[00:17] <giovani> MianoSM: except that webmin is not "supported" by ubuntu, while ebox is
[00:19] <MianoSM> Due to debians standards?
[00:19] <giovani> standards?
[00:19] <giovani> due to ebox working cleanly with configs, and webmin not, I believe
[00:19] <MianoSM> Or policy
[00:20] <giovani> !webmin
[00:20] <giovani> so no, I don't think it's a free software issue
[00:20] <giovani> it's just a functionality issue
[00:20] <MianoSM> http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-files.html#s-config-files
[00:20] <MianoSM> It is because of how webmin handles the config files, and when debian dropped the "support" as did Ubuntu. :(
[00:21] <giovani> right ... webmin is awful anyhow
[00:21] <MianoSM> In your opinion.
[00:21] <giovani> what else does one state?
[00:21] <MianoSM> Facts.
[00:22] <giovani> haha, not really
[00:22] <giovani> but anyway
[00:23] <MianoSM> I believe at the moment there are more plugins available for the wm users as well, has ebox caught up yet?
[00:24] <giovani> I believe you can count the number of people in this room who use a web gui on one hand
[00:24] <giovani> I definitely don't
[00:24] <giovani> (so I don't know)
[00:24] <MianoSM> I don't either, however, I do teach younger system administrators...
[00:24] <giovani> hopefully you aren't encouraging them to use web guis ...
[00:24] <MianoSM> and quite a few of them enjoy having a visual reference above and beyond CLI that they eventually and inevitably come to enjoy.
[00:25] <MianoSM> I don't encourage anyone to use a web gui if they are going to administrate a server, no.
[00:25] <giovani> but you support web guis in your "teaching"?
[00:25] <MianoSM> I just like to keep an open mind
[00:26] <MianoSM> and when they say: "Is there any other way that I could view X, aside from the command line?" I have answers
[00:26] <MianoSM> Just like when people say: "I use windows", I don't shun and insult or make petty jokes about it either.
[00:27] <MianoSM> We all have our opinions and choices to make, and what suits one will not suit all. It's really what brought about Linux if you think about it. ;)
[00:28] <giovani> of course, but equally weighting methods which the vast majority of professional linux administrators would agree are bunk and ones which are widely used is an unfortunate occurrence in "teaching"
[00:30] <MianoSM> If people want a shortcut, they are either going to find out on their own, or you can hopefully guide them. I used eBox myself, and when I first started managing my own personal server I used webmin. It was comforting for the transition
[00:31] <GullyFoyle> but eventually the training wheels gotta come off, might as well start woth CLI
[00:32] <MianoSM> Of course, you just can't beat a person without telling them why you are beating them. ;)
[00:32] <giovani> discussing GUIs is fine ... but supporting students in using them is a mistake
[00:32] <giovani> it's what's bred the large army of incompetent modern linux admins
[00:32] <GullyFoyle> it's like driving a car, if you start out on a standard shift, you can always move to an automatic, but vice-versa is not as easy
[00:33] <MianoSM> Really?
[00:33] <MianoSM> Starting at the hardest level and then moving down to easier levels, seems a little odd.
[00:33] <MianoSM> I know I didn't start at the 12th grade, and finish at the 1st ;)
[00:33] <giovani> MianoSM: right ... nobody does that, that's the point
[00:34] <giovani> MianoSM: in 1st grade they didn't teach you 12th grade material with pretty pictures instead of text
[00:34] <MianoSM> I started by adding apples in one hand to apples in the other.
[00:34] <giovani> I'm certainly not advocating throwing a student into a pit with no instruction
[00:34] <GullyFoyle> sink or swim
[00:35] <giovani> but giving the wrong instruction at the early stage is a crtical mistake, and very difficult to undo, as GullyFoyle pointed out
[00:35] <MianoSM> These are windows admins transitioning to a linux environment, or even worse, windows users transitioning to linux administration, training wheels help out greatly.
[00:35] <giovani> MianoSM: well we clearly differ on that
[00:36] <MianoSM> There are always lash backs, and repercussions for wrong instruction.
[00:36] <giovani> what windows admins need is to relearn everything from scratch rather than "transition"
[00:36] <MianoSM> I just feel as though you seem very closed minded.
[00:36] <MianoSM> eBox, or Nothing!
[00:36] <MianoSM> don't use something that is unsupported!!!
[00:36] <giovani> I'm not an advocate of ebox at all
[00:36] <giovani> I've never used it
[00:36] <giovani> I don't use web guis, nor would I ever teach them
[00:37] <MianoSM> so how would you really know if ebox or webmin would suit someone better?
[00:37] <giovani> because it isn't about suiting someone better
[00:37] <giovani> that's how I approach this
[00:37] <GullyFoyle> ok mebbe i was trolling a bit. let's try another analogy; do you teach your kids to add and subtract by handing them a calculator?
[00:38] <MianoSM> depends on the situation
[00:38] <giovani> oh boy
[00:38] <jmarsden> GullyFoyle: Do you teach them advanced multivariable calculus first ?
[00:38] <giovani> this is hopeless
[00:38] <MianoSM> the last two finance courses i took taught to both use a financial calc, a spreadsheet, and the long way
[00:39] <giovani> MianoSM: if you hand someone a tool to do a function they do not understand first, you should be stripped of your teaching title
[00:39] <giovani> in any subject
[00:39] <MianoSM> So judging.
[00:39] <jmarsden> giovani: So noone can be given a computer to use until they fully understand all of it?  Interesting approach...
[00:39] <MianoSM> I'll be back in a bit, sorry to leave while the convo was just getting good. :(
[00:39] <giovani> judging on content ... that's the right kind of judging
[00:40] <giovani> jmarsden: if the subject you're teaching them is the workings of a computer ... absolutely not -- which is why computers are not used in Computer Science 101
[00:40] <giovani> or 102
[00:40] <giovani> or 103
[00:40] <giovani> etc
[00:42] <GullyFoyle> hmm, another analogy, is my kid "playing" the piano when he pushes the demo button on his electric keyboard and it plays a tune?
[00:43] <jmarsden> I certainly used computers in my first year of undergraduate Computer Science study... back in 1980-1981...
[00:43] <jmarsden> GullyFoyle: No, but he did just learn one small part of the UI of that keyboard.
[00:43] <giovani> jmarsden: as part of the teaching?
[00:43] <GullyFoyle> and i'm not saying he should learn advanced polytonal harmonies or whatever before he learns to play an instrument
[00:44] <GullyFoyle> but learning to admin throught the CLI is like learning basic scales and chords and simple tunes first on your instrument.
[00:44] <jmarsden> giovani: I didn't teach the classes... but yes.  From memory, we were taught Pascal, and PDP assembler, and also basic computer architecture and so forth... in parallel, during that first year.
[00:45] <giovani> jmarsden: that would be a poorly planned cirriculum, imo
[00:51] <fbc-mx> Can any wireless device be a MASTER(Access point) on Ubuntu server?
[00:57] <giovani> fbc-mx: the device must support the mode
[00:58] <giovani> fbc-mx: as much of wireless communication is offloaded into the card, not all contained in the driver
[00:58] <giovani> fbc-mx: do you have a particular card you'd like to use?
[01:00] <fbc-mx> giovani, not really I found a USB wireless stick and plugged it in to the back of my box and tried to set master mode, I suspected that it might not be supported with every device, hence the question.
[01:00] <giovani> fbc-mx: I believe every major chipset supports it, what driver is in use, and/or what chipset is it, if you know?
[01:01] <fbc-mx> giovani, I have another wirless device laying around in a drawer somewhere I'm gonna try it out in a minute.
[01:13] <giovani> fbc-mx: any luck?
[01:17] <fbc-mx> giovani, dunno it's a digius dn-7003gs
[01:17] <giovani> ok, iirc, that's a Realtek chipset
[01:17] <fbc-mx> giovani, I guess I can use it for a CAN-tenna project is it has no master mode.
[01:18] <giovani> it should support master mode
[01:18] <giovani> it has a Realtek 8187L chipset
[01:21] <fbc-mx> giovani, I don't understand then,, I did an Ifdown beofre making changes to it...
