[02:40] hey is edubuntu just ubuntu with more packages or is it a stripped down version of ubuntu with more educational apps? [02:43] nevermind found answer of FAQ [09:07] Does anybody know why we add X-Ubuntu-Gettext-Domain=tuxtype to package tuxtype but not for tuxmath? Both are in main. [09:19] stgraber: ping [10:10] anyone know what the bzr branch is for edubuntu-docs? [10:10] im fixing a bug [10:52] highvoltage: Ping === nubae1 is now known as Nubae [11:01] bencrisford1: pong [11:03] highvoltage: I fixed a bug in a documentation package [11:03] edubuntu [11:04] saw you on the contributor list [11:04] what do i do with my nice diff now? [11:09] in fact, how do i make a debdiff :S :'( [12:48] I changed the wording of a paragraph in School Advocacy (edubuntu-docs) to fix a bug and now the motu recommend I upload it to my PPA and make a merge proposal [12:49] but I don't know which files to upload [12:49] just the .diff? the .dsc? .tar.gz? [12:49] or shall I just upload the diff as a patch to the bug? [12:49] =S [12:49] highvoltage, stgraber: ? === nubae1 is now known as Nubae === nubae1 is now known as Nubae1 === Nubae1 is now known as Nubae === nubae1 is now known as Nubae [18:31] Nubae: around? [18:35] Hey LaserJock [18:35] * bencrisford fixed his first bug [18:35] and it was in edubuntu [18:35] :) [18:36] bencrisford: I saw you filed a bug on edubuntu-docs [18:36] i didnt file it [18:36] i uploaded a patch :) [18:36] oh, I see [18:36] i subscribed you because i thought you were the maintainer of the branch [18:36] well, I don't think it needs any coordination with the doc team or translators [18:36] but thanks for the fix [18:37] :), it was really good to practice packaging [18:38] cos it was just as simple as the example on the HowToPatch [18:41] LaserJock: I noticed on the documentation team for edubuntu, the owner of the team - will something - i cant find him anywhere [18:41] its like hes disappeared [18:41] yes [18:41] he worked for Canonical at one point [18:41] perhaps the EC should restart the team? [18:41] but left over a year ago or so [18:41] oh [18:41] thats not good [18:44] !gcompris [18:44] Sorry, I don't know anything about gcompris [18:44] !info gcompris [18:44] gcompris (source: gcompris): Educational games for small children. In component main, is optional. Version 8.4.4-1.1ubuntu4 (jaunty), package size 457 kB, installed size 1568 kB [18:54] bencrisford: so I see you had some fun with #ubuntu-ops the other day :-) [19:11] Hi everybody [19:25] "bencrisford: so I see you had some fun with #ubuntu-ops the other day :-)" [19:25] LaserJock: Err, yeah :/ :P [19:34] LaserJock: Sorry about that btw ;) === hibana_ is now known as hibana [19:47] bencrisford1: np, I didn't even know about their policy myself and I've been around for 4 years [19:49] ok :) [19:49] bencrisford1: they told me to file bugs if I want more bot features [19:49] ah ok [19:49] How long do ubuntu membership meetings take these days? [19:49] oh gosh, I have no idea [19:50] I haven't been to one in years [19:50] stgraber: ping [19:50] ok [19:50] well, its just im 6th for tuesday [19:50] and i can only stay an hour :S [19:50] bencrisford1: usually if you say up front that you have a limited time they'll try to make sure they get to you by then [19:51] Ok, ill make sure i let them know [19:51] thanks ;) [19:52] LaserJock: A core-edubuntu-doc team might be useful. The team could have commit access, so it would be easier to fix bugs [19:52] bencrisford1: well, I'm glad you got to do some packaging with that doc bug, I'm not going to be able to upload it [19:52] Ill talk to mdke :) [19:52] bencrisford1: we don't actually ship the Advocacy Doc and we're not going to do an SRU just for that [19:53] ok [19:53] bencrisford1: *but*, it really should go into the bzr branch [19:53] well im glad i got to do it, and im glad ive shown the world that bencrisford *can* package :D! [19:53] unfortunately I've removed myself from ~ubuntu-core-doc so I don't have commit access to my own branches :-) [19:53] LaserJock: hi [19:53] wasss up? [19:54] LaserJock: If you had a word with the doc peoples they'd give it back [19:54] Nubae: I wondered how big your Live Sugar disk is [19:54] 400m [19:54] bencrisford1: well, I don't really want it back :-) [19:54] but we packaged pretty much everything [19:54] :P fair enough LaserJock [19:54] Nubae: no gnome? just sugar? [19:55] so all activities, all of sugar [19:55] a lot of gnome too, since sugar relies on its backend [19:55] do you use GDM? [19:55] evince, gstreamer, gdk [19:55] or does it just boot straight into