[00:00] <NCommander> what is linuxtag?
[00:00] <ogra_> biggest german linux summit
[00:00] <ogra_> its running since wed. in berlin
[00:00] <ogra_> linuxtag.de
[00:00] <ogra_> runs until sat. evening
[00:00] <NCommander> If that's it
[00:00] <NCommander> I'm going to close the meeting now
[00:01] <lool> I just wanted to ask about work items
[00:01] <NCommander> lool, shoot
[00:01] <lool> Please list work items associated with a spec in its whiteboard
[00:01] <lool> e.g.:
[00:01] <lool> Work items:
[00:01] <lool> need to froozle
[00:01] <lool> implement badle
[00:01] <lool> etc.
[00:01] <NCommander> [action] NCommander to put work items in the desktop (and other specs)
[00:01] <MootBot> ACTION received:  NCommander to put work items in the desktop (and other specs)
[00:01] <lool> Once one is completed, change it to DONE
[00:01] <lool> e.g.
[00:01] <lool> need to froozle: DONE
[00:01] <lool> That's all
[00:02] <NCommander> Alright
[00:02] <NCommander> anything else?
[00:02] <NCommander> going once
[00:02] <NCommander> twice
[00:02]  * ogra_ implements badle if anyone explains what it is
[00:02] <NCommander> O_.;?
[00:02]  * NCommander is suprised davidm_ isn't back
[00:02] <ogra_> he is rocketing or preparing for it
[00:03] <NCommander> That's tomorrow I think
[00:03] <NCommander> I think we've set a record for the longest team meeting for the Mobile team in #ubuntu-meeting
[00:03] <ogra_> shooting is tomorrow ... surely needs a lot preparation
[00:03] <NCommander> ogra, stick an engine in it, stick a plug, push the button
[00:04] <NCommander> Be ready to duct when it returns to Earth
[00:04] <NCommander> That was my experiences with rocketry :-)
[00:04] <ogra_> you underestimate the size of his things :)
[00:04] <NCommander> ogra, so run insead of just dodge :-)?
[00:04] <ogra_> anyway, go close the meeting ...
[00:04] <NCommander> I think we can end this
[00:04] <NCommander> #endmeeting
[00:04] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 18:04.
[00:05] <NCommander> Look, only 4 minutes over!
[00:05] <ogra_> phew
[00:05] <GrueMaster> My experiences always ended badly.  Not a good idea to load a pound of black powder in the nose cone of a model rocket.
[00:05] <plars> (+1 hour)
[00:05] <NCommander> plars, time is relative
[00:05] <NCommander> GrueMaster, that sounds like a Darwin Award nominee if someone died.
[00:05]  * ogra_ takes back everything he said about NCommanders german like accuracy
[00:05] <paulliu> Go to bad for 2hr sleep.
[00:06] <GrueMaster> No deaths.  But I did blow up a rock.  Kind of cool.
[00:06] <ogra_> sleep tight
[00:06] <NCommander> ogra, I was efficent, I broke up what would have taken 3-4 meetings into one
[00:06] <NCommander> ogra, :-)
[00:06] <ogra_> heh
[00:06] <NCommander> all it cost was the European souls
[00:07] <GrueMaster> They have souls?  Oh, yea.  They're not in Austrailia.
[00:07]  * GrueMaster runs
[00:07] <NCommander> GrueMaster, as a rule of thumb, its dangerous to taint the Austraillians.
[00:08] <NCommander> GrueMaster, you might find $VALUED_POSITION in pieces where pieces is greater than 1
[00:08] <GrueMaster> Kind of like tazmanian devils?
[00:08] <NCommander> er
[00:08] <NCommander> *POSSESSION
[15:58]  * pitti waves
[15:58]  * slangasek waves
[15:58]  * mvo waves too
[15:58] <lool> Hey!
[15:59]  * fader also waves.
[15:59]  * apw fades in ...
