lifelesspoolie: review done00:02
lifelesspoolie: I haven't made a vote as such, I'll leave it up to you. I would consider it needs-fixing if I were to vote00:03
poolieis this the same one ian reviewed?00:03
lifelessI didn't comment on the stuff he caught00:04
pooliei'm going to try to close mail soon and do that00:04
lifelessI'm going to look at this mv a b; mv b a; fail bug00:10
lifelessas I have dirstate paged in currently00:10
lifelessthen onto commit via deltas00:10
kenichii need help understanding the difference between rebase and merge --remember.  the situation is 3 unbound branches, A, B, C.  C was branched from A, A got merged to B, and C wants to get all of B's changes from now on.00:16
LeoNerdIt's about tree topology00:16
LeoNerdmerge joins two branches of a tree back together00:16
LeoNerdrebase pretends there wasn't a branch at all00:16
kenichiIIUC, rebase would make C look like it branched from B *today* and replay all of C's changes after that.00:16
kenichiand merge --remember would apply the changes and set parent_location for future use.00:17
LeoNerdmerge:   -----<======\----00:17
LeoNerdrebase: -------\_________00:17
LeoNerd(by terrible ASCII-art)00:17
lifelesspoolie: when thinking about testing00:18
lifelesspoolie: do remember that running the whole stack is very expensive00:18
lifelesspoolie: I hope that many easy bugs are best tested via tweaks to existing tests rather than new tests00:19
kenichiLeoNerd: thanks00:20
MT-any ideas what this error means? bzr: ERROR: bzrlib.errors.NotLefthandHistory: Supplied history does not follow left-hand parents00:21
poolielifeless: running the whole stack in the sense of run_bzr?00:23
lifelesswe say somewhere in our testing notes00:23
pooliemt-: um, it depends on the context00:23
poolieyes i do remember that00:23
lifelessthat best practice for blackbox tests is to use the low level API for setting up the scenario00:24
lifelessand only use the full stack when we're testing it00:24
MT-poolie: http://paste.ubuntu.com/218399/00:26
MT-poolie: somebody else is doing that. It works fine when I do it :S00:27
poolielifeless: yes, that's pretty much what i said in my mail00:28
igcmorning all00:29
pooliei'm not ignorant of that00:29
lifelesspoolie: ok cool00:29
pooliei'm just questioning whether it is worth trading some of that off against having:00:29
pooliebetter illustrations of what happens00:29
igchi poolie, lifeless00:29
poolieand easier approachability for people writing tests00:29
pooliewhether the second would actually happen enough to be worthwhile is uncertain00:29
pooliehello igc00:30
lifelessI am skeptical. We have lots of contributors that have wafted up and cloned tests very successfully00:31
poolieMT-: that would seem to be a bug, perhaps provoked by something in the source branch00:31
lifelesshi igc00:31
poolieMT-: the first thing i would try is going to a more recent bzr00:31
MT-poolie: I'll try that, thanks00:33
lifelesspoolie: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/bzr/+bug/395556 - you say in there you'll merge some tests. Have you?00:37
ubottuUbuntu bug 395556 in bzr "bzr mv (rename in place) causes commit to fail depending on specific filenames" [High,Confirmed]00:37
poolieso, we also have lots of contributors who balk at writing a test00:37
pooliepossibly they would do that even if testing was zero effort at all00:38
lifelesswe can test this cheaply00:38
lifelessby writing the tests ourselves, but *not* fixing up fallout00:38
lifelessby cheaply I mean, without inventing infrastructure that might not be used.00:39
pooliethat's a factor too00:39
lifelessif the contributors don't follow up and fix the regressions we find, then its pretty certain they wouldn't test that will regardless00:39
poolieanyhow, yes00:40
poolieit may be that in fact they've put up a patch that doesn't actually work00:40
pooliei'm just trying to think of some answer to "testing is too hard" beyond "suck it up"00:40
pooliealso, in reviewing aaron's patch, i do think it's suboptimal that there is no clear demonstration of how it actually works00:41
lifelessI agree with that00:41
poolielike the idea that lp should put screenshots of the proposed fix on bugs00:41
poolieheh, the analogy is interesting00:41
pooliebecause testing by comparing to screenshots is pretty sucky00:42
lifelesswe do have the ability, in run_bzr, to provide inputs to commands00:42
poolieas a stdin stringio?00:42
lifelesspoolie: the tests for bug 395556, did they land? and where can I find them -  are they XFAIL's?00:42
ubottuLaunchpad bug 395556 in bzr "bzr mv (rename in place) causes commit to fail depending on specific filenames" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/39555600:42
pooliei'll check, was talking to someone :-P00:43
lifelesspoolie: yes, though I think we provide glue to make it easier to use than that00:43
pooliei think i submitted them00:43
poolieyes, there are knownfailure tests in trunk00:44
pooliegrep for that bug number00:44
kenichiLeoNerd: i went with merge --remember, but the parent_location of the branch did not change upon commit... what am i misunderstanding?00:45
poolieone way to look at it is i'm suggesting more or higher-quality glue00:45
poolieinput as blah(... stdin="y\n\n\n\r\n") is not so easy to review00:45
poolieimproving that can be done stepwise00:46
pooliewithout going away from the other things that are good in our test suite00:46
poolieand i think not at a terribly high cost00:46
pooliespiv, re https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~mbp/bzr/391411-reconfigure-stacked/+merge/852700:47
pooliewould making RemoteRepository be a Repostiory subclass be very traumatic?00:48
* jml -> chatswood for breakfast.00:51
spivpoolie: not sure.  Well, I'm sure there was a reason why it wasn't done like that initially.00:53
spivPerhaps a good starting point would be to create a new common base class for RemoteRepository and Repository, and gradually move things into that?00:53
spivPerhaps we'll be able to collapse that base class and Repository fairly rapidly.00:54
poolieheh, that's what i was doing00:54
poolielifeless didn't like it :)00:54
pooliebut maybe with a comment it would get by00:54
spivIt is a little odd to me that we have Branch and BzrBranch, but no similar split for Repository.00:54
GungaDinHas anyone here used bzr from a virtual machine?00:55
lifelessI don't recall any good reason for them being different00:56
lifelessI think it is worth doing a test run with RR as a subclass of Repository00:56
lifelessit will answer the question much faster than speculation00:56
lifelessits true that there is potential for confusion, having a proxy object subclass the thing it proxies00:57
lifelessbut that shouldn't be worse than with Branch00:57
lifelessspiv: we do have a split in the repository classes00:57
lifelessspiv: Repository is the abstract interface - we have wildly different subclasses00:58
lifelessGungaDin: yes, people have used bzr from vms00:58
lifelessGungaDin: some of the core developers do so regularly.00:58
GungaDinand they're able to checkout stuff without problems?00:59
GungaDinwith bzr+ssh?00:59
lifelessyes and yes01:00
lifelessI really encourage you to file a bug so that *all* the developers can help you, rather than just the ones that see what you type here.01:01
GungaDinI also installed Ubuntu in VirtualBox... and the problem persists.01:01
GungaDinbtw.. I was able to checkout with https... but not with bzr+ssh.01:01
GungaDinwell, I can't be sure it's a bug.01:02
GungaDinat least not necessarily in Bazaar.01:02
lifelessthats fine01:03
lifelessbug trackers are a place to discuss problbems01:03
lifelessthere is no requirement that everything in them be known to be a bug prior to putting the thing in the bug tracker01:04
lifelessif there was such a requirement, very few bugs would ever be put in bugtrackers01:04
GungaDinI don't think it's bzr...01:05
GungaDinnow for the first time it's gone past this stage...01:05
