[00:02] <seb128> hey robert_ancell_
[00:07] <seb128> 'night everybody
[00:27] <Ampelbein> hi there. I could need some help with updating gnome-nettool to 2.27.4 . I can't get the Launchpad-Integration to work, no Menu items are added to the "help"-menu. https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~amoog/gnome-nettool/packaging2.27.4 is my current progress. I also tried adding a name to the "help1" menu, but had no luck either.
[00:27] <Ampelbein> Hope someone here can push me in the right direction.
[04:38] <mac_v> Hi, is the FUSA being replaced by User-switch-applet in Karmic? or is the temporary switch due to the GDM2.26?
[05:01] <TheMuso> mac_v: I believe its due to the new GDM.
[05:02] <mac_v> TheMuso> so we'd switch to FUSA by the time of RC?
[05:02] <TheMuso> mac_v: Not sure
[05:03] <mac_v> ok... thanx, was just wondering , whether i had messed up FUSA... :)
[07:00] <pitti> Good morning
[08:19] <didrocks> hello
[08:19] <didrocks> pitti: that's correct. Thanks for the explanation :)
[08:20] <pitti> hey didrocks
[08:30] <robert_ancell> hey seb128
[08:30] <seb128> good morning there
[08:30] <seb128> hello robert_ancell
[08:33] <seb128> robert_ancell, reading your email about gnome-games
[08:33] <pitti> hey seb128
[08:33] <pitti> hey robert_ancell
[08:33] <seb128> I'm really not convinced that binary package inflation is a good thing
[08:33] <seb128> it means the apt index becomes less managable over time
[08:33] <robert_ancell> Isn't that a scalability issue for apt?
[08:33] <seb128> too many entry, hard to work with list in package management tool, slower to download, etc
[08:33] <seb128> extra work
[08:34] <seb128> well it's rather than each description takes space
[08:34] <seb128> and every apt-get update download the index
[08:34] <robert_ancell> Well, in this case I'm proposing we'll only be distributing a subset of games
[08:34] <seb128> and it makes the number of items in the package management tools
[08:34] <seb128> I'm fine with that
[08:34] <didrocks> hey seb128 & robert_ancell
[08:34] <robert_ancell> didrocks, hey
[08:34] <didrocks> seb128: thanks for sponsoring, again and again :)
[08:34] <seb128> but I don't want to start splitting gnome-utils for each binary, and gnome-media and gnome-games, etc
[08:35] <seb128> didrocks, thanks for updates again and again ;-)
[08:35] <seb128> didrocks, if you look for tasks I've work for you
[08:35] <robert_ancell> well I'm only interested in gnome-games as there is a good reason for splitting it now
[08:35] <seb128> which one?
[08:36] <robert_ancell> anyway, gtg, see you guys next week
[08:36] <didrocks> seb128: fire up ;)
[08:36] <seb128> ok, see you!
[08:36] <seb128> have a nice week end
[08:36] <didrocks> good night robert_ancell!
[08:36] <seb128> didrocks, gobject-instrospection and clutter-0.9 to rebase on debian
[08:36] <pitti> robert_ancell: have a good weekend!
[08:36] <seb128> didrocks, kov added clutter-0.9 0.9.6 to pkg-gnome
[08:36] <didrocks> seb128: ok, I will do that between two quickly commit ;)
[08:37] <seb128> it should be mostly a sync I looked at the diff yesterday
[08:37] <seb128> though they did some different choices for the gobject-introspection
[08:37] <seb128> so you might to merge that first
[08:37] <seb128> owen rolled a mutter tarball too could be nice to try to get that in universe now
[08:37] <seb128> I will try to get gjs in universe too
[08:37] <pitti> btw, do we have anything in Ubuntu to talk to gobject-introspection-supporting libraries through Python?
[08:37] <seb128> so gnome-shell can build
[08:38] <pitti> I'd love to use libgudev from Python
[08:38] <didrocks> ok, I will look at this
[08:38] <seb128> pitti, I don't think so
[08:38] <didrocks> seb128: I should ask huats how he collaborate in alioth to avoid doubling the effort
[08:38] <pitti> that was formerly called "pybank", but was renamed or changed/merged or something
[08:38] <seb128> didrocks, easy, ask for pkg-gnome membership on alioth
[08:39] <didrocks> seb128: I think I will have to put more patch in debian bts before asking for membership
[08:40] <seb128> didrocks, right, fair enough, or maintain a package directly in debian as huats do
[08:41] <seb128> pitti, commented on the gdmsetup blueprint
[08:41] <pitti> seb128: merci
[08:50] <didrocks> seb128: just a question, do you follow a ML to see what has been commited to pkg-gnome or what is in debian experimental/NEW?
[08:50] <seb128> didrocks, no, I'm on #gnome-debian in irc.gnome.org and the commit are displayed on the channel
[08:51] <didrocks> oh, ok
[08:52] <seb128> which is something which would be really cool to have there too but not sure if that's possible on launchpad
[08:57] <didrocks> having every new uploaded package of "gnome category" or just "bzr commit" in ~ubuntu-desktop?
[08:59] <seb128> didrocks, commits
[08:59] <seb128> so you know who is doing what
[08:59] <seb128> and you have a sense of work getting done ;-)
[09:00] <didrocks> it's probably possible with launchpadAPI, I can do it, but not within those few weeks, I think :)
[09:03] <seb128> didrocks, well, polling on the server is not efficient, would be nice to have a trigger or a built in feature, but don't bother with that
[09:04] <pitti> there, gdm down to 5 small patches, and no autoreconf
[09:04]  * pitti puts down the patch cleanup axe
[09:04] <seb128> james_w, ^ do you think if there is a way to have commit to the team vcs displayed on irc?
[09:04] <seb128> pitti, speaking about gdm, look at http://git.gnome.org/cgit/gdm/log/
[09:04] <pitti> seb128: I packaged a git snapshot
[09:04] <seb128> pitti, \o/, the ping for patch review worked
[09:05] <pitti> Ray fixed the session thingy
[09:05] <seb128> yeah, I did talk to them on #gdm about that and patch review 2 days ago
[09:05] <pitti> seb128: yeah, I got some responses and patches applied \o/
[09:05] <seb128> pitti, IRC nagging is sometime useful ;-)
[09:05] <seb128> I gave them so 7-8 bugzilla URLs with patches to review there
[09:05] <seb128> and they have been nice enough to look at the list
[09:06] <pitti> yay
[09:06] <pitti> the patch stack is so much nicer now
[09:06] <pitti> I really hate 81_initial_server_on_vt7.patch, it's a nasty hack
[09:06] <seb128> 5 patches still seem a lot
[09:06] <pitti> and 03_hide_system_users.patch is still being discussed, that should eventually go away, too
[09:06] <pitti> the rest is reasonable
[09:07] <pitti> we have two that could be forwarded
[09:07] <pitti> I mean, I'll forward them, perhaps they could be applied upstream
[09:08] <pitti>   * debian/patches/01_xrdb_nocpp.patch:
[09:08] <pitti>     - call xrdb with the "nocpp" option (Ubuntu: #14268).
[09:08] <pitti> hm, that bug reference is definitively wrong
[09:08] <pitti> but it's clear enough what it does, I'll forward that one
[09:09] <pitti> oh, heh, seems that's not even shipped any more
[09:09] <seb128> pitti, it's not wrong
[09:10] <seb128> pitti, that was just a bugzilla.ubuntu.com number
[09:10] <seb128> pitti, bug #20507 now
[09:10] <pitti> oh, I see
[09:10] <pitti> thanks
[09:12] <seb128> pitti, I'm also not sure the -br change is still useful
[09:13] <pitti> seb128: no, already killed that
[09:13] <pitti> see gdm branch
[09:13] <seb128> ok
[09:13] <pitti> seb128: hm, we patch data/Xsession.in for xrdb, but ship our own debian/Xsession (which doesn't use xrdb at all)
[09:13] <seb128> the default server would probably make sense upstream too as a configure option
[09:13] <pitti> so either we should use upstream's variant and forward the patch, or drop the patch and keep our own script
[09:13] <pitti> seb128: *nod*
[09:14] <seb128> the directory workaround needs autotools work too
[09:14] <seb128> I don't like to do autotools changes ;-)
[09:14] <pitti> already settled
[09:16] <seb128> pitti, I'm not sure why we have your own Xsession script to be honest but I would tend to use debian had a reason
[09:16] <seb128> not sure if the reason still stand though ...
[09:16] <pitti> well, old gdm had a session type chooser
[09:16] <seb128> the lazy way would be to keep using that since it works
[09:16] <pitti> for failsafe, etc.
[09:17] <pitti> seb128: I'm inclined to test the upstream one
[09:17] <seb128> lowering delta is always good
[09:17] <seb128> +1
[09:17] <seb128> it's still early karmic
[09:17] <pitti> right
[09:17]  * pitti test-builds the current bzr state for now
[09:18] <pitti> seb128: I'll look into the xsession script afterwards
[09:18] <seb128> ok
[09:18] <pitti> but current gdm doesn't even have a session type chooser, hasa it?
[09:18]  * pitti can't find one
[09:19] <seb128> it does
[09:19] <seb128> you need to select an user
[09:19] <pitti> right, I did; and then?
[09:19] <seb128> at the bottom
[09:19] <seb128> you have session and keyboard selectors
[09:19] <pitti> I have language, keyboard, and a11y
[09:20] <seb128> I've language keyboard and session
[09:20] <seb128> as text entries
[09:20] <pitti> weird
[09:20] <seb128> session listing GNOME and fluxbox there
[09:20] <seb128> you maybe have no other session than GNOME
[09:20] <pitti> ah, but no failsafe, etc.?
