] <pitti> that LangpacksDesktopKDE spec was in edgy or so?
[18:03] <Riddell> pitti: I never got it working with KDE 4 (until today)
[18:03] <pitti> seb128: no, langpack.mk
[18:03] <seb128> oh ok
[18:04] <Riddell> langpack.mk doesn't touch KDE packages
[18:04] <pitti> Riddell: if it causes problems, I'll revert the stripping for kde packages
[18:04] <Riddell> pitti: it should be ok but it'll be hard to test it properly in time, dunno when launchpad will give us new langpacks etc
[18:04] <pitti> Riddell: the current ones don't work?
[18:04] <seb128> new langpacks should not be required to test that
[18:06] <Riddell> pitti: no they're not set up for it, they don't have translations from KDE 4
[18:06] <pitti> what, the langpacks don't have KDE 4 translations??
[18:06] <ArneGoetje> new langpacks are exported right now. The next export will happen on Friday 22:00 UTC, the again on Monday 22:00 UTC and the final one next week Friday 22:00 UTC.
[18:06] <Riddell> pitti: not for the desktop files
[18:06] <pitti> Riddell: also, if you aren't using the cdbs langpacks.mk, how come that the .desktop files have X-Ubuntu-Gettext-Domain?
[18:06] <Riddell> pitti: we have our own thing in kde4.mk
[18:07] <pitti> if they shouldn't use gettext, they should't add that field
[18:08] <Riddell> indeed, I never completed it for KDE 4 due to lack of time or need, so being kicked into doing it is fair enough, I'd just rather it was a month ago
[18:08] <pitti> I apologize, that was a misunderstanding then
[18:08] <pitti> if you want me to revert or clean up anything, I'll do that
[18:09] <pitti> (easiest probably being to stop adding the gettext field to .desktop files)
[18:09] <Riddell> ArneGoetje: I'll be pinging you with a list of the .pot files to make sure they're associated correctly sometime tomorrow
[18:09] <Riddell> pitti: I'm almost done implementing it now :)
[18:09] <ArneGoetje> Riddell: ok, thanks.
[18:09]  * pitti hugs Riddell
[18:14] <pROCKrammer> that is end of discussion?
[18:15] <rickspencer3> meeting adjourned?
[18:16] <rickspencer3> thanks all!
[18:16] <ArneGoetje> thanks and  good night
[18:16] <rickspencer3> Jaunty! Jaunty! Jaunty!
[18:16] <pitti> thanks all
[18:16] <rickspencer3> have fun pitti
[18:16]  * pitti goes offline again, ring my mobile on urgencies
[18:16] <pROCKrammer> rickspencer3: thanx
[18:17] <rickspencer3> pROCKrammer: seemed you had a question?
[18:17] <pROCKrammer> rickspencer3: yeap, can i be member of Uzbek Language translation teem? :D
[18:18] <rickspencer3> ArneGoetje: ^^^^^
[18:18] <rickspencer3> jono: ^^^^^^^^^
[18:18] <rickspencer3> pROCKrammer: I think you just start contributing
[18:18] <rickspencer3> however, I'm not the best person to ask how to get started
[18:19] <chrisccoulson> anyone here know if the mail-notification plugin in evolution is meant to be disabled by default?
[18:19] <rickspencer3> also, wondering if #ubuntu might be slightly better channel for that?
[18:19] <pROCKrammer> rickspencer3: 10x ))
[18:19] <rickspencer3> chrisccoulson: I'm 99% sure it is not supposed to be disabled by default
[18:19] <kenvandine_wk> chrisccoulson: it isn't supposed to be
[18:19] <jono> pROCKrammer, you sure can :)
[18:19] <chrisccoulson> rickspencer3 - thanks
[18:20] <kenvandine_wk> chrisccoulson: it should be enabled... just not the notification icon
[18:20] <pROCKrammer> jono: the question is HOW ?)))
[18:20] <jono> pROCKrammer, you should email david.planella@canonical.com and he can advise
[18:20] <jono> :)
[18:20] <pROCKrammer> jono: 10x
[18:20] <chrisccoulson> kenvandine_wk - thanks, that makes sense now:)
[18:20] <kenvandine_wk> chrisccoulson: i patched it to disable the icon stuff unless you are running with gnome-stracella... however you spell that :)
[18:21] <kenvandine_wk> but the plugin stays enabled, cause it does the dbus events... etc
[18:21] <jono> pROCKrammer, 10x?
[18:21] <pROCKrammer> jono: 10x = thanx)
[18:21] <jono> oh, haha :)
[18:21] <jono> thanks pROCKrammer ! :)
[18:21] <davmor2> jono: live and learn
[18:22] <jono> davmor2, heh
[18:22] <pROCKrammer> what about support of Atheros Wifi on laptops?