GungaDinand it'sa ctually building the tree...01:05
lifelessits happening to bzr01:06
GungaDinwhat the hell is going on...01:06
lifelesseven if its not bzr we'd like to know whats going on01:06
MT-I have a section of a bug tracker that's almost entirely used for discussions and notes..01:06
lifelessso that we can advise other people if they have these symptoms01:06
GungaDinlifelfess - I'd like to file as much as i can... but it's happening at my work... so I'm a bit limited getting all the info.01:06
lifelessor perhaps we can come up with a change to bzr to reduce this happening01:06
lifelessGungaDin: I can appreciate that01:07
GungaDinwhat would you have me do, then?01:07
lifelessfile a bug :)01:08
lifelesstell us what you can01:09
lifelessthis will let folk that are not here right now chime in01:09
lifelessit sounds like it just worked for you though?01:09
GungaDinok, I filed a bug report.01:18
GungaDinyes, now it just worked....01:19
lifelesswell thats some good news:)01:19
pooliesee? isn't filing bugs good? :)01:20
GungaDinanyway, thanks for your help.01:26
garyvdmHi igc - I'm finished everything I wanted to on the TreeWidget. Any thoughts on what to tackle next?01:39
lifelessigc: I've pushed all my inventory delta prophylactic code btw01:41
igchi garyvdm!02:13
garyvdmHi Ian02:14
igcgaryvdm: the next thing I was hoping you'd work on was ...02:14
igca better revision widget02:14
igcor was it a better branch widget? I forget02:14
igcanyhow, one or both of them given ...02:15
garyvdmbranch widget?02:15
igcnumerous q* commands use those02:15
igcgaryvdm: I'd need to look over my notes but ...02:16
igcI think the main issue was being able to select a merge directive, not just a directory02:16
garyvdmOk - Let me look at the revision selector.02:17
igcgaryvdm: thanks. I suspect it was far more important than the branch one02:18
igcgaryvdm: there were also some small qbzr issues that someone (perhaps you?) could fix soon:02:19
igc1. the compatibility with bzr-pipeline issue02:19
igc2. qinfo working on a shared repo02:19
igc3. qrevert dropping pending merges02:20
garyvdmigc: if you have a chance - please try out lp:~garyvdm/qbzr/newwtlist02:20
igcgaryvdm: I'll take a look at those next week say if no-one gets to them02:20
igcgaryvdm: I need to focus on some 2.0 stuff this week but I promise I'll take a (another) look this weekend say02:22
garyvdmigc: Np - I understand.02:22
igc(my nights are pretty full this week with family stuff)02:22
garyvdmigc: For no. 3 - I posted a mockup to the bug. How does that look?02:23
igcgaryvdm: that looks good02:24
garyvdmCool - I get that done.02:24
garyvdmFirst - a itch scratch - Spell checker suggestions in qcommit :-)02:25
igcgaryvdm: also, did you see the comments from lifeless re register_lazy_decorated?02:26
igcgaryvdm: I'm reviewing that now btw02:26
igcgaryvdm: if you're in agreement with Robert's comments, I'll defer my review till you've done those changes02:27
garyvdmYes - but unfortunately - that won't really help to solve the bzr-pipeline compatibility problem. It's a bit more complex.02:27
=== TDJACR is now known as TheDJACR
igcgaryvdm: so pipeline and qbzr are both overriding the merge command from what I've been told02:34
igcgaryvdm: if that's right, why does qbzr need to?02:34
garyvdmqbzr adds merge --qpreview02:35
garyvdmwhich shows the preview in qdiff02:35
jmlpoolie, thanks for the prompt & clear metronome response02:40
pooliethanks for the metronome02:40
pooliealso for the "these people are wrong" :-)02:40
jmlso, I'm thinking of not RMing 1.17+102:46
jmlI'd really like to get back into actually writing code.02:46
igcgaryvdm: so I think we need to rethink qdiff launching actually02:51
garyvdmqdiff or qpreview?02:51
igcgaryvdm: I like qdiff but sometimes I really want to use meld for a period of time, e.g. when doing a complex review02:52
igcgaryvdm: if I configure meld as a diff tool, then qcommit (say) still launches qdiff but then let's me launch meld from there IIUIC02:52
igcgaryvdm: I kind of think it should just launch meld directly02:53
garyvdmigc - You can make meld the default. Then if you click on diff in any of the qbzr windows, if will open meld02:53
igcgaryvdm: also, maybe "merge -qpreview" is better as "merge --review --using qdiff" or something like that02:54
igcgaryvdm: I tried that and it didn't seem to work for me. I'll try again soon02:54
garyvdmigc - yes02:54
garyvdmigc - it won't (go straight to meld) if you just run bzr qdiff - so we probably need to make things like bzr explorer aware of the qdiff config.02:57
igcgaryvdm: what about making qdiff smarter and getting it to launch the right default diff tool?03:12
igcgaryvdm: I can make epxlorer smarter but those smarts need to also go into ...03:12
igcTortoiseBzr, qbzr-eclipse, etc.03:13
igcgaryvdm: seems better to just make qdiff Do The Right Thing IMO03:13
garyvdmigc - 1. If you do that, and you make some other tool the default, how do you get into qdiff?03:14
garyvdmMaybe add a option to qdiff: bzr qdiff --usingconfigdefault03:15
garyvdm2. - err forgot what 2 was.03:15
igcgaryvdm: 1. not sure. Adding an option would work fine (either way).03:16
dashI did 'bzr uncommit' and now I regret it. however, the revision id that uncommit gave me has scrolled off my terminal. is there any way to get it back? :)03:19
garyvdmdash: install bzrtools plugin03:20
garyvdmdash: run bzr heads --dead03:20
* igc lunch then back onto reviewing apply-inv-delta patch from lifeless03:21
dashach. this is branched from SVN03:22
dashand i'm getting an error from the svn server as a result of that command03:22
dash(not a checkout, not a lightweight checkout, a branch)03:22
garyvdmdash: sorry - not sure then.03:23
dashpretty weird =/03:25
dashthanks for the pointer anyway03:25
=== _thumper_ is now known as thumper
=== garyvdm_ is now known as garyvdm
=== ja1 is now known as jam
dashheh, ran some of the code from the heads plugin mnually03:41
dashgot it back :)03:41
dashhooray for bzr.03:42
poolielifeless: why remove the branches? because they're no longer playing the same role of being canonical and primary?04:51
lifelesspoolie: several reasons; its faster to pull from lp; lp has a branch viewer; we don't point people at the directory anyway - we have a wiki page listing the urls04:52
pooliethis seems like a reason to change the wiki not remove them04:53
lifelesschanging the wiki is implicit04:53
lifelessby which I mean the wiki page should point at the primary location04:54
poolieis bug 399540 the guy who was talking to you before here?04:54
ubottuLaunchpad bug 399540 in bzr "bzr works strangely in a virtual machine guest" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/39954004:54
pooliewhat a weird bug04:54
lifelessI think so04:54
poolieigc, i've updated the spreadsheet, review it at your convenience05:27
* poolie crosses off another item05:27
igcpoolie: thanks05:41
poolielifeless, spiv, igc, i'm out for a bit, online again after 506:44
lifelesspoolie: I'll be gone by then; ciao.06:44
=== abentley1 is now known as abentley
lifelessso, 3 bugs fixed.07:00
lifelesssent up for review.07:00
lifelessciao y'all07:11
vilahi all07:26
* spiv ducks out to shops07:41
jelmermwhudson: hey08:08
jelmermwhudson: Are the git revisions imported one-by-one by launchpad?08:09
mwhudsonjelmer: no08:09
mwhudsonwell, what do you mean?08:09
jelmermwhudson: I'm subscribed to the samba branch, and woke up to find 750 new emails waiting for me...08:09
mwhudsonjelmer: the emails are done one by one and the import was broken for a few weeks08:09
mwhudsonjelmer: there's nothing special about git imports here08:09
mwhudson(we should probably avoid this sort of flood somehow though)08:10
jelmermwhudson: that'd be nice08:15
jelmermwhudson: does this also happen for "native" bzr branches, if somebody pushes multiple revisions to them?08:16
mwhudsonjelmer: yes08:16
phurlhi all08:16
