[00:52] Evening all [02:49] Evening LaserJock [02:49] hi [02:49] So, interesting. [02:49] At work, I have an older laptop I was using, that I built from a UNR image. [02:50] I build the sabayon package there, and it launches, and I can edit the desktop fine. [02:50] So, I've just installed a jaunty box here [02:50] All up-to-date [02:50] Installed my package there, and like yours, it cr*ps out. [02:51] ...ok [02:51] Only difference is, one's using the unr desktop, the other, the regular gnome desktop [02:51] the unr desktop only has 1 panel. [02:51] right [02:51] So here's my theory. [02:52] A "stock" ubuntu panel config's missing something. [02:55] I tried adding in a name key in /etc/gconf/schemas/somethingoranother [02:55] No change? [02:56] I'm going to have to look through that panel delegate code again. [02:56] See what exactly it's looking for, [02:58] it didn't seem to make a difference [03:00] off for a bit to watch the latest episode of "Canada's worst handyman", back in a bit. === GGD is now known as GGD|sleeping [04:00] Back [05:11] Hmmm [05:11] think I may be on to something... [05:11] Gonna try to get another build up in a few minutes [05:24] sbalneav: oh? [05:29] sbalneav: have u considered trying to build sabayon on oBS? it allows multiple architectures and distributions [05:30] can be quite helpful for debugging too... one can use the oBS servers to let stuff build in the bacground, or build locally using the build command... I find it to be really helpful in terms of not having to worry about the majority of the automated stuff [05:31] I suppose u get a bigger testing base too, since u can output to rpm, deb, for any distro and architecture === nubae1 is now known as Nubae [05:33] I have no idea what oBS [05:33] is [05:33] Nubae: the changes are Ubuntu-specific though so I'm not sure he'd gain much [05:34] you can then still always use local debian/ubuntu tools, I just think it makes it easier during testing faze [05:34] oh I see.... u dont think it will be valuable for other distros? [05:35] Nubae: most likely not [05:35] it's possible though I suppose [05:35] but the patches are likely to go to the mailing list so the Fedora/openSUSE experts can have a look [05:36] not sure what Gentoo's status is [05:36] oBS = opensuse BUILD SERVICE, though its distro agnostic and is a gpl tool, its kinda what BDOFL dreamed of when he created launchpad [05:36] well, one aspect of Launchpad anyway [05:37] well, then even if just for that, if u can make the src deb available would be great [05:37] I have more than enough on my plate without having to learn yet more tools, thanks. I don't know the ones I have to use now. [05:37] right, one aspect of launchpad, automation... I mean a lot of this stuff really shouldnt take as much time as it does [05:37] the source deb's in my ppa [05:38] devs should be able to concentrate on their work and not let packaging be the most complicated part of the entire distibution process [05:38] www.launchpad.com/~sbalneav? [05:38] ideally it's not [05:38] I don't think sbalneav is having really any problems with the packaging [05:38] it's the stupid bugs [05:39] ahhh... time to pull out ye olde insecticide [05:39] but they seem to be tricky bugs [05:39] that depend on your gnome setup [05:39] well, I can take a look see if we cant get some testing done on other distros [05:40] I think Fedora and openSUSE are mostly OK [05:40] openSUSE doesnt really need it, but for testing bugs might appear of a particular variety [05:40] have you tried sabayon on openSUSE? [05:40] actually no [05:40] the current main dev works for Novell so I'd think it'd be in fairly good shape [05:41] and Red Hat created it so generally they do OK as well [05:41] not really any need... but I shall... the thing is openSUSE is very LDAP centric when it comes to groups/theming/samba [05:41] it's the rest of us that seem to have problems [05:41] aha [05:41] they made assumptions about gnome that only seem to hold for Fedora/openSUSE [05:41] lemme check it out then, first from opensuse packages then from sbalneav package [05:42] heh, sunds like typical openSUSE policy... forget about other distros and do what they consider works in the moment.... no standards, no policies [05:43] that kinda