[15:59]  * leoquant \o/
[15:59] <sbeattie> hey
[16:00] <dendrobates> o/
[16:01] <slangasek> mdz, pgraner, davidm_, Riddell, Hobbsee, ScottK: ping
[16:01] <lool> davidm is on leave todat
[16:01] <ScottK> \o
[16:01] <lool> *today
[16:01] <slangasek> ok
[16:01]  * apw is covering for pgraner 
[16:01]  * mvo is covering for robbie
[16:01]  * ScottK is trying to understand debian-cd atm
[16:02] <slangasek> robbie is traveling today, and cjwatson is off
[16:02] <fader> heno is also traveling today
[16:02] <mdz> slangasek: howdy
[16:02] <slangasek> #startmeeting
[16:02] <MootBot> Meeting started at 10:02. The chair is slangasek.
[16:02] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[16:02] <slangasek> I think that accounts for everyone, then
[16:03] <slangasek> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ReleaseTeam/Meeting/2009-06-26
[16:03] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ReleaseTeam/Meeting/2009-06-26
[16:04] <slangasek> [TOPIC] QA team
[16:04] <MootBot> New Topic:  QA team
[16:04] <slangasek> fader, sbeattie: hi
[16:04] <fader> heno is not available today so I'll update what I can and see if anyone else wants to add anything :)
[16:04] <fader> The QA specs are proceeding quite well; everything is approved and specs are in progress right now.
[16:04] <fader> sbeattie: any news on the apport-adoption spec that should be brought up?
[16:04] <slangasek> (hrm, what's the moin magic for linking to blueprints?)
[16:05] <pitti> UbuntuSpec:foo
[16:05] <slangasek> ta
[16:05] <sbeattie> fader: not that I'm aware of, but heno was driving that.
[16:05] <fader> Right... just wasn't sure if anyone had any additional updates and you seemed like the right guy to ask.
[16:06] <fader> (Anything anyone else wants to add or should I move on to certification testing?)
[16:06] <slangasek> that's a non-archive-touching spec, right?  so no need to dwell on it if you guys don't know status
[16:06] <sbeattie> slangasek: correct, no changes to the archive for that one.
[16:06] <cr3> speaking of blueprints, the live cd testing is currently deployed and in final states of beta: https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/certify-web/+spec/karmic-qa-cert-install-from-live-cd-images
[16:07] <fader> cr3: This is cool... I've seen that we've been getting live cd results \o/
[16:07] <slangasek> excellent :)
[16:07] <ScottK> The ISO tracker falls under QA, right?
[16:07] <slangasek> yes
[16:08] <cr3> slangasek: the desktop images for multiple flavours of ubuntu are being tested on a daily basis: ubuntu, mythbuntu, xubuntu, etc.
[16:08] <ScottK> Unless debian-cd causes my brain to fall out of my head, I think we'll have at least some basic kubuntu-netbook images for Alpha 3.
[16:08] <ScottK> So it'll need to go on the tracker ....
[16:08] <slangasek> [ACTION] slangasek to get kubuntu-netbook added to the ISO tracker
[16:08] <MootBot> ACTION received:  slangasek to get kubuntu-netbook added to the ISO tracker
[16:08] <slangasek> thanks
[16:08] <ScottK> Thank you.
[16:09] <fader> ScottK: Do you have specific test cases for it?
[16:09] <fader> Or can we use the generic Kubuntu ones?
[16:09] <ScottK> fader: It'll start out the same as Kubuntu, except for the install process and we'll evolve from there.
[16:09] <fader> ScottK: Cool, thanks.
[16:09] <ScottK> Start with that.
[16:10] <cr3> ScottK: will the kubuntu-netbook images use d-i and/or casper+ubiquity?
[16:10] <ScottK> slangasek: Would you please add an action for rgreening to document kubuntu-netbook install process for the test cases?
[16:10] <cr3> ScottK: also, will they be usb images or cd imges?
[16:10] <ScottK> cr3: It'll be a casper+ubiquity ISO that we intend be installed via USB.
[16:10] <slangasek> [ACTION] rgreening to document kubuntu-netbook install process for ISO tracker test cases
[16:10] <MootBot> ACTION received:  rgreening to document kubuntu-netbook install process for ISO tracker test cases
[16:10] <ScottK> slangasek: Thanks.
