[05:30] <macvr> anyone knows where the notify-osd logs its notifications ? i'm not able to find it!
[05:38] <macvr> nevermind... :) found it.. 
[07:07] <macvr> Hi... is there a way to subscribe to all the NEW hundered papaercuts as and when they are reported? i'd like to help weed out the new bugs... 
[07:14] <GreySim> I think so macvr, give a moment and I'll confirm and tell you how. Computer's going a bit slow at the moment though, so bear with me please.
[07:14] <macvr> GreySim: np :)
[07:15] <macvr> i think they should re-label the project as "one THOUSAND papercuts" ... ;p
[07:16] <GreySim> macvr: On this page, "Subscribe to bug mail" will give you new bugs, but also all other comments on bugs, I *think*: https://bugs.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/
[07:17] <macvr> GreySim: oh...! i totally overlooked that  option!
[07:17] <macvr> thanx
[07:17] <GreySim> I'm not sure if it will catch the "also affects" bugs assigned either, which would mean it's basically useless for what you want, but it's the closest I know to what you want. I just don't know if it works.
[07:17] <GreySim> Good luck, and hopefully it works. :)
[07:18] <macvr> thanx .... :) i really feel pitty for the Design team... the bugs have reached 1003 !
[07:19] <GreySim> Of which they had confirmed 50 as eligible, last I heard.
[07:19] <GreySim> Anyway, I'm back to lurking and not at this computer for the most part.
[12:08]  * MacSlow -> lunch
[14:08] <macvr> anyone here has knowledge about one hundered papercuts? Is it only for issue that exist in Jaunty or for the older releases also? I see several bugs being posted by users of older releases , when the behavior has been modified in Jaunty
[14:17] <tedg> macvr: I believe that it's really only issues that are in Karmic, but most from Jaunty carry over to Karmic.
[14:18] <lamalex> macvr: if the bug is fixed, then the bug is fixed
[14:18] <lamalex> so if it doesnt exist in jaunty, and is from an old release, then it's fixed
[14:18] <macvr> tedg: there are so many bugs from intrepid users! which makes the project nearly a spam...
[14:19] <tedg> macvr: Yeah, there is some truth to that.  Hopefully, after the initial push it'll attract more serious folks.
[14:19] <macvr> lamalex: not "bugs" , but the feature requests are from intrepid and the users havent upgraded and hence the old behavior is still there! i'v been trying to weed out the papercuts, to make it easier for the devs to focus
[14:19] <tedg> macvr: Initially a lot of projects start that way.
[14:20] <macvr> tedg: ah... papercuts  seesm to attract even more due to its cool name :P
[14:20] <macvr> seems^
[14:22] <tedg> heh
[14:24] <doctormo> hey tedg, how goes the notfication team?
[14:25] <tedg> doctormo: We were doing well, but then everything got queued behind a bunch of Pidgin notifications so we're waiting to find out what happens next.  Another 100 messages or so and I'll know ;)
[14:28] <doctormo> You should have used a "fill the entire screen with text" method, that way everything would get displayed and the user wouldn't be abe to read any of it.
[14:30] <tedg> doctormo: We tried that in user testing, but it turns out we didn't have that many places to hide the bodies after the convulsions stopped :)
[14:32] <lamalex> canonical office isn't tha tbig?
[14:32] <lamalex> can't mark shove them his is space shuttle?
[14:35] <SiDi> lamalex: yeh then we can claim we sent some sattellites over the earth for a secret feature in 12.04 or something like that
[14:35] <SiDi> body-shaped sattellites
[14:36] <doctormo> SiDi: Sattellites, we got enough of those thing already, take the moons for instance.
[14:36] <SiDi> doctormo: the moon isnt a FOSS !
[14:37] <doctormo> Yet! Aim high!
[21:14] <macvr> djsiegel2: hi... there seems to be a lot of bugs piing up.. due to users not understand what papercuts project is actually intended for...