irritates me sometimes, but the thing is ends up just working... [05:43] very strange that way, u'd think since they break so many conventions that things wouldn't fit together, but they do somehow [05:45] yeah, I've noticed that [05:46] You guys seeing a 0ubuntu4 build in my ppa? [05:47] Ah, there it is. [05:48] LaserJock: When it finishes building, have a look at sabayon-2.25.0-0ubuntu4 [05:49] I cherry picked a fedora patch and modified it slightly [05:49] sbalneav: ok [05:49] which one? [05:50] https://cvs.fedoraproject.org/viewvc/rpms/sabayon/F-11/?sortby=rev [05:50] the gconf-crashes patch [05:52] we have sabayon, sabayon-lang and sabayon admin packages in openSUSE [05:52] sbalneav: fascinating [05:53] yeah, what I really want to do is find out why that object doesn't seem to be defined. [05:53] there [05:53] 's a couple other patches that might be handy there [05:54] I'd like to find the *real* problem, and then get the patches pushed upstream, but that's for later. [05:54] right now, lets see if we can get it to work, [05:54] LaserJock: ok, ppa's finished doing it's thing [05:54] give it a go. [05:55] brings up the xnest window on mine. [05:55] still pending publishing, I'll give it a minute or two [05:56] ok so its starts in opensuse [05:56] and if you edit a profile? [05:56] but setting up new profile and hitting edit kills it [05:57] MainThread 2009/05/26 06:55:12.8495 (admin-tool): Got fatal error: sabayon-session exited with a FATAL ERROR (exit code 1) [05:57] MainThread 2009/05/26 06:55:12.8684 (USER): Finishing editing profile [05:57] MainThread 2009/05/26 06:55:12.8689 (admin-tool): Terminating main loop [05:57] MainThread 2009/05/26 06:55:12.8690 (admin-tool): Exiting abnormally; dumping log due to a fatal error [05:58] I've got the full traceback if u are interested sbalneav [05:58] ok, did it die immediately [05:58] That on ubuntu? [05:58] but might be more interesting if I run your version of course [05:58] on openSUSE... yeah died right after I hit the edit profile button [05:58] yeah, well I think I just *fixed* that bug. My version has the patch for that. [05:59] ok, I'll try building yours and see if it works better, it could shed light on other items [05:59] LaserJock: Mine work for you? [06:00] no .debs published yet [06:00] * LaserJock kicks LP [06:00] sabayon-apply's still cacking out, I'll get to that next [06:01] ah, yeah, they built, but not published. [06:01] I got mine here locally from my pbuilder [06:05] sbalneav: \o/ ! [06:05] Ah [06:05] Upstream's patched this already [06:06] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=542604 [06:06] Gnome bug 542604 in general "Recoverable errors on exit. No profile changes saved." [Critical,Unconfirmed] [06:06] ok [06:06] So rather than this patch, we'll need the other one. [06:06] meh [06:06] enough for tonight. [06:07] and I still have to figure out why sabayon-apply's borked. [06:07] deal with that tomorrow. [06:07] I'mma gonna head to bed. [06:07] night all [06:08] sbalneav: night, good work [06:09] LaserJock: when is meeting today? [06:10] 20:00 UTC [06:10] ok thanks [06:11] Nubae: are you gonna make it? [07:41] yah [07:43] great [08:42] Good morning everybody [10:47] highvoltage: When is the edubuntu strat document session at the UDS? [10:47] and what room, ill get a live stream [10:47] right now [10:47] room 13 [11:05] highvoltage, stgraber: What time and what room is the edubuntu session stuff going on? [11:05] bencrisford1: it just finished [11:06] sh*t! [11:06] my internet connection been dodgy all day [11:06] :( [11:06] stgraber: Any other sessions worth watching? [11:07] watching/gobbying [11:07] highvoltage: ping [11:09] stgraber: "Edubuntu Developers are Edubuntu Members who want to work on packaging and have shown that they're unlinely to do damage to any of the Edubuntu packages." -- does that mean non-members cant package :O? [11:11] stgraber: pong [14:12] hi [14:12] Ello :) [14:12] Did you run the session on burning earlier pygi? [14:13] yup [14:13] Ah yes, I tuned in for a bit of it :) [14:14] * pygi wonders what would that mean :p [14:15] I listened the the live stream [14:16] there was a live stream lol?! [14:16] lol [14:16] greetings ogra german :p [14:16] millions of people [14:16] millions