[16:11] <cr3> ScottK: if you could being an actual iso image installable from CD in addition to the USB image, it could be automatically tested
[16:11] <cr3> s/if you could being/if it could be/
[16:11] <ScottK> cr3: Size will be the only issue.  We'll see about that.
[16:11] <cr3> ScottK: DVD is good too
[16:12] <ScottK> It'll fit on a dvd.
[16:12] <cr3> ScottK: feel free to keep me in the loop
[16:12] <fader> ScottK: Size isn't as much of a concern in the automated testing as we just use the ISO image directly rather than burning it to disc
[16:12] <ScottK> fader: Should work just fine then.
[16:13] <fader> Okay, so on the topic of automated testing...
[16:13] <fader> Current karmic coverage: http://people.ubuntu.com/~fader/hw-testing/current.html
[16:13] <fader> There was an issue in the lab preventing the CD images from being downloaded.  cr3 has fixed this and we are pulling images now and should be able to test again once they have completed downloading.
[16:13] <slangasek> [LINK] http://people.ubuntu.com/~fader/hw-testing/current.html
[16:13] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://people.ubuntu.com/~fader/hw-testing/current.html
[16:13] <fader> (This affected only laptop testing, BTW.)
[16:13] <fader> Bug 384861 is still affecting server testing.  It's in 'fix released' but it doesn't look like it's made it into any ISO images yet.
[16:14] <fader> We've also done a large round of 8.04.3 testing: http://people.ubuntu.com/~fader/sru-testing/8.04.3.html
[16:14] <fader> This looked very good -- all 'pass' across the board.
[16:14] <cr3> fader: err, the issue is that we only have a T1 in one of the labs which is being overwhelmed now that we're testing desktop images. that's not going to be fixed until mid-july
[16:14] <fader> sbeattie informs me that we'll need to do another round of testing as the images from 20090624 didn't have hardy-proposed enabled; this should happen automatically once the new images are on cdimages.u.c
[16:15] <fader> cr3: Sorry, I misunderstood.  I thought that the images were not being downloaded for some reason and that you had started the download on Wednesday.  Is the issue that it just takes that long to download them rather than a blockage?
[16:15] <cr3> fader: I wouldn't want to give the impression that we have issues within our control that are preventing images from being tested
[16:15] <cr3> fader: they've been downloading for the whole week
[16:15] <fader> cr3: Okay, I definitely misunderstood then :(
[16:15] <slangasek> fader: hmm, let me check the status of 384861; maybe we need a d-i bump yet
[16:15] <slangasek> no, that's done
[16:16] <slangasek> cr3: in that case, the server ISO testing for certification should surely be given priority?
[16:16] <cr3> slangasek: servers and desktops have been tested, only laptops are affected
[16:16] <fader> slangasek: When looking at http://cdimages.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-server/daily/20090626.1/karmic-server-amd64.list it looks like we have linux-generic_2.6.30.10.10_amd64.deb but the bug says it's fixed in 2.6.30.10.11
[16:17] <slangasek> fader: hrm, it was fixed in the metapackage?
[16:18] <fader> slangasek: To be honest I'm not sure... can we have a quick discussion after the end of the meeting to figure out what's up with it/
[16:18] <fader> ?
[16:18] <slangasek> [ACTION] slangasek to get fader server ISOs including the fix for Bug:384861
[16:18] <MootBot> ACTION received:  slangasek to get fader server ISOs including the fix for Bug:384861
[16:19] <slangasek> fader: yes
[16:19] <fader> Cool, thanks
[16:19] <slangasek> [LINK] http://people.ubuntu.com/~fader/sru-testing/8.04.3.html
[16:19] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://people.ubuntu.com/~fader/sru-testing/8.04.3.html
[16:19] <fader> That's all I've got for certification
[16:20] <slangasek> ah, all passes on 8.04.3 - nice!  Is that testing complete?
[16:20] <slangasek> or are there more boxes to be tested yet?
