[00:00] <bodhi_zazen> 'lo everyone
[00:00] <nhandler> Hey bodhi_zazen
[00:00] <bodhi_zazen> who is here for the meeting ?
[00:00] <nhandler> o/
[00:00] <Ash_R> o/
[00:00] <Joeb454> o/
[00:00] <pleia2> o/
[00:00] <drs305> o/
[00:01] <bodhi_zazen> .startmeeting
[00:01] <bodhi_zazen> #startmeeting
[00:01] <MootBot> Meeting started at 18:01. The chair is bodhi_zazen.
[00:01] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[00:01] <nhandler> Agenda: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Meetings
[00:01] <nhandler> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Meetings
[00:01] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Meetings
[00:01] <bodhi_zazen> yipee
[00:02] <bodhi_zazen> you want to do agenda items first ?
[00:02] <nhandler> Sure bodhi_zazen, but can we move the first item until the end of the agenda? It will require a little discussion
[00:03] <bodhi_zazen> oops ...
[00:03] <bodhi_zazen> sure
[00:03] <bodhi_zazen> [TOPIC] Transition from ## to #
[00:03] <MootBot> New Topic:  Transition from ## to #
[00:03] <nhandler> Currently, we have our FG channels using the naming scheme ##beginners-foo
[00:03] <bodhi_zazen> you are up nhandler
[00:04] <nhandler> As they are part of our team, they should really use #ubuntu-beginners-foo
[00:04] <bodhi_zazen> +1
[00:04] <swoody> +1 nhandler
[00:04] <nhandler> I have talked with Pricey, and there is no Freenode/Ubuntu IRC policy prohibiting this
[00:04] <bodhi_zazen> just for a little history, if I recall long ago we did just this and were asked to move to ##
[00:04] <bodhi_zazen> so I do not mind moving back
[00:04] <nhandler> It will make it clear to other users that the FG channels are in the Ubuntu namespace, and all Ubuntu rules apply in there
[00:05] <bodhi_zazen> we will have to update the wiki - AGAIN - lol
[00:05] <nhandler> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IrcTeam/MovingChannels
[00:05] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IrcTeam/MovingChannels
[00:05] <Ash_R> At least rocket won't find out until after the holiday.
[00:05] <bodhi_zazen> I will move -council
[00:05] <nhandler> That wiki page explains how to move the channels
[00:05] <nhandler> I would like to ask all FG leaders to move their own channel (if the vote passes)
[00:05] <Joeb454> I think it's probably for the best, as you say, makes it clear what the channels are
[00:05] <bodhi_zazen> do you want to vote on this ?
[00:06] <nhandler> I think we should bodhi_zazen
[00:06] <Joeb454> that said - I think the channel names could become very long
[00:06] <bodhi_zazen> LOL nhandler
[00:06] <bodhi_zazen> [VOTE] move to #
[00:06] <MootBot> Please vote on:  move to #.
[00:06] <MootBot> Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0  to MootBot
[00:06] <MootBot> E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #ubuntu-meeting
[00:06] <nhandler> +1
[00:06] <MootBot> +1 received from nhandler. 1 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 1
[00:06] <bodhi_zazen> +1
[00:06] <MootBot> +1 received from bodhi_zazen. 2 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 2
[00:06] <drs305> +1
[00:06] <sdennie> 0
[00:06] <MootBot> +1 received from drs305. 3 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 3
[00:06] <swoody> +1
[00:06] <MootBot> +1 received from swoody. 4 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 4
[00:06] <Ash_R> +1
[00:06] <MootBot> +1 received from Ash_R. 5 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 5
[00:06] <Joeb454> +1
[00:06] <MootBot> +1 received from Joeb454. 6 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 6
[00:06] <w4ett> +1
[00:06] <MootBot> +1 received from w4ett. 7 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 7
[00:07] <bodhi_zazen> any mor evotes ?
[00:07] <sdennie> Huh.  Apparently 0 doesn't mean abstained
[00:07] <nhandler> sdennie: +0
[00:07] <sdennie> +0
[00:07] <MootBot> Abstention received from sdennie. 7 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 7
[00:07] <bodhi_zazen> [ENDVOTE]
[00:07] <MootBot> Final result is 7 for, 0 against. 1 abstained. Total: 7
[00:07] <bodhi_zazen> [AGREED]Move to #
[00:07] <MootBot> AGREED received: Move to #
[00:07] <bodhi_zazen> :)
[00:08] <nhandler> bodhi_zazen: So you will move -council, and FG leads will move their own channels, correct?
[00:08] <bodhi_zazen> [TOPIC] Council members and Focus Group Leaders should sign Leadership Code of Conduct
[00:08] <MootBot> New Topic:  Council members and Focus Group Leaders should sign Leadership Code of Conduct
[00:08] <bodhi_zazen> yes nhandler
[00:08] <nhandler> [LINK] http://www.ubuntu.com/community/leadership-conduct
[00:08] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://www.ubuntu.com/community/leadership-conduct
[00:08] <Joeb454> there's a leadership CoC? lol
[00:08] <nhandler> The Leadership Code of Conduct holds leaders in the Ubuntu community to a higher standard than the normal Code of Conduct. As Council members and Focus Group leaders are leaders on an official Ubuntu team, I feel that it is important that all members sign the Leadership Code of Conduct in addition to the standard Code of Conduct (which they already should have signed). As Launchpad currently does not offer a place to upload signed copies
[00:08]  * Joeb454 takes a few mins to read the link
[00:09] <bodhi_zazen> any commnets on that ?
[00:09] <bodhi_zazen> I already signed so pfft :)
[00:09] <Saj0577> dont start vote reading time please :D
[00:09] <Joeb454> well I think it's fair, though it probably means I need another key, and I'll have to be reminded how to sign things =/
[00:09] <Ash_R> i think its a good idea
[00:09] <bodhi_zazen> how would you have them sign it nhandler
[00:10] <nhandler> bodhi_zazen: The same way as the normal CoC is signed (GPG Clearsign). We would then email it to the -council mailing list, and possibly CC the full team list (if desired)
[00:10] <bodhi_zazen> LP does the CoC, does it do the Leadership CoC as well ?
[00:10] <nhandler> No
[00:10] <nhandler> That is why I proposed emailing it to the list
[00:10] <bodhi_zazen> Well, it it is not tracked in LP, I do not want to track it either :)
[00:11] <bodhi_zazen> I think a signed CoC on LP and awareness of the Leadersip CoC is sufficient
[00:11] <Ash_R> can we not push for it to be tracked through launchpad?
[00:11] <sdennie> I tend to agree with bodhi_zazen on this.  If it's a haphazard method of tracking, it doesn't mean much.
[00:11] <w4ett> bodhi_zazen:  +1
[00:12] <bodhi_zazen> nhandler: do any other team require a signed leadership CoC ?
