[00:13] <greg-g> Hello everyone, sorry for the delay in getting started with this meeting.
[00:13] <greg-g> Welcome to the Membership Review Board for the America's meeting.
[00:14] <greg-g> First of all, the board members who are present will just say hello so you know who is who.
[00:14] <greg-g> hi :)
[00:14] <boredandblogging> hola
[00:14] <pleia2> hi everyone
[00:14] <greg-g> cool, so right now we have 3 board members, which is a quorum, so lets get started
[00:14] <greg-g> is wolter here?
[00:15] <greg-g> that is an old one, probably not
[00:15] <greg-g> is Duncan here?
[00:15] <pleia2> looks like JonReagan, brywilharris and oubiwann aren't here
[00:15] <greg-g> ok
[00:16] <greg-g> sconklin: would you like to introduce yourself briefly?
[00:16] <sconklin> Sure. I'm a kernel engineer working for Canonical. I've worked in open source since 2000, and was with Red Hat for 8 years before Canonical
[00:16]  * greg-g waits a moment more
[00:16] <greg-g> ah, hi
[00:17] <sconklin> I'm currently working on new hardware enablement
[00:17] <greg-g> Awesome.
[00:17]  * ScottK writes that down ....
[00:17] <sconklin> brief enough?
[00:18] <boredandblogging> sconklin: is pgraner dragging you to Atlanta Linux Fest?
[00:18] <sconklin> boredandblogging: yes, I'll be there, and the family too. It's pretty close to me (I'm in North AL)
[00:18] <pleia2> great :)
[00:19] <boredandblogging> sconklin: excellent, see you there
[00:19] <sconklin> cool
[00:19] <greg-g> you have very extensive experience, sconklin, which is why the questions are slow, I think :)
[00:20] <sconklin> Other than kernel work, I'm active in amateur radio, and have contributed to several projects there
[00:20] <pleia2> sconklin: you're working on hardware now, do you see yourself expanding involvement within the Ubuntu community in the future? Other future plans?
[00:20] <greg-g> what are your plans for the next year or so, either specifically to Canonical work, or community-focused?
[00:20] <boredandblogging> sconklin: any LoCo involvement?
[00:20] <greg-g> basically the same question :)
[00:21] <sconklin> I recently helped start the ubuntu-hams team, and am active in general kernel work as well. I'm also a member of Ubuntu-NGO team
[00:21] <greg-g> how is the NGO stuff going? I've haven't kept up with it
[00:21] <sconklin> My participation with the LOCO is limited to the mailing list, but I'd love to help make it a more active group
[00:22] <sconklin> greg-g: just starting, looking for examples for white papers, etc. I'm interested because of my involvement with the American Red Cross for disaster assistance
[00:22] <ScottK> sconklin: For Kubuntu we are trying to develop a netbook oriented flavor in this cycle.  We're collecting hardware compatibility information.  Are you someone we can talk to about getting stuff enabled?
[00:22] <sconklin> ScottK: yes.
[00:22] <greg-g> sconklin: good deal.
[00:23] <boredandblogging> sconklin: might want to talk to antdedyet_, think he was trying to get the LoCo a bit more active
[00:23] <sconklin> boredandblogging: thanks for the tip.
[00:23] <ScottK> sconklin: Excellent.  We've collected https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/Netbook/HardwareTesting so far (just starting).
[00:23] <greg-g> I think we should vote
[00:23] <boredandblogging> +1
[00:23] <pleia2> excellent work sconklin, +1
[00:23] <greg-g> +1 from me too, thanks for the awesome work sconklin
[00:24] <pleia2> congrats! welcome aboard :)
[00:24] <greg-g> that is 3/3, welcome!
[00:24] <sconklin> Thanks! Happy to be here!
[00:24] <greg-g> Doesn't look like tarvid is here?
[00:25] <greg-g> or corinago
[00:25] <pleia2> Wiebelhaus? bratsche?
[00:25] <greg-g> tenach?
[00:25] <pleia2> cr3?
[00:25] <greg-g> this might go quicker than I thought?
[00:26] <pleia2> hehe
[00:26] <boredandblogging> lol
[00:26] <greg-g> s/?/ :)/
[00:26] <greg-g> akgraner: you here?
[00:26] <akgraner> I'm here :-)
[00:26] <czajkowski> whooo!
[00:27] <greg-g> wanna give a brief introduction, please?
[00:27] <akgraner> sure...Started using ubuntu in Feb of this year...
[00:28] <akgraner> been involved in the NC Loco
[00:28] <akgraner> and I love the community aspect of the Ubuntu Project...
[00:28] <pak33m> hoooray for akgraner
[00:29] <akgraner> not to mention it is an OS I can use.  :-) and I Blog about my experiences
[00:29] <greg-g> akgraner: good job on the blogging, by the way
[00:29]  * ScottK gives a big +1 on the blogging.
[00:29] <sconklin> as the newest member :) - I'll vouch for akgraner's community contributions
[00:29] <akgraner> not a technical person but more of an average end user...
[00:29] <greg-g> sconklin: noted :)
[00:30] <akgraner> greg-g, ScottK sconklin pak33m and czajkowski thanks...:-)
[00:30] <greg-g> akgraner: I'm impressed by your list of Testimonials on your wiki page, 8 really good posts
[00:30] <akgraner> Thank you..
[00:30] <pleia2> as pak33m mentions, her BOF sessions on loco teams at SELF were awesome :) gave me some insight that I'd been lacking
[00:31] <itnet7> akgraner: I just added my $0.02 as well, better late than never
[00:31] <czajkowski> itnet7: ^5
[00:31] <akgraner> itnet7, thanks..
[00:31] <akgraner> :-)
[00:31] <greg-g> jcastro did have a good point though, he expressed caution toward being over committed, how do you plan on controlling that aspect?
[00:32] <akgraner> I have already implemented some balance in that I will give say 2 hours a day toward Ubuntu
[00:32] <akgraner> haven't worked out all the details yet...
[00:33] <greg-g> that is a good guide for projects that can easily take more and more time from you if you let them.
[00:33] <akgraner> but it is on my todo list
[00:33] <greg-g> heh
[00:33] <boredandblogging> akgraner: thats smart
[00:33] <pleia2> akgraner: you've done some fantastic work, thought of the future much? continuing doing what you're doing or are there other things you're interested in?
[00:33] <akgraner> since I have so many other things I work on and volunteer for I had to strike a balance
[00:34] <akgraner> future as in the upcoming year?
[00:34] <pleia2> yep
[00:34] <itnet7> You can already see her input in the Atlanta Linux Fest Payoff!
[00:34] <akgraner> I am working on the planning stages for a User Conference for 2010
[00:35] <akgraner> I am helping with ALF...:-)
[00:35] <boredandblogging> yeah, akgraner has been helping me out with the planning of Atlanta Linux Fest, couldn't do it without her
[00:35] <akgraner> I volunteered to help with SELF next year
[00:35] <akgraner> and I really enjoy the LoCo side of things...
[00:36] <akgraner> but I also want to learn more about testing in Ubuntu
[00:36] <pleia2> cool
[00:36] <akgraner> how to test a release...and features and stuff
[00:36] <greg-g> akgraner: testing as in user testing or testing to make sure things work?
[00:36] <akgraner> greg-g, make sure things work
[00:36] <greg-g> gotcha
[00:37] <greg-g> have you done much bug triage? that is a fun way to get involved with that part. You get to discover new cool programs that you wouldn't have otherwise
[00:38] <akgraner> no I haven't looked into that.. I thought my tech skills needed improvement...
[00:38] <BUGabundo> hi guys. I won't be able to be long. just wanted to give my support for akgraner application. thanks :)
[00:38] <akgraner> thanks BUGabundo :-)
[00:38] <greg-g> akgraner: well, you are welcome to try it out, we're pretty friendly in #ubuntu-bugs :)
[00:38] <greg-g> I think we're about ready to vote?
[00:38] <pleia2> yep
[00:38] <akgraner> even when I want to help review ideas in brainstorm ziroday usually reviews things with me..
[00:39] <boredandblogging> yeah
[00:39] <akgraner> greg-g,  thanks!
[00:39] <pleia2> brilliant work in such a short time! It's been fantastic working with you so far, looking forward to much more in the future :) +1
[00:39] <boredandblogging> +1
[00:39] <greg-g> well, with an eye towards a great User Conference in 2010, I'm giving a +1
[00:39] <greg-g> welcome aboard, akgraner
[00:39] <pleia2> congrats, akgraner! welcome :)
[00:39] <boredandblogging> agree with greg-g, a user conf would rock
[00:39] <akgraner> Thanks!  woo hoo!  :-)
[00:40] <czajkowski> akgraner: nice one :) kudos
[00:40] <itnet7> congrats akgraner !
[00:40] <lajjr> congratz akgraner
[00:40] <czajkowski> akgraner: well past my bedtime ,glad I stayed up,
[00:40] <akgraner> I'll get posting to the list...and keep everyone informed...
[00:40] <czajkowski> nn folks
[00:40] <itnet7> bye czajkowski
[00:40] <pak33m> congrats akgraner
[00:40] <itnet7> :-)
[00:40] <greg-g> Q-FUNK: you're up. brief introduction, please :)
[00:40] <akgraner> Thanks everyone
[00:41] <BUGabundo> congrats akgraner
[00:41] <Q-FUNK> hiya! I've been heavily involved in debian since 1999, first as a user, then as a package maintianer. at ubuntu, my involvement has mostly been in LTSP and in business issues.
[00:42] <Q-FUNK> oh and I attended UDS intrepid in Prague
[00:42] <BUGabundo> humm Q-FUNK too? just want to say, he does a great job on #ubuntu+1. and with that, I go to bed! see you all tomorrow :)
[00:42] <Q-FUNK> BUGabundo: thanks! :)
[00:43] <greg-g> quite an extensive resume, Q-FUNK
[00:43]  * beuno waves
[00:43] <Q-FUNK> I've been involved on and off at the local ubuntu support partner (Linux-Tuki) as well.
[00:43] <lajjr> Evenin BUGabundo
[00:44] <pleia2> Q-FUNK: can you briefly explain how the debian-ubuntu work you do works?