[16:21] <fader> slangasek: It's complete but sbeattie said that the images did not have hardy-proposed enabled
[16:21] <slangasek> right
[16:21] <fader> So if there are new images we will automatically test them
[16:21] <slangasek> just about to ask that
[16:21] <slangasek> there are
[16:21] <fader> All the hardware tests are complete modulo the laptops (that have not gotten the images yet :( )
[16:21] <slangasek> 20090626 server has -proposed enabled
[16:22] <fader> Okay, these should get automatically tested once the images are synced.
[16:22] <fader> I will update the sru-testing page with the results once they are in.
[16:22] <slangasek> and is syncing of those images blocked on the bandwidth issue?
[16:22] <cr3> slangasek: that might be overwritten by the installation process
[16:22] <fader> slangasek: It's blocked only for laptops.  Servers and desktops are fine.
[16:23] <slangasek> if the desktop ISO testing is causing contention, even just for laptops, then it really needs to be bumped down the list
[16:23] <slangasek> cr3: what might be?
[16:24] <cr3> slangasek: my framework assumes static pockets
[16:25] <slangasek> cr3: if the framework doesn't pull from the -proposed archive included on the CDs, then it's not suitable for point release testing
[16:26] <slangasek> let's move on; cr3: we can discuss this after the meeting?
[16:26] <slangasek> [TOPIC] Desktop team
[16:26] <MootBot> New Topic:  Desktop team
[16:26] <slangasek> pitti, rickspencer3: hi
[16:26] <cr3> slangasek: cdimage testing tests just that, the image. what you are requesting is archive testing which will land during the karmic cycle
[16:26] <pitti> As usual, current status (including RC bugs) is on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus
[16:26] <cr3> slangasek: sure
[16:26] <pitti> == Blueprints ==
[16:26] <pitti> This week we investigated the integration of empathy into main and desktop, which turned out to be much more effort than originally anticipated, so this will land later. Might slip alpha-3
[16:27] <pitti> new gdm is almost ready to land, just needs two bug fixes; will probably happen next week
[16:27] <pitti> == Other status ==
[16:27] <pitti> On the X.org front, things are going rather well. KMS for -intel is now enabled by default, -ati under testing; nouveau is still rather brittle, so it's not yet determined whether it will become the default. Upstream is reasonably responsive to bug reports and providing some patches
[16:27] <pitti> We had a detailled session with the OLS team about which packages they are going to land, how/who to package/MIR, etc.; no blockers here, just an awful lot to do
[16:27] <pitti> RC bugs didn't get a lot of attention, most people are working full steam on the more urgent specs (which make good progress) for now
[16:28] <slangasek> cr3: no, I'm not requesting  archive testing
[16:28] <slangasek> (whee, intel driver freeze)
[16:28] <pitti> ugh; hadn't had one in weeks
[16:28] <slangasek> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus
[16:28] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus
[16:29] <pitti> slangasek: it freezes when you say "intel bug fix" on IRC
[16:29] <slangasek> maybe so :)
[16:30] <pitti> oh, and about an hour ago I discovered that today's dailies didn't build; at all
[16:30] <pitti> no idea why :/
[16:30] <pitti> http://people.ubuntu.com/~ubuntu-archive/livefs-build-logs/karmic/ubuntu/latest/ looks fine
[16:30] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://people.ubuntu.com/~ubuntu-archive/livefs-build-logs/karmic/ubuntu/latest/ looks fine
[16:30] <slangasek> pitti: because according to the report for the past couple of days, ubuntu-desktop isn't installable
[16:31] <pitti> I fixed components and stuff yesterday, so it should actually work now (had been broken for a few days)
[16:31] <slangasek> (I'm guessing)
[16:31] <slangasek> oh
[16:31] <slangasek> we can look at that afterwards, certainly
[16:31] <pitti> oh, hang on, I'm lying
[16:31] <pitti> ubiquity python error -> package inistall failure
[16:31] <pitti> yep
[16:31]  * pitti will report a bug
[16:32] <pitti> so, any questions anyone?
[16:33] <lool> pitti: Can you ping us if you switch default apps?
