[05:31] <matthewmpp> I have a quick question: does anyone know how to say "here" (in this directory) in Bash?
[05:32] <hyperair> .
[05:32] <hyperair> or.. $(pwd)
[05:32] <hyperair> or.. `pwd`
[05:32] <matthewmpp> okay, thanks.
[05:33] <hyperair> or.. ../$(basename $(pwd))
[05:33] <hyperair> =D
[07:54]  * asac says hello
[07:55] <mvo> hey asac!
[07:55] <asac> hi mvo ;)
[07:56]  * asac dives into monday morning mail fun :)
[07:56] <mvo> asac: yeah, I'm right in it currently - but tea is my saviour
[08:03] <pitti> hey mvo
[08:03] <pitti> asac: good morning
[08:03] <mvo> hey pitti, good morning
[08:05] <asac> morning pitti
[08:07] <asac> http://techvideoblog.com/computex/arm-director-of-mobile-computing-about-arm-laptops-with-android-and-ubuntu/
[08:25] <didrocks> good morning o/
[08:27] <pitti> bonjour didrocks
[08:28] <didrocks> hey pitti, is your flu getting better?
[08:28] <pitti> didrocks: last days of it, just a minor inconvenience now; thanks
[08:40] <didrocks> pitti: do you thing that bug #182345 worthes a fix in hardy/intrepid-update?
[08:40] <didrocks> hey seb128 ;)
[08:40] <seb128> hello didrocks
[08:40] <pitti> hey seb128
[08:40] <seb128> didrocks: intrepid: no, who still use that when it's not a lts and jaunty is clearly better?
[08:41] <pitti> seb128: for hardy it sounds fine, given the number of dups
[08:41] <didrocks> seb128: I fixed it in jaunty before the release and it seems that there is no regression
[08:41] <seb128> didrocks: still who cares about intrepid?
[08:42] <didrocks> seb128: ok, so, I can fix it in hardy :)
[08:42] <seb128> that's what I would suggest
[08:42] <seb128> that's only my opinion though
[08:42] <seb128> hey pitti!
[08:45] <pitti> didrocks: I concur with Seb
[08:45] <didrocks> ok, it's not a big deal. I think I can find some time this evening to do it.
[08:48] <asac> ArneGoetje: any idea yet, when we do the next scheduled langpack SRU?
[09:01] <crevette> good morning
[09:04] <seb128> lut crevette
[09:04] <seb128> so I don't recommend anybody to upgrade to karmic
[09:04] <seb128> xorg crashes when I lock the screen, suspend doesn't work, vt switch bugs
[09:04] <pitti> ugh
[09:04] <seb128> not upgrading before uds was a good move ;-)
[09:04] <crevette> hey karmic is working almost fine here
[09:04] <pitti> seb128: is that with xorg-edgers or pure karmic?
[09:05] <seb128> pure karmic
[09:05] <seb128> and still running the jaunty linux version
[09:05] <pitti> eww
[09:05] <pitti> seb128: I don't think that's a good idea
[09:05] <pitti> the new intel driver needs the latest kernel pretty much
[09:05] <pitti> they dropped EXA and such
[09:05] <seb128> there is nothing in the chain of depends suggestion that
[09:05] <seb128> I'm playing luser there ;-)
[09:06] <pitti> well, a luser would have update-manager'ed and got 2.6.30 :)
[09:06] <seb128> yeah could be, I just had hours of download to get there and decided to upgrade gradually components I'm interested in
[09:07] <crevette> stp spreading FUD on ubuntu seb128 !!!! (:)
[09:07]  * seb128 kicks crevette
[09:07]  * crevette ducks
[09:08] <pitti> seb128: I'm really interested in how it works for you on 2.6.30
[09:08] <pitti> it's supposed to be wonderful
[09:08] <pitti> (especially once you enable KMS)
[09:09] <crevette> I've a potential fix for bluetooth for jaunty, is there a process before proposing it to make sure it can go on SRU?
[09:09] <seb128> crevette: to fix what?
[09:09] <pitti> crevette: make sure it matches the SRU criteria
[09:09] <seb128> pitti: ok, will continue upgrading today and let you know
[09:09] <pitti> seb128: merci
[09:09] <crevette> seb128, pairting not working, with potential overflow, the patch comes from upstream
[09:09] <seb128> crevette: sounds like a candidate for a stable update
[09:10] <crevette> I have a confirmation it fixes the problem, I hope I can haz more confirmation
[09:10] <seb128> doh
[09:10] <seb128> mailing lists ...
[09:10] <seb128> every day a new endless discussion there, mono, units, etc
[09:10] <pitti> delete-thread FTW :)
[09:10]  * pitti ignored the mono one
[09:11] <seb128> I'm just reading it quickly to know what this one is about
[09:11] <seb128> I've ignored the units one
[09:12] <seb128> this email is not really code of conduct friendly
[09:13] <crevette> the bug is https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/bugs/332119
[09:13] <crevette> if it matters
[10:07] <smb> Hello somebody around who knows more details on gvfs than I do?
[10:07] <seb128> not easy to say without knowing what you know ;-)
[10:08] <smb> Probably not that much except it is there and does network mounts (too) :)
[10:08] <smb> I am currently looking at bug 276472
[10:08] <smb> That came in as cifs bug but seems fixed there
[10:09] <smb> Only with gvfs I cannot do a touch on a file (operation not supported)
[10:09] <smb> Now, the question would be intended or bug...
