real_ateany of the kubuntu bugs people here?00:06
* real_ate pokes00:06
Mamarokreal_ate: do you need help?00:07
real_atewell i have been tracking down an issue00:07
real_ateand i think i have come to the root of it00:07
real_ate... i don't have the kwin recording "effect" in my system00:07
Mamarokreal_ate: is it already reported as bug in launchpad?00:07
real_ateMamarok: i'm looking at that right now too00:08
real_atenope! :P00:08
Mamarokreal_ate: the best would be to check if there is a bug and comment on it or file one00:08
real_ateMamarok: well i wanted to see if i was an isolated case first... hence why i came in here00:09
real_ate.... the kwin effect to record your desktop... is it installed by default00:09
real_ate... is it even "installed" :S its more of a plugin than a program00:09
Mamarokreal_ate: as most of the devs are in Europe, it's already late, you should try #kubuntu, then eventually file a bug00:09
real_ateMamarok: right so ;)00:10
* real_ate is also a dev and also in europe00:10
* Mamarok is going to bed now too...00:10
real_atei'll file a bug so00:10
real_ateMamarok: night ;)00:10
Mamarokreal_ate: thanks for reporting anyway, gn8 :)00:10
real_ateMamarok: i know you're going to bed00:12
real_atebut can i ask one more question00:12
Mamarokgo on00:12
real_ate.... is kubuntu-bugs the group where i should file the bug?00:12
real_ateor should i just file it in ubuntu?00:12
Mamarokreal_ate: exactly :)00:13
real_ate... exactly what? you mean file it in ubuntu00:13
Mamarokin the kubuntu-bugs group, as you said :)00:14
real_ateMamarok: well thats the thing... it doesn't have any "Add bug" link00:14
Mamarokwell, you report it in bugs.launchpad.net, there you can add the group00:15
real_ateok... great thanks00:15
real_atethank you for your help00:16
Mamarokyou are welcome :)00:16
* Mamarok now really goes to bed00:16
=== rickspencer3 is now known as rickspencer3-afk
nhandlerryanakca: Great job on the wiki theme!00:48
ryanakcanhandler: Thanks :)00:54
nhandlerryanakca: Any idea when/if ubuntunew is going to be moving to wiki.ubuntu.com? Also, are we really going to keep 3 kubuntu themes?00:58
super__radtrying to help out with kubuntu, I'm going through kde-bugs finding all the feature requests. The wiki says to post the "thanks for taking the time to make ubuntu better....post on brainstorm" message and then ask in #ubuntu-bugs for it to be changed to wishlist, do I need to change status from "new" to "confirmed" aswell?01:00
ryanakcanhandler: Umm... not sure, I didn't know we had a third one, but eventually kubuntunew will become default. As for ubuntunew, you'll have to ask mdke :)01:03
dtchenerr, wrong buffer  *sigh*01:04
nhandlerryanakca: Yeah, we have kubuntu, kubuntu2, and kubuntunew right now ;)01:05
ryanakcanhandler: Hmmm :)01:06
ryanakcanhandler: I think 'kubuntu2' might be a bugfix (Matt got rid of some broken links for us) for 'kubuntu' ... I haven't checked the difference though01:07
rgreeningryanakca: how do you load the new theme01:28
vorianrgreening: you have to click on your name in the top left corner for userprefs01:30
ryanakcargreening: Click the link I put in my blog post, then in the Preferred theme: dropdown box select kubuntunew01:30
vorianleft as in right, sorry01:30
vorianryanakca: nice job01:30
ryanakcargreening: found it, https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Home?action=userprefs01:31
ryanakcavorian: thanks :)01:31
voriani like the way you did the 'show editing options' too01:31
ryanakcaI'm planning on starting to tackle the website TODO next week, exams this week and Monday01:31
* ryanakca => chemistry review01:32
ryanakcavorian: You'll want to thank mdke for that part :)01:32
yuriyJontheEchidna, ScottK: are you sure this kde-icons-oxygen -> kdebase-runtime-data change is right?01:38
yuriybug 38864301:38
ubottuLaunchpad bug 388643 in ubuntu "KDE4 apps dont have icons" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/38864301:38
yuriyi checked, icons start disappearing if I remove kde-icons-oxygen01:38
JontheEchidnakde-icons-oxygen -> kdebase-runtime-data change? I know kde-icons-oxygen is no longer in kdebase-runtime, but in its own source package01:39
JontheEchidnathe thing is that we need to figure out what should depend on it01:40
JontheEchidnaI personally think it'd be reasonable to make kdebase-runtime depend on it, since any kde app needs kdebase-runtime to run and it was providing it before01:42
JontheEchidnathough technically KDE could use and xdg-compliant icon theme...01:42
yuriyJontheEchidna: so nothing depends on it now?01:50
yuriyI think kdebase-runtime should, yeah01:50
yuriyalso I think oxygen is supposed to be xdg compliant01:51
yuriymaybe it's that the other ones aren't01:51
yuriyJontheEchidna: or, more logically maybe, should kdebase-runtime-data depend on it?01:53
shtylmanyuriy: your oxygen icons are now in the go-oo install01:53
shtylmanat least the initial set I checked out a few days ago01:53
yuriyshtylman: nice :) i'll try to get to fixing up the scripts and regenerating to only include oxygen soon01:54
shtylmanyuriy: thanks for the work on that btw...makes the whole thing look fantastic01:54
