=== GreySim is now known as AwaySim === GreySim_ is now known as GreySim [12:16] * MacSlow -> lunch === MacSlow is now known as MacSlow|lunch === lex79 is now known as lex === lex is now known as lex79 === MacSlow|lunch is now known as MacSlow === SiDi_ is now known as SiDi [15:42] MacSlow: thanx for clearing that up :) ... [didnt want to spam the lp] [15:43] macvr, np... that's what we're here for too [15:44] "gardening" bug-reports is just such a tedious work, as most of the time people don't care looking for duplicates at all and just ram everything into lp no matter what [15:45] I usually have gardening-sprees every now and then [15:45] i'v been doing it for the papercuts ...! otherwise the real ones wont get noticed [15:46] macvr, yeah the papercuts... overall a good idea... but even that generated some amount of "spam" [15:47] oh my god ... is has so many rants , that when i invalidate one person has sent me personal mail! via the contact user link! [15:48] jono, hey... new to see you here :) [15:49] hey MacSlow, I always join here :) [15:49] macvr, hehe... yeah ... sometimes I wish we had a "slap"-button on lp ;) [15:49] +1^ [15:50] MacSlow: the reason why i thought that notify-osd 'had to allow' this extra notification> i thought it had strict rules as to what uses the notify daemon... my bad! [15:51] macvr, oh no... every app can send notifications vis DBus using libnotify [15:52] only no formatting :( [15:53] yeah... please no text-layout system in notify-osd [15:53] djsiegel_: might wanna add this to a milestone > https://bugs.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/392292 [15:54] macvr: so, we've collected a lot of great paper cuts since we made the first list of 100 [15:54] Since several of you are involved in XDG stuff, I'm curious for your take on http://aseigo.blogspot.com/2009/06/saving-freedesktoporg-together.html [15:54] a lot of them are more "paper-cuty" that our first 100 [15:55] if you find ones that look very paper-cut-y, let me know and I can swap them in [15:55] djsiegel_: the above is a real misleading one [15:55] yeah [15:56] djsiegel_: so the 100 has been reached? [15:56] macvr: https://edge.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/karmic (tentative list) [15:57] some are too hard to be paper cuts, we will discover [15:57] so we will need to swap them with better confirmed paper cuts [15:58] djsiegel_: oh well... i can slow down on the pruning :) [15:58] no, don't! [15:58] :) [15:58] we need the pruning more than ever [15:59] will do as much as i can :) [16:00] I'll notify you of any interesting finds, which could be swaped for the invalids in Karmic [16:13] macvr: ok, I scheduled the tooltip one you just pointed out in this week [16:31] :) [16:34] MacSlow: has there been any change in the font size in notify-osd ? [16:34] it looks _really_ little with the bzr trunk branch [16:35] I've implemented exactely what the design folks wanted now [16:37] ah [16:38] well the design folks should discuss with the accessibility ones, because im 20, my eyes aint bad, and i have trouble reading them :p [16:39] i'll report a bug :) [17:04] https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/dx-karmic-notify-osd/ i wanted to discuss about this blueprint specifically the section about consistent feedback for multimedia keys [17:04] does this mean that each time i press play, forward, etc a notification saying play, forward will appear? [17:06] if so then it will be useless and the correct way would be that banshee upon clicking play puts a notification of the song being played <--- and this is a bug on banshee bugzilla which is being/has been fixed and now if we give notification for play key. then each time i hit play there will be two notifications one for play key and one from banshee [17:06] am i wrong in interpreting this blueprint? [17:10] tgpraveen: i think it should be app-side too [17:21] SiDi: yes. are you in ayatana team/ [17:21] ? [17:23] tgpraveen: SiDi manages a lot more ;p [17:23] tgpraveen: i'm in ayatana discussion ML but i'm not working for Canonical [17:23] he is everywhere , omnipresent [17:23] macvr: c'mon.. never more than ten channels [17:24] SiDi: well... ten is a lot ;p [17:25] oh ok cool [17:25] should i mail this to the mailing list? [17:26] tgpraveen: you can [17:32] do i have to join the mailing list to send a mail? also what is the link to join if i have to [17:32] ? [17:39] tgpraveen: the subscribe link is here > https://launchpad.net/~ayatana === rickspencer3 is now known as