[11:05] <keffie_jayx> heyya folks
[11:07] <keffie_jayx> I have been reading the fridge wiki entry to get some idea of how one can send sotries
[11:07] <keffie_jayx> stories
[11:09] <keffie_jayx> is it in the idea of the fridge to showcase stories from around the world? or is it just focusing on posting the UWN
[14:32] <thewrath> m2rt the site i linked?
[14:38] <boredandblogging> keffie_jayx: around the world
[14:38] <boredandblogging> keffie_jayx: approved your request
[15:26] <effie_jayx> boredandblogging, does fridge have any wysiwyg editor for news?
[15:30] <boredandblogging> effie_jayx: no, its on the todo list
[15:32] <effie_jayx> boredandblogging, I think it is a technicall issue
[15:32] <effie_jayx> boredandblogging, security holes in the plugins
[15:33] <boredandblogging> effie_jayx: it will be done, no one has gotten around to it
[15:33] <effie_jayx> boredandblogging, is there a ticket filed for it?
[15:34]  * effie_jayx is usually pretty good at getting tickets done fast in rt
[15:38] <boredandblogging> effie_jayx: there is a LP issue somewhere
[15:38] <effie_jayx> boredandblogging, have a link?
[15:45] <boredandblogging> effie_jayx: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/fridge/+bug/301388
[15:46] <effie_jayx> boredandblogging, right
[15:46] <effie_jayx> boredandblogging, images at all?
[15:46] <boredandblogging> effie_jayx: images?
[15:47] <boredandblogging> meaning can you link to images? yes
[15:47] <effie_jayx> boredandblogging,  is there a style guidelines for the fridge?
[15:47] <effie_jayx> stored anywhere else
[16:11] <joey> effie_jayx, +1 on your email ;-)
[16:12] <effie_jayx> joey, great :D
[16:13] <effie_jayx> I am just getting acquainted with how fridge works and tring to document the unwritten roles seems the first step
[16:13] <effie_jayx> so that once new contirbutors arrive, they can be clear on the dos and don'ts
[16:19] <effie_jayx> joey, the wiki page with ideas is also a great way to go, I suggest we open up a letter with a very realistic set of goals out to the LoCo teams
[16:20] <joey> effie_jayx, We also need to figure out how to structure the Fridge in a way that preserves it's "face" to the public
[16:20] <joey> effie_jayx, so that the main page has big ticket news items
[16:21] <joey> effie_jayx, the loco material would need to attached to the front page but not, for the moment, front page material
[16:21] <joey> (too much controversy)
[16:21] <joey> newz2000 has a new fridge layout which might work
[16:21] <joey> Just need his time to upgrade the fridge and apply the theme & layout
[16:22] <joey> The new template could have the same front page news items but creatively hold other news....
[16:22] <joey> like a sidebar set of items for Locos, or, a main/front page story and loco stories underneath
[16:22] <effie_jayx> exactly
[16:22] <joey> There is also the fact that every fridge editor is a super editor
[16:23] <joey> so if we suddenly give 200 people access to the fridge, it might be problematic
[16:23] <joey> they can change layout, theme, unpublish items, turn stuff on that shouldn't be, etc
[16:23] <joey> which is why we usually pair up editors with a more senior editor
[16:23] <joey> knowing what NOT to touch is almost more important than posting stories :-)
[16:23] <joey> We tried to get around this before but haven't had much luck with Drupal
[16:23] <effie_jayx> mmm interesting}
[16:24] <joey> We were after a community way of submitting a story, like Digg
[16:24] <joey> but that would go into a queue and a fridge editor would review and approve it
[16:24] <joey> but there was no consensus on how to do that and, more importantly, we couldn't get time from Newz
[16:25] <joey> if we could get a good mockup going that we think would work, I'm happy to pilot it even without consensus
[16:26] <joey> I think our biggest challenge with the fridge is that we have folks who can dedicate a few minutes to it each day but not enough to make a huge impact (myself included)
[16:26] <joey> we need someone with no life and a desire to improve it
[16:26] <joey> :-)
[16:26] <effie_jayx> joey,  I think we can pull a gnome and do little ants work and get there ;)
[16:26] <tyche> Hey, joey!  Quit talking about me.  Hee hee
[16:27] <joey> tyche, :-D
[16:27] <effie_jayx> joey,  my concern is, fridge isn't  the point of entry for news anymore
[16:27] <joey> effie_jayx, yeah we should. Right now the only Drupal expert we have is Newz2000.  If someone else could work on that, I can get it deployed
[16:28] <joey> effie_jayx, that's by design actually. It's the combined news list and this channel
[16:28] <joey> we wanted a single place to submit news
[16:28] <joey> and then the fridge and UWN teams would figure out where it goes
[16:28] <joey> which are now really the news-team
[16:28] <joey> because the Fridge has a special ACL, it's editors are in a separate team
[16:29] <joey> in LP, but I think we all think of each other as the news team
[16:29] <effie_jayx> joey, exactly. but as we grow faster and faster it is important to reinforce that amonsts new commers
[16:29] <joey> I think UWN has the submission information but the Fridge is antiquated and probably doesn't
[16:30] <effie_jayx> joey,  is there any moderation for incoming news
[16:30] <effie_jayx> ?
