rickspencer3TheMuso: hi00:00
TheMusoHey rickspencer3.00:01
TheMusoAnd good morning robert_ancell.00:01
rickspencer3robert_ancell: just in time00:01
rickspencer3you are one minute late00:01
robert_ancellnetworking problems...00:01
* rickspencer3 slaps ruler against palm00:01
* robert_ancell begins the revolution00:01
rickspencer3TheMuso: long time no see00:02
rickspencer3hope all is well00:02
TheMusoAll is very well thanks. Hope you both had a good trip.00:02
rickspencer3I did00:02
rickspencer3and it was cool seeing robert_ancell and everyone00:02
rickspencer3TheMuso: before we start "the meeting" ...00:03
robert_ancellit was good to see all the big GNOME people00:03
=== asac_ is now known as asac
rickspencer3are you interested in attending Linux Plumbers?00:03
rickspencer3Lennart will be there00:04
TheMusorickspencer3: Robbie suggested I attend previously, but I must admit I am not really that interested, since I don't deal with that level of detail in terms of implementatino, I just package.00:04
rickspencer3I guess it's kind of soon, actually00:04
rickspencer3TheMuso: prolly too late to get you there anyway00:05
TheMusoI understand concepts, but not at any great detail in terms of pulseaudio/alsa's code base.00:05
rickspencer3I could pop down for a day if there was something useful I could do00:05
TheMusoHowever if people believe that me going is a good idea, then I will.00:05
rickspencer3it's a long trup00:05
rickspencer3trip even00:06
rickspencer3so we should only arrange it if you think it's going to really be worth it00:06
* TheMuso thought rickspencer3 was going all New Zealand on us.00:06
TheMusoI don't, but if others do, then I'll go.00:06
rickspencer3so, think about it, and let me know in a couple of days if you change your mind00:06
rickspencer3robert_ancell: I wanted to ask you about your gdm config spec00:06
rickspencer3the blueprint is a little *ahem* think right now00:07
rickspencer3understanding that you just got from desktop summit00:07
rickspencer3thin even00:07
* rickspencer3 too much typing today00:07
rickspencer3I was wondering when you thought you might get to a spec and have work items?00:07
robert_ancellOK, can add those00:08
robert_ancellwhere do I add a spec?00:08
rickspencer3you just create a wiki page, then on the blueprint you click the link to "set the url for the specification" or whatever00:09
rickspencer3there is a spec template00:09
rickspencer3since this is a pretty well defined feature, it would probably be good for you to use the template00:09
rickspencer3I'd like to get the work items added to the burndown chart as soon as is reasonable00:10
rickspencer3enough of my whip cracking ...00:10
rickspencer3do either of you guys have any agenda items?00:10
rickspencer3I wrote up the Western Edition meeting notes:00:11
rickspencer3instead of just reviewing them, shall I though on highlights that impact you, and let you read the notes at your leisure?00:11
TheMusothats a good idea00:11
rickspencer3so first is an action item:00:12
rickspencer3# ACTION: everyone try both bluetooth front ends, report experience to asac next team meeting00:12
rickspencer3we need to help asac with choosing the bluetooth front end00:12
robert_ancellno bluetooth hw for me00:12
rickspencer3robert_ancell: not even a phone?00:13
robert_ancellnope :)00:13
* TheMuso has 2 notebooks, plus a dongle he can plug into his desktop for bluetooth testing.00:13
rickspencer3so next week, give asac feedback00:13
* TheMuso has a phone and a headset00:13
robert_ancellTheMuso, perhaps I'll have to drop over for a day00:13
rickspencer3I thought there was another action item to set up the mozilla security ppa as well00:13
TheMusoThats certainly feesable.00:13
rickspencer3but I seem to have "lost" it00:13
rickspencer3that sounds fun, actually00:14
rickspencer3do you guys ever get together?00:14
TheMusoNo, but I have been thinking of organising something actually00:14
* rickspencer3 invites himself to TheMuso house in Australia00:14
TheMusoI was thinking of inviting all sydney guys up for a day of work/hacking.00:14
TheMusoregardless of team etc00:14
rickspencer3The Portland Posse does that like every month00:14
robert_ancell/drinking /w00:15
rickspencer3okay, moving on :)00:15
rickspencer3the other item I wanted to mention was Empathy for alpha 300:15
rickspencer3It's being built with webkit ...00:15
TheMusoooo no good00:15
TheMusonot for a11y anyway00:15
rickspencer3now I am woefully uneducated about this, but I fear that perhaps this makes it inaccessible00:16
TheMusoi am already getting asked questions about empathy for accessibility stuff00:16
rickspencer3TheMuso: could we ask you to test that out for us?00:16
TheMusoSure thintg.00:16
rickspencer3other than that, there was just a bunch of status updates and what not00:17
TheMusoYep. Whats the file syncing stuff that is waiting for an MIR?00:17
rickspencer3I put the irc log at the bottom of the wiki to make it easier for you guys to read through it00:17
TheMusois that ubuntuone?00:17
TheMusoah ok.00:17
TheMusoNice to see that another db for evolution is being looked into.00:17
rickspencer3is there anything that you guys know of that is in a PPA, but is meant to be in universe or main for Karmic?00:18
rickspencer3ACTION: TheMuso to test accessibility of empathy built with webkit00:18
TheMusoOnly a newer version of pulse, and that awaits an rtkit MIR competion which I need to talk to upstrea about some stuff for00:19
TheMusogah typing00:19
rickspencer3TheMuso: you may want to check with kenvandine to ensure that you test the correct version00:19
rickspencer3(of empathy I mean)00:19
TheMusoah ok.00:19
rickspencer3ok guys, it was a short meeting this morning00:20
rickspencer3in general, how are you guys finding Karmic?00:20
robert_ancellGood since the last kernel update. Video seems better quality.  Still issues with changing to compiz though00:20
TheMusoBetter than expected, and plenty to do. :)00:20
* TheMuso has never run a dev release this early in a cycle00:21
TheMusodue to a11y concerns, but all seems ok.00:21
rickspencer3TheMuso: there is still a lot of scepticism about pulse audio00:21
rickspencer3I mean "out in the world among the users"00:21
rickspencer3so you have your work cut out for you on that front, indeed00:21
TheMusorickspencer3: To be honest, I am starting to feel that myself. I feel it changes too much from release to release, making things difficult to track.00:21
* rickspencer3 nods00:22
rickspencer3is there anything we should be doing to help you?00:22
TheMusoI need more help from those who understand whats going on and how things work basically.00:22
TheMusoI do feel a little bogged down with audio stuff atm.00:22
rickspencer3when you say "those who understand" are you thinking of anyone specifically?00:22
TheMusoPeople like Daniel Chen who have knowledge of the audio architecture, how thigns fit together, and can help work out where bugs may lie, re triaging, and stuff like pulse muting volume bugs etc00:23
TheMusosee #distro for a sec, Canonical only stuff.00:24
TheMusoOther than that, things are ok. I am on top of a11y stuff, which is good.00:25
rickspencer3TheMuso: good00:26
rickspencer3does the new gdm greeter work perfectly from an accessibility point of view?00:26
TheMusoHave to look into how accessible login is enabled with it. I actually hope to do that today.00:26
rickspencer3robert_ancell: TheMuso: thanks for your time this morning00:27
rickspencer3I appreciate you guys taking the time to connect with me and the rest of the team in your mornings00:27
* rickspencer3 smells coffee?00:27
robert_ancellno prob00:27
TheMusoNo problem.00:27
=== pace_t_zulu_ is now known as pace_t_zulu
rickspencer3ok then, see you guys tomorrow00:28
TheMusoTill tomorrow.00:28
brycecya rickspencer300:30
rickspencer3heya bryce00:31
rickspencer3going to plumbers?00:31
brycerickspencer3, yeah planning to00:34
rickspencer3I was thinking about popping down for a day00:35
brycesounds like I missed a fun trip in the canaries, although sounds like there wasn't much X.org specific anyway00:35
rickspencer3bryce: there was less than zero xorg stuff00:35
rickspencer3though it was fun, and would have been great to have you there00:35
rickspencer3bryce: x seems to be working well for me00:36
brycefortunately it's been a productive week getting our intel bug reports cleaned up00:36
bryce(and lots and lots of baby prep stuff)00:36
rickspencer3baby prep is fun ... like buying a little keyboard so she can triage x bugs while nursing?00:37
rickspencer3so sometimes my screen turns black, for maybe one or two seconds, and then comes back00:38
rickspencer3is that Jesse's feature of x reconstituting itself rather than freezing?00:38
rickspencer3happens once per day or less00:38
brycerickspencer3, yeah I realized I'm like in a real sweet-spot for -intel; all the versions and configuration settings in Ubuntu and upstream are consistent and we've got new enough snapshots that I can get people to test stuff easily and push it up with little retesting hassle.  So I figured I should take advantage of this rare moment and push as many bugs up as I can.00:39
rickspencer3I saw that list00:39
rickspencer3it was impressive indeed00:39
rickspencer3I hope Yingying didn't blow a gasket ;)00:39
bryceyeah I get the periodic screen blanking myself on -ati.  Haven't sorted it out, but it sure is irritating00:39
brycehehe, yeah haven't heard a peep from her00:40
brycebut the bugs themselves are getting attention so that's nice00:40
* TheMuso gets the occasional blanking her eon nvidia as well.00:40
rickspencer3screen blanking is annoying, but far better than crashing00:40
TheMusowith proprietary nvidia drivers00:40
rickspencer3robert_ancell: in terms of bug 37213200:41
ubottuLaunchpad bug 372132 in nautilus ""Create Document" Templates difficult to use" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/37213200:41
bryceinteresting; I've assumed it to be an -ati bug, but maybe it's something more fundamental00:41
rickspencer3does it seem that people might be over-analyzing a bit?00:41
rickspencer3bryce: is there something I could do to get you debug data when it happens (which is pretty rare)00:41
brycemy current guess with the blanking bug is that it is something in the power management system00:41
rickspencer3so my guess that it was Jesse's feature doesn't ring true, huh?00:42
TheMusomakes sense00:42
brycerickspencer3, yeah I think what needs done is to look at the power management state... maybe have it log to a file and see if something changes00:42