[00:44] <pleia2> with regard to packages upstream in debian and their ubuntu counterparts
[00:44] <pleia2> what is your job?
[00:45] <Q-FUNK> pleia2: sure. from day one, I've had the approach that whatever can be merged upstream should be. from ubuntu or any other distro. I'm a fairly liberal patch merger.
[00:45] <pleia2> so if something is patched within ubuntu, you make sure it gets back to debian?
[00:45] <Q-FUNK> and it's not really a job as much as a will to avoid forks and duplicated work among debian derivatives :)
[00:45] <pleia2> cool
[00:47] <greg-g> Q-FUNK: a very great goal, I appreciate that work very much
[00:47] <pleia2> I see you have several PPAs as well, have you thought about applying to Ubuntu via MOTU (the packaging team) directly?
[00:48] <Q-FUNK> greg-g: thanks.  I still remember debconf5, which was ubuntu's first visit to the debian universe.  I was the MC at debianDay and the one who had the idea of organizing an impromptu meeting between derivatives.
[00:48] <itnet7> Nice Q-FUNK !
[00:48] <Q-FUNK> and I must say that things have come a LONG way since the edgy reception that the ubuntu crew got back in 2005.
[00:49] <pleia2> glad to hear it :)
[00:49] <greg-g> yes, yes they have
[00:49] <boredandblogging> Q-FUNK: do you think good progress is being made with LTSP into schools and businesses?
[00:50] <Q-FUNK> pleia2: I have skipped the idea of joining MOTU entirely since I have extensive packaging experience from debian and also because most of my debian packages end up in main at ubuntu.
[00:50] <pleia2> Q-FUNK: *nod* I've tended to take a similar approach, my packages are the same
[00:50] <Q-FUNK> ...where MOTU upload rights would be of no use.
[00:51] <greg-g> Well,I think we're ready for a vote now.
[00:51] <Q-FUNK> boredandblogging: definitely.   I've witnessed this first-hand at my previous job, as I was the business development manager for a company that makes, among other things, thin client hardware.
[00:52] <pleia2> great work over the years, Q-FUNK :) +1
[00:52] <greg-g> +1 from me, great contributions, Q-FUNK
[00:52] <boredandblogging> yup, yup, +1
[00:52] <boredandblogging> keep up the good work Q-FUNK
[00:52] <greg-g> welcome, Q-FUNK ! :)
[00:52] <Q-FUNK> \o/ thanks everyone! :)
[00:52] <lajjr> congratz Q-FUNK
[00:52] <pleia2> congrats, welcome Q-FUNK!
[00:53] <itnet7> congrats Q-FUNK !!
[00:53] <sconklin> congrats!
[00:53] <akgraner> congrats sconklin and Q-FUNK !  \O/  woo hoo!!
[00:53] <sconklin> and akgraner too!
[00:53] <pleia2> pak33m: ok, you're up!
[00:53] <ajmitch> Q-FUNK: might be worth looking at per-package upload rights in the future, even if you don't want universe upload rights
[00:54] <pak33m> ok i am ready
[00:54] <pleia2> just give us a brief intro
[00:54] <Q-FUNK> ajmitch: we briefly brushed this, back when stgraber got his restricted upload rights to main, actually :)
[00:54] <pak33m> bit nervous still
[00:54] <pak33m> my name is jimmy harris
[00:55] <pak33m> been a member of the florida team since march 2007
[00:55] <boredandblogging> jimmah!
[00:55] <boredandblogging> oh sorry :-!
[00:55] <pleia2> hehe
[00:55] <itnet7> JIMMY!!!
[00:55] <pak33m> np
[00:55] <pak33m> worked on various projects for the us teams since then as well
[00:55] <pak33m> including for both -fl and -us been a meeting mod, minutes recorder and reporter
[00:56] <pleia2> yeah, pak33m is our newest mentor on the USTeams \o/
[00:56] <pak33m> i continue to do the aforemntioned for -fl
[00:56] <pak33m> am currently a us teams mentor for the alaska team
[00:56] <pak33m> pleia2 gave me the biggest state other -fl
[00:57] <boredandblogging> pak33m: weren't you DJing Florida Linux Show with Ubuntu Studio?
[00:57] <pak33m> the majority of my involvment within the ubuntu community has been loco advocacy
[00:57] <greg-g> pak33m: loco advocacy is great stuff, that is how I got started
[00:57] <pak33m> boredandblogging: yes i do use ubutu studio and mixxx to dj
[00:57] <pak33m> greg-g: i got my real boost at ubuntu live
[00:57] <pleia2> pak33m was also at the SELF sessions with akgraner and I, great conversation there, inspired the US-PA team to start talking about having more tech events (we don't do enough bugjams and things)
[00:58] <greg-g> good deal
[00:58] <pak33m> yes, i cant say enough how inspriring it was to meet with other loco team members there
[00:59] <itnet7> Jimmy has helped me out tremendously. I don't even have to ask if the team reports were done. He has many good talents and loves to plan and follow through! He and another member chaynie have recently organized a re-occurring bugjam in orlando. Our first one was last weekend, but we plan to do it monthly
[00:59] <greg-g> pak33m: so, the standard question: what are your plans for the near future?
[00:59] <pak33m> my focus is on loco advocacy within the -fl team and for us teams and ubuntu in general
[00:59] <itnet7> oh sorry :-) I meant pak33m
[00:59] <pak33m> itnet7:  no worries
[01:00] <pak33m> my plans fo rthe furture are to continue working with my awesome and growing -fl team, work more with us teams projectsand more loco team mentoring
[01:00] <greg-g> pak33m: so you're doing bug jams, do you also do packaging jams or anything else like that?
[01:01] <pak33m> i have a passion for getting things going in loco teams
[01:01] <akgraner> pak33m, mentoring skills are great.. a real source of encouragement...
[01:02] <pak33m> greg-g: yes, i am helping to orgranize pack and buig jams for the -fl team
[01:02] <greg-g> good deal.
[01:02] <pak33m> as reocurring events
[01:02] <greg-g> I like the recurring part :)
[01:03] <pak33m> greg-g: inspired by the -mi team
[01:03] <greg-g> pak33m: of course, you're welcome :)
[01:03] <pak33m> we just had a bug jam this past sunday which was a blast
[01:03] <greg-g> awesome, they really can be
[01:03] <pak33m> theu -fl team is coming together better as  a result
[01:04] <pak33m> and i am proude to help oragnaize that for the -fl team
[01:04] <greg-g> That is very encouraging, I like to hear it.
[01:04] <greg-g> Well, I think we're ready to vote.
[01:04] <pak33m> i put a great deal of effort and time into my inv into the ubuntu community
[01:04] <pleia2> awesome work pak33m :) +1
[01:04] <boredandblogging> pak33m: you need to put some of your music online
[01:05] <greg-g> for using the great bug/packaging jam idea and other good advocacy work, +1 from me
[01:05] <boredandblogging> pak33m: you know, get a blog like the rest of us schmucks
[01:05] <boredandblogging> +1
[01:05] <pak33m> boredandblogging: musics coming
[01:05] <pleia2> woohoo, congrats pak33m!
[01:05] <pak33m> oh and ive been denting lately
[01:05] <greg-g> pak33m: congrats!
[01:05] <itnet7> +1 pak33m !!! Good Job you deserve it!
[01:05] <akgraner> pak33m, congrats!
[01:05] <pak33m> awesome thank you pleia2 greg-g boredandblogging
[01:05] <pak33m> and everybody else
[01:05] <pak33m> i wont let you all down
[01:06] <pleia2> :)
[01:06] <greg-g> pak33m: you've been doing great work, I don't foresee that happening
[01:06] <greg-g> congrats to all the new members!
[01:06] <pak33m> hehe that was my pledge
[01:07] <pak33m> congrats to all the new members
[01:07] <pleia2> thanks for a great meeting everyone :) congrats
[01:07] <sconklin> thank you again
[01:07] <greg-g> I think that is it for tonight. Have a great evening everyone and see you next meeting.
[01:07] <boredandblogging> congrats all!
[01:07] <akgraner> Thanks you all!!
[01:08] <pak33m> akgraner: you were great
[01:08] <akgraner> pak33m, as were you! Thanks!
[01:13] <Q-FUNK> thanks everyone!
[09:02] <modder25> [03:35] <tweaker25> http://translate.google.com/translate?prev=hp&hl=fr&js=y&u=http%3A%2F%2Fforum.ubuntu-fr.org%2Fviewtopic.php%3Fpid%3D2808462%23p2808462&sl=auto&tl=en&history_state0=
[09:02] <modder25> [03:35] <tweaker25> http://forum.ubuntu-fr.org/viewtopic.php?pid=2808462#p2808462
[10:36] <ludovicc> hello, anything going on today?
[10:48] <ttx> ludovicc: i missed the starting time
[11:04] <ludovicc> it's confusing: the wiki page says 9:00 UTC, the calendar says 14:00
[15:17] <yinoneh> hi
[15:18] <ubuntuella> Hi yinoneh.
[16:00] <dpm> ok, Ubuntu translations meeting
[16:00] <pedro_> hello everybody
[16:00] <dpm> so who's there?
[16:00] <evanrmurphy> here
[16:01] <danilos> me, though I might be only partially around
[16:01] <henninge> me, same as danilos
[16:02] <dpm> anyone else would like to raise his/her hand? Otherwise, we'll get started
[16:02] <czajkowski> aloha
[16:02] <yinoneh> me too, but have to leave... :(
[16:03] <dpm> hi everyone, let's start with some of the topics from the last meeting
[16:04] <dpm> [TOPIC] Communication within the localization teams
[16:04] <dpm> evanrmurphy: I think that was your topic, would you like to start?
[16:04] <evanrmurphy> dpm: Sure thing.
[16:05] <dpm> #startmeeting
[16:05] <MootBot> Meeting started at 10:05. The chair is dpm.
[16:05] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[16:05] <dpm> [TOPIC] Communication within the localization teams
[16:05] <evanrmurphy> I was curious to here about how communication is handled with the other localization teams.
