* mneptok stares at Channy01:38
Paddy_NIhey piracy discussion on #ubuntu01:40
mneptokPaddy_NI: anything we can help you with?01:40
Paddy_NImneptok: no.. not you01:41
mneptokPaddy_NI: is that all?01:41
Paddy_NIAre there any ops here apart from mneptok?01:41
Paddy_NImneptok: welcome to ignore :D01:41
mneptok /ignore'ing ops is a dangerous gambit01:42
mneptok(as is the veiled threat of 01:42
mneptok"i'm logging you"01:43
Paddy_NIMay I speak to an channel operator apart from mneptok please?01:43
naliothctmjr: is there something we can help you with?01:44
ctmjrwell was going to ask how to get a cloak but found it myself  i ask in freenode correct?01:45
naliothfor an unaffiliated cloak?01:45
ctmjryes for now01:45
naliothsaved you a trip  :p01:46
ctmjrthank you very much01:46
naliothyou're welcome01:46
mneptoknalioth: care to see what Paddy_NI has to say other than reporting !ot? if nothing else is on his agenda, it might be good to remind him of the no idling policy. apparently, i am /ignore'd.01:48
* mneptok will be nice and not remind him of the policy while on /ignore01:48
naliothPaddy_NI: 1247446108 19:48 <+mneptok> nalioth: care to see what Paddy_NI has to say other than reporting !ot? if nothing else is on his agenda, it might be good to remind him of the no idling policy. apparently, i am ignore'd.01:50
* mneptok tips his hat toward TX01:51
Paddy_NInalioth: apparently piracy is okay now01:51
naliothPaddy_NI: did you have anything else?01:51
Paddy_NInalioth: apparently not.. pity people dont know how to do their jobs any more01:52
mneptokmy "job"01:52
mneptokapparently people don;t have the sense not to tell other people how to do their jobs any more.01:53
naliothone man's "piracy" is another mans "what the devil are you talking about, sir?"01:53
mneptokme hearty.01:54
mneptok18:58 < th0r> xorso: if you changed the boot order the computer would read the cd first and not hang on the hd, but the net nazi doesn't like that idea01:59
mneptok18:58 < Paddy_NI> th0r: whom is the net nazi?01:59
mneptok18:59 < mneptok> Paddy_NI: please do not feed the troll. and please acknowledge that you have read my request.01:59
mneptoki suspect he will not answer. putting ops on /ignore is a bad idea.02:00
mneptoki'll ban forward him here to correct his mistake. but i suspect someone else will have to explain why it's not a good idea.02:00
naliothnah, he can talk to you02:01
* nalioth hangs the ticket on mneptok's peg02:01
tsimpsonnot if he's on /ignore02:01
naliothguess he'll just have to unignore . . .02:01
MadpilotPaddy_NI has whiffed of troll before, IIRC. The name seems too familiar.02:02
tsimpsonI think I recognise it from -ot, but not sure if that's a good or bad thing02:03
mneptoknot sure if it's Paddy_EIRE02:03
naliothunfortunately, it's quite similar to one of freenode's finest . . .02:04
naliothan no, paddy_eire is not a troll02:04
mneptokand Paddy_EIRE wouldn't put me on /ignore02:04
mneptok(as much as he may want to)02:04
tsimpsonI mean, I've seen it in -ot02:05
mneptokhe's in -ot now02:06
tsimpsonwas yesterday (for me) too02:06
tsimpsongoose: hi, can we help you?02:22
tsimpsongoose: this is not #ubuntu, you have been forwarded here because of you attitude in #ubuntu02:24
goosehow sweet; I'll be sure to modify my startup script as to reflect such02:25
tsimpsonmaybe someone should just change the forward to plain ban02:26
elky_workmaybe not a troll, but certainly a pseudotroll03:23
ubottuFloodBot2 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit)04:35
ubottuFloodBot1 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit)04:35
ubottuFloodBot3 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit)04:35
Flannel!away > Kyon0`Away 05:15
ubottuFloodBot2 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit)06:32
ubottuFloodBot1 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit)06:32
ubottuFloodBot3 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit)06:32
Flannelno k train?06:33
FlannelAlso, floodbots seem to not be banning victims06:34
naliothFlannel: the train has already left06:34
FlannelSo I can remove my ban?06:35
naliothif you want to06:50
Paddy_NIExcuse me why have I been kicked from #ubuntu?08:11
Paddy_NICould anyone tell me why I have been banned from #ubuntu ?08:13
Paddy_NItopyli: Are you here?08:14
MadpilotPaddy_NI, for /ignore on an op, far as I know08:18