[10:10] <smb> (the latest userspace I verified this was Jaunty)
[10:10] <seb128> do you try to touch on what location?
[10:11] <smb> Ok, right. The testcase is: mount share via gvfs. create a directory there and a file within that with touch. The response is the error above while the file is created with the current time and date
[10:12] <smb> Writing to the file also updates the time, only touch fails (so will cp -p)
[10:16] <seb128> gvfs can't do mounts
[10:16] <seb128> it does gmounts which can be used by GNOME applications
[10:16] <seb128> but "touch webdav://something" is not likely to work, I doubt touch understand gvfs uris
[10:16] <seb128> or use gvfs
[10:16] <seb128> or do you use the fuse .gvfs?
[10:18] <smb> It is mounted with fuse to $HOME/.gvfs/<share> Yes
[10:18] <smb> Thats done automatically when browsing into that share
[10:18] <smb> So the touch is done in that fuse subdirectory
[10:19] <seb128> could be a fuse limitation
[10:19] <seb128> I think that has been discussed upstream before
[10:21] <smb> That might be. That is where my knowledge stops.
[10:22] <smb> It seems unlikely a kernel problem (except if there is problem with the fuse kernel interface)
[10:23] <crevette> hmm bluez is a good canditate for merging with debian
[10:40] <asac> crevette: are there any changes left in ubuntu?
[10:50] <crevette> asac, from what I seen we carry the almost same patch
[10:57] <asac> crevette: so sync?
[10:58] <crevette> yep even, I need to double-check, because the packaging is different, so I need to confirm this is okay
[10:59] <asac> thanks
[10:59] <asac> let us know.
[12:15] <chrisccoulson> hi pitti
[12:16] <chrisccoulson> i'm not sure if you saw my message over the weekend or not
[12:16] <pitti> hey chrisccoulson
[12:16] <pitti> chrisccoulson: I did
[12:16] <pitti> chrisccoulson: apparently that was an accident, sorry; I copied it to karmic now as well
[12:16] <chrisccoulson> i wasnt sure if it was intntional or not
[12:16] <chrisccoulson> thanks:)
[12:17] <chrisccoulson> there was a positive comment about the upgrade on a separate bug report (bug 361560)
[12:33] <davmor2> guys I've noticed a couple of issues with totem plugins in karmic.  The bbciPlayer plugin doesn't install and I don't seem to be able to find the youtube plugin anymore even though it is still listed in synaptic for totem-plugins
[12:34] <davmor2> Bug 384768 and Bug 384767
[12:37] <seb128> davmor2: no need to join the channel 10 minutes after bug are submitted if everybody was doing that we could not use IRC
[12:37] <asac> so rfcXXXX.txt documents are not dfsg right?
[12:37] <asac> nevermind ill ask on -devel
[12:38] <seb128> asac: do we care about dfsg in ubuntu?
[12:39] <asac> seb128: to some degree yes (not sure where we draw the line). anyway, having the package dfsg free allows me to upload to debian too ;)
[12:40] <davmor2> seb128: normally I'd ask before hand.  But I thought if these were things that were expecting to be working in alpha 2 then it might be worth mentioning them here too.  But I do take your point :)
[12:41] <seb128> those don't seem stopper for alpha2 to me
[12:41] <seb128> it's still an early alpha, I expect it to install run and mostly work, we don't care if a corner option of one application doesn't work as expected
[12:42] <seb128> better to keep IRC lobbying for real issue otherwise people will just start ignoring what you say if you list every small glitch there, we get hundred of bugs a day
[12:44] <davmor2> seb128: I thought that the iplayer one might of been important.  But that's okay :)
[12:44] <seb128> davmor2: what is iplayer?
[12:44] <seb128> that's something I don't even know about
[12:44] <seb128> those bugs are about youtube and bbc no?
[12:45] <davmor2> yes BBCiPlayer
[12:45] <davmor2> seb128: iplayer is the bbc's way of doing internet tv :)
[12:46] <seb128> that one is a new upstream thing, that never worked or was there before
[12:46] <seb128> I fail to see why it should be a stopper now because it has just been added and it's not working
[12:46] <davmor2> okay
[12:49] <seb128> and the youtube plugin not being built was described in the changelog with the reason
[12:49] <seb128> sorry about the ranting, I've read too many bugs today with the weekend backlog etc
[12:53] <davmor2> seb128: One other thing I noticed is that during the install I get an error about /dev/sda being mounted.  I've had a word with the installer guys and they have said it is expected behaviour from the installer, however they are not convinced it is expected system behaviour.  The icon of the hd vanishes leading you to believe that it has been unmounted where as in fact it isn't.  Any idea what I should file the bug
[12:54] <seb128> "an error about /dev/sda being mounted."
[12:54] <seb128> what sort of error? do you have a screenshot?
[12:54] <rodrigo_> is there any way to have empathy color the tabs, or notify me when someone talks to me on a public channel?
[12:54] <rodrigo_> it just notifies me of private messages
[12:54] <seb128> usually we don't display error about things mounted, rather about things which can't be unmounted
[12:55] <davmor2> seb128: Sorry error is the wrong word a dialogue box warning "The installer has detected that the following disks have mounted partitions: /dev/sda ......."
[12:55] <seb128> ubiquity
[12:55] <seb128> if the error message is an installer one it's an installer bug
[12:55] <Zdra> rodrigo_: you get urgent hint on the chat window
[12:55] <rodrigo_> Zdra: I don't, or I can't see it
[12:56] <Zdra> rodrigo_: depends on the version you are using, we fixed a bug about that recently
[12:56] <rodrigo_> 2.26.1
[12:57] <seb128> Zdra: empathy not showing connection errors is a known issue?