[01:22] <giovani> fbc-mx: hold on, I'm talking to some people who know more about this than I do
[01:23] <giovani> ok, I'm being told that the card supports master mode, but the driver doesn't support putting it into that mode
[01:23] <giovani> if you'd really like to use that card for an AP, you can use the windows driver for it through ndiswrapper
[01:24] <giovani> or google around to see if someone has master/ap mode working with the kernel driver
[01:24] <fbc-mx> giovani,  hahaha, that's great...About as useless as a solar powered flash light.
[01:24] <giovani> fbc-mx: useless? hardly, just because it doesn't go into master mode ... it has other uses
[01:24] <giovani> that chipset supports monitor mode, and injection
[01:24] <giovani> handy for all sorts of wireless fun
[01:24] <fbc-mx> giovani, sorry, I meant for this purpose...
[01:24] <giovani> fbc-mx: like I said, you can use the windows driver in linux via ndiswrapper
[01:25] <giovani> http://my.opera.com/CrazyTerabyte/blog/linux-ehci-hcd-rtl8187
[01:25] <giovani> someone documented their efforts here
[01:25] <fbc-mx> giovani, yeah, I think that ?ll be using it in my cantenna project then.. I don't want to get too deep in drivers and related just to make it work...
[01:25] <giovani> fbc-mx: pretty much anything but straight up wireless client use requires digging around with drivers in linux, honestly
[03:14] <quizme> hi, my server keeps crashing.  i have to keep sending a reboot signal to it.  Does anybody know where the logs are for figuring out why it keeps going down?  what should i check first?
[03:16] <tonyyarusso> quizme: /var/log is where all logs go - there are a few different files in it.
[03:17] <tonyyarusso> If you find something that seems related, but doesn't have enough detail, you can tell the logging daemon to up the logging verbosity.
[03:17] <quizme> tonyyarusso: what should i check first?  apache?
[03:17] <quizme> it seems like a pretty hard problem
[03:17] <quizme> RAM might be running out
[03:17] <tonyyarusso> quizme: Depends on what the server's running and whether you have any data points to work from (like "I changed foo and then the problem started...")
[03:18] <quizme> disk might be running out
[03:18] <quizme> it's been doing it the past week
[03:18] <quizme> every few days i have to give it a reboot
[03:18] <tonyyarusso> You can keep an eye on RAM and disk by just setting up watch commands and seeing what they do right before you lose contact.
[03:18] <tonyyarusso> 'watch free -m' for RAM, 'watch df -h' for disk.
[03:19] <quizme> ok
[03:19] <tonyyarusso> By default watch updates every two seconds, modifiable with -n
[03:19] <quizme> that's handy
[03:19] <quizme> thanks
[03:19] <tonyyarusso> In terms of logs I'd start with syslog and messages
[03:20] <quizme> it's weird to me
[03:20] <quizme> servers are so complex it's like trying to diagnose a patient at a hospital
[03:20] <tonyyarusso> I'd agree with that analogy.
[03:21] <tonyyarusso> Especially if you just inherited control of the server from someone else so you don't know its history.  If you've been working on it for a while you at least have some idea what might be going on.  Kind of like cars.
[03:22] <quizme> so to make watch work even after i logout, i can do something like 'nohup watch free -m 1>2 ram.log'  ?
[03:23] <quizme> 'nohup watch free -m 1>2 ram.log &'
[03:23] <quizme> ?
[03:24] <tonyyarusso> You could do it that way.  I usually run my processes like that within screen instead of with nohup.
[03:25] <quizme> oh... watch .... ok i get it
[03:25] <tonyyarusso> But watch wouldn't write to a log - it's just updates a display so you can literally watch it in real time.
[03:25] <quizme> ya watch is for real time
[03:25] <tonyyarusso> If you want to log it just write a script with a loop to write to the log with a timestamp every so often.
[03:26] <quizme> ok
[03:26] <quizme> i see
[03:27] <quizme> i think it's cuz i'm running an unstable version of phusion passenger maybe
[03:28] <slestak_> n.
[03:28] <slestak_> anyone succesful with using python-vmbuilder with bridged networkign that can help me get my guest os to see the lan?  I can ping my guest, but it cannt see the lan
[03:29] <slestak_> i found a setup that works, but it uses a custom br-ifup script and tap.  id liek to figure out how to use simplest templated setup possible
[03:33] <MTecknology> giovani: yup, thanks :)
[03:54] <slestak_> trying again to build vm, since i think br0 is right now
[03:55] <slestak_> once i get this figured out, looking forward to this.  anyone using kvm in production?
[03:55] <MTecknology> slestak_: you mean the little hardware piece?
[03:56] <slestak_> MTecknology: no, the libvirt hypervisor kvm
[04:15] <fbc-mx> giovani, the other wireless NIC I found is a Bus 005 Device 003: ID 03eb:7614 Atmel Corp. AT76c505a Wireless Adapter, but it won't go into master mode either.
[04:16] <fbc-mx> giovani, how would I find a list of card that will go into master mode natively.
[06:43] <oh_noes> is it possible create an answer file and include it into a CD to install Ubuntu?
[06:43] <oh_noes> Similar to winnt.sif for Windows
[06:58] <twb> that is called "preseeding", and it is copiously documented in the installation guide.
[06:58] <twb> (In one of the appendices.)
[06:59] <twb> I don't know if it's available for Ubiquity, but certainly it works fine on the alternate and server installs.
[07:08] <oh_noes> thanks, and you can preseed in a CD itself?  Put CD in and it'll auto install ?
[07:14] <twb> Yes.
[07:15] <twb> Though it would be more common to use a USB key for that
[07:15] <twb> Or better, PXE (netboot) install.
[07:15] <twb> Note that the preseed file can be provided on a different medium, e.g. on an HTTP server.
[08:38] <gkahla> which revision control tool would you recommend for tracking OpenOffice.org *.odt files?
[08:38] <gkahla> blobs in RC - anyone have any opinions?
[08:42] <gkahla> svn or bazaar; any opinions about which would be better for blobs (OO.org files, jpg's)?
[09:00] <bubba> whats up fellows
[09:00] <bubba> i need help with proftpd
[09:01] <bubba> anyone out there?
[09:01] <bubba> holla
[09:03] <bubba> need help with proftpd.. anyone?
[09:05] <gkahla> sry bubba - afk a moment - what's up w/ proftpd? (not an expert, but willing)
[09:06] <bubba> i am trying to change the default index.html using an ftp client but cant get the permission
[09:07] <bubba> and i use my administration login so I dont understand why I cant manipulate the files remotely
[09:07] <gkahla> what are the perms as listed in the client?
[09:08] <gkahla> you can 'ls -l' inside most ftp clients
[09:08] <bubba> it was 644 but went ahead and changed it in the client side with no avail
[09:08] <gkahla> it'll tell you permssions
[09:08] <gkahla> are you sure the admin account is enabled for FTP?
[09:09] <bubba> i think so but how do i make sure of that?
[09:09] <mattt> bubba: sure the file is owned by the user you're logging in w/?
[09:09] <gkahla> you'd have to take a look at the config file -
[09:10] <gkahla> also, if the account is listed in /etc/ftpusers, it's NOT ALLOWED
[09:10] <bubba> hmm
[09:11] <gkahla> anyone have an opinion about which RCS to use for blobs? OpenOffice files, jpg maps, etc? CVS would loose it's mind...
[09:13] <bubba> root is listed in /etc/ftpusers
[09:13] <gkahla> then root may not use FTP
[09:15] <bubba> need I delete that?
[09:16] <gkahla> production server?
[09:16] <gkahla> I wouldn't
[09:16] <Kamping_Kaiser> i'd advise against it
[09:16] <gkahla> if you need to get to the file, i'd ssh in, change it's owner, copy it down, edit, copy back, reset owner
[09:17] <gkahla> i wouldn't change /etc/ftpusers lightly
[09:18] <bubba> ok I will try that
[09:18] <Kamping_Kaiser> bubba, any particular reason your using ftp?
[09:32] <bubba> not working
[09:34] <bubba> if you just installed proftpd and want to change the default index.html via a ftp client unsuccesfully, what would you do?
[09:35] <bubba> kapit bahai are you still there?