Sugar? [19:55] no gdm no [19:55] startx straight into matchbox [19:56] starting with 0.86 though, sugar moves to metacity [19:56] * jussi01 waves to LaserJock [19:56] hi jussi01 [19:56] anyway, we've got it all working very nicely now... only activity doesnt work properly is Read [19:56] strangely it works on the full -edu dvd, but not on the minimal sugar live cd [19:57] I'm missing something somewhere, but not sure what [19:57] * jussi01 sadly missed the meeting the other day, are there logs/summary around? [19:57] Nubae: did you have to patch any of the non-Sugar stuff? like abiword or anything [19:57] still its not bad... Sugar is about 100 packages, and its being nicely maintained [19:57] jussi01: Should be on the mailing list ;) [19:57] yeah, we patched a couple of things [19:57] but it didnt requrie much to get it all to work [19:57] its mostly out there already [19:58] jussi01: If you aren't a subscriber ill find the post in the archive for you ? [19:58] :) [19:58] please [19:58] patched sugar to work with small screens by setting it to 72% of its original size if res =< 600 height [19:58] Nubae: so there's roughly 100 packages for Sugar? and we've got what, like maybe 20? [19:59] heh, I think we might have less than that, and there's probably like 150 when u count dependencies and activities [19:59] jussi01: What meeting would that be? The council meeting or the one a week or so ago? [19:59] I packaged each activity as its own package [19:59] so activities alone there are 60 [19:59] hmm [19:59] then there are some meta packages that include a lot of stuff [19:59] do you think those will be grouped together at some point? [19:59] like glucose (sugar foundation) and sucrose [19:59] I would think most people would want to have the full sets [19:59] yeah [20:00] we had to do patches for xulrunner [20:00] for gstreamer [20:00] for xypcom [20:00] for evince, abiword, python bindings [20:00] so you have your own packages for those in the Sugar repo? [20:00] when I think of it, its a lot of work [20:00] yep [20:01] https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/edubuntu-devel/2009-May/002898.html - jussi01: thats the meeting minutes for the one the friday before last [20:01] You can take a look at the X11: Sugar repo [20:01] that should contain a lot of stuff [20:01] https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/edubuntu-devel/2009-May/002903.html - jussi01: thats the council meeting last week :) [20:01] and the .kiwi file describes the packages used to build the iso [20:01] let me see if I can give u an overview [20:01] sbalneav: around? [20:01] jussi01: they're the only ones i can find in the archive [20:02] anyway, we are pretty much done now, so if/when u like I can start with buntu [20:02] Nubae: a first step could be to have oBS spit out source packages and just upload those to a PPA [20:02] Nubae: just to see how it works out on an Ubuntu system [20:03] Nubae: we can then refine them if needed and work on getting non-Sugar patches (abiword, xypcom, etc.) into Ubuntu proper [20:03] yeah thats where most of the work is going to go I believe [20:04] but... openSUSE is a geat model [20:04] if oBS does a good job of spitting out source packages we could automate it [20:04] pretty much everything that could be done, has been done there [20:04] ok [20:04] but if it's going to take tweaking a lot we'll need to fork it I guess [20:04] http://en.opensuse.org/Sugar [20:04] thats what we got [20:05] forking is going to be required I think, but come newer releases u can always join again [20:05] the debian maintainer Jonas is taking things much more seriously now [20:05] mostly because he sees whats been done with Mandriva and openSUSE, both distros didnt even have sugar a couple months ago [20:06] "drop by the IRC Freenode #opensuse-edu channel and talk to Cyberorg or Nubae. " -- Nubae's famous :) :P [20:06] righ [20:06] Nubae: that's one of the nice things about FLOSS, sometimes people just need a kick in the butt from a "competitor" to get them going [20:07] Debian (and hence most things Debian-based) tend to be not-so-quick with these kinds of things [20:07] hehe, yeah strangely that worked very well with Jonas [20:07] but usually Debian is very good technically and very thorough [20:07] in the beginning he was like, nah, forget it, dont feel like packaging 0.84, not gonna [20:08] then around him stuff started moving, without him [20:08] and he quickly jumped the train [20:08] the sad thing is, in the process we lost the uuntu sugar team [20:08] *ubuntu [20:09] well, hopefully if things can get back on track