[16:31] <joey> So what I really think needs to happen is that Joey needs to go to UDS and hold a Fridge and News track. :-)
[16:31] <joey> effie_jayx, it's moderated in that it lands on the mailing list and then someone picks it up, edits it as necessary, and publishes it via UWN and/or the Frdige
[16:31] <effie_jayx> right
[16:32] <joey> effie_jayx, if it's deemed inappropriate, it won't get picked up
[16:32] <effie_jayx> I think the flow works
[16:32] <tyche> The flow works, but needs to be defined.
[16:33] <effie_jayx> as long as contributors keep sending stuff in with a nice writing style
[16:33] <tyche> Sorry to butt in, here, but it's something I've seen, and maybe we can hash something out between us
[16:33] <joey> tyche, it was on the original proposal. There was a wiki page with it ...
[16:33] <effie_jayx> tyche,  if it is not defined how come I know of it :P
[16:33] <joey> lemme see if I can find it
[16:33] <tyche> UWN has some defined ideas as to what gets put in.
[16:34] <tyche> effie_jayx: Because you've discovered it by context and example, rather than having something laid out for you.  That's NOT a disparragement, BTW.  I do the same thing.
[16:34] <joey> tyche, so that idea was on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Fridge/Rejuvenate
[16:34] <tyche> Looking . . .
[16:35] <joey> as well as the main page
[16:35]  * joey edits the fridge page
[16:35] <effie_jayx> right
[16:38] <effie_jayx> joey, can we still use the Rejuvenate entry to post ideas?
[16:38] <joey> yes
[16:38] <joey> I just gardened the front page and rejuv
[16:38] <joey> if you refresh you'll see the changes
[16:38] <tyche> OK.  From the standpoint of the UWN vs. the Fridge, I see a lot of what goes into the Fridge as either "Breaking News" or General Community News.  Some of that gets paralleled into the UWN.
[16:38] <joey> rejuv needs more love though :-)
[16:39] <joey> and UWN is posted on the Fridge :-)
[16:39] <tyche> The heading area is posted on the Fridge, with link to the actual UWN
[16:40] <tyche> That way, the Fridge isn't cluttered up with a lot of stuff that isn't "right now" stuff, like the Security and Updates.
[16:41] <tyche> Also, the UWN is more of a window on what people outside of Ubuntu and Canonical think of Ubuntu, such as the news articles.
[16:42] <tyche> What I've seen on the Fridge seems to be more internal, such as announcements of events, reminders of sessions, information on things that are more specific to individual areas of the Ubuntu community.
[16:43] <tyche> Between the two, there is some duplication, such as the Fridge calendar, and the posting of Upcoming Meetings and Events in the UWN
[16:43] <tyche> Which, BTW, comes from the Fridge calendar.
[16:44] <tyche> The Fridge is immediate, where the UWN is generalized over a longer period.
[16:45] <tyche> Am I making sense?
[16:46] <joey> yep!
[16:47] <joey> The Fridge was the first thing in place and has suffered a bit from a small editorial community
[16:47] <joey> we are push driven
[16:47] <joey> rather than pull
[16:48] <tyche> I guess what I'm trying to say is that the Fridge is like electronic media (TV/Radio), where the UWN is like traditional print media.
[16:48] <joey> I'd like to the change that but it's been hard for me to free up some time to go stir up some trouble :-)
[16:48] <joey> tyche, and we know the future fate of print media don't we? ;-)
[16:48] <tyche> (Oh, I don't know.  I think you do a very good job of stirring up trouble.  Hee hee)
[16:49] <tyche> joey: Not necessarily.  they just have to get out of the idea that they OWN everything, and understand that once you put something on the Internet, it's GONE.
[16:49] <tyche> They suffer from "corporate think" (I know, that's something of an oxymoron)
[16:54] <effie_jayx> sorry just read up
[16:55] <tyche> NP.  I get a bit verbose when I get on a subject near and dear to my heart (or some organ)
[16:59] <effie_jayx> tyche,  it's all cool
[17:00] <effie_jayx> there are several issues and they all boil down to  newz2000 doing all the work?