[09:36] <Kamping_Kaiser> no idea. I avoid ftp like plauge.
[09:36] <bubba> you are not kidding
[09:37] <bubba> i am using ftp because the server has no gnome
[09:37] <Kamping_Kaiser> whats wrong with scp?
[09:38] <Kamping_Kaiser> or rsync, for big transfers
[09:38] <bubba> scp? rsync?
[09:39] <Kamping_Kaiser> yes. commands to move files around
[09:40] <bubba> ok. well let me give that a shot
[09:45] <gkahla> scp is your good friend, really...
[09:51] <bubba> do i need to uninstall proftpd from the server then?
[09:52] <gkahla> was this the only reason you have it on there?
[09:52] <bubba> yep
[09:53] <gkahla> then, to minimize the amount of programs that could respond to outside requests, I'd definitely get rid of proftpd
[09:54] <bubba> alright thanks a mil
[09:56] <bubba> still the same deal the server wont let me delete the default index.html
[09:56] <gkahla> ssh normally doesn't allow root to login either - who owns the file?
[09:57] <bubba> the admin
[09:58] <gkahla> all you need to do is delete this file, right?
[09:58] <bubba> yes and replace it with my own index.htm
[09:59] <gkahla> what is the name of your non-admin account on the box?
[10:00] <bubba> i am inside /var/www/ and keeps saying permission denied
[10:00] <bubba> is it mysql that is denying me access?
[10:00] <gkahla> two questions: 1 - who are you logged in as? 2 - what user:group owns the index.html file?
[10:02] <bubba> i am logged in as the administrator and the index.html file is the default file that reads "It Works" when you initially setup mysql
[10:02] <gkahla> you're logged in as "root", right?
[10:03] <gkahla> 'the administrator' doesn't tell me which account you're using - you can set it to anything...
[10:03] <bubba> correct. how do i dbl chech that. excuse the ignorance
[10:03] <gkahla> type the command 'whoami' and hit enter
[10:04] <gkahla> that's who you're logged in as
[10:04] <bubba> type it in where?
[10:04] <gkahla> how are you logged into the remote machine? via ssh?
[10:05] <bubba> correct
[10:06] <gkahla> so, you've got a terminal open and you're on the remote machine in that terminal? right?
[10:06] <bubba> i downloaded th scp client and put in all the info into it
[10:06] <bubba> correct
[10:06] <gkahla> which scp client?
[10:06] <bubba> winscp
[10:07] <gkahla> ah - you're doing this from a Windows machine?
[10:07] <bubba> yes
[10:07] <bubba> connected to a ubuntu server
[10:07] <gkahla> now i understand - are you comfortable with DOS or the command-line?
[10:07] <bubba> yes
[10:08] <gkahla> can you install PuTTY instead?
[10:08] <gkahla> use that to sign into the server?
[10:08] <bubba> ok
[10:11] <gkahla> putty will give you a command-line, which is *much* more powerful
[10:12] <bubba> ok i signed in on it
[10:12] <gkahla> you've got a blinking prompt, yes?
[10:12] <bubba> yes i already logged in
[10:13] <gkahla> whoami <enter> will tell you the username you're signed on as - it is most likely not going to be 'root'...
[10:13] <gkahla> ls
[10:13] <bubba> yes it says bubba
[10:14] <gkahla> pwd <enter> will tell you the directory (folder) you're currently sitting in - where are you?
[10:14] <bubba> home/bubba
[10:15] <gkahla> where is the file you want to replace?
[10:15] <gkahla> /var/www?
[10:15] <bubba> its in /var/www/
[10:16] <gkahla> let's find out who owns it - try the command 'ls -l' <enter> (no quotes)
[10:16] <gkahla> let's find out who owns it - try the command 'ls -l /var/www' <enter> (no quotes)
[10:16] <gkahla> sorry about that
[10:17] <gkahla> there will be a column where you'll see owner:group listed...
[10:17] <bubba> root
[10:17] <gkahla> probably, it'll be root:root
[10:17] <bubba> there you go
[10:18] <gkahla> so, to become the root user, run the command 'sudo bash' <enter> (no quotes)
[10:18] <gkahla> the prompt will change from $ to #
[10:18] <bubba> ok there i am
[10:18] <bubba> it did
[10:18] <gkahla> cd /var/www <enter>
[10:19] <bubba> ok
[10:20] <gkahla> you've got options here - you can either 1) change the index.html file to be owned by bubba, or 2) just make a backup and clear the space for the new version of the file... I'd recommend the later
[10:21] <bubba> i will opt for tha latter but how do i change the ownership
[10:22] <gkahla> if you wanted to change that file to be owned by the user 'bubba', you could 'chown bubba:bubba index.html' <enter> (no quotes)
[10:22] <bubba> oh ok
[10:23] <gkahla> for the 2nd option, 'mv index.html index.html.backup' <enter> (no quotes)
[10:24] <bubba> k
[10:24] <gkahla> now, on your Windows box, you've got a replacement for that index.html file, right?
 so, to become the root user, run the command 'sudo bash' <enter> (no quotes) <- if you must suggest dropping to a shell, please use sudo -i
[10:25] <gkahla> Kamping_Kaiser-  point taken... :)
[10:25] <Kamping_Kaiser> :)
[10:26] <gkahla> still with us, bubba?
[10:27] <bubba> oh yeah. i am waiting for you to say something
[10:27] <gkahla> you've got a replacement file on your Windows machine, right?
[10:27] <bubba> yes i do
[10:28] <gkahla> you can fire up winscp and drop it into /home/bubba - then, move it to the destination folder (/var/www) and chown it to root:root...
[10:29] <gkahla> leave the putty session open
[10:29] <bubba> ok
[10:30] <Kamping_Kaiser> bubba, can i ask why you want to change the file in /var/www/ ? would you be served just as well by using $HOME/public_html/
[10:30] <gkahla> you'll have to move it over with the putty commandline - as well as changing the owner
[10:31] <bubba> and i did
[10:31] <gkahla> who owns the file in /var/www?
[10:31] <bubba> huh?
[10:32] <bubba> LOL
[10:32] <gkahla> who owns the file you just put in /var/www?
[10:33] <bubba> you mean the replacement index.html?
[10:33] <gkahla> yes
[10:33] <bubba> bubba
[10:33] <gkahla> that's no good - the original file was owned by root:root
[10:33] <gkahla> change the ownership to root:root
[10:34] <bubba> then I guess that who owns it. how deo i verify
[10:34] <bubba> then I guess that who owns it. how do i verify
[10:34] <gkahla> 'ls -l /var/www' <enter> (no quotes)
[10:35] <bubba> in putty right?
[10:35] <gkahla> yes sir - winscp doesn't allow you to type anything
[10:36] <bubba> ok what i got was root root with the backup file on it
[10:36] <gkahla> the replacement isn't in /var/www yet?
[10:37] <bubba> i am not seeing it.
[10:37] <gkahla> where did you copy it with winscp?
[10:38] <bubba> copied it into /var/www but i did not chown it. didnt know how
[10:38] <gkahla> the winscp program only knows how to sign on as bubba  - it cannot land files into /var/www
[10:38] <gkahla> you'll have to use winscp to drop the file into /home/bubba
[10:39] <bubba> i dragged it into /var/www
[10:39] <gkahla> then, use putty to move it to /var/www and change the owner
[10:39] <gkahla> winscp can't land files into /var/www
[10:39] <gkahla> not as bubba
[10:39] <gkahla> user accounts mean something in Ubuntu
[10:40] <gkahla> that's why we're concerned with who owns things
[10:40] <bubba> my mistake
[10:40] <gkahla> np - navigate to /home/bubba in winscp and drop the file in there
[10:42] <bubba> thats where it is now. so does bubba own it now?
[10:42] <gkahla> you've still got putty open, right?
[10:42] <bubba> yes
[10:42] <gkahla> still signed on as root in that putty session, right?
[10:42] <bubba> yes
[10:42] <gkahla> 'ls -l /home/bubba' <enter> (no quotes)
[10:43] <gkahla> that'll tell you who owns it
[10:43] <gkahla> it should be bubba:bubba
[10:43] <bubba> it is not bringing it up. idk why
[10:44] <gkahla> did you get a set of columns?
