[00:00] <Corey> So noone knows then ?
[00:00]  * robert_ancell reads about GtkActionGroup
[00:00] <rickspencer3> Corey: this is not really a place where people wold know
[00:00] <Corey> where would i found out then  ?
[00:00] <rickspencer3> hmmm
[00:00] <rickspencer3> #ubuntu, maybe?
[00:01] <Corey> I also wish to know if in the next realise, maybe LAMP should should be pre-installed....
[00:01] <Corey> #ubuntu I have tried
[00:01] <rickspencer3> Corey: in terms of LAMP, that would be for the server guys, i would think
[00:01] <rickspencer3> there is a product called Ubuntu server that is good for that
[00:02] <rickspencer3> the desktop, not so much
[00:02] <Corey> Is there any wehre were you can put in requests for next editions
[00:02] <rickspencer3> Corey: yes
[00:02] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3: It appears you use them to logically group your actions, the example the docs give is having a group per document and joining all those actions together to make the menus.  I've never used them though
[00:02] <rickspencer3> Ubuntu has an open planning process
[00:02] <Corey> wheres that ?
[00:03] <Corey> Do you have the URL ?
[00:03] <rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com
[00:04] <Ampelbein> Laney: i have an own version of that script running, the result is at http://217.11.53.243/new/versions.psp . it enhances seb128's version with comments. code available at https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~amoog/+junk/desktop-versions
[00:04] <Corey> Cheers I'll check it out
[00:04] <Laney> Ampelbein: Cool, I suggested that addition earlier
[00:04] <rickspencer3> robert_ancell: I didn't find that doc, could you please me link?
[00:04] <rickspencer3> but essentially, they are optional?
[00:05] <Ampelbein> Laney: i don't know if that will work on people.ubuntu.com though. it needs mod_python enabled to dynamically generate the comments in html.
[00:05] <Laney> Ampelbein: find out how MoM does it?
[00:05] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3: http://library.gnome.org/devel/gtk/unstable/GtkActionGroup.html
[00:05] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3: i guess so?
[00:05] <Ampelbein> Laney: pretty much, yeah. the newcomment.py is "inspired" by MoM ;-)
[00:05] <Laney> then I'd guess it should be alright
[00:06] <rickspencer3> robert_ancell: right, so I read through that, but it's not clear why you need actiongroups
[00:06] <rickspencer3> I'll keep plugging, thanks
[00:08] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3: let me know too :)
[00:10] <Ampelbein> Laney: I'll have a chat with seb128 tomorrow, let's see what he thinks about it.
[00:10] <Laney> sweet
[00:11] <Laney> I guess I should do this update with a bzr merge
[00:16] <rickspencer3> robert_ancell: I guess you nest actions in an action group element, but glade does not seem to support this :(
[00:17] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3: it sounds like relatively new functionality.  Probably don't want to mention it to quickly users
[00:17] <rickspencer3> right
[00:17] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3: We should probably make a cut down version of http://library.gnome.org/devel/gtk-tutorial/unstable/
[00:18] <rickspencer3> except that I don't think we should tell people to use the DOM
[00:18] <rickspencer3> I think you are supposed to inline XML
[00:18] <rickspencer3> I think glade has not caught up with gtkbuilder yet
[00:19] <robert_ancell> We need a gap document...
[00:19] <rickspencer3> robert_ancell: do you think we should forget about actions and such for quickly?
[00:19] <rickspencer3> just bind the controls right to signal handlers and forget all the action/action group stuff, I suppose
[00:19] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3: yes, I think we should only mention basic functionality (let people find out about more advanced stuff themselves)
[00:20] <rickspencer3> right, especially since the "advanced stuff" is totally half bakes wrt glade
[00:21] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3: absolutely.  Glade is aiming to support everything but it will take time
[00:23] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3: Is there a wiki space for quickly?  I think we need to write down what sort of applications a quickly user would create, then look at can we do that and how hard it would be
[00:23] <rickspencer3> the whole system seems unnecessarily complex ... I think it should be a simple matter to build abstraction around it, but I just can't figure some of the stuff out
[00:23] <rickspencer3> robert_ancell: please, be my guest
[00:23] <rickspencer3> https://edge.launchpad.net/~quickly
[00:24] <rickspencer3> you could add bluerpints and such
[00:24] <robert_ancell> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Quickly
[00:24] <rickspencer3> There's some strange relationships between actiongroups, actions, accellgroups, accellerators, and widgets
[00:24] <rickspencer3> but no one has documented the relationship (that I can find)
[00:25] <rickspencer3> just the interfaces for the individual classes
[00:25] <rickspencer3> oh right, and accell paths
[00:26] <rickspencer3> you need like six classes to set up simple key bindings

[06:44] <pitti> Good morning
[06:45] <pitti> kenvandine: they fit right now, but have zero i18n support
[07:22] <didrocks> good morning pitti o/
[07:35] <pitti> hey didrocks, bonjour
[07:53] <crevette>  & good morning
[07:53] <didrocks> hello crevette /
[07:53] <crevette> hey hey didrocks
[08:02] <huats> morning everyone
[08:10] <MacSlow> Greetings everybody!
[08:19] <seb128> good morning there
[08:24] <didrocks> hi seb128!
[08:24] <mvo> hey seb128
[08:24] <mvo> hey didrocks
[08:24] <seb128> hey didrocks mvo
[08:24] <didrocks> hello mvo
[08:29] <robert_ancell> seb128: morning seb, check out the versions script..