yuriyshtylman: and thanks for your work on the widgets and dialogs!01:54
shtylmanyuriy: hold off on removing the non-oxygen icons (I asked for a bit more clarification on that today) ... want to actually make sure it is the right thing to do :)01:55
yuriyshtylman: yeah i'm not sure that fallback works right now, from what we saw when you don't have the crystal style installed (should have been falling back to tango)01:56
JontheEchidnasuper__rad: for wishlist items for kubuntu we don't usually tell people to go report them in brainstorm. If the feature is not implemented and is a reasonable feature we usually mark it as confirmed02:01
JontheEchidnaof course we do eventually want to send the wishlist items to bugs.kde.org and link them to the bug report (click the "also affects project" link)02:01
JontheEchidnaotherwise they just tend to sit there ;-)02:02
super__radok, was told by someone on #ubuntu-bugs to copy and paste that brainstorm bit then change it to confirmed02:03
JontheEchidnabrainstorm isn't the most kde friendly place, unfortunately. Generally wishlist items aren't too unmanageable for Kubuntu/KDE stuff02:04
JontheEchidnaso we tend to not use brainstorm, but maybe that should change in the future? I dunno02:05
nhandlersuper__rad: Personally, I find that stock reply to be completely pointless02:05
JontheEchidna^me too02:05
JontheEchidna"go report it somewhere else equally useless"02:05
super__radyeah it did seem a bit pointless, but someone on ubuntu-bugs said to do that so thought I should follow their advice02:06
JontheEchidnaOh, and I would like to thank you for taking a look at the bugs. More hands is always better02:06
super__radso from now on for kubuntu/kde wishlists just change status to confirmed (should I add a comment aswell?) and then just post it on #ubuntu-bugs for someone to set as wishlist?02:07
super__radhave no programming or packaging skills (plan to learn to package soon) so thought I could help out by trying to sort some of the mountain of bugs02:07
JontheEchidnathat'd work02:08
yuriysuper__rad: if you can tell it's not a Kubuntu specific bug, also report it to bugs.kde.org02:08
yuriythat's probably the most useful step02:09
yuriysuper__rad: you know how to link to an upstream bug?02:09
super__radok, yeah it's just "also affects project" isn't it?02:10
JontheEchidnayeah, then there's a place to paste the bug link02:11
yuriymhmm. thanks for working on it super__rad!02:11
super__radno problem, only way I could help out with kubuntu at the moment as I have no other skills, want to learn packaging soon but missed the tutorial tonight02:11
JontheEchidnayuriy: oh, here's a bug for userconfig02:12
JontheEchidnathe show system accounts radio is off by default, but you can still see system accounts until you check/uncheck it02:13
vorianhowd your class go JontheEchidna?02:13
JontheEchidnavorian: pretty well02:13
JontheEchidnasuper__rad: I could probably get you a log if they haven't made them available yet02:13
super__radthat would be great, thanks02:13
voriansuper__rad: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2009/06/18/%23ubuntu-classroom.html02:14
JontheEchidnairclogs.ubuntu.com to the rescue02:15
super__radthanks, will have a read now02:16
JontheEchidnayuriy: also userconfig will allow you to change a username to start with a capital letter02:16
yuriyis that not legal?02:17
yuriynever tried, but that's not my code either02:17
JontheEchidnanot according to adduser02:17
yuriyI should find the standard and improve that validator then02:17
* JontheEchidna nods02:17
JontheEchidnathanks for the work, its looking good02:17
yuriyhalf the network settings in system settings should really be in an advanced section02:43
_Groo_hi/2 all02:43
yuriymy bad can't keep those 4's straight02:51
=== santiago-pgsql is now known as santiago-ve
super__radJontheEchidna got right to the end then getting errors while trying to build http://pastebin.com/m529f792d02:58
shtylmanRiddell: I was bouncing around a few ideas with pinheiro about the installer...we both agreed that if the installer was always fullscreen it would make it clean and clear what was happening as well as the "serious" nature of the process. Obviously once the install begins it would minimize and the user can play around...pinheiro also suggested to add an icon to the upper corner to minimize the installer at any point incase the03:08
shtylman user wants to jump back to the system... I did a quick mockup (http://shtylman.com/stuff/kubuntu_installer/ubiquity_idea2.png) and must say that I personally am warming to the idea...it puts the users focus on the installer while still giving them the option to minimize it. Likewise...I have added some things to the spec about small screen support because I know that will be an issue for us with netbooks. Ideas? Oh and a03:08
shtylman final note...I think a kubuntu logo wouldn't hurt on the installer :) and other distros that rebrand could just replace the image file :)03:08
shtylmanrgreening: how goes the usb creator? make you want to kill yourself yet ;p03:24
rgreeningshtylman: It was pretty hairly today...03:24
rgreeningI junked the FS on my usb sticks multiple times today03:25
rgreeninghad to fdisk and mkfs manually to recover. lol03:25