[16:33] <pitti> lool: okay
[16:33] <lool> We'd like to follow changes in UNR such as default player
[16:33] <pitti> slangasek: bug 392424 FYI
[16:33] <slangasek> ok
[16:34] <slangasek> no other questions here, thanks
[16:34] <slangasek> [TOPIC] Mobile team
[16:34] <MootBot> New Topic:  Mobile team
[16:35] <slangasek> lool: hello
[16:35] <lool> Hey
[16:35] <lool> [link] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileTeam/ReleaseStatus/Karmic this new page lin
[16:35] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileTeam/ReleaseStatus/Karmic this new page lin
[16:35] <lool> ks to our Roadmap overview page and to relevant list of specs, bugs etc.
[16:35] <lool> This week saw a lot of work on specs, planned karmic images/spins are now tracked as real specs, a couple of specs were demoted to drafting, some new specs were added documenting potential future work which isn't fully decided yet.
[16:35] <slangasek> (sorry, still a little slow here, using my backup desktop while trying to get a crash report off this X freeze)
[16:35] <lool> Various bug fixing efforts on mono and thunderbird issues.
[16:35] <lool> Progress on the qemu buildds work which is aimed at A3.
[16:35] <lool> Kernel team reported some progress on Babbage 1 patches; still fighting some boot issues and then will move to Babbage 2.
[16:36] <lool> (I tried to move most things to the above wiki page; this is all I have for a high level summary dumped on IRC)
[16:36] <lool> We also borrowed the Work items thing, are using pm-dashboard; we're stealing good ideas  ;)
[16:36] <slangasek> lool: aimed at A3> but no spec targeted, that I saw?
[16:36] <slangasek> (perhaps it doesn't need one)
[16:36] <lool> slangasek: It's the toolchain one
[16:36] <slangasek> oh
[16:37] <lool> Which covers all we need to move to ARMv7 including buildds
[16:37] <lool> Could have been two specs indeed
[16:37] <lool> The thing is that we were hoping for hardware   :-/
[16:38] <slangasek> right
[16:38] <lool> There are links to specs status and karmic bugs on the page; the milestoned bugs and specs are covered on the page; any question on these?
[16:39] <lool> (I'm happy to work on improving specific areas of the reporting page if you'd like different information/formatting)
[16:39] <slangasek> no questions from me, thanks; the page seems to provide a good summary
[16:40] <slangasek> anyone else have questions?
[16:40] <lool> (NB: I wont be around next week (GUADEC))
[16:40] <slangasek> [TOPIC] Kernel team
[16:40] <MootBot> New Topic:  Kernel team
[16:40] <slangasek> lool: ack (and thanks)
[16:41] <slangasek> apw: hi
[16:41] <apw> hi
[16:41] <apw> Feature status is available here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KernelTeam/ReleaseStatus/Karmic.  Things are generally progressing, the only specs which are not are not release items.  Apparmor patches are being tested currently.  Arm integration is still ongoing.  Kernel  v2.6.31-rc1 has just released and we are hoping for an upload for that this week.
[16:41] <apw> You called out two bugs for the kernel:
[16:42] <apw> Bug:359338: apparmor paths broken when using ecryptfs -- Still waiting on the updated AA patches to be ready, currently being tested. As its not in currently I don't believe anyone can hit this issue.
[16:42] <apw> Bug:290153: Fails to find boot device in Intel D945Gnt -- Investigation progressing slowly, bug appears to be exhibiting in Karmic also.
[16:43] <slangasek> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KernelTeam/ReleaseStatus/Karmic
[16:43] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KernelTeam/ReleaseStatus/Karmic
[16:44] <lool> (I just add a question for bjf/amitk; wanted to check whether they needed for testing / access to some hardware, but I'll check with them out of band)
[16:44] <lool> s/add/had
[16:44] <slangasek> apw: what can we do to make bug #290153 move along faster?
[16:44] <apw> to be frank its been rather ignored, we had thin feedback from the users, and have not chased them more agressivly
[16:45] <slangasek> so currently blocking on user feedback?
[16:45] <apw> i've put that one up on my list for a review, there may be relevant changes in 2.6.31-rc1
[16:45] <ScottK> apw: I have a machine that has that bug.  I can run test kernels on it if needed.