[08:29] <seb128> hello robert_ancell
[08:30] <vuntz> seb128: my dear friend
[08:30] <vuntz> seb128: I know you want to be my tester :-)
[08:31] <seb128> hey vuntz, yes?
[08:31] <seb128> robert_ancell, checking
[08:33]  * vuntz tests the bugs out of xephyr before using his seb128 joker
[08:34] <seb128> vuntz, what are you playing with?
[08:35] <vuntz> just triaging some panel bugs
[08:35] <vuntz> I can't reproduce http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=332054 and http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=570458
[08:35] <seb128> robert_ancell, trying to update but the server seems to not give any data today
[08:35] <seb128> ie it's hanging ...
[08:35] <seb128> ah, working now
[08:36] <seb128> waouh, lot of good work there!
[08:37] <robert_ancell> :)
[08:38]  * seb128 run update to see the httml
[08:38] <seb128> html
[08:38] <seb128> waouh!
[08:39] <robert_ancell> it's the one stop desktop shop
[08:39] <vuntz> seb128: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=576865 is a bug in some Ubuntu patch, fwiw
[08:39] <didrocks> seb128: can you update the online version, please? :)
[08:39] <seb128> didrocks, pitti, mvo: http://people.ubuntu.com/~seb128/versions.html
[08:40] <robert_ancell> seb128: I think you missed my last push, it gets the non GNOME stuff too
[08:40] <seb128> ^ check out, robert_ancell rocked today
[08:40] <mvo> nice
[08:40] <didrocks> seb128: waow, nice ^^
[08:40] <pitti> awesome!
[08:40] <pitti> the ordering is much better now, and bug links FTW
[08:40] <didrocks> congrats robert_ancell ;)
[08:40] <pitti> robert_ancell: *hug*
[08:40] <robert_ancell> thanks all!
[08:41] <seb128> robert_ancell, I've revision
[08:41] <seb128> 15
[08:41] <robert_ancell> what is the bzr command to list revision?
[08:42] <seb128> bzr log | less? ;-)
[08:42] <pitti> robert_ancell: list what?
[08:42] <robert_ancell> I have 18
[08:42] <seb128> did you push your changes?
[08:42] <robert_ancell> pitti: list the revision
[08:42] <robert_ancell> I pushed them as you were downloading. they seem all pushed
[08:42]  * seb128 pulls again
[08:43] <seb128> that's being sloooow today for some reason
[08:43] <robert_ancell> pitti: what was the issue with the builds last night?
[08:43] <seb128> what issue?
[08:43] <pitti> robert_ancell: bzr log|head or bzr info -v
[08:43] <pitti> robert_ancell: new binutils was uploaded, should be fixed now
[08:43] <robert_ancell> pitti: The logs were gone when I woke up so I couldn't see that the problem was with gnome-games
[08:43] <robert_ancell> s/that/what
[08:44] <pitti> robert_ancell: I mailed you the two "real" FTBFSes
[08:44] <seb128> if there is no log that's because there is a new build?
[08:44] <pitti> the others were just binutils fallout and were retried
[08:44] <robert_ancell> pitti: the links in the emails were dead
[08:44] <pitti> right, because of the mega give-back
[08:44] <pitti> robert_ancell: just delete them
[08:44] <seb128> the build logs are cleaned when the builds are retried
[08:45] <seb128> ok, bzr just hang on me today
[08:45]  * seb128 kicks launchpad
[08:45] <pitti> robert_ancell: you can ook at https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-games -> click on top version to get the current logs
[08:46] <robert_ancell> pitti: i see now, thanks
[08:46] <seb128> *shrug*, 160 bug emails during the night
[08:46] <seb128> and -discuss is crazy too today
[08:47] <didrocks> seb128: I think you can almost mark all of them as read... a lot of trolls... :/
[08:47] <seb128> didrocks, I did go through those quickly yes
[08:48] <seb128> I'm pondering un-subscribing
[08:48] <seb128> the ratio signal noise is too high nowadays
[08:49] <didrocks> fortunately, I have two hours a day of transportation, that enables me to do/triage this paperwork thanks to my gphone ^^
[08:49] <seb128> urg, that's quite a lot
[08:49] <seb128> ok, launchpad doesn't reply, reconnection to see if that's an issue there
[08:50] <didrocks> seiflotfy: "urg, that's quite a lot" -> Paris... ^^
[08:50] <didrocks> oupss, sorry seiflotfy
[08:50] <pitti> seb128: hm, bzr push hangs for me as well
[08:50] <seb128> pitti, ok thanks
[08:50] <seb128> robert_ancell, I will get your new revisions and update the page when they fix launchpad
[08:51] <robert_ancell> seb128: cool
[08:51] <seb128> robert_ancell, anyway good job, the page looks much better now ;-)
[08:51] <seb128> robert_ancell, btw how do you get versions for non GNOME components?
[08:51] <seb128> I'm curious
[08:51] <crevette> didrocks, I thought you were working for cano, as I see you working a lot of time on packaging during the dauy
[08:51] <crevette> :)
[08:51] <seb128> you look to the upstream tarballs?
[08:51] <robert_ancell> seb128: scan the pages for tarball names
[08:51] <robert_ancell> seb128: messy but works
[08:52] <didrocks> crevette: no, I'm just "effective" enough in my daily work so that people don't remark this :p
[08:52] <seb128> robert_ancell, you code the urls for each component in the source?