[18:22] <chrisccoulson> kenvandine_wk - thanks for the info
[18:22] <kenvandine_wk> chrisccoulson: anytime
[18:22] <rickspencer3> pROCKrammer: that is definetly a great question for #ubuntu (if you are looking for support)
[18:23] <rickspencer3> if you want to contribute to it #ubuntu-devel might be a good place
[18:23] <rickspencer3> pROCKrammer: what are you thinking?
[18:23] <pROCKrammer> rickspencer3: no no ) not support) it is for U ) will be it supported in new version
[18:23] <rickspencer3> your asking if Ubuntu will support atheros in Jaunty?
[18:24] <pROCKrammer> aha
[18:24] <pROCKrammer> rickspencer3: aha)
[18:24] <pROCKrammer> rickspencer3: cuz on 8.10 i had some problems
[18:24] <pROCKrammer> rickspencer3: i installed back-ports for that
[18:25] <rickspencer3> so atheros is typically supported by madwifi driver
[18:25] <rickspencer3> not sure if there is a change there
[18:26] <rickspencer3> I think the best place to ask about that would be #ubuntu
[18:26] <pROCKrammer> rickspencer3) thanx)
[18:26] <rickspencer3> this room is more where we discuss the progress of developing the desktop
[18:26] <rickspencer3> while #ubuntu people talk more about how to support certain things
[18:27] <rickspencer3> of course, you are more than welcome to hang out in #ubuntu-desktop :)
[18:27] <rickspencer3> just might not get some of your questions answered quickly
[18:27] <pROCKrammer> I C ))
[18:37] <kenvandine_wk> asac: ping
[18:38] <kenvandine_wk> asac: i was just talking to jorge about gwibber... and i hear ryan did whacky crap in the 1.0 branch
[18:38] <kenvandine_wk> asac: is there bug fixes we need to pull into what we have now?
[18:38] <asac> kenvandine_wk: not saying crap. but they synched trunk to 1.0 branch ;)
[18:38] <asac> which is kind of unexpected
[18:38] <kenvandine_wk> wild wild west :)
[18:38] <kenvandine_wk> i think what is there now is pretty good :)
[18:38] <asac> not sure. its a huge amount of changes
[18:39] <kenvandine_wk> s/there/jaunty
[18:39] <kenvandine_wk> asac: basically i am wondering if we need to merge anything
[18:39] <kenvandine_wk> the package just needs a Recommends: python-indicate added imho
[18:39] <asac> thats hard to say as the 1.0 branch only has a few clean commits. rest is synchs from trunk
[18:39] <asac> kenvandine_wk: for that we need indicate in the branch at all
[18:40] <asac> but thats completely lumped together with other chnages
[18:40] <kenvandine_wk> asac: the indicator stuff is there already
[18:40] <asac> so we probably cannot pick just that
[18:40] <asac> kenvandine_wk: yes. but not in 0.8
[18:40] <kenvandine_wk> i think we have it already...
[18:40] <kenvandine_wk> oh... humm
[18:40] <asac> nope
[18:40] <kenvandine_wk> ok
[18:40]  * kenvandine_wk was wrong
[18:40] <asac> they wanted to give us a topic patch for that
[18:40] <kenvandine_wk> damn
[18:40] <asac> at least i hoped
[18:40] <asac> but they just synched it from trunk ;)
[18:41] <kenvandine_wk> sigh
[18:41]  * kenvandine_wk will mock ryan about that later :)
[18:41] <asac> james_w: can you checkout  bzr+ssh://bazaar.launchpad.net/%7Egwibber-committers/gwibber/gwibber-1.0/ and run a
[18:42] <asac> bzr log -p -r 239..
[18:42] <asac> that gives a bad exception with encoding somehow
[18:42] <asac> bzr: ERROR: exceptions.UnicodeDecodeError: 'ascii' codec can't decode byte 0xd8 in position 9: ordinal not in range(128)
[18:42] <asac> am i misuing bzr again ;)?
[18:43]  * asac has to run to get some food
[18:43] <james_w> I think that's fixed
[18:43] <james_w> there was a bug with log -p, and it works for me on bzr.dev
[18:44] <nhaines> I have a (procedural) question about the decision to remove the update notification in jaunty.
[18:44] <nhaines> Specifically, I was wondering what would be the best way to keep informed about these sorts of decisions.
[18:46] <james_w> running the development release (in a VM if you are not comfortable recovering from not being able to boot) is the most reliable way
[18:46] <nhaines> I do that with my laptop, but the icon simply disappeared around the same time notifications got an overhaul.  I didn't know it had been planned back in December.
[18:47] <james_w> well, that's a different question
[18:47] <nhaines> The question is "how do I keep informed of these decisions?"