people will re-join [20:09] but yeah, there's always these silly political things that happen [20:09] we'll see, I think it needs someone thats gonna be realtively permenant [20:09] and aploticial [20:10] thats what really put me off debian... the politics... otherwise it would be my distro of choice [20:10] fortunately, the negative parts of debian policy are left at the ubuntu door, and good parts taken [20:10] luckily the groups I work with in Debian are pretty good that way [20:10] so we get a relatively forward thinking, yet still solid distro [20:11] yeah, there's a place for both [20:11] openSUSE is just too wild in that sense [20:11] politics isn't all bad in a way [20:11] Debian has been a great place for thrashing out important things like "what is free software?", etc. [20:11] well, it has a place... but not in my world.. I rather spend my time working on actually getting the job done [20:12] but for those of use that just want to get something done it's nice to have a place for it [20:12] don't be distracted by shiny objects... working code first! :-) [20:14] there is this new distro called tin hat linux... everything launches from ram.... so its blazingly fast... takes 5 minutes to start up, but after that its like the fastest distro u ever saw [20:14] heh [20:14] how much RAM do you need? [20:14] 2 gigs [20:15] not bad [20:15] but its been done for security reasons [20:15] so people cant run off with sensitive stuff [20:15] the speed is just an added benefit [20:15] right [20:18] im gonna try and rescue my old laptop by installing xubuntu on it [20:21] bencrisford1: what are the specs? [20:32] dunno LaserJock [20:32] 256MB ram [20:32] 20GB hdd [20:33] you might want something even lighter with 256 MB [20:34] !fluxbuntu [20:34] fluxbuntu is a LPAE-standard compliant, Ubuntu-based derivative that maintains the goal of running on a wide range of mobile devices and computers (low-end & high-end). It is lightweight, swift and efficient. | Support Channel: #fluxbuntu on freenode | Homepage: http://fluxbuntu.org/ [20:34] maybe? [20:34] well ubuntu just about starts on it [20:34] 6.10 [20:34] but x doesnt always work [20:34] i think xubuntu *should* work [20:34] if it doesnt ill try fluxbuntu, thanks jussi01 ;) :) [20:35] I'd go with crunchbang over fluxbuntu I think [20:35] but that's maybe because I don't particularly like fluxbox [20:35] theres also lubuntu, but Ive not tried that [20:35] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lubuntu [20:35] oh i read about that today actually [20:35] :) [20:36] well the xubuntu install is going a helluvalot better than the ubuntu one went [20:42] * bencrisford1 takes that back... [20:42] are you installing via live CDs? [20:42] yep [20:42] that's probably not going to work very well [20:43] :'(, i just want an ubuntu that works for it :P [20:43] you want to use the Alternate CDs for installing [20:43] LiveCDs take lots and lots of RAM [20:43] I think Ubuntu's LiveCD needs ~ 384MB or so [20:43] lol i wish you'd told me that after i spent an hour downloading it :P [20:43] before* [20:44] sorry, I just assumed [20:44] I rarely use the Desktop CDs [20:44] lol, its ok :), no need to be sorry :P [20:44] im glad i have a xubuntu cd anyway [20:56] actually the specs make it a great thin client [20:58] Well i just spoke to the #lubuntu peoples :) [20:58] they say itll be better when its complete [20:58] so ill give em a hand with development i guess :) [21:02] either that or you use it to test edubuntu as a thin client :p [21:07] If you guys were on the membership board, how many testimonials would it take on my profile for me to be considered would you say? [21:09] LaserJock: Nubae: jussi01: ? [21:09] hmm [21:09] depends on the testimonials, and content of what you have done. [21:09] yeah [21:10] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BenCrisford - LaserJock, jussi01 [21:10] bencrisford: btw, mdke just made a edubuntu-karmic doc branch [21:11] bencrisford: so if you make your changes for the Advocacy doc there, and request a merge then you can mark that bug as fixed === hibana_ is now known as hibana [21:11] LaserJock: I was planning on uploading my patch to my PPA and them requesting a merge [21:12] but i couldnt work out what to upload :( [21:12] bencrisford: no PPA needed [21:12] oh ? [21:12] bencrisford: the docs are done in bzr [21:12] yeah, but i wont have commit access [21:12] the .debs are totally different in a sense [21:12] the .diff was a bzr diff [21:12] i got the bzr branch and then changed it and did a bzr diff to get the .diff [21:12] ok [21:13] so