/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2009/07/09/#ubuntu-artwork.txt

billybigriggeranyone alive?02:49
macvrbillybigrigger: i guess no ;p06:04
billybigriggerany chance we're gonna see the shiki arc and gnome colors as default themes in karmic?06:12
billybigriggeri've been using them for the last week or so and should definitely be installed and an option by default06:12
billybigriggeri prefer them over human06:13
billybigriggerand im sure lots of people do :P06:13
dashuabillybigrigger: sudo apt-get install shiki-colors :)06:25
billybigriggeryeah but, why isnt it installed by default06:26
billybigriggerwhen a new user checks out appearance, those 4 colored themes should be there by default06:26
dashuaOh default for sure probably not06:26
billybigriggerwhy?06:27
BHSPitMonkeybecause ubuntu isn't ever what we want it to be by default06:34
billybigriggerits 4 themes06:35
billybigriggerthat look alot better than the default06:35
billybigriggerand are practical06:35
BHSPitMonkeybillybigrigger: and that is why they will never ship :P06:42
billybigriggeroh the truth hurts haha06:42
macvrbillybigrigger: kwwii_ was saying that they are thinking of using Humanity.06:55
billybigriggeris that the one that uses the nodoka engine that doesn't work?06:55
billybigriggeroh06:56
billybigriggerthats not on the karmic art wiki06:56
billybigriggerwhere can i find humanity?06:56
macvrbillybigrigger: : http://sinecera.de/humanity-icon-theme_0.1_all.deb06:57
billybigriggerthats the newest?06:57
billybigriggeris there a ppa or anything for it to keep updated?06:57
macvrbillybigrigger: wiki  >> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Karmic/elebuntu_Icons06:57
billybigriggeroh i thought humanity was a gtk theme07:03
billybigriggernot just iconset07:03
macvri dont , think they will change the theme.07:06
macvrbillybigrigger: new theme might be only for karmic+107:06
billybigriggerbah humbug07:07
macvrbillybigrigger: well that is what the UX team says! they might also change the brown color07:10
billybigriggergood07:10
billybigriggerso what is the art team canonical hired doing for karmic then?07:10
billybigriggernothing07:10
billybigrigger??07:10
macvrbillybigrigger: that is the silliest question i have heard!07:11
billybigriggerwell if they're not changing the theme for karmic07:11
billybigriggeri thought mark said we're ditching brown for karmic?07:11
macvrbillybigrigger: yes he did but he also said there wasnt enough time! you seem to be bordering on trolling!07:12
billybigriggerhaha what do you mean?07:12
billybigriggeri my original question was about having shiki arc and gnome colors for 4 default themes07:13
macvrtrash talking the canonical art team is not appropriate for this room07:13
billybigriggerno no07:13
billybigriggeri wasn't trash talking07:13
billybigriggeri just thought an art team was hired for jaunty+1 and wondered why no change in karmic07:14
billybigriggerim sorry if i offended you07:14
billybigriggeri don't mean to come off as rude07:14
macvrFYI , it is not the art team, it is the UX team , UX=user experience07:14
billybigriggermy bad07:14
billybigriggermaybe i should sub to the mailing list to catch up on some stuff07:15
macvrbillybigrigger: dont worry , i'm not working for canonical ;p07:15
billybigriggermy info is outdated apparently07:15
kwwii_good morning09:46
=== kwwii_ is now known as kwwii
kwwiiw00t, I am back09:47
thorwilgood morning, kwwii09:49
kwwiihi thorwil09:51
* kwwii reads his email backlog...what fun!09:52
kwwiithorwil: I just sent an email to our lawyer, we'll see what she says10:07
thorwilkwwii: cool, ty10:07
kwwiiwow, creating a flickr group is a lot of work10:10
thorwilkwwii: what, it's not just "add group" give a name and answer join requests?10:11
kwwiiwell, there are rules and an icon ans uch10:13
kwwiisuch10:13
kwwiiand such...man my spelling is poor this morning10:13
thorwilmay the spelling be with you later today!10:14
kwwii:p10:14
SiDikwwii: back from spain ?10:19
kwwiiSiDi: yepp10:19
SiDihow was it ?10:19
kwwiiexcellent ;)10:20
kwwiinow I wish I would have stayed the rest of the week10:20
kwwiihttp://www.flickr.com/groups/ubuntu-artwork/ is the revamped flickr group11:05
kwwiimaybe if everyone invites their friends and tell people about it we will get some new contributors11:05