[00:13] <pleia2> no, but there is a LP bug about it
[00:13] <pleia2> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu-community/+bug/392976
[00:13] <pleia2> mentions that it probably should be :)
[00:13] <sdennie> Maybe we should bring the subject up again if/when the bug is fixed
[00:14] <bodhi_zazen> +1 sdennie
[00:14] <Ash_R> +1 sdennie
[00:14] <bodhi_zazen> and perhaps we should nudge the bug trackers :)
[00:14] <pleia2> it's a brand new bug
[00:14] <pleia2> only 3 days old
[00:14] <bodhi_zazen> any other comments b4 we vote ?
[00:15] <Saj0577> I think it is a good idea so why not set the example in saying we should sign it?
[00:15] <nhandler> Just because it is not tracked on LP is no reason not to hold our team leaders to it
[00:15] <swoody> +1 nhandler
[00:15] <Saj0577> agreed.
[00:15] <Ash_R> i agree also
[00:15] <Joeb454> I'm sort of mid-field on this one
[00:15] <sdennie> Saj0577: Do you plan to get my public key and verify that the stuff at the bottom of my signature is indeed a signature and not just random characters?
[00:15] <swoody> I think it would be a great show if we take the initiative and start a push ourselves
[00:16] <bodhi_zazen> holding team leaders to it and gpg signing it are separate though
[00:16] <Joeb454> I agree that team leaders should be aware of it, and have read it (I've just finished reading) - but there's no way to see if they have done that
[00:16] <bodhi_zazen> gpg signing means we need a way to track
[00:16] <sdennie> bodhi_zazen: Right.  Holding team leaders to it is fine in my opinion
[00:16] <nhandler> bodhi_zazen: If they have not signed it, they never really agreed to follow it
[00:16] <Ash_R> i have been aware of it for a while.  never seen it mentioned anywhere else though
[00:16] <nhandler> bodhi_zazen: If we have a signed copy of it on the ML, we can track it ;)
[00:16] <bodhi_zazen> it does not really matter if they agree nhandler , we will hold them to it anyways, lol
[00:17] <Ash_R> then that is holding them to something they did not agree to bodhi_zazen
[00:17] <bodhi_zazen> indeed Ash_R
[00:17] <Saj0577> Ash_R but if they got an objection too it do we really want them as a team leader?
[00:18] <nhandler> The Leadership CoC is more of a formality. I doubt that any of our current leaders will be violating it (even if unsigned)
[00:18] <bodhi_zazen> I do not think it is unreasonable to hold "leaders" to a higher standard
[00:18] <bodhi_zazen> and that is the other issue nhandler
[00:18] <Ash_R> Saj0577,  having seen the terms they would have had opportunity to back out
[00:18] <cprofitt> is there even a way to sign it nhandler ?
[00:18] <nhandler> cprofitt: GPG clearsign
[00:18] <swoody> I think we should implement it with all new team leads. Sort of like a EULA where they have to accept to abide by the code to become a lead in the first place.
[00:18] <sdennie> I really don't see this as an issue.  The Leadership CoC is common sense stuff.  I'd be happy to sign it if there were an official way to track it.  There isn't so, I'm not sure what good signing it will do.
[00:18] <bodhi_zazen> people who violate the principles generally are not in leadership positions
[00:19] <pleia2> On the CoC page: "In addition to this Code of Conduct, we hold our community leaders (such as IRC operators, Forums staff, team leaders and LoCo coordinators) to an even higher standard which is documented in the Leadership Code of Conduct."
[00:19] <pleia2> so in theory, leaders *are* bound by it already
[00:19] <cprofitt> nhandler, but is there a 'process' as there is for the CoC?
[00:19] <bodhi_zazen> +1 pleia2
[00:19] <Joeb454> pleia2: it does? damn...I'm in 3 of those categories ;)
[00:19] <nhandler> cprofitt: The 'process' for the normal CoC is mainly to get it to show up on LP. All we would do is GPG clearsign it and email it to the mailing list (which is publicly accessible)
[00:20] <Joeb454> but you do have a good point there
[00:20] <bodhi_zazen> I think people in leadership are bound by the principles and we should ask them to file a signed CoC on LP
[00:20] <sdennie> nhandler: But, as I said, is anyone going to go to the trouble to see if it's actually signed or just has a bunch of random characters at the bottom?
[00:20] <bodhi_zazen> in addition when LP is able to track a Leadership CoC , add it in
[00:20] <cprofitt> nhandler, who would record that it had been signed? When it is modified who would send out a notice to re-sign it? If I change my gpg would I have to resign it?
[00:20] <sdennie> I agree with bodhi_zazen
[00:20] <nhandler> sdennie: I would have no issue verifying all of the signatures
[00:21] <bodhi_zazen> a signed CoC essentially includes the leadership clauses, IMO
[00:21] <cprofitt> bodhi_zazen, +1
[00:21] <cprofitt> unless there is a way to track it... I think it is likely more 'trouble' than it is worth
[00:21] <sdennie> I say shelve the issue or vote on it.  We are just talking in circles.
[00:21] <cprofitt> certainly if a leader violates it they should be questioned by the remaining leaders
[00:21] <nhandler> Most of that 'tracking' stuff you were asking about cprofitt isn't even available for the normal CoC
[00:21] <nhandler> The Leadership CoC should also remain relatively stable
[00:22] <cprofitt> nhandler, then I see no value in signatures...
[00:22] <bodhi_zazen> [Vote] Leaders gpg sign Leadership CoC
[00:22] <MootBot> Please vote on:  Leaders gpg sign Leadership CoC.
[00:22] <MootBot> Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0  to MootBot
[00:22] <MootBot> E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #ubuntu-meeting
[00:22] <sdennie> -1
[00:22] <cprofitt> leaders by default agree to it
[00:22] <MootBot> -1 received from sdennie. 0 for, 1 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now -1
[00:22] <bodhi_zazen> -1
[00:22] <MootBot> -1 received from bodhi_zazen. 0 for, 2 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now -2
[00:22] <cprofitt> -1
[00:22] <MootBot> -1 received from cprofitt. 0 for, 3 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now -3
[00:22] <drs305> +0
[00:22] <MootBot> Abstention received from drs305. 0 for, 3 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now -3
[00:22] <Saj0577> -1
[00:22] <MootBot> -1 received from Saj0577. 0 for, 4 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now -4
[00:22] <duanedesign> +0
[00:22] <swoody> -1
[00:22] <MootBot> Abstention received from duanedesign. 0 for, 4 against. 2 have abstained. Count is now -4
[00:22] <MootBot> -1 received from swoody. 0 for, 5 against. 2 have abstained. Count is now -5
[00:22] <w4ett> +0
[00:22] <Ash_R> -1
[00:22] <MootBot> Abstention received from w4ett. 0 for, 5 against. 3 have abstained. Count is now -5
[00:22] <MootBot> -1 received from Ash_R. 0 for, 6 against. 3 have abstained. Count is now -6
[00:22] <nhandler> +1
[00:22] <MootBot> +1 received from nhandler. 1 for, 6 against. 3 have abstained. Count is now -5
[00:22] <Joeb454> +0
[00:22] <MootBot> Abstention received from Joeb454. 1 for, 6 against. 4 have abstained. Count is now -5
[00:23] <bodhi_zazen> any other votes
[00:23] <cprofitt> three times for Robert's Rules bodhi_zazen
[00:23] <Ash_R> we seem to be short on numbers.