rgreeningshtylman: but I am getting closer to ridding myself of gobject03:25
shtylmanso you see the light at the end of the tunnel03:26
rgreeningI won't pretend the code is pretty. It's definately not.03:26
rgreeningported code is always ugly03:26
shtylmanif it works it works...cleanup can come later :)03:26
rgreeningWell, it makes a successful boot stick :)03:27
yuriyrgreening: are you sure there isn't a gobject-qobject bridge out there already you can use?03:28
rgreeningyuriy: if you can find one...03:28
rgreeningbut I'm pretty sure NO03:29
yuriyshtylman: wow, sleek mockup03:29
shtylmanthanks...yea...I want to explore the idea of making the installer go fullscreen... with the option to minimize03:38
shtylmanits a serious process that really don't take that long so it should require all of your focus for those few minutes...03:38
yuriyshtylman: maybe once it's actually installing, it can minimize to a small window or even something in the panel? that is, if we don't have a slideshow03:48
shtylmanyuriy: indeed...that is the goal03:48
yuriywhat if it was maximized instead of full screen?03:49
yuriyfull screen and minimizable feels kind of old school windows installerish03:49
yuriyactually, nevermind03:50
yuriybecause then it might as well just be a window on top of the background... which is kind of what your mockup is03:50
shtylmanyuriy: yep...and yea...it may feel oldschool...but technically speaking you are about to perform serious operations to your local disks and whatnot... you should focus :) .. and that is also why we let you minimize it (that will be a very clear icon)03:56
shtylmanthe usage scenario is: II am installing a system (new user) and this thing needs to hold my hand and guide me through it with no other distractions while I do that.03:57
ScottKyuriy and JontheEchidna: What about seeding the Oxygen package in kubuntu-desktop.  Since in theory another icon set is possible, that way things aren't locked in.04:00
yuriyScottK: that would break things for ubuntu/gnome users04:01
ScottKWe don't fall back to Tango or something?04:02
yuriyseems not. does tango use xdg naming?04:02
ScottKNo idea.04:02
yuriyif it does then something is wrong04:02
ScottKyuriy: I'd go for recommends.04:24
yuriyScottK: makes sense04:29
=== lex79 is now known as lex79_
=== lex79_ is now known as lex79
=== rgreening_ is now known as rgreening
DaskreeCHTonio_: ping05:52
nixternalshtylman: the plasmoid is still stupid, but it connects to a PHP script on a server, and the PHP script is the smart portion of it and redirects the plasmoid to the correct survey. No more manual work needed :)07:25
nixternalRiddell: ^^ also check email, Alpha 2 is out :)07:25
DaskreeCHWhich plasmoid?07:26
nixternalKubuntu QA Feedback07:26
sebasRiddell: ping09:43
freinhardbug 359805 : update-notifier-kde failed because it couldn't allocate memory to run lsb_release. should that exception be caught?09:51
ubottuLaunchpad bug 359805 in update-notifier-kde "python2.6 crashed with OSError in _execute_child()" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/35980509:51
Riddellsebas: you pinged?10:44
seaLneRiddell: how stable would you say alpha2 is? would it be stable enough for using to run the PCs for the video recording at gcds? the dependancies for dvswitch in jaunty are broken so you can't even build it11:45
RiddellseaLne: it's pretty good, I don't have  any real problems11:59
=== ejat is now known as e-jat
seaLnegood enough aswell that i could run on my laptop that i really need to be working for gcds?12:00
seaLnei guess there won't be a huge difference kdewise between running 4.3 on jaunty and karmic?12:02
e-jatRiddell: recently i discover my wireless cant connect well with the kdenetwork-manager .. it is my hardware problem or the kdenetwork-manager ..12:02
e-jatit happend to the AP which doesnt have key (security)12:03
RiddellseaLne: right12:05
Riddelle-jat: tried the plasma-widget-network-manager from jaunty-proposed?12:05
e-jatRiddell: in karmic12:06
e-jatim in karmic12:06
Riddelle-jat: hmm, you could  try compiling it from svn to see if it works better12:09
Riddellcould try the network-manager-gnome nm-applet to see if that works12:10
e-jatok thanks .. i need to try / double confirm with network-manager-gnome .. or it maybe course by the driver inside the new kernel ..12:13
e-jatRiddell: http://yfrog.com/e8plasmoidnetworkp12:15
e-jatthe screenshot12:16
e-jatRiddell: hv u see the screenshot  ?12:32
Riddellyes, what am I looking for?12:40
seeleshtylman: ping12:56
ScottKWhat packages do I need to install to get a good backtrace from Akregator?13:44
ScottKGood morning all.13:44
Riddellkdepim-dbg and/or akregator ddeb?13:46
* ScottK tries.13:54
* txwikinger_work has almost the maximum number of question marks on his screen14:03
=== akonadi is now known as AutumnCat
=== AutumnCat is now known as nihui
seaLnewell jaunty certainly dosen't dist-upgrade to karmic nicely atm14:38
shtylmanseele: here14:39
shtylmanRiddell: evand told me to poke you about approving (asking Rick for exception) the kubuntu ubiquity spec14:42
seaLnelibqtscript4-* having conflicting files14:47
ScottKRiddell: The kubuntu-ayatana one still needs approving too.14:48