[08:52] <seb128> didrocks, make me think about my job before canonical ;-)
[08:52] <robert_ancell> seb128: yes, each package has a URL. The GNOME packages all have the same URL and it uses vincents list instead for them
[08:52] <didrocks> seb128: :-)
[08:53] <seb128> robert_ancell, ok good, I know about the GNOME versions I did this one ;-)
[08:53] <seb128> now we just need a way to run that script regularly somewhere
[08:53] <robert_ancell> seb128: I think we should split the script into two so it can scan for upstream versions each day and scan for LP bugs each time it is run
[08:53] <seb128> I'm not sure where somewhere is yet though
[08:54] <seb128> robert_ancell, yeah I was thinking about something like that too, though maybe versions more often than 1 day on new GNOME days
[08:54] <robert_ancell> agreed
[08:55] <seb128> pitti, mvo: any idea where I could run the versions script?
[08:55] <pitti> seb128: I'd use rookery
[08:55] <seb128> rookery can't connect to ftp.debian.org
[08:56] <pitti> seb128: works fine for me
[08:56] <seb128> weird
[08:56] <pitti> pitti@rookery:~$ wget http://ftp.debian.org/debian/README.html
[08:57] <seb128> $ lftp ftp.debian.org
[08:57] <seb128> lftp ftp.debian.org:~> debug 3
[08:57] <seb128> lftp ftp.debian.org:~> ls
[08:57] <seb128> ---- Connecting to ftp.debian.org (130.89.149.226) port 21
[08:57] <seb128> **** Socket error (Connection refused) - reconnecting
[08:57] <pitti> seb128: ah, I guess the firewall allows http, but not ftp
[08:58] <seb128> oh
[08:58] <seb128> ok, that's easy then ;-)
[08:59] <seb128> indeed, my experimental sources were using ftp, works when using http now
[09:05]  * pitti -> dentist, bbl
[09:07] <seb128> pitti, good luck
[09:08] <crevette> bzzzzZZZzz
[09:11] <chrisccoulson> robert_ancell - i assigned bug 388263 to myself. i already started it sometime ago, but it got sidelined due to other committments
[09:12]  * chrisccoulson thinks all that green is too bright for his eyes
[09:13] <robert_ancell> chrisccoulson: cool, I started working but ended up a bit lost :)
[09:13] <chrisccoulson> robert_ancell - it's quite a lot of work
[09:15] <seb128> robert_ancell, ok, update works now
[09:17] <seb128> http://people.ubuntu.com/~seb128/versions.html updated
[09:18] <robert_ancell> chrisccoulson: less green for you now :)
[09:18] <seb128> robert_ancell, maybe we could split the page in 2 tables?
[09:18] <seb128> there is some weird components you added there
[09:18] <seb128> ie poedit?
[09:19] <robert_ancell> I dunno, I was just added stuff into extras that I had installed... I want to make the extras stuff invisible by default and have a toggle at the top of the page
[09:19] <seb128> or blender?
[09:20] <seb128> anyway it's already much better
[09:20] <seb128> we can do tweaking on the way if required
[09:20] <seb128> I will set a cron job today to update the list
[09:20] <robert_ancell> We should look at poularitycontest and make the top installed stuff able to be shown
[09:20] <seb128> well, I think we have enough to do already
[09:20] <robert_ancell> Absolutely, it's always a work in progress.
[09:20] <seb128> so we should probably limit that to components we work on
[09:20] <seb128> or have 2 pages, one for ubuntu-desktop and one for extra components
[09:21] <seb128> the other are nice to track but not a priority to work on for us
[09:21] <robert_ancell> Sure
[09:21] <robert_ancell> I tried to put everything in default_packages that is in the default desktop install
[09:22] <vuntz> stupid question: where's the show desktop button on the default panel on ubuntu?
[09:22] <seb128> right
[09:22] <seb128> vuntz, top right corner?
[09:22] <seb128> hum
[09:23] <seb128> ignore me, I'm not sure
[09:23] <seb128> rather bottom left in fact I think ;-)
[09:23] <vuntz> so like upstream?
[09:23] <seb128> yes
[09:23] <vuntz> okay... So I don't understand http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=540147 :-)
[09:24] <seb128> vuntz, the guy says he's using mandriva
[09:24] <vuntz> yeah, but they said they were using upstream defaults...
[09:25] <vuntz> asking to mandriva people now
[09:25] <robert_ancell> bye all
[09:25] <seb128> robert_ancell, bye
[09:28] <didrocks> seb128: maybe we should differentiate "open task" (opened bug, in progress state") and "ready to sponsor" (bug in triaged state) in versions.html? Because here, we have no clue that bug-buddy is actively updated bu huats for instance, and if he opened a bug, you don't know if it's ready to be sponsored or not.
[09:28] <seb128> didrocks, open a bug when you start on something subscribe sponsors when ready?
[09:29] <seb128> we can easily look for the sponsor team being subscribed or not
[09:29] <didrocks> seb128: yes, also. We just have to put this information in the page. I can do it tonight.
[09:29] <seb128> cool
[09:53] <seb128> dpm, hello
[09:54] <seb128> dpm, could you have a look to bug #357678 and try to make sure it gets fixed in the next italian language pack update?