[00:24] <cprofitt> pain, but the process
[00:24] <bodhi_zazen> [ENDVOTE]
[00:24] <MootBot> Final result is 1 for, 6 against. 4 abstained. Total: -5
[00:24] <bodhi_zazen> [VOTE]Bring issue up when we can track the document on LP
[00:24] <MootBot> Please vote on: Bring issue up when we can track the document on LP.
[00:24] <MootBot> Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0  to MootBot
[00:24] <MootBot> E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #ubuntu-meeting
[00:24] <bodhi_zazen> +1
[00:24] <MootBot> +1 received from bodhi_zazen. 1 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 1
[00:24] <nhandler> +1
[00:24] <MootBot> +1 received from nhandler. 2 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 2
[00:24] <Ash_R> +1
[00:24] <MootBot> +1 received from Ash_R. 3 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 3
[00:24] <swoody> +1
[00:24] <MootBot> +1 received from swoody. 4 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 4
[00:24] <sdennie> +1
[00:24] <MootBot> +1 received from sdennie. 5 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 5
[00:24] <w4ett> +1
[00:25] <MootBot> +1 received from w4ett. 6 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 6
[00:25] <Saj0577> +1
[00:25] <cprofitt> +0
[00:25] <MootBot> +1 received from Saj0577. 7 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 7
[00:25] <MootBot> Abstention received from cprofitt. 7 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 7
[00:25] <Joeb454> +0
[00:25] <MootBot> Abstention received from Joeb454. 7 for, 0 against. 2 have abstained. Count is now 7
[00:25] <duanedesign> +0
[00:25] <MootBot> Abstention received from duanedesign. 7 for, 0 against. 3 have abstained. Count is now 7
[00:25] <drs305> +1
[00:25] <MootBot> +1 received from drs305. 8 for, 0 against. 3 have abstained. Count is now 8
[00:25] <bodhi_zazen> any mor evotes ?
[00:25] <bodhi_zazen> [ENDVOTE]
[00:25] <MootBot> Final result is 8 for, 0 against. 3 abstained. Total: 8
[00:26] <bodhi_zazen> [ACTION]Bring the issue of Leaders signing Leadership CoC when we can track it on LP
[00:26] <MootBot> ACTION received: Bring the issue of Leaders signing Leadership CoC when we can track it on LP
[00:26] <bodhi_zazen> [TOPIC]Get rid of Jedi Fellows
[00:26] <MootBot> New Topic: Get rid of Jedi Fellows
[00:26] <nhandler> bodhi_zazen: Would you (or another council member) like to give a status update of the charter now?
[00:27] <bodhi_zazen> REMINDER 30 min left :)
[00:27] <bodhi_zazen> nhandler:
[00:27] <bodhi_zazen> nhandler: do you want to table your agenda item ?
[00:27] <nhandler> I guess we can do it now (and the status update after)
[00:27] <bodhi_zazen> Well, I do not see charter on the agenda
[00:27] <sdennie> I talked with nhandler about this topic but, I don't think getting rid of the Jedi Fellows is needed
[00:28] <nhandler> A Jedi Fellow is a Beginners Team member who is also an Ubuntu member. This grants no special powers/privileges, and is designed to encourage Beginners Team members to become Ubuntu members. I do not think that we should be encouraging people to become Ubuntu members in order to be listed as a Jedi Fellow.
[00:28] <bodhi_zazen> which although important, means
[00:28] <bodhi_zazen> agenda items first
[00:28] <bodhi_zazen> then new members
[00:28] <cprofitt> I see no reason to get rid of the Jedi Fellows...
[00:28] <bodhi_zazen> and comments from FG
[00:28] <cprofitt> there is no reason to not recognize them
[00:28] <Ash_R> bodhi_zazen,  comments on what sorry :)
[00:28] <nhandler> No other Ubuntu *team* recognizes Ubuntu members. Only *areas* of the community (Forums, IRC, LP, etc) recognize them
[00:28] <bodhi_zazen> I am neutral tending to want to encourage Ubuntu Membership
[00:29] <nhandler> bodhi_zazen: I think we should encourage Ubuntu Membership, but not with a title
[00:29] <bodhi_zazen> FG leads should at least give us an update or things they need from the team
[00:29] <sdennie> I think a lot of people use the BT as an easy to access stepping stone into the Ubuntu community.  Knowing the people that have been recognized as Ubuntu members seems important to me.
[00:29] <cprofitt> it was not meant to encourage people to become a member for 'recognition' but to cast it in a positive light
[00:29] <Saj0577> I think it may influence people to become members who otherwise would not seek it.
[00:29] <cprofitt> nhandler, we are not other teams
[00:29] <Ash_R> oh right.  in that case i have something to add if time allows bodhi_zazen
[00:29] <cprofitt> BT is the team that helps guide users in to the rest of the Ubuntu Community Cosmos
[00:30] <sdennie> cprofitt: I agree
[00:30] <bodhi_zazen> OK Ash_R :)
[00:30] <drs305> I don't care what they are called but feel there should be an easy way to identify BT Ubuntu members
[00:30] <bodhi_zazen> wait ... Ash_R
[00:30] <nhandler> You can get that info by 1) Looking at the group on the forums 2) Looking at our cloaks 3) The +members page on LP
[00:30] <cprofitt> if nothing else having such recognition serves to make new people aware that such a recognition exists from the Ubuntu community
[00:31] <cprofitt> nhandler, Yes, but as a team we are the gateway to that information
[00:31] <cprofitt> we server the purpose making people aware of that
[00:31] <sdennie> Again I agree with cprofitt
[00:31] <bodhi_zazen> I think recognition is important as I do think this team helps people move from forums -> Greater Ubuntu Community
[00:31] <nhandler> cprofitt: So we can link them to those locations instead of reproducing the list ourselves
[00:31] <bodhi_zazen> and most team members feel it helps :)
[00:31] <cprofitt> if people can only see that in the traditional ways then we do not need to 'guide' them
[00:31] <cprofitt> I disagree nhandler
[00:31] <nhandler> If we feel the need to have a list, I would like to propose using the LP api to generate it
[00:32] <cprofitt> just because there are other ways does not mean we should not recognize them and provide another way
[00:32] <drs305> None of those are well known or comprehensive, nor directly connected to the team.