[12:57] <Zdra> rodrigo_: The patch that fixed urgency hint for MUC: http://git.gnome.org/cgit/empathy/commit/?id=7c1c77662edf9ef232bb7648fa6c516d31de3648
[12:57] <Zdra> rodrigo_: I don't remember if that was included in 2.26
[12:58] <Zdra> seb128: The main window shows an error, normally
[12:58] <rodrigo_> Zdra: seems not in here, so where are packages for that fix if any?
[12:58] <Zdra> seb128: but it is known that in general error reporting is really poor
[12:58] <seb128> not there, and the status is displayed nowhere out of the details dialog that I found just by playing around
[12:58] <rodrigo_> I seem to be missing people's comments a lot since I moved to empathy :)
[12:59] <cjwatson> hi, davmor2 said he was having trouble explaining an installer-relevant problem here
[12:59] <Zdra> rodrigo_: you can use the telepathy ppa to use 2.27.x versions
[12:59] <seb128> empathy doesn't make me a great impression either so far too
[12:59] <seb128> cjwatson: <davmor2> seb128: Sorry error is the wrong word a dialogue box warning "The installer has detected that the following disks have mounted partitions: /dev/sda ......."
[12:59] <rodrigo_> Zdra: and would that bring too many karmic deps?
[12:59] <rodrigo_> Zdra: still on jaunty here
[12:59] <cjwatson> ok, let me explain with a tad more context :-)
[12:59] <seb128> cjwatson: that's what he described and yeah, I've difficulties to understand the issue
[13:00] <Zdra> rodrigo_: we backport everything to jaunty
[13:00] <rodrigo_> ah cool!
[13:00] <cjwatson> apparently on karmic the desktop automounts filesystems a bit more aggressively than it used to (at least, that's what the symptoms suggest)
[13:00] <seb128> I would not be surprised since we switched to a new technology, ie devicekit-disks
[13:00] <cjwatson> since the installer is doing partitioning, it needs to make sure that the disk it's partitioning isn't busy - that is, no filesystems on it are allowed to be mounted
[13:00] <cjwatson> is the more aggressive automounting deliberate?
[13:01] <cjwatson> or just an accidental consequence of switching to dk-disks?
[13:01] <seb128> not sure, do you have details on what event trigger the mounting?
[13:01] <cjwatson> no
[13:01] <cjwatson> AFAIK they're just mounted on startup
[13:01] <davmor2> seb128: it's just mount on the live desktop when the system starts
[13:01] <seb128> I would say that devicekit-disks behaves differently from what we had, we need details about the events it reacts to to say if that's a bug or not
[13:02] <seb128> pitti: ^ do you know?
[13:02] <cjwatson> automounting is something we used to do, and then AFAIK deliberately moved away from since it caused problems
[13:02] <cjwatson> for instance automounting journalled filesystems was an issue for anyone who'd hibernated
[13:02] <cjwatson> so I was a bit surprised to hear about it returning
[13:03] <seb128> the GNOME stack should not automount static partitions, only removable devices
[13:03] <cjwatson> davmor2: is /dev/sda your USB stick or your hard disk?
[13:03] <rodrigo_> ok, brb on empathy 2.27.x
[13:04] <davmor2> cjwatson: seb128:  No sda is my main harddrive
[13:04] <cjwatson> yeah, the installer would normally only complain about the installation *target* so that makes sense
[13:04] <seb128> I doubt it's GNOME mounting it, you would need a password to mount a static partition
[13:05] <seb128> ie get a policykit dialog asking your password to do the mount
[13:05] <cjwatson> I suppose there's an outside chance it could be casper, but nothing relevant has changed in that area as far as I know
[13:06] <cjwatson> do you mean GNOME as distinct from DK-disks
[13:06] <cjwatson> ?
[13:06] <seb128> could be lower in the stack, ie devicekit-disks
[13:06] <seb128> let's wait for pitti, he's the one who knows about this one
[13:06] <cjwatson> ok
[13:06] <seb128> yeah, GNOME, as gvfs etc
[13:06] <rodrigo_> hmm, empty contacts list in empathy 2.27.2, is that known?
[13:07] <seb128> gvfs used hal as a backend and use devicekit-disks now
[13:07] <seb128> so maybe it gets different events
[13:07] <seb128> but gvfs would be asking for a password to mount a static partition so I guess it's something lower in the stack doing it
[13:07] <davmor2> seb128: there's no policykit password request.
[13:08] <seb128> do we have any indication of when that behaviour started?
[13:08] <seb128> pedro_: ola!
[13:09] <pedro_> bonjour seb128!
[13:09] <davmor2> seb128: it didn't before uds
[13:09] <pedro_> seb128: feeling better?
[13:09] <seb128> ok, so it's a "some weeks margin"
[13:09] <davmor2> this is my first test post uds
[13:09] <seb128> not making very easy to spot what changed
[13:10] <cjwatson> hardly davmor2's fault, we didn't have karmic live CDs for ages
[13:10] <seb128> pedro_: yeah, spent my weekend in bed, thanks to you but today I'm almost back to normal, just coughing still
[13:10]  * mvo hugs seb128
[13:10] <mvo> seb128: get well!