[09:55] <seb128> it's a frequent issue for italian users apparently
[10:02] <mvo> if noone mind, I can take the metacity sponsoring
[10:02] <seb128> mvo, go for it, there is another update? pitti did an upload yesterday I think, check before if that was just a bug not closed or an another change
[10:03] <seb128> oh ftbfs fix, ok good
[10:03] <mvo> seb128: its one from robert, it was not commited yet, fixes a build failure
[10:03] <seb128> cool
[10:03]  * mvo uploads
[10:03] <asac> mvo: hi
[10:04] <asac> mvo: do you have a minute or five today to discuss something on third party stuff?
[10:04] <mvo> asac: sure
[10:04] <mvo> asac: phonecall?
[10:05] <asac> mvo: yes. what time would be best (not right now please)?
[10:05] <dpm> seb128: hi, I'm reading the bug report right now...
[10:06] <seb128> dpm, thanks
[10:06] <chrisccoulson> vuntz - iwas thinking about taking a look at fixing gnome bug 164057 if no-one else is interested in working on it. what are your thoughts on how it should behave?
[10:07] <chrisccoulson> ugh
[10:07] <chrisccoulson> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=164057
[10:07] <mvo> asac: after lunch? I don't really mind the time as long as its not too late
[10:08] <seb128> chrisccoulson, there is a bug which has a patch to add a gconf key somewhere
[10:09] <seb128> chrisccoulson, http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=549788
[10:09] <asac> mvo: when is lunch in your world?
[10:09] <pitti> seb128: thanks, was just checking today; I have two followup sessions with real bzzzzzz now, though :/
[10:09] <pitti> seb128, mvo: metacity yesterday was FTBFS, this will probably be the fix
[10:09] <pitti> so go for it
[10:09] <seb128> pitti, checking what? I switched context since I pinged you I think ;-)
[10:10] <vuntz> chrisccoulson: no strong opinion. Calum's idea was nice, except that we'd need to put the most used locations inline. And we don't have the notion of "most used"
[10:10] <pitti> seb128: dentist
[10:11] <seb128> oh right
[10:11] <seb128> pitti, good ;-)
[10:11] <seb128> not so much for the bzzzzzz though
[10:11] <pitti> two ancient fillings need to be replaced
[10:12] <seb128> I will probably have some of those soon too
[10:12] <pitti> haven't been to the dentist for 3 years, was about time
[10:12] <seb128> indeed
[10:13] <seb128> I tend to go once a year for checking
[10:14] <seb128> *shrug*, users complaining about logout sound not working
[10:14] <crevette> pitti, I went there two weeks ago, didn't went to see him for 5 years (shame)
[10:14] <crevette> I was happy when i told me "no problem"
[10:14] <crevette> :)
[10:15] <pitti> lucky you!
[10:15] <pitti> seb128: feature!
[10:15] <seb128> pitti, "who cares"? ;-)
[10:15] <seb128> the hundredpapercut is creating lot of noise for sure
[10:15] <seb128> everybody claim having paper cut issues now
[10:23] <asac> crevette: do you know http://www.blueman-project.org/ ?
[10:23] <chrisccoulson> thanks seb128
[10:23] <crevette> asac, I heard of it
[10:24] <chrisccoulson> vuntz - yeah, i like calum's idea too. i don't know how you define "most used" either really though
[10:25] <chrisccoulson> also, the bookmarks menu collapses in the same way too doesn't it?
[10:25] <asac> crevette: I think we need a package so we can test/compare
[10:25] <crevette> I seen a packaging in a PPA
[10:25] <asac> crevette: i tested gnome-bluetooth and asked me about a few things, which blueman seems to have addressed
[10:26] <asac> especially wrt to DUN networks
[10:27] <asac> crevette: any clue about that PPA?
[10:27] <crevette> I confess I don't do networking with bluetooth, so I can't say :), my use-case is quite limited
[10:27] <crevette> https://edge.launchpad.net/~blueman/+archive/ppa
[10:27] <asac> debian bug 448153
[10:30] <asac> thx
[10:30] <seb128> brb
[10:32] <asac> which team is owning UNR? is that us?
[10:32] <asac> or mobile? ... or noclue?
[10:40] <pitti> asac: mobile
[10:40] <pitti> asac: so, David Mandala
[10:42] <asac> thx
[10:59] <mdz> so, after a gpu hang and a reboot, my pointing device (trackpoint) is no longer detected :-/
[10:59] <mdz> it seems to not be in hal anymore
[10:59] <mdz> there is no input device for it
[11:01] <mdz> seems like a kernel problem, but my kernel hasn't changed
[11:01] <asac> scary. maybe you to powercycle your machine completely?
[11:02] <mdz> yeah, I'll try that
[11:05] <mdz> asac, yep, that fixed it
[11:11] <asac> good. so i can get the latest bits without loosing my pointer ;). thanks!
[11:11]  * asac upgrades
[11:19] <asac> crevette: seems we have blueman already ;)
[11:19] <asac> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/blueman
[11:19] <asac> came from debian a few days ago
[11:22] <pitti> hm, today's live CD didn't build, because of empathy
[11:22] <pitti> http://people.ubuntu.com/~ubuntu-archive/livefs-build-logs/karmic/ubuntu/latest/livecd-20090618-i386.out
[11:22] <pitti> kenvandine: ^ seems some more MIRs are in order
[11:23] <asac> yeah
[11:27] <asac> wow. so blueman is kind of impressive ;)
[11:28] <pitti> asac: better than gnome-bluetooth?