bryceI'm not familiar enough with pmutils and such to know what specifically to do00:42
rickspencer3it happens so rarely, but I'll try00:42
rickspencer3I'll talk to robbiew, see what they suggest00:42
bryceI've noticed sort of a pattern to it, like it happens N minutes after powering on my monitors (where N is something like 30 or 60)00:43
rickspencer3powering on your monitor, but not your computer?00:43
robert_ancellrickspencer3, I guess people are a bit worried that that menu will become full of stuff00:43
TheMusoIt happens randomly for me, I can go several days without it occurring, and then it happens all of a sudden, then nothing for a while again.00:44
rickspencer3robert_ancell: but can't we just drop three templates in the ~/Template directory for the user?00:44
rickspencer3we have "examples"00:45
robert_ancellAs the default profile. Makes sense to me...00:45
rickspencer3would that be hard to do?00:45
* rickspencer3 is simple minded, but the fix seems simple00:46
brycerickspencer3, anyway with -intel it feels like we've turned a sharp corner.  There's still bugs, but they seem less severe and upstream seems to be smashing them much more definitively than in the past.00:46
rickspencer3bryce: that is awesome00:46
rickspencer3it does seem like it's all come together in Karmic00:46
rickspencer3and in no small part thanks to your tireless efforts00:46
rickspencer3as pitti mentioned this morning, you can play tux racer for hours now00:47
brycewell, I certainly feel motivated to hammer on it since I feel so bad at all the trouble it was in jaunty00:48
rickspencer3well ... it was trouble, indeed00:48
robert_ancellrickspencer3, I think I agree the whole concept of a "new" menu is not necessarily good but it needs some user testing to back up that idea00:48
bryceI just wish more of the fixes could be backported00:48
rickspencer3robert_ancell: it just seems like the users need something simple, and the concerns about the menu growing and stuff seem academic to me00:49
rickspencer3bryce: well ... we're moving on to a new release00:49
TheMusobryce: I feel the same way re audio. With karmic, a lot is changing and cannot be backported due to core infrastructure requirements.00:49
rickspencer3users have lots of choice00:49
* rickspencer3 nods00:49
rickspencer3seems that TheMuso and bryce work in domains that have some similarities00:49
TheMusoYeah, although there is many more combinations of hda implementations, compared to intel/other video chips.00:50
robert_ancellrickspencer3, well we can add a few defaults.  I think the menu should have a link to the ~/Templates dir so the user can easily add/remove templates00:50
rickspencer3Jaunty was actually a very good release ... and I think it's making Karmic a better release, because the foundation is solid00:50
brycelots more bugs than devs to fix them, and what devs there are seem to be predisposed to rewriting the architecture every other year ;-)00:50
rickspencer3robert_ancell: but that sounds hard to implement ... and the user just needs something simple ... couldn't we just add the templates now, and change it later if there is user demand?00:51
rickspencer3djsiegel: welcome, I was just discussing the paper cut bug 372132 with robert_ancell00:53
ubottuLaunchpad bug 372132 in nautilus ""Create Document" Templates difficult to use" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/37213200:53
rickspencer3robert_ancell: I think the Example folder works by a sym link to /usr/share/something00:54
rickspencer3could we not use a similar system for Templates?00:54
robert_ancellrickspencer3, yes it does00:54
robert_ancellrickspencer3, I'd expect so00:54
rickspencer3funny how this UI stuff can create so much discussion00:55
rickspencer3I'd like to get that paper cut fixed this week, in a simple way00:55
robert_ancellthat's the point of the papercuts project right? scratching those scars :)00:55
rickspencer3yeah, but as we said this morning, some of the paper cuts turn out to really be more like knife wounds ;)00:56
rickspencer3though not this one00:56
rickspencer3thanks guys00:56
rickspencer3I'll catch you all tomorrow00:56
TheMusobryce: Its not quite like that with audi, but pulse for example is still undergoing rapid development.01:00
chrisccoulsonis gnome-session crashing for anyone here on shutdown?01:00
bryceTheMuso, yeah neither with xorg, but that's how it's viewed from the outside sometimes01:01
TheMusochrisccoulson: I restarted earlier, and when I went to shut down, I didn't get the dialog box as I normally would. I just dropped back to gdm.01:01
TheMusobryce: yeah same with audio01:01
chrisccoulsonTheMuso - looks like the same symptom01:01
chrisccoulsongnome-session crashes before showing the dialog01:01
TheMusohrm and no crash file either.01:02
TheMusoAnd then gdm wouldn't let me restart. I clicked restart, and nothing happened, so I had to go back to a VT and press ctrl + alt + del.01:03
chrisccoulsonhmmm, wierd. not sure if the gdm issue is related01:03
chrisccoulsonit could be actually - they both use gnome-session01:03
TheMusothats true.01:06
chrisccoulsonseems someone already reported it - bug 39953101:09
ubottuLaunchpad bug 399531 in gnome-session "[karmic] shutdown menu immediately logs out" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/39953101:09
* TheMuso looks.01:14
chrisccoulsonthere is a bug in one of our patches which causes it to crash when shutdown is not available01:22
chrisccoulsonso there are 2 bugs01:22
chrisccoulsonTheMuso - i commented on the bug. there seems to be a bug with consolekit too01:33
TheMusooh fun.01:34
pittiGood morning06:44
pittibryce: upstream intel> I agree, they responed/fixed all my upstream bugs that I sent against uxa/dri206:45
TheMusoHey pitti.06:48
pittihey TheMuso06:49
brycepitti, :-)06:51
pittibryce: hm, seems https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingXorg#Debugging%20Hangs%20/%20Freezes%20/%20Lockups is not the current documentation for debugging freezes; where does that live nowadays? (I'm following up on a bug)06:57
pittiah, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Troubleshooting/Freeze06:58
pittibryce: perhaps the old DebuggingXorg page should redirect to X/Troubleshooting06:59
bryceoh yeah that page really ought to be deprecated in favor of stuff in the wiki.ubuntu.com/X namespace06:59
brycepitti, some of the info on that page is useful and should be merged in07:00
bryceit's on my todo list to mrge that page, but kind of lower down in the list07:01
pittibryce: not that urgent, was just a little confusing07:01
bryceyeah.  also it needs to be done with some care since a variety of !X pages link to that page07:02
bryceso whatever the new landing page needs to match what visitors are going to be expecting07:02
pittibryce: the redirect can stay for an indefinite time, to not break old links07:05
seb128good morning there08:20
pittihey seb12808:21
seb128hey pitti08:22
JonDoe297seb128: good morning :)08:22
seb128hi JonDoe29708:22
seb128hey mvo08:22
pittiugh, yesterday's empathy switch made the CDs overflow08:40
pittiwhy does it still ship pidgin? hm08:40
mvohey seb12808:41
seb128pitti, you still have pidgin-libnotify seeded maybe?08:42
pittiseb128: ah, that would be it, thanks08:43
seb128that's just a guess I didn't look at your changes but it depends on pidgin08:43
pittiseb128: won't help a lot08:43
pittibut half an MB08:43
pittiunfortunately libpurple pulls in pidgin-data08:43
seb128how much space change did it make08:43
pittiabout 10 MB08:43
pittiI guess it's time to remove gimp docs and add bck two langpacks08:44
seb128hey robert_ancell08:47
robert_ancellhey seb12808:47
robert_ancellseb128, can you pill the latest versions.py?  It has a few small fixes08:48
seb128robert_ancell, updated and page update done too08:50
seb128didrocks, are you still working on your gnome-python-desktop update?08:51
didrockslut seb12808:54
didrocksseb128: I was planning to do it tonight (I'm almost free for working in the evening until next week)08:54
seb128didrocks, 'lut, ok cool08:55
didrocksand as I have made the last split of this package, I prefer to make the first update :)08:55
seb128yeah, it's just on your plates for some 3 weeks now08:55
seb128so I was wondering if you were still working on it08:56
didrocksRMLL and quickly stuff had higher priority at this time :)08:56
robert_ancellhey who updated the menu so it now uses categories? My games menu is now browsable08:58
seb128didrocks, understandable that's why I was asking if the update should be unassigned so somebody else can claim it08:58
didrocksseb128: fine, but I keep it ;) (and I'm also planning in working on the dynamic association this week-end \o/)08:59
seb128robert_ancell, that's a merge error from Laney, the patch comes from debian but is buggy and we didn't use it before08:59
seb128didrocks, be careful to not overwork yourself though08:59
didrocksseb128: I just want to do as much as I can before my real holidays (mid-August)09:00
seb128everybody is taking holidays mid-august apparently09:00
seb128we can close the channel for 2 weeks or so ;-)09:00
seb128robert_ancell, does it still break the alphabetic ordering?09:01
robert_ancellthe submenus are before menu items but everything is in alphabetical order otherwise09:02
pittiArneGoetje: oh, update-support doesn't build l-s-translations-* any more?09:02
seb128robert_ancell, hum, maybe debian updated it but it used to break alphabetic ordering, at least when you don't have enough items to get categories09:03
robert_ancellseb128, checked all the other menus, everything is correct09:04
seb128ok good09:04
seb128robert_ancell, http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=543078 in fact09:05
Laneyhmm I didn't notice09:05
ubottuGnome bug 543078 in layout "Split games menu when too many games are installed" [Enhancement,Unconfirmed]09:05
seb128"the games won’t be sorted anymore and will sometimes be duplicated. "09:05
seb128good news is that the other bug has been fixed in git now09:05
robert_ancellcool, it is a huge improvement!!09:06
seb128Laney, that's ok we didn't merge for a while and there is quite some changes, easy to overlook one, I just know I dropped the debian patch in intrepid09:07
seb128it was breaking the ordering for some users09:07
Laneyah well we can roll another revision with the new patch if we need to I guess now09:08
seb128Laney, we can wait as long as it's fixed for karmic09:08