[13:10] <pedro_> was the french flu not mine :-P
[13:10] <seb128> cjwatson: oh I was not blaming anybody, just trying to figure if that was matching recent changes ;-)
[13:10] <rodrigo_> hola pedro_
[13:10]  * seb128 hugs mvo
[13:10] <pedro_> hola rodrigo_
[13:10] <pedro_> hey mvo
[13:10] <mvo> hey pedro_
[13:10] <seb128> mvo: I got the chilian flu, I can understand you felt after GUADEC now
[13:11] <pedro_> I got the french one and then you get the same
[13:11] <seb128> pedro_: no no, I only had running nose and I was fine, with you flu I've spent almost a week being k.o
[13:11] <pedro_> so it was a variant of your own flu!
[13:24] <didrocks> pedro_: not the french one. I didn't got it :) (hey !)
[13:25] <pedro_> didrocks: hello!, because you're french and inmune!
[13:25] <seb128> next they will call me german again ... ;-)
[13:25] <didrocks> ahah :-)
[13:42] <didrocks> seb128: as soon as the "Application Priorities" spec is ready, I agree to work on it, as we discussed at UDS
[13:42] <didrocks> (and yes, I just got spammed ;))
[13:43] <seb128> didrocks: ok, excellent ;-)
[13:45] <kenvandine> seb128: feeling better i hope?
[13:58] <seb128> pitti: did you read the backlog?
[13:58] <pitti> oops, doing now
[13:59] <seb128> pitti: nothing urgent don't worry, btw do we have some documentation on devicekit-disks, how to debug issues in the new world etc?
[14:00] <pitti> cjwatson: you mean internal disks get automounted?
[14:00] <pitti> cjwatson: that's indeed a fallout from hal -> DK migration
[14:00] <pitti> cjwatson: I disabled that for internal disks in hal
[14:00] <pitti> but didn't port the patch to dk
[14:01] <pitti> seb128: no documentation yet
[14:01] <pitti> cjwatson: indeed, I guess partman needs to be updated for that (devkit-disks --inhibit <program>, or spawn devkit-disks --inhibit and kill it once your're done)
[14:02] <cjwatson> what does partman have to do with it?
[14:02] <pitti> seb128: you can run the d-bus backend in the foreground for debugging output, similar to hal
[14:03] <pitti> cjwatson: ubiquity, sorry
[14:03] <cjwatson> but the disks are being automounted before ubiquity starts
[14:03] <pitti> cjwatson: right, I need to fix that
[14:03] <cjwatson> I mean, OK, we can convert ubiquity over, it just doesn't seem to address this :)
[14:03] <pitti> cjwatson: it just occurred to me that ubiquity needs a replacement for the current hal automount inhibition
[14:04] <cjwatson> ok, I'll look at that, thanks
[14:05] <cjwatson> pitti: does it have the same argument handling stupidity as hal-lock?
[14:05] <pitti> seb128: ^ BTW, we need to fix that in gvfs
[14:05] <seb128> pitti: "that"?
[14:05] <pitti> seb128: not automount internal drives by default
[14:05] <seb128> pitti: it's not gvfs doing the automounting, is it?
[14:05] <pitti> seb128: I suppose it is, what else?
[14:05] <seb128> gvfs would need to ask you polkit credentials
[14:05] <pitti> seb128: not in the live system
[14:05] <seb128> and it doesn't
[14:06] <pitti> cjwatson: in what way?
[14:06] <seb128> pitti: hum, it's weird, on my laptop partitions are not automounted
[14:06] <pitti> seb128: nautilus then, I suppose; well, I'll look at it
[14:06] <cjwatson> pitti: hal-lock took the subsidiary program and arguments to run as a single argument, so you had to join them together with spaces
[14:06] <seb128> I'm not sure why it would be different on the livecd though
[14:06] <cjwatson> e.g. hal-lock --interface org.freedesktop.Hal.Device.Storage --exclusive --run 'ubiquity --foo --bar'
[14:07] <cjwatson> rather than e.g. having a -- to terminate its own options
[14:07] <pitti> cjwatson: no, that works now (with --)
[14:07] <cjwatson> oh good, thanks
[14:08] <pitti> sudo devkit-disks --inhibit -- ls --help
[14:08] <pitti> -> ls help
[14:08] <pitti> sudo devkit-disks --inhibit  ls --help
[14:08] <pitti> -> dk-disks help
[14:11] <ArneGoetje> asac: there are language-pack updates waiting in -proposed for Hardy and Intrepid. So far I didn't get any feedback yet from the community. Next updates are due after the Rosetta database has been converted to use message sharing.
[14:12] <asac> ArneGoetje: why just hardy/intrepid and not jaunt?
[14:12] <asac> y
[14:13] <ArneGoetje> asac: because the process for message sharing started immediately after Jauty release and hasn't finished yet.
[14:14] <asac> ArneGoetje: will that have any impact on output format/syntax of the exported po files?
[14:14] <ArneGoetje> asac: nope
[14:15] <ArneGoetje> asac: but after the db has been converted, there will be an influx of "new" messages across the stable releases.
[14:15] <asac> ArneGoetje: what does "process" mean here? rolling out code? or db conversion?
[14:15] <ArneGoetje> code and db conversion. db conversion has not finished yet.
[14:16] <asac> ArneGoetje: can you explain what "influx of new messages across ..." means?