phurli have a launchpad branch i would like to merge to08:16
jelmermwhudson: ah, ok08:16
jelmermwhudson: It's just a temporary thing then I guess, since this branch got "unbroken" because of the new bzr-git08:16
mwhudsonjelmer: right08:17
mwhudsonjelmer: it makes rebasing a bit interesting!08:17
phurlwhat is the syntax of that? do i got to my existing branch and say bzr merge ******08:17
jelmerphurl: bzr merge lp:~username/projectname/branchname08:23
jelmermwhudson: did something just land that makes sure the cache is kept?08:33
jelmermwhudson: I was a bit surprised to see the samba branch working now08:33
mwhudsonjelmer: yes08:35
jelmermwhudson: \o/08:40
johnskulskican anyone point me to documentation about keeping one bzr branch in another?08:48
johnskulskisay I have project1/ and module1/  and I want to keep a copy of module1 within project108:48
johnskulskiis this a vendor branch08:49
=== abentley1 is now known as abentley
jmljohnskulski, the feature is known as 'nested trees', and it's not implemented in Bazaar (yet)08:51
johnskulskijml:: i see. is there a workflow without using 3rd party tools?08:52
LarstiQjohnskulski: with bzr-scmproj08:53
johnskulskihave you all used either that or config-manager? are they solid?08:53
jmljohnskulski, it depends on what you mean by 'third party tools' and what you're exact use case is. You can do a pretty good job with symlinks & a couple of simple shell scripts08:53
LarstiQjohnskulski: I've used scmproj, but most people get by without anything of the sorts08:54
johnskulskihm ok08:54
asabiloui ?08:54
asabilsorry wrong window :)08:54
jmljohnskulski, I haven't used config-manager directly, but I'm told that the Launchpad development team use it.08:54
johnskulskithanks for you advice.08:55
johnskulskiit would be great to push back changes from individual projects08:56
johnskulskijml:: what would the shell scripts do?08:56
johnskulskigenerate and apply patches?08:56
jmluhh, they'd reimplement config-manager :)08:57
jmlor as much of it as you actually need for what you want to do.08:58
johnskulskijml:: i'm confused on what commands would accmplish what I'm trying to do09:03
johnskulski(new to bzr)09:03
jmljohnskulski, what are you trying to do?09:04
johnskulskiproject/ is a bzr repository, module1/ is a bzr repo, i would like to have project/module1/ be a branch of module1 such that i can add it to the project repos (so another branch will have that) and push changes back to module1/ (bug fixes, the module is shared among other projects)09:06
jmlwow... getting acf locally!09:07
jmljohnskulski, not related to our conversation, but related to the channel more generally :)09:08
jml(I'm multitasking a little atm)09:08
johnskulskino worries :)09:08
jmljohnskulski, so, what you'd do is have a script or a make step or something in project/ that run 'bzr branch central-copy:module1'09:09
jmljohnskulski, that is, there'd be no tightly defined relationship between project/ & module1/ in bzr itself, it would be a part of your build scripts.09:10
johnskulskijml:: i am not sure what central-copy: means09:10
johnskulskii am not find it in the docs09:10
jmlthere's going to be a canonical location for module1 right?09:11
jmlon one of your servers or launchpad or whatever09:11
jmlthe thing that's 'trunk' for that module.09:11
johnskulskiyeah this will all be on a local filesystem09:11
jmljohnskulski, is it just you working on the project?09:11
johnskulskisomething liek /var/bzr/shared/module109:11
johnskulskijml:: no about 12 of us09:12
johnskulskiall diferent projects09:12
johnskulskiusually sperately09:12
jmlwhy are you sharing a filesystem?09:12
johnskulskicentral dev09:12
jmlcan't you afford hard drives?09:12
jmlanyway, that's off topic09:12
johnskulskiwe have a centralized development server09:13
johnskulskisame machine09:13
jmlyou can't run the project on your local machines?09:13
igcnight all09:13
johnskulskijml:: it doesn't matter :)09:13
jmlso, as I was saying, you'd have something in your build scripts that says, 'bzr branch file:///var/bzr/shared/module1'09:14
jmlor a variation on that.09:15
johnskulskilet me tyr this, thanks!09:16
jmlI work on Launchpad. We have a bunch of dependencies that we manage in branches. We pull those from a server using a script, and then whenever we create a branch locally, we run another script to symlink those branches into that new branch.09:16
jml(because we tend to have one branch per feature/bugfix)09:16
johnskulskijml, do you work with applications?09:24
jmljohnskulski, I don't follow. I work on Launchpad itself. :)09:25
johnskulskimy set up is: we are a webapp shop and generally we work on 8-10 projects at a time all based off a standard framework, on top of that we have modules that we would like to include in each projects. it would be a great win if say i'm working a project and could push back changes to the framework or module09:26
johnskulskimaybe another set up is more appropriate09:26
johnskulskilaunchpad itself? the webapp?09:26
jmljohnskulski, yes.09:26
fullermdI tend to just merge in modules that I use in multiple places.  That doesn't work well for the case where you want to work ON the module in the context of a given project, and then push those module changes back upstream though.09:28
fullermdBut I don't do that very often, so dealing with it manually in those cases works well enough for me.09:28
johnskulskijml:: we don't do builds, which may be something we could switch to09:28
johnskulskifullermd:: so if you fix something in the module, you generate a patch and apply it to it manually?09:30
=== abentley1 is now known as abentley
fullermdjohnskulski: In one form or another, yah.09:37
fullermdMost of the time I just work on changes directly in the module though (and the ones that make that hard, I have on my list to improve so that it's not)09:38
LarstiQjohnskulski: seriously, have a look at scmproj09:38
fullermdYah.  The 'by-reference' style nested tree work will be most like what you want, and scmproj is a variant of that.09:40
johnskulskiLarstiQ:: yes this looks great09:52
johnskulskithis channel proves helpful everytime, thanks!09:52
=== mario__ is now known as pygi
=== beuno_ is now known as beuno
eyda|moncan someone remind me what plugin is required to get the webserve thing going?13:23
vilaloggerhead ?13:24
eyda|monyes, thanks13:25
eyda|monhow do I use this thing?13:30
eyda|monhow do I see what plugin commands are avail?13:31
luksbzr plugins13:38
=== Pilky_ is now known as Pilky
eyda|monluks: that tells me what plugins are available, not what the commands are13:53
spiveyda|mon: bzr commands, although that will list builtin commands.13:54
luksoh, sorry, I misread the question13:54
spivBut will include the plugins too :)13:54
eyda|monluks:  no worries13:54
luksbzr help commands13:54
spivEr, sorry: bzr help commands13:54
eyda|monso there's no specific command to just list the ones for a specific plugin13:54
luksbzr help commands | grep PLUGINNAME :)13:54
eyda|monI'm trying to use the loggerhead but there are no instructions on their site13:55
LarstiQbzr help plugins/<plugin> ?13:55
eyda|mongrep works :)13:55
luksthat shows you the help page, not a list of commands13:55
LarstiQluks: sure, but it is probably more helpful13:55
LarstiQluks: seeing as loggerhead doesn't feature in commands, but does mention how it works in the plugin help13:56
LarstiQluks: to be fair, eyda|mon asked the wrong question ;)13:57
luksI know nothing about loggerhead, just answering questions :)13:57
LarstiQeyda|mon: found the `bzr serve --http`?13:57
eyda|monLarstiQ: to be fair, eydaimon didn't know what question to ask because the plugin setup isn't obvious13:57
* LarstiQ nods at eyda|mon 13:57
eyda|monLarstiQ: yes, thanks13:57
spiveyda|mon: also, the README file might help: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~loggerhead-team/loggerhead/trunk-rich/annotate/head%3A/README13:57
LarstiQeyda|mon: asking the right question is not easy to do13:58