[00:32] <cprofitt> what 'problems' do you have with the recognition
[00:32] <nhandler> cprofitt: The wiki page requires us to manually update it, and it has frequently been out-dated
[00:32] <cprofitt> nhandler, that is true of many of the wiki pages
[00:32] <cprofitt> it is easy enough to have people who become members update it themselves
[00:33] <cprofitt> if they want to be listed
[00:33] <bodhi_zazen> +1 cprofitt
[00:33] <bodhi_zazen> it is not "our" responsibility to keep that info up to date
[00:33] <drs305> Once a member, always a member unless they leave the team. The list would have to be updated once. Let the members list themselves.
[00:33] <drs305> * What cprofitt said!
[00:33] <Saj0577> drs305 only lasts 2 years then needs renewing i believe.
[00:33] <bodhi_zazen> and when people recieve recognition they are usually quite willing to add in their names ;)
[00:33] <cprofitt> +1 bodhi_zazen
[00:34] <drs305> ty Saj0577
[00:34] <bodhi_zazen> are we ready to vote ?
[00:34] <cprofitt> Saj0577, true
[00:34] <nhandler> bodhi_zazen: Willing isn't the issue. Many people don't know the list exists and needs updating
[00:34] <cprofitt> I am bodhi_zazen
[00:34] <cprofitt> nhandler, then educate them about the list -- do not get rid of it because it requires a bit of work
[00:34] <nhandler> This is why I suggested using the LP API to generate it
[00:34] <bodhi_zazen> any additional comments prior to vote ?
[00:34] <Ash_R> i am ready to vote.
[00:34] <nhandler> It would always be up-to-date
[00:35] <cprofitt> I think there are far more positives to it than negatives
[00:35]  * Saj0577 has a point for AOB
[00:35] <bodhi_zazen> [Vote]Get rid of Jedi Fellows
[00:35] <MootBot> Please vote on: Get rid of Jedi Fellows.
[00:35] <MootBot> Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0  to MootBot
[00:35] <MootBot> E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #ubuntu-meeting
[00:35] <cprofitt> and the work and effort is worth it
[00:35] <cprofitt> -1
[00:35] <MootBot> -1 received from cprofitt. 0 for, 1 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now -1
[00:35] <Joeb454> +0
[00:35] <swoody> -1
[00:35] <MootBot> Abstention received from Joeb454. 0 for, 1 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now -1
[00:35] <MootBot> -1 received from swoody. 0 for, 2 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now -2
[00:35] <drs305> -1
[00:35] <MootBot> -1 received from drs305. 0 for, 3 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now -3
[00:35] <duanedesign> -1
[00:35] <MootBot> -1 received from duanedesign. 0 for, 4 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now -4
[00:35] <sdennie> -1
[00:35] <MootBot> -1 received from sdennie. 0 for, 5 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now -5
[00:35] <bodhi_zazen> +0
[00:35] <MootBot> Abstention received from bodhi_zazen. 0 for, 5 against. 2 have abstained. Count is now -5
[00:35] <w4ett> -1
[00:35] <MootBot> -1 received from w4ett. 0 for, 6 against. 2 have abstained. Count is now -6
[00:35] <Saj0577> +0
[00:35] <Ash_R> -1
[00:35] <MootBot> -1 received from Ash_R. 0 for, 7 against. 2 have abstained. Count is now -7
[00:35] <MootBot> Abstention received from Saj0577. 0 for, 7 against. 3 have abstained. Count is now -7
[00:35] <nhandler> +1
[00:35] <MootBot> +1 received from nhandler. 1 for, 7 against. 3 have abstained. Count is now -6
[00:35] <bodhi_zazen> Any additional votes ?
[00:36] <bodhi_zazen> [ENDVOTE]
[00:36] <MootBot> Final result is 1 for, 7 against. 3 abstained. Total: -6
[00:36] <bodhi_zazen> [AGREED] Keep Jedi Fellows
[00:36] <MootBot> AGREED received:  Keep Jedi Fellows
[00:37] <bodhi_zazen> do we want to talk charter ?
[00:37] <bodhi_zazen> or hear from FG and new members ?
[00:37] <nhandler> bodhi_zazen: I think a status update of the charter would be nice
[00:37] <bodhi_zazen> charter may be short or long
[00:37] <nhandler> Just a status update (no discussion)
[00:37] <Ash_R> i think new members
[00:37] <bodhi_zazen> +1 nhandler
[00:37] <cprofitt> new members then status updates
[00:37] <bodhi_zazen> any objections 9as it was not on the agenda)
[00:38] <cprofitt> charter good too...
[00:38] <swoody> +1 charter
[00:38] <nhandler> bodhi_zazen: It was an action from the last meeting
[00:38] <bodhi_zazen> [TOPIC]Charter
[00:38] <MootBot> New Topic: Charter
[00:38] <bodhi_zazen> nhandler: well it really needs to be on the agenda :)
[00:38] <nhandler> bodhi_zazen: We didn't have our meeting to discuss it until yesterday ;)
[00:39] <nhandler> Would another leader like to summarize?
[00:39] <cprofitt> feel free nhandler
[00:39] <bodhi_zazen> I know, but if we or you were even thinking of discussing it, it really should have been added, and canceled if needed (IMO) for future meetings
[00:39] <Joeb454> nhandler: go ahead :)
[00:40] <nhandler> We started puting some ideas on the wiki for a charter: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Council/Charter
[00:40] <nhandler> As a note, that is simply a draft. We will be cleaning it up and reorganizing it soon
[00:40] <bodhi_zazen> nhandler: just so we know, who is "we" ?
[00:40] <nhandler> We in this case is the BT Council
[00:40] <bodhi_zazen> just curious as to who fees we need to change is all
[00:41] <bodhi_zazen> TY
[00:41] <nhandler> For those of you who have suggestions/comments about the charter, please feel free to contact the council either on IRC or via email (to the list)
[00:41] <cprofitt> feels
[00:42] <bodhi_zazen> For others, in the past this has been here :
[00:42] <bodhi_zazen> [LINK]https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Council/
[00:42] <MootBot> LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Council/
[00:42] <nhandler> bodhi_zazen: That page is relatively new and just a copy/paste from the Structure page
[00:43] <bodhi_zazen> well, yes is new, but the content is not new
[00:43] <bodhi_zazen> it is not as if we are just starting to discuss the role of the council
[00:44] <bodhi_zazen> the first link does not have any history behind it , and people outside the discussion can not follow without the page I linked
[00:44] <sdennie> I'm not sure if we should dwell on this much tonight if there is more business to attend to
[00:44] <nhandler> I am fine with moving on sdennie
[00:44] <bodhi_zazen> I think the page I linked is sufficient, but am open to suggestions if anything needs to be added or changed
[00:45] <bodhi_zazen> I would like to have some idea of where we are going with this, at least a general trend
[00:45] <bodhi_zazen> or is the page I linked sufficient ?