Paddy_NII am perfectly within my rights08:18
Paddy_NIthere are many other ops that could have talked to me08:19
Paddy_NIthe one that is not doing his job properly kicked me08:19
Paddy_NIrather *banned* me08:19
Madpilothmm, reading the scrollback, there's also the feeding of trolls mentioned, but mostly the quasi-trollishness of /ignore mneptok 08:21
Paddy_NIthere are no trolling I have the scroll back here08:21
Paddy_NIshow me where I trolled08:21
Madpilot18:58 < Paddy_NI> th0r: whom is the net nazi?08:22
Madpilot18:59 < mneptok> Paddy_NI: please do not feed the troll. and please acknowledge that you have read my request.08:22
Paddy_NIMadpilot: yes.. as it was directed at me08:22
Paddy_NIMadpilot: so I got banned for that08:23
Paddy_NII chose to ignore an op that was not doing his job properly.. If he could please get over this childish huff that would be great thanks08:23
mneptok19:00 <+mneptok> 18:58 < th0r> xorso: if you changed the boot order the computer would read the cd first and not hang on the hd, but the net nazi doesn't like that idea08:23
mneptokNOT directed at Paddy_NI 08:24
Madpilotah, you are still up08:24
Paddy_NImneptok: yes it was.. 08:24
Madpilotyou're xorso as well?08:24
mneptokPaddy_NI: your nick is not xorso. and even if it was, do not feed trolls.08:24
ubottuThe above mess was caused by someone who thought it was funny (they're gone now). Please ignore it completely, since discussing it and making a fuss will only make them think they've reached their "fun" goal.08:24
mneptokwe even have a factoid to that effect08:24
Paddy_NImneptok: still not an excuse to ban me from the channel08:24
Paddy_NIand you banned me much later on08:25
Paddy_NIafter the fact.08:25
Paddy_NIwhich shows a rather childish over use of power in my opinion08:25
tsimpsonyou say "I chose to ignore an op that was not doing his job properly", what is your interpretation of "not doing his job properly"?08:25
mneptokyou were banned for not responding when i asked for an acknowledgment that you had read my request, and failed to do so.08:25
Paddy_NIthere was piracy discussion in the channel that he completely dismissed08:25
mneptoki asked people to stop. more than once.08:26
Paddy_NImneptok: you may have asked another op08:26
mneptokthat's as far as i chose to take it.08:26
Paddy_NIyou knew I ignored you08:26
mneptokthat was your decision. you live with the consequences of it.08:26
tsimpsonit's not your place to decide what his "job" is08:26
tsimpsonespecially since ops are volunteers08:27
Paddy_NIThis is really very biased.. is piracy not against the rules of the channel.. and is it not the ops responsibility to deal with it08:27
tsimpsonif you think there was some major transgression, the you should report it08:27
Paddy_NIto whom08:27
tsimpsonrather than just /ignore the op08:27
MadpilotPaddy_NI, given that you were right in the middle of the piracy discussion, you're not being too convincing right now08:27
Paddy_NIMadpilot: explain that08:28
tsimpsonhere or to the mailing list08:28
Paddy_NII was telling them to stop08:28
tsimpsonor the IRCC mailing list08:28
FlannelPaddy_NI: It's not our job to find someone who you will listen to; if you don't listen when asked, it's a problem, regardless of who asked you.08:28
MadpilotPaddy_NI, you were getting right into !feedthetroll territory08:28
Paddy_NII guess so.. but nothing was being done about it for quite a while Madpilot I was just showing a little initiative08:29
mneptok18:37 < Paddy_NI> Reitz: simply telephone dell then08:29
mneptok18:37 < Paddy_NI> gogeta: yes.. it is08:29
mneptok18:37 < Paddy_NI> gogeta: read the eula instead of making up your own rules08:29
mneptok18:37 < Paddy_NI> it is08:29
mneptok18:37 < Paddy_NI> and it should stop08:29
mneptok18:38 < Paddy_NI> gogeta: not to pirate it though08:29
mneptok18:38 < Paddy_NI> gogeta: your morals are very loose08:29
mneptok18:38 < gogeta> Paddy_NI: downloading a iso is not pirate unless you dont own it08:29
mneptok18:38 < Paddy_NI> gogeta: and he does not.08:29
mneptok18:38 < mneptok> gogeta Paddy_NI: drop it, please08:29
mneptok18:39 < Madpilot> gogeta, Paddy_NI, Reitz, whoever else - #ubuntu-offtopic or ##windows, please. Not here.08:29
mneptok18:39 < Paddy_NI> Reitz: what does linux have to do with pirating windows?08:29
mneptok18:40 < Paddy_NI> Reitz: telephone dell and I *guarantee* that you will not get a rar file ;)08:29