[14:20] <ArneGoetje> asac: message sharing means, that for the same project (e.g. Ubuntu) messages and translations get shared across the releases. Before they have been separated. Means translators had to translate the same string for the same applications multiple times to make it available in all releases. MOst translators only focused on the current release, some focused on the last LTS, instead. Example: a number of strings have been translated for Hardy after its
[14:22] <asac> ArneGoetje: ok thanks. wonder what that means for firefox-3.5 vs. firefox. i think it will not matter if we use a different template name?
[14:23] <asac> ArneGoetje: any clue why our firefox-3.0 source provided template is called "firefox" (without version) in rosetta?
[14:23] <ArneGoetje> asac: correct.
[14:23] <asac> same for xulrunner-1.9
[14:24] <ArneGoetje> asac: because it wasn't necessary to have a version number, yet.
[14:24] <ArneGoetje> asac: will the templates be radically different from firefox-3?
[14:24] <asac> ArneGoetje: that might be the rational, but how did this happen? was that done manually? what happens if i upload firefox-3.5?
[14:24] <rickspencer3> pitti: good afternoon
[14:25] <pitti> hey rickspencer3, how was your weekend?
[14:25] <rickspencer3> pitti: fine, though I discovered that liblaunchpad is not entirely thread safe :(
[14:25] <ArneGoetje> asac: I suppose that sourcepackage would then be named accordingly and not firefox-3?
[14:26] <asac> ArneGoetje: yes.
[14:27] <ArneGoetje> asac: would it be possible to have both, firefox 3 and 3.5 installed in parallel?
[14:27] <rickspencer3> pitti: I can surely put the burndown script in a lp branch, but I'm not sure what people.ubuntu is, or how to use it
[14:27] <rickspencer3> should I?
[14:27] <asac> ArneGoetje: yes
[14:27] <asac> ArneGoetje: i want them to have different templates
[14:27] <asac> ArneGoetje: i am just curious how the firefox-3.0 template got named firefox in rosetta
[14:27] <pitti> rickspencer3: it's your ~/public_html/ on ronne.ubuntu.com
[14:27] <ArneGoetje> asac: makes sense then.
[14:28] <pitti> rickspencer3: we use that for storing publicly accessible stuff, both temporary (like http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/tmp/) and permanent (like http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/scripts)
[14:28] <ArneGoetje> asac: we set the name manually. It's also possible to rename templates in the database.
[14:28] <pitti> rickspencer3: I also use to put my talk slides there, and so on
[14:28] <rickspencer3> hmmm
[14:28] <asac> ArneGoetje: ok. so currently there is a mapping firefox-3.0 -> firefox and xulrunner-1.9 -> xulrunner. good.
[14:28] <rickspencer3> sounds like I should learn how to do that
[14:29] <ArneGoetje> asac: yes
[14:32] <ArneGoetje> asac: we can rename the old ones to carry the version number if you want, or we just name the new ones to carry the new version number. It's basically the script in langpack-o-matic, which needs to distinguish the versions. And currently the xpis are in rosetta-jaunty/xpi/firefox/ and rosetta-jaunty/xpi/xulrunner. If we rename those two templates to carry the version number, those directories will reflect this.
[14:32] <seb128> kenvandine: hi
[14:34] <asac> ArneGoetje: right. i think it would be good to rename them ...
[14:34] <asac> ArneGoetje: but i think not now. lets better wait till we have ffox 3.5 and then fix bugs in lang-pack-o-matic first
[14:35] <kenvandine> hey seb128
[14:35] <kenvandine> seb128: feeling better?
[14:35] <ArneGoetje> asac: +1
[14:36] <asac> ArneGoetje: so is there any ETA on when we can start using rosetta for kamic?
[14:38] <ArneGoetje> asac: I hope in the end of this month. Need to prod the rosetta guys how their testing is going.
[14:40]  * asac noted
[14:42] <seb128> kenvandine: yes, much better, thank you
[14:42] <kenvandine> great
[14:42] <kenvandine> seb128: see my mail about empathy?
[14:42] <seb128> kenvandine: to respond to your email, using libpurple for msn sounds good indeed
[14:42] <kenvandine> great
[14:42] <kenvandine> how about python-telepathy?
[14:42] <kenvandine> i think it would be useful
[14:44] <seb128> kenvandine: in which sense?
[14:44] <seb128> kenvandine: is it used right now?
[14:45] <kenvandine> i think only for butterfly
[14:45] <kenvandine> but other apps could use it
[14:45] <seb128> we can delay the mir until it's required
[14:45] <kenvandine> sure
[14:45] <kenvandine> ok
[14:45] <seb128> usually we do mir things when we block on those
[14:45] <kenvandine> sounds good... i need to run... be back in a couple hours :)
[14:45] <seb128> btw are you done with the other mir for telepathy*?
[14:45] <kenvandine> later folks!
[14:45] <kenvandine> yes
[14:45] <seb128> I noticed you didn't open bugs
[14:46] <kenvandine> yes i did
[14:46] <seb128> or didn't subscribe the ubuntu-mir team to those
[14:46] <kenvandine> there are links to the bugs in the wiki pages
[14:46] <seb128> they were not on the team buglist some hours ago
[14:46] <kenvandine> i wanted you to look at them first :)
[14:46] <seb128> oh ok
[14:46] <seb128> will do that
[14:46] <kenvandine> thx
[14:46] <seb128> see you later!
[14:46] <kenvandine> my first MIRs :)
[14:47] <seb128> pitti: ^ empathy, telepathy-* MIR have been written if you want to push it before alpha2
[14:47] <Mark__T> tedg: got my mail?