[00:45] <Saj0577> sufficient
[00:46] <bodhi_zazen> nhandler: or anyone else have any suggestions ?
[00:46] <nhandler> bodhi_zazen: We (BT Council) will be talking more with paultag and other users who expressed strong opinions on the mailing list thread
[00:46] <Ash_R> can this be put on the next agenda as it would give members who are not present to think on it
[00:46] <nhandler> Ash_R: Yes. Hopefully, we will have a charter to vote on for that meeting
[00:46] <Ash_R> we seem to have less that 12 voters present
[00:46] <Ash_R> *than
[00:46] <nhandler> New members now?
[00:46] <bodhi_zazen> I am ok with discussing the charter later
[00:47] <cprofitt> we will likely have to have some rules -- written in the charter about how much of the team will be required to accept it...
[00:47] <bodhi_zazen> [TOPIC]New members
[00:47] <MootBot> New Topic: New members
[00:47] <cprofitt> and what will be required to change it... etc
[00:47] <bodhi_zazen> cprofitt: I think as general as possible :)
[00:48] <cprofitt> bodhi_zazen, not sure those things can be general...
[00:48] <bodhi_zazen> pleia2: I think is up for membership
[00:48]  * pleia2 waves
[00:48] <cprofitt> we can use well tested ones
[00:48] <bodhi_zazen> I know cprofitt
[00:48] <nhandler> pleia2: Care to introduce yourself?
[00:48] <cprofitt> yes... I present pleia2 for membership
[00:48] <cprofitt> her wiki page is here - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/lyz
[00:49] <cprofitt> she has worked with the Education FG is getting the Ubuntu Community Learning Project off the ground
[00:49] <pleia2> Sure, I'm Elizabeth Krumbach, have been working with Ubuntu for a few years, became a member about 2 years ago, started working with cprofitt and all on the education FG related to Classroom which led into the new Learning project
[00:49] <cprofitt> and has been very helpful with several other teams
[00:50] <pleia2> and I hang out in the #ubuntu-beginners team and help out as needed, would like to start doing soem Classroom classes under the BT label
[00:50] <nhandler> Any questions for pleia2 ? Or can we vote?
[00:50] <bodhi_zazen> I support pleia2 in membership :)
[00:50] <pleia2> thanks :)
[00:50] <bodhi_zazen> [VOTE] pleia2 for membersihp
[00:50] <MootBot> Please vote on:  pleia2 for membersihp.
[00:50] <MootBot> Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0  to MootBot
[00:50] <MootBot> E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #ubuntu-meeting
[00:50] <sdennie> +1
[00:50] <bodhi_zazen> +1
[00:50] <MootBot> +1 received from sdennie. 1 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 1
[00:50] <Ash_R> +1
[00:50] <nhandler> +1
[00:50] <MootBot> +1 received from bodhi_zazen. 2 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 2
[00:50] <Saj0577> +1
[00:50] <MootBot> +1 received from Ash_R. 3 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 3
[00:50] <w4ett> pleia2 has been indispensable in assisting in the reformation of the tennessee loco team
[00:50] <MootBot> +1 received from nhandler. 4 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 4
[00:50] <swoody> +1
[00:50] <jgoguen> +1
[00:50] <w4ett> +1
[00:50] <MootBot> +1 received from Saj0577. 5 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 5
[00:50] <MootBot> +1 received from swoody. 6 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 6
[00:50] <MootBot> +1 received from jgoguen. 7 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 7
[00:50] <MootBot> +1 received from w4ett. 8 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 8
[00:51] <drs305> +1
[00:51] <MootBot> +1 received from drs305. 9 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 9
[00:51] <cprofitt> +1
[00:51] <MootBot> +1 received from cprofitt. 10 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 10
[00:51] <bodhi_zazen> Any additional votes ?
[00:51] <bodhi_zazen> [ENDVOTE]
[00:51] <MootBot> Final result is 10 for, 0 against. 0 abstained. Total: 10
[00:51] <pleia2> thanks everyone :)
[00:52] <bodhi_zazen> w00t :)
[00:52] <Ash_R> congratulations pleia2
[00:52] <nhandler> Congrats pleia2 ! What is your LP name?
[00:52] <pleia2> nhandler: lyz
[00:52] <Ash_R> you earned it
[00:52] <Joeb454> fwiw, if I had been paying attention I would've +1'd pleia2 :)
[00:52] <bodhi_zazen> we have 8 minutes to discuss FG :)
[00:52] <nhandler> pleia2: You have been added to the BT LP team
[00:52] <pleia2> nhandler: thanks \o/
[00:52] <Ash_R> shall i go as i have minor thing to announce?
[00:53] <nhandler> I have to leave. I will read the logs later
[00:53] <Joeb454> later nhandler
[00:53] <bodhi_zazen> go Ash_R
[00:53] <Saj0577> later nhandler
[00:53] <bodhi_zazen> thanks nhandler
[00:54] <Joeb454> I have something after as well :)
[00:54] <Ash_R> The young new user focus group had its first meeting.  Here is the wiki page:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/FocusGroups/YNU/Meetings/06-28-2009
[00:54] <bodhi_zazen> SWEET
[00:54] <Ash_R> thats about it really ;)
[00:54] <Joeb454> nice
[00:54] <bodhi_zazen> Thank , I think the YUN FG will be very helpful
[00:54] <bodhi_zazen> Joeb454: go :)
[00:54] <sdennie> Excellent Ash_R
[00:55] <Joeb454> basically, after a meeting amongst the council, we decided to change some settings in the council channel
[00:55] <Ash_R> though we had to put together a quick channel as it was late notice (10ish minutes) laugh out lud
[00:55] <Ash_R> loud
[00:55] <Joeb454> some of you may already be aware, but the channel is now +mz
[00:55] <Saj0577> +mz meaning?
[00:55] <Joeb454> basically this means that nobody will be able to speak without voice, however channel operators (i.e. the council) will be able to hear you
[00:55] <sdennie> Militarized Zone
[00:56] <bodhi_zazen> +mz == stfu :)
[00:56] <Joeb454> so if you have a query to raise with the council, they can voice you and you will be heard by all
[00:56] <bodhi_zazen> j/k
[00:56] <Joeb454> I'm sure if it turns out to not work as we expect, we can change it back :)
[00:56] <Joeb454> that's all I think :)
[00:56] <sdennie> I have something to add to that
[00:56] <cprofitt> The Educations FG team is still involved in the Ubuntu Community Learning Project. With the guidance that bodhi_zazen is giving it progress is being made in adopting a structure. Legal questions are still being discussed as to the license to use for courses.