[18:48] <james_w> well, you were informed
[18:48] <james_w> there are hundreds of decisions made every day about Ubuntu, I'm sure you don't want to be involved in them all
[18:48] <james_w> if you are particularly interested in update-notifier then following that package and talking to the developers would work
[18:49] <mnemo> nhaines: join mailing lists, stay online at IRC, subscribe to logs of bugmail and read the planet blogs?
[18:50] <nhaines> james_w: I was informed yesterday, once people started denting about it.
[18:50] <nhaines> mnemo: I do follow planet but don't recall hearing about it.
[18:50] <james_w> heh, I'm sure people have been denting for longer than that
[18:50] <james_w> I'd suggest you subscribe to ubuntu-devel-discuss@
[18:51] <james_w> there was a large thread about it on that list
[18:51] <nhaines> Now that I haven't followed for a while, since a few months after it was split from ubuntu-devel.  So that's a really good idea.
[18:51] <nhaines> It was really dead for a long time.  Excellent.  Thank you very much for reminding me about that list.
[19:02] <rickspencer3> bug #337926
[19:03] <asac> james_w:  ok thanks. is there a more recent snapshot of bzr.dev available as a package?
[19:03] <james_w> there are dailies
[19:03] <james_w> what version are you using?
[19:05] <asac> james_w: ii  bzr                       1.13.1-1
[19:05] <james_w> hmm, I thought it was fixed in that
[19:06] <asac> let me check if its really the -p
[19:06] <james_w> but, as I said, there are dailies
[19:06] <asac> ok seems its the -p inded
[19:07]  * asac branches bzr.dev
[19:07] <johanbr> james_w: I tried your indicator patch for Empathy. Very nice!
[19:08] <johanbr> I just have a question... is clicking on an event in the applet supposed to do anything?
[19:08] <johanbr> Because it doesn't seem to...
[19:08] <asac> usually it should open the app/window that focusses the conversation
[19:08] <asac> at least that the behaviour we have for other apps
[19:08] <rickspencer3> asac: who would be a good person to look at bug 355317
[19:10] <asac> rickspencer3: i would think seb128 might give some initial input if something changed in how gnome deals with new storage devices
[19:10] <rickspencer3> tx
[19:11] <asac> from there we can see if its desktop or lower level issue
[19:11] <james_w> johanbr: yeah, it's supposed to open the chat
[19:11] <rickspencer3> okay, assigned to seb128
[19:12] <james_w> johanbr: I assume that they don't disappear when you click either?
[19:12] <johanbr> james_w: hmm... even for "someone just came online events" ?
[19:12] <johanbr> they do disappear
[19:12] <asac> james_w: seems to be fixed in .dev
[19:12] <james_w> ah
[19:12] <james_w> asac: thanks
[19:13] <james_w> asac: I'll add it to my list for 1.13.2 consideration
[19:13] <james_w> johanbr: I might not have implemented that bit properly
[19:13] <asac> cool.
[19:13] <johanbr> rickspencer3: That looks like a kernel problem to me. usb-storage should print "usb-storage: device scan complete" if everything works normally.
[19:13] <james_w> johanbr: no, it works ok for me
[19:14] <johanbr> james_w: so clicking on "foo just appeared online" is supposed to bring up a chat with foo?
[19:14] <james_w> ah, you see "just appeared online"?
[19:15] <johanbr> well, not in exactly those words
[19:15] <johanbr> I mean the notification that someone in my contact list appeared.
[19:15] <james_w> ok
[19:16] <johanbr> you know what... it does appear
[19:16] <johanbr> just behind other windows
[19:16] <johanbr> compiz focus stealing problem, I guess
[19:16] <james_w> ah
[19:16] <james_w> yeah, I'm not very good at all that stuff.
[19:17] <james_w> in that case it's just empathy doing its normal thing, but I would like it if we could make it work much better
[19:17] <james_w> once this gets more mature I'm sure one of the more experienced people at that sort of thing will help to make them all behave sensibly
[19:18] <johanbr> right...
[19:18] <james_w> thanks for the feedback though, good to know that it works ok for you
[19:18] <johanbr> thank you :)
[19:18] <johanbr> I also have a problem with the indicator applet sometimes becoming invisible. But that's most likely nothing to do with the empathy stuff.
[19:20] <james_w> I don't think so
[19:20] <james_w> it will become invisible if all the servers drop off the bus
[19:21] <johanbr> it disappeared when I quit empathy
[19:21] <johanbr> and didn't reappear whtn I started empathy
[19:21] <johanbr> *when
[19:21] <james_w> I learnt that it is quite easy to debug, use ps to get the command line for kill indicator-applet, ignore the dialog for now, run it from a terminal with the same command line, then click the "reload" button from the dialog
[19:21] <james_w> you should get all the debugging output
[19:23] <johanbr> no output at all
[19:23] <johanbr> do I have to set some variable?