mneptokthat looks like a bit more than telling people to stop08:29
Paddy_NImneptok: I was trying to reason with them 08:30
mneptokand that looks like a bit more than telling people to stop08:30
Madpilottwo or three minutes is not really 'quite a while' when #ubuntu is busy, either08:30
Paddy_NIwell however I find the ban completely unnecessary especially since it only just took place a little while ago08:31
mneptoki banned you much earlier.08:31
mneptokthen i banned you a few minutes ago when your hostmask changed.08:31
mneptoki'll give you the benefit of the doubt that you were not deliberately evading.08:32
Paddy_NIOkay is there any chance that the ban can be lifted.. as the main error I made was to ignore you08:32
Paddy_NImneptok: no I am not deliberately evading08:32
mneptokplacing ops on /ignore is dangerous, as you have discovered.08:33
Paddy_NIWell I guess I learned the hard way08:33
mneptoktelling me my what my "job" is does not make me happy. the veiled threat of "i'm logging this" makes me even less happy. i'd like to be happy.08:34
mneptokthe ban is removed.08:37
mneptokplease play nicely.08:37
Paddy_NImneptok: thank you, I apologise for my attitude earlier08:37
mneptokappreciated, but not necessary.08:37
bazhangany ideas who masterbot was yesterday? had to kill my xchat session to escape from the dcc sends it was trying to give me14:11
naliothbazhang: not sure why, it flooded itself off almost instantly14:30
bazhangnalioth, thanks :)14:31
naliothas far as i saw, it only sent 3 DCC attempts14:35
bazhangthat was what I got; was away so could not cancel quickly enough14:36
* nalioth reserves his opinion on xchat14:37
naliothyou DO have it set to not accept DCC automatically, right?14:37
bazhangnow I do :)14:37
* nalioth facepalms14:38
PiciIs the default setting to allow them through?14:44
Tm_TPici: allow AND run too!14:45
bazhangon xchat at least14:45
PiciYuck, thats quite a bit of a security hole imo14:45
Tm_TPici: FYI, that run part was a joke, I hope14:45
PiciTm_T: I hope too14:46
bazhangpolicy on bots? if silent leave alone, or just kick if permission not asked? toxbot_ is not responding to PM or communication in channel15:25
Tm_Tif it is verified to be bot, remove with point to bot policy15:26
bazhangtwo of them in fact toxbot_ and toxbot__15:27
nalioth"all bots need approval"15:27
bazhangand Mystic as well15:29
naliothyeah, run 'em all out15:35
jussi01Ladies and Gents, we just wanted to run over the  "Ubuntu operator expectations" quickly, as it is a good thing to keep refreshed on what is expected of you.17:34
jussi01[07/13/09 19:27:00] [+Amaranth ] [+Gary     ] [+mneptok   ] [+stew       ] [ fdoving ] [ ubot3    ]17:34
jussi01[07/13/09 19:27:00] [+bazhang  ] [+ikonia   ] [+nalioth   ] [+SWAT       ] [ JanC    ] [ ubot4    ]17:34
jussi01[07/13/09 19:27:00] [+christel ] [+jpds     ] [+Pici      ] [+Tm_T       ] [ jdong   ] [ ubottu   ]17:34
jussi01[07/13/09 19:27:00] [+Dave2    ] [+jrib     ] [+pleia2    ] [+tomaw      ] [ jdong_  ] [ ubuntulog]17:34
jussi01[07/13/09 19:27:00] [+Daviey   ] [+jussi01  ] [+popey     ] [+tonyyarusso] [ juliux  ] [ Ursinha  ]17:34
jussi01[07/13/09 19:27:00] [+DLange   ] [+jussi01_ ] [+Pricey    ] [+topyli     ] [ Nafallo ]17:34
jussi01[07/13/09 19:27:00] [+elky     ] [+Mamarok  ] [+robotgeek ] [+tritium    ] [ Riddell ]17:34
jussi01[07/13/09 19:27:00] [+elky_work] [+Martinp23] [+Seeker`   ] [+tsimpson   ] [ ryanakca]17:34
jussi01[07/13/09 19:27:00] [+Flannel  ] [+Mez      ] [+SportChick] [+vorian     ] [ ubot2   ]17:35
jussi01oh dear, that wasnt supposed to paste17:35
popeygot everyone listening though, no doubt17:35
topyliat least you have an audience :)17:35
jussi01ANyway, I now hand over to nalioth to continue17:35
stewone thing that is expected of you, is to know how to use copy/paste :P17:36
topyliwe're doing a podcast in 25min here though17:36
naliothwe are not like any other operating system / distro17:36
* jussi01 hugs stew17:36
naliothwe should not act like the others here, either17:36
Nafallooh hai!17:36
jribleave bots that don't talk alone :/17:37
naliothto wit, when there are troublemakers, we should keep a "ladder of resolution" in mind when dealing with them, and our first interaction should be a PM 17:37
naliotha PM with "this is why your behaviour is not acceptable" can sometimes turn a troublemaker into an asset17:37