neversfeldeoh, I can use kpackagekit, is it a new version?15:02
Riddellshtylman, ScottK: ok15:02
seaLnejaunty->karmic dist-upgrade wasn't all that bad actually apart from those conflicts, ignoring wireless not seeming to authenticate15:08
=== fjlacoste is now known as flacoste
=== jjesse_ is now known as jjesse
rickspencer3seele: hi16:33
ScottKseaLne: We'll want bugs on the conflicts so we can fix them.16:33
rickspencer3seele: can we discuss 100 paper cuts my afternoon, your late afternoon/evening?16:41
rickspencer3seele: I just want to know what I can do to help move it along for Kubuntu16:42
rickspencer3hi flacoste!16:42
rickspencer3everyone knows that Launchpad devs love Kubuntu, right?16:42
nixternalhello my fellow kubunteers16:52
ScottKrickspencer3: Love from proprietary software is generally unrequited love around here.16:57
rickspencer3ScottK: but they are working so hard on open sources it, as we speak16:58
ScottKrickspencer3: Partially16:58
rickspencer3I know, but still, we should be encouraging the progress, plus, we should encourage our users!16:59
nixternalrickspencer3: launchpad devs don't love anyone! they are evil and mean people :p   just kidding!16:59
ScottKActually I viewed the announcement that it would be partially open sourced as a regression.  Previously it had at least appeared to me that all of it would eventually be released.16:59
DaskreeCHScottK: based on what ?17:00
nixternalit is great having a weather radio, but when the alarm goes off waking you up for a tornado warning for some place you haven't even heard of it, then there is a problem17:00
ScottKDaskreeCH: Based on the bug against Launchpad and the comments in it.17:00
ScottKnixternal: Problem with the alert area or problem with your knowledge of geography?17:00
JontheEchidnaIt seems we have been unobservant. Debian changed the plasma-widget-network-manager package to plasma-widget-networkmanagement since January17:00
JontheEchidnawhich means we'll have to transition to a new package. Again17:00
ScottKIt might do to ask if they are done changing the name.17:01
* ScottK heads out ...17:01
DaskreeCHoh someone was asking about the kwin record desktop plugin. Is that a kde default plugin?17:01
nixternalScottK: both17:01
nixternalthey said some town that I had never heard of17:01
nixternalbut recently, I have found out new towns that are within a 10 mile radius of me that I never heard of before, and I have lived here for 30+ years now17:02
JontheEchidnaDaskreeCH: KDE removed it since it was too buggy17:02
JontheEchidnaas of KDE 4.2 iirc17:02
DaskreeCHJontheEchidna: Removed to work on or just dropped the idea ?17:02
JontheEchidnathe source is totally gone from svn17:02
DaskreeCH!info krecordmydesktop hardy17:03
ubottukrecordmydesktop (source: krecordmydesktop): kde frontend to recordmydesktop. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.1~alpha1+debian-1 (hardy), package size 75 kB, installed size 300 kB17:03
DaskreeCH!info krecordmydesktop intrepid17:03
ubottukrecordmydesktop (source: krecordmydesktop): KDE frontend to recordmydesktop. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.1~alpha1+debian-2 (intrepid), package size 69 kB, installed size 288 kB17:03
DaskreeCH!info krecordmydesktop17:04
ubottuPackage krecordmydesktop does not exist in jaunty17:04
JontheEchidnaoh, well that's totally different. I was talking about the kwin video record "effect"17:04
DaskreeCHYes I know but I'm saying that we are progressively running out of ways to record the desktop it seems17:04
JontheEchidnakrecordmydesktop: (Reason: (From Debian) RoQA; obsolete for KDE 4, orphaned, RC-buggy)17:05
DaskreeCHat least basket k3b and kmymoney are back \o/17:06
shtylmananyone that wants to try out my kubuntu ubiquity mockups: bzr branch lp:~shtylman/+junk/kubuntu_ubiquity_overhaul17:12
shtylmanseele, Riddell: ^17:12
DaskreeCH_rickspencer3: how many cuts are we aiming for?17:14
shtylman99.9999 ... we had some rounding errors :)17:15
rickspencer3DaskreeCH: this comes up with the whole project ...17:15
rickspencer3to me, in this context, "100" is a concept, not a target17:15
rickspencer3it's more important to me to have a list of good bugs, than a list of some certain size17:15
rickspencer3so I wouldn't shoot for a number, if it were me17:16
DaskreeCH_So just fill the truck?17:16
=== ejat is now known as e-jat
=== rickspencer3 is now known as rickspencer3-afk
JontheEchidnashtylman: looks awesome18:01
JontheEchidnawith a few tweaks (uncommenting some code, turning on desktop effects, setting the wallpaper) I got this: http://imagebin.ca/view/1aQkc-S.html18:02
RiddellI loaded JontheEchidna's link and for some reason clicked on "Previous", which wasn't the most sensible thing to do18:03
Riddellshtylman: are you running a live CD by any chance, would you know a file I can use to check if an app is running from a live CD?18:04
lex79Riddell: have you seen my problem with membership? Alessandro Ghersi member since 2008-02-2118:11
seeleshtylman: hmm.. have a link to a pdf or pngs or something?18:15
seelerickspencer3-afk: hey.. got back from some meetings. i will be around all afternoon to chat18:16
