| === Ursinha is now known as Ursinha-bbl | ||
| === Ursinha-bbl is now known as Ursinha | ||
| === noodles775 is now known as noodles-afk | ||
| === salgado-afk is now known as salgado | ||
| === noodles-afk is now known as noodles | ||
| barry | #startmeeting | 15:00 |
|---|---|---|
| MootBot | Meeting started at 09:00. The chair is barry. | 15:00 |
| MootBot | Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE] | 15:00 |
| barry | hello everyone and welcome to this week's ameu reviewers meeting. who's here today? | 15:00 |
| allenap | me | 15:00 |
| noodles | me | 15:00 |
| mars | me | 15:00 |
| bac | me | 15:00 |
| bigjools | me | 15:00 |
| adeuring | me | 15:01 |
| henninge | ms | 15:01 |
| abentley | me | 15:01 |
| henninge | me | 15:01 |
| salgado | me | 15:01 |
| leonardr | me | 15:02 |
| deryck | me | 15:02 |
| barry | jtv, intellectronica ping | 15:02 |
| jtv | barry: pong | 15:02 |
| jtv | me | 15:02 |
| barry | cprov, BjornT_ sinzui ping | 15:02 |
| cprov | me | 15:02 |
| BjornT_ | me | 15:03 |
| EdwinGrubbs | me | 15:03 |
| sinzui | me | 15:03 |
| barry | rockstar: ping | 15:03 |
| barry | gmb: ping | 15:03 |
| gmb | me | 15:03 |
| barry | [TOPIC] agenda | 15:03 |
| MootBot | New Topic: agenda | 15:03 |
| barry | * Roll call | 15:03 |
| barry | * bac to chair for the next two weeks - barry | 15:03 |
| barry | * Action items | 15:03 |
| barry | * Mentoring update | 15:03 |
| barry | * deryck graduates | 15:03 |
| barry | * Alphabetical sorts are case sensitive? insensitive? - barry | 15:03 |
| barry | * Peanut gallery (anything not on the agenda) | 15:03 |
| barry | 15:04 | |
| barry | [TOPIC] bac to chair for the next two weeks - barry | 15:04 |
| MootBot | New Topic: bac to chair for the next two weeks - barry | 15:04 |
| barry | so i will not be at these meetings for the next two weeks. bac will chair them in my absence | 15:04 |
| intellectronica | me | 15:04 |
| barry | bac: thanks! | 15:04 |
| bac | np | 15:04 |
| barry | [TOPIC] * Action items | 15:04 |
| MootBot | New Topic: * Action items | 15:04 |
| barry | * deryck to update js wiki page with recommendations on loading js files in devmode only | 15:05 |
| deryck | did it yesterday. :) | 15:05 |
| barry | deryck: awesome, thanks | 15:05 |
| deryck | np | 15:05 |
| barry | * gmb to update style guides to clarify that `reST` is to be used in doctests, with existing pages to be converted at coder's discretion | 15:05 |
| gmb | Done. | 15:05 |
| barry | fantastic! can we keep this momentum going? | 15:06 |
| gmb | Though I'm going to reword it to make the second part a bit more explicity. | 15:06 |
| * gmb has a new hobby - adjectifying adjectives. | 15:06 | |
| barry | cool | 15:06 |
| barry | * flacoste to update reviewer docs and dev wiki about avoiding permission explosions | 15:06 |
| barry | oops, looks like we're missing flacoste and gary | 15:07 |
| bigjools | autofail, he's not here | 15:07 |
| mars | barry, flacoste is on vacation this week | 15:07 |
| barry | ah thx | 15:07 |
| mars | and gary is at OSCON | 15:07 |
| barry | thx | 15:07 |
| bac | flacoste did add that page | 15:07 |
| barry | bac: super | 15:07 |
| barry | [TOPIC] mentoring updates | 15:07 |
| bac | and, it turns out, the example he cited of permission explosion was actually necessary... | 15:07 |
| MootBot | New Topic: mentoring updates | 15:07 |
| barry | bac: oh! did he talk about that in the wiki? | 15:08 |
| bac | no. the lesson still stands... | 15:08 |
| barry | cool | 15:08 |
| barry | so. everyone, please congratulate deryck on his graduation to full-fledged reviewership! | 15:09 |
| * bigjools hi-5s deryck | 15:09 | |
| * deryck hi-5s bigjools back | 15:09 | |
| barry | deryck: i heard glowing reports of your reviews. i think you graduated in record time. great job! :) | 15:09 |
| deryck | barry, I feel so grown up now. :) | 15:09 |
| barry | and thanks gmb for your mentoring | 15:09 |
| noodles | Congrats deryck! | 15:10 |
| deryck | yes gmb rocks as a mentor | 15:10 |
| * gmb applauds | 15:10 | |
| gmb | deryck: Only when the student doesn't actually need all that much mentoring :) | 15:10 |