jribhonestly, I can't remember the last time that has worked for me17:38
naliothif the PM doesn't serve to mitigate the bad behaviour, a limited +q or a /remove should be used17:38
naliothkickbans should only be used as a last resort - never a first response17:39
naliothjrib: back in the day, it worked wonderfully17:39
naliothanyway, we've gotten away from "the kinder, gentler folks" that we are here on the irc, and it's not pretty  :(17:40
naliothany questionss or comments?17:41
jussi01No one has comments? 17:42
naliothfreenode isn't an "old school" network, and neither should Ubuntu be an "old school" community17:43
bazhangPM idea has merit ; if they are capable of suasion in cases like ifailatlife and one other yesterday where they are flooding huge lines of nonsense though, not so much17:44
nalioththe PM idea works.  we used it to good effect in the early days17:45
* Amaranth wonders what early days nalioth is remembering17:45
bazhangsure it does, when they enter right off the bat with obscenities and huge floods though not so much17:45
PiciWe also asked that people start using it again about 6 months ago, but it has fell into disuse again. I admit, I'm one of the people who stopped doing it as well,.17:46
jussi01bazhang: there is a guide to when to use certain types of bans on the operator guidelines page (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IrcTeam/OperatorGuidelines ) I trust you have read it?17:47
bazhangjussi01, yes I have, will read it once more thanks17:48
* Amaranth hasn't read it :P17:48
Amaranthoh, that page used to have another name, didn't it?17:48
jussi01Anyway, As I mentioned before, the purpose of this little discussion was to refresh, and remind. :)17:48
PiciDon't be afraid to ask here too if you aren't sure whether a kick or ban or whatever was necessary.17:49
jussi01The other operators and the IRC council are here to help you if needed. sometimes its best to talk it out, to gain a little more objectivity.17:51
topyliwell, i'm all for ubuntu being extra nice, including the ops17:53
bazhangthey are nice already17:53
Mezbazhang: depends who you ask :D18:21
bazhangMez, true :)18:21
bazhangthose being banned in -ot especially (power mad operators!!!1)18:22
ubottuIn #ubuntu, wizzo50 said: ubottu: What is the difference between the 2?19:29
ubottuIn ubottu, wizzo50 said: BestBot What is the difference between Ubuntu and Kubuntu and which is the best to use?19:32
Picicome on!19:33
PiciI messaged him...19:33
* genii sips19:58
* genii hands jussi01 a coffee20:05
* jussi01 waves, and politely declines the coffee... its almost bedtime20:19
Tm_Tjussi01: thanks for noticing (:20:22
* mneptok reads backscroll20:56
mneptoki'd be interested to know what prompts that reminder20:56
ikoniajust read the reminder, seems fair enough, I assume it's just common sense stuff, if a guy jumps in with an obvious troll quieting him before talking to him is appropriate (I assume)21:04
Ampelbeinhi there. you might want to watch for "imgoofygoober", he asked some troll-ish question in #ubuntu-classroom.21:16
Ampelbeini did not want to answer him because then he might just leave, but who knows what he is about to do.21:17
ikoniaAmpelbein: I've not got any power in there but I'll have a look in 21:32
ikoniaAmpelbein: sometimes people can be "talked down" if they become a problem21:33
Ampelbeinikonia: seems he's a one-time troll only.21:33
Ampelbeinikonia: in my experience, arguing with those kind is complete waste of time.21:34
ikoniaAmpelbein: does look it, but lets keep an eye out, thanks for the heads up21:34
ikoniaAmpelbein: totally agree21:34
Ampelbeinikonia: ok, have fun with him in case he wakes up ;-)21:34
ikoniano problem21:34
ikoniathank you21:34
ubottuFloodBot3 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit)22:19
jribthat was actually kind of funny22:20
ikonia!staff | someguy1 targeted DCC exploit22:20
ubottusomeguy1 targeted DCC exploit: Hey nalioth, jenda, rob, SportChick, seanw, Dave2, Christel, tomaw, Gary, Vorian, PriceChild or stew, I could use a bit of your time :)22:20
jribshould have muted him on his failed cat22:23
ikoniajrib: I was too slow22:24
stew17:20 -!- someguy1 [n=mooncup@static-72-64-146-9.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has quit [K-lined]22:24
ikoniaI'll remove the ban then22:24

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