rickspencer3-afk [20:27] danrabbit: I think the open icon is a bit confusing [20:27] please elaborate :p [20:28] danrabbit: maybe something that looks more like the regular folder icon, but sort of being peeled open? [20:28] like the front-right corner is being pulled forward and left, and there is a document in the folder [20:28] maybe the document is coming up, out of the folder [20:29] I was trying to get away from the document thing... but I'll play with it === GreySim is now known as GreenSim === GreenSim is now known as GreySim [20:30] danrabbit: did you revert the trash icon? [20:31] to the original? [20:31] from Human? [20:31] no... [20:31] I thought you changed it to a more recycle bin type thing [20:32] danrabbit: the desktop icon is great [20:32] what about stylizing the panel icons, any more thoughts on that? [20:35] Well, the big problem is this: [20:35] USers [20:35] :D === rickspencer3-afk is now known as rickspencer3 [20:36] If i knew for a fact that the panel was going to be one color and one color only or at least within a certain range of colors then it would be easy [20:36] for example: we could do some color monochrome stuff like Leopard [20:36] or make the icons look etched into the panel [20:36] but, as soon as the user changes the color of the panel [20:36] :( [20:38] Depending on what you're talking about, there may also be the issue of people deleting one or both panels, or otherwise rearranging them. [20:40] danrabbit: please dont worry about panels changing color [20:40] Are you sure? [21:18] danrabbit: just out of curiosity... what icon set were you guys talking about? [21:18] Humanity [21:18] DBO, macvr, what do you think of this one: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/393606 [21:19] * macvr checks [21:19] Install Applications... is not exactly accurate either [21:20] Manage Packages... is more accurate but much less friendly... [21:20] yeah, I am thinking of really novice users [21:20] we can't teach them what a package is... [21:20] right [21:20] they are looking for "programs" and "applications" [21:20] or maybe "apps" and even "widgets" [21:20] I think programs is a better word than applications [21:21] but the menu is "Applications" [21:21] Ah true [21:21] that could look like a glaring error [21:21] even though you could be right [21:21] the menu should be Programs =P [21:21] :) [21:21] seriously, Programs is a much more specific word than Applications [21:21] djsiegel: Maybe > "Add/ Remove Applications " [21:22] thats too long [21:22] ah! [21:22] it will stretch the menu [21:22] Manage Apps [21:22] yeah, I just don't know if users actually remove apps [21:22] admittedly i18n will throw a kink in that anyhow [21:22] +1 [21:22] Browse applications... [21:22] that's very web 2.0 [21:22] very AppStore :) [21:23] thats a good way to put it [21:23] i like danrabbit's Manage Apps [21:23] Manage is a bad word [21:23] "Manage" makes me think i am only dealing with installed apps [21:23] Sounds too much like work. [21:23] it implies some kind of administrative functionality beyond a simple installation [21:23] Yea, now that I think about it I don't like Manage either [21:23] like moving them around [21:24] I do use that tool to remove apps. [21:25] me too [21:25] im not sure its good but "Find Applications..." or "Search Applications..." [21:25] Find might work [21:25] * GreySim never uses Synaptic. Add/Remove for browsing upon a fresh installation, then apt-get directly for specific needs. [21:26] Then Add/Remove again for stuff I was just trying, but didn't like, so now want to remove. [21:26] GreySim, thats because you know terminal [21:26] I love how half of this channel is from gnome-do [21:26] i think "Find Applications..." or "Browse Applications..." work best in this situation [21:26] Add/Remove is very windows control panel [21:27] DBO: Right, I'm just saying, I'm theoretically a "power user", but I do use and like the Add/Remove tool. I'm not sure if I was really trying to make a point otherwise though... [21:27] and if you think back to that you end up remembering that only dealt with already installed apps [21:28] also, you have to install apps before you remove them [21:28] djsiegel: oh this isn't #gnome-do? [21:28] * danrabbit looks at the tab... [21:28] you would learn that apps can be removed after looking through the app the first time [21:28] hopefully... [21:28] " App Janitor" :P [21:28] lol [21:28] macvr: that makes me think of urinal cakes [21:28] djsiegel, I think you would get that, the checkboxes make