[17:01] <effie_jayx> or having the time
[17:01] <effie_jayx> I know a little drupal
[17:01] <tyche> There are other people in the community that have some knowledge of Drupal, at least from the standpoint of administering it.  They may not be programmers or developers, but they have some ability.
[17:02] <tyche> So do kennymc0 and MTechnology
[17:02] <tyche> I'm sure there are others.
[17:03] <effie_jayx> I believe the flow joey mentioned is fine
[17:03] <effie_jayx> it only needs to be hit with more contributions and more people ready to act on them
[17:03]  * joey is talking with Newz about a Fridge sprint in Colorado.
[17:03] <MTecknology> what?
[17:03] <MTecknology> I heard my name
[17:04] <effie_jayx> joey, while that happens can we have just regular news cming up every now and then ;)
[17:04] <effie_jayx> ?
[17:04] <effie_jayx> MTecknology,  you are drupal savvy no?
[17:04] <MTecknology> tyche: I really hope you can consider me at least somewhat of a dev
[17:04] <tyche> MTecknology: We were just talking about people with knowledge of Drupal.
[17:04] <MTecknology> effie_jayx: ya
[17:04] <kennymc0> uh oh sounds like tyche is trying to volunteer me for something
[17:04] <kennymc0> lol
[17:04] <MTecknology> check out staging.profarius.com
[17:04] <effie_jayx> exactly
[17:05] <joey> effie_jayx, well, I was thinking of just getting the Canonical Drupal expert and Fridge Webmaster over to my place in Colorado and have us upgrade and overhaul the fridge...with a VOIP conf setup for anyone who wants to dial in
[17:05] <tyche> Naw.  Just mentioning your name in artery.  That's because I wasn't taking it in vein.
[17:05] <MTecknology> I'm making the whole header right now, it has over 100 combos for images :)
[17:05] <effie_jayx> joey,  sounds ubber cool
[17:05] <MTecknology> 13*3*12 - w/e that it
[17:06] <MTecknology> is*
[17:06] <tyche> joey: With regard to MTecknology:  Now is the time that johnc4510 would say, "Here, little fishy."  Hee hee
[17:06] <MTecknology> lol - /me goes back to coding a drupal theme
[17:07] <effie_jayx> MTecknology,  looks cool
[17:07] <MTecknology> actually - it's just time to test in IE :D
[17:07]  * tyche covers his heart with his hat for MTecknology
[17:07] <MTecknology> ?
[17:07] <MTecknology> effie_jayx: thanks
[17:08] <tyche> Sympathy for your having to work with IE
[17:08] <effie_jayx> joey, but again while that happens we should educate LoCo teams to submit their content in a way that would make it fit to print in the fridge
[17:08] <tyche> Condolences, even.  Hee hee
[17:08] <MTecknology> tyche: My code is clean enough that IE8 renders everything prior to my work today perfect w/o patches
[17:09] <tyche> effie_jayx: I tried that with the UWN.  The best I could come up with was, "send it in, and I'll get back to you to help clean it up and get more information."
[17:09] <tyche> The trouble is that it makes the editors "mentors" to a WIDE bunch of people.
[17:10] <tyche> The good part is that a lot of them catch on very quickly.
[17:11] <tyche> brb
[17:16] <tyche> Back.  sorry.  When you get to my age nature doesn't just call, it screams in your ear and bangs on your head.
[17:18] <effie_jayx> lol
[17:21] <effie_jayx> well my initial input is get people to cherish the fridge, and offer their contect for review
[17:21] <effie_jayx> tyche,  does that make sense?
[17:22] <effie_jayx> joey, where do LoCo team submissions go on the page now.
[17:22] <effie_jayx> ?
[17:23] <joey> effie_jayx, everything goes to the front page. The only variable is what category to file it under
[17:23] <tyche> That's a good start.  Two things that come to my mind are: 1. WHERE should they submit; and 2. WHAT type of material should they submit to the Fridge?
[17:24] <effie_jayx> tyche,  for the time being stick to basics
[17:24] <effie_jayx> the problem we have is ... the only whay for the community to find ut what the community does
[17:24] <effie_jayx> is either check monthly reports that almost none of the teams fill up
[17:24] <effie_jayx> or check UWN
[17:25] <tyche> I've often found that I work better with some boundaries to act as a constraint.  It gives more shape to what I do.
[17:25] <effie_jayx> and that means the news-team taking initiatives on behalf fo the teams if it does look awesome.