eyda|monI was after what I thought would be a common interface on how to use plugins13:58
eyda|monor to find out their usage anyway13:58
spivPlugins can do quite a wide variety of things :)13:58
LarstiQeyda|mon: I usually look at the README13:58
eyda|monthat's why I think it would be nice if I could just do bzr plugins PLUGIN and it would tell me the avilable commands13:59
spivSome add commands, some extend existing commands, some add hooks, some add new formats, etc...13:59
LarstiQeyda|mon: but I think stressing something useful in the online help system is a good idea13:59
eyda|monand that includes extending, adding, hooks etc :)13:59
eyda|monLarstiQ: are you suggesting I file a ticket?14:00
spiveyda|mon: that's "bzr help plugin/<foo>" at the moment.14:00
LarstiQeyda|mon: I didn't yet, but yes please :)14:01
spivPerhaps "bzr plugins" should suggest that, it's not particularly discoverable at the moment.14:01
* LarstiQ nods at spiv14:01
fullermdThere is no help plugin/XYZ...14:01
fullermdThere's plugin_s_/XYZ, but that just gives the 1-liner.14:01
spivfullermd: sorry, typo.  Thanks14:01
spivfullermd: try plugins/svn or plugins/gtk14:02
LarstiQor plugins/loggerhead14:02
spivfullermd: it's not necessarily a one-liner.14:02
fullermdSure, but that's only if the plugin lists it.  bzrtools frex tells you nothing.14:02
spivFile a bug on bzrtools :)14:02
eyda|monyou guys are missing the help plugins :)14:03
eyda|monseems like something so useful as loggerhead should be included in bzr14:04
spiveyda|mon: yeah, that's been discussed occasionally.  I don't recall the outcome, though.14:05
fullermdWell, once you add up all the so-useful-to-$PERSON's, you end up with a real big tarball  ;)14:05
eyda|monfullermd: I'm more important than others so, my useful-to-eydaimon should be considered very carefully14:06
spivI know we would like to make it easy to do something like "bzr serve --http" to run up a quick and simple bzr+http smart server with loggerhead.14:06
spiveyda|mon: :)14:06
eyda|monyeah, like mercurials14:07
fullermdeyda|mon: Oh, I didn't realize it was YOU.  Carry on.14:07
eyda|monnothing fancy, but it works14:07
eyda|monfullermd: there we go :)14:07
* eyda|mon wonders when people will start to grasp his importance14:07
fullermdProbably not 'till after they give up on their screwed up sleep schedules and just synchronize with mine.14:08
* fullermd still vaguely wishes to be able to sufficiently flexibilate URL handling on bzr+http.14:09
fullermd(and flexibilate is totally a word.  You can look it up.  In my brain.)14:10
* eyda|mon makes a new port for SimpleTAL since macports doesn't have one.14:12
eyda|monfeels like I'm ALWAYS making new ports14:12
fullermdHey, welcome to MY life...14:12
hmeland_I've had a look at one of the 'easy' open bugs, namely #72227 -- but I am unable to reproduce the problem with the current bzr (1.17~rc1+4531+117 from the nightly ppa).14:15
hmeland_Does anyone know if the problem still is present?14:16
fullermdbug 7222714:16
ubottuLaunchpad bug 72227 in bzr "should avoid loading modules from working directory" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/7222714:16
fullermdSeems like I heard it mentioned just last week or so, biting somebody.14:16
LarstiQehm, that one is not actually easy14:17
fullermdHey, paramiko moved to git...14:17
LarstiQhmeland_: it certainlly still happens. Do you have access to Windows?14:18
hmeland_LarstiQ: Yes, I can install Bazaar in my XP virtualbox.  Is the problem only happening on Windows, though?14:19
LarstiQhmeland_: no, it happens everywhere14:19
LarstiQwell, maybe not everywhere then14:21
hmeland_A transcript of (one of) my attempts at reproducing it can be found here: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/218919/14:21
hmeland_Where am I going wrong?14:21
LarstiQhmeland_: some but not all python installations add '' to the path14:23
* LarstiQ looks for one of the duplicates14:23
hmeland_According to http://docs.python.org/library/sys.html#sys.path , the '' stuff should only happen if "the script directory is not available".14:25
hmeland_Are you saying that some Python versions are getting this wrong, or is it stuff that some distributions of Python get wrong (e.g. in their site.py)?14:27
LarstiQhmeland_: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/bzr/+bug/30489114:27
ubottuUbuntu bug 304891 in bzr "bzr doesn't work in parent directories of python packages with certain names (dup-of: 72227)" [Undecided,New]14:27
ubottuUbuntu bug 72227 in bzr "should avoid loading modules from working directory" [High,Confirmed]14:27
LarstiQhmeland_: one of those I guess14:27
eyda|monalright, port submitted14:28
eyda|monnow to continue on with the installation of loggerhead :)14:28
LarstiQhmeland_: I personally can't get it to reproduce on Lenny either14:28
LarstiQhmeland_: but I've witnessed it in the past14:28
LarstiQeyda|mon: thanks :)14:28
LarstiQhmeland_: you could ask wgrant14:28
eyda|monLarstiQ: it was the port for simpletal. I guess I could make for loggerhead too14:29
LarstiQeyda|mon: is that MacPorts?14:31
eyda|monLarstiQ: yes14:33
eyda|monthe loggerhead tarball untarred a bunch of files in the extract dir14:33
* eyda|mon whines14:33
eyda|monit does have a setup.py though. that will make it easy to install at least the libs14:34
wgrantLarstiQ: I'm confused - I know nothing about that bug, so why am I suggested?14:41
LarstiQwgrant: eek, sorry :/14:43
wgrantLarstiQ: 'tis no problem. I'm just intrigued as to why me. But I'm half asleep, so I'm also intrigued as to why I'm not in bed yet.14:47
* wgrant goes to bed.14:47
LarstiQwgrant: because in my memory it was you, and I glossed over the reports name starting with a W but being different14:48
fullermdAll then W's look alike to me...14:48
=== ddaa1 is now known as ddaa
eyda|mon bzr serve --http15:12
eyda|monbzr: ERROR: No module named config15:12
eyda|monYou may need to install this Python library separate15:12
eyda|monany idea what's missing here?15:12
eyda|monit's not listed in depenency for loggerhead15:13
LarstiQeyda|mon: could you pastebin the backtrace from .bzr.log?15:13
LarstiQwoo, that is not supposed to happen15:15
LarstiQeyda|mon: is there a 'loggerhead' directory in your cwd?15:17
LarstiQeyda|mon: how did you install loggerhead? It looks you might have one layer of hierarchy too much in ~/.bazaar/plugins/loggerhead/loggerhead/15:21
LarstiQeyda|mon: if ~/.bazaar/plugins/loggerhead/ only contains the loggerhead directory, move that one up15:21
eyda|monlet me wipe it and start over15:22
eyda|monmaybe the port installed another one15:22
LarstiQhow I would install it: `bzr branch lp:loggerhead ~/.bazaar/plugins/`15:23
eyda|monyeah, but I'm making a port since I'm at it15:24
* LarstiQ nods15:24
LarstiQeyda|mon: in that case, the right location is probably bzrlib/plugins/15:24
eyda|moncan I find that path out from running some bzr cmd?15:25
LarstiQeyda|mon: `bzr --version` should tell you15:25
eyda|monmeh, I'll need to parse that output with tcl15:26
eyda|monwho chooses tcl.. gree15:26
eyda|moni don't suppose loggerhead itself knows where to install itself15:26
eyda|monoh, there's a gtk port15:27
eyda|monI can see how they did it15:27
fullermdThere's probably a bzrtools port too, which may be quicker to read.15:27
eyda|monthere is15:28
eyda|mondoesn't look like it does anything special to install.. maybe it's setup.py takes care of it for it.15:29
fullermdYah, setup.py does all that fiddling...15:29
eyda|monbut it doesn't do that for loggerhead15:30
eyda|monsame with gtk15:30
LarstiQso where does gtk end up then?15:31
eyda|monI have to go. I guess I will resume this later.15:34
LarstiQeyda|mon: ah, I think it might be the packager_dir/packages pointing to bzrlib.plugins?15:34
LarstiQeyda|mon: k15:34
=== kiko-afk is now known as kiko
jnz_Hi, when I type `bzr send -o ~/filepath' there's are some errors: http://www.nopaste.com/p/aoIFcyzjab16:23