JontheEchidnaseele: I haz screenshot http://imagebin.ca/view/1aQkc-S.html18:16
seeleJontheEchidna: <318:16
Riddelllex79: how strange.  it shouldn't cause any problems though18:17
lex79Riddell: the problem is the membership expire 2010-02-20 instead 2011-06-16  :)18:19
e-jatRiddell:  http://imagebin.ca/view/fwy70q7.html18:20
e-jatUnknown Network should be the ZyXEL AP18:20
Riddelllex79: you can just renew it18:22
DaskreeCH_JontheEchidna: Wow. What's that written in?18:24
JontheEchidnaDaskreeCH_: shtylman did it18:26
DaskreeCH_I saw. I just didn't see it :)18:27
e-jatcan some help me with the screenshot i posted... why ZyXEL not in the list but i connected to it ..18:28
Riddellbecause network manager plasmoid is more buggy than an ant hill18:32
DaskreeCH_has anyone hit the bug where after you switch Desktops he Keyboard dies?18:34
Riddellnot I18:35
DaskreeCH_I think I figured out a work around18:36
nixternal12:03:37 [   Riddell] I loaded JontheEchidna's link and for some reason clicked on "Previous", which wasn't the most sensible thing to do18:36
nixternalI just fell out of my damn chair!!!18:36
DaskreeCH_You decided to ignore the senisble advice and do the insensible?18:37
DaskreeCH_Hmm Choqok kills plasma for me everytime it checks the network18:39
lex79JontheEchidna: have you started with merge digikam?18:42
JontheEchidnalex79: nope, working on networkmanager plasmoid atm18:43
lex79ok, I'll do it18:43
=== rickspencer3 is now known as rickspencer3-af1
JontheEchidnaIt'd be awesome if karmic could look like so: http://imagebin.ca/view/63lasZ.html19:08
rgreeningI think akonadi is causing system lag for plasma, or maybe it was kopete or Kontact. Plasma was at 100%, killed Kontact, saw it go to 9999%, then killed Kopete and it crashed and I saw akonadi go to 9999%. I stopped akonadi server and all has returned to normal...19:11
rgreeninghmm.. nope, plasma is back to 100%..... grrrrrrrrrrrrrr19:14
seelei dont understand how to assign stuff to hundredpapercuts19:27
seelewhen i click on assign-to and search for hundredpapercuts it doesnt show up19:28
seelenevermind, got help19:33
JontheEchidnaRiddell: speaking of networkmangler, could you offer some core-dev/archive admin assistance? I have a merge of the plasmoid from debian, but its got a different name so it'd need to be NEW'd and put in main19:34
JontheEchidnadebian-to-merged.diff: http://paste.ubuntu.com/199488/19:35
JontheEchidnaIf the merge meets the approval of your core-dev hat, I can upload19:41
RiddellJontheEchidna: approved!20:03
lex79Riddell: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/digikam/+bug/38961320:03
ubottuLaunchpad bug 389613 in digikam "Merge digikam 1.0.0~beta1 with debian unstable" [Undecided,New]20:03
JontheEchidnaRiddell: uploaded, if you could push that and kcm-gtk through new that'd be grand20:07
seelerickspencer3: i blogged about people participating in kubuntu papercuts and started an idea page to turn into some bugs20:11
seelerickspencer3: not sure what i should do besides try to get some bugs registered to hundredpapercuts20:11
rickspencer3seele: ok20:12
rickspencer3I'm meeting with someone right now20:12
rickspencer3can you paste me a link and I can check it out after lunch?20:12
seelerickspencer3: http://weblog.obso1337.org/2009/100-papercuts-and-kubuntu/20:13
seelerickspencer3: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/seele/KarmicPapercuts20:13
smarterMake desktop cashew menu appear on hover instead of click. it disappears on blur and not click so the interactions don't match20:16
smarterwhat do you mean by "disappears on blur"?20:16
GibsonGuyI heard all the best kubuntu people are here and someone might know what I can try to get an install working20:19
RiddellGibsonGuy: our support dudes are in #kubuntu20:20
GibsonGuyah, ok thanks20:20
MamarokRiddell: he is the jukebox guy from Gibson :)20:24
Mamarokand a dev, starting on Linux20:24
nixternalRiddell: hey, working on some QA stuff, mind if I create a bzr branch under ~kubuntu-members for 'kubuntu-qa-tools' ?20:24
nixternalI will put all of the scripts and yummies there as well as the plasmoid stuff20:24
Riddellnixternal: sure go ahead20:25
nixternalgo go go!20:25
Riddell"digikam.install: add /usr/bin/cleanup_digikamdb"  lex79 what is that?20:26
Riddelland why doesn't debian want it?20:26
lex79dunno, I think is for cleaning digikam database, I thought debian has forgotten to include it in digikam.install20:29
lex79I can remove if it is necessary20:30
Riddelllex79: I expect we want it, but could you check with the debian package if that's the case?20:30
RiddellI'll upload now though20:30
lex79Riddell: ok, I will check20:31
Riddelllex79: uploaded!20:40
nixternalare there any python plasmoids in the repos yet?20:40
Riddellnixternal: not that I know of20:40
lex79I think not20:40
nixternalheh, wonder what the perferred dir structure would be for one20:41
lex79Riddell: in debian experimental there is ktorrent 3.3~svn, can I merge? or we wait 3.3 stable ?20:43
Riddelllex79: hmm, probably better to wait for an upstream release?  random svn snapshots may lead to random problems unless there's a paticular reason we want it20:44
RiddellMamarok: know if anyone has tried amarok 2.1.1 from backports?20:47