robert_ancellCan anyone explain to me why gnome-games has a dependency like this? gnome-games-data (>= ${gnome:Version}), gnome-games-data (<< ${gnome:NextVersion})09:09
pittirobert_ancell: looks like it would work with any 2.26.x, but not with a 2.25 or 2.2709:11
robert_ancellpitti, but why not just depend on the same version as the gnome-games package? It doesn't seem safe to me09:12
pittirobert_ancell: sure09:12
pittithat's in fact the usual approach09:12
=== mdz_ is now known as mdz
seb128what would work with 2.26 only?09:13
robert_ancellpitti, so if I change to to = ${binary:Version} would anyone complain?09:14
seb128hum, got the gnome-session crash when opening dialog too09:14
pittirobert_ancell: fine for me09:15
seb128robert_ancell, what is the issue?09:15
robert_ancellseb128, the gnome-games package has an odd dependency that appears to make it use any one the data packages in that series.  But that doesn't seem safe to me and the user will end up downloading a new package for every upgrade anyway09:15
robert_ancell"any of the"09:16
seb128robert_ancell, using binary:Version breaks installability on other archs during some time09:18
seb128ie the package will build on i386 first so you will get the -data to the new versions but the arch any binaries not matching yet09:18
robert_ancellseb128, but in that case won't the packages be held back until both the gnome-games and gnome-games-data packages are built with the same versions?09:19
seb128installability is an issue for new installs, CD builds, etc09:19
seb128not really for upgrades which can be hold as you said09:19
robert_ancellseb128, a CD build by definition requires all it's dependencies to be built right?  And a new install is from a CD image?09:21
seb128both require to be able to install everything which is on the CD09:21
seb128the desktop CD is basically a compressed installed and the install is copying things from the CD to the disk09:21
robert_ancellseb128, I don't see the problem.09:22
seb128well, apt-get install gnome-games will not work09:23
seb128it will say "gnome-games on amd64 is 2.26.1 but -data is 2.26.2 they don't match"09:23
robert_ancellwhy not?09:23
seb128since gnome-games 2.26.1 will depends on -data 2.26.109:23
seb128but since i386 already built 2.26.2 -data is 2.26.2 since it's arch all09:24
seb128and the amd64 arch any didn't build yet so gnome-games is still 2.26.109:24
robert_ancellSo what do all the other packages do about this?09:24
pittimvo: ok, so apport test suite failure isn't your fault, seems something changed in toolchain/gdb/whereever; will investigate09:25
seb128they don't depends on binary:Version in a strict way09:25
robert_ancellseb128, ok, does it make sense to just depend on gnome-games-data (no version).  It's about as safe as assuming the data wont change between minor versions09:26
seb128robert_ancell, either use source:Version or a >= at least09:26
seb128I would use >= ${source:Version}09:27
robert_ancellseb128, oh, ok, can I use = ${source:Version} ?09:27
chrisccoulsongood morning everyone09:27
mvopitti: thanks09:28
pittimvo: merged now, thanks for your work there!09:28
pittiI'll fix the gdb tests, merge the kernel crash bits to trunk as well, and then upload09:28
mvopitti: great :)09:28
seb128robert_ancell, I would use >= to avoid the installability issue I described before but yet09:29
seb128robert_ancell, you think the datas change in an incompatible way between minor versions?09:30
robert_ancellseb128, there's no guarantee.  For instance I just moved the location of a data file so in that case it would not be compatible09:30
seb128robert_ancell, ok, so use = ${source:Version}09:31
seb128robert_ancell, that doesn't make a real difference with binary:Version for us since we don't have binary rebuilds09:31
seb128that's a slight tradeoff between installability issues and non compatible datas issues09:32
robert_ancellseb128, sure.  I guess the archive needs to know which older versions to keep back for new installs09:33
seb128right, that would be the best way to address that09:33
robert_ancellseb128, and I guess apt doesn't handle picking and older version when multiple are available?09:34
seb128I'm not sure but usually the issue is rather than the old deb doesn't stay on the mirror once it's deprecated by a new build09:34
robert_ancellwell, there is a fundamental problem there.  I guess the current solution is to get everything to build on all archs!09:36
seb128yes, the issue is not new, it's less of an issue in ubuntu since we have regular mirror updates09:37
seb128ie you retry one hour later and that's ok09:37
seb128if you miss the run in debian you have to wait half of a day09:37
ArneGoetjepitti: correct09:52
chrisccoulsonpitti - regarding bug 399531 - if you're working on the consolekit part of it, do you want me to look at the gnome-session part? that will be a relatively low priority issue when consolekit works anyway, as the code path that triggers the crash won't be executed anymore.10:54
ubottuLaunchpad bug 399531 in consolekit "shutdown menu immediately logs out" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/39953110:54
pittichrisccoulson: would be good for robustness, since in theory one coudll change the d-bus policy10:54
pittichrisccoulson: or call it from an inactive session, or os10:54
chrisccoulsonpitti - yeah, definately.10:54
pittichrisccoulson: yes, I'm fixing CK now, and clean up patches along the way10:54
pittithanks to you!11:02
=== ember_ is now known as ember
asacany friendly archive admin around who could take a quick look at the modemmanager package and complain before i upload this? ;)11:31
pittiseb128: hm, since yesterday's updates, nautilus always destroys my icon arranging on my desktop11:34
pittiknown bug, or shall I file it?11:34
seb128pitti, did you update gvfs too? does rebuilding nautilus with the new gvfs makes a difference?11:36
pittiseb128: yes and unknown11:36
seb128pitti, somebody mentioned the bug on #nautilus yesterday and I asked to open an upstream bug dunno if there is one now though11:38
seb128pitti, that's due to the gvfs charges11:38
pittiok, I'll try a rebuild then11:38
* seb128 can see Keybuk reassigning all the dbus bugs to the softwares11:39
rodrigo_what provides libgconf2.0-cil in jaunty?11:39
seb128rodrigo_, http://packages.ubuntu.com/11:40
pittirodrigo_: it was temporarily renamed to libgconf2.24-cil for some reason11:40
rodrigo_ah ok, thanks11:41
Keybukseb128: not all of them ;)11:41
Keybukjust those that really look like invalid data being passed to libdbus functions11:41
seb128Keybuk, bug #335284 for example what sort of code error is the application doing?11:41
ubottuLaunchpad bug 335284 in gnome-keyring "gnome-keyring-daemon crashed with SIGSEGV in dbus_connection_get_dispatch_status()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/33528411:41
seb128ie http://launchpadlibrarian.net/23191024/Stacktrace.txt11:42
seb128Keybuk, should libdbus handle a transport=0x0 without crashing?11:42
Keybukseb128: the entire struct being passed in looks like it was free()'d previously11:43
Keybukie. gnome-keyring is passing in random pointers11:43
seb128Keybuk, where do you see that from the stacktrace?11:43
KeybukI suspect gnome-keyring is keeping a pointer to the connection, and hasn't ref()d it11:44
Keybukso the connection has been freed11:44
Keybukseb128: it's the only way that transport can be 011:44
Keybukit's one of the last things that dbus_connection_last_unref does before calling free()11:44
pittiseb128: shall I look at libgnomekbd/g-c-c sponsoring?11:45
seb128my question still stand, should libdbus handle 0x0 without crashing?11:45
Keybukseb128: no11:45
rodrigo_seb128, pitti: about the 0ubuntu1 suffix in versions, which one should be incremented when doing revisions?11:45
seb128rodrigo_, 0ubuntu<n>11:45
Keybukseb128: the problem is that the pointer connection=0x15d04a0 is invalid11:45
Keybukyou can't just pass free()d objects to a function and expect things to work out11:45
rodrigo_seb128: ok, got it right then this time :)11:45
seb128Keybuk, right, I'm just trying to figure how you know that the address is not valid11:45
* seb128 learns every day11:46
Keybukseb128: because it has the tell-tale signs of having been freed11:46
KeybukI just recognise the symptoms having crashed D-Bus a few times that way myself11:46
Keybukyou really have to keep your refs in order11:46
seb128ok, seems rather guessing work that something I can apply in a rational way when triaging bugs11:46
seb128thanks anyway ;-)11:46
Keybuknot guess work11:47
KeybukI just know the code well enough to read the stack trace and understand what happened11:47
seb128well, deep knowledge of the library if you want11:47
Keybuksomething in gnome-keyring's main loop got the dispatch status of a free'd connection11:47
seb128I was trying if there is something a bug triager without coding skills could use to triage those bugs correctly11:47
pittiseb128: could you please have a look at bug 399508, my last comment?11:47
ubottuLaunchpad bug 399508 in libgnomekbd "Please update to latest GIT snapshot" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/39950811:47
seb128+to figure11:47
pittiseb128: just checking whether the approach is okay with you11:48
pittiseb128: I would really like the two to be co-installable11:48
seb128pitti, sorry got sidetracked in this discussion, looking11:48
seb128pitti, yes I think that's fine11:48
seb128that's only a schemas and translations11:49
pittiseb128: the new version just adds a new key schema, so it should work fine with lib 311:49
pittidoing then, thanks11:50
Keybukpitti: I'm doing some serious gardening on the dbus bugs list11:56
KeybukI think a lot of the crashes were the same bug I found a while back with Upstart, and I fixed that11:56
Keybukfiling everything else back upstream, or bouncing back to the package that caused it11:56
seb128ok, new linux version doesn't boot on my laptop apparently12:08
davmor2meh weird.  does anyone use salut on karmic's empathy and have a jaunty box with bonjour on it?  Empathy seems to be able to see the jaunty box but not talk to bonjour, bonjour just doesn't see the karmic box :(12:08
davmor2bonjour in pidgin12:09
chrisccoulsonpitti - i didn't know about bzr mv before. that's useful to know though. thanks;)12:12
chrisccoulsonseb128 - any idea how i can attach gdb to gnome-session when it crashes at the start of the session?12:21
chrisccoulsonit was easy with the old GDM, but doesn't seem possible with the new one12:21