SiDikwwii: should we advertise the group on social networkz ?11:07
SiDinetsplit :o11:11
kwwiiSiDi: yes, please do ;)11:27
kwwiiseveral of the design team are going to blog about it, etc.11:27
SiDii'll post on facebook n identi.ca then11:28
SiDimy blog is still offline11:28
kwwiicool11:36
kwwiilol, I forgot the password to my blog :p11:44
kwwiishows how much I blog :p11:45
knome:P11:47
kwwiihttp://kwwii.blogspot.com/11:57
kwwiita-da11:57
* thorwil marks the day in calendar11:57
knomeso *that's* what you look like12:00
kwwii:p12:01
kwwiibig and ugly12:01
knomenaahh12:01
thorwilnah, at least not just a floating head like oh-so-many planet bloggers!!12:02
kwwiiactually, I am not in 99% of those photos12:02
knomewell you are in the profile photo...12:02
kwwiiahhh, on the blog, right12:02
knomeyep12:02
kwwiiI was thinking of my flickr page12:02
knomenah12:02
kwwiiwow, about 3,200 people have looked at my profile :p12:03
thorwilhttp://people.ubuntu.com/~kirkland/Museum/12:04
knomeheh12:04
thorwilhttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Archives12:04
knomesaw that already, it's a nice idea, but why no xubuntu...12:04
thorwilhmm12:04
thorwilwhat's xubuntu?12:05
kwwiithorwil: did you make that logo?12:05
kwwiithey had asked me for one but I got too busy12:05
thorwilkwwii: no12:05
knomeit's a sexy flavor of ubuntu :P12:05
thorwilknome: does it come with a lingerie theme??12:06
knomethorwil, that's the xubuntu limited edition, with comes with a real lingerie12:06
knomeyou must've messed those up12:06
kwwiixfce edition12:06
kwwiierm, not edition but flavor ;)12:07
thorwilknome: fresh or used lingerie in the limited edition?12:07
knomeyou can choose while ordering12:07
thorwilwow!12:08
knomeyou also can choose from red, one or black and from different sizes, of course12:08
knomepink is doable, but it costs $10 extra12:08
thorwiloh, i suspected blue-only12:08
kwwiiw00t, I received and answer from a lawyer within hours :p12:16
knomehah12:28
knomehe must be a fake lawyer12:28
thorwilkwwii: got it, thanks. of course "sign" is funny, if all we ask of everyone is to just claim to be the photographer/model of the submitted picture12:30
kwwiiwell, in order to use someone photo we will really need a signed release form12:31
kwwiiI assumed that was clear12:31
kwwiisorry12:31
kwwiisomething to have in hand in case someone tries to sue us for using their image :)12:32
thorwilkwwii: that needs to be on paper, sent to canonical, then?12:32
kwwiithorwil: I am not sure, maybe a scanned copy is enough12:34
kwwiiwow, looking into it, there is a special release form for minors :p12:36
kwwiiso, looking at what istockphoto does, you can sign the release form and then upload that scanned copy12:37
thorwili know that istockphoto asks for signed model release forms for each and everyone12:37
kwwiihttp://www.istockphoto.com/tutorial_9.0_modelrelease.php12:37
thorwillol12:37
kwwiiit does not say it has to be the original piece of paper though...just that it has to be a copy which was signed by hand12:38
thorwilkwwii: so can we make this a very official project and your lawyer to prepare such model releases?12:43
kwwiithorwil: well, I think we can take a normal model release form, fill in the right names, etc and then send it to her for review12:44
kwwiiwell, both and adult version and a minor version12:44
kwwiihttp://www.betterphoto.com/article.asp?id=37 seems to have a link to word docs12:49
thorwilwhy am i doing this again? oh right, i'm not quite right in the head an think it's fun, somehow! :)12:49
kwwii:p12:49
kwwiithorwil: I will edit the ones on that page and send them to her and ask if that they are ok13:07
thorwilkwwii: great! keep in mind that it's about having a permissive license in contrast to what stock sites and co do. thanks!13:10
kwwiithorwil: sent...we will see what she says13:15
thorwilkwwii: i have a draft call-for-submissions, though without the model release business so far. working on an illustration for it13:17
kwwiicool13:21
kwwiiI guess that the model release is only needed for the ones which are picked to be included13:22
thorwilyes, but i wouldn't consider submisions without it in the first place ...13:22
kwwiiyeah, you are probably right13:25