| barry | deryck: remember that you can now switch ocr days if you want. just ping me in email or pvtmsg to work out any day changes | 15:10 |
| deryck | barry, ok, will do. I'm flexible about that and happy to do whatever day is best for others. | 15:10 |
| intellectronica | congratulations deryck!!! | 15:11 |
| barry | one other quick note: rockstar is out tomorrow, so i will be switching my ocr this week from friday to thursday so that i can mentor leonardr | 15:11 |
| barry | any other mentoring issues today? | 15:12 |
| barry | moving on then | 15:12 |
| barry | [TOPIC] * Alphabetical sorts are case sensitive? insensitive? - barry | 15:12 |
| MootBot | New Topic: * Alphabetical sorts are case sensitive? insensitive? - barry | 15:12 |
| barry | so, in __all__ and a few other places, we want lines to be sorted | 15:13 |
| intellectronica | insensitive | 15:13 |
| sinzui | insensative | 15:13 |
| barry | we are currently inconsistent about this. so i'd like to hear opinions | 15:13 |
| bigjools | insensitive | 15:13 |
| abentley | insensitive | 15:13 |
| henninge | insensitive | 15:13 |
| allenap | UCA | 15:14 |
| * henninge wonders if we are an insensitive bunch ... | 15:14 | |
| * jtv feels particularly insensitive | 15:14 | |
| intellectronica | allenap: what does uca stand for? | 15:14 |
| jtv | Unicode Collation Algorithm? | 15:14 |
| adeuring | the nice thing about case-sensitive sorting is the emacs helper we have | 15:14 |
| barry | ouch | 15:14 |
| allenap | jtv: Yep. | 15:14 |
| noodles | By insensitive, do we mean: from blah import Apples, apple, Banana, banana | 15:14 |
| barry | adeuring: agreed | 15:14 |
| adeuring | ...for sorting imports | 15:14 |
| allenap | I know next to nothing about it though! :) | 15:14 |
| bac | adeuring: yes. | 15:14 |
| barry | also M-x sort-lines is case sensitive by default :) | 15:15 |
| intellectronica | noodles: that's already theology, but yes, i guess caps first makes sense | 15:15 |
| noodles | lol | 15:15 |
| jtv | allenap: don't need to, it's mostly about nasty stuff like I/i with/without dots and weird orders of reading a string. | 15:15 |
| allenap | jtv: I didn't realise at first that we were talking just about module imports and the like. Doh. | 15:15 |
| allenap | ECU - Emacs Collation Algorithm. | 15:16 |
| intellectronica | Ulgorithm | 15:16 |
| allenap | Crap. | 15:16 |
| barry | so, am i alone in wanting case sensitive sorting? ;) | 15:16 |
| jtv | I still prefer insensitive... is emacs being sensitive because it just is, or because people are running it in C locale? | 15:16 |
| adeuring | barry: me too ;) | 15:17 |
| barry | jtv: it's just case sensitive by default. you have to (setq sort-fold-case t) to make it otherwise | 15:17 |
| bac | i'm for sensitive but mainly due to the tools... | 15:17 |
| barry | this is one place i /would/ like to be consistent so we don't end up in line sorting churn | 15:18 |
| BjornT_ | bac: !sort in vim is case insensitive | 15:18 |
| bigjools | heh | 15:18 |
| barry | BjornT_: is this going to be an emacs vs vim fight? :) | 15:18 |
| jtv | I've been doing insensitive... for me converting what you already have is usually more important than Making a Decision. | 15:18 |
| bac | BjornT_: i should have said "my tools" but let's not go there. | 15:18 |
| allenap | Sensitive, so classes get sorted separately from functions. | 15:18 |
| barry | allenap: oh. nice point! | 15:19 |
| cprov | allenap: that's a good point. | 15:19 |
| allenap | Finally, I say something that makes sense. Phew. | 15:19 |
| barry | :-D | 15:19 |
| intellectronica | tools aside, anything but case-insensitive is harder for humans to work with. we should optimize for that | 15:19 |
| noodles | +1 | 15:19 |
| barry | intellectronica: python is case sensitive :) | 15:19 |
| abentley | allenap: But just in the context of imports and __all__, not in the body of the file? | 15:19 |
| barry | abentley: gawd no | 15:20 |
| allenap | abentley: Yeah, that's true. I tend to like putting functions at the top. | 15:20 |