[21:14] <beuno> macvr, yeah, we've been trying to figure out what to do about it
[21:14] <djsiegel2> macvr: yes, I've noticed
[21:14] <beuno> but it seems our hands are kind of tied
[21:15] <djsiegel2> macvr: I will put together a wiki page "What is a paper cut?" but I don't think it will help at all
[21:15] <djsiegel2> people don't want to hear that their pet bug is not a paper cut
[21:15] <djsiegel2> Also, the term "paper cut" is too similar to the term "bug" -- people think that they are the same thing
[21:15] <djsiegel2> we should have called them something like "koala bites"
[21:15] <macvr> Could you list the ayatana project link for the bigger bugs , or a confirmation regarding have you read "what this project is about?" ?
[21:17] <macvr> the list has gone more than 1000 , which makes the really useful bugs to get lost in the plie :(
[21:18] <macvr> djsiegel2: there is a drawback to having awesome names to projects ;p
[21:18] <djsiegel2> we will just have to keep invalidating them
[21:18] <macvr> djsiegel2: some get really angry !
[21:18] <djsiegel2> if we can get 20 people to do 5-a-day :)
[21:18] <djsiegel2> macvr: yeah, I know
[21:19] <beuno> I've been trying to do 10-20 a day
[21:19] <beuno> invalidating
[21:19] <beuno> as djsiegel2 is doing such a good job of validating  :)
[21:20] <beuno> djsiegel2, maybe a blog psot about what is clearly *not* a papercut, and a cry for help in marking invalid bugs?
[21:20] <djsiegel2> beuno: yeah, will do
[21:20] <macvr> djsiegel2: i think you have to stop the new bugs to the project or make sure the submitter reads the intention of the project
[21:20] <djsiegel2> macvr: people cannot be made to understand
[21:20] <beuno> macvr, unfortunetly, we can't do that
[21:20] <beuno> there's no way to shut it off
[21:20] <djsiegel2> the kind of people who cry and throw a fit won't listen
[21:21] <macvr> djsiegel2: stop alteast for the time being... till the present list gets sorted out... other wise it is no use
[21:22] <SiDi> i must say a lot of  general IT sites just spoke about the project without saying what it is
[21:22] <SiDi> a bit like "finally those linux noobs care about usability"
[21:22] <SiDi> so people read that and go report crazy bugs
[21:22] <SiDi> without knowing what a papercut is
[21:23] <djsiegel2> Yeah, a lot of people got linked to it from reddit and digg
[21:23] <djsiegel2> didnt read anything but the word "paper cut"
[21:23] <djsiegel2> signed up for launchpad, reported "my suspend doesn't work"
[21:23] <djsiegel2> then act up when we mark it invalid
[21:24] <djsiegel2> I can't really blame them
[21:24] <djsiegel2> but it created a lot of work for us
[21:24] <macvr> beuno: djsiegel2 i realized Some file multiple bugs, for the same non-papercuts... its been easier to weed out those members and invalidate theirs
[21:24] <beuno> macvr, true
[21:24] <djsiegel2> macvr: yeah, usually when I see someone report 5 bugs in a row, I check it out
[21:25] <macvr> djsiegel2: i really pitty u guys... i got fed up of just half a day of sorting stuff!
[21:26] <beuno> macvr, think of the millions of people you'll make happy
[21:26] <macvr> ;p
[21:26] <beuno> you have to get passed the noise, and remember that croudsourcing has it's costs
[21:27] <macvr> djsiegel2: just noticed that ayatana is accepting for the bigger bug... shall i tag them or only the"official" devs allowed for ayatana tags?
[21:27] <djsiegel2> macvr: even 10 a day would be so helpful
[21:27] <djsiegel2> and get a friend to do some
[21:28] <djsiegel2> macvr: just leave that alone for now
[21:28] <macvr> ok...
[21:28] <djsiegel2> we don't have an official policy on that yet
[21:30] <macvr> djsiegel2: oops i had just recommended it half hr back...> https://bugs.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/390386/comments/10 ... wont hereafter though
[21:30] <SiDi> djsiegel2: macvr for usability non-trivial bugs, we mark incomplete at the moment, right ?