[16:45] <apw> in big part waiting on information yes, but a review today shows some hope of some of the conflated issues being resolved by latest kerenl
[16:46] <apw> ScottK, excellent, i'll put you on my testers list, i think testing the next karmic kernel will be worth doing
[16:46] <ScottK> apw: It's a 'production' machine (my kids' desktop), so I won't upgrade, but I can test a kernel.
[16:46] <ScottK> apw: Just give me a ping.
[16:47] <apw> ScottK, heh thanks
[16:48] <apw> thats it from me
[16:49] <slangasek> ok, thanks
[16:49] <slangasek> anyone else with kernel questions?
[16:50] <slangasek> apw: fwiw, in looking at bug #384890, I think we have an additional kernel bug here affecting ThinkPads - my power button doesn't show any kernel input event at all
[16:50] <slangasek> I'll file a proper bug report 'n'such, but figure I'll throw that out there so y'all are expecting it
[16:51] <apw> slangasek, thanks ... more bugs yay
[16:51] <apw> subscribe me to it pleasae
[16:51] <slangasek> can do
[16:51] <pitti> slangasek: on that note, WDYT about removing all the acpi-suport event scripts and sending out a large call for testing what gets broken?
[16:51] <pitti> to identify the remaining ACPI keys which the kernel doesn't convert into input events early?
[16:51] <pitti> (I don't think that there's too many of them still)
[16:52] <slangasek> pitti: I think we can do a better job of determining which ones are still in use by reading them instead
[16:52] <slangasek> anything that uses acpi_fakekey is broken, we know that; but there are other scripts firing that don't
[16:52] <slangasek> [TOPIC] Foundations team
[16:52] <MootBot> New Topic:  Foundations team
[16:52] <slangasek> mvo: hi
[16:52] <pitti> slangasek: you mean checking kernel sources for the acpi event numbers?
[16:52] <mvo> hi
[16:52] <mvo> Current status: [link]  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FoundationsTeam/ReleaseStatus/Karmic
[16:52] <mvo> Blueprints targeted for alpha3:
[16:52] <mvo>   * Spec:foundations-karmic-usb-creator-for-windows - latest status is that its likely to make it for alpha3
[16:52] <mvo>    * Spec:foundations-karmic-rsyslogd - looks good
[16:52] <mvo>    * Spec:foundations-karmic-i586-support - archive rebuild to get stats in progress (not sure alpha3 is realistic for this)
[16:52] <mvo>    * Spec:foundations-karmic-apturl-policy - improvements for software-properties mostly in place, looks good for alpha3
[16:52] <slangasek> pitti: no, I mean reading the scripts?
[16:52] <mvo>    * Spec:foundations-karmic-robust-python-packaging: not started yet, may not make it for alpha3
[16:52] <mvo>    * Spec:foundations-karmic-upgrade-support-in-landscape: foundations part of the spec (non-interactive upgrade support via update-manager) ready
[16:52] <mvo> There was a boot speed sprint in london this week that went pretty well.
[16:53] <mvo> thats what I have, if you have specific questions I'm happy to answer them
[16:54] <slangasek> i586-support> I'm told the rebuilds have started this week, but that it takes on the order of 2-4 days for each one, so we're looking at next week or the week after before we have any numbers to compare
[16:55] <slangasek> mvo: is a3 still the right target for bug #369820?
[16:55] <slangasek> (should it be assigned to you? :)
[16:56] <mvo> slangasek: yes and yes, I will try to attack it for a3, might slip for a4 but I target a3
[16:56] <slangasek> ok
[16:56] <mvo> the other (#392144 - fixed by pitti, thanks)
[16:56] <mvo> and 364616 targeted for a4 now
[16:57]  * slangasek nods
[16:57] <pitti> mvo: well, it screwed my box entirely :)
[16:57] <pitti> mvo: (but it helped to find out that the Dell support hotline is pretty good :) )
[16:57] <mvo> heh :)
[16:59] <slangasek> anything else from anyone for Foundations?