| noodles | barry: but you are not a python interpreter ;) | 15:20 |
| barry | noodles: you're sure about that? | 15:20 |
| bigjools | barry: start a vote so we can move on! | 15:20 |
| barry | bigjools: fantastic idea | 15:21 |
| allenap | barry can already run the python 4.0 bytecode. | 15:21 |
| sinzui | I wish I could find this discussion from two years ago. This is not the first time we have discussed this | 15:21 |
| noodles | lol | 15:21 |
| barry | #startvote sort __all__ and similar case insensitive = -1, case sensitive = +1 | 15:21 |
| jtv | guys, no Turing tests here please | 15:21 |
| bigjools | yeah I have deja vu | 15:21 |
| barry | #startvote | 15:21 |
| adeuring | +1 | 15:21 |
| sinzui | -1 | 15:21 |
| jtv | 0 | 15:21 |
| bac | +1 | 15:21 |
| cprov | +1 | 15:21 |
| allenap | +1 | 15:21 |
| bigjools | botfail | 15:21 |
| intellectronica | -1 | 15:21 |
| noodles | -1 | 15:21 |
| BjornT_ | -1 | 15:21 |
| barry | hang on folks! | 15:21 |
| barry | [VOTE] | 15:21 |
| MootBot | Please vote on: . | 15:22 |
| MootBot | Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to MootBot | 15:22 |
| MootBot | E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #launchpad-meeting | 15:22 |
| allenap | +1 | 15:22 |
| barry | okay, now! | 15:22 |
| MootBot | +1 received from allenap. 1 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 1 | 15:22 |
| gmb | +1 | 15:22 |
| MootBot | +1 received from gmb. 2 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 2 | 15:22 |
| intellectronica | -1 | 15:22 |
| MootBot | -1 received from intellectronica. 2 for, 1 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 1 | 15:22 |
| barry | +1 | 15:22 |
| MootBot | +1 received from barry. 3 for, 1 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 2 | 15:22 |
| cprov | +1 | 15:22 |
| BjornT_ | -1 | 15:22 |
| MootBot | +1 received from cprov. 4 for, 1 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 3 | 15:22 |
| bac | +1 | 15:22 |
| MootBot | -1 received from BjornT_. 4 for, 2 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 2 | 15:22 |
| jtv | 0 | 15:22 |
| noodles | -1 | 15:22 |
| MootBot | +1 received from bac. 5 for, 2 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 3 | 15:22 |
| sinzui | -1 | 15:22 |
| MootBot | -1 received from noodles. 5 for, 3 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 2 | 15:22 |
| MootBot | -1 received from sinzui. 5 for, 4 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 1 | 15:22 |
| jtv | +0 | 15:22 |
| MootBot | Abstention received from jtv. 5 for, 4 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 1 | 15:22 |
| abentley | +1 | 15:22 |
| bigjools | -1 | 15:22 |
| adeuring | +1 | 15:22 |
| MootBot | +1 received from abentley. 6 for, 4 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 2 | 15:22 |
| MootBot | -1 received from bigjools. 6 for, 5 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 1 | 15:22 |
| MootBot | +1 received from adeuring. 7 for, 5 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 2 | 15:22 |
| salgado_ | -1 | 15:22 |
| MootBot | -1 received from salgado_. 7 for, 6 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 1 | 15:22 |
| henninge | -1 | 15:22 |
| MootBot | -1 received from henninge. 7 for, 7 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 0 | 15:22 |
| deryck | +1 | 15:22 |
| MootBot | +1 received from deryck. 8 for, 7 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 1 | 15:22 |
| bigjools | jtv you meanie | 15:22 |
| * barry is on the edge of his seat! | 15:22 | |
| gmb | This is the tensest vote evar. | 15:22 |
| mars | 0 | 15:22 |
| sinzui | flacoste is a vim users and a human being: he would vote -1 | 15:22 |
| bigjools | agh another fence-sitter! | 15:22 |
| jtv | bigjools: I _honestly_ _don't_ _care_ | 15:22 |
| abentley | -1 | 15:23 |
| barry | yeah, but gary would definitely vote +1 <wink> | 15:23 |
| gmb | I'm a vim user and a human being... I vote +1 | 15:23 |
| sinzui | kiko is also a vim user, he will vote -1 | 15:23 |
| gmb | Well, I'm a vim user... | 15:23 |
| bigjools | haha | 15:23 |