[16:05] <MootBot> New Topic:  Communication within the localization teams
[16:05] <evanrmurphy> With the Ubuntu Spanish Translators, we've got a tried and true mailing list which is the fount for basically all our communication.
[16:06] <evanrmurphy> It's nice because it's simple and centralized, but I became aware of some weaknesses to our relying on it entirely.
[16:07] <evanrmurphy> The largest point of concern is that new people interested in our team I think are often looking for a lot of feedback.
[16:08] <evanrmurphy> But it's happened that people have written to the ML and been underwhelmed by responses.
[16:09] <evanrmurphy> (People on our team naturally get busy and don't respond to every post they see on the mailing list, plus the nature of a mailing list makes responses less obligatory, IMO.)
[16:09] <evanrmurphy> so I recently started (actually revived) an IRC channel for our team at #ubuntu-l10n-es
[16:10] <evanrmurphy> A few of us have been hanging out there fairly consistently, and I've been pleased because it's allowed me to get to know better some of my teammates, who I was otherwise working side-by-side with but seldom conversing with.
[16:11] <evanrmurphy> We've already had a few new people come to the channel, and I think the live interaction has been beneficial for them, and encouraged them to continue pursuing translations with us even though it can be difficult.
[16:11] <dpm> evanrmurphy: I'm pleased to hear that. We've got the same approach and issues in our Catalan team with the mailing list. We haven't got a dedicated channel for translations, but we've just been talking about using the one from our loco for meetings and so on.
[16:12] <evanrmurphy> So that's all I had to say, really. Just an anecdote about this recent development in our team I wanted to share with you, perhaps have your feedback, and hear how these kinds of things are on your teams. Thanks.
[16:13] <dpm> I do agree that IRC is also good for translations. Sometimes it helps even for experienced translators to have real-time communications for quick reviews. Do other translation teams use e.g. forums?
[16:14] <adiroiban> IRC is ok if you have a very active team
[16:14] <adiroiban> otherwise a forum or a ML is recommended as most probably you will not have all translators online in the same time
[16:15] <adiroiban> and reading  IRC logs is not a pleasant task
[16:15] <evanrmurphy> adiroiban: Yes, I agree. IRC has its weaknesses as well.
[16:15] <adiroiban> we are using #ubuntu-ro as an all jack channel
[16:16] <adiroiban> chat, support, l10n, planning, meetings
[16:16] <adiroiban> but we don't have to many l10n discussions
[16:16] <evanrmurphy> adiroiban: That sounds very sensible for the Romanian team.
[16:17] <evanrmurphy> With Spanish, there are tens and tens of LoCo teams, but only one translations team. So it's a bit unfortunate that with all the translators spread across so many countries, we're unable to unite in one LoCo.
[16:17] <evanrmurphy> But we're lucky to have so many contributors all across the world.
[16:18] <evanrmurphy> I suppose different teams will need different solutions and tools.
[16:19] <dpm> Yes, I think that's a good summary, I'd also propose you to just ask in the ubuntu-translators mailing list, see what other teams not here today do
[16:20] <evanrmurphy> dpm: Sounds good. :)
[16:20] <dpm> ok, anything else, shall we go for the next topic?
[16:21] <dpm> [TOPIC] Reverting old translations to packaged ones
[16:21] <MootBot> New Topic:  Reverting old translations to packaged ones
[16:21] <dpm> danilos: that was your topic, if you've got time, go ahead, if not, I can take it
[16:22] <danilos> well, it's simple
[16:22] <danilos> I am considering reverting all changed translations before 2008-01-01, when we didn't have enough tools to track those changes, or when Launchpad didn't behave as well as today
[16:23] <danilos> so, this would be for all languages in Ubuntu, and it'd be interesting to know if people are interested in us doing it
[16:23] <danilos> if not, there's always an option for any particular team to ask for a single language to be reverted
[16:23] <adiroiban> what do you mean by reverting?
[16:23] <danilos> adiroiban: well, reverting to packaged translations, when they are different from ones provided in LP
[16:23] <adiroiban> moving current translations as suggestions?
[16:24] <danilos> basically, use "Packaged" suggestions for all translations changed in LP before 2008-01-01
[16:24] <adiroiban> or just deleting them?
[16:24] <evanrmurphy> Using Packaged instead of Current?
[16:24] <danilos> adiroiban: we wouldn't be deleting them, we would leave them as suggestions
[16:24] <danilos> in general, we very rarely delete anything
[16:25] <danilos> only in the case of obvious mistake (like someone uploading a wrong language PO file to another language)
[16:25] <evanrmurphy> Could you explain a bit more about the rationale, danilos?
[16:25] <adiroiban> Hm... I don't know what to say. I don't feel the need for this in RO translations.
[16:25] <adiroiban> maybe just leave each team to request it.
[16:26] <danilos> evanrmurphy: just a little bit more: in early days of Launchpad, there was no 'changed in LP' filter, nor were 'Packaged' translations shown so prominently
[16:26] <adiroiban> also, I think that soon UTC will be able to revert a package
[16:26] <dpm> danilos: and with how much granularity could this be done, i.e. could people provide a list of templates who'd like to see reverted, or would this just apply to a whole distro?
[16:26] <danilos> which means that there were a lot of inadvertent changes done in many ubuntu translations, why upstreams hated us
[16:27] <danilos> dpm: no, it's either easy do-it-for-all, or back to using changed-in-lp filter if people want more granularity
[16:27] <danilos> we don't have enough time to handle all this for each team specifically
[16:27] <danilos> adiroiban: why do you think that? if that was the case, I think I'd know about it :)
[16:28] <danilos> adiroiban: (i.e. that UTC will be able to revert a package)
[16:28] <adiroiban> :p
[16:28] <evanrmurphy> ah
[16:28] <danilos> so, my impression from this meeting is: there's no particular interest for this simple solution; conclusion is: we won't do it :)
[16:29] <danilos> we still offer each team an option to request that language to be reverted, but otherwise, it's up to using the web UI :)
[16:29] <dpm> danilos: so just to get it clear, this would be for all languages at once, if it were to be done?
[16:29] <danilos> dpm: that's right
[16:29] <evanrmurphy> danilos: I guess it just comes as a bit of a shock.
[16:29] <evanrmurphy> And I'm not sure I understand all the implications.
[16:30] <danilos> evanrmurphy: depends on who you ask, translators active both upstream and in Ubuntu, and where Ubuntu translation teams were open for a long time, were those who made me think it would be desireable
[16:30] <danilos> in general, it seems we don't have those people here, so it's a moot point
[16:30] <danilos> anyway, there doesn't seem to be enough motivation to carry on with this, so I won't
[16:30] <evanrmurphy> Perhaps we can discuss it further on the ML?
[16:30] <danilos> sorry, I got to go back to the other stuff I got to finish today
[16:30] <danilos> evanrmurphy: by all means, but I will be gone for 2 weeks
[16:31] <danilos> evanrmurphy: I am happy for ubuntu translators to discuss it and let me know if they want it done
[16:31] <dpm> Yes, again, let's take it to the ML, thanks for the explanation, danilo. My take is that it'd be interesting only on a team by team basis
[16:32] <dpm> anything else, shall we move on?
[16:32] <ArneGoetje> danilos: I would prefer not to do it for all languages. It should be left open for each team to decide if they want it for their language or not. (I know that for zh_TW we would not want it.)
[16:33] <dpm> yes, maybe request it through the rosetta Answers in LP
[16:33] <danilos> ArneGoetje: we already said many times that's fine, this time I am proposing doing it with a date limitation
[16:34] <dpm> danilos: would it be fine if we ask it on the ML and provide a list of those teams who'd want to do that?
[16:35] <danilos> dpm: sure
[16:35] <dpm> ok, let's take it from there then
[16:35] <dpm> next topic, adiroiban
[16:35] <dpm> [TOPIC] Communicating with Ubuntu translation teams
[16:35] <MootBot> New Topic:  Communicating with Ubuntu translation teams
[16:36] <adiroiban> ok.
[16:37] <adiroiban> Now that we have shared translations between jaunty and karmic
[16:37] <adiroiban> I think that we should see more progress for Jaunty translations during the Karmic development cicle
[16:37] <evanrmurphy> \o/
[16:37] <adiroiban> and it this case it would make sense to have oftern language packs updated for Jaunty
[16:38] <adiroiban> but since we don't have a communication with  many teams
[16:38] <adiroiban> maybe it will be hard to have the signoff of the language packs
[16:38] <adiroiban> ... this is just one of the reasons why communication is important
[16:38] <adiroiban> so
[16:39] <adiroiban> our goal should to be see ways in which we can reach
[16:39] <adiroiban> ubuntu localization teams
[16:39] <adiroiban> first questions
[16:39] <adiroiban> do you think we should name ubuntu localizatoin team contacts?
[16:40] <adiroiban> or just communicate with teams
[16:40] <dpm> I like the idea of having a team contact, since sometimes it is difficult to contact a team with say 3 administrators
[16:40] <adiroiban> without the need of naming team coordinators
[16:40] <adiroiban> coordinator
[16:41] <adiroiban> why is dificult to contact a team with 3 admins?
[16:41] <dpm> what do you mean by "without naming team coordinators"? I think the team coordinator would be the first candidate for being the contact point
[16:41] <adiroiban> the answer probability should be greater :)
[16:42] <evanrmurphy> Probability is greater with 3 admins, but responsibility is diffused.
[16:42] <adiroiban> team coordinator(s) = team contact(s)
[16:42] <dpm> adiroiban: it is only difficult (although that was probably the wrong word) in the sense that you do not know which one is the coordinator
[16:43] <dpm> evanrmurphy: you put it very nicely :)
[16:43] <adiroiban> as long as we got an answer, why should we care who is the coordinator?
[16:44] <evanrmurphy> I can consult with my team and see if the team leader, Ricardo Pérez, would be willing to be the l10n team contact.
[16:44] <dpm> As the team's representative I'd expect the coordinator to be more responsive, and it's easier to just contact one person
[16:44] <adiroiban> dpm: ok.
[16:45] <adiroiban> then let's start a wiki page similar to LoCo teams
[16:45] <dpm> but I think the next question is how can this be implemented, do we take the model of loco teams adi is suggesting?