vilajnz_: wow, 'bzr version' , 'bzr info' please16:25
jnz_1.14.1, http://www.nopaste.com/p/ajijogjifb16:27
vilajnz_: hmm, sorry,  'bzr info -v'16:28
vilajnz_: anyway, the warnings are ugly enough, file a bug,16:30
vilajnz_: Can you try to upgrade to a more recent version of bzr ?16:31
vilajnz_: Also, have a look in .bzr.log, there may be more detailed info there16:32
jnz_ok, I'll try. If I still have the problem, I should open a file? where? (sorry I'm new to bzr)16:33
vilajnz_: np, welcome on board :)16:34
jnz_ah right16:34
jnz_thanks :)16:34
_gpg_is it possible to have the latest release (and updates) for ubuntu 8.04 ?17:35
luksuse the ppa?17:40
vila_gpg_: https://edge.launchpad.net/~bzr/+archive/ppa and take your pick17:40
_gpg_vila, thank you17:42
_gpg_vila, i have seen it just before your post :)17:43
jnz_ok, I've resolved upgrading to 1.16.1 :>17:48
cellofellowI'm trying to push a bzr branch to an svn repository. The bzr branch has about five revisions that need to be pushed. I got this error: bzr: ERROR: Operation denied because it would change the mainline history. Set the append_revisions_only setting to False on branch "http://runningmethod.com/svn/runningmethod/mrc/trunk" to allow the mainline to change.18:37
cellofellowIs there a way to push my changes as one svn revision?18:37
jelmercellofellow: yes, set the append_revision_only setting to False18:39
jelmercellofellow: as the error message indicates :-)18:39
cellofellowwhere's that setting?18:39
jelmercellofellow: in locations.conf, subversion.conf or bazaar.conf18:41
cellofellowok, added to bazaar.conf18:41
fullermdI didn't know you COULD pivot the mainline history in svn...18:42
cellofellowcan I wrap up all my revisions into one somehow?18:43
Luke-Jrjelmer: why does bzr-svn never seem to work for anything other than the simplest stuff? :þ19:15
jelmerLuke-Jr: what's not working?19:15
Luke-Jrpushing a merge19:16
jelmerLuke-Jr: what about it is not working?19:16
Luke-Jrbzr: ERROR: exceptions.AssertionError: path: path/to/THIS/branch, 197 ≥ 47119:16
jelmerLuke-Jr: what version?19:16
Luke-Jrbzr: ERROR: exceptions.AssertionError: path: path/to/THIS/branch, 197 >= 47119:16
Luke-Jrbzr 1.15.1; bzr-svn 0.6.119:17
jelmerLuke-Jr: please try 0.6.2 or the 0.6 branch, if that doesn't work please file a bug19:17
Luke-Jrtell bzr overlay guy to update? :þ19:17
jelmerLuke-Jr: it might just be that the existing data in your repository is broken and that's continuing bzr-svn to break19:17
Luke-Jrbetter not be :þ19:18
Luke-Jrthis isn't even the same repository that was giving me problems before19:19
jelmerdoes the other repository work now?19:20
Luke-Jrusing 0.6.2, get a different error19:20
Luke-Jrno idea19:20
Luke-Jrbzr: ERROR: Tags not supported by SvnBranch('svn+https://svn.openmethodscorp.com/svn/SoftPhone/Harte-Hanks/CTI/Cvlan-Server'); you may be able to use bzr upgrade.19:20
Luke-Jrerr, ignore the paths in that of course ☺19:20
Luke-Jrjelmer: so am I just not allowed to tag things? :þ19:21
jelmerLuke-Jr: that one isn't a bug19:21
jelmerLuke-Jr: your local branch has tags but bzr-svn doesn't know where to store the tags in the svn repositories19:22
Luke-Jrneither do I19:22
Luke-JrI don't see a push option to omit tags19:22
jelmerLuke-Jr: there isn't one19:22
Luke-Jrso how do I get past this?19:22
Luke-Jrideally without losing my local tags19:23
jelmerLuke-Jr: remove your local tags19:23
jelmerLuke-Jr: or modify your configuration to indicate where the tags are in svn19:23
Luke-Jrnowhere :þ19:23
Luke-Jrcan't it just be lossy in that regard?19:23
jelmerLuke-Jr: bzr would need infrastructure for that first19:23
jelmerLuke-Jr: this is unrelated to bzr-svn19:24
Luke-Jrfine, how do I make it put them in a tags dir?19:24
jelmerLuke-Jr: set the tags option in the configuration19:24
Luke-Jrwhat configuration?19:24
jelmerLuke-Jr: subversion.conf or locations.conf19:25
Luke-Jrtags = svn/SoftPhone/Harte-Hanks/CTI/Server-tags/*19:28
Luke-Jrstill does the same thing19:28
jamhey jelmer how's it going?19:29
jelmerhey jam19:29
jelmerjam: pretty good, hanging out in Madrid19:29
jamsounds like fun19:30
jamI was wondering if you had a chance to look at the small patches to bzr-svn and bzr-rewrite to get them to work properly with bzr 1.17 (especially when bundled for windows)19:30
jelmerLuke-Jr: try running "bzr svn-layout" on that URL, that should tell you where it will store the tags19:30
jelmerjam: I already applied an alternative fix to the bzr-svn one19:31
jelmernot sure about bzr-rewrite19:31
jamjelmer: did you make a release?19:31
Luke-Jrbzr: ERROR: Not a Subversion branch or repository.19:31
jamI didn't see a new release on Launchpad at least19:31
jammwhudson: I have a partial fix for bug #393366. There are some edge cases it doesn't quite handle, so I was wondering if you could determine how often those edge cases occur19:32
ubottuLaunchpad bug 393366 in bzr "KeyError in knit.simple_annotate running annotate on a stacked branch" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/39336619:32
jam(bug #399884)19:32
ubottuLaunchpad bug 399884 in bzr "get_record_stream(..., 'topological', True) in pre 2.0 formats does not preserve topological sorting across stacking boundaries" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/39988419:32
Luke-JrRepository root: svn+https://svn.openmethodscorp.com/svn/SoftPhone19:32
Luke-JrLayout: CustomLayout(['Harte-Hanks/CTI/Cvlan-Server'],[])19:32
Luke-JrBranch path: Harte-Hanks/CTI/Cvlan-Server19:32
Luke-JrProject: Harte-Hanks/CTI/Cvlan-Server19:32
Luke-Jrbzr: ERROR: Layout CustomLayout(['Harte-Hanks/CTI/Cvlan-Server'],[]) does not support custom branch paths.19:32
Luke-Jrjelmer: …19:41
jelmerjam: no I haven't made a release yet20:29
Luke-Jrjelmer: poek20:30
jelmerLuke-Jr: the URL you're specifying should be the URL of the repository20:31
Luke-Jryes, I did that, see above?20:32
Luke-Jr[13:32:44] <Luke-Jr> Repository root: svn+https://svn.openmethodscorp.com/svn/SoftPhone20:33
Luke-Jr[13:32:44] <Luke-Jr> Layout: CustomLayout(['Harte-Hanks/CTI/Cvlan-Server'],[])20:33
Luke-Jr[13:32:44] <Luke-Jr> Branch path: Harte-Hanks/CTI/Cvlan-Server20:33
Luke-Jr[13:32:44] <Luke-Jr> Project: Harte-Hanks/CTI/Cvlan-Server20:33
Luke-Jr[13:32:44] <Luke-Jr> bzr: ERROR: Layout CustomLayout(['Harte-Hanks/CTI/Cvlan-Server'],[]) does not support custom branch paths.20:33
jelmerso what did you set exactly?20:34
SamBhmm ... is there someone I could ask for the "~/.bzr.log" for a consistantly failing mirrored branch?20:36
AdysGetting this on anything I do in my repo: bzr: ERROR: Cannot lock LockDir(file:///home/adys/src/bzr/sigrie/.bzr/checkout/lock): Permission denied: "/home/adys/src/bzr/sigrie/.bzr/checkout/lock/drthu03p89.tmp": [Errno 13] Permission denied: '/home/adys/src/bzr/sigrie/.bzr/checkout/lock/drthu03p89.tmp'20:36
jelmerSamB: I think the .bzr.log file is provided on the website20:37
SamBjelmer: really?20:37
jelmeryeah, there should be a link to view the log20:37
SamBI don't see anything on https://code.launchpad.net/~dvc-dev/dvc/main :-(20:38
Luke-Jrtags = Harte-Hanks/CTI/Server-tags/*20:40
Luke-Jrbranches = Harte-Hanks/CTI/*Server*20:40
Luke-Jroverride-svn-revprops = svn:date20:40
jelmerLuke-Jr: that's not the repository root20:40
jelmerLuke-Jr: [svn+https://svn.openmethodscorp.com/svn/SoftPhone/Harte-Hanks/CTI/*Server*]20:42
Luke-Jrjelmer: meaning?20:42
jelmer is not the repository root20:42
Luke-Jrit only applies to those paths20:42
Luke-Jrsvn+https://svn.openmethodscorp.com/svn/SoftPhone/Harte-Hanks/CTI/foobar could be entirely different20:43
djahandarieHello... I'd like some opionios on how to structure our bzr repo. I've already read the section on this in the intro guide.20:44
djahandarieBasically, I'm working with a web application. Therefore local 'compiling' is worthless at this point.20:45
djahandarieI have three servers currently: 'development', 'testing', and 'production'.20:45