chrisccoulsonhmmm, i suppose i don't need to do that actually. i could just get it to leave a coredump and analyse it after12:23
pittiseb128: so, rebuilding nautilus doesn't change anything12:24
pittichrisccoulson: by and large, g-c-c still seems to work12:25
chrisccoulsonpitti - thanks. i didn't have a chance to test it last night with the libgnomekbd issue. i wasn't sure whether those dependencies could be relaxed or not, and it got quite late in the end12:25
pittichrisccoulson: should be fine, new -common just adds a new gconf key schema, should work fine with 312:26
pittichrisccoulson: I added a new keyboard layout, etc., works fine12:26
pittichrisccoulson: now I jsut wonder what g-c-c uses policykit for, to test that12:26
chrisccoulsonthanks, thats good to know12:26
pittithere's a "set system-wide" button in keyboard capplet, but it doesn't seem to do anything12:26
pittimight that need the gconf polkit-1 migration?12:27
pittieither way, I'd upload the lot now, seems to work fine, and depwait will sort it out12:27
chrisccoulsonupstream g-c-c only uses policykit or something in gnome-about-me. the "set system wide" button is an ubuntu patch, which mvo ported yesterday12:27
chrisccoulsonthe rest of the fedora patch was actually to patch an existing fedora patch, to add a "set system wide" button in gnome-appearance-properties12:27
mvopitti: it needs the new ubuntu-system-service (that is not uploaded yet)12:28
pittichrisccoulson: many thanks for that mega-update12:28
chrisccoulsonand we don't have that patch12:28
pittimvo: ah12:28
chrisccoulsonpitti - you're welcome12:28
mvopitti: it should be uploaded when g-c-c is ready, then it should function again12:28
chrisccoulsoni'm wondering if we should look at the fedora patch for changing system theme? it would mean users could theme GDM then12:28
pittiI'd wait with that until DX has done their works on new gdm12:29
chrisccoulsonyeah, no problem12:29
chrisccoulsonpitti - does the display capplet work ok? i had to change the screen-resolution-extra patch to work with the new version12:30
pittichrisccoulson: by and large, yes12:31
chrisccoulsoncool, thanks:)12:31
pittienabling my internal LVDS switches down the resolution, and unusably rearranges the desktop12:32
pittibut that doesn't sound like a capplet problem12:32
chrisccoulsonthat bits difficult for me to test anyway, as i have nvidia hardware and use evil proprietary drivers;)12:32
pittichrisccoulson, mvo: g-c-c 2.27.3 uploaded12:32
chrisccoulsonyay \o/12:33
pittihttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/PolicyKitOneMigration updated12:33
ftaseb128, evolution crashes or freezes each time i try to view or save an attachement, or when i ask the spell checker to correct a typo, is that known?12:34
mvoubuntu-system-service uploaded now too12:35
pittichrisccoulson: so it should now be gnome-{settings-daemon,screensaver,applets?, moblin-applets which need that soname transition, not too bad12:35
pittimvo: \o/12:35
=== MacSlow is now known as MacSlow|lunch
seb128chrisccoulson, start a non GNOME session and run gdb gnome-session there?12:36
seb128fta, where does it crash? did you update dbus and gvfs? did you reboot since?12:37
ftastarted a few weeks ago, and i see that on several boxes, so yes, updated and rebooted12:38
ftai can capture traces if it doesn't ring a bell12:39
seb128_chrisccoulson, start a non GNOME session and run gdb gnome-session there?12:40
seb128_fta, where does it crash? did you update dbus and gvfs? did you reboot since?12:40
seb128_Keybuk, would some recent dbus changes make libdbus clients crashes in some cases until the dbus daemon restart?12:40
fta<fta> started a few weeks ago, and i see that on several boxes, so yes, updated and rebooted12:41
fta<fta> i can capture traces if it doesn't ring a bell12:41
seb128_fta, spell checker rings a bell not the file viewing or opening12:41
Keybukseb128_: I can't think of anything that would, no12:41
Keybukif there were protocol bugs, you'd get disconnected12:42
seb128_ok, weird, I will keep an eye on that12:42
seb128_I got some things crashing this morning and that has been fixed after a reboot12:43
Keybukthough remember that after an upgrade, both the clients and daemon are *still* using the old libdbus anyway12:43
seb128_right, I did restart some applications though12:43
seb128_in fact I restart my session but didn't reboot12:44
ftaseb128, view/save seems to be a freeze /w 100% cpu, not a crash12:44
Keybukthat's odd12:45
Keybukif you restarted your session, you'd be using both the new dbus daemon and new library ;-)12:45
seb128_Keybuk, the system daemon wouldn't be restarted would it?12:46
Keybukseb128_: no, but that depends on which clients12:46
seb128_I will try to see if I can get the issue again12:46
seb128_the crashed where in dbus call made by gvfs12:47
seb128_the crashes were12:47
seb128_fta, bug #389101 is the spell checking bug12:47
ubottuLaunchpad bug 389101 in gtkhtml3.14 "evolution crashed when correct new message" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/38910112:47
seb128_fta, 100% cpu are you sure you are not just opening something which takes a while to download or process?12:48
ftaseb128_, it's a brand new quadcore, i doubt 1h of 100% cpu is normal to open a pdf or a ppt/doc12:50
seb128_fta, ok, so I don't know, works fine here12:50
pittijames_w: halp plz12:51
james_whi pitti12:51
chrisccoulsonKeybuk - a long time ago, you made a change to procps to increase the maximum number of inotify watches, due to tracker (and the change was eventually moved to tracker). Was that change in response to any specific issues?13:10
Keybukchrisccoulson: yes13:11
chrisccoulsonthe only reason i ask, is because the tracker developers tell me that it limits the number of inotify watches to (MAX - 512), although it is not clear how long that has been the case13:11
Keybukchrisccoulson: "MAX" ?13:12
Keybukchrisccoulson: the simple answer is that each directory watched costs one inotify watch13:12
Keybukif you have 100,000 directories, you need 100,000 watches13:12
chrisccoulsonit gets the maximum from somewhere in /proc apparently, and then self limits13:12
chrisccoulsonah, ok. so the change is probably still needed then13:12
Keybukquest scott% cat /proc/sys/fs/inotify/max_user_watches13:13
seb128ok, I had to use a livecd to fix my karmic13:13
Keybukthat would mean you can watch no more than 8,192 directories13:13
seb128thanks to Keybuk13:13
Keybukif you had more, tracker would exhaust all inotify watches leaving none for anybody else13:13
Keybukthat's probably why it limits itself to MAX-51213:13
Keybukbut something still needs to increase the MAX13:13
Keybukseb128: what did I do?! :p13:13
chrisccoulsonkeybuk - thanks. so it looks like the change still needs to remain even though tracker self-limits13:13
Keybukchrisccoulson: tracker should probably use fanotify() rather than inotify() anyway13:14
Keybukgiven it's design13:14
chrisccoulsonKeybuk - there's already talk about going to that13:14
seb128Keybuk, sudo dpkg -i *.deb let me downgrade libdbus and next reboot gave a init undefined symbol: dbus_message_iter_abandon_container13:15
Keybukseb128: you downgraded libdbus too far?13:17
seb128Keybuk, 1.2.14-2ubuntu313:17
Keybukthat's too far ;)13:17
seb128Keybuk, what I don't get it why dpkg didn't tell me that things are depending on >= 1.2.14-2ubuntu713:17
chrisccoulsonseb128 - just saw your earlier comment. is it possible to start a non-Gnome session from the new GDM (I didn't think it was, although I can't check that at the moment). With the old GDM, i just started a failsafe terminal13:17
Keybukseb128: dunno, shlibs just didn't work for some reason13:17
Keybukit looks like it worked for the 1.2.16 upload13:18
seb128chrisccoulson, sudo /etc/init.d/gdm stop: echo "somecommand" > .xsession; startx?13:18
Keybukmaybe I haven't quite figured out how all this symbols stuff works yet13:18
Keybukseb128: why did you need to downgrade dbus?13:18
seb128Keybuk, I wanted to see if I was getting those apps crashing again after upgrading13:19
chrisccoulsonseb128 - thanks, i'll try that13:19
Keybukseb128: also remember that dpkg doesn't warn you when downgrading about breaking >= rules13:19
Keybukit's one of the dpkg "annoyances"13:19
Keybukit only ensures the dependencies of the set you're installing are correct13:19
Keybukit doesn't check that you're not violating any dependencies of things already installed13:20
Keybuk(which is why dpkg -i can leave a system needed apt-get -f install)13:20
seb128anyway fixed by copying the new libdbus from a livecd ;-)13:20
seb128chrisccoulson, btw http://download.gnome.org/sources/libgnomekbd/2.27/libgnomekbd-2.27.4.tar.gz13:22
seb128some GNOME guy noticed the issue while trying to build GNOME 2.27.4 and rolled a tarball13:23
chrisccoulsonseb128 - thanks. right after i prepared the GIT version ;)13:23
seb128chrisccoulson, yeah, sorry about that, svu who is the maintainer is not around but somebody else took the liberty to roll a tarball now13:23
chrisccoulsonthanks. i suspect nothing has changed though, so there's probably no win in uploading this version13:24
=== MacSlow|lunch is now known as MacSlow
chrisccoulsonyeah, i just had a look in GIT, and 2.27.4 is the same as the one we just uploaded13:26
Keybukseb128: obviously NoReply, Timeout and AccessDenied D-Bus errors are not dbus bugs - they're bugs of clients or services13:27
seb128Keybuk, right, I'm not the one who reassigned those13:28
KeybukI saw lots of crashes inside dbus_connection_dispatch which I think I've fixed13:28
Keybukbut I'll keep an eye out to see whether they come back13:28
Keybukthere may actually be some dbus-glib bugs13:28
Keybuksince a lot of the GNOME apps use that instead of libdbus13:28
seb128Keybuk, I've rather issue with things similar to bug #39710913:28
ubottuBug 397109 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/397109 is private13:28
seb128bug #39710913:28
ubottuLaunchpad bug 397109 in gnome-screensaver "gnome-screensaver crashed with SIGSEGV in dbus_connection_get_dispatch_status()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/39710913:28
Keybukseb128: again, that's one of those things that looks like it's passing a free'd connection13:29
seb128lot of applications seem to be doing that13:29
seb128do you have any tip on how to debug those?13:29
KeybukI think there might be a dbus-glib bug there somewhere13:29
KeybukI had a similar bug in nih-dbus where I'd iterate a loop of watches13:29
Keybukthe first one would free the connection13:30