[16:45] <dpm> like having l10n-contacts or something?
[16:45] <adiroiban> at least, this could help up in identifing the teams what receive our information
[16:46] <adiroiban> dpm: I will keep it on launchpad-translators
[16:46] <adiroiban> do don't have a huge trafic anyway
[16:47] <dpm> adiroiban: what do you mean by keeping it in launchpad-translators?
[16:47] <dpm> I mean in practical terms
[16:47] <adiroiban> if we are going to have a  l10n-contacts (team or ML), it is better to name it approved-l10n-teams
[16:47] <adiroiban> launchpad-translators mailinglist
[16:48] <adiroiban> basicaly we need a communication channel with l10n team contacts. Right?
[16:48] <adiroiban> Or I'm missing the point
[16:48] <evanrmurphy> adirioban: Yes.
[16:48] <evanrmurphy> That channel could take many different forms, correct?
[16:49] <dpm> yes, I understant you mean the launchpad-translators mailing list, but in which way does this differ from the current ubuntu-translators mailing list?
[16:49] <evanrmurphy> Are you suggesting the l10n team contacts be available on the launchpad-translators ML?
[16:49] <adiroiban> dpm: darn. my bad
[16:49] <adiroiban> ubuntu-translators
[16:49] <evanrmurphy> How about this:
[16:49] <dpm> Right, now I get you :)
[16:49] <adiroiban> ignore what I said about launchpad-translators and replace it with ubuntu
[16:50] <dpm> yes, yes, I get you
[16:50] <evanrmurphy> l10n team contacts (probably the team admin) should be available on the ubuntu-translators ML
[16:50] <evanrmurphy> but their info will also be catalogued on a l10n contact page so that they can be individually contacted if needed.
[16:51] <dpm> yes, that sounds good to me, the only grey area for me atm is the implementation of the l10n contact page
[16:51] <adiroiban> we can start with a wikipage
[16:52] <adiroiban> and then see if we can use the LoCo directory
[16:52] <adiroiban> LoCo directory infrastructure - webapp + LP teams
[16:52] <dpm> right, now it gets clearer. Yes, the loco directory sounds a good resource to explore also for translation teams
[16:53] <adiroiban> ok
[16:53] <evanrmurphy> Not sure I'm not familiar with the LoCo directory. Link please?
[16:53] <adiroiban> evanrmurphy: LoCo directory is WIP
[16:53] <adiroiban> we can start with a wikipage
[16:54] <adiroiban> similar to the current one
[16:54] <dpm> so do we agree on a) name team contacts and b) adding them initially to a wiki page and then see if we can use a more automated resource (LP team or LoCo directory)?
[16:54] <adiroiban> a) let each team name it's contact
[16:55] <adiroiban> b) ask team contact to add their team/info to a wikipage
[16:55]  * evanrmurphy says "Ay".
[16:56] <dpm> although I agree, I'd strongly recommend the contact to be the coordinator
[16:56] <evanrmurphy> Include strong recommendation in a).
[16:57] <dpm> right, let's take this to actions, would anyone like to volunteer to create the l10n-contacts wiki page?
[16:57] <adiroiban> even without our recommendation, I believe will chose their contacts from withing  their coordinators
[16:58] <adiroiban> dpm: I can do that
[16:58] <dpm> adiroiban: thanks
[16:58] <adiroiban> we can talk on the ML about the fields and what info do we require from each team
[16:59] <adiroiban> ex. like if they have bad writing support
[16:59] <adiroiban> and in this case Arne could contact them and look into that matter
[17:00] <adiroiban> ok.
[17:00] <adiroiban> I think we are close to the end of this meeting
[17:00] <ArneGoetje> adiroiban: "bad writing support"?
[17:00] <adiroiban> or we can continue?
[17:00] <adiroiban> no fonts
[17:00] <evanrmurphy> I am available to continue.
[17:00] <evanrmurphy> We still have several topics, if other people can stay.
[17:00] <adiroiban> or keyboard layouts
[17:01] <dpm> is there something else after our meeting?
[17:01] <evanrmurphy> no
[17:01] <ArneGoetje> adiroiban: we do ship fonts and keyboard layouts for every language we have in Launchpad, AFAIK
[17:01] <evanrmurphy> dpm: I don't think there's another meeting.
[17:01] <dpm> I can stay as well, if you like, or other wise we can move it to ubuntu-translators
[17:01] <evanrmurphy> Hope not. :)
[17:01] <adiroiban> dpm: nope. Only at 18 UTC
[17:01] <dpm> right, let's go on then
[17:02] <dpm> I do have to go in 30 mins, though
[17:02] <adiroiban> ok.
[17:02] <dpm> shall we move on to the next one?
[17:03] <evanrmurphy> Wait.
[17:03] <adiroiban> from my point of view. Ubuntu Translations project is doing well... there are a lot of bugs :)
[17:03] <evanrmurphy> So adiroiban volunteered to start the wiki.
[17:03] <dpm> adiroiban: wait a sec, evanrmurphy wants to add something
[17:04] <evanrmurphy> Does someone need to start something on the ML as well?
[17:04] <dpm> evanrmurphy: would you like to start a thread for that?
[17:04] <adiroiban> we can continue the brainstorm on the ML
[17:04] <adiroiban> and see if we get any good ideas :)
[17:04] <evanrmurphy> Sure. I'll do that.
[17:05] <dpm> ok, next one
[17:05] <dpm> [TOPIC] Promoting the Ubuntu Translations project
[17:05] <MootBot> New Topic:  Promoting the Ubuntu Translations project
[17:05] <dpm> This is about how to best let bug reporters and triagers know about the ubuntu-translations project
[17:06] <dpm> I've asked pedro_ to be here to give us some advice on that
[17:06] <dpm> As those on the last meeting know
[17:07] <dpm> the ubuntu-translations project in Launchpad was started to be the central place for bugs (although we've been discussing other things, like support requests as well) in Ubuntu translations
[17:08] <dpm> bug reporters and triagers can either add the ubuntu-translations project to a bug ("also affects project" field) or report the bug against it
[17:08] <dpm> in the latter case, the Ubuntu Translations Coordinators team will figure out which package it affects
[17:09] <dpm> it is a very recent project, and we'd like to promote it in the best way and integrate it in the bug triaging/reporting process (hug days, etc)
[17:10] <dpm> soren, any ideas on how to do that?
[17:10] <dpm> (I don't know why 'so' always gets replaced by 'soren' ;) )
[17:11] <pedro_> in the case of requesting feedback from the ubuntu-translations team
[17:11] <pedro_> do you still want us to open a new tasks for that?
[17:11] <pedro_> or do you guys have a team we could just subscribe to the bugs
[17:12] <pedro_> IMHO that'd work better
[17:12] <dpm> we've got the ubuntu-translations-coordinators team, which is the driver for the project, and we're subscribed to bugs
[17:12] <dpm> they end up in our mailing list
[17:13] <pedro_> alright we need to update some of the docs of the triage process then to reflect that
[17:13] <adiroiban> pedro_: we can also create a ubuntu-translations team
[17:14] <dpm> pedro_:  you say that subscribing the UTCs team would work better than opening a new task for the ubuntu-translations project?
[17:14] <adiroiban> but we went for creating a project to also cover the case where people are not sure if the bug is in launchpad or ubuntu
[17:14] <pedro_> dpm: well i don't know for which kind of reports are you going to use the project
[17:14] <pedro_> most of translations issues are related to packages (empathy, gwibber, etc)
[17:15] <pedro_> and other things can maybe be discussed at mailing lists , etc
[17:15] <adiroiban> yes, but there are also bugs regarding language packs
[17:15] <dpm> anything related to translations _in Ubuntu_, it's to have a central place to have them and to be able to suscribe to
[17:15] <adiroiban> or ubuntu translations process
[17:15] <pedro_> adiroiban: which could be assigned to the right language-pack ? ;-)
[17:15] <adiroiban> pedro_: right... but it is hard for us to subribe to each language pack
[17:16] <ArneGoetje> dpm: we could add an apport-hook, so that 'ubuntu-bug translations' will collect useful system information (locale, release, etc.) and submit the bug report to the Ubuntu Translations project.
[17:16] <dpm> before that, we had a wiki page. It's not as much as language packs but also i18n bugs (for language packs, if it's a wrong translation, I just contact the team coordinator to correct it)
[17:16] <ArneGoetje> pedro_: there are more than 770 language packs...
[17:17] <dpm> ArneGoetje: apport, that's a good point as well
[17:19] <dpm> pedro_: one important point is to get a general overview of the translation bugs (l10n and i18n) and be able to subscribe to them
[17:20] <pedro_> dpm: got it
[17:21] <dpm> pedro_: but as I say, this is a very recent project. It seems to work well, but we've just started, so we are open to any suggestions
[17:21] <pedro_> well let see how that works, i'm just worried about people opening thousand of tasks for bugs
[17:23] <dpm> so you'd suggest for us to test it for a bit before making a big announcement, or just announce it and see how it works out as we go along?
[17:26] <pedro_> let's announce it and see how it works, if it doesn't too nice, later we can try some other option :-)
[17:28] <dpm> soren, quickly to wrap up some actions: I can talk to pedro_ to see how we can include this in the documentation, and we should probably announce it on the ML again and blog about it. Agreed? Any other ideas?
[17:28] <adiroiban> talk about next meeting
[17:28] <adiroiban> we will have kubuntu translations in 29 ?
[17:29] <adiroiban> and the next ubuntu translations in 30 ?
[17:29] <adiroiban> July
[17:29] <dpm> adiroiban: so, step by step, do you first want to defer this topic to the next meeting?
[17:29] <dpm> not defer, I mean put it on the agenda again
[17:30] <adiroiban> yes
[17:30] <adiroiban> I think we can evaluate it again
[17:30] <dpm> sounds good to me, anyone else?
[17:31] <dpm> now for the Kubuntu translations questions: I've only got 2 mins, I've got an appointment
[17:31] <dpm> adiroiban: can you elaborate the Kubuntu question?