[10:44] <gkahla> or just a list of files and dirs?
[10:45] <bubba> i have three files in there
[10:45] <bubba> drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 4096 2009-03-10 11:14 apache2-default
[10:45] <gkahla> that's a directory - is that in /home/bubba?
[10:46] <bubba> correct
[10:46] <bubba> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root   45 2009-05-24 23:43 index.html.backup
[10:46] <bubba> drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 4096 2009-05-25 00:04 webalizer
[10:46] <gkahla> that's . . . strange - it's acting like you're running 'ls -l' in the /var/www directory . . .
[10:46] <gkahla> did you type 'ls -l /home/bubba' ???
[10:47] <Kamping_Kaiser> suspect he is.
[10:47] <Kamping_Kaiser> or a mv has gone awry
[10:47] <bubba> let me do it again
[10:47] <bubba> stupid me. i am in /var/www
[10:48] <bubba> how do i get out cd..
[10:48] <gkahla> that's why i suggested you add /home/bubba to the end of the ls command - it'll look over there without changing directories
[10:49] <bubba> what i typed in was exactly what u said
[10:50] <gkahla> if you want to change directories, try 'cd /home/bubba'
[10:50] <bubba> oh there it is
[10:50] <bubba> bubba is the owner
[10:51] <gkahla> copy it over to /var/www, then change the owner to root:root
[10:51] <bubba> cmd pls?
[10:55] <gkahla> cp index.html /var/www
[10:55] <gkahla> that'll copy it over
[10:56] <gkahla> chown root:root /var/www/index.html
[10:56] <gkahla> changes the owner
[10:57] <bubba> root@server1:/var/www# cp index.htm /var/www
[10:57] <bubba> cp: cannot stat `index.htm': No such file or directory
[10:58] <gkahla> you're sitting in the /var/www dir - didn't know that
[10:58] <gkahla> cp /home/bubba/index.htm .
[10:58] <bubba> k
[10:58] <gkahla> did it make it over to /var/www?
[11:00] <bubba> let me see
[11:00] <owh> Is there a UDS channel?
[11:00] <bubba> it sure did
[11:01] <gkahla> bubba-  did you chown it to root:root?
[11:01] <bubba> yes i did
[11:01] <Kamping_Kaiser> owh, at a guess something like #ubuntu-uds
[11:02] <Kamping_Kaiser> owh, i expect they have per topic channels though - its what we do at LCA
[11:02] <gkahla> bubba-  you should be done -
[11:02] <bubba> do i need to transfer the accompanying files to index.htm to /var/www as well?
[11:05] <bubba> thanks for your time <gkahla>
[11:09] <gkahla> anyone have an opinion about a RCS for blobs?
[11:09] <Kamping_Kaiser> gkahla, depending on your workflow, bzr would work
[11:10] <gkahla> it'll be basically two people working on different sections with little overlap
[11:11] <gkahla> my concern is about the blobs - there will be jpg images for maps, and OpenOffice.org files with documents
[11:11] <Kamping_Kaiser> i know bzr and svn dont care about blobs as far as commitming them goes. iirc bzr allows binary diffs.
[11:11] <Kamping_Kaiser> gkahla, i'd suggest asking #bzr to get opinions on bzrs suitability
[11:11] <gkahla> ooh - binary diffs!!
[11:12] <gkahla> thx, Kamping_Kaiser - appreciate the feedback
[11:12] <Kamping_Kaiser> gkahla, gl
[11:18] <Gargoyle> Mornin All
[11:18] <gkahla> howdy, Gargoyle
[11:20] <Gargoyle> Laptop + Garden + Sun = Win! :)
[11:22] <gkahla> congrats - sun's not up over here yet
[11:24] <gkahla> thanks all - try and stay out of trouble, eh?
[11:31] <Gargoyle> Was hardy 8.04 or 8.10?
[11:35] <Gargoyle> Is there a command in ubuntu to get the version without having to look in /etc/apt/sources.list?
[11:51] <Gargoyle> Anyone have any recomendations or arguments for/against monit vs nagios. I am looking to install something on a single server and thinking that nagios might be a bit overkill.
[11:56] <yann2> why not use munin? :)
[11:57] <Gargoyle> yann2: ahh, so many options!
[11:57] <yann2> but munin is in main :]
[11:58] <Gargoyle> I take it that when apt-cache show monit is telling me version 1:4.8.1-2.1 that it means 4.8
[12:03] <Gargoyle> yann2: Looks like its munin then! :)
[12:03] <yann2> http://waste.mandragor.org/munin_tutorial/munin.html :)
[12:05] <Gargoyle> yann2: Ta
[12:06] <Gargoyle> Is there a way I can get a list of all installed packages? I want to try and get a virtual machine running as close to my real server as possible and then test installations on the VM first.
[12:16] <maxb> # On the source machine
[12:16] <maxb> dpkg --get-selections > foo
[12:16] <maxb> # On the destination VM
[12:17] <maxb> dpkg --set-selections < foo
[12:17] <maxb> apt-get dselect-upgrade
[12:17] <maxb> Gargoyle: ^
[12:18] <Gargoyle> Sweet!
[12:18] <Gargoyle> Cheers, maxb
[12:18] <Gargoyle> Will it mess things up if the source machine is a VM running the Xen kernel?
[12:19] <Gargoyle> The destination is just gonna be a vmware VM, with the normal kernel.
[12:31] <maxb> Hmm. You probably want to prune the kernel packages out of the foo file
[12:32] <Gargoyle> maxb: Too late! ;)
[12:32] <Gargoyle> I was thinking I can probably just check menu.lst when its finished and check it doesn't default to the xen one?
[12:33] <maxb> Yes, and you'll likely want to uninstall the unwanted kernels from the guest too
[12:33] <maxb> for tidyness / conserving diskspace
[12:34] <Gargoyle> Not too worried about that as long as it doesn't have knock on effects with other packages.
[12:42] <Gargoyle> Thanks for the tips guys. Time to fire up the bbq for lunchtime burgers! :D
[12:56] <GullyFoyle> anyone run nginx as a webserver? mine is running fine, but there's one thing. when i do a nginx -t i get an error "can't open /var/run/nginx.pid permission denied. nginx is running as default user www-data. what permissions do i have to change?
[13:11] <GullyFoyle> d'oh, i had to run sudo nginx -t
[13:11] <GullyFoyle> got it
[14:00] <samirnassar> I have two virtual servers with private IP addresses on virtual interfaces (eth0:0) Can I force traffic from and to to go over the virtual interface?
[14:00] <giovani> samirnassar: with a properly set default route, yes
[14:02] <samirnassar> giovani: so I need to set a route for traffic to virtual server #2 traffic that is different from traffic for everything else
[14:02] <giovani> I'm sorry, I don't follow what you're saying
[14:02] <giovani> if you'd like to control over which interface traffic is routed by default, you set your default route to that interface, as well as a gateway
[14:03] <giovani> see "man route" for information on how to write the route statement
[14:04] <samirnassar> giovani: ah sorry. This is new terminology to me.
[14:05] <samirnassar> giovani: my virtual servers are in the same data center, with private interfaces enabled on both I can transfer data between them that does not count towards the bandwidth limits
[14:06] <giovani> samirnassar: ok ...
[14:06] <giovani> then you shouldn't need to modify your route statement
[14:07] <giovani> your set a private block to your two virtual servers
[14:07] <giovani> when you reference that IP, it should be routed over the interface that's directly on that private block
[14:07] <giovani> i.e. virtualserver1's public ip is 1.1.1.1 and private ip is 10.0.0.1, and virtualserver2's public ip is 2.2.2.2 and private ip is 10.0.0.2
[14:08] <giovani> if you ping 10.0.0.2 from virtualserver1, the traffic will go over the internal interface
[14:08] <giovani> unless you haven't configured it with an ip and subnet mask
[14:09] <samirnassar> giovani: ah ok. I have ip and masks set already. I thought I might need to do more
[14:09] <giovani> well did you try pushing traffic to the internal ip?
[14:09] <giovani> if it gets there ... then you're done
[14:11] <samirnassar> giovani: ping (host).(internaldomain) seems to work.