make sure to do it on the new karmic branch [21:13] and there is a specific syntax for bug closings [21:14] so where do i upload the files, and what files to i upload? =S [21:14] so in the changelog write what you changed and then do: Closes LP: bug #210771 [21:14] Launchpad bug 210771 in edubuntu-docs "School advocacy wrongly speaks about Scribus being Illustrator-like" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/210771 [21:14] so email the .diff to the doc list [21:14] asking them to apply it to edubuntu-karmic [21:15] Ah ok [21:15] bencrisford: does that make sense? [21:15] yeah :) [21:15] thanks [21:22] LaserJock: edubuntu-docs_9.04.1ubuntu2.diff - an appropriate filename for the diff? [21:22] well [21:22] that's more like a debdiff [21:23] you're just making a change, not an upload [21:23] so I'd maybe name it something that describes the change [21:23] well, thats what was on the packaging tutorial :P [21:23] what do i call it? [21:23] well, but you're not packaging [21:23] :( [21:23] you're more like making an upstream change [21:23] god, right click and get terminal option is such a stupid thing, but its so incredibly highly useful for me [21:24] in Fedora to open the terminal u have to go in the systems menu... its like totally hidden away... almost as bad as windows [21:24] ubuntu is ok, but openSUSE makes it the most logical... right click on the desktop, get option for terminal.... [21:25] yeah, that would be nice [21:25] i have a popup terminal thats on my awn [21:26] its just like a little bubble coming off my awn when i click it [21:26] right but I mean as a distro default [21:26] yeah i know [21:26] bencrisford: let me pastebin what I think your diff should look like [21:26] ok ty [21:27] nubae: You tried dos emulator? [21:27] i can imagine windows veterans loving it [21:27] dos emulator, in linux? [21:27] yeah [21:27] its like a command prompt [21:27] well its useful to play some of those old adventure games [21:27] and you can manipulate your ~ through it too [21:29] i forot all my dos though :/ [21:29] dos is mostly useless [21:29] yeah [21:29] but its quite cool [21:29] having the emulator [21:29] it would be useful for windows veterans turned linux [21:30] LaserJock: Is the one I uploaded to the bug not correct :/? [21:30] it's ok [21:30] I mean, technically it's fine [21:31] it's just there's more to it in this case [21:31] stuff that you wouldn't necessarily know [21:32] ok [21:34] http://paste.ubuntu.com/184540/ [21:34] bencrisford: ^^ [21:34] ty [21:34] ill check it out [21:39] LaserJock: I didn't go too far off track with my changelog as far as i can see :) [21:39] mdke suggested I add the other suggestinos b the reporter [21:40] nope, not at all [21:40] yeah [21:40] I just saw his email [21:40] oh :) [21:40] was it to the doc list? [21:40] so LaserJock, when do I get considered for membership again? [21:41] btw, something like this is very relevant short term for edubuntu packages... so we can at least show the public that things are moving ahead: http://en.opensuse.org/Education/Applications/Desktop [21:41] bencrisford: no, the comment on the bug report [21:41] oh [21:41] yeah [21:41] nicely split into subject areas too [21:42] nubae: yes, very nice indeed! [21:42] including nice little icons for DE (desktop environment) [21:42] good thing about opensuse wiki system is how easy it is to edit [21:42] what I'd like to have is a place for everybody to contribute to something like that [21:42] u should check that out some time [21:43] right... it should be as easy as possible for people to add/rate.... Moodle would be one such way [21:43] yeah, novell has probably *the* best docs and doc systems around [21:43] but even that is too much work... it needs to be practically getting very little info, but allowing almost immediate contribution [21:43] I don't find Moodle very easy [21:43] I'd much rather just have a wiki page [21:43] yeah its not unfortunately [21:43] powerful, but steep learning curve [21:44] for Sugar, they've taken out about 80% of its options [21:44] yeah for this agreed, wiki page... but just overall, we should have as few and as simple tools as possible [21:44] yep [21:44] But moodle comes to mind becuase if properly setup its a one stop shop that is very inviting [21:45] yeah, it's just not trivial for us to set up [21:45] anyway, take a look at that wiki page, and we can probably rip most of it [21:45] although with the Learning Project setting up an instance maybe there will be more moodle around Ubuntu [21:46] well, otherwise we'll loose out to suse... where they set up