[14:48] <pitti> seb128: oh, great! hm, didn't get MIR bug mail
[14:48] <seb128> pitti: kenvandine didn't subscribe the ubuntu-mir team yet to those he wanted me to have a look first, I will do that now and subscribe the team
[14:48] <seb128> pitti: btw did you send an email with empty subject and content to ubuntu-devel-list or purpose or that's an error?
[14:49] <seb128> or a spammer?
[14:55] <pitti> seb128: was already pointed out; no idea how that happened
[14:55] <seb128> ok
[14:57] <tedg> Mark__T: Yes.  Thank you!
[14:57] <Mark__T> your welcome (though I don't like signing anything)
[15:17] <crevette> asac, btw why gnome-bluetooth wasn't uploaded yet?
[15:19] <asac> crevette: thought you wanted to update the patch with upstream comments
[15:20] <crevette> asac, I thought the debian version would be uploaded first and I would patch it later
[15:20] <crevette> but it's okay
[15:21] <asac> crevette: gnome-bluetooth (2.27.5-1) unstable; urgency=low
[15:21] <asac> thats what is currently in karmic
[15:21] <crevette> asac, ah I didn't had it ...
[15:21] <asac> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-bluetooth
[15:21] <crevette> okay cool, my patch is in https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/bugs/372395 waiting for a review
[15:21] <asac> crevette: is that with upstream comments?
[15:22] <crevette> not yet
[15:23] <jcastro> pitti: wrt. banshee memory consumption I think it's best to wait until mono 2.4 hits karmic and then test, it would be a waste to test it on the old stack
[15:24] <crevette> asac, but for the comment on libnotify in the patch, how  should I do?
[15:25] <asac> crevette: adress everything except that. i dont think he will hold back the patch just because of that
[15:27] <asac> crevette: point him to http://trac.galago-project.org/ticket/188 and the launchpad bug 383875 if you want to show him that there is work in progress on improving libnotify
[15:31] <pitti> jcastro: sure
[15:31] <seb128> jcastro, pitti: what is the discussion about?
[15:31] <jcastro> seb128: pitti updated the spec asking if someone was going to do a memory breakdown
[15:32] <seb128> ah ok
[15:37] <seb128> pitti: your G1 works fine with rhythmbox? kenvandine tried during the uds session and said it was not working
[15:37] <pitti> seb128: probably missing product ID in hal-info
[15:37] <pitti> I didn't upload the very latest hal-info to karmic yet
[15:37] <seb128> jcastro: what are the big selling point for banshee, responsive upstream doesn't fit in user story and pitti doesn't believe in device syncing ;-)
[15:38] <pitti> seb128: oh, don't get me wrong; responsive upstream is a big plus :)
[15:38] <seb128> pitti: to be honest I've not so much user stories to sell it
[15:38] <seb128> it's just it get lot of work where rhythmbox almost get none
[15:38] <pitti> I'd just like to see some more compelling argument than just "it's something else with the same functionality but twice the CPU and RAM cost"
[15:38] <seb128> and ipod syncing seems to be a thing almost every ipod customer or eom wants
[15:39] <pitti> hm, I had assumed that ipods have worked for years
[15:39] <seb128> ipod or device, that works for other devices too
[15:39] <pitti> the one that I borrowed worked fine, anyway
[15:39] <jcastro> seb128: we wrote them all down!
[15:39] <pitti> did that get broken?
[15:39] <jcastro> video podcasts with syncing is nice
[15:39] <seb128> pitti: "syncing", is a 2 ways update, not you doing manual dnd
[15:40] <pitti> seb128: I see
[15:40] <seb128> pitti: ie you plug you ipod, click "sync" and it upload all the song which have been added to your library since you previous plugged the device
[15:40] <seb128> it's a "keep my datas in sync" thing
[15:40] <seb128> the same way you would do with contacts
[16:00] <didrocks> seb128: oh, btw, if you have some time to see if everything's ok for you at bug #384236
[16:00] <seb128> didrocks: yeah, it's on my todolist
[16:01] <didrocks> seb128: great, keep me in touch :)
[16:20] <seb128> mvo: could you look at bug #384824?
[16:20] <mvo> seb128: sure
[16:20] <seb128> mvo: thanks
[16:22] <mvo> seb128: hm, hm, I asked for more info
[16:23] <seb128> mvo: thanks
[16:26] <seb128> mvo: would it make sense to auto add dpkg.log for upgrade issues?
[16:26] <mvo> seb128: probably, up until now the terminal log was good enough for 99% of the issues
[16:27] <mvo> seb128: the those "already installed and configured errors" are a mystery
[16:27] <seb128> but it's not in this case?
[16:27] <seb128> we get quite a lot of those ...
[16:27] <mvo> seb128: I wish I would get hold of somoene getting it in irc
[16:27] <seb128> mvo: could you also look to those
[16:27] <mvo> seb128: yes :(
[16:27] <seb128> bug #372451
[16:27] <seb128> bug #363825
[16:28] <seb128> mvo: I guess those are the same issue
[16:28] <seb128> do you have a bug to use as master for those issues?
[16:33] <mvo> seb128: sort of, the first I know about is #291482
[16:36] <mvo> seb128: but the former happend during a complex dist-upgrade
[16:37] <mvo> seb128: and the later does not, its a very simple operation apparently
[16:52] <Pici> 4/22
[16:52] <Pici> ermm, sorry
[17:04]  * kenvandine returns
[17:16] <rickspencer31> kenvandine: do you know to crop a photo with f-spot?