[11:30] <pitti> indeed, just looked at the screenshots
[11:35] <seb128> whiteboard change emails are the suck they don't tell you what changed
[11:37] <asac> first time i have the feeling that bluetooth just worked (now we just need a better volume applet that covers more features from pavucontrol - like moving streams)
[11:37] <asac> created a dialup network for my phone and it just showed up in NM ;)
[11:37] <asac> do we know what is planned for the volume applet this cycle?
[11:37] <asac> seb128: ?
[11:38] <seb128> asac: we will switch to the new pulseaudio upstream one
[11:38] <asac> seb128: is that somewhere to test?
[11:39] <seb128> asac: sudo apt-get install gnome-volume-control-pulse
[11:39] <seb128> asac: are you speaking about the applet or the mixer dialog?
[11:40] <seb128> asac: gnome-volume-control-settings is the new upstream dialog
[11:40] <asac> thanks.  i will just check both
[12:30] <pitti> ugh, review queue empty once again
[12:30] <pitti> I think now I reviewed all karmic-targetted specs at least once
[12:31] <pitti> asac: https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-karmic-audio-experience says we're going to use the puse-enabled mixer
[12:32] <pitti> lunch o'clok
[12:35] <seb128> pitti: enjoy
[12:35]  * seb128 just back from lunch
[13:02] <seb128> pedro_: ola!
[13:03] <pedro_> salut seb128!
[13:58] <pitti> crevette: I just checked the Debian/Ubuntu obex-data-server diff, looks like it's mostly just noise and we can sync
[13:58] <crevette> ah okay, true there is my name on it :)
[13:58]  * pitti is currently checking the merges list
[13:58] <crevette> I trust on you, go ahead !!
[13:59] <pitti> crevette: this is the only weird change:
[13:59] <pitti> +       install -D -m 0644 $(CURDIR)/data/obex-data-server.conf $(CURDIR)/debian/obex-data-server/etc/dbus-1/system.d/obex-data-server.conf
[13:59] <pitti> ^ i. e. debian does _not_ have this line
[13:59] <pitti> my Q is, why does obex-data-server need a system d-bus configuration file in the first place?
[13:59] <pitti> isn't this per-user?
[13:59] <pitti> on the session bus?
[13:59] <crevette> there is both but we use session bus
[14:00] <pitti> crevette: do you care about this? if not, I'd just sync
[14:00] <crevette> I'm not sure I understand the impact, I would sync
[14:00]  * crevette hides
[14:00]  * pitti pushes button
[14:00] <crevette> and I'd blame filippo :)
[14:00] <pitti> it's all in bzr, so if we ever need the change, we just reapply it
[14:04] <seb128> pitti: I commented on desktop-karmic-bug-workflow
[14:04] <seb128> I'm not sure about the "needs info" button
[14:05] <seb128> ie should we really triage those bugs or just flag those as "need to get extra informations to be useful"
[14:05] <pitti> seb128: I think those details probably don't need to get firmly fixed in the spec anyway
[14:05] <seb128> ok
[14:05] <pitti> this power-triager-tool will be an evolving project anyway
[14:05] <seb128> otherwise the spec looks alright to me
[14:05] <pitti> seb128: thanks for review
[14:05] <seb128> you're welcome
[14:06] <pitti> it's a bit unfortunate that it mixes workflow with writing a new tool
[14:06] <seb128> right
[14:06] <pitti> but *shrug*, I won't fuss about the tool, as long as it does what you need :)
[14:06] <seb128> ;-)
[14:09] <pitti> didrocks: can you please check your vino merge? or whether we can sync?
[14:10] <seb128> pitti: there is a sponsoring request from Laney for that I think
[14:10] <seb128> hey rickspencer3
[14:10] <pitti> seb128: hm, it doesn't appear on https://merges.ubuntu.com/main.html; other merges do
[14:10] <pitti> but maybe that needs to be done manually
[14:10] <pitti> hey rickspencer3
[14:10] <pitti> rickspencer3: thanks for the burndown fixes, looks better now (http://piware.de/tmp/desktopteam-burndown-karmic.png)
[14:10] <rickspencer3> hi pitti, hi seb128
[14:15] <kenvandine> pitti, we should drop the recommends for elepathy-butterfly imho
[14:15] <pitti> kenvandine: that works for me, too
[14:15] <kenvandine> so we need the farsight stuff
[14:16] <kenvandine> pitti, i can't do it until the weekend though... actually taking vacation today/tomorrow :)
[14:16] <pitti> kenvandine: ah, enjoy
[14:16] <kenvandine> pitti, wanted to fill you in on u1 though
[14:16] <davmor2> Guys query on empathy are you going to include the irc package for it or not as it isn't in by default currently?
[14:16] <pitti> kenvandine: doing an upload to drop butterfly then
[14:17] <kenvandine> ubuntuone-client and ubuntuone-storage-protocol is in REVU now
[14:18] <pitti> nice
[14:18] <Zdra> pitti: why dropping butterfly?
[14:18] <pitti> kenvandine: ^
[14:18] <kenvandine> Zdra, it brings in more deps, and haze seems to satisfy the need for now
[14:19] <Zdra> pitti: kenvandine: not that butterfly in karmic is unusable, latest release fix most issues
[14:19] <kenvandine> Zdra, it didn't work last time i tried it :)
[14:19] <kenvandine> well... haze worked better
[14:19] <jcastro> they just had a release yesterday I think
[14:19] <jcastro> or the day before
[14:19] <kenvandine> Zdra, file a bug if you want us to reconsider that, and i will look at it after my vacation :)
[14:19] <kenvandine> Zdra, just assign it to me
[14:19]  * kenvandine needs to run though... later folks!