[09:20] <pitti> right, that could be it
[09:20] <seb128> no, there is a bug open about that
[09:20] <pitti> but an xterm session, etc. would be nice
[09:21] <pitti> seb128: either way, since debian/Xsession presumably is from the old gdm, I'd rather use upstream's
[09:21] <seb128> pitti, bug #399516
[09:21] <seb128> pitti, right, me too
[09:22] <pitti> seb128: thanks
[09:23] <pitti> WTH? build now fails with
[09:23] <pitti> (gconftool-2:30958): GConf-WARNING **: Failed to load source "xml:merged:/home/martin/ubuntu/desktop-bzr/build-area/gdm-2.26.1+git20090717/debian/gdm//var/lib/gdm/.gconf.mandatory": Couldn't resolve address for configuration source: Bad address `xml:merged:/home/martin/ubuntu/desktop-bzr/build-area/gdm-2.26.1+git20090717/debian/gdm//var/lib/gdm/.gconf.mandatory': `+' is an invalid character in a
[09:23] <pitti> configuration storage address
[09:23] <pitti> **
[09:23] <pitti> GConf:ERROR:gconftool.c:969:main: assertion failed: (err == NULL)
[09:23] <pitti> oh, that's my version number, I see
[09:23] <seb128> drop the +
[09:23] <pitti> what does it have to do in a gconf tree anyway..
[09:24] <seb128> pitti, ls /usr/share/xsessions
[09:24] <pitti> seb128: right, just gnome.desktop
[09:24] <seb128> pitti, having extra session is just a matter of dropping .desktops there
[09:25] <seb128> we could easily add some in the debian directory to copy there for the options you listed before
[09:25] <seb128> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdm/+bug/399516/comments/1 also has a user session desktop example
[09:30] <chrisccoulson> seb128 / pitti - i just saw your comment about the session issue being fixed in GDM now
[09:30] <chrisccoulson> i still intend to write a patch for metacity to disable the dialog though. there's still quite a f ew applications that don't play nice
[09:31] <pitti> seb128: right, sounds like a good idea; I'll add a failsafe one at least, and have a look at the two bugs you mentinoed
[09:32] <seb128> pitti, thanks
[09:32] <pitti> chrisccoulson: hm, but wasn't it useful for something?
[09:32] <pitti> chrisccoulson: it should probably display it if you enabled session saving?
[09:32] <chrisccoulson> pitti - not really, other than annoying users.
[09:33] <chrisccoulson> it only means that the window size / position won't be saved. and metacity will show the dialog regardless of whether you want to save the session or not
[09:33] <chrisccoulson> i don't think it warrants a dialog every time you log out
[09:33] <seb128> the dialog is displayed only when an application claim to register to the session but don't do it correctly no?
[09:34] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - the dialog will be displayed for any application that doesn't tell the window manager its client ID - that basically means any application that doesn't connect to the session manager
[09:34] <chrisccoulson> or any application that does connect but is buggy
[09:34] <seb128> hum
[09:34] <chrisccoulson> eg, xterm, synaptic both trigger this dialog
[09:34] <chrisccoulson> any proprietary application or non-native app will trigger it too
[09:35] <seb128> I probably never close my session with lot of cluttering on screen
[09:35] <chrisccoulson> every time you log out;)
[09:35] <mvo> I guess synaptic does not do it because of gksu ?
[09:35] <seb128> I'm too well behaved for that ;-)
[09:35] <chrisccoulson> mvo - most likely, yes
[09:35] <chrisccoulson> but i think a dialog is complete overkill for this. it should just be a warning in the users .xsession-errors
[09:36] <chrisccoulson> if the user actually notices window positions are not restored after they save their session, they'll report bugs against those applications
[09:36] <chrisccoulson> (i think)
[09:40] <pitti> new gdm works great \o/
[09:40] <chrisccoulson> fantastic:)
[09:40] <james_w> seb128: ideally LP would have CIA integration or something
[09:41] <seb128> pitti, rock on!
[09:41] <seb128> james_w, there is no hackish way or receipe for that right now?
[09:41] <james_w> you can do it client side with the bzr-cia plugin
[09:41] <james_w> but it requires everyone to install and configure it
[09:42] <james_w> or you could run a watcher on one machine
[09:42] <seb128> ok thanks
[09:42] <seb128> I was curious to know if some teams or channel already had something similar we could copy
[09:54] <seb128> pitti, do you know if any karmic language pack update is scheduled?
[09:54] <pitti> ArneGoetje: ^ ?
[09:54] <pitti> seb128: no, I just read dpm's announcement that they are finally open now
[09:55] <seb128> pitti, ok, I was not sure of who is in charge of those between dpm and ArneGoetje now
[09:56] <dpm> pitti: seb128 ArneGoetje told me that the first langpack had started to be generated and would be released in a couple of days (the same which is stated in the announcement). ArneGoetje is currently in charge of them
[09:56] <seb128> dpm, ok thanks
[10:15] <lool> seb128: It looks like something broke gedit recently
[10:16] <lool> process 13636: type array 97 not a basic type
[10:16] <lool> process 13636: type array 97 not a basic type
[10:16] <lool> ..
[10:16] <lool> zsh: segmentation fault  gedit
[10:16] <seb128> lool, did you reboot since you upgraded gvfs and dbus?
[10:16] <lool> No
[10:16] <seb128> that would be it
[10:16] <lool> I'll do that then, thanks
[10:16] <seb128> not sure what is going on
[10:16] <seb128> but something doesn't work as expected after upgrade until dbus restart
[10:17] <lool> It looks like the daemon and the lib disagree about gtype ids, but it means these are passing around gtype ids which would be nasty
[10:19] <seb128> lool, I don't really understand what is going on and if the issue is rather gvfs or dbus but a restart fix it
[10:22] <lool> seb128: Killing gvfsd wasn't enough, but once I had killed all gvfs processes it worked
[10:22] <lool> It looks like we're missing a kill in an upgrade script
[10:22] <seb128> weird, I'm pretty sure I had the issue after a session restart the other dya
[10:22] <seb128> day
[10:23] <lool> These were the processes I had before killing http://paste.ubuntu.com/220378/
[10:23] <lool> (I had killed gvfsd stuff already)
[10:48] <vuntz> seb128: isn't your gnome-menus bug an alacarte bug?
[10:48] <vuntz> seb128: ie, what is it doing?
[10:49] <seb128> vuntz, dunno
[10:49] <seb128> vuntz, run alacarte, sudo touch /usr/share/applications/something
[10:49] <seb128> vuntz, and your gnome-panel applications menu is empty
[10:49] <seb128> alacarte and gmenu-simple-editor still work
[10:50] <vuntz> err, no, works here?
[10:50] <seb128> not a surprise you always deny having bugs in your code ;-)
[10:50] <seb128> no? ;-)
[10:51] <seb128> hum, I don't get the issue either now
[10:52] <vuntz> see
[10:52] <vuntz> that's not a valid bug :-)
[10:52] <vuntz> (for those kind of bugs, it's basically impossible to know what's going on unless you attach the stuff from ~/.config/menus)
[10:53] <asac> any decision on ephy+webkit yet?
[10:53]  * asac sits in front of a failed build of the gecko stuff against 1.9.1 and wonders if he should really start looking at this
[10:54] <seb128> vuntz, hum, I don't get it again now, annoying
[10:54] <vuntz> 11:52 < vuntz> (for those kind of bugs, it's basically impossible to know what's going on unless you attach the stuff from ~/.config/menus)
[10:54] <vuntz> seb128: and stop leaving when I talk to you ;-)
[10:54] <asac> lol. thats seb128
[10:54] <seb128> vuntz, I restarted my session to see if that makes a difference
[10:54] <asac> he should start using screen + irssi at least ;)
[10:55] <vuntz> asac: I definitely agree :-)
[10:55] <seb128> vuntz, well I tried the steps and that emptied the menu so I though that was enough
[10:55] <vuntz> asac: re ephy+webkit, decision will be taken during the next release team meeting upstream. That being said, the ephy team has definitely switched to webkit
[10:55] <seb128> asac, I would use a proxy if we had one such service free somewhere
[10:55] <asac> well. they have switched for two cycles now ;)
[10:56] <vuntz> asac: sure, but they never released tarballs with webkit before. Now they do :-)
[10:56] <asac> ah ok. so there is indeed improvement
[10:56] <asac> when is the next release team meeting?
[10:57] <asac> i want to get all ported before alpha4 cycle so if i know lets say shortly after alpha3 is out that would be good enough i guess
[10:57] <seb128> the question is not really epiphany
[10:57] <vuntz> asac: before end of july
[10:57] <seb128> but rather to know if other desktop components will switch too
[10:57] <asac> though if its like just 20% chance now that we get it i would start anyway
[10:58] <asac> because i have the feeling that the ephy port might be a bit of a beast
[10:58] <asac> seb128: yeah. but the other stuff is most likely easy to port (and most i already did)
[10:58] <seb128> well the question is not to be easy or not
[10:58] <seb128> is to know if we will ship the webkit versions
[10:59] <seb128> I'm not going to ship code not flagged as ready by GNOME
[10:59] <asac> then gnome should also review the state of their gecko epiphany
[10:59] <asac> :)
[11:00] <seb128> how is that revelant?
[11:00] <asac> seb128: well. if they say that they dont go for webkit it practically means they have no browser for distros that want to do xul 1.9.1
[11:00] <seb128> well, as said I don't really care about epiphany we have epiphany-webkit
[11:00] <asac> imo that should be considered when deciding whether or not to allow webkit
[11:01] <asac> ok
[11:01] <seb128> that's rather other desktop components
[11:01] <seb128> ie what we ship on the CD
[11:01] <seb128> the issue with webkit is not to accept it, is to make sure that the webkit version has no major issue, they are blocking on webkit not be accessible right now for example
[11:04] <seb128> vuntz, gnome-panel doesn't seem to pick some changes or that's gnome-menus ... did you drop the command line gmenu test tool?
[11:05] <asac> fyi, people.ubuntu.com gets now redirected to people.canonical.com for me ;)
[11:06] <seb128> asac, for me too
[11:06] <vuntz> seb128: it's not installed anymore. Still in git
[11:06] <asac> so seems people.ubuntu.com is getting closer to become open to community ... which is great!