[17:00] <slangasek> [TOPIC] Server team
[17:00] <MootBot> New Topic:  Server team
[17:00] <slangasek> mvo: thanks
[17:00] <dendrobates>    * Bug:326768: mysqld_safe thinks mysqld has crashed when it hasn't - on target.  Mathiaz is preparing an upload
[17:00] <dendrobates>    * Spec:server-karmic-screen-profiles-popup-info - done
[17:00] <dendrobates>    * Spec:server-karmic-pristine-daily-virt-builds - on target
[17:00] <slangasek> dendrobates: hi
[17:00] <dendrobates>    * Spec:server-karmic-update-motd-inotify - deferred - blocked on work keybuk is doing.
[17:00] <dendrobates>    * Spec:server-karmic-kvm-qemu-packaging - on target - pending peer review.
[17:00] <dendrobates> hi
[17:01] <slangasek> dendrobates: what work is it blocked on?  upstart?
[17:01] <Keybuk> it could be implemented a different way, of ourse
[17:01] <dendrobates> kirkland: can you elaborate?
[17:01] <Keybuk> but that different way seems rather expensive given Upstart will have the required support for karmic+1
[17:01] <slangasek> so it's deferred until Leaping Lizard?
[17:02] <kirkland> Keybuk: we spoke about this at UDS
[17:02] <kirkland> Keybuk: update-motd needs an inotify daemon that can watch a directory
[17:02] <dendrobates> slangasek: that was not my understanding, but this is not an essential feature,.
[17:02] <Keybuk> kirkland: I know ... ;)
[17:02] <kirkland> Keybuk: we have implemented based on such a daemon provided by a package in universe
[17:02] <slangasek> dendrobates: indeed, but the 10-minute cronjob is a nuisance for me when on battery :)
[17:03] <kirkland> Keybuk: we can use that opportunistically, Suggesting the package, or MIR it
[17:03] <dendrobates> slangasek: agreed
[17:03] <kirkland> Keybuk: but rather than MIR that package, I'd rather use Upstart if possible
[17:03] <Keybuk> kirkland: adding yet-another-daemon to the default install just for one release seems a bit wasteful
[17:03] <pitti> or perhaps not have the cronjob on desktop installs?
[17:03] <pitti> server installs are less prone to running on battery, and on desktops it's rather uninteresting
[17:03] <Keybuk> especially something like an inotify daemon, which is going to end up having tracker-like properties
[17:04] <slangasek> we should probably not have detailed design discussions in-band here
[17:04] <kirkland> slangasek: agreed
[17:04] <kirkland> slangasek: i have re-targeted that spec at alpha4
[17:04] <kirkland> slangasek: Keybuk chances upstart might have the feature by alpha4?
[17:04] <slangasek> sounds fine for now
[17:05] <Keybuk> kirkland: zero
[17:05] <Keybuk> kirkland: unless you mean alpha 4 of karmic+1, in which case moderate ;)
[17:05] <kirkland> Keybuk: okay, thanks, i'll proceed with MIR'ing an inotify daemon for now
[17:05] <ScottK> slangasek: Could we make an appointment for Monday for executing a clamav + rdepends backport?  I've got Hardy/Intrepid all ready and will have Dapper by then.
[17:05] <pitti> kirkland: :-(
[17:05] <kirkland> Keybuk: and replace the functionality when upstart comes to term
[17:05] <Keybuk> kirkland: I'd rather we just deferred the spec
[17:06] <Keybuk> kirkland: an inotify daemon is not a trivial thing to consider adding to all our seeds
[17:06] <pitti> for desktops that's overkill
[17:06] <kirkland> Keybuk: i'm okay with that;   dendrobates/slangasek?
[17:06] <slangasek> ScottK: yes, can do
[17:06] <dendrobates> kirkland: agreed
[17:06] <ScottK> slangasek: Great.  I'll ping you then.  What timezone will you be in?
[17:06] <dendrobates> with pitti, that is.