Keybukbut I'd still visit the connection in the second watch because the connection had more than one13:30
Keybukvalgrind should help13:30
Keybukif it's doing what I think it's doing, it'll show up as accessing free'd memory13:30
seb128the issue is that most people get the issue only once randomly which doesn't make debugging easy13:31
seb128chrisccoulson, did you say you had a fix for the gdm greeter registration warning issue?13:32
chrisccoulsonseb128 - not for the GDM side, but i was going to disable the dialog in metacity. that was going to be my next task, although i need to debug this gnome-session crash first13:33
seb128is any gnome-session work pending?13:36
seb128I need to do an upload to fix gnome-session-bin not using Replaces on gnome-session13:38
chrisccoulsonseb128 - there is an outstanding change in bzr to not call gtk-window-decorator from gnome-wm13:39
chrisccoulsonhmm, at least i thought there was13:41
seb128chrisccoulson, it's not indeed13:41
chrisccoulsonperhaps i didn't push the change13:41
chrisccoulsonwhich one is not needed?13:41
seb128can you push it now?13:41
chrisccoulsoni can't now, as the branch is at home13:41
* chrisccoulson really should get a job where he can work on ubuntu during the day without people noticing13:42
seb128ok, I will do the Replaces change now we can merge your change later13:43
chrisccoulsonyeah, no problem. it will hopefully come with 2 crasher fixes too13:43
crevettechrisccoulson, I thought you were working for cano13:44
crevettein regards of the things you do13:44
chrisccoulsoncrevette - no, i don't ;)13:44
chrisccoulsoni work in an entirely unrelated industry13:44
seb128asac, is there any way to import rdf bookmarks in firefox?13:55
seb128asac, ignore that epiphany can export in html too13:56
asacseb128: i wouldnt think so at first, but what rdf standard is epiphany using?13:57
seb128asac, that's ok I used html and that worked13:59
* seb128 gives a try to firefox13:59
asacseb128: now that you asked, could you please paste the rdf exported thing? ;)13:59
asacor at least a few examples so i can figure what they use ;)13:59
seb128<?xml version="1.0"?>14:00
seb128<rdf:RDF xmlns="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/" xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/" xmlns:ephy="http://gnome.org/ns/epiphany#" xmlns:rdf="http://www.w3.org/1999/02/22-rdf-syntax-ns#">14:00
asacseb128: using Shiretoko?14:10
seb128asac, no, using whatever is in karmic14:10
seb128and I already hate firefox14:10
asacuse firefox-3.5 ;)14:10
asacthats what will be in karmic14:10
asacseb128: be open minded14:10
asaci dont hate epiphany either ;)14:11
seb128the damn thing use a cached version of a greasemonkey script and no way to update14:11
seb128asac, well I'm fighting for 10 minutes to get a greasmonkey script working now14:11
asacnor do i hate kazehase ;) ... its just that i hate konqueror :-P14:11
asacseb128: click on it after installing greasmonkey extension14:11
asacif it doesnt work then its a bug in the greasemonkey script ;)14:11
seb128asac, I opened http://people.ubuntu.com/~seb128/bugtriage.user.js but that was an outdated version14:11
seb128I deleted it in firefox14:11
seb128scped a new version there14:12
seb128and did add it again14:12
seb128and it's still using the outdated version14:12
seb128sshing on rookery show the right version is on disk14:12
asacmaybe the http headers are messed up14:12
asacand ffox thinks the file hasnt changed14:12
asaci would restart firefox if thats the case14:12
seb128it tries to be too smart14:13
asacif webserver is really buggy its not really a bug ;)14:13
asacbut that first needs to be confirmed14:13
seb128still not14:13
seb128asac, can you open http://people.ubuntu.com/~seb128/bugtriage.user.js and tell me if you have a GNOME stock reply if you do view source14:13
asacseb128: whats the diff of the two files ;)14:14
seb128in the prevalues list14:14
seb128the new file has a prevalues GNOME14:14
asacseb128: using our greasmonkey package or downloaded from AMO?14:14
seb128ii  greasemonkey                               0.8.20090123.1-0ubuntu2                    firefox extension that enables customization14:15
seb128I've that installed14:15
seb128I didn't download anything14:15
asacyeah. havent heard of such a bug though14:16
seb128asac, it's a caching issue if I rename the script on the server it's fine14:17
seb128hate hate hate14:17
asacgood. then the questio is if the http headers are broken14:17
asacwhich i would think for now14:17
asacotherwise its greasmonkey trying to be too smart on its own14:18
seb128I didn't ask it to cache anything for me14:18
waltersKeybuk: so these are some older crashes?14:18
asacfirefox caching definitly works14:18
asacseb128: you did, because the default is to cache http stuff14:18
seb128how do I clean the cache?14:18
asacon disk and in mem14:18
seb128that's ridiculous14:18
asacnot honouring http headers would be stupid14:19
seb128I'm probably not lucky but I'm running it for 15 minutes and I spent 10 minutes to try to make a thing which should be trivial work14:19
=== agateau_ is now known as agateau
asacseb128: tols -> clear private data14:21
Keybukwalters: I think the ones I cleared out were - the ones I've filed upstream I think have not been fixed14:21
seb128asac, I don't want to clear my private data I just want to tell it to not try to play smart on this one since apparently that's a fail14:21
asacseb128: can you tell epiphany to not be smart about any operation?14:21
asacno. so if its really the cache then its to clear private data14:22
asacyou caan select which private data you want to clear14:22
seb128asac, no, but epiphany doesn't fail to get my update greasmonkey version either14:22
waltersKeybuk: are these all single crashes?  i'm not seeing a duplicate thing in the lp bug view14:22
asacyes, maybe because its stupid. or maybe because our greasmonkey extension is buggy14:22
asacbut definitly not because firefox is smart ;)14:22
asacits stupid == our http server is broken and doesnt do proper timestamps14:23
Keybukwalters: which?14:23
seb128asac: well, forget about that, I've work to do I go back to epiphany if I can't get my greasmonkey to work with firefox14:23
waltersKeybuk: say like https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dbus/+bug/39521614:23
ubottuUbuntu bug 395216 in dbus "SIGSEGV in dbus_address_entry_get_value()" [Unknown,Confirmed]14:23
waltersKeybuk: oh wait, i do see a duplicate thing on the right, need to log in though.14:24
Keybukwalters: that has one duplicate, the link is on the RHS14:24
waltersKeybuk: ok logged in, but i don't have permission14:28
Keybukwalters: what are you trying to do?14:29
waltersKeybuk: click on the "Duplicates of this bug" link on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dbus/+bug/39521614:29
ubottuUbuntu bug 395216 in dbus "SIGSEGV in dbus_address_entry_get_value()" [Unknown,Confirmed]14:29
waltersi guess one of the duplicates is private maybe?14:29
Keybukfixed that14:29
Keybukyou should be able to see it now14:29
seb128mvo, the xapian synaptic thing is really suboptimal14:30
seb128mvo, typing firefox-3.5 doesn't list firefox-3.5 on the first screen14:30
seb128it's some 3 screen further on the list14:31
mvoseb128: hm, I can confirm that14:32
* mvo scratches his head14:32
seb128hey rickspencer314:33
seb128mvo, I would expect the exact matches to be listed first14:33
rickspencer3hi seb12814:33
mvoseb128: it does that for most stuff (or should do it)14:34
seb128mvo, my experience is that it mostly doesn't14:34
mvoseb128: xapian is sometimes too clever, I'm having a look14:34
seb128mvo, ie "nautilus" gives some python-nautilus first14:34
seb128libgtk2.0-0 gives lot of dbgsym and libgtk2.0-0 is very far down the list14:35
seb128update-notifier lists update-manager before14:36
seb128mvo, in fact it's hard to find a case where it works ;-)14:36
mvoseb128: hrm14:38
mptmvo, what would it take for Update Manager to be able to detect, ahead of time, which updates require a restart?14:39
mpt(Instead of springing the "oh, btw, you need to restart" surprise on you afterwards)14:39
seb128mpt, something in the package informations I guess14:40
seb128mpt, right now it's done my having packages dumping a file somewhere on the disk after install14:40
seb128my -> by14:40
mvompt: next to impossible unfortunately in the general case. we can add a heurisitic of course that should get ~90%14:41
mptmvo, Mac OS X manages it, so it can't be impossible :-P14:41
seb128mvo, well we could have an extra control field for that ...14:42
seb128assuming that something requires a reboot in a consistent way after any upgrade14:42
mvompt: sorry, I meant with the current way its next to impossible. if we change the game (as seb128 suggested) then its certainly doable14:43
mvohow far head? I assume before actual packages have been downloaded?14:44
mptmvo, yes14:44
mptSo that it could be shown in the list of updates, for example, which ones will require a restart and which won't14:44
mvompt: we will have to add it to the packages list then14:47
mvoseb128: I think I figured how to make it better now14:57
seb128mvo, you really rock!14:59
seb128mvo, let me know if you want some user testing ;-)14:59
* mvo mubbles something about black art14:59
mvoseb128: I will polish it a bit more and upload in some minutes, then feedback is welcome14:59
* mvo adds a "Debug::Synaptic::xapian" option15:05
hyperairhuh for some reason notify-osd stopped displaying notifications O_o15:06
seb128mvo, are all those debug options listed somewhere?15:06
seb128hyperair, dbus upgrade?15:06
seb128works here15:06
seb128but I rebooted after upgrade15:06
mvoseb128: not all, I add them to the README15:07
seb128$ dpkg -L apt | grep README15:08
mvoseb128: oh, the apt ones are in configure-index15:08
mvoseb128: the synaptic ones are not15:08
seb128configure index?15:08
ftaseb128, evolution-data-server-2.28 just crashed (a few minutes after a reboot with a fully synched karmic 32), that's in dbus.. but i see a new dbus that just appeared...15:09
seb128fta, talk to Keybuk about dbus issues ;-)15:09
seb128mvo, danke, I usually try the manpages and then google, good to know ;-)15:10
ftai'm waiting for the dbus -dbgsym.. too bad there's no -dbg15:10
hyperairseb128: no, notify-osd seems to be complaining about not being able to find a panel.15:13
hyperairseb128: but i do have a panel.15:13
seb128hyperair, notify-osd bug then15:13
seb128fta, https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/395216 could be?15:13