[17:25] <effie_jayx> so I think spreading the word about how to get stuff on the fridge could work
[17:26] <tyche> effie_jayx: I agree with you about the problem we have.  I'm just thinking that if we put some defining parameters out there for them, and teach them as we go, it would make it easier in the long run.
[17:27] <tyche> That doesn't stop us from just collecting the information as they pass it to us, and working with them to point it in the right direction, or clean it up for publication.
[17:27] <effie_jayx> about the complete overhauling of the fridge, that's a different story. which indirectly would make it appealing to more people
[17:28] <tyche> There, too, I agree.  And it's been talked about for at least a year (I remember boredandblogging talking about it shortly after I joined the UWN)
[17:28] <effie_jayx> then a group of the best contributors could do the LoCo sumbitions, that could help
[17:29] <tyche> It means creating a Fridge Team, much like the UWN team is.  We have specific levels of contribution dependent on ability:  Contributor, Editor, and Chief Editor.
[17:29] <joey> effie_jayx, tyche (et al) - I've submitted a request to see if I can steal NewZ for a few days and sequester him in my Colorado office. If that gets approved we'll work on the improvement ideas so please post any others there.
[17:29] <joey> I'll post to the news list if we get the go ahead.
[17:30] <effie_jayx> joey, that sounds fantastic
[17:30] <tyche> joey: Also, put it on the Fridge.  Hee hee
[17:30] <joey> tyche, :-)  after the fact!  Otherwise the surprise will be spoiled
[17:31] <tyche> True.  When it gets approved.  But then, too, this is a wide open channel.  Do you really think the information won't get out there?
[17:31] <tyche> I can just hear the comments: "Hey!  joey is stirring up trouble, again."
[17:46] <MTecknology> What do you guys think of the heading here? http://staging.profarius.com
[17:47] <tyche> Not bad
[17:49] <MTecknology> tyche: anything you don't like?
[17:49] <MTecknology> I know I need to sanitize the images some
[17:49]  * effie_jayx checks
[17:49] <tyche> Not really.  It's clean.
[17:50] <MTecknology> the current images being used work fine, but the other options need to be cleaned up
[17:50] <effie_jayx> MTecknology,  looks sweet :D
[17:51] <MTecknology> customizable too
[17:51] <MTecknology> effie_jayx: you use drupal?
[17:51] <MTecknology> If you do, you should try the theme and see what you think... bzr branch lp:ubuntu-drupal-theme
[17:52] <tyche> Of course, it's not http://www.azloco.com/
[17:52] <MTecknology> The options are in the theme settings page
[17:52] <MTecknology> yam this one's better
[17:52] <MTecknology> it uses Drupal instead of Joomla
[17:53] <tyche> Actually, that IS Drupal
[17:53] <MTecknology> oh... it used to be joomla though - i thought
[17:53] <MTecknology> "The upgrade will not effect the IRC server." s/effect/affect/
[17:54] <effie_jayx> MTecknology,  yep
[17:54]  * effie_jayx on lunch break :S
[17:54] <tyche> We've never tangled with joomla.  we went from the wiki straight to Drupal
[17:54] <MTecknology> I created a countdown module for Drupal :)
[17:55] <MTecknology> I still need the support of newz2000 and a back port to D5
[17:55] <tyche> I think you're thinking of my personal blog site, which is wordpress
[17:55] <MTecknology> Drupal > Wordpress :P
[17:55] <MTecknology> My blog is on drupal
[17:56] <tyche> I'm too lazy to change.  I use Drupal on the AZ site for posting things like the team newsletter and the live feed I did from an install fest.
[17:59] <MTecknology> I'm so excited I finally rolled out these changes. Massive Massive Massive improvements. Rather than try to replicate these changes to my D5 version I think it'll be easier to just back port again
[18:03] <MTecknology> tyche: sweet... We almost have an RTL file for the theme too - Now the theme can be used in any LTR or RTL language :D
[18:03] <MTecknology> ubuntu-il.com/site/new if you wanna see
[18:03] <MTecknology> only a tiny tiny IE8 bug
[18:05] <tyche> You're just a Drupal Demon.  Hee hee
[18:07] <MTecknology> ?
[18:07] <MTecknology> I'm getting better :)
[18:08] <tyche> Or would that be daemon?  Hee hee
[18:08] <MTecknology> :P
[19:19] <effie_jayx> joey, just so you know the LoCo teams just had a meeting and I have a couple of questions I would like to run by you first
[19:20] <effie_jayx> or you would prefer this on an email?