[11:06] <seb128> vuntz, when I hide or unhide gnomecc.desktop the panel doesn't pick the change dynamically
[11:07] <vuntz> seb128: and it works in my jhbuild
[11:07] <seb128> hum ok
[11:08]  * seb128 stop bothering about gnome-menus
[11:08] <vuntz> is there any weird patch for gnome-menus that you use? :-)
[11:08] <seb128> vuntz, fix alt-f2 not working ;-)
[11:09] <lool> vuntz: Hmm that broke recently for me as well; not sure whether it's related, but I installed a wine app a couple of weeks ago and got it in the menu immediately (new top level menu) but after installing another app last week I had to killall gnome-panel to see it
[11:10] <seb128> vuntz, no weird patch in karmic no
[11:17] <vuntz> seb128: I have no idea why it stopped working. I assume it's broken in compiz too?
[11:17] <seb128> vuntz, yes
[11:17] <seb128> I'm using compiz
[11:19] <vuntz> lool: was it for a new app in this new top level menu?
[11:19] <lool> vuntz: it was for a new app below this top level menu, actually a new submenu
[11:20] <lool> (Wine > Programmes > Game X, Game Y etc.)
[11:20] <vuntz> that could be a bug, yes. Can you file it?
[11:22] <pitti> bryce: do you know whether the kernel team plans another kernel upload by alpha 3, which could pull drm-intel-next?
[11:23] <pitti> bryce: (I guess you'll update the userspace bits by next Tuesday, so that a3 ships with the lastest intel drivers?)
[11:24] <lool> vuntz: GNOME #588859
[11:28] <vuntz> lool: thanks
[11:32] <bryce> pitti, no clue, I've probably got less insight into kernel team plans than you do
[11:33] <pitti> bryce: ok, just wanted to know whether you already happened to hear about that; I'm happy to talk to them about it
[11:33] <bryce> and yes, I plan to either get 2.8.0 in for A3 or if that's not released by then, at least an updated git snapshot
[11:33] <pitti> bryce: the stuff needs to be in by next Tuesday for a3
[11:33] <bryce> yep, I know
[11:34] <bryce> pitti, 2.8.0 is scheduled for "Monday or Tuesday"
[11:34] <pitti> hah, nice timing
[11:37] <bryce> yeah :-/
[11:37]  * bryce keeps fingers crossed, and goes to bed.
[11:49] <Ampelbein> hi there. I could need some help with updating gnome-nettool to 2.27.4 . I can't get the Launchpad-Integration to work, no Menu items are added to the "help"-menu. https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~amoog/gnome-nettool/packaging2.27.4 is my current progress. I also tried adding a name to the "help1" menu, but had no luck either.
[12:06] <SteveA> hi
[12:06] <SteveA> I just upgraded from jaunty to karmic dev release
[12:07] <SteveA> I'm logged into my gnome desktop.  alt+tab, the shortcut for expose, and switching desktops using the keyboard, isn't working
[12:07] <SteveA> I can switch desktops using a mouse click
[12:07] <SteveA> desktop effects are set to "normal", and animations etc. are working
[12:08] <SteveA> alt+space to activate the window menu also does nothing
[12:08] <SteveA> XF86AudioMute does work
[12:09] <SteveA> seb128: hi, any ideas?
[12:09] <SteveA> ctrl+alt+L works to lock the screen
[12:09] <seb128> SteveA, hey, seems compiz is bugged, try asking mvo
[12:09] <mvo> ha! I knew this answer ;)
[12:09] <SteveA> hi mvo!
[12:10] <mvo> hey SteveA
[12:11] <mvo> SteveA: what is the output of "gconftool -g /apps/compiz/general/allscreens/options/active_plugins" ?
[12:11] <SteveA> steve@blixa:~$ gconftool -g /apps/compiz/general/allscreens/options/active_plugins
[12:11] <SteveA> [core,ccp,dbus,place,mousepoll,gnomecompat,move,resize,decoration,png,svg,imgjpeg,text,neg,video,wall,snap,animation,scale,scaleaddon,expo,staticswitcher,regex,resizeinfo,workarounds,ezoom,vpswitch,extrawm,fade,session]
[12:12] <pitti> (just for the record, all of that works here)
[12:13] <SteveA> hmm... is there some way I can reset it to defaults?
[12:14] <pitti> there is
[12:14] <pitti> gconftool --recursive-unset /apps/compiz/general/allscreens/options/
[12:14] <pitti> but before you do that, perhaps get a backup of ~/.gconf, so that we can debug it further, if mvo wants to?
[12:14] <SteveA> should I do this, or is there some debugging you want to do?
[12:14] <seb128> gconftool --unset /apps/compiz/general/allscreens/options/active_plugins
[12:16] <seb128> Ampelbein, looking
[12:16] <mvo> SteveA: hm, my initial idea was that gnomecompat might be missing, but that is there
[12:17] <Ampelbein> seb128: thanks. the problem for me comes in the change from libglade to gtkbuilder and I don't really know how to debug this.
[12:17] <SteveA> so, I have made a tar file of .gconf/
[12:17] <mvo> SteveA: what does "gconftool -g /apps/compiz/plugins/staticswitcher/allscreens/options/next_key" have ?
[12:17] <SteveA> and run the command:
[12:17] <SteveA> gconftool --unset /apps/compiz/general/allscreens/options/active_plugins
[12:17] <SteveA> and logged out and back in
[12:18] <SteveA> alt+tab + shifting desktops with the keyboard still does not work
[12:18] <SteveA> steve@blixa:~$ gconftool -g /apps/compiz/plugins/staticswitcher/allscreens/options/next_key
Tab
[12:18] <seb128> Ampelbein, your ui path is obviously wrong
[12:18] <seb128> Ampelbein, there is no "menubar1" in the source
[12:19] <seb128> ups, grepping in the wrong directory
[12:19] <Ampelbein> seb128: huh?
[12:19] <seb128> what is the issue exactly?
[12:19] <mvo> SteveA: if you have a backup of .gconf you can run "gconftool --recursive-unset /apps/compiz/"
[12:20] <Ampelbein> seb128: the menu items do not get added to the help menu
[12:20] <seb128> Ampelbein, have you tried to make the path start with /ui/menubar...?
[12:21] <SteveA> steve@blixa:~$ gconftool --recursive-unset /apps/compiz/
[12:21] <SteveA> Failure during recursive unset of "/apps/compiz/": Bad key or directory name: "/apps/compiz/": Key/directory may not end with a slash '/'
[12:21] <seb128> SteveA, gconftool --recursive-unset /apps/compiz
[12:21] <SteveA> ok
[12:22] <SteveA> done that.  no output.
[12:22] <seb128> that's normal
[12:22] <seb128> it did reset your config though
[12:22] <seb128> works better now?
[12:22] <SteveA> no change in the working of key combinations
[12:22] <SteveA> do I need to log out first?
[12:22] <seb128> compiz --replace
[12:22] <seb128> Ampelbein, I've to go for lunch by try adding /ui that might be it
[12:23] <Ampelbein> seb128: i'll try that
[12:23] <Ampelbein> seb128: thanks for looking
[12:23] <seb128> you're welcome
[12:23] <SteveA> seb128: done.  screen went crazy for a few seconds.  I now have 2 desktops rather than 6.  alt tab still does nothing.
[12:23] <seb128> lunch bbl
[12:23] <SteveA> I'll go for lunch too... meanwhile, I'll try a new user account
[12:24] <mvo> SteveA: that is a bit mysterious, try the guest account
[12:24] <SteveA> to see if it's a user config issue or a global issue
[12:24]  * mvo nods
[12:24] <seb128> mvo, no guest account in karmic
[12:24] <mvo> wasn't that a gdm2 feature?
[12:24] <pitti> I need to look into that
[12:25] <pitti> but you can create a fresh user, test with that, and remove it again afterwards
[12:25] <pitti> right, what SteveA said
[12:25] <SteveA> using a different account works
[12:25] <SteveA> so, it's something in the 'steve' user's configuration
[12:27] <pitti> SteveA: as a first bisecting, I'd switch off desktop effects and try again
[12:28] <pitti> if it's still there, I suspect gnome-settings-daemon; if that fixes it, probably compiz
[12:28] <SteveA> with no desktop effects, alt+tab and desktop switcing work
[12:29] <SteveA> I'm trying to switch "visual effects" back to "normal"
[12:29] <SteveA> but I have a pop-up with a message "searching for available drivers..."
[12:29] <SteveA> and a progress bar that is sweeping like a cylon and reading 0%
[12:29] <pitti> yeah, that will take some seconds
[12:29] <pitti> (known wart)
[12:30] <SteveA> it's been 2 minutes already
[12:30] <pitti> oh, that's not good then .. perhaps you could mail /var/log/jockey.log to me then?
[12:31] <SteveA> pitti: it's in my home on rookery, jockey.log
[12:31] <SteveA> oh, it's empty
[12:33] <pitti> SteveA: does "ps aux|grep jockey-backend" show a process?
[12:33] <SteveA> yes
[12:33] <pitti> hm, so it got activated, but doesn't do anything
[12:34] <pitti> sudo killall jockey-backend
[12:34] <pitti> sudo /usr/share/jockey/jockey-backend --debug
[12:34] <pitti> and in another terminal,
[12:34] <pitti> jockey-gtk --list
[12:34] <pitti> that should cause some debug stuff to appear from jockey-backend?
[12:35] <SteveA> ok...
[12:35] <SteveA> I have a "Application problem" window
[12:35] <SteveA> telling me jockey-gtk closed unexpectedly
[12:35] <pitti> ah, so it crashed then
[12:35] <SteveA> and
[12:35] <SteveA> steve@blixa:~$ sudo /usr/share/jockey-backend --debug
[12:35] <SteveA> sudo: /usr/share/jockey-backend: command not found
[12:35] <SteveA> oh, I missed a directory
[12:37] <SteveA> ok.  I'm running jockey-backend --debug in one term
[12:37] <SteveA> and jockey-gtk --list in another
[12:37] <SteveA> no output from either
[12:37] <pitti> meh
[12:37] <pitti> so perhaps it crashed again then
[12:37] <SteveA> and no new gtk windows I can see
[12:37] <pitti> no, it's not supposed to spawn one
[12:37] <SteveA> it doesn't respond to ^C in the term
[12:38] <SteveA> I can kill it with 'kill'
[12:38] <pitti> try ^\
[12:38] <SteveA> oh wait
[12:38] <SteveA> after a while, I get a python trackback
[12:38] <SteveA> KeyboardInterrupt
[12:38] <pitti> right, expected
[12:38] <SteveA> in msg_reply_handler from dbus/connection.py
[12:38] <pitti> something seems wrong in the d-bus communication
[12:39] <SteveA> ^\ made it quit and dump core
[12:39] <pitti> SteveA: you have i386 or amd64?