listening to pygi talking about burning discs [14:16] bencrisford1: stop joking with me :p [14:17] I would give you an oscar, for best documentary [14:17] there were exactly three persons in the room xD [14:17] lol :P [14:17] and millions listening [14:17] noes! [14:17] lies [14:17] lo;l [14:17] edubuntu session was pretty cool [14:18] I am glad I was there [14:18] If im honest I didnt intend to listen to you, but it was an accident [14:18] I thought the edubuntu was an hour later than it was [14:18] and i didnt realise until you started talking about brasero :P [14:18] lol, so it was seriously streamed? :D [14:18] yeah [14:18] all the rooms are being streamed all day i think [14:19] even when theres nothing there [14:19] argh xD [14:19] i could hear the cleaners and what have you argueing after a session finished [14:19] I didn't knew that :D [14:19] hi asanchez [14:19] hi pygi [14:19] bencrisford1: hehe :D [14:19] bencrisford1: so did you learn something at least? ;-P [14:20] :/ that i missed the edubuntu session [14:20] bencrisford1: except that :p [14:20] something about burning? [14:21] bencrisford1: btw. don't worry, I'll post the notes to the mailing list tomorrow [14:21] if im honest - not really, i only went on there for a minute or two im busy doing a 4 page essay on the british empire [14:21] :P [14:21] did you mention my openweek idea btw? [14:21] for developers [14:22] no, not yet :-/ We didn't had time to focus on getting developers, but I think we'll schedule another session this week [14:22] ok, cool :) [14:22] * bencrisford1 wishes he was in barcelona, not writing a history essay [14:23] asanchez: you somewhere near the bazaar room? [14:33] bencrisford1: tell him not to ignore me :p [14:34] pygi, sorry, we're at Internal Package Repository Management (room 2) [14:35] asanchez: I'm joking :) O, I hope its interesting :) [14:36] mm, nothing new [14:37] can anyone turn up to the UDS? [14:37] * bencrisford1 might jump on a plane :P (joke) [14:38] where are you from bencrisford1 ? [14:38] UK [14:38] this is so near [14:39] there are very cheap flights between UK and Spain [14:39] yep [14:39] but as im not actually a dev it would be a bit pointless [14:39] if the UDS comes to the UK ill be there :) [14:39] im not a developer too [14:40] oh :/ [14:40] is the UDS coming to the uk any time soon? [14:41] I don't know, i think many people from Canonical works in UK [14:41] yeah including sabdfl himself :) [14:42] id love to work for canonical :P [14:44] Morning all [14:45] hi :) [14:47] hi sbalneav [14:48] asanchez: apparently the first UDS was UK, and the canonical team sprint is scotland [14:48] so might not be in UK for a while [14:48] but if it is [14:48] you'll see me there hopefully [14:54] UDS Hardy was 2006 right? [14:55] UDS Hardy was 11/06 i think [14:55] ah pl [14:55] ok [15:00] hey bencrisford1 [15:02] hey [15:02] cant stop just going out [15:02] back in 10 minutes or so :) [15:03] What's the general feeling here? Should we patch up sabayon to use Xephyr, like Fedora? Or should we just stick with Xnest? The only thing I can see that it would give us is composite support, but I'm not sure if that's particularily necessary for a window-in-window X desktop. [15:04] OTOH, xnest is directly supported by Xorg, which, one assumes, should be the most compatible with the host Xorg system [15:04] Personally, I'm inclined to stick with Xnest, but I'm open to suggestions. [15:05] ... [15:05] * sbalneav listens to crickets [15:07] go for it [15:07] :-) [15:28] sbalneav: ++ on xnest [15:29] sbalneav: +1 (xnest) [15:46] pygi, stgraber yeah, thanks, that was my thought. One less extra dependency too. [15:46] ok, working on a different patch. [15:46] should have a new build up in 20 minutes or so. [17:02] Looks like we also have to add .gvfs to the list of directories to ignore. [17:02] Patching that [17:02] getting cloooooser... [17:22] Ok, for anyone interested, sabayon 2.25.0-0ubuntu6 is being pushed to my ppa now [17:22] sabayon-apply (actually applying the profile) is still borken, but I can confirm that the profile's actually saving. [17:23] If anyone's interested, give it a test when it appears in my ppa [17:25] wahoo [17:25] sbalneav: so was there any upstream Fedora/openSUSE patches for