[14:11] <giovani> why are you not using the ip instead?
[14:11] <giovani> I don't know what host.internaldomain resolves to
[14:13] <samirnassar> giovani: both seem to work. SSH works as well.
[14:13] <giovani> ok
[14:13] <giovani> there's no problem then :)
[14:14] <samirnassar> giovani: hah! I like this idea. "If I don't know a problem exists, then there is no problem."
[14:15] <giovani> what?
[14:15] <giovani> but you tested it -- no problem exists
[14:15] <samirnassar> giovani: I guess I didn't realize the testing is so simple.
[14:17] <samirnassar> giovani: thanks for the help
[14:18] <giovani> samirnassar: no problem
[15:42] <TJ`> hi, im trying to get ubuntu installed on the ML110 G5 which has an embedded raid controller
[15:42] <TJ`> this is my 1st server setup
[15:42] <TJ`> if i set up the raid array will ubuntu see it as just one big drive?
[15:42] <giovani> TJ`: presuming it's a real raid controller, yes
[15:43] <TJ`> its not
[15:43] <TJ`> its a soft one
[15:43] <giovani> then no, it requires drivers
[15:44] <giovani> the RAID card may be supported, I don't know
[15:44] <giovani> you could try it out
[15:44] <giovani> if not, you can look at using software raid
[15:46] <TJ`> sorry had to step out
[15:46] <TJ`> basically im under the impression that when you set it up in the ROM based setup it creates a virtual RAID array
[15:46] <TJ`> that most operating systems just see
[15:47] <TJ`> could be entirely mistaken...
[15:47] <giovani> operating systems with the drivers to interact with the card, yes
[15:47] <TJ`> what are the odds that the distro already has them?
[15:47] <giovani> no idea
[15:47] <TJ`> lol
[15:48] <giovani> you could've found out 3 times already ... just try it
[15:48] <giovani> it takes 5 minutes to get the installer to that stage
[15:48] <giovani> there's no advantage to guessing
[15:48] <giovani> softraid is a mess, I advise against it -- but if you want to use it -- just try
[15:49] <TJ`> i got this system as a test bed for me to learn server OS's
[15:49] <TJ`> was cheap :)
[15:49] <giovani> great
[15:49] <TJ`> another question
[15:49] <Gargoyle> TJ`: Should have just got vmware! ;)
[15:49] <TJ`> i have it :)
[15:49] <TJ`> exsi hyper V
[15:50] <TJ`> got em all
[15:50] <TJ`> what dyu guys think of gui's on servers?
[15:50] <giovani> a horrible, horrible idea
[15:50] <TJ`> haha thought so
[15:50] <Gargoyle> TJ`: I think they are a waste of time, and just add extra un-needed software to the system
[15:51] <TJ`> ok...
[15:51] <TJ`> any tips on hardening a box?
[15:51] <TJ`> apart from the obvious ones like changing the ssh port?
[15:51] <giovani> that's a topic that cannot be summed up with "tips"
[15:51] <Gargoyle> TJ`: Don't install a gui!
[15:51] <Gargoyle> ;p
[15:51] <giovani> TJ`: that's not advisable
[15:51] <TJ`> Gargoyle not going to install a gui :)
[15:52] <giovani> changing the ssh port does nothing but prevent your logs from being filled with automated password attacks
[15:52] <TJ`> giovani u wouldnt recommend changing the ssh port?
[15:52] <giovani> no, I wouldn't
[15:52] <TJ`> ok
[15:52] <Gargoyle> TJ`: Why change the port? That is not hardening. It will take a port scanner all of 2 seconds to work that one out!
[15:52] <TJ`> i suppose
[15:52] <giovani> TJ`: instead, look at using keys instead of passwords for ssh
[15:52] <giovani> and ban password auth on ssh
[15:52] <TJ`> so by banning password auth one can only access the box using the key?
[15:53] <giovani> yes
[15:53] <TJ`> bit like encrypted drives? thats cool
[15:53] <giovani> no ... not like encrypted drives
[15:53] <Gargoyle> :)
[15:54] <TJ`> ah
[15:54] <TJ`> i meant keyfiles
[15:54] <giovani> yes, cryptographic keys can be used for many things, but, using them for SSH and for whole disk encryption aren't related
[15:54] <TJ`> oh i know
[15:55] <giovani> (and just for the person who wants to chime in -- sure, you can link auto-decryption with a pam login, but that's not the point)
[15:55] <TJ`> i meant the feature in regards to using a key instead of password like keyfiles
[15:55] <giovani> sure
[15:55] <giovani> they both can use keys
[15:55] <TJ`> what about re-boots?
[15:56] <TJ`> do you guys ever reboot servers on a sunday morning for example?
[15:56] <giovani> ... no
[15:56] <giovani> why?
[15:56] <TJ`> just wondering
[15:56] <Gargoyle> TJ`: no... If I wanted to do that, I would install Windows!
[15:56] <TJ`> im a noob here lol
[15:57] <giovani> what would be the reasoning for rebooting the server on a sunday?
[15:57] <TJ`> dyu guys run any regular virus scans if the server file serves to windows clients?
[15:58] <TJ`> giovani from windows
[15:58] <Gargoyle> TJ`: Nope, thats the windows users problem, not mine!
[15:58] <kees> TJ`: many people use clamav when they want to do virus scanning
[15:58] <giovani> TJ`: many people who run windows file servers do, yes
[15:58] <TJ`> giovani ive found that a weekly reboot for windows desktop/servers does a lot
[15:59] <giovani> TJ`: that won't be the case with linux -- this is why windows is considered poorly designed, and a waste of time to use
[15:59] <TJ`> thanks kees ive got some experience with clam av
[15:59] <TJ`> ive been running a small ubuntu based server on my mini-itx server for the last 2months
[15:59] <giovani> the only reasons to reboot a linux server are to upgrade the kernel, to do hardware maintenance, or to ensure that a machine will come back up cleanly on unplanned reboot (such as during a power outage and recovery)
[16:00] <TJ`> im falling in love with ubuntu
[16:00] <TJ`> though my only concern with the server being on 24/7 using ext3 is the hdd's
[16:00] <Gargoyle> TJ`: If you are playing around with software RAID, I did a video the other week for someone else and stuck it on my blog.
[16:00] <TJ`> constantly journaling wont their performance be affected long term?
[16:00] <TJ`> Gargoyle got url?
[16:01] <giovani> TJ`: constantly journaling?
[16:01] <Gargoyle> http://ga.rgoyle.com/blog
[16:01] <TJ`> giovani doesnt ext3 constantly write to the drive?
[16:01] <TJ`> ty Gargoyle
[16:01] <giovani> TJ`: no ...
[16:01] <TJ`> ah
[16:01] <giovani> servers are always on 24/7 ... I don't know where you'd find one that isn't
[16:02] <TJ`> the drives giovani
[16:02] <Gargoyle> TJ`: Whizz down to May 10th, "10 Min Ubuntu Server".
[16:02] <giovani> what about the drives?
[16:02] <TJ`> i was under the impression that ext3 keeps them spinning 24/7 as well
[16:02] <giovani> no ...
[16:02] <giovani> drives spin when they're written to or read from ...
[16:02] <TJ`> thanks Gargoyle! oh and assasins creed is the best game ever haha
[16:03] <giovani> just like any drive
[16:03] <Gargoyle> TJ`: Google did some experiments, there was no conclusive evidence to suggest powering drives down or leaving them on changed their life.
[16:03] <TJ`> yeah i remember reading that
[16:04] <TJ`> security updates? i knwo there is an option during install for the system to do it automatically
[16:04] <TJ`> does that just mean it runs apt update?
[16:04] <giovani> it means it updates packages for which there are security-based updates
[16:05] <giovani> for an admin who knows what they're doing, I'd advise not using that feature
[16:05] <giovani> but, for someone who wants a set-it-and-forget-it server, it's useful
[16:05] <giovani> unless a new package breaks something
[16:05] <TJ`> would a simple apt-get update also do security?