Moodle for me about an hour after I suggested it [21:46] am now populating it... so they've got their heads in the right place... once its done, I'll point u to it, so u can take a look [21:46] well, I think openSUSE must not be quite the target that Ubuntu is [21:47] for a long time we had a no-PHP policy [21:47] and that's been slowly weakening [21:47] but we still get hacked [21:47] btw, u remember I did that desktop background with the penguins learning that polar bears are not food, but rather they are food to polar bears? [21:47] oh yeah, I ran across that on my laptop just yesterday I think [21:47] u still wanna use that for a release? [21:47] its quite a funny one [21:48] I ask because otherwise I'll give it to the openSUSE community, although I'd rather see it running on edubuntu [21:48] yeah, we should do something with it [21:48] well, can't both use it? [21:48] I can jaz it up somewhat [21:49] well, its more inline with ubuntu colours, and I was thinking about edubuntu when I created it, so default it will be edubuntu... but sure, people can install on whatever [21:49] u have any suggestions for it? ideas? [21:49] should I make a theme to go with it? splash, bootup? [21:49] icon set? [21:49] LaserJock: What should I call the .diff file? [21:49] well, we need all of those [21:50] the cool thing is I have one of those wacom cintiq tablets [21:50] bencrisford: advocacy_bug210771.diff [21:50] so its quite easy and lots of fun to create this stuff [21:50] nubae: I'd quite like to see that background, have a link? [21:50] LaserJock: ty :) [21:50] so tell me in order of importance whats needed? [21:50] icons are tough to get a full set [21:50] bencrisford: let me check [21:50] LaserJock: I know... but we can start via priorities [21:50] wallpaper + gdm is most important I think [21:50] I can help with GDM [21:51] ive got a bit of experience [21:51] ah yes... login... ok, will work on that next [21:51] then gnome splash, gtk/metacity/compiz theme [21:51] we could get an existing one [21:51] bencrisford: oh ok.. perhaps u can port the wallpaper to gdm somehow [21:51] LaserJock: u have a link so he can see it? [21:51] one sec [21:51] if we got an existing ubuntu GDM, and plugged the edubuntu artwork [21:51] would be easier :) [21:52] just need to change the .desktop [21:52] of the existing theme [21:52] yeah, the colour set is pretty much inline with ubuntu already... the wallpaper is made to evoke an emotional response of laughter, which I think it does quite well [21:52] aww i wanna see it :D [21:53] I wonder whether we can make mouse pointer set with a similar response [21:53] so like the same teacher penguin pointing or something [21:53] and instead of an X, u get a polar bear eating a penguin [21:53] :P [21:53] and instead of a tick mark, u get a penguin eating a tasty fish [21:54] LaserJock: So I send the .diff in an email to the ubuntu-doc@lists.ubuntu.com [21:54] it would make people laugh for sure [21:54] but they would need to be big [21:54] bulky [21:54] so people could see whats in them [21:54] yeah true... still a penguin pointing is possible [21:54] just the penguins arm [21:54] yeah [21:54] bencrisford: actually, since mdke already commented on it, just attach it to the bug report [21:54] ok :) [21:55] hmmpf, now I can't find the wallpaper [21:57] oh, I think it was in my email [21:58] * LaserJock chuckles [21:58] yeah need to upload it some place... but forgot my flickr user and pass [21:59] we could do a set of funny educational ones like that [21:59] one where learning math is important or there be dire consequences ahead for the penguin [21:59] http://laserjock.us/files/edubuntu/penguin-edubuntu.png [21:59] like 20 penguins + one seal, not so bad... 20 seals and one penguin not so good [22:00] would just require switching the blackboard picture to make some more funny ones [22:00] given that we're not stretched for space I think having some sets like that would be great [22:00] maybe one can be a windows logo with an X, a penguin with a tick [22:01] but we make the penguin a female ;-) [22:01] that would have some internal humour to it [22:01] nubae: I'd work with the Ubuntu Artwork team maybe a bit to get their input, etc. [22:02] well, to be honest I think thats too much input, I was hoping just to throw some ideas around here [22:02] and we can come up with something, then maybe after the work is done, pass it by the artwork team [22:02] they're going to know more about doing the themes, etc. though [22:02] but otherwise no work is gonna be done [22:02] sure [22:02] u know how it is [22:02] yeah [22:03]