[12:40] <pitti> (amd64 latest karmic here)
[12:40] <pitti> seb128: you are on i386? does jockey currently work for you? or just hang like for StevenK?
[12:40] <pitti> erm, SteveA
[12:40] <SteveA>  /proc/cpuinfo says Intel Core2 CPU 1.20 GH
[12:40] <SteveA> z
[12:40] <pitti> uname -m
[12:40] <SteveA> i686
[12:41] <pitti> ok
[12:41] <pitti> I doubt that it's an i386 specific problem, I guess it's something else, but worth checking
[12:41] <pitti> SteveA: you got an apport crash before? could you please file it?
[12:41] <pitti> perhaps that says something about what went wrong
[12:42] <asac> wasnt there someone claiming today that he needed a restart to get dbus working again?
[12:43] <SteveA> I just tried logging out as me, and in as a different user
[12:44] <SteveA> the user that the alt_tab plus other keys works in
[12:44] <SteveA> desktop effects was working.  I turned them off.
[12:44] <SteveA> I turn them on, and I get the same problem with the progress bar
[12:44] <SteveA> pitti: what apport command should I run?
[12:45] <pitti> SteveA: oh, didn't you say it offered you to file the crash?
[12:45] <pitti> if you cancelled that, either open /var/crash in nautilus and click on the .crash file
[12:45] <pitti> or /usr/share/apport/apport-gtk -c /var/crash/foo.crash
[12:46] <SteveA> pitti: nautilus crashes when I try to open it
[12:46] <pitti> urgh
[12:46] <SteveA> which may be an ubuntu one issue
[12:46] <SteveA> as u1 appears to be broken here
[12:46] <pitti> something is seriously screwed here
[12:46] <SteveA> I'll uninstall that
[12:46] <SteveA> probably old u1 pacakges from jaunty or something
[12:46] <pitti> SteveA: I have the karmic ubuntuone as well, though
[12:47] <pitti> SteveA: oh, the upgrade to karmic should have upgraded those as well?
[12:47] <pitti> clicking on .crash works here
[12:48] <pitti> oh, I lied, I don't have u1 installed right now
[12:49] <pitti> indeed, 0.90.3+r63-0ubuntu1~ppa2~jaunty is >> the karmic version
[12:50] <SteveA> I'm restarting the laptop
[12:50] <SteveA> after I uninstalled ubuntuone packages
[12:50] <SteveA> will /var/crash stay around?
[12:50] <pitti> yes
[12:51] <SteveA> hmm
[12:52] <SteveA> it's taking a long time to restart
[12:52] <SteveA> I see the small ubuntu logo
[12:52] <SteveA> and the red bar under it
[12:52] <SteveA> about 1/10 of it is filled with light
[12:52] <pitti> SteveA: oh, you didn't reboot after upgrading to karmic?
[12:52] <SteveA> I did
[12:52] <SteveA> now I'm rebooting again
[12:52] <SteveA> except it is stuck
[12:52] <pitti> does that behave differently than the first reboot?
[12:52] <SteveA> yes
[12:52] <pitti> usually the first couple of seconds are readahead
[12:52] <SteveA> the first reboot was fine
[12:53] <SteveA> this is minutes now
[12:53] <pitti> SteveA: could you ctrl+alt+f1 and see whether there's messages there?
[12:53] <SteveA> 19+0 records in
[12:53] <pitti> if not, reboot with removing "quiet splash" from the kernel commands, and see where it hangs?
[12:53] <SteveA> 19+0 records out
[12:53] <pitti> hm, dd
[12:53] <SteveA> kinit: name_to_dev_t(.... stuff)
[12:54] <SteveA> kinit: trying to resume from /dev/disk/byuuid/stuff
[12:54] <pitti> all normal so far
[12:54] <SteveA> kinit: no resume image, doing normal boot
[12:54] <SteveA> and now other stuff appeared
[12:54] <SteveA> and it has booted
[12:54] <pitti> init scripts, etc.?
[12:54] <SteveA> it stopped after the last kinit message for a long time
[12:54] <seb128> pitti, sorry was at lunch
[12:54] <seb128> jockey-gtk displays a bouncing bar
[12:55] <seb128> and then an empty dialog
[12:55] <seb128> which I think is normal on my intel laptop config
[12:55] <pitti> seb128: ok, works then
[12:55] <pitti> thanks
[12:55] <seb128> you're welcome
[12:55] <pitti> SteveA: so it took a while to boot, or still stuck?
[12:55] <SteveA> it's now booted, and I logged in as 'steve'
[12:55] <SteveA> I went to the Appearance preferences app
[12:56] <SteveA> and chose "normal" visual effects
[12:56] <SteveA> the "cylon" window bounced for about 30 secs
[12:56] <SteveA> and then I got a dialog saying "Desktop effects could not be enabled [ok]"
[12:56] <pitti> SteveA: which graphics card do you have?
[12:56] <SteveA> which is odd, because I know they work with a fresh user account
[12:56] <seb128> SteveA, we get a lot of nautilus crash due to u1 recently
[12:57] <seb128> SteveA, try again, for some reason it works every second try there
[12:57] <SteveA> 945
[12:57] <SteveA> trying again...
[12:58] <SteveA> no cylon window this time.  just the dialog that effects could not be enabled
[12:58] <seb128> weird
[12:58] <seb128> compiz --replace works?
[12:58] <pitti> SteveA: I think I actually had that once as well
[12:58] <Ampelbein> seb128: still no launchpad-menu items in gnome-nettool. I'll finish the update without lpi and let someone experienced look at this, ok?
[12:58] <pitti> SteveA: seems like a weird bug in control-center/compiz, I worked around it by resetting the gconf key
[12:58] <seb128> Ampelbein, did you commit your changes? I can have a look now
[12:58] <SteveA> compiz --replace runs compiz
[12:59] <SteveA> so I am now running compiz, and getting compositied graphics
[12:59] <seb128> so it's a capplet bug
[12:59] <SteveA> (and my alt_tab key doesn't do anything)
[12:59] <SteveA> I kill compiz with ^C in the term I ran it in
[12:59] <SteveA> and alt+tab works as expected
[13:00] <Ampelbein> seb128: code is at lp:~amoog/gnome-nettool/packaging2.27.4
[13:01] <pitti> seb128, SteveA, mvo: I can reproduce the capplet bug; enabling desktop effects starts compiz, then restarts metacity, and complains about not being able to start compiz
[13:01] <SteveA> pitti: you still want the jockey crash report?
[13:01] <pitti> but this seems entirely separate to your keyboarrd problems
[13:01] <pitti> SteveA: sure
[13:01] <seb128> pitti, yeah, I've been running into it too
[13:02] <seb128> Ampelbein, ok, I've some other things to do now but I will have a look after that and let you updated
[13:02] <Ampelbein> seb128: thanks
[13:03] <mvo> pitti: are you debugging this now or shall I have a look (in some minutes when I'm finished with debugging a vte problem?)
[13:04] <pitti> mvo: no idea about it, I'm afraid :(
[13:04] <SteveA> pitti: jockey bug filed, bug 400638
[13:04] <pitti> seems to be some compiz gconf setting, I guess this needs to be bisected
[13:04] <pitti> SteveA: thanks
[13:05] <mvo> pitti: the capplet bug I mean (not the keyboard one) :)
[13:05] <pitti> mvo: oh; can do
[13:05] <pitti> mvo: (not right now, though, urgent requirement to get some lunch :) )
[13:05] <mvo> heh :)
[13:06] <didrocks> pitti: you only speak about data/**.py, you're not concerned about ui and desktop files which can be in this directory (don't know if it can interfere)?
[13:06] <didrocks> (for bug #399324)
[13:06] <Keybuk> walters: tested that patch when you're around?
[13:07] <pitti> didrocks: so, 2.5 uploaded with that fix
[13:07] <pitti> also to my ppa
[13:07] <pitti> didrocks: hm, *.desktop is an interesting conflict, indeed
[13:07] <pitti> anyway, lunch! now! really!
[13:07] <pitti> bbl
[13:07] <didrocks> pitti: have a good lunch!
[13:07] <pitti> thanks
[13:09] <didrocks> pitti: when you will be back, they will be desktop and .ui file (what do you do on .ui file, btw?). I reckon that you move desktop file ready to install .desktop files in /usr/share/applications/
[13:41] <SteveA> pitti, mvo: http://groups.google.com/group/linux.debian.bugs.dist/browse_thread/thread/0a0215fcd93a797c/856acfb0ef8c3c5c?lnk=raot
[13:44] <SteveA> ok, this is really weird
[13:45] <SteveA> if I hold down MOD4 while doing alt+tab, it works as expected
[13:45] <SteveA> that's the windows key
[13:45] <SteveA> hi seb
[13:45] <mvo> SteveA: oh, that is indeed odd
[13:45] <SteveA> I found something really interesting about this keyboard shortcut problem
[13:45] <SteveA> so, I can do alt+f1, and I just get a control code in my terminal
[13:45] <SteveA> 3P
[13:46] <SteveA> but alt+mod4+f1 opens the applications menu in the panel, as expected
[13:46] <SteveA> how weird is that
[13:46] <SteveA> it's the same problem being reported by the debian user I linked to
[13:48] <seb128> what is the issue now?
[13:48] <seb128> is alt-tab still broken for you?