[17:31] <adiroiban> I only want to know if we are going to have the kubuntu translations day, or no
[17:32] <dpm> right, yes, I have to announce it properly, but basically I confirmed it on kubuntu-devel and I added it to the fridge calendar
[17:32] <adiroiban> and where is the agenda
[17:33] <evanrmurphy> Good.
[17:33] <adiroiban> or what are the expectations for the Kubuntu translations day
[17:33] <adiroiban> but we can talk later
[17:33] <adiroiban> :)
[17:33] <adiroiban> no hurry
[17:33] <dpm> adiroiban: It's not as much as a meeting but rather a day where to care for Kubuntu translations. I will be announcing it in more detail next week
[17:33] <adiroiban> ok
[17:33] <dpm> and activities which can be done
[17:34] <dpm> ok, then I'd like to thank you all very much for your participation and always good ideas and discussion, and I think we can wrap it up
[17:35] <evanrmurphy> Thanks, dpm.
[17:35] <evanrmurphy> Thanks all.
[17:35] <ArneGoetje> thanks
[17:35] <dpm> I'll be sending the minutes tomorrow
[17:35] <dpm> Thank you all! \o/
[17:35] <adiroiban> great :)
[17:35] <dpm> #endmeeting
[17:35] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 11:35.
[18:28] <grantbo1> jcastro: next time you twit about a meeting on IRC, please include the channel name :-)
[18:28] <grantbo1> this is grantbow, thanks for following me on twitter
[18:29] <jcastro> oh, heh, yeah good idea.
[18:57] <jcastro> 3 minutes until Ubuntu Global Jam meeting!
[18:57] <jono> :)
[18:57] <Daviey> !!
[18:58] <jcastro> and Daviey is here! woo.
[18:58] <Daviey> jcastro: Sarcasim is just rude :)
[18:58] <b1ackcr0w> i assume i'm welcome to lurk and see what's going on?
[18:58] <jcastro> b1ackcr0w: of course!
[18:58] <jcastro> Daviey: I miss you dude, I need more englishmen in my life.
[18:58] <b1ackcr0w> cool thx
[18:59] <jcastro> ok we'll give people like 3 more minutes to join, etc.
[19:01] <jcastro> ok, please holler if you were here the last meeting (about a month ago)
[19:01] <jcastro> if this is your first meeting, then please introduce yourself and which loco you are from
[19:01] <jono> hi folks, sorry I can't help run the meeting
[19:01] <jono> a last minute call I have to get on
[19:01] <jono> I am sure the able hands of jcastro will do a great job :)
[19:02] <b1ackcr0w> alistair - just a relatively new user looking to get involved - maybe in documentation in due course - UK based
[19:03] <Daviey> Hi b1ackcr0w, good to hear
[19:03] <jcastro> ok so to just recap
[19:03] <jcastro> in the past Ubuntu has had a "Ubuntu Global Bug Jam"
[19:03] <jcastro> which was a coordinated effort to get all the local teams to triage bugs during one specific weekend.
[19:04] <jcastro> This went well but we thought we could expand it to include other things, not just bugs
[19:04] <jcastro> so this time we're calling it the "Ubuntu Global Jam"
[19:04] <jcastro> and your loco can pick what they want to do
[19:04] <jcastro> so you could do an installfest, a translations thing, a documentation sprint, whatever
[19:04] <jcastro> We are coordinating this effort here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuGlobalJam
[19:05] <jcastro> if you look here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuGlobalJam/Events
[19:05] <jcastro> you'll see that local teams are already signing up to do certain types of things
[19:05] <jcastro> the Jam isn't actually until October
[19:05] <jcastro> so we started early because people need time to get venues, have time to advertise, etc.
[19:06] <jcastro> so right now we're still in the "get Local Teams to sign up" phase
[19:06] <jcastro> any questions so far?
[19:06] <e-jat> jcastro: how to sign up ? is it just filling up the event on the wiki ?
[19:06] <jcastro> yep
[19:06] <e-jat> of sorry .. btw .. im from ubuntu-my loco
[19:06] <jcastro> rock and roll!
[19:07] <jcastro> however, depending on how your loco works you might want to ask around first
[19:07] <jcastro> it might be bad if you post on your list "hey guys I just committed us to a 12 hour installfest! come help me!"
[19:07] <jcastro> Some locos might work like that though, heh.
[19:08] <e-jat> what is "others" mean
[19:08] <jcastro> the other people in your loco
[19:08] <e-jat> jcastro: owh really ..
[19:08]  * ball wishes there were other people in his loco team
[19:08] <ball> ...or even his lug
[19:08] <e-jat> jcastro: yeah .. for sure ill ask the team members 1st
[19:08]  * ball shrugs
[19:09] <jcastro> e-jat: so what we usually do is someone asks "so hey, what do we want to do for this global jam?"
[19:09] <jcastro> you might want to do a bunch of things, depends on the interests of your members
[19:09] <jcastro> our lug for example will probably do bugs, but not an installfest.
[19:10] <jcastro> another reason we try to fill out the events page is so that locos can know what other locos are doing
[19:10] <jcastro> so you can share information and materials
[19:10] <e-jat> jcastro: maybe we can separate into groups ..
[19:10] <jcastro> but also as an opportunity for people to browse the list and find a loco that they can join
[19:10] <jcastro> e-jat: yep, whatever way works best for your team
[19:10] <e-jat> who n which their interested to ..
[19:10] <e-jat> yeah .. the wiki might help ..
[19:10] <jcastro> Ok so we make some resources available to you to help you run a good jam
[19:11] <jcastro> on the wiki page you see that Jono and  I run IRC and video sessions on how to run a jam
[19:11] <e-jat> resources ? a mentor ?
[19:11] <e-jat> ic ..
[19:11] <jcastro> that's where we cover things like how to find a venue, how to advertise, things like that
[19:11] <jcastro> so someone from your team should try to attend one of those sessions, they are very useful
[19:11] <jcastro> or click on the IRC logs link to follow along
[19:12] <jcastro> if you're an experienced Loco and want to have other sessions or lessons, that would be great too!
[19:12]  * jcastro looks over to Daviey 
[19:12] <jcastro> :p
[19:12] <e-jat> how about triage a bug ?
[19:12] <jcastro> e-jat: sure
[19:12] <Daviey> o/
[19:12] <jcastro> so some resources available to you
[19:12] <jcastro> if you look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Jams
[19:13] <jcastro> we've recently revamped this documentation to be easy to read and apply to your team
[19:13] <sbalneav> Afternoon all
[19:13] <e-jat> jcastro: great .. it will be great if our loco can get a mentor while running the bugs jam
[19:13] <jcastro> people from other Loco's have been adding information too so you don't repeat mistakes made by other teams
[19:13] <jcastro> hi scottie!
[19:13] <Daviey> http://blog.daviey.com/blogroll/ubuntu-uk-community-bug-jam-09.html <-- a quick write up from our one earlier this ear
[19:13] <Daviey> year*
[19:14] <jcastro> e-jat: another reason we have the loco event list is so that newer teams can learn from more  experienced teams
[19:14] <jcastro> e-jat: don't worry the entire weekend has a ton of locos in IRC, so you should never feel like you are in a vaccum
[19:14] <e-jat> :)
[19:15] <jcastro> sbalneav: here's the URL https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuGlobalJam
[19:15] <jcastro> so what we are trying to do right now is to get other Loco teams from around the world to sign up with an event
[19:15] <jcastro> it's still early so alot of locos aren't signed up yet
[19:15] <jcastro> so part of the reason we have this meeting is to encourage everyone to sign up for an event
[19:16] <jcastro> and to get the word out so other locos become interested and sign up as well
[19:16] <jcastro> So please blog/dent/tweet/call/smoke signal/morse code the jam throughout all our communication channels
[19:17] <jcastro> the goal of the Jam is for locos to get together
[19:17] <jcastro> so even if your "event" ends up being 2 people in a pub because you live in the middle of nowhere (ie. Canada), then that's ok too
[19:17] <dantalizing> +1
[19:17] <grantbo1> +1
[19:17] <e-jat> Daviey: great writeup .. but how can ubuntu-my afford to fly in the developer :)
[19:17] <jcastro> Sometimes locos get concerned because they have 20 people show up and they "only triaged X amount of bugs"
[19:18] <jcastro> if your members have a good time and learn something and you're coming together, then that is success.
[19:18] <e-jat> +1
[19:18] <jcastro> so don't get too bent around the axle about numbers of bugs or code or docs or whatever.
[19:18] <Mean-Machine> yeah. we already started working on our 2nd Bug Jam https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IrishTeam/GlobalJam09
[19:18] <jcastro> this one time we planned a jam at the library and we got random people walking in and kind of interrupting
[19:18] <e-jat> jcastro: just make it done which how much u can , right?
[19:18] <jcastro> so instead we just brought them in and talked beginner stuff
[19:18] <jcastro> right
[19:19] <jcastro> So sometimes things don't go according to plan - but if you get a bunch of new people then concentrate on them
[19:20] <e-jat> agreed..
[19:20] <jcastro> because even if they are not interested in ubuntu or anything at that moment in time, they will remember the nice group of geeks that took the time to explain things to them and show them ubuntu, etc.
[19:20] <jcastro> any questions so far?
[19:21]  * e-jat no from me ..
[19:21] <ball> jcastro: is there anything that a small LUG (that isn't necessarily affiliated with a LoCo) can do?
[19:21] <jcastro> yes
[19:21] <jcastro> so the last jams there was a group called "club ubuntu"
[19:22] <jcastro> which was a virtual loco
[19:22] <jcastro> of people just like you banded together
[19:22] <grantbo1> interesting
[19:22] <jcastro> or, you can just be involved individually if you want
[19:22] <jcastro> you can hang out the entire weekend in irc and just follow along with what people are working on
[19:22] <jcastro> the ubuntu teams usually do things like put together a list of bugs to look at
[19:22] <jcastro> or wiki pages that need to be cleaned up
[19:22] <jcastro> or things like that
[19:23] <jcastro> you would just follow along like everyone else
[19:23] <ball> Hmm... okay.  Thanks.