djahandarieWould it be best to have branches of these? A central repo? Hooks?20:46
djahandarieI'm new to bazaar so anyone's opinion would be great!20:46
Luke-Jrdjahandarie: not sure, you might try asking in an anime channel20:48
* djahandarie stabs Luke-Jr 20:48
mwhudsonjam: how can i do that?20:48
jammwhudson: for branches which are failing, run that code with "bzr annotate $PATH"20:49
jammwhudson: you're on your own for figuring out what was failing, :)20:51
mwhudsonjam: probably a bit of a fiddle to do automatically, i'll see what i can manage20:51
mwhudson(after i've finished getting up :)20:51
Luke-Jrjelmer: so what SHOULD I be putting?20:51
jammwhudson: well, I made it work for the one you mentioned20:51
jamI don't know about others20:51
jelmerLuke-Jr: the repository root as reported by e.g. bzr info20:52
djahandarieSo, anyone got any ideas as to how to format the centralized repository to handle my 3-tiered server install?20:53
Luke-Jrjelmer: ok, I'll ignore the obvious problems with that for a minute-- it still doesn't work20:54
Luke-Jrtags = Harte-Hanks/CTI/Server-tags/*20:54
Luke-Jrbranches = Harte-Hanks/CTI/Cvlan-Server20:54
Luke-JrRepository root: svn+https://svn.openmethodscorp.com/svn/SoftPhone20:55
Luke-JrLayout: WildcardLayout(['Harte-Hanks/CTI/Cvlan-Server'],['Harte-Hanks/CTI/Server-tags/*'])20:55
Luke-JrBranch path: Harte-Hanks/CTI/Cvlan-Server20:55
Luke-JrProject: Harte-Hanks/CTI/Cvlan-Server20:55
Luke-Jrbzr: ERROR: Layout WildcardLayout(['Harte-Hanks/CTI/Cvlan-Server'],['Harte-Hanks/CTI/Server-tags/*']) does not support custom branch paths.20:55
djahandarieLuke-Jr, pastebin20:55
jelmerLuke-Jr: that looks right, except for that last bit20:56
djahandarieI feel like I'm going to have to abandon the practice of making a seperate repo for every feature, because every time I push to that repo I'll need to merge it with the dev repo as well to actually test it.20:56
Luke-Jrdjahandarie: why would it be any different from normal software production?20:57
Luke-Jrjelmer: so... :/20:57
djahandarieLuke-Jr, well, you can compile locally when normally working. But now you'll have to upload all your changes to the testing server every time to test something.20:57
Luke-Jrdjahandarie: rsync works well20:59
djahandariersync what?20:59
djahandarieThe central repo to the server?20:59
Luke-Jrrsync ./ devserver:/var/www/bla/htdocs/…/ -av20:59
djahandarieLuke-Jr, uh, so I'd end up having files on the server that have nothing to do with the central repository?21:00
djahandarieThis is for a team enviornment21:00
Luke-Jrdjahandarie: guess you shoudl setup local webservers21:00
djahandarieLuke-Jr, can't.21:00
djahandarieI was thinking about making the central repo have 3 branches: 'development', 'testing', 'production'.21:01
jelmerLuke-Jr: not sure what that's about, I'll go check21:02
djahandarieAnd then you'd merge your change locally into the right branch, commit to the central repo, and then the central repo would have a hook to automatically update the servers.21:03
Luke-Jrdjahandarie: pretty sure bzr doesn't support such hooks21:03
djahandarieLuke-Jr, it does.21:04
Luke-Jrand you should really test things before committing21:04
djahandarieLuke-Jr, the point is that testing it is impossible.21:04
jelmerLuke-Jr: Sorry, this doesn't seem to be implemented yet for WildcardLayout21:06
jelmerLuke-Jr: for CustomLayout it should work without problems21:06
jelmerLuke-Jr: I *think*21:06
jelmerLuke-Jr: layout/standard.py:34421:06
Luke-Jrfrom an end user perspective?21:06
jelmerLuke-Jr: I don't think this works yet, unfortunately so please file a bug21:07
djahandarieThe only annoying part about how I'm doing this is that when a change is made in a feature branch, you'd need to 1. save the file 2. merge the feature branch with the development branch 3. commit the development branch 4. check21:07
djahandarieSo feature branchs would be a huge hassle until you actually push the changes to testing, and then production.21:07
djahandarieBut if I didn't do feature branchs, then I'd have to cherry-pick the correct things into the testing/production branches, which would suck even more.21:08
Luke-Jrdjahandarie: s/push/merge21:08
djahandarieYeah, sorry, merge*21:08
Luke-Jrdjahandarie: seems to me your development model is inherently flawed21:08
djahandarieLuke-Jr, yes, because of the fact you can only test it in one place.21:09
djahandarieSo a DVCS is hard to work with/21:09
djahandarieBut trying to do crazy merging with SVN sucks so I stayed away from that21:09
fullermdI've occasionally taken contracts that required working on code that could only be worked on in one place.  I've never done so and not regretted it, though...21:10
Luke-Jrdjahandarie: "only test it in one place" is inherently bad21:10
djahandarieIdeally, the solution for this would be that 'feature branchs' automatically merge into the 'development' branch.21:11
djahandarieLuke-Jr, I know, but that's the environment I'm working with here, so stop making me feel even worse about it, alright?21:11
fullermdIf every commit has to be made and then stuck in dev before it can even be tested, it would be a lot easier to just eschew feature branches and work right in dev, I'd think.21:11
fullermdI mean, you're basically talking about making a commit at a time, and merging them individually before moving on to the next one anyway.  So you're not in essence using another branch ANYway.21:12
=== beaumonta is now known as abeaumont
djahandariefullermd, right, but then how would I push the feature to testing/production?21:13
djahandarieWithout cherry-picking21:13
fullermdPresumably, the same way you would've yanked the feature from the feature branch to dev, with a merge.21:13
djahandariefullermd, wait, I thought you just said to scrap feature branches?21:14
fullermdHence "would've" rather than "did"   :p21:14
djahandariefullermd, ah.21:14
djahandarieBut then I would have to move ALL of development into testing/production21:15
djahandarieNot the 'parts that work'.21:15
djahandariei.e., totally ruining the whole point of using Bazaar21:16
fullermdAh.  Well, there's no getting around 'take it all' or 'cherrypick'; Excluded Middle.21:16
djahandarieActually, does anyone know if a hook would be able to automatically merge the branch if the name of the branch isn't in [x,y,z]?21:16
djahandarieBecause that would solve the problem.21:17
djahandarieIt's just that the hook would have to be on every developer's local repo.21:17
fullermdWell, with feature branches, you'd still have cherrypick issues, unless you started each branch from a GCA of the 3 dev/test/prod.  And that's just going to be an ever-increasing nightmare scenario, even before taking into account the huge overhead your process imposes on feature branch work anyway.21:18
fullermdI'd start by semi-eliminating the test/prod split, by making production be pull'd from test at "stable" points (that being the point of test).  That at least drops you to 2 nightmares instead of 3...21:19
fullermdThe latest common node in their combined DAGs.21:19
fullermd(DAGen?  DOG?)21:19
djahandariefullermd, well, then how would I do bug fixes on production?21:20
fullermdWell, the theory is that nothing ever goes to production until it's been vetted in test...21:20
djahandarieTesting is just to make sure feature X works with the rest of the system outside of the development enviornment.21:21
fullermdSo you'd bring bugfixes into test (however you do that), and when it's solid, pull test over prod.21:21
djahandarieAnd there are always bugs even after the code is tested.21:21
Luke-Jrjelmer: so how do I get CustomLayout21:21
djahandarieConsidering it's only going to be tested by the people here...21:22
djahandarieAnd we might miss something21:22
Kobazso i have a strange problem21:23
Kobazconflicts: Contents conflict in ViewerCdrs.fcgi21:23
Kobaz# bzr revert ViewerCdrs.fcgi21:23
Kobazbzr: ERROR: Path(s) are not versioned: ViewerCdrs.fcgi21:23