MamarokRiddell: we already had some bug reports :)20:48
RiddellJontheEchidna: how do I add a sidebar like in your plasma screenshot?20:49
Mamarokand it installed correctly so far, we still have that crash on first start bug though, for some users20:50
jjesseRiddell: i've had no problems with 2.1.1 from backports20:51
jjesserunning fine for me20:51
jjesserunning jaunty amd-6420:51
Mamarokwell, the crash on first start is only happening to people who already have a db, so it's probably database related, much WIP right now anyway in trunk20:52
Mamarokand even then, not to everybody20:52
JontheEchidnaRiddell: add a panel and make it wide enough for plasmoids not to show up as icons20:56
JontheEchidnathen set it to autohide20:56
RiddellJontheEchidna: how do you add a panel?20:56
JontheEchidnaright click on desktop -> add panel20:57
RiddellJontheEchidna: oh aye, there it is21:01
Riddellbit cluky all that panel setup21:01
Riddelland autohide could do with some animation21:01
Riddelland it really is hidden, could do with some clue that it's there21:03
RiddellJontheEchidna: kcm-gtk accepted, going to add to the seeds?21:16
JontheEchidnaRiddell: needs mir first, I think21:25
JontheEchidnaunless its simple enough not to need one?21:25
JontheEchidnaIt was real easy to write one up for, anyway: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/MainInclusionReportKcmGtk21:28
JontheEchidnabut it looks like its in main :)21:28
RiddellJontheEchidna: it's already been in main as part of qtcurve21:29
Riddellpart of gtk-qt-engine rather21:29
Riddellso no need21:29
RiddellMamarok, Nightrose: what is sven423's name?21:30
JontheEchidnaIt'd be easier if a core-dev added it to the seed since only core-dev can commit to the seed branch21:31
JontheEchidnaI should start on a core-dev app soon I suppose21:31
Riddellgood point21:32
nixternalRiddell: I just did what was done for kubuntu-dev-tools, created a new project (kubuntu-qa-tools) and make kubuntu-members the maintainer...as I am hoping in the future this becomes as populate as the -dev-tools :)21:36
JontheEchidnahum, the "report bug" menu item doesn't work in dolphin21:37
JontheEchidnaor akte21:37
yuriynixternal: ^21:41
nixternalgo figure21:43
nixternalit works here21:43
nixternaljust tested it in dolphin21:43
nixternalopened up apport and did its scan/test, and presented me with the ability to send off a bug report21:44
nixternaljust tested in kate as well and it works21:44
Riddellnixternal: testing your patch or the one in the archive?21:45
nixternalI just created/edited/copied the code without even testing it, made a patch, and implemented it....no QA whatsoever on it, except a test build...I knew it would work and threw all caution to the wind ;p21:45
nixternalthe one that installed recently on my computer from the archive21:46
nixternalthat doesn't sound right though21:46
nixternalanyone else having issues with the "Report Bug..." feature in KDE apps?21:51
ryanakcanixternal: Ping, how's help.kubuntu.org comming along? Put on the backburner for now or ?21:52
nixternalya, need to add it to my todo list for docs....i will get it done, i swear to it :)21:52
nixternalnot back burner, as I need to get the docs rolling, so maybe sooner than the backburner21:53
ryanakcanixternal: OK, great :)21:53
nixternalits nice having a bunch of packagers around now, I can work on development stuff now :)21:53
rgreening+1 nixternal22:05
rgreeninganyone want to see if akonadi is a cpu killer for plasma?22:06
rgreeningwhen I open kopete/kontact, akonadi server starts and some time after plasma-desktop cpu usage goes bonkers22:07
NightroseRiddell: Sven Krohlas22:07
=== Quintasan_ is now known as Quintasan
=== rickspencer3-afk is now known as rickspencer3
rickspencer3seele: I think the list of paper cuts you already have is sufficient, so I think you are well on your way22:44
MamarokRiddell: Sven Krohlas23:07
rickspencer3hi djsiegel123:09
rickspencer3seele: ??23:09
djsiegel1hey rickspencer323:09
djsiegel1seele: let's talk paper cuts when you have a moment23:09
rickspencer3we were discussing the merits of a single unified launchpad project, versus one for Kubuntu and one for Ubuntu23:10
rickspencer3I like the single project because of what it implies for teamwork, but I like the separate ones for the managability23:10
djsiegel1rickspencer3: did you see my proposed name, "hundredpaperkuts", on seele's blog?23:10
djsiegel1rickspencer3: clever, huh?23:10
rickspencer3let's see rgreening, Nightrose, Riddell, thoughts? ^^^23:11
djsiegel1we could do hundredpaperguts and hundredpaperkuts to be fair23:11
Nightroserickspencer3: kde is trying to get away fromt he k thingy ;-)23:12
rickspencer3Nightrose: ok23:12
Nightroseso no for that from me23:12
rickspencer3but, what do you think of having a Kubuntu paper cuts launchpad project next to the Ubuntu one23:12
rickspencer3but reporting on them simultaneously23:12
Nightrosesounds fine to me23:13
rickspencer3(without the cute "k" thing)23:13
rickspencer3well, given that it is Friday night on the East Coast, I assume that's all we'll get out of this discussion today :)23:13
rickspencer3thanks djsiegel1 and Nightrose23:14