kwwiiin any case, the release forms should not be publicly vewable13:25
kwwiiviewable13:25
SiDimeh13:27
SiDichromium having trouble with freenode's webir13:27
SiDic13:27
thorwilkwwii: how about a special email address for submissions? bad regarding bandwidth, but something virtually everyone can handle13:29
kwwiithorwil: true, we could use the ubuntu-art-devel list for that13:30
thorwilkwwii: huh? what i had in mind was an everyone can post with big attachments list13:33
SiDii found a wikipage for the hall of fame13:34
SiDihttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Karmic/new_human_icons13:34
kwwiilol, guess I will erase that13:58
SiDicome on, you're weakening the community when you do such things :O13:59
kwwiihehe13:59
kwwiithorwil: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WfBlUQguvyw14:52
kwwiireally cool video of using multiple videos14:52
kwwiitime for a break, bbiab14:52
kwwiiwow, two responses from two lawyers in one day16:06
kwwiithorwil: I sent them the release forms and they responded by saying that canonical has their own and that they will find them and send them to me16:06
SiDikwwii: canonical has cool lawyers !16:22
kwwiiSiDi: no doubt, I already got another response with the release16:27
kwwiithat makes the legal team the most responsive team in canonical :p16:27
kwwiithorwil: I will forward the release to you, there is a catch in it :(16:28
SiDimeh16:28
SiDitthe SiDi fan team is responsive too16:28
knome"the sidi fan team"?16:28
SiDiyeh knome16:29
SiDiim the main and unique member16:29
SiDibut i keep hoping16:29
knomehaha..16:29
thorwil0.016:35
SiDiknome: wanna join ? D:16:39
knomehmm...16:39
knomelet me think16:39
* kwwii cooks dinner while thorwil reads his email16:39
knomeSiDi, maybe once you're ready to take credit for what you've done :]16:40
SiDiknome: there is no credit i should take, what i do anyone else could do it16:40
knomethat's a bed excuse.16:40
knome*BAD16:40
knomedamn it...16:40
SiDibed ?16:41
SiDiMy invitation to join was _only_ about the fan club knome !16:41
knomehehe..16:41
macvrkwwii: awesome youtube video... amazing editing   0.016:44
SiDiyeh i must say the concept is quire original16:47
knomewhich video?16:49
SiDiknome: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WfBlUQguvyw16:56
SiDiwww.sidifanclub.com btw !16:56
knomeopen that site first :P16:57
macvrknome: i fell for that page too !16:58
knomeSiDi, http://files.boardgamegeek.com/images/shake.gif17:00
SiDiknome: emonk.fi !17:01
SiDivery up-to-date :p17:01
knomewehmm.. isn't it?17:01
knomethe fact that some section if updated last in mid-jaunuary 2009 doesn't mean it's not up-to-date17:02
knomei need something to drink17:03
SiDimacvr: http://img244.imageshack.us/img244/3119/capture3w.png17:03
SiDimy system is completely broken17:04
macvrSiDi: is that a mockup ? or is that the dialogue in xubuntu?17:05
SiDiit doesnt suspend when i close the lid, it kernel panics on wake up, it refuses to shutdown properly, terminals open in .cache instead of ~17:05
SiDimacvr: mockup17:05
SiDiwording is far from perfect but thats the last of my problems :p17:06
macvrSiDi: addressing directly like 'you havent' is not nice... rather things needs to be as "the system hasnt been"17:07
SiDiAh true17:08
SiDidamn i need to gimp it again now17:08
macvrSiDi: also... the warning seems too "in your face" , maybe you are trying to keep it that way... but IMO that is a *very* scary warning for average users17:11
SiDimacvr: this would only appear after a week17:14
SiDiand its meant to be scary17:15
SiDiif you dont scare users they dont scare17:15
SiDiand as scottk pointed out the current problem is that they dont care17:15
macvri know... but still, it is too much17:15
macvrjust my 2 cents ;p17:15
SiDiso instead of bothering the 80% who already care, lets scare only the remaining 20%17:15
SiDihttp://img199.imageshack.us/content.php?page=done&l=img199/7207/capture3j.png macvr17:17
macvrSiDi: the initial "It looks like" is not needed , Just "The system..."17:19
SiDii have the feeling i'll reinstall xubuntu soon :|17:19
SiDimacvr: yeh i know :p17:19
SiDialso the 2nd ยง sucks a lot17:19
SiDii just wanna convey the idea, the wording will come later17:19
dashuaSiDi: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Karmic/Human-Redux?action=AttachFile&do=view&target=gnome-themes-ubuntu_0.4_all.deb20:17