[19:23] <e-jat> c00l
[19:23] <Daviey> e-jat: He happend to be in London :)
[19:23] <jcastro> actually, 2 global jams ago I think the club ubuntu virtual loco got in the largest number of bugs touched
[19:24] <e-jat> Daviey: ;]
[19:24] <jcastro> ball: whatever works for you
[19:24] <jcastro> trust me there will be plenty of people without locos looking to contribute
[19:25] <Daviey> We actually found that a large bulk of people who attended had never even heard of Launchpad, let alone had an account!
[19:25] <jcastro> Daviey: right so that's one thing I cover in the training sessions
[19:25] <jcastro> it's useful if you tell people how to prepare beforehand
[19:25] <jcastro> like, "everyone go sign up for an lp account if you don't have one!"
[19:25] <jcastro> there will still be people who don't have them
[19:25] <jcastro> but you can at least get the word out early
[19:26] <Daviey> I think people who attended still found it useful to have a real life "tour" of launchpad
[19:26] <jcastro> yes, for sure
[19:27] <ball> I have a Launchpad account, just very little idea how to drive the thing.
[19:27] <jcastro> Daviey: if you can find someone in your loco to do a few irc sessions during july/august that would be great, I am travelling: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuGlobalJam
[19:27] <Daviey> I also found that you need to keep checking people, to see how they are doing.  The inner geek in many found it hard to say "i'm stuck", and sat there scrolling mouse up and down - not knowing what to do.
[19:28] <e-jat> Daviey: +1
[19:29] <jcastro> ok, so at a minimum we should all make sure our locos want to plan to participate
[19:29] <jcastro> and then get on the event wiki page
[19:29] <jcastro> I have 2 sessions in september on how to run a successful jam
[19:29] <jcastro> but hopefully someone can have some in july/august
[19:29] <jcastro> but most of the information is on the wiki, if you've got a person who knows how to plan events it shouldn't be so hard.
[19:29] <Daviey> jcastro: Do you mean on a LoCo level, or global thingy?
[19:30] <jcastro> Daviey: loco level to find out if you want to do the global level. :D
[19:30] <jcastro> also, something that people don't tend to know
[19:30] <Daviey> heh, we are
[19:30] <jcastro> the global bug jam is just one event
[19:30] <jcastro> that is coordinated amonst all the locos
[19:30] <jcastro> your loco can have as many jams as it wants
[19:30] <jcastro> whenever you want!
[19:30] <Daviey> i'm having a jam in my house right now!
[19:31] <ball> Daviey: jamtastic
[19:31] <jcastro> so if your loco is good at something and you have the people, Just Do It(tm) and tell the world about it
[19:31] <e-jat> Daviey: woo
[19:31] <grantbo1> Ubuntu Global Jam - we all still stick Bug in there sometimes, haha
[19:31] <grantbo1> or were you talking about the weekly bug jams?
[19:31] <Mean-Machine> if you're organizing the bug jam for the first time I'd suggest to bring along someone who has done some triaging before. the intro was done by one of our members the 1st time and it was extremely useful
[19:32] <jcastro> grantbo1: we'll always have one big coordinated jam per cycle, the global jam
[19:32] <Daviey> grantbo1: Well it's not *wrong* to be focussed on bugs IMO.. To an english speaking nation, the translations are less importiant.. but could also do an "Answers" focus jam
[19:32] <jcastro> grantbo1: and your loco can have all sorts of jams if it wants
[19:32]  * grantbo1 nods
[19:32] <jcastro> the global thing is nice because we can do one big event as a group and learn what other locos are doing
[19:33] <e-jat> Mean-Machine: +1 .. but how if dont have any? so need to refer someone in IRC to help about it right?
[19:33] <jcastro> I cannot stress how important cross-pollination of ideas from locos can be
[19:33] <Daviey> "set a date, and people will come"
[19:33] <jcastro> so like, some locos put together signs and graphics and put them on the wiki
[19:33] <jcastro> that you can adapt to use for your needs, etc.
[19:33] <grantbo1> common problems, common solutions
[19:33] <Mean-Machine> e-jat, IRC is always helpful. loads of ppl online during bug jams. you'll get answers in miliseconds :)
[19:34] <jcastro> ok, if there are no more questions let's officially end the meeting now, and just chat for a bit (unless there's another meeting)
[19:34] <jcastro> oh I almost forgot
[19:34] <jcastro> if you're struggling, please mail the loco-contacts list
[19:34] <jcastro> this is where a bunch of loco leaders hang out, so they can always help you
[19:34] <jcastro> and of course feel free to mail me at jorge@ubuntu.com if you need help or advice
[19:34] <grantbo1> will this meeting's log be posted to the wiki page?
[19:35] <jcastro> grantbo1: good idea!
[19:35] <Daviey> grantbo1: well voluntered!
[19:35] <jcastro> I am screened in and I fail at copy and paste in screen, so someone else will have to do it
[19:35] <jcastro> but feel free to put it in there
[19:35] <grantbo1> I can, but there's already a log when using this channel, right?
[19:35] <Daviey> !logs
[19:35] <e-jat> jcastro: ill mail u if need help ..
[19:35] <jcastro> hey look at that!
[19:35] <grantbo1> ty
[19:36] <grantbo1> should I cut it up and put just this meeting on a wiki page?
[19:37] <jcastro> sure
[19:37] <grantbo1> cut up the html one I guess.  http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2009/07/16/%23ubuntu-meeting.html
[19:37] <grantbo1> kk
[19:37] <e-jat> or buzz at ya microblog :)
[19:38] <Daviey> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2009/07/16/%23ubuntu-meeting.txt
[19:38] <Daviey> ^ txt
[19:39] <grantbo1> Daviey: are you volunteering?  ;-)
[19:39] <Daviey> grantbo1: nope, you did that nicely. kkthnx
[19:41] <grantbo1> actually, you did it for me when I asked a question, lol.  it all works out.
[19:41] <mhall119|work> jcastro: you still around?
[19:42] <jcastro> mhall119|work: yep
[19:42] <mhall119|work> would it be possible to have some LoCo channels pinged before these meetings?
[19:43] <jcastro> mhall119|work: indeed, let me make sure they're on the fridge calendar as well
[19:43] <mhall119|work> I was in #ubuntu-us-fl all morning and had no idea there was going to be a meeting here
[19:43] <Mean-Machine> mhall119|work, great idea
[19:43] <mhall119|work> even if it's just a bot that joins, mentions the channel and time, and parts
[19:43] <Mean-Machine> an email to lococontacts would also be nice
[19:44] <jcastro> Mean-Machine: noted
[19:44] <Mean-Machine> could then forward to the locos lists
[19:44] <mhall119|work> the problem with email is that I'm at work,and don't check my personal email often
[19:45] <mhall119|work> but, thanks to irssi, I'm on IRC
[19:45] <jcastro> well, a few days before would be good
[19:45] <mhall119|work> you over-estimate my memory
[19:45] <mhall119|work> but you're right, a 24 or 48 hour notice would help
[19:45] <jcastro> and on top of that we're not on the fridge calendar either
[19:45] <Daviey> rly?
[19:45] <jcastro> oh no, wait, it is
[19:45] <Mean-Machine> jcastro, tis ;-]
[19:45] <Daviey> but hidden! :)
[19:46] <Mean-Machine> +3 more
[20:00] <highvoltage> Hi, who's here for the Edubuntu meeting
[20:01] <LaserJock> I am
[20:01] <highvoltage> <question mark />
[20:01]  * Lns raises hand
[20:01] <highvoltage> Agenda is on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Edubuntu/Community/MeetingAgenda
[20:01]  * alkisg also raises hand
[20:01] <highvoltage> We kept it simple since it wasn't clear whether LaserJock would be able to attend and we knew that stgraber wouldn't be able to make it
[20:02] <LaserJock> hmm, the agenda looks kinda thin
[20:02]  * ball raises his hand too
[20:02] <e-jat> o/
[20:02] <ball> I wasn't, but since I'm here anyway...
[20:02] <highvoltage> ball: heh
[20:02] <highvoltage> LaserJock: anything you would like to add?
[20:03] <LaserJock> well, I think top priority is an assessment of Karmic
[20:03] <highvoltage> LaserJock: last week you said that you wouldn't mind putting together a to-do list for edubuntu, would you perhaps like to discuss that?
[20:03] <ball> Will there be a section near the end for random questions?
[20:03]  * sbalneav waves hand
[20:03] <sbalneav> Present.
[20:03] <highvoltage> ball: we can do that, #edubuntu is always open for that as well.
[20:03] <LaserJock> highvoltage: oops, yeah, i didn't send that out. I'd be happy to give a list here
[20:03] <highvoltage> sbalneav: great :)
[20:04] <ball> highvoltage: thanks
[20:04] <highvoltage> LaserJock: thanks
[20:04] <highvoltage> ok, let's get going
[20:04] <highvoltage> 1. Website
[20:05] <highvoltage> I got in touch with Phillip Schroder who's currently in charge of the website
[20:05] <highvoltage> he said that between his work and his family he won't have any more time for the site
[20:05] <highvoltage> and he's happy to give it over to anyone who's willing to give it attention.
[20:06] <highvoltage> I wish I had more time to spend energy on it, but my plate is full and I think we need to assign someone to the site who can give it some special attention
[20:06] <LaserJock> I did a run-through of all the edubuntu.org pages earlier in the year
[20:06] <LaserJock> there's some amount of cleanup that could be done, particularly in namespace
[20:07] <highvoltage> LaserJock: that was on the wiki, right?
[20:07] <LaserJock> maybe, I honestly don't remember. At one point I had it just on a piece of paper
[20:07]  * Lns doesn't have enough authoring knowledge to step up :(
[20:07] <ball> Is it done with a content engine, or just XHTML and CSS?
[20:07] <LaserJock> but I think top priority would be to look at what needs to be done for Karmic's release
[20:07] <highvoltage> I think it was, perhaps we should combine the job as the person who is repsonsible for the site and wiki pages
[20:07] <LaserJock> ball: drupal
[20:08] <ball> Ah okay.  I don't know that.