[19:23] <johanbr> oh, did something wrong
[19:23] <johanbr> let's try again
[19:24] <johanbr> well, now it prints IOR: <long hex string> when being started
[19:24] <johanbr> but no reaction to quitting or starting empathy
[19:28] <james_w> did you hit reload?
[19:30] <johanbr> no, I didn't... I can't read today, obviously
[19:31] <johanbr> now the icon appears, after I did that... weird
[19:31] <johanbr> and killing and reloading normally also works... it seems to be intermittent
[19:33] <johanbr> this time the icon went away... and there's no reaction to restarting empathy
[19:33] <johanbr> (although I get other debug output)
[19:34] <james_w> ok
[19:34] <james_w> do you have d-feet installed?
[19:35] <james_w> it's a dbus browser
[19:35] <james_w> you could use it to check that the empathy process was on dbus and exporting an appropriate object
[19:36] <johanbr> installed now... what am I looking for?
[19:37] <james_w> ok
[19:37] <james_w> fire it up
[19:37] <james_w> is there a "Session bus" tab?
[19:37] <johanbr> yes
[19:37] <james_w> k
[19:37] <james_w> find the icons for empathy in the list
[19:38] <johanbr> yep
[19:38] <james_w> click on each entry in turn until you find one with something in the right pane
[19:38] <johanbr> there are two, named :1.870 and :1.871
[19:39] <johanbr> the only thing they have on the right is the text "Object Paths"
[19:39] <james_w> ok
[19:39] <james_w> so it's an empathy issue
[19:40] <james_w> it's not exporting anything over dbus
[19:40] <james_w> can you now open empathy preferences and check that the indicator preference is enabled?
[19:41] <johanbr> yep
[19:42] <johanbr> restarting empathy made more stuff appear in d-feet
[19:42] <johanbr> and also made the indicator applet appear
[19:43] <johanbr> All my libs might not be 100% up-to-date. I'll do a complete update and see if that helps.
[19:43] <johanbr> Thanks for the debugging help.
[19:46] <james_w> I doubt not being up to date will affect it, but thanks for trying
[19:46] <james_w> it's a bit hard to know what went wrong from that, but if you can reproduce I'd like to fix it
[19:48] <johanbr> it seemed like empathy sometimes fails to completely connect to dbus
[19:48] <johanbr> might not be your fault
[19:49] <mvo> mpt: i followed up on #356152 and would appreciate your input
[19:49] <james_w> well, the reason that it shows up twice in the list is that it has it's own connection (maybe libnotify?) and libindicate connects one
[19:50] <james_w> so it may be a problem in libindicate or the way I am using it, but it would be good to track down
[19:51] <johanbr> Just updated the system. I'll use it for a few days and let you know if the bug still appears.
[19:51] <james_w> thanks
[20:07] <kenvandine_wk> oh crap... my laptop is crumbling underneath me here...
[20:07]  * kenvandine_wk cries
[20:12]  * kenvandine_wk runs fsck and prays
[20:17]  * hyperair needs to figure out a way to switch from RAID-0 to RAID-1 (of the root drive) via SSH.
[20:17] <hyperair> pivot_root comes to mind..
[20:18] <hyperair> but i need a complete system that has sshd stuffed in tmpfs without the help of a swap.. hmmmm
[20:18] <hyperair> big problem.
[22:02] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - just been speaking with martyn in #tracker, and he's looking at this issue with indexing removable media tomorrow, so we should get a fix quite soon :)
[22:02] <seb128> hey chrisccoulson, thanks
[22:02] <chrisccoulson> no problem
[22:05] <chrisccoulson> has anyone noticed whether the indicator-applet works after suspend-resume cycle?
[22:05] <chrisccoulson> i can't test here as my desktop doesn't resume
[22:06] <kenvandine_wk> chrisccoulson: it does for me
[22:07] <chrisccoulson> someone reports that it doesn't work for them (bug 355667)
[22:08] <hyperair> i think it disappears for em
[22:08] <hyperair> i know it disappears from time to time, but i never bothered to figure out why
[22:08] <hyperair> restarting pidgin/evolution makes the icon appear again
[22:09] <chrisccoulson> the disappearing is already known, but that's not related to suspend/resume
[22:09] <hyperair> oh
[22:09] <kenvandine_wk> i just commented as well
[22:10] <chrisccoulson> thanks kenvandine_wk
[22:10]  * kenvandine_wk -> dinner, bbiab
[22:10] <seb128> chrisccoulson: it works here
[22:10] <chrisccoulson> i suppose it could actually be related to bug 345599 - the suspend/resume bit might just be a red herring