[16:05] <giovani> update only updates the list of available packages
[16:05] <giovani> after doing update, you must do upgrade to install new versions
[16:06] <TJ`> yes sorry i meant upgrade
[16:06] <giovani> but yes, that gets you the same result, and more
[16:06] <TJ`> lastly - i hope... :P
[16:06] <TJ`> backups
[16:06] <TJ`> not the data
[16:06] <TJ`> but the configurations
[16:07] <giovani> what about them?
[16:07] <TJ`> any specific packages that automate this or do you just have a custom script?
[16:07] <giovani> any file transfer application does what you need
[16:08] <giovani> at work we use a more complex version-control system
[16:08] <giovani> to track -changes- to configs over time, and who made them
[16:08] <giovani> but using rsync, or scp, or whatever works fine
[16:08] <TJ`> thats a good idea...
[16:08] <TJ`> svn for config files...
[16:08] <TJ`> well thanks guys
[16:08] <giovani> both scp and rsync support file lists
[16:08] <TJ`> appreciate the help :)
[16:08] <giovani> you can make a list of config files, and write a cronjob to move those somewhere every x hours/days/whatever
[16:09] <TJ`> yea thats what i planned
[16:09] <giovani> and any time you want to change that list, just modify the text file, rather than the cronjob
[16:09] <giovani> but yes, version control for configs is the right way
[16:09] <giovani> especially in larger environments
[16:09] <Gargoyle> giovani: Out of interest, what do you use?
[16:10] <giovani> Gargoyle: use for?
[16:10] <giovani> for version control? we use SVN
[16:10] <Gargoyle> giovani: Version control of your configs? Is it automated update of files from a git repo or something?
[16:11] <giovani> we track our cisco configs, our voip configs, etc
[16:11] <giovani> in our tftp directory
[16:11] <giovani> as well as system configs in various places
[16:11] <giovani> when you have an admin team of 19 ... it's handy to see who's doing what, and when mistakes happened
[16:12] <Gargoyle> giovani: So you are still editing the files direct in their normal locations?
[16:12] <giovani> Gargoyle: yes
[16:12] <giovani> either in tftpboot, or in the various locations of configs
[16:12] <giovani> and then commiting to svn
[16:13] <Gargoyle> Any munin users around?
[16:13] <giovani> I've played with minun
[16:13] <giovani> munin*
[16:13] <giovani> but not a "user" per-se
[16:14] <TJ`> giovani 19 admins? wow lol
[16:14] <Gargoyle> I am just trying it out, but getting a bit of information overload!
[16:14] <giovani> TJ`: that includes the network team, and the unix team, but yes
[16:14] <giovani> for a company of 150 ... :)
[16:15] <TJ`> yikes
[16:15] <TJ`> actually while im here...
[16:15] <TJ`> is there an nix equivelant to active directory?
[16:15] <giovani> eh, kinda sorta
[16:16] <giovani> active directory is like 20 features smashed into one product
[16:16] <TJ`> lol
[16:16] <giovani> unix systems tend to compartmentalize tasks, so there's definitely no drop-in replacement for active directory
[16:17] <giovani> can you be more specific about what parts of active directory you're interested in?
[16:17] <TJ`> but is there something that could allow it to be a primary domain and manage policies and restrictions?
[16:17] <TJ`> i know there is LDAP
[16:17] <giovani> can you be more specific about "manage policies and restrictions"?
[16:17] <giovani> describe EXACTLY what you'd like to do
[16:17] <TJ`> eg
[16:18] <TJ`> create users that would authenticate against it, deploy software, run remote commands, restrict access to certain windows features
[16:18] <TJ`> just like AD basically
[16:19] <giovani> ok, so you want to keep using windows desktops but have a linux server that replaces the role of AD?
[16:19] <TJ`> basically
[16:19] <giovani> ok, so ... kind of
[16:19] <giovani> samba, as of version 4.0 has begun integrating AD features
[16:20] <TJ`> cool
[16:20] <giovani> but it's still pretty new, and definitely not a drop-in replacement for AD yet
[16:20] <giovani> most people in windows management environments are going to want to keep an AD server around
[16:20] <giovani> but that may not always be the case in the future, as samba develops
[16:21] <TJ`> would be amazing if samba could replace pricey AD
[16:21] <giovani> AD doesn't cost anything though ...
[16:21] <giovani> just the server
[16:47] <TJ`> 64bit or 32bit?
[16:47] <TJ`> any dissatvantages/advantages with ubuntu server?
[16:49] <giovani> TJ`: other than certain proprietary applications potentially not being compiled for one or the other, no
[16:49] <giovani> (that's a reasonably rare problem for server applications, though)
[16:50] <TJ`> so would u use 64bit over 32?
[16:50] <giovani> yes
[16:51] <giovani> presuming the hardware supported it
[16:54] <TJ`> cool ty
[16:56] <TJ`> i dont get the difference between 8.04, 8.10 and 9.04
[16:56] <TJ`> ive been using 8.10
[16:56] <giovani> you don't get the difference? they're release versions ...
[16:56] <giovani> like 1.0, 2.0, 3.0
[16:56] <TJ`> no i understand thaat
[16:57] <TJ`> but why are more poeple using 8.04 over 8.10 just because of the long term support?
[16:57] <giovani> yes
[16:57] <giovani> or because they don't want to upgrade
[16:57] <giovani> upgrades are messy
[16:57] <giovani> they often break things
[16:57] <TJ`> is 9.04 good enough for production environments or should one just stick to 8.x
[16:58] <giovani> so people generally stay away from upgrading production servers unless required to
[16:58] <giovani> TJ`: in my opinion, it's perfectly fine
[16:58] <giovani> but, different people have different opinions on what "production quality" is
[16:58] <TJ`> do all the same programs and what not work on 9.04? surely...
[16:59] <giovani> what programs?
[16:59] <TJ`> samba lamp modrails pptpd
[16:59] <giovani> lamp isn't a program
[17:00] <giovani> presuming those applications are bundled with 9.04, sure, they should work
[17:00] <giovani> they may work differently than in previous versions, for better or worse -- they're going to be more up to date versions of the applications
[18:49] <cchildress> hi all. i just purchased a vps, which has a very vanilla ubuntu-server 9.04 installation on it.  as it has to be generic, it doesn't run through any of the nice choice-based setup that you get if you run the installation on a local machine.  what's the best way to do this, post-install?
[18:50] <billybigrigger> to do what?
[18:50] <giovani> cchildress: there are a very limited number of things the installer asks -- you can just go and modify the files it wrote
[18:51] <cchildress> basically, when I used the installation disc, it had choices about what services i wanted, what settings i wanted for them, etc. i'm wanting that same automation
[18:51] <cchildress> giovani, fair enough, i'm just being lazy ;)
[18:51] <giovani> just install the services you want
[18:51] <giovani> name a service :)
[18:51] <billybigrigger> cchildress::: well you could dpkg-reconfigure <insertpackagehere> to configure whatever packages/services you want
[18:51] <cchildress> giovani, postfix is a real bugger...but generally it just speeds up the initial steps
[18:52] <billybigrigger> cchildress::: install dovecot-postfix
[18:52] <cchildress> billybigrigger, hmm...yeah, i hadn't thought of that but it's probably all i'm wanting. thanks
[18:52] <billybigrigger> i had that running within a few hours :P
[18:52] <giovani> cchildress: the installer doesn't do anything that you can't do with apt-get
[18:52] <giovani> a few hours?
[18:52] <cchildress> billybigrigger, postfix configs are worse than installation
[18:52] <giovani> postfix is a 10 minute install
[18:52] <giovani> cchildress: the installer wouldn't have configured it any differently
[18:52] <billybigrigger> giovani::: are you some guru?
[18:52] <billybigrigger> haha
[18:52] <billybigrigger> must be
[18:52] <giovani> billybigrigger: no ... postfix is very clear
[18:53] <billybigrigger> well maybe for some
[18:53] <cchildress> alright, haha. i'll just work on it and if i get stumped or do something stupid/newbish i'll let you know so you can get a chuckle :p
[18:53] <billybigrigger> i had problems cause i couldnt figure out how to send mail out on a different server, until i found relayhost and blah blah, it was my first mailserver setup, so ya it took me a few hours! :P
[18:54] <billybigrigger> and the fact i don't think i had my mx record setup correctly added a bit of time/frustration
[19:01] <TJ`> im trying to install ubuntu server 8.10 on this new server
[19:01] <TJ`> the installation went fine
[19:01] <TJ`> but on first boot grub seems to fail and drops to shell
[19:01] <billybigrigger> whats the error
[19:01] <TJ`> so now i have a prompt with busybox
[19:02] <TJ`> i get
[19:02] <TJ`> usb device not accepting address 2 error 71
[19:02] <TJ`> and unable to enumerate usb device on port 2
[19:02] <TJ`> and then
[19:03] <TJ`> check root
[19:03] <TJ`> then it drops to shell
[19:03] <giovani> were you depending on something usb-based?