[17:16] <irvan> hi
[17:16] <rickspencer31> hi irvan
[17:16] <kenvandine> rickspencer31: yeah, in edit mode
[17:17] <rickspencer31> I'm in edit mode, and have a section selected
[17:17] <rickspencer31> help says: Once you have made your crop selection, you must click the crop button beneath
[17:17] <rickspencer31> 					the image to finalize the crop. If you are working with the original photo, cropping
[17:17] <rickspencer31> 					creates a new version your photo.
[17:17] <rickspencer31> 				
[17:17] <kenvandine> see the crop button
[17:17] <rickspencer31> but I can't see the crop button
[17:17] <kenvandine> oh
[17:17] <kenvandine> there is a right-left scroll bar
[17:17] <kenvandine> that sucks
[17:18] <rickspencer31> don't see one
[17:18] <kenvandine> do you see a cancel button?
[17:18] <rickspencer31> nope (using Jaunty atm)
[17:18] <kenvandine> you hit the crop button then select a region
[17:18] <kenvandine> or
[17:18] <irvan> i wnat to use a tv card on my system but no application will not work it wit
[17:18] <kenvandine> chose a restraint
[17:18] <irvan> pls help me
[17:19] <kenvandine> hi irvan
[17:19] <rickspencer31> kenvandine: I have no "crop button" that I can see
[17:19] <kenvandine> in edit mode of the photo?
[17:19] <kenvandine> weird... you should
[17:19] <rickspencer31> hmmm
[17:19] <kenvandine> do you have a left pane?
[17:19] <kenvandine> irvan: you probably want #ubuntu
[17:20] <rickspencer31> omg
[17:20] <rickspencer31> the left pane was collapsed all the way down
[17:20] <kenvandine> irvan: this is the desktop team channel, user support is in #ubuntu
[17:20] <rickspencer31> I had no idea
[17:20] <kenvandine> rickspencer31: ah!
[17:20] <rickspencer31> that sux!
[17:20] <kenvandine> file a bug please :)
[17:21] <rickspencer31> kenvandine: I'll check it out when I install karmic
[17:21] <kenvandine> ok
[17:21] <rickspencer31> irvan: right, this is where the developers of Ubuntu itself hang out (as well as a pointy haired manager or two)
[17:21] <kenvandine> hehe
[17:21] <rickspencer31> irvan: you're welcome to hang out, but you'll probably get better results at #ubuntu
[17:28] <seb128> rickspencer31, kenvandine: the sidepane bar width being 0 was an intrepid bug fixed in jaunty but user config don't change on upgrade
[17:28] <seb128> rickspencer31: try with a guest user if you get the issue
[17:28] <rickspencer31> seb128: ack
[17:28] <rickspencer31> thanks for the info
[17:28] <rickspencer31> seb128: will do
[18:22] <NCommander> seb128, if you have some free time later today, I have an ARM FTBFS fix for gnome-power-manager thats been sitting on launchpad for awhile, and it would be nice if that got sponsored soonish :-)
[18:22] <NCommander> (its not a rush job)
[18:23] <seb128> did you subscribe ubuntu-main-sponsors to the bug?
[18:23] <NCommander> seb128, yes
[18:23] <seb128> ok, so it's probably not there for "a while", I've reviewed the list some days ago and it was not there
[18:23] <seb128> anyway it's almost diner time here but I will do that tomorrow if pitti is not faster on it
[18:24] <NCommander> like I said, low priority. I think I had the bug open, then came back and found sponsors missing
[18:24] <NCommander> so I misspoke.
[18:24] <pitti> need to run in 5 mins for Taekwondo, sorry
[18:24] <pitti> so, time to say "good night"
[18:24] <seb128> ok, please subscribe the sponsor team so it's listed on http://people.ubuntu.com/~dholbach/sponsoring/index.html
[18:24] <pitti> NCommander: will remember to do some sponsoring tomorrow morning again
[18:24] <seb128> time for dinner here too
[18:24] <seb128> pitti: enjoy!
[18:25]  * pitti had his 2 hours share of sponsoring this week already
[18:25]  * seb128 no swimming, still not feeling good enough for that
[18:25] <pitti> NCommander: ^ fortunately for you our concept of "week" starts on Tuesdays :)
[18:25] <NCommander> pitti, timezones rock.
[18:41] <kenvandine> crevette: have you done anything with the notify osd patches for gnome-bluetooth yet?
[18:41] <crevette> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=584857
[18:42] <crevette> sent upstream, trying to understand with my low coding-fu what to do
[18:46] <kenvandine> crevette: want me to try to modify it to meet their needs?
[18:46] <crevette> I'm in the middle of it, trying to understand the g_list_find_custom thingy
[18:46] <kenvandine> ok, you got the rest already?
[18:48] <kenvandine> crevette: ok, well let me know if you need anything
[18:49] <crevette> the other is quite trivial :)
[18:53] <crevette> kenvandine: I'll made you review it, it'll avoid make me flamed by hadess
[18:54] <crevette> :)
[18:54] <asac> crevette: i used the custom thingy in the patch for libnotify
[18:55] <asac> thats bug 383875
[18:56] <crevette> I'll not read now in order to try to found myself
[18:56] <asac> crevette: yeah. check when you are finished ;)
[19:35] <hggdh> seb128, hi. Would it be worth any to have evolution (during the development cycle) to save the debug log? We would have to set the environment variables for that
[19:56] <seb128> hggdh: no opinion about that, in most case have clear steps to trigger the issue is enough and we don't ask for debug logs so often, but if you think that's a good idea feel free to submit a change to review
[20:02] <crevette> asac: yeah, (sorry I was away, it was dinner time)
[20:05] <asac> crevette: dinner is for the weak :-P ...