[13:49] <SteveA> yes, just as described here: http://groups.google.com/group/linux.debian.bugs.dist/browse_thread/thread/0a0215fcd93a797c/856acfb0ef8c3c5c?lnk=raot
[13:49] <SteveA> but, oddly, it works if I hold down the windows key (mod4) also
[13:49] <SteveA> same for a bunch of other shortcuts that involve the alt modifier
[13:59] <SteveA> is there a reasonable way to do a diff of gconf settings?
[13:59] <mvo> SteveA: do you have anything in your keyboard layout options that might looks odd?
[14:00] <mvo> gnome-keyboard-preferences
[14:00] <mvo> layouts/layout options
[14:00] <pitti> SteveA: "gconftool -R /" is a complete, diff'able dump
[14:02] <SteveA> mvo: my keyboard layout is a standard USA
[14:02] <SteveA> hmm
[14:02] <SteveA> alt is mapped to right win...
[14:03] <SteveA> I reset the keyboard layout options to the defaults
[14:03] <SteveA> and now I can't use the workaround I found of holding down the windows key as well as Alt
[14:04] <SteveA> the only setting that allows this workaround is "Alt is mapped to Right Win, Super to Menu"
[14:09] <pitti> didrocks: right now, data/*.ui is shipped literally, in /usr/share/<project> (i. e. "data" is stronger than "*.ui")
[14:09] <pitti> didrocks: so that part should work for you
[14:09] <pitti> didrocks: I'm actually not entirely sure what happens with data/*.desktop.in
[14:09] <seb128> hey tedg
[14:09] <tedg> Morning seb128
[14:12] <pitti> didrocks: however, I just noticed that the lastest update fixed the test suite's test case, but not actually the quickly tree; reiterating then
[14:12] <pitti> hey tedg, how's things?
[14:13] <tedg> pitti: Going okay.  I had set a bazaar command to run most of yesterday and through the night, to have it fail this morning :(
[14:14] <didrocks> pitti: oh? strange. The update you've done seems fine (I just gave a look at your bzr branch). so, as an extra bonus and if you have some time, you can try to add a dummy .desktop file in data/templates/ubuntu-project/ :)
[14:15] <didrocks> pitti: out of curiousity, what do you do for .ui for file which are not in data/ directory?
[14:16] <pitti> didrocks: just install into /usr/share/<project>/
[14:16] <pitti> right, I should document that in the docstring, thanks
[14:17] <pitti> didrocks: well, for gtkbuilder, anyway (Qt *.ui files need special treatment and compiling)
[14:18] <didrocks> pitti: oh ok, no special treatment added for ui file using gtkbuilder. distutils just makes something for Qt *.ui files
[14:20] <pitti> didrocks: so gtk/foo.ui and data/foo.ui are actually identical :)
[14:21] <didrocks> understood :)
[14:22] <didrocks> but yes, documentation on what is done on each type of file can be great :)
[14:26] <seb128> rickspencer3, hey
[14:26] <rickspencer3> hi seb128
[14:27] <rickspencer3> boy, is my computer in a world of hurt
[14:27] <seb128> oh?
[14:27] <rickspencer3> after upgrading last night, gnome-panel is totally busted :/
[14:27] <rickspencer3> I can
[14:27] <rickspencer3> 't run apps or anything
[14:27]  * rickspencer3 tries upgrading again
[14:27] <seb128> or anything?
[14:27] <seb128> ie the menu is broken?
[14:28] <rickspencer3> right
[14:28] <rickspencer3> I can't click on anything in the panel, can't create a launcher on the desktop
[14:28] <seb128> empty? or running applications doesn't work?
[14:28] <seb128> weird
[14:29] <rickspencer3> well, the icons display, but I can't click on them
[14:29] <rickspencer3> when I switch to VT1 and back to VT7, the icons don
[14:29] <rickspencer3> t repain
[14:29] <rickspencer3> t
[14:29] <rickspencer3> *sigh* had to type on this little keyboard
[14:30] <rickspencer3> fortunately, I've been using U1, so it won
[14:30] <rickspencer3> t be hard to just reinstall if I need to
[14:32] <SteveA> seb128: ok, here's something really weird
[14:32] <seb128> weird, do you get the same issue with an another user?
[14:32] <SteveA> seb128: when I make alt-tab work to switch windows, using alt+win+tab...
[14:32] <SteveA> seb128: I actually see two slightly different window switching effects overlayed
[14:33] <SteveA> it's like there are two window-switching plugins competing to use alt-tab
[14:33] <seb128> mvo, ^ any idea?
[14:34] <mvo> yeah, the win+alt-tab is bound to one of the fancier switchers by default
[14:35] <SteveA> I have two windows open.  one of the overlaid switchers displays a selector 2 windows wide
[14:35] <SteveA> the other 3 windows wide
[14:35] <SteveA> both run at the same time when I do win+alt-tab
[14:36] <mvo> hm, no - at least not on my system
[14:36] <rickspencer3> seb128: yes, the issue effects other users as well
[14:36] <rickspencer3> perhaps I should reinstall gnome-panel?
[14:36] <seb128> SteveA, seems you have some weird keyboard config for your user, not sure where
[14:37] <seb128> rickspencer3, I doubt it's gnome-panel if you get the issue on the background too
[14:37] <seb128> rickspencer3, and reinstalling usually don't make any difference under linux, I doubt you have a file corruption leading to that
[14:37] <rickspencer3> seb128: well, the background works, in that I can browse my external HD which shows up there
[14:38] <seb128> "can't create a launcher on the desktop"
[14:38] <seb128> what happen when you try?
[14:38] <rickspencer3> seb128: well, sometimes I find that reinstalling fixes configuration problems that I've created by installing ppas and such
[14:38] <rickspencer3> when I try to create a launcher, there is simply no system response
[14:38] <seb128> rickspencer3, packages don't touch user configuration, and I doubt you got a gnome-panel ppa version
[14:38] <rickspencer3> true
[14:38] <seb128> rickspencer3, can you open a command line?
[14:38] <pitti> rickspencer3: hey
[14:39] <rickspencer3> seb128: I can use VT1, if that's what you mea
[14:39] <rickspencer3> n
[14:39] <pitti> rickspencer3: could it be that you caught the latest consolekit without the latest gnome-session? I had symptoms like that
[14:39] <seb128> pitti, why would that lead to a broken gnome-panel? (just being curious)
[14:40] <pitti> seb128: I don't know, the broken gnome-session broke pretty much everything
[14:40] <pitti> including the panel
[14:40] <seb128> rickspencer3, try dist-upgrading again to make sure you are  uptodate
[14:40] <pitti> probably the processes hung on trying to register to the session or whathnot
[14:40] <seb128> pitti, yeah, could be
[14:40] <rickspencer3> pitti: would I be able to tell from the version numbers?
[14:41] <pitti> rickspencer3: 2.26.2-x was broken until 2.26.2-1ubuntu3
[14:41] <rickspencer3> so for gnome session I have 2.26.1-1ubuntu2
[14:41] <pitti> that's the broken one
[14:42] <pitti> ubuntu3 should fix everything
[14:42] <rickspencer3> tasty
[14:42] <pitti> I just wonder how you ended up with the new consolekit and the old gnome-session
[14:42] <pitti> since CK was uploaded 12 hours after gnome-session
[14:42] <rickspencer3> for console kit I have 0.3.0-2ubuntu6
[14:42] <pitti> right, that's the latest one
[14:43] <rickspencer3> they only thing I'm doing that is odd is running grub 2
[14:43] <pitti> so, dist-upgrade and restart, that shold do it
[14:43] <seb128> rickspencer3, you might also be using an odd mirror ;-)
[14:43]  * rickspencer3 distipgrades
[14:43] <rickspencer3> I didn't think to dist-upgrade
[14:43] <pitti> rickspencer3: oh, FYI, I'm going to manage alpha-3 next week, since both Steve and Colin are at debconf
[14:43] <rickspencer3> :/
[14:43] <rickspencer3> pitti: thanks, that means I can push all my pet projects in at the last minute, right?
[14:44] <seb128> pitti, gnome-session should probably have a versionned depends too?
[14:44] <pitti> rickspencer3: if you have some "convincing" arguments :)
[14:44] <pitti> seb128: well, it breaks with a specific CK version, and it's due to a bug in a specific gnome-session version
[14:44] <pitti> combinations with older versions work as wel
[14:44] <seb128> ok
[14:45] <pitti> so I considered it just a bug in 1ubuntu1 and 1ubuntu2
[14:45] <pitti> (which it is, really)
[14:45] <seb128> yeah, transitional bugs during karmic course are ok
[14:45] <rickspencer3> anyway, only users of the unstable development release have any chance of seeing this issue
[14:45] <seb128> the gnome-menus merge mistake was the same
[14:45] <rickspencer3> and most of them are probably smarter than me, and will try a dist-upgrade
[14:45] <rickspencer3> ;)
[14:45] <pitti> seb128: I wouldn't like to add 100 Breaks: for those transitional things, they'd clutter the dependencies a lot
[14:46] <seb128> pitti, right, if that doesn't bit jaunty upgrades no need
[14:46] <pitti> rickspencer3: welcome to karmic :)
[14:46] <seb128> bite
[14:46] <pitti> right
[14:46] <pitti> rickspencer3: at least you can now sleep again, seeing that karmic actually changes instead of just keeping working eternally :-P
[14:46] <rickspencer3> lol
[14:47] <rickspencer3> honestly, that's what I was thinking last night
[14:47] <pitti> didrocks: oh, I see the flaw
[14:48] <didrocks> pitti: nice \o/ Seems I will have a working distutils-extra this week-end to play with it :)
[14:49] <pitti> didrocks: this time I'll really check it with your branch, promised
[14:49] <pitti> didrocks: hah, reproduced it in my test suite now
[14:49] <pitti> I only guarded against modules, not packages
[14:50] <seb128> can somebody with a license clue tell me what license is http://paste.ubuntu.com/220535/ so I can write the copyright correctly? ;-)
[14:50] <seb128> and what license text I need in the tarball
[14:50] <didrocks> pitti: thanks for testing with my branch ;)
[14:50] <pitti> seb128: looks BSDish
[14:51] <pitti> seb128: ah, it's MIT
[14:51] <pitti> seb128: http://www.opensource.org/licenses/mit-license.php
[14:51] <pitti> seb128: but, like BSD, just copy the entire thing, it's short enough
[14:51] <rickspencer3> pitti: seb128: fyi dist-upgrade of course fixed it
[14:52] <pitti> rickspencer3: *phew*
[14:52] <seb128> rickspencer3, ;-)
[14:52] <pitti> so, no Friday-midnight working to fix the boss' machine
[14:52] <seb128> pitti, and do I need to GPL, LGPL or anything for the exceptions?