[19:03] <TJ`> nope
[19:03] <giovani> i.e. a network card, a hard drive, etc
[19:03] <TJ`> there is a missing module
[19:03] <giovani> a kernel module?
[19:03] <TJ`> cat /proc/modules ls /dev
[19:04] <TJ`> ./dev/mapper/ddf1 bunch of numbers does not exist
[19:04] <jmarsden> cchildress: If you want to add software the way the installer does, you can use tasksel
[19:04] <giovani> wait, why are you installing 8.10?
[19:04] <TJ`> why not?
[19:04] <giovani> because it's outdated?
[19:05] <TJ`> u recommending 9.04?
[19:05] <giovani> I'm not "recommending" something, I'm asking why you chose 8.10
[19:05] <TJ`> ive installed it before its what i know quite simply
[19:06] <giovani> this could be a kernel bug, it could be a bad sector on your disk
[19:06] <giovani> TJ`: it's the same OS
[19:06] <TJ`> giovani they are new disks
[19:06] <TJ`> just formatted them
[19:06] <giovani> ok, could be something funky with your softraid
[19:06] <TJ`> probably
[19:06] <giovani> how did that end up going?
[19:06] <TJ`> went fine
[19:06] <giovani> how did you configure things?
[19:06] <TJ`> through the ROM based setup
[19:06] <TJ`> made a RAID 1
[19:06] <giovani> so you enabled raid ...
[19:06] <TJ`> made it bootable
[19:07] <TJ`> and enabled raid in the setup
[19:08] <giovani> I would recommend not doing that
[19:08] <giovani> if you want to use software raid -- don't use the fake stuff on the mb
[19:08] <giovani> just use software raid
[19:09] <giovani> and defintiely don't combine the two
[19:15] <billybigrigger> you don
[19:16] <billybigrigger> you don't suggest using the setup's software raid and using mb0?
[19:16] <billybigrigger> hmmm thats how i was told to setup my raid 1
[19:17] <Doonz> hey has anyone managed to setp up azureus on a headless server? im having trouble with the webui part
[19:19] <billybigrigger> Doonz::: are you set on using azureus? deluge has a nice daemon for running headless
[19:20] <giovani> billybigrigger: software raid is fine ... just don't use the fakeraid unless you have to
[19:20] <giovani> Doonz: I'd advise against azureus heavily
[19:20] <Doonz> yeah billybigrigger thats what everyone said
[19:20] <Doonz> now im reading howtos
[19:20] <Doonz> Thanx
[19:20] <giovani> uhh ...
[19:20] <giovani> rtorrent
[19:20] <giovani> please
[19:20] <TJ`> user rtorrent and wrtorrent
[19:20] <giovani> please only use rtorrent
[19:20] <TJ`> the best webui and torrent solution for headless
[19:21] <giovani> (and whatever gui you want)
[19:26] <cchildress> jmarsden, thank you! i just got that working and it's exactly what i want.  appreciate the help.
[19:29] <RoAkSoAx> ivoks, heya master how's it going
[19:38] <TJ`> for fake raid
[19:38] <TJ`> http://0x45.com/2009/02/ubuntu-and-sata-fake-raid-on-a-proliant-ml320/
[19:38] <TJ`> that fixes it
[19:41] <neshaug> Hey, I have some samba shares up, but I can not copy files to the shares from ubuntu or windows.. I get this error in ubuntu, "There was an error copying the file into smb". Sometimes on small files I can get the copying to complete, but on bigger files it alwasy fails.
[19:42] <giovani> neshaug: did you look at logs?
[19:42] <neshaug> nope
[19:42] <giovani> why not start there?
[19:43] <neshaug> I'll try, thanks.
[19:43] <giovani> as a general rule of thumb ... that's where you should ALWAYS start when you get an error from a server
[19:44] <neshaug> look at samba logs? ;)
[19:45] <neshaug> I get it, I'll look into getting more familiar with log files, I'm just a newcomer.
[20:08] <adv> windows has wifi internet, windows connected through LAN to notebook Ubuntu. Ubuntu manual 192.168.0.11, 255.255.255.0 no gateway
[20:08] <adv> how can i connect internet through shared wifi on windows?
[20:09] <adv> do i need to have a gateway on ubuntu?
[20:09] <adv> hello?
[20:15] <mdlueck> adv, you would need to share the Windows wifi connection. Not sure how to do that. If you have an extra box, consider setting up something like IPCop and share that one Internet connection to your 192.168.0.xx LAN.
[20:15] <giovani> adv: of course you have to have a gateway
[20:15] <giovani> or you have to bridge the connections
[20:16] <giovani> one or the other
[20:16] <giovani> but this isn't ubuntu-specific
[20:51] <masc> oi oi all....is there any open source product that works like a Citrix Access Gateway, but then with Ubuntu Terminal Server instead of Citrix?
[20:57] <fevel> hello
[20:57] <fevel> can someone explain to me what this means:
[20:57] <fevel> engenet  pts/0        192.168.0.201    Mon May 25 08:59 - down   (00:00)
[20:58] <fevel> its an entry on last
[20:58] <fevel> does it mean it mean the server was shutdown?
[20:58] <jmarsden> fevel: The user engenet was connected from that IP from that time on Monday May 25 until the system went down
[20:58] <fevel> ok so it lost energy maybe
[20:59] <jmarsden> You can use the uptime command to check how long it has been up...
[20:59] <fevel> maybe the power supply went off
[20:59] <fevel> after it came back up the stupid local admin rebooted since network wasnt working
[20:59] <fevel> probably because of squid
[20:59] <fevel> so uptime shows his reboot
[21:00] <jmarsden> Then you can look in the logs to see when the earlier restart happened.
[21:00] <fevel> which logs syslog?
[21:01] <fevel> I always find it on syslog but for some reason cant find anything
[21:01] <fevel> the user says that he got there and there was no networking, the local admin says at 8 59 he rebooted
[21:02] <fevel> how can he have rebooted if the down indicates the system was off
[21:02] <fevel> he probably turned it on
[21:02] <fevel> agree?
[21:02] <jmarsden> Yes, it must have been running when it was rebooted, by definition :)
[21:03] <jmarsden> grep /var/log/messages for "Initializing CPU#0" to get some idea of when boots / reboots happened ?
[21:03] <fevel> does "down"indicate a reboot or that the system was turned off?
[21:03] <jmarsden> Either one.
[21:03] <fevel> what does it mean then?
[21:03] <jmarsden> It indicates that the system went away while that user was logged in.
[21:04] <fevel> can you explain to me what you mean by went away?
[21:04] <jmarsden> What caused the system to disappear (stop, halt, reboot, cease to function) is not revealed by that last entry
[21:04] <jmarsden> Read the logs for more details :)
[21:04] <fevel> I see
[21:04] <fevel> ok
[21:08] <fevel> jmarsden: Do you have any idea what may have caused the server to lose connection to the internet? maybe something happens when syslogd restats?
[21:10] <jmarsden> Not from the info you have provided, no.  last is just logging info about user sessions, not about systemwide networking issues... I would read the server logs looking for more clues about what happened, if it was my server...
[21:12] <fevel> ok
[21:12] <fevel> ill take a loog
[21:12] <fevel> look
[21:12] <fevel> thanks for your help
[21:12] <jmarsden> No problem.
[21:37] <Fenix|work> Greetings...
[21:38] <Fenix|work> I'm ripping my hair out for something stupid... how do I use bzip to compress from stdin?
[21:39] <dayo> Fenix|work: check the man pages for tar
[21:39] <dayo> Fenix|work: man tar
[21:40] <Fenix|work> ?