| sinzui | gmb: you have issues. I don't think we need to bring them up now. | 15:23 |
| jtv | And I still say what we decide here doesn't matter that much unless we clean up what we already have. | 15:23 |
| bigjools | abentley: you already voted +1! | 15:23 |
| gmb | Touche. | 15:23 |
| bigjools | I prefer to use an editor, not an OS | 15:24 |
| * bigjools hides | 15:24 | |
| abentley | bigjools: Yes, but the vote was unspecified, so I assumed we were voting for insensitive. | 15:24 |
| barry | abentley: mootbot is stricter than the florida election committee | 15:24 |
| allenap | vim is an OS. A DOS-era OS. | 15:24 |
| intellectronica | aha, i abentley changed his vote that changes the picture | 15:24 |
| * allenap ducks | 15:24 | |
| barry | well, don't forget asiapac has to weigh in | 15:24 |
| bigjools | since it's so close, I vote we leave it *random* | 15:25 |
| barry | bigjools: perfect! | 15:25 |
| bac | jml, mwh will definitely +1 | 15:25 |
| bigjools | :) | 15:25 |
| allenap | bigjools: +1, and if it's at least sorted one way or the other, don't change it. | 15:25 |
| barry | bac: yeah, i think so | 15:25 |
| barry | #endvote | 15:25 |
| bigjools | yep, on reflection I think this is a pointless debate | 15:25 |
| noodles | yap | 15:25 |
| intellectronica | bigjools: it's not. if we could avoid the editor wars and make a decision it would be good to have a standard on that | 15:26 |
| jtv | What's already there generally overrules what is decided somewhere, and I don't think this is worth a cleanup effort. | 15:26 |
| barry | we're about evenly divided anyway. i'll consult with asiapac and see where we stand, then make an announcement later today | 15:26 |
| bigjools | intellectronica: in the grand scheme of things, it's not that important IMO | 15:26 |
| sinzui | If only barry had thought to include his editor's behaviour into PEP8 | 15:26 |
| === salgado_ is now known as salgado | ||
| * barry looks around for the time machine keys | 15:27 | |
| barry | anyway. that's all i have on my list, so now... | 15:27 |
| barry | [TOPIC] peanut gallery | 15:27 |
| MootBot | Vote is in progress. Finishing now. | 15:27 |
| MootBot | Final result is 8 for, 7 against. 1 abstained. Total: 1 | 15:27 |
| MootBot | New Topic: peanut gallery | 15:27 |
| sinzui | I have a sonic screw driver in my hand roght now | 15:27 |
| barry | any topics you might have that are not on the agenda? | 15:27 |
| mars | +1 for Doctor Who references | 15:27 |
| jtv | sinzui: pour me one too please | 15:27 |
| intellectronica | did we ever decide how to get new contributors in? | 15:27 |
| * sinzui really does have a sonic screwdriver | 15:28 | |
| intellectronica | do they do normal reviews? | 15:28 |
| intellectronica | are we going to put something in place to guide them through the development process, pre-imp-->landing ? | 15:28 |
| barry | intellectronica: yes, i think so, with a dedicated shepherd to help them through the process. | 15:28 |
| barry | intellectronica: i will write up a proposal for this | 15:28 |
| barry | [ACTION] barry to write a proposal about guiding new outside contributors | 15:29 |
| MootBot | ACTION received: barry to write a proposal about guiding new outside contributors | 15:29 |
| intellectronica | so the current recommendation, if anyone wants to start working on lp branches is to find a mentor who will guide them through the process? | 15:29 |
| intellectronica | i think that's a good way to do this | 15:29 |
| sinzui | I think our current process of hack on code for 3 months, then being mentat training will work fine | 15:29 |
| bigjools | barry: how much more info than the existing wiki page do you plan on adding? | 15:29 |
| adeuring | i think if somebody just sends a little bug fix, but clearly says that he sodes not want to get closer invloved, we should not require the regular proceure | 15:29 |
| adeuring | s/sodes/does/ | 15:29 |
| jtv | Let's not re-use "mentor" here... | 15:30 |
| intellectronica | sinzui: oh, i'm not talking about becoming reviewers, but about getting branches in | 15:30 |
| intellectronica | we can worry about that later | 15:30 |