[19:20] <joey> effie_jayx, doesn't matter. I'm here, ask away
[19:20] <joey> email is fine too
[19:21] <effie_jayx> joey, ok... the LoCo teams seem of wth emailing you content. I will highlight the guidelines for submissions
[19:21] <effie_jayx> joey, some teams already do news in english... can the y have aggregation in a special block for LoCo news or something?
[19:22] <effie_jayx> lets say.. ubuntu-florida
[19:22] <joey> effie_jayx, technically it's possible
[19:22] <effie_jayx> http://ubuntu-fl.org/
[19:22] <joey> effie_jayx, there needs to be some sort of owner for each of those, or one combined owner ... someone who will look after it
[19:23] <joey> put that idea up on the rejuv page please. I'll see what Matt and I can do if we get to do the sprint
[19:23] <effie_jayx> joey,  owner means also moderating andor maintaining?
[19:24] <effie_jayx> I will put the idea up in the rejuv, but I would need to know if own means the same to you as it does to me :P
[19:27] <effie_jayx> joey,  can there also be a slideshow of pictures with a tag coming from picasa, flicker and the like?
[19:27] <joey> effie_jayx, at this point, since the technology we'd use to do that is not decided, let's call it "oversight & care and feeding"
[19:27] <joey> effie_jayx, yes on pictures technically but we've shied away from putting that on the front page
[19:27] <joey> effie_jayx, and in the main feed
[19:28] <joey> effie_jayx, we try to put a specific picture up to ensure we keep the front page solid and professional
[19:28] <effie_jayx> joey, mmm let's say front page is not our aim
[19:28] <joey> then yes, sure
[19:29] <joey> a better way to do it might be to source in the team blogs
[19:29] <effie_jayx> we wouldn't mind having fridge.ubuntu.com/locoteams for that kinda stuff
[19:29] <joey> vs the team planets
[19:29] <effie_jayx> joey, problem is htere is no archive
[19:29] <effie_jayx> we have blogged good stuff in the last three years and it gets lost in sindication
[19:30] <effie_jayx> joey, some teams might want to aggregate their content... like the florida team
[19:30] <effie_jayx> some others (like mine) might have to do it manually since their sites content is not in spanish
[19:31] <joey> effie_jayx, that may not be an issue so long as there is an understanding of the desired content on the fridge. We don't care about someone in Fla who blogs about their vacation but we would care about their release party
[19:31] <joey> if you have a set of use cases, please add those to the item on rejuv
[19:32] <effie_jayx> joey, exactly, so it would make sence to filter out the contect with a tag or category
[19:32] <joey> as Matt and I see what we can install and configure (we have some limitations set by our system admins) we'll see what we can do to get close
[19:32] <effie_jayx> joey, one last question... comments are off for all contect
[19:32] <effie_jayx> could they be on for LoCo team content?
[19:32] <effie_jayx> or is it too much mayhem
[19:35] <joey> comments are meant to go to the Forums by design
[19:35] <joey> so we can look at just moving the posts to each of the loco team's sub forums
[19:38] <effie_jayx> joey, great then
[19:39] <effie_jayx> I will add them to the rejuv entry
[19:39] <effie_jayx> joey, in the mean time can I encourage teams to submit news following your guidelines?
[19:41]  * joey is on the phone running a meeting. Please stand by. :-)
[19:54] <effie_jayx> joey, I gotta run, but please do answer the question and I shall check later
[19:55] <joey> ok, meeting over
[19:55] <joey> so effie_jayx, the best way until we sort something out is to send it to the news submission email
[19:55] <joey> most likely it'll get picked up ONLY in UWN
[19:56] <joey> until we have a format of doing that officially... unless it's really headline stuff which will then trigger a fridge post
[19:56] <joey> but in reality it's not this clear cut :-)
[19:57] <joey> If it is a win for Ubuntu, a special international event, or something that affects a large international population effie_jayx then it usually gets posted to the Fridge
[19:57] <joey> i.e. the front page
[19:58] <joey> The fridge though should really also contain targeted content like loco news as a side bar
[19:58] <joey> or "second page"
[19:58] <joey> We're not setup to do that right now but with some hacking and layout changes we might be able to do that very easily
[20:00] <joey> when we did a round of voting about a year ago, the digg style back page concept was rejected (iirc) but your loco proposal is different and should fit within the personas we're targeting
[20:00] <joey> (see the front page for personas)
[20:00] <joey> (of the wiki entry)
[20:01] <joey> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Fridge/Persona
[20:02] <joey> tyche, has johnc4510 surfaced?
[20:33] <tyche> joey: Nope.  I haven't seen him in channel since a week ago Sunday.  He was supposed to be back Friday or Saturday.