[20:08] <highvoltage> ball: the site is drupal and the wiki pages are moin markup
[20:08] <LaserJock> I think we need to divide the site between the "current" content and archival content
[20:08]  * highvoltage makes notes
[20:08] <LaserJock> I found a lot of pages that were old but were written as current
[20:09] <LaserJock> so if a person stumbles onto the Dapper release notes they may think they are the current ones
[20:09] <LaserJock> I think we need to have a set of pages (Download, etc.) that are kept current
[20:09] <highvoltage> hmm, that would also make it easier to update with every release
[20:09] <LaserJock> and then a namespace for archived info that is useful for people not using the latest release (release notes, etc.)
[20:10] <highvoltage> you can just go through the category/namespace/whatever that is marked as current-type pages and make sure that they are up to date without having to go through everything
[20:11] <LaserJock> so I was thinking something like:
[20:11] <LaserJock>  /ReleaseNotes  (current release notes)
[20:11] <LaserJock>  /8.10/ReleaseNotes (Intrepid release notes)
[20:12] <LaserJock>  /8.04/ReleaseNotes (Hardy release notes)
[20:12] <LaserJock> etc.
[20:12] <LaserJock> I think we could do the same for the download pages and any releases-specific documents
[20:13] <highvoltage> LaserJock: that sounds real nice. I'm surprised no one has suggested it before
[20:13] <ball> Could we include a warning sign at the top? ;-)
[20:13] <highvoltage> ball: what kind of warning sign?
[20:14] <ball> How about a yellow triangle with a "!" in it, along with a short note and a link to the equivalent page for Jaunty?
[20:14] <highvoltage> ball: we could add a banner for all pages withing a namespace that says "This document is relevant to Edubuntu 8.04 LTS, please refer to this other page for the current release"
[20:15] <ball> highvoltage: yes, that'd work.
[20:16] <highvoltage> We still don't really have an answer of how we're going to do this from a who's-going-to-do-what perspective
[20:17] <LaserJock> yep
[20:17] <highvoltage> I guess we could blog/announce it wherever possible and let people know that we're looking for people who can help with the site
[20:17] <ball> I'll put the kettle on.
[20:17] <highvoltage> some people have raised their hands on the list and said that they want to get involved but they don't know how
[20:18] <highvoltage> the barrier of entry for drupal and moin is quite low, so pretty much anyone who has the time can get involved
[20:19] <LaserJock> I also think it would not take a huge amount of effort
[20:19] <LaserJock> if somebody put some steady work starting nowish I think it would be a pretty easy task
[20:19] <highvoltage> LaserJock: probably not the site as much, but last when I looked at the wiki space it was a really big mess
[20:19] <LaserJock> to start with it can just be organization without having to do a lot of content creating
[20:19] <highvoltage> LaserJock: but if the website can just be fixed up that would be  a big win already
[20:19] <LaserJock> yeah, I went through the wiki as well
[20:19] <highvoltage> LaserJock: *yep
[20:20] <LaserJock> basically we have a huge wiki structure that is *waaay* bigger than the team
[20:20] <Lns> question - and this might be stupid to ask, but would it be totally out of the question to consolidate the wiki and the webpage?
[20:20] <LaserJock> yes :-)
[20:20] <Lns> ok =p
[20:20] <LaserJock> wiki.ubuntu.com/Edubuntu is for us as a team
[20:20] <LaserJock> coordination, etc.
[20:20] <highvoltage> Lns: that's a good and valid question. the reason for not merging is that we need a space that anyone can edit
[20:21] <highvoltage> the wiki is good for that. otherwise we would have had to create users for everyone for drupal and set the appropriate rights, etc
[20:21] <LaserJock> ideally the help.ubuntu.com/community wiki pages would mostly move to edubuntu.org once they are deemed "stable"
[20:22] <highvoltage> I'll send a message to the list and ask around if we can get some hands involved, there's a website team as well with a bunch of people subscribed, perhaps we can pull them in
[20:22] <highvoltage> I think we can revisit the website stuff further next week, are we ok with moving on to the next topic for this meeting?
[20:23] <LaserJock> yeah, I think we've done about all we can
[20:24] <highvoltage> Team Reports- We're supposed to do them monthly
[20:25] <highvoltage> LaserJock: do you perhaps know when last we had a team report?
[20:25] <LaserJock> I don't think we've ever done one
[20:25] <highvoltage> I remember we used to have them when JaneW was around
[20:25] <highvoltage> I can't remember when exactly they stopped though
[20:25] <LaserJock> well, with the new team report thing anyway
[20:25] <highvoltage> ah ok
[20:26] <highvoltage> I think if we have weekly IRC meetings and keep it up, it will be easy to build at least some kind of a monthly report quite easily from the logs
[20:27] <LaserJock> there is a team reporting template
[20:27] <LaserJock> we just need a wiki page
[20:27] <highvoltage> so we do weekly mini-reports on IRC which gets summarized and sent to the list, and then we can make a monthly report out of those about what happened during the period, status updates, blockers, etc
[20:27] <LaserJock> *but* we also need things to put things in it
[20:27] <Lns> For those not in #edubuntu, here are the list pages to subscribe: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/edubuntu-users -- https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/edubuntu-devel -- https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-education
[20:28] <Lns> I apologize everyone I have to go - granddad is in the hospital, need to go see him. Cheers all
[20:28] <highvoltage> cheers Lns, thanks for coming
[20:28]  * Lns will keep the chan open and review for later
[20:29] <sbalneav> Does someone want an update from me?
[20:29] <highvoltage> LaserJock: do the reports have to be in by a certain time of the month? (I assume end of month?)
[20:29] <highvoltage> sbalneav: go for it
[20:29] <LaserJock> highvoltage: it used to be by the 22nd
[20:30] <LaserJock> highvoltage: not sure if that is still the case
[20:30] <highvoltage> LaserJock: ok, I'll find out if that's still the case and send an update to the list
[20:30] <LaserJock> highvoltage: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TeamReports
[20:31] <dgroos> Hi!
[20:31] <highvoltage> hi dgroos
[20:31] <highvoltage> sbalneav: You have some Sabyon and handbook updates?
[20:32] <dgroos> I'm afraid I miscalculated times (drat daylight saving time) and so wont be able to be here!
[20:32] <dgroos> I've got to run but, like Lns.  will leave the channel open for review later.
[20:32] <sbalneav> Why yes. Yes I do.
[20:33] <dgroos> sbalneav: just to let you know, I'm excited to see how sabayon is going.  adios all for now
[20:33] <sbalneav> 1) Sabayon: I've had 5 people give me feedback  3 can now run it, 2 can't.  So that's a (counts on fingers) bazillion % better than the old situation of 0 people running it :)
[20:34] <sbalneav> I'm making a pest of myself in #sabayon on irc.gnome.org, so I'm going to keep at them.
[20:34] <sbalneav> We'll get this nailed down in time for release.
[20:34]  * highvoltage hugs sbalneav 
[20:35] <sbalneav> 2) LTSP upstream docs have been (more or less) up to date.  Currently sitting at 84 pages.
[20:35] <sbalneav> I will now move on to updating the Edubuntu handbook, ripping out the LTSP stuff, as it'
[20:35] <sbalneav> s been covered in the LTSP docs
[20:35] <sbalneav> I need help with 2 things.
[20:36] <sbalneav> a) LTSP upstream dock NEED NEED NEED NEED i18n
[20:36] <sbalneav> Currently, they're english only.
[20:37] <sbalneav> I need someone with knowledge of either po4a, or another way to internationalize a docbook document to give me a hand and show me the light.
[20:37] <highvoltage> sbalneav: I saw some discussion on the handbook in #ltsp this afternoon, it's kept in a bzr branch isn't it?
[20:37] <sbalneav> b) I need help on how to package.....
[20:37] <sbalneav> yes
[20:37] <sbalneav> lp:~ltsp-docwriters/ltsp/ltsp-docs-trunk
[20:37] <highvoltage> what format/markup is it in?
[20:38] <sbalneav> ....package the docs, specifically, with an eye to making them yelp-able.
[20:38] <highvoltage> oh docbook, sorry I missed it before
[20:38] <sbalneav> docbook.
[20:38] <sbalneav> So if one of you packaging wizards can gimme a hand...
[20:39] <sbalneav> 3) Bug triaging
[20:39] <LaserJock> sbalneav: is ltsp-docs going to be a package?
[20:39] <highvoltage> sbalneav: are there lots of bugs assigned to the documentation currently?
[20:40] <LaserJock> we can use the same tools as for the Ubuntu Docs and Rosetta
[20:40] <sbalneav> Once I get the handbook sorted (I'm going to be going on holidays soon, and I expect to spend my time at my cottage editing the handbook 'CUZ I'M A FREAKING IDIOT) done in about 2-3 weeks, I'll move on to handling some of the crasher bugs.
[20:40] <sbalneav> LaserJock: That's my intention, yes.
[20:40] <sbalneav> highvoltage: which, the upstream ltsp, or edubunut-handbook
[20:41] <sbalneav> So if someone would like to work with me when bug season is open to prioritize the crashers they'd like fixed, I'd be obliged.
[20:41] <highvoltage> sbalneav: both, since you mentioned triaging
[20:42] <sbalneav> Oh, I was talking all the other package bugs
[20:42] <highvoltage> ok
[20:42] <highvoltage> sbalneav: we need to get more people from #ltsp to work on these things in edubuntu
[20:43] <LaserJock> phew
[20:43] <sbalneav> Like who? :)
[20:43] <LaserJock> we're up to 278 open bugs :(
[20:44] <sbalneav> Ogra's too busy, stgrabers already working, vagrant's full time on debian, etc :)
[20:44] <sbalneav> LaserJock: Yeah, I'd like to see that come down.
[20:44] <highvoltage> sbalneav: heh, good point
[20:44] <LaserJock> perhaps we need to tap into general Ubuntu resources more
[20:44] <sbalneav> A lot of them could probably be handled by updating the upstream.