ubottuUbuntu bug 395216 in dbus "SIGSEGV in dbus_address_entry_get_value()" [Unknown,Confirmed]15:13
hyperairbut what could suddenly cause it i wonder =\15:13
seb128hyperair, did you do any change to your gnome-panel config?15:15
hyperairseb128: nope.15:15
hyperairseb128: not recently, in any case.15:15
seb128dunno then15:15
waltersi'm analyzing that bug now15:15
waltersit's a fun one15:15
hyperair** (notify-osd:11961): DEBUG: selecting monitor 0 at (0,0) - 1280x102415:16
hyperair** (notify-osd:11961): DEBUG: no panel detetected; using workarea fallback15:16
hyperair** (notify-osd:11961): DEBUG: top corner at: 2295, 2315:16
* hyperair scratches head15:16
hyperairlemme try and turn off one monitor15:17
hyperairaha. it works now.15:17
hyperairso basically it fails at detecting a panel on a dual head setup15:18
ftaseb128, not sure, the (unresolved) StacktraceTop is slightly different, http://paste.ubuntu.com/218970//top15:18
ftaseb128, btw, after by last reboot, all my menus are sorted (all separators gone too) and my desktop has been fully re-organized, which huge spaces everywhere15:19
ftait's the 2nd time15:19
seb128fta, "sorted"?15:20
seb128fta, nautilus not storing positions correctly is a known issue15:20
ftai had my own organization for years :P15:20
seb128could be one of the debian changes15:21
seb128need debugging by somebody having the issue15:21
seb128asac, how do I do the "lp: 123 open launchpad.net/123" in firefox?15:27
seb128or whatever equivalent there is to having text entries for website/%s in epiphany15:27
hyperairseb128: create a bookmark and add a keyword to it15:28
seb128how do I tell it what url part the 123 should replace?15:28
pittiseb128: oh, gnome-shell in karmic now15:29
seb128pitti, autofinger error15:29
pittiit wasn't meant to be?15:30
seb128pitti, and somebody did NEW it by mistake, it was supposed to be a ppa upload15:30
seb128pitti, well it doesn't hurt but some depends are not in karmic yet so it will not build15:30
pittiseb128: and I wanted to commend you for being aggressive about reaching karmic goals :)15:30
seb128well I don't plan to get git snapshots in universe15:30
seb128and they didn't roll tarballs yet15:31
seb128asac, thanks15:31
seb128ok, that's a space to use15:31
seb128I was doing "lp123" and "lp:123"15:31
asac16:27 < gnomefreak> did my menu redo its self? things i removed from it came back15:34
asacseb128: ^^15:34
asaci think its the gnome-panel he talks about15:34
asacfta had the same problem as it seems15:34
seb128Laney, ^15:35
stgraberhello, anyone also has its gconfd in some kind of inifinte loop eating all CPU looking for /schemas/desktop/gnome/interface (on Karmic of course) ?15:35
* asac doesnt want to upgrade if that happens :)15:35
stgraberstarted this morning and reduced the battery life of my laptop by half :)15:35
seb128stgraber, did you try enable desktop effects?15:35
gnomefreakasac: seiflotfy1 the preferences/admin menus re populated itself with things i removed from menus15:35
gnomefreakalso happened to fta15:36
seb128gnomefreak, no need to repeat that again that has just been said15:36
stgraberseb128: I have compiz running15:36
asacah ... so really the menu. thats not that bad at least15:36
rickspencer3seb128: I wasn't able to reproduce Steve's screen saver issue eitehr15:36
rickspencer3is it ok for me to close it as invalid?15:36
rickspencer3by "ok" I mean "customary"15:37
seb128rickspencer3, well if that happens for steve that's a bug, I would just not mark it high priority if that's config specific15:37
rickspencer3ok, I'll leave it as is, but unassign it from the desktop team15:37
seb128rickspencer3, sounds good15:37
stgraberhttp://paste.ubuntu.com/218991/ small part of what strace shows me though it's always the same thing repeating over and over15:38
seb128gnomefreak, fta: are your changes in .local/share/applications?15:38
seb128stgraber, is metacity running?15:38
stgraberseb128: I just turned off compiz so now it does yeah15:39
seb128stgraber, there is a known issue about it using cpu15:39
Laneythere was a file rename, maybe that causes it15:39
seb128chriscoulson knows about it15:39
seb128Laney, which one?15:39
Laneymv debian/gnome-menus/etc/xdg/menus/applications.menu debian/gnome-menus/etc/xdg/menus/gnome-applications.menu15:40
Laneymv debian/gnome-menus/etc/xdg/menus/settings.menu debian/gnome-menus/etc/xdg/menus/gnome-settings.menu15:41
seb128Laney, arg, another debian change we undo usually15:41
Laneyyeah I guess I didn't see the problem because I was only testing on new users15:42
Laneyand it didn't break my normal user actually15:42
seb128well, when we do something usually keep doing it when merging15:42
seb128when it's done that's for a reason15:42
ftaseb128, I have 77 files in my .local/share/applications, some years old, it looks like my changes are in there, but ignored, or something15:43
gnomefreakseb128: no but i have already changed the settings back to what i had15:44
LaneyI'll fix it and grab that patch from git if you want15:44
gnomefreaki only have 12 in mine15:44
seb128fta, does doing a mv symetric to what Laney describe fixes the issue?15:44
seb128Laney, that would be nice thank you15:44
seb128fta, ie going in /etx/xdg/menus and drop the gnome- prefixes there15:45
Laneyis there something like svn-do for our packaging branches?15:49
james_wbzr bd-do15:49
james_wa tongue-twister command15:50
kenvandinewhat does that do?15:50
Laneyjames_w: what package?15:51
Laneymaybe I don't have builddeb on this box15:51
Laneythought I did, silly me15:51
kenvandinejames_w, that looks very useful!15:51
james_wthank the person that wrote svn-do, I just stole the idea :0)15:52
Laneyhaving debian/ only branches without it is a major headache15:52
ftaer.. it's already called /etc/xdg/menus/applications.menu and settings.menu here15:53
ftaseb128, ^^15:53
seb128fta, does moving the gnome-* away makes a difference?15:53
pittimvo: congrats, the "support kernel crashes" trunk commit is r150015:54
pittiI added a "except OSError:" for the calling of "crash" (if it's not installed) and did some stylistic cleanups, otherwise looks fine15:54
ftaseb128, http://paste.ubuntu.com/219009/ (without any rename)15:55
seb128fta, right, mv gnome-* ..15:55
seb128fta, and see if that makes a difference15:55
ftaseb128, then restart?15:55
ftaLaney, no?15:56
LaneyI don't think that will work15:56
seb128restart gnome-panel15:56
seb128Laney, any idea what else broke menus?15:56
Laneyit's reading gnome-* right now15:56
Laneythere's a patch15:56
seb128ah ok15:56
seb128fta, wait for the update rather than15:56
Laneyif you move the other way then you will get your settings back15:56
seb128there is a patch which should not be applied which has been used15:56
Laneybut we'll revert this change15:56
seb128neither Laney nor pitti noticed15:56
Laneyso just hold tight15:56
ftai'll wait15:56
seb128pitti, gnome-menus got some merge errors but no big deal going to sort that15:57
Laneyshouldn't have applied 06_menus_rename.patch15:57
Laneynaughty us15:57
seb128no need to be sorry guys that happens to anybody15:58
Laneyjust pulling the patches for menu merging15:59
Laneythen the split should work well too15:59
james_wmpt: have you seen http://mail.gnome.org/archives/gnomecc-list/2009-July/msg00007.html ?16:00
mptjames_w, no16:00
* mpt looks16:00
mvopitti: thanks a lot!16:01
mptthanks james_w16:01
pittirickspencer3: gnome-power-manager is desktop team (bug 135548)16:09
ubottuLaunchpad bug 135548 in gnome-power "[Gutsy] Action on critical battery isn't triggered - regression" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/13554816:09
rickspencer3pitti: yeah, Keybuk let me know like 2 minutes after I reassigned it :)16:10
pittiassigned back to us16:10
rickspencer3could you please assign it to an engineer, rather than the team?16:10
Keybuk2 minutes?16:10
KeybukI was that slow? :p16:10
Laneythe git patch is already in by Debian16:13
seb128Laney, which might explain why the sorting issue was fixed ;-)16:21
Laneyseb128: lp:~laney/+junk/gnome-menus16:23
Laney(built but not tested, on osx right now)16:23
seb128Laney, thanks, building now to test and uploading16:25
seb128Laney, we might need to add a postinst snippet to clean the new .menus since those are conffiles16:26
Laneyyeah there is already some logic in gnome-menus.postinst if you want to do that16:27
Laneypreinst sorry16:27
mclasenpitti: hey, I think I saw you file a bug about CK dbus permissions earlier today, but I've lost it in bug spam...16:48
pittimclasen: hey16:51
pittimclasen: I sent it to https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2217816:51
pitti(comment 1)16:51
ubottuFreedesktop bug 22178 in Daemon "port to PolicyKit 1.0" [Normal,New]16:51
seb128Laney, uploaded with the preinst change16:53
Laneycool, nice work16:53
mclasenpitti: ah, turns out we had that change hidden in some other patch...16:55
pittimclasen: I reviewed our CK package today, and we also have tons of patches16:56
pittihalf of them are in git now, though16:56
pittibut last release is a while ago, so understandable :)16:56
mclasenpitti: I think we'll need a new ConsoleKit release soon, together with a new gdm release16:57
seb128mclasen, does gdm let out log out on fedora when you use autologin?16:57
seb128mclasen, I'm surprised that nobody noticed or opened a bug upstream before, I'm wondering if that's ubuntu specific for some reason16:58
mclasenlet out ?16:58
seb128set autologin, start the computer, try to close the session16:59
seb128it autolog you again16:59
pittii. e. no timed login?16:59
seb128where you would expect it to stay on the greeter and let an another user to log in16:59
seb128pitti, I'm not sure now if it used to time login the same user or just to stay on the greeter16:59
mclasennot sure what the latest status about that is, it sure has been complained about before17:00
seb128I might better try asking on #gdm maybe17:00
* seb128 fixes gnome-menus again17:14
seb128Laney, 08_menus_prefix.patch need to be commented too17:15
chrisccoulsongdm requires gnome-settings-daemon doesn't it?17:57
seb128chrisccoulson, yes18:06
chrisccoulsonseb128 - i thought so.18:06
seb128chrisccoulson, it requires gnome-session which requires gnome-settings-daemon if you want things working correctly18:06
seb128ie have a theme, etc18:06
chrisccoulsonyeah. did you see cody-somerville proposed a merge in to GDM, which changes the dependency from gnome-session to gnome-session-bin?18:07
chrisccoulsonthat will mean that GDM no longer gets the gnome-settings-daemon dependency18:07