[14:52] <rickspencer3> lol
[14:52] <rickspencer3> like I would do that
[14:52] <rickspencer3> :/
[14:52] <pitti> seb128: exceptions?
[14:52] <seb128> pitti, the
[14:53] <seb128> "The following files contain code from Mozilla which
[14:53] <seb128> is triple licensed under MPL1.1/LGPLv2+/GPLv2+:
[14:53] <seb128> The console module (modules/console.c)
[14:53] <seb128> Stack printer (gjs/stack.c)"
[14:53] <seb128> pitti, at the bottom
[14:53] <seb128> pitti, of the COPYING
[14:53] <pitti> seb128: IMHO, pointing to LGPL (as the most permissive of those) should be eonugh
[14:54] <seb128> pitti, which means I need a LGPL copy in the source?
[14:54] <pitti> seb128: well, any of MPL/GPL/LGPL, yes
[14:54] <seb128> ok thanks
[14:54] <seb128> hum
[14:54] <seb128> though upstream let the license choice
[14:55] <seb128> so should they be shipped one of those in the tarball?
[14:55] <seb128> all of those?
[14:55] <seb128> should we ship one in the diff.gz?
[14:55] <seb128> sorry about the questions, but licensing is not really my thing ...
[14:55] <pitti> no, needs to be in orig.tar.gz
[14:55] <seb128> which one?
[14:55] <seb128> upstream let the choice, they should distribute one, all?
[14:55] <pitti> if I were to source NEW this, I'd require that any is in the orig.tar.gz; don't particuarly care which one
[14:56] <pitti> they should distribute at least one IMHO
[14:56] <seb128> ok, I will contact them about that, thanks
[14:56] <pitti> you can repack the orig.tar.gz to add one, and file a bug upstream
[14:56] <pitti> (not necessary to block on it)
[14:56] <seb128> right
[14:56] <seb128> will do that
[14:56] <mac_v> pitti> hi... you have marked this bug 395299 as a wishlist , will it be done by karmic?
[14:57] <mac_v> or expected to be done?
[14:57] <seb128> mac_v, see the blueprint associated to the bug
[14:57] <seb128> mac_v, ie most recent comment
[14:57]  * mac_v looks
[14:57] <pitti> mac_v: yes, very likely
[14:58] <SteveA> ok, I have disabled switch_windows under metacity/global_keybindings in gconf-editor, and I have just one window switcher running now
[14:58] <mac_v> \o/
[14:58] <SteveA> it's still using the wrong keys though
[14:58] <seb128> mac_v, upstream doesn't want a gdmsetup though
[14:58] <seb128> mac_v, what option do you miss out of autologin?
[14:59] <pitti> "about me" is quite a strange place for it, but if they want that, and no gdmsetup, *shrug*, WFM
[14:59] <seb128> pitti, I don't think they specialled argued it should be there, but do you have a better suggestion?
[15:00] <pitti> well, personally I'd prefer something in gdm itself
[15:00] <pitti> like, in the greeter
[15:00] <seb128> I would like suggestion from the design team there
[15:05] <mac_v> seb128> i miss the autologin itself , not sure if this is related, the FUSA has been replaced by User-switch-Applet , i had asked earlier and was told this switch was due to the gdm ..
[15:05] <mac_v> IMO FUSA is better
[15:05] <pitti> didrocks: ok, works beautifully with your tree now
[15:07] <mac_v> seb128> also not having an auto login almost spoils the karmic's fast boot work
[15:07] <seb128> sorry got to restart my session
[15:07] <seb128> mac_v, autologin is really orthogonal to boot speed
[15:07] <seb128> mac_v, it's the speed to reach gdm and the speed from gdm to desktop
[15:08] <mac_v> yeah...thats y i said "almost"
[15:08] <pitti> didrocks: so, data/foo.desktop is similar, "data/" wins over ".desktop"
[15:08] <pitti> didrocks: erm, .desktop.in I mean
[15:08] <seb128> mac_v, well that's not the right argumentation way to convince people
[15:08] <pitti> (*.desktop is not magic at all)
[15:08] <seb128> mac_v, anyway, what option do you need out of autologin?
[15:08] <mac_v> seb128> since in 9.04 there is no wait , now we have to wait, that small wait negates the good work done
[15:08] <mac_v>  i miss the autologin itself , not sure if this is related, the FUSA has been replaced by User-switch-Applet , i had asked earlier and was told this switch was due to the gdm ..
[15:09] <seb128> mac_v, autologin is still there, it's kept on upgrade and an option on new installs
[15:09] <didrocks> pitti: perfect. What do you normally do to .destkop.in (for those which are not in data/), for the record?
[15:09] <seb128> mac_v, tedg is working on updating fusa
[15:10] <mac_v> seb128> oh....ok. didnt realize that.
[15:10] <pitti> didrocks: run intltool-merge to merge translations from po/, and install into /usr/share/applications, or /usr/share/autostart if "autostart" is anywhere in the path
[15:10] <didrocks> pitti: oh nice :)
[15:11] <didrocks> pitti: can you put the new version it in your jaunty ppa, please?
[15:11] <seb128> mac_v, anyway the question about options stand ;-) upstream wants to integrate auto-login and background selection in GNOME
[15:11] <pitti> didrocks: will do, sure
[15:11]  * didrocks hugs pitti 
[15:11] <SteveA> seb128: fixed the weird alt behaviour
[15:11] <pitti> didrocks: still adding documentatino
[15:11] <seb128> mac_v, I'm wondering if there is other option users need
[15:11] <seb128> SteveA, how?
[15:11] <pitti> didrocks: if you are eager to try, get lp:~python-distutils-extra-hackers/python-distutils-extra/debian, debuild -us -uc -b, install, and go
[15:12] <SteveA> seb128: I had to disable the keyboard layout option for "alt is mapped to right win, super to menu", and return that "alt/win key behaviour" to "default"
[15:12] <didrocks> pitti: I'm at my company on a windows desktop right now. But I will do it in a few hours, at home :)
[15:12] <SteveA> seb128: then I had to log out and log back in before it would fix the alt-tab (and alt-other things) behaviour
[15:12] <seb128> SteveA, ok, seems an xorg keyboard issue
[15:13] <SteveA> I could reproduce the problem by logging into a fresh user, and establishing that with compiz running, alt-tab works fine
[15:13] <SteveA> seb128: then, selecting that keyboard layout option, and finding that alt-tab no longer works, but alt+win-tab works
[15:13] <pitti> didrocks: ah, it'll be on the mirrors by then
[15:13] <SteveA> seb128: then, setting it back to "default" makes alt-tab work again
[15:13] <pitti> didrocks: you shuold bump the auto requirement to >= 2.6
[15:14] <didrocks> pitti: yes, will do.
[15:17] <mac_v> seb128> almost forgot... the graphical session selection thats something a lot of users will miss
[15:18] <pitti> seb128: hm, is it just me, or did the gpg agent broke today?
[15:18] <seb128> mac_v, it's there on the login screen
[15:18] <seb128> pitti, wfm but I didn't upgrade since lunch
[15:18] <pitti> already in the morning
[15:18] <pitti> nevermind for now
[15:18] <seb128> pitti, but I'm using seahorse-plugins not gpg-agent
[15:18] <pitti> so do I
[15:18] <pitti> that's what I mean
[15:18] <pitti> ssh works fine
[15:18] <mac_v> i dont see it now...
[15:18] <seb128> ssh is gnome-keyring
[15:18] <seb128> mac_v, you probably don't have several session available
[15:19] <seb128> mac_v, ls /usr/share/xsessions
[15:19] <mac_v> previously the fail safe  was always available, that helped
[15:20] <seb128> mac_v, are you running the current gdm from today?
[15:20] <seb128> mac_v, that has been fixed in the version pitti uploaded today
[15:20] <SteveA> so, I switched to karmic today.  I don't like how my full name is advertised in bold letters top-right to anyone looking over my shoulder.
[15:20] <SteveA> is there a way to turn that off, but still get the functionality of that part of the panel?
[15:21] <pitti> SteveA: our previous fusa applet is being ported to new gdm
[15:21] <mac_v> seb128> ah... updated yesterday... will check again after today's update...
[15:21] <pitti> SteveA: so that should get fixed eventually
[15:21] <mac_v> thanx
[15:25] <pitti> didrocks: ok, 2.6 released to sid, karmic, jaunty PPA, and upstream; have fun
[15:26] <didrocks> thanks pitti \o/
[15:29] <seb128> gjs upload to universe now, let's see if it gets accepted ;-)
[15:38] <seb128> lool, do you remember why you added use-default-python-path to gnome-menus?
[15:38] <seb128> lool, there is no bug reference in the changelog and the issue is not clear to me
[15:38] <dobey> pitti, seb128: if i want to push an upgrade for a package in karmic, do i just upload to revu again?
[15:38] <seb128> dobey, no, open a bug and subscribe the sponsor team to it
[15:39] <seb128> ubuntu-universe-sponsors if that's an universe package
[15:39] <dobey> they are main packages
[15:39] <seb128> and add the debdiff or the tarball and diff.gz if that's a new version
[15:39] <pitti> dobey: are you using bzr nowadays? (that speeds up sponsoring a lot)
[15:39] <seb128> ubuntu-main-sponsors then
[15:39] <dobey> pitti: yeah
[15:40] <SteveA> seb128: should I report this weird alt-key behaviour somewhere?