djahandarieBah, why does this have to be so complicated. -_-21:23
fullermdWell, my conception of such arrangements is that test is a staging area for production.  In that case, having production be a [often out-of-date] mirror of test makes perfect sense, since it makes the VCS structure mirror the procedure.21:23
Kobazhow can i have a conflict in a file that's not versioned21:23
fullermdWell, obviously because (a) you have straitjacketish developmental constrants, and (b) you're trying to use a VCS as a deployment solution  :p21:24
djahandariefullermd, well, how would you recommend doing a bug fix on production when it's out of the VCS?21:25
djahandarieBecause testing might have new features in it by that point21:25
fullermdWell, I don't, because I don't put up with dev structures like that  :p21:25
fullermdI deploy a trunk, and other work is in a feature branch (or a degenerate version of such) until it's presumed ready for trunk.21:26
djahandarieWell, the thing is the feature branches can't be tested locally...21:26
fullermdYeah, that's why I'm not working with you   :)21:27
djahandarieWell, is there any other way to VCS a web application?21:27
fullermdYour problem is in trying to build a workflow around that.  And however you do it is gonna suck.21:27
fullermdI tend to think it may be easier to NOT try and make the VCS handle part of that workarounding.21:28
fullermdCan, for instance, it REALLY only be tested in that one _place_, or can it be tested on that one _server_?21:28
djahandarieThe server.21:28
fullermdOK.  So, couldn't each dev get their own little sandbox on the server, in which they can setup their feature branches and work there on them, until they're ready to land?21:29
djahandarieHow would I hook that into everything else?21:29
djahandarieI'm a bazaar and in general DVCS noobie, so I might be missing something21:29
fullermdWell, you wouldn't necessarily.  That's where the D comes in  :)21:30
djahandarieWell, I somehow need the local repo to get to files on the server21:30
fullermdEach dev would have their 1 or 2 or 10 feature branches in ~/work/damntheseconstraints/{one,two,tree,etc}, and work on them until they're ready to land.21:30
fullermdThen merge them into their ~/work/trunk/ checkout, or some such process.21:31
* Luke-Jr mutters21:38
* SamB discovers that launchpad is apparantly not very good at preserving multiple spaces in the web rendering of a bug...21:41
* fullermd suspects LP is preserving them just fine, the SGML engin^W^Wcrapsoup parser in your browser just isn't.21:42
SamBbug 399942 looks awful :-(21:42
ubottuLaunchpad bug 399942 in bzr-svn "HTTP 403 during svn transport probe causes bzr to give up entirely" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/39994221:42
SamBfullermd: well, bad at instructing the browser to do so, then ...21:43
SamBnot sure21:43
SamBmight just be the browser ...21:43
lifelessit looks fne to me21:50
lifelessthough very long :)21:50
SamBlifeless: yeah, I guess cgitb will do that ;-)21:51
SamBbut for me the spaces between the line numbers and their code are all collapsed into one21:51
lifelesswhat browser?21:52
SamBMozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv: Gecko/2009061212 Iceweasel/3.0.11 (Debian-3.0.11-1)21:52
lifelesswhat font too21:53
lifelessmight be a prop/non-prop thing21:53
lifelessI' using epiphany21:53
SamBit's showing in a fixed-width font21:53
SamBI have no idea how to get mozilla to tell me exactly what font21:53
SamBI looked for an add-on for that once, I think21:53
SamBcouldn't find one :-(21:53
lifelessjam: if you're still around, I fixed three small dirstate/commit bugs yesterday21:54
lifelessjam: would love a rubberystampy21:54
* SamB quits iceweasel in the hopes that starting it again cold will make it notice that he downgraded firebug again21:55
jamlifeless: I'll try to give them a look21:56
jaminvestigating the absent-content-factory w/ bundles issues right now21:56
lifelessjam: they are all ~ 1 line fixes21:58
jamlifeless: well, they aren't all 1-line diffs. :)21:59
* SamB wishes qemu supported reasonable acceleration21:59
lifelessI know, which is why I'm telling you something diffstat doesn't ;)22:00
jamlifeless: what are you calling "forward edits" ?22:00
lifelesswhen something moves22:01
lifelessand something thats deeper in the old iterator gets changed by processing the item in the new iterator22:01
lifelesswe then encounter the thing that moved again in the old iterator, but we were seeing the moved item, rather than the original old-state22:02
lifelessthats why 'mv b a' broke but not 'mv a b'22:02
jamso is it better to deepcopy the old iterator, or to copy the items themselves before we mutate them?22:03
jamthe later seems to require less copying22:03
lifelessbut more complex code22:03
lifelessI think we should do the simpler thing and then usertest to find out if it really matters perf wise22:03
SamBmaybe you should stop mutating shit so much ;-)22:05
* SamB <- Haskeller22:05
lifelessso it might find this easier to do22:06
lifelessbut we're updating a table22:06
lifelessby walking the table and a tree in parallel22:06
lifelessit would be arguably nicer to transform the new inventory into a delta against the old inventory and apply that22:07
lifelessbut I am concerned that that might be slower22:08
lifelesswithout care22:08
lifelessso I wanted to fix the bug, and come back later and look at deleting a tonne of code; particularly if we can just remove callers to this method22:08
lifelessthanks jam!22:09
jamlifeless: while your head is in this code, I've noticed times where the auto-remove still fails if you delete the parent directory of a file22:09
jam(foo/bar/baz/bing, all of bar/baz/bing have been deleted)22:09
jamI'm pretty sure there is an open bug on it22:10
lifelessin commit?22:10
jamif you do "bzr rm" then commit works22:10
jambut if you just "rm -rf foo/bar; bzr commit" it blows up22:10
jamI thought you looked a while ago about removing the strict ordering requirement22:10
lifelessI think thats bug 18720722:11
ubottuLaunchpad bug 187207 in bzr "Inconsistent deltas created when commiting and an implicit delete has happened" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/18720722:11
lifelessI'll have a look for a bug22:11
lifelessunversion doesn't have a strict ordering requirement22:11
lifelessin fact, it setifies its inputs immediately22:11
jamlifeless: for  https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~lifeless/bzr/bug-187207/+merge/880022:12
jamthe big change is to only discard when it isn't already absent/renamed?22:13
lifelessdiscardin the id stops us unversioning it again22:13
lifelessso we only discard when we actually unversion it22:13
lifelessfinding it at an old path before we find it at a new path doesn't actually count as discarding22:13
jamlifeless: so since we were skipping , we leave the id around22:13
jamto be unversioned later?22:14
lifelessthats inside the code for deleting an entire block22:14
eyda|monI've got two repos, A and B. B is a branch of A. I change file F1 and F2 in branch B. F1 has one comitt message, and F2 has commit message. I then merge to branch A, but then I revert the changes made to file F2 before I commit to branch A.  bzr log will still show the commit messages made for file F2. Is that supposed to be like that? Those changes were just not part of  branch A at all, but they still22:14
eyda|monshow up.22:14
lifelesswhere a subtree has been deleted22:14
dasheyda|mon: revert just changes the working copy22:14
dasheyda|mon: merge brings in the entire history22:14
fullermdeyda|mon: That's what merge does.  (also, you don't (well, you may, but it's not relevant) have two repos, you have two branches)22:15
lifelesseyda|mon: thats normal yes; if you do a merge, and then change the merge to be different, then commit, bzr doesn't know the /meaning/ of the change you made22:15
dasheyda|mon: so the result is that the merge revision undoes the changes to F222:15