[17:06] <dendrobates> and keybuk
[17:06] <kirkland> slangasek: pitti: like said, we can opportunitistically use an inotify daemon, if installed on the system
[17:07] <slangasek> kirkland: deferral is fine, it means I'll be your ally in nagging Keybuk ;)
[17:07] <slangasek> ScottK: PDT
[17:07] <kirkland> without depending on it
[17:07] <pitti> kirkland: ah, I misunderstood you then; right
[17:07] <kirkland> fall back to the cronjob
[17:07] <Keybuk> slangasek: you're the one who said I couldn't put the new Upstart in after beta ;)
[17:07] <kirkland> rather, continue using the cronjob, unless someone such as slangasek hates that, in which case he installs the suggested inotify package
[17:07] <slangasek> Keybuk: the nagging would only happen for karmic+1, of course. :)
[17:08] <slangasek> kirkland: how is installing that package going to make the cronjob disappear?
[17:08] <slangasek> I hate the cronjob because it's a cronjob that fires every 10 minutes - making it a no-op cronjob doesn't change the synchronous log writes :)
[17:08] <kirkland> slangasek: haven't thought about that yet;  right now, it just additionally uses inotifyd if available
[17:08] <kirkland> slangasek: that's a bug in the pam logger IMHO
[17:09] <Keybuk> kirkland: which daemon are you using?
[17:09]  * kirkland suggests design discussions ---> #ubuntu-devel
[17:09] <kirkland> Keybuk: iwatch
[17:09] <kirkland> Keybuk: but we've toyed with several
[17:10] <slangasek> anything else for server team?
[17:11] <dendrobates> nope
[17:11] <slangasek> [TOPIC] MOTU
[17:11] <MootBot> New Topic:  MOTU
[17:11] <slangasek> ScottK: hello
[17:11]  * ScottK waves.
[17:11] <ScottK> No major MOTU news.
[17:12] <ScottK> We're rolling along wishing there were more people to get stuff done as usual.
[17:12] <ScottK> In Kubuntu news we are working on packaging KDE 4.3 RC 1 right now.
[17:13] <slangasek> who's signed on for motu-release for this cycle?
[17:13] <ScottK> 4.3.whatever is ready is our target for Karmic
[17:13] <ScottK> slangasek: IIRC the team is unchanged from the last cycle.
[17:13] <slangasek> ok
[17:14] <ScottK> I do have a debian-cd branch I'd like feedback on for kubuntu-netbook. lp:~kitterman/+junk/kne-debian-cd
[17:14] <ScottK> I gave up on trying to understand debian-cd and went with the cargo cult approach. so it may be completely off base.
[17:14] <ScottK> slangasek: At some point we need to discuss post archive-reorg release team structure.
[17:15] <ScottK> I think that's about it.
[17:15] <slangasek> [ACTION] slangasek, cjwatson? to review lp:~kitterman/+junk/kne-debian-cd
[17:15] <MootBot> ACTION received:  slangasek, cjwatson? to review lp:~kitterman/+junk/kne-debian-cd
[17:15] <ScottK> Thanks.
[17:15] <slangasek> sounds good then
[17:15] <lool> I guess crontab of whatever sets project needs to be changed as well, but looked okay from a quick look
[17:16] <ScottK> lool: Thanks.
[17:17] <slangasek> [TOPIC] AOB
[17:17] <MootBot> New Topic:  AOB
[17:17] <ScottK> slangasek: As far as I understand the process, I think once that's pushed we should be ready to roll iso's for kubuntu-netbook (at least the externally visible bits)
[17:17] <slangasek> ScottK: should be; I'll have a closer look later today, anyway
[17:17] <slangasek> anything else to discuss today?
[17:17] <ScottK> Thanks.
[17:18] <slangasek> I don't have anything to say about ISO sizes today that wouldn't be entirely repeating myself
[17:18] <lool> I think I saved some small space by dropping sg3-utils
[17:18] <lool> But that's negligible I guess
[17:19] <lool> Looks like we're done!
[17:21] <slangasek> #endmeeting
[17:21] <slangasek> thanks, folks
[17:21] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 11:21.
[17:21] <slangasek> hrm
[17:21]  * slangasek pokes MootBot 
[17:21] <slangasek> #endmeeting
[17:21] <slangasek> there we are :)
[17:21]  * ScottK runs off to do $WORK
[17:21] <lool> Cheers all
[17:21] <pitti> thanks all
[17:21]  * mvo waves