sabayon-apply? [17:28] we're applying some patches in openSUSE... I'll let u know how it goes [17:29] sbalneav: that's awesome!!! [17:32] highvoltage: ping [17:35] highvoltage: ping too [17:37] ping three [17:37] :d [17:41] so meeting in 20 mins right? [17:42] crap? really? :P [17:42] LaserJock: want me to take minutes? [17:42] stgraber: so, uh, what did you do to my strategy doc? [17:42] no more areas of focus? [17:46] we made it a bit shorter :) mainly by merging that into the objectives [17:46] we're trying to be less specific so we don't have to update it over and over [17:49] hmm, I think we'll need to discuss this some [17:49] for me personally it's now so vague and short that it's lost a lot of power to direct [17:49] sure, just waiting for highvoltage to join me downstairs [17:55] LaserJock: ping [17:55] I mean [17:55] LaserJock: pong [17:55] stgraber: pong too [17:55] hi [17:56] LaserJock: yes it needs some more discussion indeed, it's not finalised in any way [17:57] good ;-) [17:57] so are we supposed to have our EC meeting now? [18:00] * Lns has to go in about 5 min :( [18:01] we better be quick then :P [18:01] stgraber, highvoltage: we're starting please [18:01] we better check nubae is here [18:01] bencrisford1: you're doing minutes? [18:01] sure if you want me to [18:02] but if my internet goes [18:02] someone else might need to [18:02] k [18:03] this is the part of UDS I hate [18:03] everybody is hard to get ahold of [18:04] I am here [18:04] LaserJock: the areas and focus in addition to the other sections was a bit much [18:04] stgraber: here? [18:05] LaserJock: yeah, next to highvoltage :) [18:05] LaserJock: ok I was just gone for a minute had to talk to someone but I'm here now [18:05] === Start Edubuntu Council Meeting === [18:05] ok, who all is here today to apply for Edubuntu Membership? [18:05] so this is another impromptu EC meeting right? [18:05] highvoltage: I thought this was the scheduled one [18:05] I suppose its me and Lns [18:06] "or if you have applied before, please join us on [18:06] #ubuntu-meeting on the freenode network on Wednesday 27 May 2009 at [18:06] 20:00 UTC." [18:06] (e-mail sent to edubuntu-devel" [18:06] soooo, that's tomorrow? [18:06] yeah [18:06] LaserJock: you got us a bit confused :) [18:06] * LaserJock has lost track of all sense of time in pursuit of a PhD ;-) [18:06] oh ok then :-= [18:06] nubae: can you make it tomorrow? [18:07] yeah [18:07] that's tomorrow and a bit later (3 hours) so we can grab some food before then [18:07] we can do it now if you can't [18:07] hold on [18:07] LaserJock: So we're not doing it now? [18:07] you already started it! [18:07] heh [18:07] highvoltage: no he didnt [18:07] you didnt do the bong [18:07] I guess we can wait until tomorrow [18:07] no problem [18:07] highvoltage: well, the 2 people we're expecting are here [18:07] *but* there could be more at the *right* time [18:07] I just had to snap into ec mode real quickly and out :) [18:08] Lns might already be gone [18:08] * nubae is usually around aynways, so no matter [18:08] I'm here, but leaving in ~30sec. [18:08] * bencrisford1 just made the minutes look pretty :( [18:08] screw it, let's do this [18:08] LaserJock: back to the strategy dock, I think we need to keep it really quick and snappy and get the message accross [18:08] argg [18:08] LaserJock: most of what's taken out was repeated and it's still there [18:09] Lns: can you make the meeting tomorrow? [18:09] * bencrisford1 prefers highvoltage in EC mode [18:09] * bencrisford1 fumbles for the switch [18:09] LaserJock: yep, what time? [18:09] 1pm our time [18:09] *FWOOP* [18:10] CRAP! Its 26th may!!! my membership meeting is next week :'( [18:10] LaserJock: ahh...what's our time? =p [18:10] bencrisford1: Ubuntu Membership? [18:10] yeah [18:10] Lns: Pacific [18:10] LaserJock: oh yeah i forgot you live so close to me! ;) [18:10] *beers LaserJock* [18:10] ;-) [18:11] bencrisford1: oh really, so I'll see you there ;) [18:11] oh ? [18:11] I'm an EMEA council member [18:11] ok, so EC meeting is voided because of LaserJock's stupidity [18:11] ooh, do you take bribes? [18:11] * Lns sunbirds tomorrow @1pm pst [18:11] cheers all [18:11] bencrisford1: btw, if a person is already an Ubuntu Member then Edubuntu