dashuaTesting, when you get a chance.20:17
SiDicurrently trying to prevent a kitten from being eaten by a bigger cat :|20:18
dashuaOh20:18
dashuaTake of your little friend20:18
SiDicats are STRICTLY forbidden here20:21
SiDiif im caught with her im fired off my home :p20:21
ckontrosmacvr: I didn't get the attachment on that email about the folder.21:52
macvrckontros: oh... i didnt send ;p  its the same one from the submissions page21:53
ckontrosAnd to answer you question "Is it better" (re nm icon revision) Yes. yes they are. ;)21:53
macvrckontros: BTW , is the nm- icon better now?21:53
macvrok.21:54
ckontrosI'm going to make a big upload tonight. Mostly accumulated fixes.21:55
macvrckontros: the face-sad needs fixing too.21:55
ckontrosI have the latest rev from the wiki. Is there another?21:56
macvri mean , i'v sent the corrected labels21:56
macvrnothing else , just the labels21:56
macvrckontros: the wiki is the wrong one... the one from the mail i sent is labelled correctly21:57
ckontrosLooks like mine is correct.21:57
ckontrosSo I guess I have the right one. As well as "face-sick".21:57
macvrckontros: the emblem-default is new version too21:58
macvron the sub page21:58
macvrckontros: the appointment-soon , in the trunk , is blurry. did you check out the edit i had done? [aligned the pixels]22:01
ckontrosDont think I did.22:02
ckontrosI'm grabbing all the emblems on the wiki but " emblem-readonly". Still not crazy about it.22:03
macvr;p22:04
macvrckontros: http://files.getdropbox.com/u/1325768/appointment-soon.png < appointment soon22:04
ckontrosEmail it. I'll throw it in this upload.22:05
macvrk...22:05
kwwiickontros: hey dude22:05
ckontrosyo yo22:05
* kwwii returns from band practice22:05
ckontros\m/22:05
kwwiisaw luis in las palmas22:05
* ckontros has just returned from work and is doing email.22:05
kwwiiI took a ride in his car22:05
ckontroskwwii: Oh nice. He's been kinda absent lately.22:06
ckontrosAlot going on with work. Not that he's a full employee at SUN.22:06
ckontrosErr... Oracle22:07
kwwiilol, well, he still works for sun22:07
kwwiibut it is all the same, I gues22:07
kwwiis22:07
ckontrossure22:07
ckontrosmacvr: got it.22:07
macvr:)22:07
macvrSiDi: proposing any idea with tray icon wont be accepted ;p22:12
macvrmpt wont allow22:12
macvroops ayatana discussion!22:13
SiDimacvr: yeh well find me another bug with 32 duplicates22:13
SiDithe new design is not satisfying at all22:13
ckontrosbug #?22:14
macvrckontros: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/update-notifier/+bug/332945?comments=all22:14
ubottuError: Could not parse data returned by Ubuntu: The read operation timed out (https://launchpad.net/bugs/332945/+text)22:15
macvrhttps://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/update-notifier/+bug/33294522:15
ubottuError: Could not parse data returned by Ubuntu: The read operation timed out (https://launchpad.net/bugs/332945/+text)22:15
macvrbots!22:16
ckontros(rendering latest Breathe updates)22:23
ckontros"We discussed it publicly at the Ubuntu Developer Summit in December." really doesn't mean anything. As much as I love them, things are mostly decided by then.22:25
SiDihey mma22:25
ckontrosyo22:25
SiDitook me time to notice you22:25
ckontros;)22:25
SiDickontros: i was at uds, didnt notice the discussion22:25
SiDibut i was late22:25
ckontrosSure.22:25
SiDianwyay i think its too drastic22:26
SiDiits ok for windows users who expect their OS to misbehave them and who are too lazy / scared to do the updates22:26
SiDibut many average level users took it bad22:26
* ckontros is still sreading the bug.22:26
ckontros*reading22:27
SiDibasically they removed the tray icon and replaced it by auto popping update manager22:27
SiDii understand why they did it22:27
SiDii just cant accept it :|22:27
* ckontros likes the tray icon as well. Thinks <PT knows F-all about UI design. But, Canonical will do what it wants to do.22:28
ckontross/<PT/MPT22:29
ckontrosBut this is not to say I have a particular opinion about this issue quite yet. ;)22:31
* ckontros keeps reading.22:32
* macvr missed the icon at first but, now got used to it... still not happy about the pop-under :/22:32