[21:30] <SiDi> Does anyone have preformated answers to explain users why their bug is rejected as a papercut ?
[21:31] <macvr> SiDi: https://lists.launchpad.net/ayatana/msg00408.html
[21:31] <macvr> djsiegel2: SiDi: i would like a pre-formated answer list too
[21:35] <SiDi> maybe there should be a more general "usability-bugs" project
[21:35] <SiDi> and let papercuts be a subset of this one
[21:35] <SiDi> the "most important" and "easiest to fix"
[21:35] <beuno> well, we could use tags eventually
[21:35] <beuno> on the ubuntu project
[21:36] <macvr> beuno: worse part is some reset the status to new! 
[21:37] <beuno> yeah, we can build a nice bot that un-reverts that using launchpadlib
[21:37] <beuno> if it takes up too much of our resources
[21:38] <macvr> Hail to the BOTS :)
[21:39] <beuno> :)
[21:39] <macvr> beuno: do you have any pre-formatted answers?
[21:40] <beuno> macvr, yes
[21:40] <beuno> Thank you for bringing this bug to our attention. Unfortunately a paper cut should be a small usability issue that affects many people and is quick and easy to fix. I'm afraid this bug can't be addressed as part of this project.
[21:40] <beuno> A paper cut is a minor usability annoyance that an average user would encounter on his/her first day of using a new installation of Ubuntu 9.10.
[21:40] <beuno> (that's what I use)
[21:41] <macvr> thanx... :)
[21:41] <macvr> SiDi: ^
[21:42] <SiDi> beuno: cheers
[21:42] <beuno> :)
[21:42] <SiDi> i just posted with another (worse) msg
[21:43] <djsiegel_> sorry, my laptop decided to shutdown instantly
[21:43] <djsiegel_> very scary
[21:44] <SiDi> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/122935
[21:44] <SiDi> this isnt trivial, right ?
[21:44] <macvr> actually it can
[21:45] <macvr> SiDi: its not a bug, pzip does password archives
[21:45] <macvr> p7z
[21:55] <macvr> djsiegel_: could you come up with a bunch of pre-formatted answers , and add a link  to the #ayatana irc topic ? so anyone could quickly and uniformly go through the new bugs?
[21:56] <djsiegel_> macvr: you can just use the one beuno gave, we have been using the same one
[21:56] <djsiegel_> I always add one sentence specific to the bug though
[21:56] <macvr> ok...
[22:09] <macvr> SiDi: .7z password files need p7zip-full package... i'v invalidated the bug
[22:11] <SiDi> macvr: do these pass protected 7z files work out of the box in file-roller's gui when the package is installed ?
[22:11] <macvr> SiDi: yup
[22:11] <macvr> SiDi: i double check just now
[22:11] <macvr> checked^
[22:11] <SiDi> okey
[22:12] <SiDi> then shouldnt that be repackaged in a single 7z package with a more explicit name ,
[22:13] <macvr> SiDi: actually i had not used the password .7z files for a long time , so to make sure i had to find an old file!
[22:15] <macvr> SiDi: p-7zip is a minimal version, doesnt do passwords... while full does
[22:17] <SiDi> macvr: why packaged in two parts ?
[22:17] <SiDi> That has to be answered :]
[22:17] <macvr> i read about that some where long time ago... 
[23:45] <macvr> djsiegel_: if a fix has been rejected in  the main package[firefox] , then could the papercut be change to invalid too?
[23:46] <macvr> I'm considering changing this to invalid > https://bugs.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/387822 as firefox has a wont fix status
[23:47] <macvr> beuno: ^ ? thoughts?
[23:47] <beuno> macvr, agreed
[23:47] <beuno> yes, nuke it
[23:47] <macvr> thanx.. :)
[23:47] <beuno> we have enough problems
[23:47] <beuno> :)