[00:57] <bodhi_zazen> cprofitt: is too kind
[00:57] <bodhi_zazen> cprofitt: Vantrax pleia2 and doctormo deserve more credit then I do
[00:57] <bodhi_zazen> really
[00:57] <Joeb454> cprofitt: hopefully they'll get sorted soon
[00:57] <Joeb454> and sdennie quick, add to what I said before we forget! :)
[00:57] <cprofitt> it is not an easy topic...
[00:57] <sdennie> We did this because the council channel was recently a very unfriendly place to be for a few incidents.  There was a lot of name calling and otherwise unfriendliness so, we decided to make it more "sanitary".
[00:58] <cprofitt> and can be very contentious, but I feel the people involved while strong of opinion are stronger of desire to see the project successful
[00:58] <bodhi_zazen> juat FYI I am kind of -1 on the whole +mz thing, although I am vulnerable to peer pressure
[00:58] <bodhi_zazen> I like the channel to be open
[00:59] <bodhi_zazen> so if there are problems or concerns PLEASE bring them forward
[00:59]  * bodhi_zazen hides
[00:59] <bodhi_zazen> other issues ?
[00:59] <Joeb454> bodhi_zazen: I agree there, but we'll see how it pans out :) Like I said, I'm happy to change it if needs be
[00:59] <sdennie> bodhi_zazen: I've turned -1 on the issue because for some reason pidgin doesn't do it right...  ;)
[00:59] <bodhi_zazen> LOL sdennie
[00:59] <swoody> I somewhat agree bodhi_zazen I like open channels, but when something 'official' starts in the channel, I think it should go to +mz by default
[01:00] <bodhi_zazen> just helping nhandler feel better , so he is not the only one swamped with -1
[01:00] <bodhi_zazen> lol
[01:00] <sdennie> Haha
[01:00] <sdennie> Well, if we find it doesn't work, it's easy enough to reverse the change
[01:01] <sdennie> Or if people don't like it
[01:01] <bodhi_zazen> +1
[01:01] <bodhi_zazen> :)
[01:01] <bodhi_zazen> #endmeeting
[01:01] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 19:01.
[01:01] <bodhi_zazen> thank you everyone
[01:01] <Saj0577> 19:01 i wish.
[01:01] <Ash_R> can we not give it a go and see how we get on with it
[01:01] <Ash_R> lag...
[11:08] <lukjad007> Dubie, Dubie, Dooo...
[11:08] <leoquant> do dun dun do...
[11:08] <leoquant> du du duuuuu
[11:08] <lukjad007> Sing siiiiiiing.
[16:01]  * liw waves
[16:01] <robbiew> #startmeeting
[16:01] <MootBot> Meeting started at 10:01. The chair is robbiew.
[16:01] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[16:01] <robbiew> hi
[16:01] <al-maisan> hello there!
[16:02] <slangasek> morning
[16:02] <mterry> Hello
[16:02] <robbiew> cjwatson is on his way...having freenode irc issues
[16:02] <evand> hi
[16:04] <robbiew> agenda located here: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/FoundationsTeam/Meetings/2009/0701#Agenda
[16:04] <robbiew> [TOPIC] 8.04.3
[16:04] <MootBot> New Topic:  8.04.3
[16:04] <robbiew> hey cjwatson_
[16:04] <robbiew> just started
[16:04] <cjwatson_> ah, there it goes, finaly
[16:05] <cjwatson_> +l
[16:05] <robbiew> slangasek: is everything "okay" with 8.04.3?
[16:05] <robbiew> anything you need from folks?...or me?
[16:06] <slangasek> robbiew: I've had conversations with Zaid and Etienne last week about some bugs that haven't gotten fixed yet for 8.04.3, but that they consider critical to have: #236640, #207072
[16:06] <robbiew> grrrreat
[16:07]  * mvo adds a late hi
[16:08]  * robbiew looks at bug 236640 and bug 207072
[16:08] <slangasek> I've been working on trying to squeeze the first in (iSCSI), but it's pulling teeth to get things tested - need to chase up with the server team
[16:09] <slangasek> the other I need to talk to Rick about today, for the desktop team
[16:09] <slangasek> depending on how these fixes play out, I think we need to consider pushing the point release back further to accomodate them
[16:10] <slangasek> (another week, no more)
[16:10] <robbiew> hmm
[16:10] <robbiew> i suppose a week delay is not the end of the world
[16:11] <cjwatson> that pushes it into debconf, iirc?
[16:11] <robbiew> hmm...right...I keep forgetting we delayed it already
[16:12]  * robbiew needs to update his google calendar
[16:12] <slangasek> cjwatson: Jul 16 - DebCamp, but not DebConf
[16:12] <robbiew> cjwatson: what is the current planned date for 8.04.3?
[16:13] <slangasek> currently planned for 9 Jul
[16:13] <cjwatson> so early debcamp then
[16:13] <cjwatson> my travel plans for debcamp got a bit torpedoed by various things, so I'm not actually going to make it there until the 21st
[16:14] <cjwatson> meaning that I'd have no problem being available around the 16th
[16:14] <slangasek> ok
[16:15] <robbiew> slangasek: I'll add this to the weekly manager's meeting agenda as well
[16:15] <robbiew> to make sure Rick and Rick know
[16:15] <slangasek> robbiew: alright - though I won't be waiting for that before talking to them
[16:15] <robbiew> heh...understand
[16:16] <slangasek> the short-term problem is to get the bugs fixed, both of which have been quite intransigent.  One defies backporting, the other still isn't actually fixed in karmic.
[16:17] <robbiew> ok
[16:17] <robbiew> so there's also the possibility that we go out next week...if a "fix" for neither looks promising
[16:18] <robbiew> getting a fix in time, that is
[16:18] <slangasek> I'm given to believe that's a very bad possibility. :)
[16:19] <robbiew> heh
[16:19] <robbiew> k
[16:19] <robbiew> slangasek: anything else around 8.04.3?
[16:19] <slangasek> not at present; testing feedback of the candidate ISOs seems to be positive
[16:19] <robbiew> ok, tnaks
[16:20] <robbiew> thanks :/
[16:20] <robbiew> [TOPIC] Karmic Status
[16:20] <MootBot> New Topic:  Karmic Status
[16:20] <robbiew> http\://wiki.ubuntu.com/FoundationsTeam/ReleaseStatus/Karmic
[16:20] <robbiew> http://wiki.ubuntu.com/FoundationsTeam/ReleaseStatus/Karmic
[16:20] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://wiki.ubuntu.com/FoundationsTeam/ReleaseStatus/Karmic
[16:20] <robbiew> I've updated the "grand pooba" wiki page with milestones
[16:21] <robbiew> at least the ones I have...i think I still need to add the multiarch one
[16:22] <slangasek> cjwatson: you're listed as reviewer of the multiarch spec, and it's still marked for 'review' - do you have any feedback on that so far?