SiDii usually perform updates weekly unless security updates22:33
SiDibandwidth issue... and i do it manually anyway22:33
ckontrosGeeeeeeeeze 420 comments. Wow.22:33
SiDibut i HATE stuff popping up22:33
macvrSiDi: i changed the pop-under to daily22:33
SiDiand 32 dupes, ckontros22:33
ckontrosouch22:33
SiDimacvr: i changed to old behaviour22:33
SiDinever a feature has been so rejected by users22:34
SiDiand they DONT want to add a GUI-way to revert the change22:34
SiDiyou have to change a gconf key by hand22:34
ckontrosSuch is the way of progress. ;)22:34
macvrSiDi: mot is working on a new Update manager design22:34
macvrmpt!22:34
ckontrosIn a year, this will be forgotten. ;)22:34
macvrckontros: yeah! so true22:35
SiDickontros: its a progress if it addresses the aimed issue without pissing off a vast majority of the current userbase :D22:35
macvrthere were atleast 10 comments/day when jaunty was released ... now no one cares ;p22:35
* ckontros also wonders how much of this is driven by mobile?22:35
macvrexcept SiDi ;p22:35
ckontrosSiDi: Canonical can do things to piss alot of people off. People will still stay.22:36
ckontrosI will.22:36
SiDimacvr: i learnt it recently22:37
SiDii mostly use xfce as you know :p22:37
ckontrosActually, I'd switch to Debian. But, I haven't been pushed that hard yet. :P22:37
macvrckontros: the great thing about removal of the icon is > we dont think much about updates22:37
macvrSiDi: dont worry , u'll give up in a few days then22:37
* ckontros still updates by CLI.22:37
SiDickontros: same here. and anyway debian seems to import upstream only the polemic changes22:37
SiDimacvr: i already gave up for ubuntu22:38
SiDii know it'll stay like that unless something clearly preferable appears22:38
macvr;p22:38
SiDiwhich i'm thinking off, but i'm not a designer at all :p22:39
SiDianyway xubuntu doesnt ship it and will probably not ship it for the next years22:39
macvrSiDi: if they pop-up the update-window it will probably eat up the resources... i noticed that in an old netbook every time i opened the update window22:40
SiDiits not about that imo22:40
SiDii think they just didnt like the design22:41
SiDiwe dont ship PA either for instance22:41
ckontros[Breathe] Branches updated. https://code.launchpad.net/breathe-icon-set22:58
kwwiickontros: do you have breathe in a ppa yet?23:17
kwwiiif not, and you want/need my help I will put it in mine asap23:17
ckontroskwwii: You haven't been reading your email. ;)23:17
kwwiiI have a bunch of other stuff to do as well23:17
kwwiilol23:17
kwwiiyeah, I missed a lot of the breathe conversation23:18
kwwiiahhh23:18
kwwiiyes23:18
kwwiiok23:18
kwwiisorry23:18
ckontrosPPA is up and will get updated regularly and should go to REVU next week.23:18
kwwiidid he use my packaging?23:18
ckontrosI added your changes. He made more.23:19
kwwiicool23:19
ckontrosMostly license stuff.23:19
kwwiiwe should make an "ideal package" like we had in the past23:19
kwwiiperhaps with instructions for change23:19
kwwiibut that is another matter23:19
ckontrosLike a base package for other sets?23:20
kwwiiexactly23:20
ckontrosWould be nice to add to the example-look stuff.23:20
kwwiinot sure how many newbies want to start an icon theme23:21
ckontrosSure.23:21
kwwiibut it would be good to add somewhere :p23:21
kwwiialthough after packaging the humanity theme I must say there is no one-size-fits-all solution23:22
* ckontros notes that doing all the wiki linking is *not* fun but works pretty well. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/BreatheIconSet/Icons/Emotes23:22
ckontroskwwii: What do they do differently?23:22
kwwiithe whole set is svg and icon dirs are layed out differently than normal23:23
kwwiievery size has svgs instead of pngs23:23
ckontrosI wonder why?23:23
ckontrosOh neat.23:23
ckontrosBut maybe a little unnecessary.23:24
kwwiiyeah23:24
kwwiiI wonder why I say yeah all the time...in german is sounds different :p23:24
ckontros:)23:25
kwwiiat least it makes sense to me23:27
ckontrosmacvr: There's 1 issue with the notification-* icons. The script still tries to make a SVG in scalable/ but they are empty. Gotta figure something out for that. For now, I'll remove them manually.23:37
* kwwii heads out for the night...bis morgen!23:40

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