eyda|mondash:  but that still results in a very misleading log22:15
dasheyda|mon: well don't do that then :)22:15
lifelesseyda|mon: if you made separate commits, you can do something like 'bzr merge -r -2 B' in A22:15
lifelesswhich will merge all but the last commit22:16
eyda|moni normally dont, but I was pushing changes to production, and I didn't want all those changes to production.22:16
eyda|monlifeless: i see, ok, interesting22:16
jamlifeless: I think I have a basic handle on bug #39334922:17
ubottuLaunchpad bug 393349 in bzr "exceptions.AttributeError: 'AbsentContentFactory' object has no attribute 'get_bytes_as'" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/39334922:17
jambasically, the bundle code doesn't ensure the same state in a stacked branch22:17
jamthat the fetch code does22:17
lifelessjam: might want to move all the dicussion to that bug :)22:17
lifelessjam: 390563 is the iter_interesting_changes bug22:18
jamso I was wondering what your thoughts might be about the proper fix22:18
jamis it a limitation of the bundle *generator*22:18
jamor the bundle *inserter*22:18
jam(or both :)22:18
lifelessI think the inserter should error-or-fix-on-the-fly22:19
lifelessthats for robustness22:19
lifelessit shouldn't fail late22:19
lifeless(maybe it isn't)22:19
jamit is failing during "check diff" which I think is later than it should be erroring22:20
lifelessbut as the source isn't guaranteed to be around, if the best the inserter can do is error [without the source], then clearly we need to change the creator.22:20
lifelessso, sounds to me like the inserter can be improved22:20
lifelessI think we should make sure we're not creating partial rev inventory data etc as a priority22:20
lifelessand perhaps a fixup tool for existing damaged branches (tied into fetch perhaps - bzr fetch --ghosts <...>)22:21
lifelessand then move onto getting enough data sent in the first place22:21
jamhmm... at least here it is failing on "self._ensure_root()" which would say that the root chk isn't present at all...22:23
lifelessbut the inventory is22:24
jamlifeless: there are 0 chk pages in the final result22:24
lifelessthats fairly corrupt22:24
jamlifeless: so the bundle generator code seems to directly access the inventory data22:28
jamand include it in the bundle22:28
jambut it *doesn't* include the chk data22:28
jamso it neither upcasts to an XML inventory22:28
jamnor includes chk22:28
jamso bundle generator w/ chk... completely broken22:29
lifelessI'm sure then that we want to make the inserter more paranoid22:31
lifelessand the generator fixed (perhaps upcast to XML for existing formats, and add a delta based one)22:31
jamlifeless: so I'm pretty sure that whatever I do, the new bundles won't be compatible with older bzr22:34
jamand if that is true22:34
jamthen I'm thinking it may be time to change how we deal with bundles22:34
jamand go the full route into making them just a transport for a stream22:35
lifelessI think if you upcast to xml and did the existing bundle code, that will work with older bzr; could be wrong22:35
lifelessI'm pro doing the full mccoy22:35
jamlifeless: the existing code will try to insert those XML texts *into* repository.inventories22:35
jamas is22:35
jamit doesn't go through Serializers at all22:35
lifelessso two things22:35
lifelesswhat about xml bundles from people using 1.9-rr to someone using 2a22:36
lifelesswell, one thing really;)22:36
lifelessback shortly22:39
jamlifeless: ok. so it seems the existing code says "if serializer.format_num == bundle_serializer.format_num: _install_mp_records_keys"22:53
jamotherwise it assumes that it can apply the mpdiff directly to the parent inventory22:53
jamah, because it grabs the Inventory, then serializes it in the  source format22:54
jamthen reads it back in as a string22:54
mwhudsonjelmer: https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~vcs-imports/openlibrary/trunk <- submodules!23:04
lifelessbah, my bug 395556 bugfix isn't complete. I'm going to have to look deeper.23:10
ubottuLaunchpad bug 395556 in bzr "dirstate.set_state_from_inventory is broken with forward-edits." [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/39555623:10
lifelessThe other two should be fine23:10
lifeless(395556 causes fallout)23:10
=== kiko is now known as kiko-afk
SamBabentley: shouldn't bundle buggy provide a link to the superseding bundle if a bundle has a Status of Superseded ?23:37
SamBI'm looking at http://bundlebuggy.aaronbentley.com/project/bzr/request/%3CE1MRCZb-0007ee-Kn%40hydrogen%3E and wondering what in the world it picked up as superceding that23:38
SamBoh ... I guess it picked up http://bundlebuggy.aaronbentley.com/project/bzr/request/<E1MQZOB-0003MV-Id%40hydrogen> ?23:40
* SamB was given to understand that bundle buggy didn't take bundles with [PATCH] prefixes23:40
abentleySamB: It should, but it doesn't.23:42
SamBabentley: did you just add support for [PATCH] prefixes or something?23:43
SamBor was bundle buggy down for a long while ?23:43
abentleySamB: It was down.23:43
SamBand whoever told me about that I needed [MERGE] was wrong ;-)23:44
KhaZHello.  I'm contemplating an idea, and I'm curious if other people can shoot holes in it.  At work we use Perforce, but I was thinking it would be nice to run a bzr depot locally to allow me to do multiple 'checkins' locally, and possibly share with other developers similary set up (via push/pull).  I'd treat 'syncs' from Perforce as 'checkins' to bzr.  Would this scheme break down fast, or would it give me the benefit of local changes, and pot23:48
mwhudsonKhaZ: your message got truncated there23:49
KhaZmwhudson: What'st he last bit you received?23:49
KhaZ*what's the?23:49
thumperKhaZ: line limits for irc23:50
mwhudson"nges, and po"23:50
KhaZpotentially the ability to 'share' code with other developers?23:50
KhaZthumper: Weird.  I would've figured irssi would've caught that for me.  Oh well.  Pardon me.23:50
lifelessKhaZ: I know of other people that do roughly what you describe; I don't know the details though23:51
mwhudsonKhaZ: nothing about that sounds too insane23:51
KhaZHrmm.  I might give it a shot.  Maybe it'll give some adoption to other devs anyhow.  I'm really sick of Perforce outages and slow syncs. :/23:51
mwhudsonKhaZ: the area you might have problems is when the changes you make in bzr end up in perforce and then you sync from perforce, you might get conflicts23:52
lifelessKhaZ: If I may be nosy, what organisation do you use p4 at?23:53
SamBKhaZ: it's nondeterministic, or something23:53
SamBthe line-limit thing23:53
SamBI've seen the same text truncated to different lengths when sent twice in a row23:53
* SamB isn't sure if it was by the same person or not, though -- that would make a difference23:54
KhaZlifeless: Well, in this case it's a company called Propaganda Games.  But most gaming companies I've worked at use Perforce.23:54
KhaZSamB: What is non-deterministic?23:54
KhaZOh, the line-limit thing.23:54
lifelessKhaZ: interesting :) - thanks for satisfying my curiosity.23:55
SamBI'm not sure if it is really nondet or not23:55
SamBbut it acts like it to the naive observer ;-)23:55
KhaZlifeless: No worries.  Mind if I ask what made you curious about it?  Sitting on this channel as you do, I'm sure you don't ask everyone what company they're at? :)23:55
KhaZRight, makes sense SamB.23:56
lifelessonly people that use p4 ;)23:56
KhaZHah.  What's so curious about p4?  I'd be more interested in knowing who's still using VSS!23:56
lifelessmore seriously, if you were at one of the companies that I know people that use bzr w/p4 I would have tried to get you talking to a colleague.23:56
KhaZlifeless: Ah, fair enough.23:57
lifelessbut I couldn't ask them if they were happy to share the name immediately, and you were here ;)23:57
KhaZMakes sense!  Thanks for satisfying *my* curiousity. ;)23:58

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