[14:20] <Zdra> kenvandine: That's fine for me
[14:20] <seb128> well we don't need a strong decision on it now
[14:20] <seb128> we can play with both and see how they work
[14:20] <pitti> davmor2: telepathy-idle shold be there by default
[14:20] <Zdra> kenvandine: in fact I'm looking for comparaison between haze-msn and butterfly
[14:21] <Laney> can versions.html be made to update more often?
[14:21] <Zdra> kenvandine: In empathy we made the choice to privilege butterfly but we could reconsider
[14:21] <seb128> Laney: it's not made to update at all right now
[14:21] <davmor2> pitti: I'm not seeing irc as an account option and idle is only suggested and not recommended
[14:21] <Laney> seb128: Oh, s/more often// then :)
[14:21] <seb128> Laney: still fixing some issues before having it running regularly
[14:21] <Laney> got it
[14:21] <davmor2> unless that has changed
[14:22] <davmor2> pitti: that's from upgrade I'm about to check a cd now
[14:22] <pitti> davmor2: probably needs seeding
[14:23] <didrocks> pitti: I was thinking someone declared to work on it yesterday, if there is nobody, ok, I can check
[14:24] <seb128> mpt: grrr
[14:24] <pitti> WARNING: desktop-karmic-network-ui has no work items
[14:24] <pitti> WARNING: desktop-karmic-bluetooth-stack has no work items
[14:25] <pitti> WARNING: desktop-karmic-browsers has no work items
[14:25] <pitti> WARNING: desktop-karmic-firefox-3.5 has no work items
[14:25] <pitti> WARNING: desktop-karmic-content-library has no work items
[14:25] <mpt> WARNING: seb128 is angry
[14:25] <seb128> mpt: I don't mark bugs duplicates because launchpad suck at searching bugs and I don't want to spend half of my days looking for useless numbers
[14:25] <seb128> mpt: and I don't want the bug list to be noisy with things I know to be duplicates either
[14:26] <pitti> asac, kenvandine ^
[14:26] <pitti> (just the daily nag)
[14:27] <mpt> seb128, I know what you mean, I was in the same position with bugs about Launchpad itself for years. But every so often I'd realize that whoops, this bug actually *hadn't* been reported before.
[14:27] <Laney> didrocks: I did it, don't worry
[14:27] <Laney> (vino)
[14:28] <seb128> mpt: well the choise is between having a useless list full of known duplicates or a few bugs wrongly closed
[14:29] <seb128> mpt: we have a number of bugs way higher that what we can work on anyway, so better to try to keep the buglist under control
[14:34] <didrocks> Laney: ok, that's what I was thinking :) did you keep the NM support in ubuntu?
[14:35] <didrocks> (this is the main diff between the debian version and ours)
[14:35] <Laney> didrocks: yes, but joss just added it
[14:35] <Laney> so next time: sync
[14:35] <didrocks> great ;)
[14:36] <rickspencer3> hi didrocks
[14:36] <didrocks> hey rickspencer3
[14:36] <rickspencer3> pitti: I updated burndown.py yesterday
[14:36] <rickspencer3> if you want to try it out
[14:36] <pitti> rickspencer3: [15:10]     pitti| rickspencer3: thanks for the burndown fixes, looks better now (http://piware.de/tmp/desktopteam-burndown-karmic.png)
[14:37] <pitti> :)
[14:37] <rickspencer3> sweet
[14:52] <kenvandine> pitti, desktop-karmic-content-library was marked as informational
[14:53] <pitti> kenvandine: ah, ok
[14:53] <kenvandine> pitti, there are no actions from it...
[14:53] <pitti> I should teach my script about that
[14:53] <kenvandine> maybe your script should not warn on those
[14:53] <kenvandine> :)
[14:54] <kenvandine> pitti, you saw that u1 stuff made it to REVU?
[14:54] <pitti> I heard, yes
[14:54] <kenvandine> ok
[14:55] <rodrigo_> kenvandine: so, my blueprints look ok, so what do I need to do next?
[14:55] <kenvandine> rodrigo_, i think pitti should be marked as approver
[14:55] <rodrigo_> ah ok
[14:56] <kenvandine> then send it to review status
[14:56] <kenvandine> and wait for pitti to critic it :)
[14:58]  * pitti sharpens the review knife again :)
[14:59]  * rodrigo_ prepares some nice wine bottles to send to pitti
[14:59] <pitti> rodrigo_: fail! I don't drink wine
[14:59] <pitti> beer appreciated, though :)
[14:59] <rodrigo_> pitti: ok, beer then :)
[14:59]  * pitti ^5s rodrigo_
[15:00] <rodrigo_> pitti: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/couchdb-glib-package-for-karmic and https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/evolution-couchdb-package-for-karmic , all yours :D
[15:01] <pitti> rodrigo_: please set it to "review" when you are happy with the wiki spec
[15:01] <rodrigo_> pitti: ah ok
[15:05] <rodrigo_> pitti: done
[15:30] <pedro_> Zdra, cassidy, have you guys seen something similar to bug 335986 ?
[15:32] <jcastro> Zdra, cassidy, also, should we be encouraging people to use what's in the telepathy in the PPA? I see some bugs reported against Jaunty that are probably dupes of stuff you guys fixed in 2.27.x.