[15:40] <seb128> SteveA, yes, that's a bug, I doubt anybody will look at it though, we don't have keyboard issue experts
[15:41] <seb128> the gnome capplet only set xorg issue
[15:41] <seb128> if you open a bug do it on xkeyboard-config
[15:41] <SteveA> at least others will be able to find the issue in launchpad there
[15:41] <SteveA> and thus on google
[15:41] <pitti> (or report it upstream directly)
[15:42] <SteveA> steve@blixa:~$ ubuntu-bug xkeyboard-config
[15:42] <SteveA> says xkeyboard-config does not exist
[15:45] <seb128> pitti, apport doesn't take source package names?
[15:45] <pitti> seb128: you mean xkb-data?
[15:45] <seb128> SteveA, xkb-data is the binary
[15:45] <pitti> seb128: no, binary packages
[15:45] <seb128> pitti, ok, I though that both were working
[15:46] <pitti> seb128: well, source packages don't get installed, so you can't get their version, check package consistency, conffiles, binary-package hooks, etc.
[15:47] <seb128> pitti, indeed, fair enough
[15:47] <seb128> I usually use the source when I know the issue is in the source and not a binary one
[15:48] <seb128> but better to get infos about depends etc anyway
[15:54] <rickspencer3_> seb128: any thoughts regarding why an audio cd is not showing up on my desktop?
[15:54] <seb128> rickspencer3_, is it listed in the computer view or gvfs-mount -li?
[15:55] <rickspencer3_> yikes
[15:55] <rickspencer3_> computer view makes nautilus crash!
[15:55] <rickspencer3_> Places -> Computer = nautilus crash
[15:56] <seb128> I bet it's another of those nautilus crashes due to ubuntuone-client
[15:56] <seb128> can you remove it and see if nautilus still crash?
[15:56] <seb128> it seems to turn nautilus in crash land, 80% of the crashes we get on nautilus are due to it
[15:56] <rickspencer3_> you mean apt-get remove?
[15:56] <seb128> yes, or mv the .so on the side
[15:56] <seb128> dpkg -L ubuntuone-client | grep nautilus
[15:57] <rickspencer3_> nothing
[15:57] <seb128> rickspencer3_, dpkg -S ubuntuone | grep nautil?
[15:58] <rickspencer3_> well ... I just apt-get removed it
[15:58] <seb128> ok
[15:58]  * rickspencer3_ logs out
[15:58] <seb128> rickspencer3_, no need, just restart nautilus
[15:59]  * seb128 teaches nautilus --quit to rickspencer3_
[16:00] <dobey> pitti: so now that we have source package branches, what should we do with them exactly?
[16:00] <rickspencer3_> seb128: well .. I had already "restarted" nautilus by crashing it again
[16:00] <seb128> rickspencer3_, still crashing?
[16:00] <rickspencer3_> so thought to log out/log in to make sure something else wasn't still running
[16:00] <rickspencer3_> nope
[16:00] <seb128> ok
[16:00] <seb128> I would tend to say it's the same bug we get crash duplicates every day about
[16:01] <rickspencer3_> but my dvd drive is now called "Generic Multi Card" ;)
[16:01] <dobey> seb128: it is
[16:01] <seb128> rickspencer3_, iz pitti bog
[16:01] <seb128> ;-)
[16:01] <seb128> rickspencer3_, devkit-disks --show-info <device>
[16:02] <seb128> it's probably listed somewhere there
[16:02] <dobey> seb128: i made a tarball release yesterday. we could get it uploaded to karmic today if possible, or we can wait for the 0.91.0 release I'll do on Tuesday if you prefer
[16:03] <pitti> seb128, rickspencer3_: ubuntuone-client-gnome has the nautilus extension
[16:03] <seb128> dobey, I don't know how stable the versions are, what are the changes, etc
[16:03] <pitti> dobey: for now they are pretty much "read only", I don't think it's clear what to do with them commit-wise yet (james_w would know better)
[16:04] <seb128> dobey, so basically it's your call
[16:04] <james_w> you can push to ~dobey/ubuntu/karmic/ubuntuone-*/branch-name at your will
[16:04] <dobey> seb128: well, 0.90.4 is pretty stable. and it would solve the nautilus crash, and stop all the dups from rolling in :)
[16:04] <james_w> we're working on code so that the sponsor can merge that to the official branches
[16:05] <Laney> seb128: what do you want to do about tomboy now?
[16:05] <dobey> james_w: we have them under ~ubuntuone-control-tower/ubuntu/karmic/ubuntuone-*/karmic and i've been managing the packaging in them
[16:05] <james_w> that's perfect
[16:06] <james_w> you can "propose merge" from those branches to the official branches if you like
[16:06] <dobey> seb128: but if it will take until tuesday to get uploaded, we might as well just wait for 0.91.0
[16:07] <james_w> but until this job is finished it will claim that it is merging too much
[16:07] <seb128> Laney, let pitti and jcastro argue and go back to what lool was working on, ie backport the change
[16:07] <james_w> so I'd wait for a little while until we've closed the loop
[16:07] <lool> Hmm?
[16:07] <Laney> ok
[16:07] <pitti> Laney: why not just backport the fix? seems easy enough?
[16:07] <dobey> james_w: hrmm. well, these aren't branches off the "official" branches... so i'm not sure how that would work
[16:08] <Laney> pitti: That's what we did but apparently jcastro had some agreement with upstream
[16:08] <Laney> I don't know the details
[16:08] <lool> seb128:     - New patch, 21_default-python-in-shebang, fixes shebang of
[16:08] <lool>       gmenu-simple-editor to use the default Python version.
[16:08] <seb128> lool, not this one
[16:08] <lool> seb128: I guess it was using python2.x explicitely instead of "python"
[16:08] <lool> Oh
[16:08] <james_w> dobey: we might be able to make them official, depending on whether they are suitable in terms of layout and history
[16:08] <pitti> Laney: well, so I heard, but it still doesn't fit SRU criteria
[16:08] <Laney> sure
[16:08] <seb128> jcastro, ^
[16:08] <Laney> just did what I was asked
[16:08] <mac_v> seb128> yup.. sessions are fixed ... thanx pitti
[16:08] <seb128> jcastro, no tomboy stable update for you
[16:08] <james_w> dobey: I'll try and remember to discuss that with you once we are ready to go
[16:09] <pochu> lool: http://svn.debian.org/viewsvn/pkg-gnome?view=rev&revision=6753
[16:09] <dobey> james_w: any idea when that will be?
[16:09] <james_w> dobey: we're waiting on LP
[16:09] <james_w> "soon"
[16:10] <lool> That goes a long way back
[16:10] <lool> I guess I heard about it via email or in another bug report
[16:10] <dobey> james_w: waiting for a feature, or waiting for it to finish processing something?
[16:10] <seb128> lool, right, it's one of those patches we carry for ages and I would like to get cleaned or upstreamed
[16:10] <james_w> dobey: a feature
[16:10] <dobey> ah ok
[16:10] <seb128> lool, I just don't understand what issue it solve to upstream it
[16:12] <jcastro> seb128: that sucks, but we'll live.
[16:12] <seb128> we have an issue that we have no solution to deal with stable upstream updates right now
[16:12] <seb128> not sure how to deal with that though
[16:13] <jcastro> seb128: sprint discussion maybe?
[16:13] <seb128> yes, we can try discussing it again
[16:13] <seb128> but I doubt we will agree on anything
[16:13] <lool> seb128: I found messages exchanged with piman back then, but not about this patch; still digging
[16:13] <seb128> lool, thanks!
[16:13] <Laney> seb128, jcastro: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates/MicroReleaseExceptions ?
[16:15] <lool> seb128: Couldn't find anything, even on his blog; might have been a request on IRC or an allusion on a mailing list hmpf
[16:15] <Laney> pitti: for this particular case, lool already put a debdiff on the bug
[16:15] <Laney> don't know if you saw
[16:16] <pitti> ah, I didn't
[16:16] <pitti> sponsors is sub'ed, so we'll get to it then
[16:17]  * Laney fixes status
[16:17] <Laney> thanks
[16:20] <lool> seb128: So I couldn't find the original discussion; I didn't have IRC logs back then, so it might be the reason
[16:20] <lool> seb128: I suspect it had to do with either running it with a custom python
[16:20] <lool> Or with a python build issue
[16:20] <lool> Since this is about the time the pycentral stuff was added, I'd opt for the later
[16:21] <lool> I wonder whether pycentral used a special path at some point
[16:21] <seb128> lool, ok, thanks for trying to figure the reason
[16:21] <lool> seb128: So since the package moved to support, let's kill the patch and see if anything breaks
[16:21] <lool> IMO it's not needed anymore
[16:21] <seb128> lool, do we think we should try to comment it and see what happens?
[16:21] <seb128> ok good
[16:21] <seb128> thanks!
[16:22] <lool> That said I also think that upstreams shouldn't add such snippets
[16:22] <lool> People should just set PYTHONPATH
[16:24] <seb128> ok
[16:35] <seb128> pitti, audio CD are not detected in karmic, do you know if that's a devkit bug?
[16:37] <pitti> seb128: ah, can reproduce
[16:37] <pitti> seb128: nautilus crashed again, argh
[16:37] <seb128> pitti, using ubuntuone?
[16:37] <pitti> yes
[16:38] <seb128> uninstall it
[16:38] <seb128> and nautilus will be stable
[16:38] <pitti> can we get this fixed for alpha-3?
[16:38]  * pitti looks at dobey
[16:38] <seb128> $ devkit-disks --show-info /dev/sr0 | grep audio
[16:38] <seb128> $
[16:38] <seb128> not sure what should be listed
[16:38] <seb128> but I assume it's a devkit issue
[16:38] <seb128> gvfs doesn't list any drive or media
[16:39] <pitti> I'm not either; not sure whether it's gvfs or DK, but I can take a look
[16:39] <pitti> (sorry, release meeting right now)
[16:39] <seb128> tools/devkit-disks.c:                g_print ("    num audio tracks:      %d\n", props->optical_disc_num_audio_tracks);
[16:39] <pitti> could someone please file a bug and assign to me, as a reminder?