[20:05] <asac> just kidding :)
[20:05] <hggdh> seb128, I am not sure myself. I wrote a first try on a apport-hook for Evo, but found myself being paranoid on uploading gconf data, and unsure about the debug log... will think more on that
[20:07] <seb128> hggdh: yeah, don't print account informations, I'm not sure other settings are often useful for bugs on evolution
[20:09] <hggdh> seb128, agreed. Found myself using only a few of the gconf data. I am starting to lean more on sanitising BT full as the only thing really useful (generically) for Evo
[20:09] <hggdh> i.e., masking out account names & servers
[20:09] <seb128> that would be nice indeed
[20:10] <hggdh> will work more on that, then.
[20:29] <crevette> asac: so basically for g_list_find_custom is should like http://dpaste.com/52960/ ?
[20:32] <asac> crevette: is that paste complete?
[20:32] <crevette> hmm, I forget the return part
[20:33] <asac> crevette: also you have syntax error in lines following 7
[20:33] <asac> and the if
[20:33] <asac> misses brackets ;)
[20:33] <crevette> ah true
[20:33] <asac> crevette: but the g_list_find_custom itself looks ok
[20:34] <chrisccoulson> what populates the GList 'caps' there as well?
[20:34] <asac> crevette: also you nowehere get the caps
[20:34] <asac> right
[20:34] <asac> you have to get that
[20:34] <asac> if you want you can just pick the function body from my patch here: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/27521372/libnotify_server_caps_convenience.patch
[20:36] <crevette> did forget caps = notify_get_server_caps();?
[20:36] <asac> that patch doesnt cache the result, but imo that shouldnt be built into all apps. rather libnotify should be fixed to cache and flush cache on NameOwnerChanged
[20:36] <crevette> ah yeah, it was really a quick cut'n paste
[20:36] <asac> crevette: right. you forgot that in the if (!have_checked)
[20:36] <crevette> my copy wasn't complete, I wonder what I did
[20:36] <asac> 21:32 < asac> crevette: is that paste complete?
[20:37] <asac> :-P
[20:40] <crevette> asac: should I check for NULL for caps "if (caps != NULL) {" before g_list_find_custom?
[20:41] <asac> crevette: NULL is empty list. so g_list_find should be safe
[20:41] <crevette> okay
[20:53] <crevette> http://dpaste.com/52975/ asac, is it better ?
[20:53] <asac> crevette: thats a db table ;)
[20:54] <crevette> http://dpaste.com/52976/ asac, is it better ?
[20:54] <crevette> :)
[20:54] <asac> crevette: yeah. though i wouldnt do the caching
[20:54] <asac> did he ask for that?
[20:55] <crevette> I took the code from bratsche
[20:55] <asac> crevette: GList* c; is not used
[20:55] <crevette> ah yeah I can remove that
[20:55] <crevette> I can remove the have_checked if needed
[20:56] <asac> crevette: i would think we should remove the caching
[20:57] <asac> otherwise we need to patch all apps again when we fix libnotify to do the caching for us ;)
[20:57] <crevette> what do you call caching? (sorry)
[20:57] <asac> crevette: all the static stuff and the have_checked thing
[21:04] <crevette> http://dpaste.com/52980/
[21:04] <crevette> sorry asac, for such trivial patch
[21:04] <asac> welcome
[21:04] <asac> try to build ;)
[21:05] <crevette> let's go
[21:05] <asac> (its wrong) ;)
[21:06] <crevette> ah
[21:08] <crevette> yeah some c'n'p stupidities
[21:08] <crevette> :/
[21:12] <crevette> http://dpaste.com/52985/
[21:12] <crevette> and it compiles
[21:13] <asac> crevette: heh. yeah. now compare to what i had in the patch
[21:14] <asac> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/27521372/libnotify_server_caps_convenience.patch
[21:14] <asac> crevette: also check if your code style matches what is used else where
[21:14] <asac> in particular the if with just one line is most likely usually not done using {} brackets
[21:15] <crevette> I corrected the code style already I think, the only problem is make sure I don't use space but tab
[21:15] <crevette> as I can remove the brackets
[21:15] <asac> crevette: right. but check what i said about the "if" and the {} brackets
[21:15] <crevette> s/as/ah/
[21:15] <asac> just check what the rest of the code does
[21:16] <asac> so after that go ahead ;)
[21:16] <asac> after the rest cleanup we can resubmit and upload the package imo
[21:16] <crevette> for 1 line, the if doens't contains {}
[21:17] <crevette> I wonder if vim can help me to get ride of the space versus tab
[21:17] <crevette> problem
[21:20] <asac> crevette: not sure. only know that it works well if you have emacs header in the file and say "indent-all"
[21:20] <asac> like: /* -*- Mode: C; tab-width: 4; indent-tabs-mode: t; c-basic-offset: 4 -*- */
[21:20] <asac> in the first line
[21:20] <asac> thats what we have in NM
[21:20] <asac> vim can probably do the same, but i dont know how ;)
[21:20] <crevette> I lack of time to go deep in vim dcoumentation