[15:32] <dobey> pitti: hey
[15:33] <cassidy> jcastro: jaunty users who are interested in testing telepahy/empathy should definitely use the PPA, yeah
[15:33] <dobey> pitti: btw, ubuntuone-storage-protocol and ubuntuone-client are in REVU now :)
[15:33] <jcastro> ok
[15:33] <cassidy> I'm maintaining to keep it as up to date as possible
[15:36] <Zdra> pedro_: 2.24 is obsolete
[15:36] <Zdra> pedro_: ask to retry with 2.26 or 2.27
[15:37] <Zdra> pedro_: but I see no reason for it to fail, we just call gtk_show_uri()
[15:38] <pedro_> Zdra: alright, will do that, thanks you
[15:57] <pedro_> Zdra: may you have a look later to bug 206547 ? your last comment suggest wontfix but there's a few comments from the community on it
[15:58] <Zdra> pedro_: there is an upstream bug about that
[16:09] <asac> pitti: i think all from that list should have work items now. i also added desktop-karmic-modemmanagers ... please approve that for karmic goal as well.
[16:10] <asac> pitti: (its not a real spec. more a work item attached lightweight spec - see whiteboard comment i dropped there)
[16:12] <asac> pitti: did you keep mozilla...wifi spec intentionally out of the burn down script?
[16:12] <asac> pitti: would be ok with me ... just wonder if the work item deadline applies for that one too ;)
[16:13] <seb128> versions is automatically in a cron job now
[16:13] <seb128> +updated
[16:14] <Laney> hoorah
[16:39] <pitti> seb128: yay
[16:40] <pitti> asac: not intentionally, it just doesn't match the desktop-karmic-* pattern, thus the script doesn't see it
[16:40]  * pitti fixes
[16:40] <asac> pitti: hmm. ok. i wouldnt mind ;)
[16:40] <asac> but let me add a few items there too
[16:41] <pitti> asac: modemmanagers ack'ed for karmic
[16:44] <asac> pitti: thanks!
[16:44] <asac> ok items added to wifi scanning too. i think i am done for whatever i have now.
[16:44] <pitti> asac: mind if I rename mozilla-karmic-firefox-wifi-scanning to desktop-karmic-firefox-wifi-scanning?
[16:45] <pitti> (if you want to get WI coverage for it)
[16:45] <pitti> if this should be under the desktop team umbrella, it's easier to find "our" specs that way
[16:45] <asac> pitti: if you think its better. i wanted to use mozilla- prefix for mozillateam stuff in the long run. but since we didnt do that for the rest, its consistent for this cycle i guess
[16:46] <pitti> okay
[16:46] <asac> so go ahead
[16:46]  * pitti re-runs script
[16:46] <asac> the idea of having mozilla prefix would be that i could publish burn downs for the mozillateam etc.
[16:47] <pitti> asac: right, that's possible as well; I can add them as patterns for desktop work items as well
[16:47] <asac> but for this cycle i probably just want to do that for the firefox 3.5 transition spec and maybe we will get a addons community spec
[16:47]  * pitti fixes one work item syntax
[16:47] <pitti> ERROR: invalid work item format: Xulrunner - roll out PPA work to real archive
[16:47] <asac> pitti: which one?
[16:47] <asac> ah ...missing :?
[16:47] <pitti> from which spec is that?
[16:47] <pitti> asac: yes
[16:47] <asac> let me do that
[16:48]  * pitti should teach his script to tell the bp name
[16:48] <asac> maybe it should be TODO by default ;)
[16:48] <asac> pitti: ok rerun.
[16:49] <pitti> asac: still says that, but that's just LP lagging, so nevermind; thanks for fixing
[16:49] <pitti> yay, no WARNINGs left
[16:49] <pitti> http://piware.de/tmp/desktopteam-burndown-karmic.png
[16:49] <pitti> nice spike :)
[16:49] <pitti> rickspencer3: ^ so I think we are good to flush the DB and consider "now" as start of the data?
[16:50]  * pitti adjusts the y scale
[16:50] <asac> ~310 items ;) ... fun
[16:50] <pitti> ok, fixed; looks better now
[16:51] <asac> pitti: can we allow us to use INPROGRESS? maybe map that TODO for the chart.
[16:51] <rickspencer3> 250+ work items
[16:51] <rickspencer3> omg
[16:51] <rickspencer3> pitti: that's fine with me
[16:51] <rickspencer3> as long as INPROGRESS = TODO for the chart
[16:51] <rickspencer3> what we might want to do is flag INPROGRESS items that are in progress for say, more than 2 days
[16:52] <rickspencer3> (similar to block-o-matic
[16:52] <rickspencer3> )
[16:52] <asac> 2 days? maybe 7 days? ;)
[16:52] <pitti> asac, rickspencer3: committed
[16:52] <rickspencer3> pitti: I set the y-scale to be 20% greater than the tallest bar
[16:52] <asac> great. so at some point i now need something to grep for INPROGRESS items associated with me. but not that importnat to get started
[16:52] <rickspencer3> perhaps I should tweak that to 10%?
[16:53] <asac> will we publish a raw csv somewhere?