| barry | sinzui: agreed | 15:30 |
| sinzui | intellectronica: my bad | 15:30 |
| barry | bigjools: i don't know i have to review what we've got ;) | 15:30 |
| bigjools | https://dev.launchpad.net/PatchSubmission | 15:30 |
| barry | jtv: right, "shepherd" is what i've been using, but maybe not a great term | 15:30 |
| abentley | What about this policy that we're not supposed to put procedures on the dev wiki? I think it would make a lot of sense to put all the procedures we can on the dev wiki. | 15:30 |
| barry | abentley: this is process that directly involves the community now, so definitely dev wiki | 15:31 |
| intellectronica | i think it would be good to emphasize the importance of getting a mentor before starting the work, but other than that it looks perfect | 15:31 |
| barry | bigjools: thanks, i'll review that | 15:31 |
| gmb | Didn't we rip out hte mentorship code for bugs? Shame... | 15:31 |
| adeuring | how do we know if somebody signed the contributor's agreement? | 15:32 |
| barry | adeuring: and once they sign it, can they land branches into pqm directly? | 15:32 |
| intellectronica | we could add everyone who did to a team when they send it | 15:33 |
| gmb | barry: That would be dangerous. | 15:33 |
| gmb | potentially, anyway. | 15:33 |
| barry | gmb: well, signing it is a necessary but not sufficient condition! | 15:33 |
| adeuring | barry: we're testing via EC2, so I think one of us needs to do that. | 15:33 |
| gmb | barry: Okay, agreed. | 15:34 |
| barry | adeuring: meaning, our outside contributors can't run through ec2? i guess there's the little matter of cost | 15:34 |
| jtv | barry: just remembered the term I had in mind: "sponsor." | 15:34 |
| adeuring | barry: yes, that's what I meant | 15:34 |
| bigjools | make check *cough* | 15:34 |
| gmb | jtv: +1 | 15:34 |
| noodles | +1 for sponsor | 15:34 |
| gmb | bigjools: make computer_melt | 15:35 |
| barry | jtv: nice | 15:35 |
| bigjools | gmb: speak for yourself! | 15:35 |
| intellectronica | i think mentor is better because it communicates that you will get help from the person through the entire process | 15:35 |
| sinzui | adeuring: The CoC code is generic. We just assume it is The ubuntu code co conduct in the UI. We will update the CoC UI to support mutilple signings | 15:35 |
| intellectronica | i think that's very important because i worry that people will come, out of the blue, with branches they want merged, and will be dissapointed when we have to reject them for whatever reason | 15:36 |
| barry | let's take further discussions of this to the new public mailing list, and i will take the action item to collect feedback and update wiki pages | 15:36 |
| barry | intellectronica: we need to triage branches early. people may submit things we won't ever care about (e.g. convert all lp code to perl :). we should let them know this early in the process so they don't waste their time | 15:37 |
| jtv | intellectronica: a sponsor is also supposed to go to bat for you. But we've already had confusion over this, might as well keep separate terms. | 15:37 |
| barry | intellectronica: the beauty of course, is that we're free software now | 15:37 |
| intellectronica | barry: exactly | 15:37 |
| barry | cool. 7 minutes left. anything more on this or any other topic? | 15:38 |
| jtv | ceterum censeo carthaginem esse delendam | 15:39 |
| barry | i believe we are done then | 15:39 |
| barry | #endmeeting | 15:39 |
| MootBot | Meeting finished at 09:39. | 15:39 |
| barry | thanks everyone! | 15:39 |
| jtv | thanks barry, you evil emacs user! | 15:39 |
| bac | thanks barry | 15:40 |
| barry | jtv: i am now doing irc in emacs too :) | 15:40 |
| intellectronica | thanks barry | 15:40 |
| jtv | emacs is an os... vim was written by someone who already had a nice one | 15:40 |
| bigjools | barry: irc in emacs? you sick puppy! | 15:41 |
| barry | jtv: what's an os? oh, it's all that extra crap that slows down emacs? | 15:42 |
| bigjools | chuckle :) | 15:42 |
| jtv | barry: sure, blame some other piece of software... ! | 15:42 |
| barry | jtv: let me count the ways... :) | 15:43 |