rickspencer3nixternal:  ^^^ thoughts?23:14
djsiegel1yes, the 'k' thing was a joke :)23:14
Nightroseit's friday night in europe too :D23:14
djsiegel1wtf, it's Wednesday here23:14
* Nightrose doesn't believe djsiegel123:15
djsiegel1I have been filing paper cuts for too long23:15
dtchenah, so that's why my inbox blew up this week.23:19
seelerickspencer3: pong23:35
seeledjsiegel1: pong23:35
seeledjsiegel1: i almost entitled the blog post 100 paperkuts  ;)23:36
rickspencer3seele: did you see the discussion regarding launchpad projects?23:37
Nightroseseele: hey :)  you wanted to talk about how to get the word out to users23:37
seelerickspencer3: yes, the question was if it should be the same or a separate project?23:37
Nightroseseele: i think kde@kde.org and the forum are your best bet23:37
seeleNightrose: kk23:37
Nightroseseele: and the kubuntu users list23:38
rickspencer3seele: I think djsiegel1 would prefer two projects, as it would make his work for the Ubuntu paper cuts easier23:38
Nightrosethe kde forum guys will likely be happy to help with an announcement there23:38
seelerickspencer3: yeah, i guess. i'll take whatever i can get23:38
Nightrosethey are in #kde-forum23:38
rickspencer3but he is amenable to combining if there is a strong sentiment that they should be23:38
seelerickspencer3: i would still prefer to be part of the original project to show unity with ubuntu23:38
seeleotherwise it just looks like a cheap spinoff23:38
seeleand not official23:38
rickspencer3seele: right23:38
seeleNightrose: ok thanks, i'll hop in there in a few minutes23:39
rickspencer3oth if they are separate, the kubuntu one can have it's own branding a bit, and working with the bugs will be easier23:39
seelei guess.. but ubuntu already got the press for it23:40
seelethey were talking about it on utest for heaven's sake23:40
djsiegel1I don't think combining them in one launchpad project is going to make them appear divided.23:40
djsiegel1What is utest?23:40
seeledjsiegel1: stuffy usability testing listserv full of human factors engineers23:40
djsiegel1We just need to blog about them as one effort.23:40
rickspencer3seele: what were they saying about it?23:41
seelerickspencer3: there was a discussion of what a "papercut" was and the dangers of trying ti fix "small" issues with small fixes when small issues may take a lot of time and consideration23:41
seeleso the tradeoff of slapping a bandaid on a design problem versus really fixing it i guess23:42
djsiegel1Well, we are "really fixing them"23:42
djsiegel1many of these issues have not made progress in years23:42
seeledjsiegel1: i dont understand your comment. i think putting them in one project would make them look unified. did you mean separate projects?23:42
rickspencer3so in other words, get bound up in analysis to the degree that you don't have to take accountability for any actual deciscions23:42
djsiegel1no, we are using the word "project" loosely23:42
seelerickspencer3: well.. i think they just had no clue what was really going on and talking for the sake of it23:42
djsiegel1They should be one project, with shared principals and goals and timelines23:43
rickspencer3right, I think the next thing to figure out is launchpad implementation23:43
seelerickspencer3: but they did have a point of "real fix" versus bandaid. we've had the problem in kde where people only look at one layer of the problem and don't realise the underlying problem23:43
djsiegel1for example, next friday's milestone will have to halves23:43
djsiegel110 ubuntu papercuts, 10 kubuntu papercuts23:43
djsiegel1we may throttle down to 8/week23:43
seeledjsiegel1: 10 papercuts fixed? or identified?23:44
djsiegel1If we are going to deliver 100 for karmic, we need to begin fixing now23:44
djsiegel1we have 60-80 identified23:44
seelei dont think we have the man power to keep up with ubuntu. aurelian is the only one i know who could work on stuff from the canonical side and i dont even know if he is availabe to us23:44
seeledjsiegel1: right, well the other issue of having a seperate tally for kubuntu is that i dont think we can fix 100 papercuts23:44
djsiegel1so, what do you propose?23:45
seelethat's why i would rather contribute to the ubuntu tally23:45
djsiegel1so, you guys do 20, we do 80?23:45
seeledjsiegel1: that sounds excellent23:45
djsiegel1I don't know how we will define the split.23:45
seeleand it can be a soft number if you want more and we cant deliver23:45
rickspencer3does it have to be a quota system?23:45
seelerickspencer3: as in a hard number? or that only 100 papercuts are done for karmic?23:46
nixternalNO I WANT 100 PAPER KUTS! I am still an old school KDE'er now, more than 10 years and counting! Gimme my 'K' :p23:46
* rickspencer3 kicks nixternal23:46
nixternalyay, more tornados on the way...god I love Chicago23:46
seelenixternal: do you have C++ skillz to contribute? :P23:46
* Nightrose steals nixternal's K23:47
nixternalI hope so23:47
nixternalwhat am I contributing to?23:47
seelenixternal: fixing a 100 paperKuts ;P23:47
nixternalbesidens insanity23:47
rickspencer3I was thinking more like Kubuntu would put in the bugs they have, and then ew see where it shakes out23:47
nixternalseele: I thought we get future contribs to do it23:47