it pretty clear [21:29] Get Apps [21:29] I think checkboxes are really great for plugins (in Do), but it's kind of weird in Add/Remove [21:29] of course there are about 100 design issues inside the add remove thingie [21:29] it's like a watered down synaptic [21:29] then you "apply" the change of adding a new app? [21:29] weird [21:29] "Canonical-maintained Applications" -- why the fuck is Canonical? [21:29] yea, it is weird.. [21:29] mpt: hurry up on that AppBrowser thingy [21:30] and there should be an Install button or a remove button if its already installed [21:30] yeah [21:30] " +/- Applications " with a tooltip? [21:30] no [21:30] AH! [21:30] no 'syntax' [21:30] i'm really on a bad roll! [21:31] That's one thing I dislike about "Add/Remove" -- it's like a regex with that '/' [21:31] mpt: we could really benefit from your thoughts on https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/393606 [21:31] well the problem is the / is replacing what should be a UI element but doing so with text [21:31] I've always hated that when you see foo/bar [21:32] or my favorite [foo|bar] [21:33] CLiCK HeRe To iNSTaLL L33T PRoGRaM$ !!!11!! [21:33] "Manage applications" or "App manager" [21:33] That's what I said [21:33] danrabbit: the preferences icon is a bit squat, it looks like it sits 4-5px below the system monitor icon, for example [21:34] oops! [21:34] djsiegel, one more that bugs me about the add/remove manager... the popularity stars are easily mistaken for quality... [21:34] if you guys think of good suggestions, add them to the bug descriptions [21:34] djsiegel, It's vertically centered [21:34] danrabbit: yes, I know [21:35] It's looks funny taller, like the Do icon. [21:35] I was thinking of scraping it for just the tools [21:36] * macvr thinks he is in the wrong room, checks again to make sure this isnt Gnome DO [21:36] I think someone already suggested this, or similar, but, "Application Browser" [21:36] Except that doesn't imply installing. So nevermind. [21:37] djsiegel: "App Administrator" [21:37] no i take it back!" [21:38] * macvr needs to get some rest! [21:39] Make it two entries, possibly using the same tool in two different modes or something. "Get more applications" and "Remove applications". [21:47] did anyone took a look at this http://spuriousinterrupt.org/projects/xfce4-notifyd ? [21:48] gus_: seem to be still in v0.1 since nov 08! [21:48] seems^ [21:49] well i dont trust that much in version numbers :P [21:50] not being updated is kinda , the devs cant dedicate more time on it [21:54] yeah, it seems xfce has few devels and thing go slow, but well..... [22:00] danrabbit: ping [22:00] kallepersson danrabbit kwwii: ok, we're here [22:00] kallepersson: :D [22:00] danrabbit: what's up? [22:01] no much, you? [22:01] just had a chat with djsiegel [22:01] I'd like to help out [22:01] sweet [22:03] danrabbit: I checked out the icon theme. What is the reason for the extension having text in icons? [22:04] in Mimes? [22:05] I mean, it's good info for us nerds (when we don't check the file name), but regular people just don't (shouldn't) care [22:05] (*shouldn't need to) [22:05] yes, mime [22:05] I can see the logic behind that [22:05] I like the difference between binary, regular text and code documents though. GNOME-Icon-Theme doesn't do that [22:07] I think the one's that I did like that were mostly programming languages and that [22:07] I did it for DO [22:07] aha, Isee [22:08] want to join this team: https://launchpad.net/~elementaryicons === jono_ is now known as jono [22:26] gus_: i dont think xfnotifyd is a big priority for them :) but the panel / file manager progress very very fast ;) [22:27] SiDi, you might be right, as is it now it has some features that notify-osd dosent even have, like placing notifications in different positions, and lack other but it's just 3k lines of code [22:33] djsiegel: wasnt there talk of merging all the different locations where a user installs programs?[Add/remove , Synaptic ] , I think mpt 's App centre idea is for that... so then removing the Add/remove is better , right? === rickspencer3 is now known as rickspencer3-afk [22:33] yes, that's mpt's domain, but it's not going into Karmic as far as I know [22:34] djsiegel: you might wanna check , he was quite sure App centre is going to be in Karmic [22:34] oh, ok [22:34] it was discussed at UDS, you're right [23:46] macvr: you should blog about your hundredpapercuts strategy to get more people helping [23:46] macvr: we are running low on confirmed paper cuts