Laneyseb128: hehe18:16
seb128chrisccoulson, no18:16
seb128chrisccoulson, those merge requests go whoever knows18:17
chrisccoulsonpitti - i think i've spotted the gnome-session problem ;)18:32
pittichrisccoulson: yay!18:32
chrisccoulsonthe dbus_g_proxy_call_with_timeout used to call CanStop is missing a G_TYPE_BOOLEAN18:33
chrisccoulsonits crashing after calling that function anyway18:33
pittichrisccoulson: ah, that explains why it still broke even if it's allowed to call this18:34
chrisccoulsonyeah, it seems something in the session calls CanShutdown on the gnome-session interface, then that makes it crash18:34
chrisccoulsonits not actually crashing or leaving a core dump though. it actually catches the SIGSEGV, then freezes :-/18:35
chrisccoulsonit freezes in the signal handler somewhere18:36
chrisccoulsonbut that is better for me because it means i can attach gdb too it ;)18:36
chrisccoulsonyay! gnome-session doesn't crash anymore \o/18:53
chrisccoulsonand the shutdown dialog works:)18:53
didrocksseb128: gnome-python-desktop ready for review18:54
seb128chrisccoulson, didrocks: good work ;-)18:55
chrisccoulsoni'll push the changes shortly seb128. there is still one crash bug to fix, but users won't experience that unless their dbus policy is messed up or consolekit disappears18:56
chrisccoulsondo you want me to push the changes and then look at the other crash later on? it's less urgent than the one i've just fixed18:56
seb128whatever you prefer, I'm about to go for dinner I will do sponsoring in 1.5 hour18:57
chrisccoulsonok, i'll catty on working on it for now. i might have the other one fixed by the time you finish dinner hopefully18:57
chrisccoulsoncatty -> carry18:57
chrisccoulson(my fingers must be too big)18:58
asacsuperm1: hey. re bluez upgrade issue. i think its ok to not do any complicated recovery stuff for the ubuntu1/2 packages20:00
superm1asac, so just ignore them?20:01
asacsuperm1: we are just having brekage for 24h in karmic alpha ... so i think if it helps we dont need to fix it.20:01
asacyes ... if the fix is really tricky, just ignore it (assuming its really not a problem if users go to ubuntu3 directly)20:02
superm1yeah it's fine if you go to ubuntu3 directly20:02
superm1the fix is really tricky to get right it seems after looking at a few different options20:02
asacthats what i thought20:02
superm1i'll mark the bug as 'Won't Fix' then and put the workarounds in the description then20:02
asaci think < 24h not-recovered brekage is ok in alpha2 stage20:02
asacsuperm1: right. thats good approach20:03
superm1okay thanks :)20:04
chrisccoulsonit does seem like breakage is increasing now ;)20:04
asacchrisccoulson: in ubuntu3?20:04
chrisccoulsonin general20:04
asacor in general ;)20:04
gesersuperm1: I don't have any detailed analysis, but to it looks like the old prerm tries to stop the daemon (and the initscript fails). If that's the only thing the prerm does, the new prerm just need to catch this ("failed-upgrade") and do nothing (the daemon is stopped else the bug won't occur) and the upgrade should proceed.20:05
asacah. hehe. yes, i always felt like that at some point everything will blow up completely ;)20:05
chrisccoulsonit wouldn't be as much fun if things didn't break ;)20:05
chrisccoulsoni'd have nothing to do in the evenings!20:06
asacno complains, no rants. that would be bad indeed20:06
chrisccoulsonheh. well, i'm sure everyone could do without the rants20:06
chrisccoulsonbreakage && !rants = good ;)20:07
superm1geser, okay i'll try, if that doesn't work out, i'll plan on just "Won't Fix"20:08
gesersuperm1: see also comment #8 and #9 for a prerm and postrm20:11
geserin that bug20:11
chrisccoulsonhi seb12820:14
chrisccoulsonnice dinner?20:14
seb128hello chrisccoulson20:14
chrisccoulsoni just finished fixing the second crash now \o/20:14
didrocksseb128: I'm looking at updating empathy. Upstream seems to have API incompatibility (some symbols removed) without bumping the soname. I looked at what the DM does to achieve the same thing. But probably tomorrow :)20:14
seb128ready for some sponsoring now if anybody has something ready ;-)20:14
seb128didrocks, ask bigon if he's around*20:15
chrisccoulsonseb128 - i'll push the changes, but the second patch is quite hard to review with it being a patch on a patch. it looks much bigger than it really is20:16
seb128chrisccoulson, I usually apply patches to both versions and diff those for reviewing20:17
chrisccoulsonseb128 - i can do that20:17
seb128chrisccoulson, don't bother I will do that while reviewing20:18
seb128but did you add a patch changing an another one?20:18
seb128or did you update a patch?20:18
chrisccoulsonseb128 - i just updated an existing patch20:18
seb128ok so don't bother I know how to review those ;-)20:19
seb128chrisccoulson, there is a new gnome-session version available btw if you want to do the update20:21
chrisccoulsonyeah, i could do20:22
chrisccoulsoni also notice theres a new g-c-c available ;)20:22
seb128g-c-c is going to be challenging whoever takes it should be ready20:23
seb128they switched things to gtkbuilder and we have glade patches that will be fun20:23
didrockshow to have some funny time  \o/20:24
didrocksseb128: the easier way for regenerating a .symbols file, is to empty the existing one, and then run dpkg-gensymbols? or is there something else I'm missing?20:25
seb128didrocks, updating you mean?20:25
didrocksseb128: yes20:26
seb128didrocks, well usually build breaks and give you the diff to apply20:26
seb128at least for the packages which use .symbols I've worked on20:27
didrocksok, so copy the diff and apply the patch.20:27
Laneythere is a good guide somewhere on the wiki20:27
Laneygoogle for dpkg-gensymbols or so20:27
didrocksLaney: thanks. let's try this20:27
seb128didrocks, that's what I do20:28
didrocksok, thanks :)20:28
chrisccoulsonseb128 - i've pushed the gnome-session fixes. i'm not sure if you want to sponsor them as they are, and i'll prepare the new upstream version later this evening after i've had some dinner20:29
chrisccoulsonor whether you want to wait for me to do the new version update20:29
seb128chrisccoulson, I will sponsor the fix first and then you can do the update easier this way20:30
chrisccoulsonseb128 - thanks:)20:30
seb128thank you!20:30
chrisccoulsonif you test gnome-session, you will notice that the shutdown and restart options in the session dialog will be inactive. that will go away when pitti uploads his consolekit fix20:31
didrocksseb128: do we have to keep the #MISSING in the .symbol file so that dh_shlibsdeps knows when a public symbol was removed?20:38
seb128didrocks, no idea, I've no clue about .symbols20:38
didrocksseb128: ok, let's google if dh_shlibsdeps is smarter enough and detect this case20:38
superm1geser, gave it a shot, but still fails20:48
seb128chrisccoulson, could you change the .install in the next upload to not move the desktop to usr?20:48
gesersuperm1: :(20:49
superm1will mark it as won't fix then.  no use investing too much time into this with other breakage going on right now outside of bluez20:50
gesersuperm1: will look myself later at it20:51
superm1well i only changed the prerm20:51
superm1that poster seems to  think if i change both it will be fine20:51
superm1ill do that just for santities sake20:51
seb128didrocks, you use "2.27.2" as package version?20:56
seb128didrocks, don't bother changing I will fix that while I change the upload target to karmic too20:56
didrocksseb128: oupsss, sorry, too tired apparently :)20:58
seb128didrocks, no worry ;-)20:58
chrisccoulsongi seb128 - does the current version move desktop files to /usr?20:58
Laneytomboy got done already20:58
seb128chrisccoulson, yes, debian doing20:58
seb128chrisccoulson, but conffiles are not moved on upgrades so we got duplicates desktop files shipped20:59
chrisccoulsonit's not installing any at all20:59
chrisccoulsoni made the debian/rules change to not move the desktop files20:59
seb128Laney, yes, robert_ancell did that, better to open a bug to claim work nowadays20:59
chrisccoulsonbut i must have forgotten to change the install file when i did the merge too20:59
Laneyseb128: ok since you asked me to do it I thought it wasnt necessary20:59
chrisccoulsonso i doubt it's installing any desktop files at all21:00
seb128chrisccoulson, debian/tmp/etc/xdg/autostart usr/share/gnome21:00
seb128in gnome-session.install21:00
chrisccoulsonoh, ok. that must have changed in debian then. they moved them in debian/rules before21:00
seb128Laney, sorry about that, it come as a surprise that robert_ancell did it but he picks things on versions.html so better to open bugs nowadays21:00
Laneyits no worry21:00
seb128Laney, doing the jaunty sru would still be appreciated21:01
Laneyyeah I got that version into sid yesterday21:01
Laneywill do21:01
Laneydid you get sru ack?21:01
seb128hey jbailey21:02
jbaileyseb128, Got time for a silly Gnome coding question?  I'm trying to figure out how to make Chrome an option on the Preferred Browser option.  I figured out how to make it show up on right-click, but can't for the life of me find docs for preferred apps.21:02
seb128Laney, no but it's getting political with upstream and I told jcastro we will do it21:02
Laneyi'll do it tonight21:03
seb128jbailey, gconf /desktop/gnome/applications/browser21:03
jbaileyAh, okay.  I was looking through fd.o stuff, since I noticed that Konq adds itself there.21:04
jbaileyThanks. =)21:04
seb128you're welcome21:04
seb128james_w, did you get any bug about bzr-buildpackage failing to untar the orig tarball?21:06
james_wseb128: fixed in karmic today21:06
seb128james_w, I've 2.2~ubuntu121:07
seb128I don't see a newer version uploaded21:07
james_wfile a bug with the log then please21:08
seb128it doesn't do it on any source but I get the issue on gnome-desktop21:08
seb128"gzip: stdout: Broken pipe"21:08
seb128james_w, ok, will do21:09
james_wsounds like that bug21:09
james_wperhaps there's a case I missed21:09
seb128jbailey, sorry I misread your question before, I though you wanted to change the default browser21:12
jbaileyseb128, Ah, right.21:14
jbaileyNo, I mean from a package's point of view of how to make itself an option.21:14
seb128jbailey, add a .xml in /usr/share/gnome-control-center/default-apps21:14
seb128jbailey, see bug #357675 there is an example21:14
ubottuLaunchpad bug 357675 in gnome-control-center "other packages are unable to populate gnome-default-applications" [Wishlist,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/35767521:14