[16:40] <seb128> it seems devicekit disks should display track infos, etc
[16:40] <pitti> *nod(
[16:40]  * seb128 opens bug
[16:40] <pitti> probably something in udev or dk, will look
[16:40] <pitti> seb128: merci
[16:44] <dobey> pitti: the crash is fixed. all i need to know is what the best way for me to get the updates pushed to karmic is.
[16:44] <pitti> ah, I see
[16:44] <pitti> dobey: so just attach the patch to a bug (or open one) and sub ubuntu-main-sponsors
[16:45] <dobey> pitti: well i made a new release, and will be making another release on Tuesday for getting into karmic alpha3
[16:45] <seb128> pitti, bug #400742
[16:45] <dobey> pitti: should i just file a bug to update, sub sponsors, and link the branch?
[16:45] <seb128> rickspencer3_, ^
[16:46] <pitti> dobey: sounds fine
[16:46] <rickspencer3_> oops
[16:46] <dobey> pitti: ok, cool. will do that as soon as i return from lunch :)
[16:46] <rickspencer3_> seb128: do yu want me to use apport on that?
[16:47] <seb128> rickspencer3_, no, everybody get the issue apparently so that should be fine
[16:47] <seb128> I don't have the ubuntu-bug reflex yet ;-)
[16:47] <rickspencer3_> k
[16:47] <rickspencer3_> thanks seb128
[16:47] <rickspencer3_> or should I say "merci"
[16:49] <seb128> de rien!
[16:52] <pitti> but you should do it anyway, just to train the habit :)
[16:53] <seb128> pitti, how do I get udev details about a drive?
[16:53] <seb128> I've the feeling it's an udev issue after looking a devicekit-disks
[16:53] <pitti> seb128: udevadm info --query=all --name=/dev/sr0
[16:54] <seb128> ok
[16:54] <seb128>         /* device_is_optical_disc and optical_disc_* */
[16:54] <seb128>         if (g_udev_device_has_property (device->priv->d, "ID_CDROM_MEDIA_STATE")) {
[16:54] <seb128>                 devkit_disks_device_set_device_is_optical_disc (device, TRUE);
[16:54] <seb128> $ udevadm info --query=all --name=/dev/sr0 | grep STATE
[16:54] <seb128> $
[16:54] <pitti> ah
[16:54] <seb128> that's the issue
[16:54] <pitti> great
[16:55] <pitti> so, I'm upstream committer for udev, but not dk-disks (yet), that makes it easier to fix :-P
[16:55] <seb128> I still don't know if udev is wrong of devkit
[16:55] <pitti> anyway, will check with kay on which side the bug is
[16:55] <seb128> ie what ID_CDROM_MEDIA_STATE is
[16:55] <pitti> thanks for the investigations
[16:56] <seb128> pitti, you're welcome
[17:43] <rickspencer3_> pitti: I put a list of our bugs targeted for previous releases here:
[17:43] <rickspencer3_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-07-21/PreviousVersionBugs
[17:46] <pitti> rickspencer3_: nice, thanks! I'll go down that list at some point and weed out some obsolete ones
[17:46] <rickspencer3_> pitti: ideally, we should identifiy the ones that we will actually fix, and get them fixed asap
[17:47] <rickspencer3_> in other words, we should drive this list to zero so we can remove the "noise"
[17:47] <rickspencer3_> perhaps discuss at the team meeting next week?
[17:49] <pitti> rickspencer3_: sure, but as I said, before we should do some "wontfix" cleanup
[17:49] <rickspencer3_> right
[17:50] <rickspencer3_> that's what I mean by "drive to zero"
[17:50] <rickspencer3_> either fix them, or nuke them
[17:50] <pitti> or handle this by mail (no need to block everyone else on discussions on individual bugs, IMHO)
[17:50] <rickspencer3_> agree on the individual bug discussion
[17:50] <pitti> so perhaps everyone could take a look at "their" bugs first
[17:51] <rickspencer3_> I meant discuss having people look them first
[17:51] <rickspencer3_> but, as you wish, whatever is deemed most efficient
[17:52] <rickspencer3_> seb128: btw, brasero is not recognizing my blank cdr
[17:52] <rickspencer3_> though it is on the desktop
[17:52]  * rickspencer3_ assumes a similar issue to the audio cd one
[18:02] <pitti> right
[18:02] <pitti> let me upload that fix now, I'm done with spec review
[18:05] <seb128> rickspencer3_, not the same issue I would say since gvfs and nautilus see blank disks
[18:05] <seb128> let's wait for pitti's update to see if that makes a difference though
[18:12] <pitti> works like a treat with audio CDs, uploaded
[18:13] <pitti> yep, brasero is busted here, too
[18:14] <pitti> rickspencer3_, seb128: ^
[18:14] <seb128> rather a software bug that a gvfs, devkit one
[18:14] <seb128> that will be for next week, now is time to go for dinner and weekend
[18:15] <seb128> have fun everybody!
[18:15] <pitti> likewise
[18:15] <pitti> have a good weekend everyone!
[18:16] <didrocks> have a good weekend pitti!
[18:16] <didrocks> too late for seb :)
[18:16] <crevette> seb128, is it a know problem that gvfs crash (or perhaps the consumer of gvfs) crashes when mounting ftp connection?
[18:16] <didrocks> crevette: raté ;)
[18:17] <pitti> /quit/quit
[18:17] <pitti> oops
[18:19] <crevette> I don't see such problem in malone
[18:19] <crevette> let's open a bug
[18:19] <rickspencer3_> thank pitti
[18:19] <rickspencer3_> I'll update tomorrow, and then start speaking French ;)
[18:19] <didrocks> rickspencer3_: you're surrounded by French people ;)
[18:20] <rickspencer3_> didrocks: yes, so I decided to learn some French
[18:20] <didrocks> hehe :-)
[18:20] <rickspencer3_> and I bought some French lesson CDs last night, and they didn't work :(
[18:20] <didrocks> rickspencer3_: really?
[18:21] <rickspencer3_> well, not "they didn't work" as in "I don't speak French yet"
[18:21] <rickspencer3_> ;)
[18:21] <rickspencer3_> "didn't work" as a bug in Karmic kept them from being loaded
[18:21] <didrocks> that's seb128's fault, for sure :-)
[18:22] <didrocks> He knew that you wanted to learn French and prevent it so that you can't understand when French people speak together :p
[18:23] <rickspencer3_> lol
[18:23] <rickspencer3_> my goal is to be able to greet people and order food, maybe get directions
[18:23] <rickspencer3_> so you are safe
[18:24] <didrocks> order food is always the must difficult thing in a language, to my mind (and the most dangerous too!) :)
[18:25] <didrocks> ordering*
[19:11] <cj> putting karmic on a xen vm.  can someone point me at the package signing key?
[19:11]  * cj is going to try out jdub's wp/drizzle stuff
[22:17] <hyperair> has anyone noticed that applets in the panel can't be dragged around using the middle button anymore?
[22:17] <hyperair> or is this a bug that's affecting just me?
[22:17] <bryce> hyperair, does it work with ctrl or alt?
[22:18] <hyperair> bryce: no it doesn't.
[22:18] <hyperair> well that said, *one* applet can be moved around using the middle button
[22:18] <hyperair> the menu bar
[22:18] <hyperair> but that's all
[22:18] <bryce> are they locked?
[22:19] <hyperair> i can't even drag the panel around the screen or from screen to screen anymore
[22:19] <hyperair> they're not.
[22:19] <hyperair> i checked already
[22:19] <hyperair> they're movable via right-click->move
[22:19] <bryce> weird, no idea
[22:19] <hyperair> it works for you then?
[22:19] <hyperair> how strange -=
[22:20] <hyperair> =\
[22:21] <bryce> hyperair, my desktop is not up to date on karmic at the moment so I'm not a good one to test
[22:21] <hyperair> also some of my notification area icons have suddenly gotten black backgrounds
[22:23] <hyperair> specifically liferea and banshee
[22:23]  * hyperair scratches his head
[22:24] <bryce> hyperair, look in your dpkg log and see what you've updated recently, try downgrading and find what package caused the regression
[22:24] <hyperair> it happened sometime back
[22:24] <hyperair> i didn't bother about it =\
[22:25] <bryce> ah too bad.  could search launchpad to see if there's already a bug about it
[22:26] <bryce> are you using metacity or compiz or ...?  What you're describing sort of sounds like a window manager problem, so maybe trying a different window manager would prove/disprove that
[22:26] <hyperair> compiz.
[22:26] <hyperair> let's try metacity then =\
[22:26] <hyperair> no change.
[22:26] <chrisccoulson> hyperair - someone else mentioned your issue on here a couple of days ago
[22:27] <chrisccoulson> BUGabundo had the same issue i think
[22:27] <hyperair> hmm is that so?
[22:27] <chrisccoulson> yeah
[22:27] <hyperair> i'll go poke him later then
[22:27] <chrisccoulson> he doesn't seem to be on any of the channels this evening though
[22:28] <hyperair> he's online though
[22:28] <hyperair> connected to freenode i mean
[22:28] <chrisccoulson> ah, ok
[22:29] <chrisccoulson> Ampelbein - did you get your gnome-nettool query sorted in the end?
[22:32] <hyperair> aha seems fixed now
[22:32] <hyperair> at least the middle-click-moving part
[22:33] <hyperair> icon still has a black background though
[22:33] <hyperair> and i still can't drag the panel around.
[22:34] <hyperair> no wait, i can.
[22:34] <hyperair> requires alt
[22:38] <bcurtiswx> pitti:are you available for a /msg?
[22:46] <chrisccoulson> glad you got it sorted hyperair
[22:46] <chrisccoulson> requiring alt to drag the panel hasn't changed recently though
[23:29] <cj> anyone know how to add alt-tab back into wm shortcuts?  it seems to have been removed.  yay. wm=compiz.