[16:23] <cjwatson> I think I got most of my review in at UDS - I'll give it another once-over and process the blueprint
[16:23] <slangasek> (there are a couple of points that discussion has reopened on in Debian, but these are relatively small; I'm happy to notify you as those get resolved, if you like)
[16:25] <robbiew> I'll start the much-anticipated color coding next week
[16:25] <robbiew> heh
[16:26] <mterry> \o/
[16:26] <robbiew> lol
[16:26] <robbiew> [TOPIC] Doko topic: handling of component mismatches
[16:26] <MootBot> New Topic:  Doko topic: handling of component mismatches
[16:26] <robbiew> doko, around?
[16:26] <doko> yep
[16:26] <robbiew> the stage is yours
[16:26] <robbiew> :)
[16:27] <doko> just pointing out that component mismaches aren't handled currently
[16:27] <doko> like the example I did give. most of them are introduced by syncs from debian, so they are less seen.
[16:27] <cjwatson> I don't think it's fair to go from "there are some component mismatches that I've noticed not being dealt with" to "component mismatches aren't being handled [at all]".
[16:28] <slangasek> fwiw, what you see there is about a 1.5 weeks of drift I guess
[16:28] <slangasek> hmm, make that 2.5week
[16:29] <cjwatson> in a lot of cases, we're somewhat blocked on MIR reviews, though, which I see you have later among your topics
[16:29] <slangasek> perhaps we should emphasize more to the archive admins that this should get attention on archive days?
[16:29] <doko> I didn't say "at all". I was just observing
[16:29] <cjwatson> you said they weren't being handled
[16:29] <doko> ok, ok ...
[16:30] <cjwatson> in the cases you give, they are unfortunately blocked on the MIR team as far as I can see ...
[16:30] <cjwatson> (bug 382692, bug 391375)
[16:30] <cjwatson> and I do agree that's a problem
[16:32] <cjwatson> so, a while back we added a bunch of new members to the MIR team in an attempt to unbottleneck that
[16:32] <cjwatson> doko excepted, are those people not pulling their weight?
[16:32] <cjwatson> apart from doko, none of them are on this team
[16:33] <doko> I'll talk to the MIR team, I tried myself to stay away from this for the karmic cycle
[16:33] <doko> cjwatson: so maybe somebody else from foundations would make sense in the MIR team?
[16:33] <cjwatson> perhaps, but TBH I feel that the existing people should be able to keep up
[16:34] <cjwatson> maybe they need to establish some kind of rota so that it isn't always distracting them
[16:34] <cjwatson> but so that they still get stuff done
[16:35] <doko> let's try that. will followup next week
[16:35] <robbiew> ok...did that also cover your MIR topic?
[16:36] <doko> yes
[16:36] <robbiew> and the second? handling of the new queue (selfish example: python3.1)
[16:36] <cjwatson> if the people on that team feel they need to be replaced, we can do that; if they genuinely feel they're pulling their weight but just aren't managing to keep up, then that would suggest adding more people
[16:36] <doko> and somebody did work on NEW while we were talking ;)
[16:36] <cjwatson> I might have seen the agenda item ;-)
[16:36] <doko> heh
[16:36] <cjwatson> NEW seems to be backing up a bit, although not *too* badly
[16:37] <cjwatson> the oldest thing there is an outlier source package at 12 days; everything else is a week or newer
[16:37] <cjwatson> 67 items in all right now (binaries tend to show up as several items, one per architecture)
[16:38] <cjwatson> so not as fast as it might be, but not cause for immediate alarm I think - did you try contacting archive admins on their archive days first?
[16:38] <james_w> I could do a "half-day" on Monday before slangasek gets up to help clear the weekend backlog. Steve, what do you think?
[16:38] <doko> would it make sense (for stuff like MIR, NEW) to mention processing these after some milestones explicitely?
[16:39] <cjwatson> I don't have an archive day right now; maybe I should do that half-day
[16:39] <slangasek> oh, that would definitely make a difference
[16:39] <cjwatson> oh, nor does James :)
[16:39] <cjwatson> how about I do some on Wednesday to supplement Dustin, since (a) he's on a different timezone (b) he's listed as just syncs and bug processing?
[16:40] <slangasek> I was thinking that I should swap days with Riddell or StevenK so that someone farther east can get a jump on the week, but this would work as well
[16:40]  * kirkland would much appreciate that, as wednesdays have been particularly bad for him :-(
[16:41]  * james_w adds himself to the wiki page
[16:42]  * robbiew sheds a tear over seeing such great teamwork
[16:42] <robbiew> okay....moving on :P
[16:42] <robbiew> [TOPIC] Sponsorship Queue
[16:42] <MootBot> New Topic:  Sponsorship Queue
[16:43] <robbiew> I see Keybuk is meeting his goal of zero this week...heh
[16:43] <Keybuk> :D
[16:43] <Keybuk> I'm quite happy to do 1/5th less work a week if you like <g>
[16:43] <robbiew> he and I are tied :/
[16:43] <robbiew> sponsorship queue processing is "work"....but I know what you mean
[16:45] <robbiew> I'd generally like to see folks doing some sponsorship work, but also understand that we have features to deliver and bugs to fix....it's finding the balance between the two that's tricky
[16:46] <slangasek> I'm conscious of my own delinquence over the past couple of weeks, and will play catch-up soon
[16:47] <robbiew> no worries...I'm not worried about it....yet ;)
[16:47] <robbiew> [TOPIC] Good News
[16:47] <MootBot> New Topic:  Good News
[16:47] <robbiew> US holiday this Friday...whoohoo!
[16:47] <robbiew> whoa...a lot of folks just left
[16:48] <cjwatson> netsplit/rejoin
[16:48] <evand> netsplit
[16:48] <Keybuk> robbiew: my problem is that I'm in the group of people who can't just "go and do something else for 20 minutes"
[16:48] <robbiew> Keybuk: ack
[16:48] <Keybuk> a 20 minute interruption can lose me an entire day of work
[16:48] <Keybuk> because I'll never get back into what I was doing
[16:48] <Keybuk> this is basically the reason I switch all the notifications for things like IRC and e-mail off ;)
[16:49] <robbiew> any Good News?
[16:49] <liw> the world didn't end yet
[16:49] <cjwatson> mm, I find sponsorship works better for me at the start or end of the day
[16:49] <doko> back
[16:50] <cjwatson> as a get-brain-moving or wind-down activity
[16:50] <cjwatson> archive admin's sort of similar for me
[16:50] <mvo> yeah, for me too (wind-down usually)
[16:51] <robbiew> [TOPIC] AOB
[16:51] <MootBot> New Topic:  AOB
[16:51] <robbiew> slangasek: you're out tomorrow and Friday, right?
[16:51] <slangasek> yes
[16:51] <robbiew> do we need coverage for the release meeting?