djsiegel1ha, you guys code in C++ so one person should be able to fix as many paper cuts as 20 C hackers working on Ubuntu paper cuts :)23:47
rickspencer3but I have the feeling that djsiegel1 needs it more tightly managed than that23:47
nixternalseele: actually paper kuts are small, easy fixes I thought23:47
rickspencer3well, they'll fix one paper cut in the base class, and the rest of the paper cuts will get fixed automatically23:48
dtchennixternal: well, yes. properly tagged ones.23:48
rickspencer3but it will take them 5 years to define the base class fix23:48
nixternalgotta love kdelibs :)23:48
seelerickspencer3: well if i have a hard target, then i can bother people to get stuff done23:48
seeleif it is soft, then it might be harder to get people to commit23:48
djsiegel1so, the problem is, Ubuntu can fix 10023:48
nixternalseele: I would be down, pick a paperKut, and start assigning them to people :)23:48
rickspencer3okay, I am concerned that we will complicate the Ubuntu project too much if we mingle them on launchpad23:48
nixternalleave some low-hanging fruit ones to attract new contributors23:48
djsiegel1I don't like eating away at those because Kubuntu can't keep pace -- no fault of their own23:48
seelerickspencer3: part of the community draw is that a lot of kubuntu stuff goes upstream. so i could find people outside kubuntu to submit patches for karmic because they would eventually end back upstream23:49
rickspencer3and I think the design team likes the "big round number" effect23:49
djsiegel1Why not leave 100 for ubuntu, and have different number for kubuntu?23:49
seeleeh, i guess. i have no idea how to calculate that number since i dont manage the single canonical kde developer23:50
djsiegel1It doesn't make sense to not maximize potential to fix ubuntu papercuts.23:50
rickspencer3perhaps Kubuntu could do it for a different and shorter period of time23:50
rickspencer3like get as many kubuntu bugs as you can, then go for 10 a week until they are done23:50
rickspencer3djsiegel1: right, I agree23:50
seeleit's not the same program :(23:51
rickspencer3we shouldn't fix n bugs in Kubuntu *instead* of in Ubuntu23:51
rickspencer3but can't we fix more than 100?23:51
djsiegel1100 is still feeling pretty good23:51
rickspencer3I always thought of "100" as more of a concept than a hard target23:51
djsiegel1this next week will tell us a lot23:51
djsiegel1I we can make 100, I will be very happy23:52
rickspencer3so how about this:23:52
nixternalthink it is time to go storm chasing...gonna hop on the bicycle and ride :p23:52
rickspencer31. we get Kubuntu bugs into the same launchpad project23:52
rickspencer32. seele triages from Ux pov23:52
rickspencer33. every week 10 Ubuntu bugs and x Kubuntu bugs are picked for that week as a target23:52
rickspencer34. Every week a post about the success is made jointly23:53
djsiegel1What about have 10 bugs each week for 10 weeks23:53
rickspencer3djsiegel1: would that be too weak in terms of your "100" concept?23:53
djsiegel1and we intersperse "kubuntu papercut weeks"23:53
rickspencer3tell me more23:53
djsiegel12, 3, 4 of them, depending on how kubuntu can ramp up23:53
rickspencer3but wouldn't that be replacing Ubuntu bugs?23:54
djsiegel1No, I mean, ubuntu will still do 10 weeks23:54
rickspencer3personally, I think if we say that we fixed 100 paper cuts between both projects ... that would be a hug success23:54
djsiegel110 10-bug milestones23:54
djsiegel1but some weeks, we do a kde 10-bug milestone instead23:55
rickspencer3and then some weeks there would 10 + n where n are the Kubuntu bugs for that week?23:55
djsiegel1or some weeks we do both23:55
rickspencer3so if we do 2 Kubuntu weeks, that would 20 Kubuntu paper cuts, and 80 Ubuntu paper cuts23:55
djsiegel1I think we should always keep it ten -- I don't want people to think "Ubuntu did 10, Kubuntu got 4, so Ubuntu is 2.5x better"23:55
rickspencer3which would be a *huge* success23:55
djsiegel1yes, that would still be a great success, but I am saying that kubuntu papercut weeks are in addition to ubuntu papercut weeks23:56
rickspencer3so 12 weeks total?23:56
djsiegel1yes, some concurrent23:56
djsiegel112 person-weeks :)23:56
rickspencer3so there would be 20 some week, because it's a "Kubuntu" week23:56
rickspencer3seele: thoughts?23:56
seelerickspencer3: i'm sorry but i did not follow that23:57
djsiegel1so every third week, kubuntu would heal ten papercuts23:57
djsiegel1that week would be a double feature23:57
djsiegel1at the end of the week, we would cover both projects23:57
rickspencer3I am so late to go pick up my daughter!23:57
* rickspencer3 is in big trouble23:57
rickspencer3gots to run23:57
seeleis aurelian a guaranteed resource or no?23:57
=== rickspencer3 is now known as rickspencer3-afk
djsiegel1seele: what does that mean? I am not his manager23:58
seeleaurelian is the canonical kde developer, i'm asking if he would be available to help. if not, i dont know if we could fix 3.3 bugs per week because we don't have that many kde developers involved in kubuntu23:58
seeleRiddell is also possible, but he does more distro stuff i think23:59

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