[16:53] <pitti> rickspencer3: I meant --height
[16:53] <rickspencer3> oh
[16:53] <pitti> rickspencer3: it looked very condensed and the scale numbers weren't readable
[16:53] <pitti> I used --height=600 now
[16:53] <rickspencer3> looks good
[16:53] <asac> for me the chart looks good now
[16:53] <pitti> ok, reload
[16:53] <pitti> just updated it with flushed DB
[16:53] <rickspencer3> yeah for arguments
[16:53] <asac> doesnt fit on my x61s browser screen though ... but i guess i can live with that ;)
[16:54] <rickspencer3> ok, IT'S ON!
[16:54] <pitti> Let the race begin! :-)
[16:54] <rickspencer3> asac, can't you do "View Image"?
[16:54] <asac> rickspencer3: why does the trend line start with the red one?
[16:54] <rickspencer3> asac: because I don't give credit for things that are done before
[16:54] <asac> rickspencer3: i can ... but if i just open it in my browser window it doesnt fit at 100%
[16:54] <asac> rickspencer3: ok
[16:54] <rickspencer3> that would start us under the trend line, give us false confidence
[16:54] <pitti> asac, rickspencer3: current picture is without --height
[16:55] <pitti> rickspencer3: can we fix the axis numbers to have steps of 10?
[16:55] <asac> too bad ... no ramp up bonus ;)
[16:55] <pitti> (i. e. reload again)
[16:55] <asac> pitti: now the numbers are really tight again
[16:55] <asac> even overlapping in some cases
[16:55] <rickspencer3> pitti: yes
[16:55] <rickspencer3> in fact, it's supposed to, I switched the intervals for the x/y axis
[16:56] <rickspencer3> x is supposed to be 7, y is supposed to be 10
[16:56] <rickspencer3> I'll fix it, and give you cl arguments while I'm at it
[16:56] <rickspencer3> (have to run off to my son
[16:56] <pitti> n/p
[16:56] <rickspencer3> s little 8th grade graduation ceremony, but in 90 mins.)
[16:56] <asac> did you commit both parts (e.g. parser + graph plotter) to some branch yet?
[16:57] <pitti> asac: plotter is bzr+ssh://bazaar.launchpad.net/%7Erick-rickspencer3/%2Bjunk/py-burndown-chart/
[16:58] <pitti> asac: workitems.py is in http://www.piware.de/bzr/bin/
[16:58] <pitti> I should eventually move that to somewhere else
[16:58] <asac> great thanks.
[16:59] <pitti> I have it at --height=500 now, looks okay
[16:59] <asac> pitti: we already have MOIN work items too? nice.
[16:59] <pitti> asac: yes, special favour to Riddell :)
[17:00] <asac> pitti: i wanted that too. thought it was cut ;)
[17:00] <asac> pitti: not for our items, but i might want to reuse those scripts for something else
[17:00] <asac> pitti: which wiki pages are you looking at? those linked from blueprints (sorry, i could read code)
[17:00] <pitti> asac: it's not hardcoded
[17:01] <pitti> 03 3 * * * bzr update $HOME/bin; $HOME/bin/workitems.py -d data/desktop-workitems.db -r karmic -p 'desktop-karmic-' -m 'https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kubuntu/Todo/Karmic?action=raw'; $HOME/bin/workitems.py -d data/desktop-workitems.db --csv --to 2009-10-01 | python ubuntu/py-burndown-chart/burndown.py --output=www/www/tmp/desktopteam-burndown-karmic.png --height=500 --title='Desktop Team Karmic Burndown'
[17:01] <pitti>  -
[17:01] <asac> ok so you maintain that outside?
[17:01] <pitti> is the entire cronjob
[17:01] <asac> ah. i see
[17:01] <asac> thanks
[17:01] <pitti> asac: the -m is the wiki
[17:01] <asac> yeah
[17:01] <pitti> I want it to be reusable for other teams
[17:01] <pitti> thus --moin and --pattern and --release, etc.
[17:02]  * pitti plays spec approval whack-a-rat again
[17:13] <asac> pitti: oh seems i added the work items to summary for modemmanagers spec ... moved to whiteboard now
[17:23] <pitti> bryce: what's the status of bug 377090? is this waiting for/fixed by linux 2.6.31?
[17:23] <pitti> Riddell: do you know the status of bug 339313?
[17:29] <Riddell> pitti: the updated network manager plasmoid doesn't seem to solve all the problems for everyone, although it does solve it for some people, so I'm not sure what to do
[17:30] <Riddell> pitti: it's a big change for an SRU so it seems improper to put it in while it's not working for everyone.   on the other hand it's the only option
[18:01] <pitti> Riddell: no, I mean for karmic
[18:01] <pitti> Riddell: but for jaunty, if the current one doesn't work at all, there's not much chance for regression
[18:02]  * pitti -> off for today, I meet with a prospective new DD for keysigning
[18:06]  * seb128 is away too and on holiday tomorrow so see you maybe then or monday otherwise
[18:06] <seb128> I will probably be reading emails during the day but maybe not on IRC
[18:25] <bryce> pitti: I suspect 377090 will need stuff that's in 2.6.31.
[18:28] <bryce> pitti: since I think the feature will be available in released code for karmic, I'm not in a big hurry to pull branches of things, but it might be nice to put it in the xorg-edgers ppa; I might do that if I run out of other high priorities.
[18:53] <rickspencer3> pitti: fyi: I fixed up burndown.py
[20:32] <pmatulis> i want to change the default Panel settings, is http://docs.sun.com/app/docs/doc/806-6878/6jfpqt2t6?a=view still relevant? particularly the heading 'To Set Preferences for Individual Panels and Panel Objects'