seb128jbailey, the pastebin url has a browser example21:15
jbaileyD'oh!  It looks liek someone beat me to this in the latest devchannel release.21:15
jbaileyThe new update at the end of last week seems to have added itself there.21:15
jbaileyThanks. =)21:16
seb128james_w, bug #https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bzr-builddeb/+bug/39993821:18
ubottuUbuntu bug 399938 in bzr-builddeb "unpacking the upstream tarball not working" [Undecided,New]21:18
seb128let me know if you need extra details21:19
Laneyreally close to 400000 now21:20
seb128indeed we will probably get there over night21:21
LaneyI wish we could sync to -proposed21:32
seb128you don't want extra package changes for a sru21:34
seb128in not sync on debian just do the update21:34
LaneyI know :)21:35
Laneyjust that it would be easier21:35
chrisccoulsonLaney - i'm sure we'll hit 400000 in an hour or so with our enthusiastic users ;)21:40
LaneyI told ubuntu-uk and a couple of people said it was so bug-free that they had nothing to report...21:40
chrisccoulsonreally? i'm surprised!21:41
james_wseb128: wfm21:42
james_wseb128: what does "bzr plugins -v" say?21:42
seb128_james_w, hum, ok21:42
seb128_james_w, http://paste.ubuntu.com/219273/21:42
=== ajmitch_ is now known as ajmitch
james_wseb128: weird21:43
didrocksI had this error once with a package (maybe gnome-python too)21:43
james_wah "dpkg-source"21:43
james_wnot "tar"21:43
james_wsorry :-)21:43
seb128_james_w, the steps are not clear enough?21:44
james_wthey were21:44
james_wI just killed it too early I think21:44
james_wI saw it download the tarball and extract it21:44
seb128_james_w, btw is there a way to tell to bzr-buildpackage to not clear the build dir after signing?21:44
james_w  --dont-purge          Don't purge the build directory after building.21:45
seb128_james_w, I'm used to run dh_install --missing and some other things there21:45
seb128_james_w, right but can I set that as default somewhere?21:45
seb128_sorry the question was not clear21:45
seb128_I'm lazy to type the option every time ;-)21:45
seb128_ok, I will do an alias then I guess21:46
james_wyou could "bzr alias bd 'bd --dont-purge'"21:46
james_wand then use "bzr bd" instead of bzr-buildpackage21:46
james_wor a shell alias21:46
james_wor send a patch to add the config option21:46
seb128_lot of options ;-)21:46
james_wshould be easy21:46
seb128_I will figure something thanks21:46
seb128_I just didn't want to duplicate something existent21:47
james_wseb128: do you know why I don't get a gpg agent on karmic?21:49
james_wand perhaps relatedly why the ssh-agent doesn't always come up?21:49
seb128_james_w, is seahorse-plugins installed?21:49
james_wah, no21:49
james_wmust have been removed on upgrade21:49
seb128_that would be why21:49
seb128_there is a bug opened about that21:50
seb128_the current way it works it take start time21:50
seb128_and most users don't need a gpg agent21:50
seb128_there has been discussing on whether it should still be installed by default or not21:50
james_wseb128: upload on the way to fix you problem, thanks for the report21:51
seb128_james_w, you rock as usual thanks for the quick fixing ;-)21:52
james_wshould have noticed that problem when I fixed the same thing elsewhere21:52
=== seb128_ is now known as seb128
seb128asac, is pagedown not working in firefox on launchpad sometime a known issue?21:58
=== tkamppeter_ is now known as tkamppeter
asacseb128: yeah. that came back up today ... http://identi.ca/notice/650509222:11
asacis that caret mode thing what you experience?22:11
asace.g. suddenly having a caret like in the editor moving around?22:12
seb128asac, yes, I had the same issue in epiphany that's one of the things which made me try firefox in fact since I though that was a GNOME bug ;-)22:13
seb128asac, though epiphany doesn't annoy me with a dialog when I do f7 twice quickly to workaround the bug22:14
seb128(though I think it's a good idea that firefox display a warning that confuses quite some users)22:14
seb128anyway thanks for the bug reference22:14
seb128I'm getting used to firefox though the quick bookmark thing is less efficient22:15
seb128you have to type things and remember keywords22:15
didrocksok, time to get some reste. Just noticed that upstream forgot to generate the configure from last configure.ac (was wondering why the old librairie named version was still built)… That will be for tomorrow evening :-)22:16
asacseb128: its an odd bug. i am not sure, but it was never raised since the last comment was made22:16
seb128didrocks, 'night22:16
asactoday it sprang up again22:16
chrisccoulsongood night didrocks22:16
seb128asac, I started getting the issue one week ago or so22:16
asacwas about to get that upstream soon22:16
didrocksseb128, chrisccoulson: thanks, good night to both of you too :)22:16
asacseb128: yeah. but its not like ffox/xul changed then22:17
seb128asac, I think there is still a xulrunner bug there, the carret should not turn on whatever the page is doing22:17
asacso its either launchpad retriggering this somehow22:17
asacor its somewhere else22:17
asaci agree ;)22:17
seb128launchpad is a good testcase right now ;-)22:17
seb128chrisccoulson, btw open a bug if you intend to work on the gnome-session updates22:24
chrisccoulsonseb128 - yeah, i'll do that22:24
chrisccoulsonin case someone else takes it ;)22:24
seb128chrisccoulson, robert_ancell basically start when everybody else go to bed and he uses the versions page to see what is to update22:24
chrisccoulsoni need to set up port forwarding on my router tonight so i can ssh in to my desktop and work on updates from work ;)22:25
Laneytomboy is good22:25
seb128Laney, the jaunty update you mean?22:25
Laneyjust updated changelog22:25
Laneyno other changes22:26
seb128Laney, good, I will review and upload that tomorrow morning22:26
seb128no bug to close?22:26
Laneyyeah looking at those now22:26
Laneyis bug 201231 right?22:31
ubottuLaunchpad bug 201231 in tomboy "Tomboy should not be present in Applications(accessories) menu since it is supposed to be added to the panel like an applet" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/20123122:31
chrisccoulsonLaney - you can run it in the notification area though22:32
chrisccoulsonit doesn't have to be used as an applet does it?22:32
seb128no, you have way22:32
seb128ie the menu entry is useful, I would let upstream decide about that or just close the bug if it's not open there22:33
chrisccoulsonseb128 - do you know anyone i can speak to upstream about a patch in gnome-settings-daemon?22:35
chrisccoulsoni attached one to the bugzilla some time ago but noone has given any feedback yet22:36
walterschrisccoulson: what bug?22:47
chrisccoulsonhey walters. i'll just find it22:47
seb128chrisccoulson, try asking rodrigo_ maybe when he's around22:47
chrisccoulsonwalters - gnome bug #57398022:47
ubottuGnome bug 573980 in plugins "Low Disk Space warning doesn't suggest emptying the Trash if that will help" [Enhancement,New] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=57398022:48
walterschrisccoulson: i know gnome as a whole isn't always as responsive to patches as it should be, but if you make a bit of noise and/or poke people directly it helps22:48
chrisccoulsonit's quite a big patch, and i wouldn't mind some feedback on it soon :)22:48
chrisccoulsonthanks walters + seb12822:48
chrisccoulsonseb128 - the gnome-session update probably won't be finished tonight. we carry a patch that makes some changes to the capplet, which has been completely re-written in the new version, so it will reauire some porting22:52
seb128chrisccoulson, right the change is coming from debian22:54
chrisccoulsonyeah, thats the one. it adds the button to save the session back to the capplet22:55
seb128we should try to get that upstream this cycle22:56
seb128chrisccoulson, btw did you send your previous fix to bugzilla, the patch we used for the polkit1 use comes from there I think22:57
chrisccoulsoni think the patch came from upstream. i'm sure someone (perhaps vuntz?) said that when i talked about the patch in here before22:57
chrisccoulsonseb128 - yeah, i sent that one to the bugzilla22:57
seb128chrisccoulson, http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=57554422:57
chrisccoulsonno feedback yet though22:57
ubottuGnome bug 575544 in gnome-session-properties "gnome-session-properties needs button to save session" [Normal,Unconfirmed]22:57
chrisccoulsonseb128 - yeah, that looks like the one22:58
chrisccoulsonwe have quite a bit of stuff using the gnome-session dbus interface now btw;)22:58
chrisccoulsonthe installer uses it and i think update-notifier does now as well22:58
walterschrisccoulson: i took a quick look and commented, but i'm not a g-s-d maintainer22:59
seb128chrisccoulson, http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=585614 seems to not have the bug you fixed, maybe pitti got an outdated version or something22:59
ubottuGnome bug 585614 in gnome-session "port to PolicyKit 1.0" [Normal,Unconfirmed]22:59
chrisccoulsonseb128 - perhaps. the one pitti got was from the redhat bugzilla. i was going to leave a comment there ;)23:00
chrisccoulsonwalters - thanks for the comment. i'll check the patch again and see if i'm leaking that data23:01
seb128chrisccoulson, he left23:01
Laneywhat's the proper version for a new upstream in SRU23:07
seb128_Laney, you can use 0ubuntu1 karmic has a newer version23:14
Laneyok just didn't want AA to reject23:14
seb128_you just need something which will not conflict with next uploads in unstable23:15
seb128_unstable = unstable version = karmic now23:15
Laneybug 34516623:15
ubottuLaunchpad bug 345166 in tomboy "Tomboy tries to load fuse module in Jaunty...and can't" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/34516623:15
Laneydiff is exceptionally trivial23:16
seb128_Laney, can you open a new bug for the update and add the diff.gz and the debdiff there?23:18
seb128_that will make review easier for the sru team I think23:18
Laneyi can do23:18
Laneybug 39998223:20
ubottuLaunchpad bug 399982 in tomboy "SRU to 0.14.3 in Jaunty" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/39998223:20
Laneyjaunty task needs approving23:21
seb128_Laney, thanks, time to go to bed now but I will talk to pitti about that and sponsor the upload tomorrow morning23:22
seb128_'night everybody23:22
Laneyok, sleep well23:22
rickspencer3hi robert_ancell23:59

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