[20:45] <LaserJock> IMO, #ltsp and #edubuntu people are generally going to be either 1) to busy already or 2) not technically adept enough at the moment
[20:45] <LaserJock> I think we need to look at #ubuntu-bugs and the Ubuntu Bugsquad
[20:45] <LaserJock> after all, our packages *are* in the Ubuntu repos
[20:45] <highvoltage> LaserJock: I'll start attacking some of the low-hanging fruit as soon as stgraber and I have most of the ltsp-cluster packaging in shape. I've learned a lot from him the last few weeks, so I should be able to actually do more fixing there
[20:46] <LaserJock> so we shouldn't get a "we have to do everything all by ourselves" mentality
[20:46] <highvoltage> and if anyone comes across a bug that isn't very complex from a packaging perspective, feel free to subscribe me
[20:46] <LaserJock> Edubuntu is likely to never have a super strong developer community
[20:46] <Ahmuck-Jr> working with ubuntu-ltsp i could
[20:46] <Ahmuck-Jr> er, it could
[20:47] <LaserJock> I doubt it
[20:47] <sbalneav> I'd like to see us maybe get some of the kde-edu and/or debian-edu people helping us out.
[20:47] <highvoltage> LaserJock: yep. sabdfl once had a blog entry about work that is "sexy" and work that is not, and things like bzr, upstart, etc are much more "sexier" things to work on for lots of people than education related stuff
[20:47] <LaserJock> I mean, we've always had a pretty small group, even at Edubuntu's largest
[20:48] <highvoltage> LaserJock: well, I think it could always have been bigger than it was
[20:48] <LaserJock> I think we should leverage the broader Ubuntu community
[20:48] <sbalneav> ltsp already has an exceedingly small developer community, for the size of project it is.
[20:48] <LaserJock> just because our stuff isn't "sexy" doesn't mean we can't guilt developers into sponsoring work ;-)
[20:48] <mhall119|work> hi
[20:48] <highvoltage> LaserJock: but I do agree, as edubuntu we should really try to use whatever is available to us instead of trying to build rome ourselves
[20:49] <highvoltage> LaserJock: heh, good strategy!
[20:49] <LaserJock> "think of the kids!!!!"
[20:49] <mhall119|work> just wanted to mention, I make Qimo (http://qimo4kids.com), and if there's any way my project can help yours, I'm all for it
[20:49] <Ahmuck-Jr> edubuntu can be done with a simple ubuntu install and adding the edu apps by aptitude.  setting edubuntu apart as a schoolbuntu distro would make more sense.  if your wanting it in schools, you need "classroom" type of setup
[20:49] <highvoltage> mhall119|work: I'm glad you're here, we talked about Qimo at UDS
[20:49] <mhall119|work> oh yeah?
[20:50] <LaserJock> anyway, as far as bug triage goes it's a general task, you don't have to have a ton of app-specific knowledge
[20:50] <mhall119|work> wish I could have gone, had a couple of friends go though
[20:50] <LaserJock> a huge amount of our bugs just need to be triaged and forwarded
[20:50] <highvoltage> mhall119|work: we'd *really* like to get you involved, and perhaps, if possible, and if you're wiling, try to get some of the Qimo packages into ubuntu so that someone could just install a qimo desktop
[20:50] <mhall119|work> highvoltage: there's not much in Qimo that isn't already in Ubuntu's repos
[20:51] <mhall119|work> I don't have any deb packages yet, I'm working on that for the next release, will either setup a PPA for them, or host a separate repository on my server
[20:51] <highvoltage> mhall119|work: exactly, so adding the qimo desktop to ubuntu would only require a few small packages
[20:51] <mhall119|work> in theory, yes
[20:51] <mhall119|work> right now, my "custom desktop" is just a pre-configured /home/qimo directory
[20:51] <highvoltage> mhall119|work: well, I can't promise anything for now, but at least long-term, we're more than happy to lend you a hand there
[20:51] <LaserJock> mhall119|work: if there isn't any conflicts or Qimo-specific modifications you could do it all in the Ubuntu repo
[20:52] <mhall119|work> LaserJock: what is the process of getting my packages into Universe?
[20:52]  * mhall119|work is new to all this
[20:52] <mhall119|work> sorry, I didn't mean to side-track the meeting, just wanted to offer what I could
[20:52] <LaserJock> mhall119|work: I could give you a big long talk on that but #ubuntu-motu is the channel that would help you out
[20:52] <mhall119|work> thanks
[20:53] <highvoltage> mhall119|work: I'm *very* familiar with how Xfce implements it's custom panels and settings in a standard way, I could help you convert it to the correct /etc/xdg/xfce4 structure so that you don't have to do that anymore
[20:53] <highvoltage> mhall119|work: but we can talk about that outside of the meeting as well
[20:53] <mhall119|work> highvoltage: I'd like that very much
[20:53] <LaserJock> mhall119|work:  having built a few derivatives myself I'd strongly encourage you to work on getting your packages into Universe
[20:53] <mhall119|work> which mailing list should I join?  users or devel?
[20:53] <highvoltage> mhall119|work: are you on the edubuntu-devel mailing list? I think it would be great if you could join.
[20:53] <mhall119|work> or ubuntu-education?
[20:54] <LaserJock> mhall119|work: -devel would probably be the most appropriate I think
[20:54] <mhall119|work> what the heck, I'll join them all
[20:54] <highvoltage> mhall119|work: you could join that as well, but edubuntu-devel is the one to join
[20:54] <highvoltage> mhall119|work: welcome aboard :)
[20:55] <mhall119|work> thanks
[20:55] <LaserJock> depending on how things work out I wouldn't mind seeing Qimo as the default for Edubuntu for the preschool category
[20:55] <mhall119|work> it'd need some extra stuff, Qimo wasn't made for a classroom setting, so there's not much management software
[20:55] <LaserJock> well, Edubuntu isn't *just* classrooms
[20:56] <highvoltage> mhall119|work: are there any branding issues that would disallow you from having any qimo artwork in ubuntu?
[20:56] <mhall119|work> does edubuntu use content filtering for internet?
[20:56] <mhall119|work> highvoltage: my graphics guy has made it all creative commons, attribution, share alike
[20:56] <highvoltage> mhall119|work: those are more ubuntu-server kind of focusses, but they are important areas in edubuntu, we haven't spent any time on those recently
[20:56] <mhall119|work> so as long as the Ubuntu guidelines are cool with that, it's good
[20:56] <LaserJock> mhall119|work: not by default
[20:56] <highvoltage> mhall119|work: great!
[20:57] <mhall119|work> I ask because I'm going to try Dan's Guardian in Qimo 2
[20:57] <LaserJock> mhall119|work: I think it would really be worthwhile to discuss some sort of partnership between Qimo and Edubuntu
[20:57] <mhall119|work> #edubuntu?
[20:57] <mhall119|work> is that the channel?
[20:58] <highvoltage> mhall119|work: indeed
[20:58] <LaserJock> yep
[20:58] <mhall119|work> cool
[20:58] <highvoltage> we'll probably move there soon so that we don't clobber up #ubuntu-meeting too long
[20:58] <mhall119|work> ok
[20:58] <Ahmuck-Jr> my work is in the pre - 2nd grade category, and i agree about qimo
[20:58] <highvoltage> shall we wrap up and decide on our next meeting time?
[20:58] <mhall119|work> there's also #qimo, but it's rarely used
[20:58] <LaserJock> well
[20:58] <LaserJock> I'm really concerned about the technical bits of getting Karmic out
[20:59] <LaserJock> we don't even know what medium we're using
[20:59] <LaserJock> we haven't done anything with package selection/review, etc.
[20:59] <highvoltage> LaserJock: can we take that to #edubuntu? or would you rather keep it as part of this meeting?
[20:59] <LaserJock> well, we've gone the hour, we can move to #edubuntu
[21:00] <highvoltage> LaserJock: any suggestion for the next meeting time?
[21:00] <LaserJock> whenever, I'm really likely to not make any more that aren't 9-5 for me
[21:01] <LaserJock> once I start my job I'll be behind an Air Force network running Windows :(
[21:01] <highvoltage> what times UTC are good for you?
[21:01] <mhall119|work> LaserJock: I'm like that here, have irssi running on an outside server, using ssh to connect to it
[21:01] <mhall119|work> but the USAF might not appreciate you working around that
[21:02] <LaserJock> not really I don't think
[21:02] <LaserJock> I don't think I'll even have ssh
[21:02] <ball> carrier pigeon
[21:02] <highvoltage> there's mibbit... but we can discuss getting around USAF's ISA servers later in #edubuntu
[21:03] <highvoltage> let's decide on the next meeting time first
[21:03] <LaserJock> highvoltage: you know, I really can't say right now what times are going to be good
[21:03] <highvoltage> LaserJock: ok, we just need enough advance time so that we can put it on the appropriate calendars, UWN, etc
[21:03] <LaserJock> but like 10:00 UTC - 12:00UTC and then 22:00UTC -
[21:03] <highvoltage> Wednesday 12:00 UTC?
[21:04] <highvoltage> sbalneav, mhall119|work (and others): will that work for you?
[21:04] <LaserJock> I won't make that in the next 2 weeks but I think we need to get away form 18:00-19:00 for a while
[21:04] <sbalneav> okdokie
[21:04] <LaserJock> *from
[21:04] <mhall119|work> what's that in EST?
[21:04] <LaserJock> 8am I think
[21:05] <highvoltage> yes it is
[21:05] <mhall119|work> I'd likely be in transit
[21:05] <mhall119|work> I usually get to work about 9am EST, so anytime after that I can make
[21:05] <highvoltage> 13:00 UTC then?
[21:05]  * mhall119|work needs an Android phone so he's available anytime
[21:06] <mhall119|work> that would work for me
[21:06] <highvoltage> LaserJock?
[21:07] <LaserJock> that's at least a possibility for me
[21:07] <LaserJock> that's 6am here
[21:07] <highvoltage> ok, so let's make it so
[21:07] <highvoltage> Wednesday 13:00
[21:08] <highvoltage> any last words before I hit the meeting-over-gong?
[21:08] <LaserJock> nope
[21:08] <highvoltage> We'll be moving over to #edubuntu for technical discussions relating to karmic.
[21:08] <highvoltage> LaserJock, Lns, alkisg, ball, e-jat, sbalneav, dgroos, mhall119|work: thanks for attending this meeting
[21:08] <highvoltage> *gong*