[21:44] <Fenix|work> ok ... found a tar cheatsheet that showed piping tar to gzip, so I used the same method.
[21:44] <neshaug> hmm, I have this /usr/sbin/smbd process running wich I can not kill with code 9, how can I get rid of it? :)
[21:45] <neshaug> I can't start samba again when it is there..
[21:45] <yeason> I'm running a dovecot/postfix mail server and when i try to send mail it fails, this is the pertinent info from the log: "warning: SASL authentication failure: cannot connect to saslauthd server: No such file or directory". Obviously the auth isn't working right, any suggestions on where to look for more info or what package to install for this to work?
[21:45] <mdlueck> tar -j would put it in bzip format
[21:46] <mdlueck> Fenix|work, I believe that is what dayo meant
[21:47] <Fenix|work> mdlueck, I wasn't looking at using tar...
[21:47] <Fenix|work> so I was thrown with man-tar
[21:47] <Fenix|work> :)
[21:47] <Fenix|work> anyway... thanks again dayo
[21:47] <mdlueck> Ja, but try man bzip
[21:48] <mdlueck> ;-)
[21:56] <RoAkSoAx> heya ivoks how's the UDS
[21:58] <ivoks> lots of sessions :)
[21:58] <RoAkSoAx> ivoks, I've seen that the clustering stack session is the first one on thursday
[21:58] <ivoks> would someone notify the admins, which are in front of the hotel, thath ubuntu.com doesn't work :)
[21:58] <ivoks> yeah...
[21:58] <ivoks> but no one signed to attend :/
[21:58] <neshaug> heh, I get an error while copying to my samba share, but the process keeps on transfering until it's finished :P
[21:59] <ajmitch> ivoks: ubuntu.com works for those of us on the outside
[21:59] <ivoks> ajmitch: great them
[21:59] <ivoks> then
[22:00] <infinity> ivoks: Works from my hotel room too.
[22:00] <ivoks> works now for me too
[22:02] <RoAkSoAx> ivoks, oh really?? i think it is because there's another server sessions at the same time and lots of people are signed to it
[22:02] <ivoks> RoAkSoAx: actually, two of them
[22:03] <ivoks> RoAkSoAx: so, there are 3 server related sessions at the same time
[22:04] <RoAkSoAx> ivoks, yes.. there are.. so other people have signed to those other meetings.. anyways.. I won't be able to listen to it since It's like 2am for me :)
[22:06] <ivoks> RoAkSoAx: i'll talk with session manager to get that rescheduled if possible, since i'd like to attend those other sessions at that time
[22:07] <RoAkSoAx> ivoks, ok cool :) btw.. do you have little time for a couple of packaging related questions?
[22:07] <ivoks> sure
[22:08] <RoAkSoAx> ivoks, remeber paraview http://launchpadlibrarian.net/27131383/paraview_3.4.0-4ubuntu1.debdiff ? Do I have to summit to debian the changes originated from the python 2.6 transition ? How should I send the changes?
[22:09] <NicolasM14> Hi ! I wonder how to display Ext4 new creation, deletion dates attributes. LS and STAT just give the 3 Ext3 attrs. Anyone know how ?
[22:10] <ivoks> RoAkSoAx: you can send a patch, saying that you tested it with python2.6, and that this diff will make it possible to build with future releases of python in debian
[22:11] <RoAkSoAx> ivoks, so for example, I can strip out my debdiff like this: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/180680/ and send it to debian?
[22:13] <ivoks> RoAkSoAx: didn't you have to change one more file to make it build with python2.6?
[22:13] <ivoks> RoAkSoAx: you took an upstream patch, remember?
[22:14] <RoAkSoAx> ivoks, I forwarded that patch to debian, and they included it very quick so i no longer need it:    * Bug fix: "paraview fails to build with some QT lib 4.x versions",
[22:14] <RoAkSoAx>      thanks to Andres E. Rodriguez Lazo (Closes: #529632).
[22:14] <ivoks> RoAkSoAx: great
[22:14] <ivoks> RoAkSoAx: than that's it
[22:15] <RoAkSoAx> ivoks, ok, I'll summit the diff then. my other question is realted to:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mapnik/+bug/378819 ...Upstream has left a comment and said that I could drop some changes in debian/rules because in the perspective of upstream, they are not needed to build... Should I do what upstream recommends?
[22:17] <NicolasM14> Hi ! No one using Ext4 here ? :(
[22:19] <ivoks> RoAkSoAx: i'll have to look at that during day time; i can't concentrate very well now
[22:21] <RoAkSoAx> ivoks, ok :)-.. and besides of that I've done other merges, you can see them here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/4nDr3s/Mentorship#Merges if you want to review them, however i've subscribed them to u-u-s
[22:22] <ivoks> RoAkSoAx: good; i'll look at them after uds
[22:22] <RoAkSoAx> ivoks, ok awesome.. I'll work on other merges this week and after that we can work on something else then :) Have fun there btw :)
[22:23] <ivoks> hehe will do
[22:23] <ivoks> good nihgt
[22:24] <RoAkSoAx> night
[22:29] <yeason> dovecot/postfix, this shows up in the mail.log: "warning: SASL authentication failure: cannot connect to saslauthd server: No such file or directory" Any ideas...? I can't seem to figure it out. sasl2-bin and the libraries are installed
[22:36] <yeason> anybody have any ideas...?
[22:46] <Rafael_> is rsync the best option to makes copies of and ubuntu server to a NAS?
[23:01] <TJ`> is there an alternate ubuntu server iso?#
[23:01] <TJ`> i cant seem to find one...
[23:04] <ajmitch> no, because the server iso uses the same installer as the alternate iso
[23:04] <ajmitch> dekstop & alternate install the same stuff, different ways
[23:05] <TJ`> according to the wiki the alternate install is what i need to get my fakeraid to work
[23:06] <yeason> the server iso should come with support for that, you would need the alternate if you are installing ubuntu desktop. if I remember correctly
[23:10] <TJ`> yeason it claims to be supported
[23:11] <TJ`> but the the system doesnt boot correctly
[23:11] <TJ`> doesnt boot at all more like
[23:11] <TJ`> !
[23:12] <TJ`> the alternate desktop installation works
[23:12] <TJ`> but the server iso doesnt!
[23:12] <TJ`> ok no it doesnt...
[23:14] <TJ`> for some reason though when i do dmraid -ay and then exit from the shell it works perfectly
[23:15] <TJ`> is there a way to automate this?
[23:50] <billybigrigger> can anyone here help me?
[23:50] <billybigrigger> im trying to get apache to read index.php instead of index.html
[23:50] <TJ`> did u delete index.html?
[23:51] <TJ`> do you have them both in the same folder?
[23:51] <billybigrigger> i've added directoryindex index.php index.html index.htm into my /apache2/sites-available/default and restarted apache...
[23:51] <yann2> billybigrigger > edit the order of the files in the DirecotryIndex thingy
[23:51] <billybigrigger> edit?
[23:51] <billybigrigger> i had to add it...where can i edit it?
[23:51] <yann2> well now that seems correct
[23:51] <yann2> /etc/apache2/apache.conf
[23:51] <billybigrigger> maybe im adding it in the wrong place if there's a place to edit it :P
[23:51] <yann2> I'd change it there and leave the vhost
[23:51] <billybigrigger> ahh i was told to add it to my vhost
[23:51] <billybigrigger> k lemme try that out...
[23:52] <billybigrigger> DirectoryIndex not found in apache2.conf
[23:53] <billybigrigger> hmmm...should i add it to end? or is supposed to be somewhere
[23:54] <yann2> just put index.php first
[23:54] <yann2> mmh wait
[23:55] <yann2> mods-available/dir.conf
[23:55] <yann2> change it there
[23:56] <billybigrigger> seems every forum question on directoryindex looks like its in the vhost conf
[23:56] <billybigrigger> ok, ill try there
[23:57] <billybigrigger> roger
[23:57] <billybigrigger> thanks yann2
[23:57] <yann2> you can probably also put it in the vhost conf :)
[23:57] <yann2> np
[23:57] <yann2> just if you put it there it will be valid for all the websites