Membership is easily obtained ;-) [18:11] ciao Lns [18:12] Lns: cya [18:12] ok, ok, back to Strategy Doc [18:12] here's my reasoning [18:12] I wanted do the following: [18:12] 1) introduce what Edubuntu is [18:12] 2) outline what our objectives and goals are [18:13] 3) have specific strategies for how to achieve those objectives/goals [18:13] 4) outline what the community looks like [18:13] 5) outline our development policies and methods [18:14] stgraber: Do you take bribes? [18:14] bencrisford1: nah :) [18:14] I want to have something that when people come to our community they can read it and get a good grasp on what we do [18:14] :( [18:14] * bencrisford1 didnt just ask you that btw... [18:15] and that chan isn't logged on a public web server btw ... :) [18:15] * bencrisford1 smashes server with hammer [18:15] and something that when we're thinking of initiating a new program/ including new apps, etc. that we can turn to it for guidance [18:15] no it isnt stagraber :) [18:15] stgraber* [18:15] hey ubuntulog [18:16] lol, just to make sure - i was joking when i asked if you took bribes btw.. [18:16] highvoltage: so to me the current doc seems a bit to vague for giving a lot of guidance, what do you think? [18:16] LaserJock: right but it was a bit too specific as it was including things like the whole metapackages list, and some technical details that may not be of general interest like the seeds and similar stuff [18:17] LaserJock: that looks like a good layout [18:17] stgraber: well, people don't have to read the whole thing [18:17] the problem is that *nothing* is codified right now [18:17] nobody knows how Edubuntu is developed or what it really is [18:18] LaserJock: are you going to be here a while still? I mean, for several hours? after today I need an hour or two away from my computer [18:18] yes [18:18] I'll be here [18:18] (so would be nice if we can follow-up after dinner) [18:18] awesome [18:19] I like how you put the upstream relationships in objectives [18:20] I would call it "Strong Upstream Relationships" [18:20] to fit in grammatically with the other items [18:27] Back === hibana_ is now known as hibana [19:21] sbalneav: so, right now we can make and edit profiles but the fail to get applied, right? [19:27] I'm fixing that. And the gconf dir wasn't getting saved [19:27] I've just come up with a couple more patches [19:28] One that I cribbed and modified from upstream (had to add in not to save the .gvfs and .pulse dirs) and one that I fixed in the sabayon apply [19:29] 0ubuntu7 should post in a couple minutes here, if my pbuilder reports a success :) [19:30] sbalneav: should the patches apply cleanly to 2.22.1? [19:30] Don't know. Once I get 2.25 working, I'll look at a backport. [19:31] I can't see why not. [19:31] There's really not much that's changed [19:31] yeah [19:31] I guess that's one nice thing about a dead upstream ;-) [19:32] I'd like to SRU Hardy and Intrepid [19:40] Ladies and gentlemen, we have a winner [19:41] Created profile [19:41] Added stickey notes to top panel [19:41] saved profile [19:41] said that profile should apply to me [19:41] logged out [19:41] logged in [19:42] sticky notes on top panel appeared as if by freaking magic. [19:42] wahoo [19:42] sabayon-2.25.0-0ubuntu7 in my ppa [19:43] it's saving dbus information, which it shouldn't, so I'll exclude that as well, but interested sabayon people can play with what's there. [20:01] LaserJock: Was it just sabayon that wasn't working, or did pessulus have bugs as well? [20:02] I *think* it was just sabayon [20:02] pessulus just munges gconf keys [20:04] Another thing that I'll work on adding to sabayon: you can only apply profiles by *users*, really you'd realisticyally want to apply profiles by *group* [20:05] i.e. everyone in the "grade8" group gets this profile, everyone in "grade9" gets *this* one, etc. [20:05] Once I get something like that going, we'll send patches upstream. [20:06] yeah [20:06] once we get things actually working we can look at enhancements [20:06] btw, the Ubuntu Desktop team is wanting to get rid of gnome-system-tools [20:07] the only thing that we don't have a ready replacement for is useradmin [20:07] Saw that, but what will they replace with? Write something on their own? [20:07]