[16:51] <slangasek> cjwatson agreed to cover; I'll be sending him notes today on what I use to pull together the agenda
[16:51] <Keybuk> cjwatson: the end of my day is usually suddenly stoping coding at the words "dinner's ready!"
[16:52] <cjwatson> slangasek: which means I know what I'm doing tomorrow :)
[16:52] <robbiew> lol
[16:52] <robbiew> okay...that's all I got
[16:52] <robbiew> #endmeeting
[16:52] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 10:52.
[16:52] <robbiew> 8 minutes to spare!
[16:52] <slangasek> :)
[16:52] <liw> thanks
[16:52] <al-maisan> Bye!
[16:53] <evand> thanks
[16:53] <mvo> thanks
[17:58] <heno> hello everyone
[17:58] <fader> Howdy
[17:59] <cr3> hidy ho
[18:00] <heno> lots of people out today for various reasons
[18:01] <heno> but let's start
[18:01] <heno> #startmeeting
[18:01] <MootBot> Meeting started at 12:01. The chair is heno.
[18:01] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[18:01] <heno> agenda: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/Meetings
[18:01] <heno> [TOPIC] UbuntuBugDay highlights
[18:01] <MootBot> New Topic:  UbuntuBugDay highlights
[18:02] <heno> can anyone comment on this? pedro is travelling
[18:02] <ara> hello
[18:02] <heno> hey ara
[18:03] <heno> ogasawara: perhaps you want to give an update on kernel bug days?
[18:04] <ogasawara> heno: they're still going great, with good participation from each of the kernel devs
[18:04] <ogasawara> heno: our focus now is to get more community participation
[18:04] <heno> ogasawara: are they themed?
[18:04] <heno> and when is the next one?
[18:04] <ogasawara> heno: yes, they'll target for ex bugs with patches attached.
[18:04] <ogasawara> heno: the next one is Tues July 7 - likely to target wifi bugs
[18:05] <heno> ok, great
[18:05] <heno> thanks
[18:05] <heno> [TOPIC] SRU Verifications -- sbeattie
[18:05] <MootBot> New Topic:  SRU Verifications -- sbeattie
[18:05] <sbeattie> Thanks to exe, Shahar Or, Evan Broder, Mika Pflüger, Magnus Hjorth, and Neil Hoggarth fortesting various SRU fixes this week.
[18:06] <sbeattie> 8.04.3 SRU work continues, the list is getting smaller, but we could still use somehelp on the hardware specific ones.
[18:06] <heno> my calendar says 8.04.3 is tomorrow, has that changed?
[18:07] <sbeattie> also re: 8.04.3, I expect iso testing to formally begin soon given we expect to release on july 9th
[18:07] <sbeattie> heno: july 9th based on the hardy schedule in the wiki, I thought
[18:08] <sbeattie> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardyReleaseSchedule
[18:08] <heno> that's probably true then. the calendar entry says TBC
[18:08] <sbeattie> ah
[18:08] <heno> sbeattie: many hw-specific issues outstanding?
[18:08] <sbeattie> (I've been informally testing the iso images to verify some of the installer fixes that have landed)
[18:09] <sbeattie> Yeah, hw-specific issues are pretty much unchanged.
[18:09] <heno> how many images are we expecting?
[18:09] <sbeattie> just the ubuntu ones.
[18:10] <heno> just server or desktops too?
[18:10] <sbeattie> desktops as well, I believe..
[18:10] <sbeattie> (they've been respinning)
[18:10] <heno> still, not too bad
[18:10] <heno> ok, thanks sbeattie
[18:11] <heno> [TOPIC] Ubuntu Developer Week -- ogasawara
[18:11] <MootBot> New Topic:  Ubuntu Developer Week -- ogasawara
[18:11] <ogasawara> just a sec, getting the link
[18:11] <ogasawara> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperWeek/Prep
[18:12] <ogasawara> After chatting with the community team I just want to mention that UDW is coming up
[18:12] <ogasawara> If anyone is interested in leading a session, please sign up!
[18:13] <heno> seems we are already well-represented
[18:14] <heno> cr3, sbeattie: anything you feel you'd like to present?
[18:15] <heno> cr3: metrics attachments for fun and profit perhaps?
[18:15] <cr3> heno: sure, checkbox!
[18:15] <cr3> heno: yep, I'll thing of a topic relating to checkbox
[18:15] <heno> ok, great
[18:16] <artir> ogasawara: what about a pyclutter tutorial ;)?
[18:16] <artir> I can do it
[18:17] <artir> no, I can't
[18:17] <artir> :(, I'm without a PC till 5 of september
[18:17] <ogasawara> artir:  heh, oops
[18:17] <heno> how to sign up? contact jcastro?
[18:17] <ogasawara> artir: maybe next time
[18:17] <artir> but I can give the tutorial and all the stuff to other guy
[18:17] <ogasawara> heno: I'd say probably best to run your idea by jcastro or dholbach first before taking a slot
[18:17] <artir> this is quite important since there aren't any good pyclutter tutorials out there
[18:18] <artir> and clutter is very cool
[18:18] <heno> artir: perhaps work on the docs this time and present next time?
[18:19] <heno> next topic ...
[18:19] <artir> Giving the pyclutter talk is not so complex
[18:19] <heno> [TOPIC] Presenting http://mago.ubuntu.com/
[18:19] <MootBot> New Topic:  Presenting http://mago.ubuntu.com/
[18:20] <ara> Yes, we have a brand new site for the Mago project
[18:20] <heno> let's give some applause to ara for heading up the Mago project and setting up the site!
[18:21] <heno> it will be officially presented next Wednesday at the desktop summit
[18:21] <ogasawara> ara: nice work!
[18:21] <sbeattie> yay ara! nice work!
[18:21]  * fader applauds.
[18:22] <heno> a who wiki for us to fill with useful testing automation docs :)
[18:22] <heno> any other meeting topics?
[18:22] <artir> mago means wizard/magician in spanish :P
[18:23] <ara> artir: ;-)
[18:23] <heno> because it makes things magically appear on your desktop :)
[18:24] <cr3> heno: good, I'd be worried if it magically made things disappear :)
[18:24] <heno> it can do that too
[18:24] <cr3> "now you see it, rm -fr /, now you don't"
[18:24] <artir> lol
[18:24] <fader> What's Spanish for "evil wizard"?
[18:24]  * heno copies that command to test
[18:25] <artir> Mago Malvado
[18:25] <artir> :p
[18:25] <artir> or Mago Maligno
[18:25] <fader> :)
[18:25] <heno> kidding
[18:25] <artir> alias evil_wizard="rm -rf"
[18:25] <artir> :P
[18:25] <heno> ok, I think were done
[18:25] <heno> #endmeeting
[18:25] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 12:25.
[18:25] <heno> thanks all!
[18:25] <cr3> cheerio
[18:26] <ara> cheers