| jtv | barry: at least that extra crap doesn't usually use a pointer's high byte to store lisp bits! | 15:43 |
| * jtv is enjoying this | 15:43 | |
| barry | jtv: ouch | 15:43 |
| barry | jtv: what are you, a parenthesist? | 15:44 |
| jtv | barry: I've got nothing against parentheses... | 15:44 |
| jtv | ...in reasonable numbers. | 15:44 |
| === salgado is now known as salgado-lunch | ||
| === ursula_ is now known as Ursinha | ||
| === joey is now known as launchpad | ||
| === launchpad is now known as Rinchen | ||
| === Rinchen is now known as joey | ||
| === noodles is now known as noodles775 | ||
| === salgado-lunch is now known as salgado | ||
| === ejat is now known as e-jat | ||
| === salgado is now known as salgado-afk | ||
| jml | lalalala | 23:28 |
| thumper | jml: tellytubbies | 23:29 |
| * thumper pictures jml in a yellow fuzz suit | 23:30 | |
| barry | #startmeeting | 23:30 |
| MootBot | Meeting started at 17:30. The chair is barry. | 23:30 |
| MootBot | Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE] | 23:30 |
| jml | thumper, I was actually singing the Bob Dylan song that features in the Big Lebowski | 23:30 |
| barry | jml, thumper, mwhudson howdy | 23:30 |
| jml | barry, hi | 23:30 |
| thumper | hi | 23:30 |
| barry | jml: i am loving erc :) | 23:30 |
| thumper | erc? | 23:31 |
| barry | emacs irc client | 23:31 |
| jml | barry, :( | 23:31 |
| barry | jml: no. :) | 23:31 |
| jml | barry, last time I used erc, I accidentally ended up editing other people's nicks. | 23:31 |
| thumper | heh | 23:31 |
| barry | ouch | 23:31 |
| jml | when I wasn't blocked on network io | 23:32 |
| barry | i hook it up to bip so it's fast | 23:32 |
| barry | and isn't hampered by canonical's ssl craziness | 23:32 |
| barry | anyway... | 23:32 |
| barry | quick update and then topics? | 23:32 |
| barry | summary from ameu... | 23:33 |
| barry | deryck graduates | 23:33 |
| thumper | congrats | 23:33 |
| barry | i have an action item to start a discussion about sponsoring contributions from the community | 23:33 |
| barry | and we had a discussion and vote about __all__, etc, sorting, vis case sensitive or insensitive | 23:33 |
| barry | on the latter, without knowing the results of this morning's vote, what say ye? | 23:34 |
| jml | slow news week, eh? | 23:34 |
| barry | yep | 23:34 |
| jml | barry, I was told insensitive in the past. | 23:34 |
| jml | barry, and so that's what I've been doing | 23:34 |
| barry | jml: yes, but what do you /really/ want :) | 23:34 |
| jml | barry, but I don't have a strong feeling on the matter | 23:34 |
| jml | barry, as long as it's consistent. | 23:35 |
| barry | jml: agreed. we don't currently have consistency | 23:35 |
| * jml would much rather have from foo import (bar,\nbaz,\n) than ordering. | 23:35 | |
| thumper | +1 on consistency | 23:35 |
| barry | jml, thumper, mwhudson so if you had to vote, which would it be? | 23:35 |
| jml | barry, so in that case, I default to everyone else being consistent with what I already do :P | 23:35 |
| thumper | jml: is this alphabetical case sensitivity of imports? | 23:36 |
| barry | jml: in __all__'s do you use M-x sort-lines? | 23:36 |
| jml | but I might change my vote for a barrel of salted pork. | 23:36 |
| thumper | sorry, barry not jml | 23:36 |
| jml | thumper, yeah. | 23:36 |
| barry | thumper: yes | 23:36 |
| jml | barry, umm... no, I think I manually edit. | 23:36 |
| * jml votes [A, a, B, b, ...] | 23:36 | |
| barry | jml: ah | 23:36 |
| thumper | barry: I've not been personally consistent | 23:36 |
| barry | jml: that's case insensitive then | 23:36 |
| jml | barry, yes | 23:37 |
| thumper | barry: not really | 23:37 |
| thumper | what about [DEF, dab] ? | 23:37 |
| thumper | capitals first or real insensitive? | 23:37 |
| jml | thumper, that's case sensitive | 23:37 |
| jml | thumper, [A, B, ..., a, b, ...] | 23:37 |
| thumper | [DEF, dab, EFG, eag] | 23:37 |
| jml | all caps being special? | 23:38 |
| jml | *gasp* | 23:38 |
| thumper | possibly? | 23:38 |
| barry | nothing special about it. ascii sort | 23:38 |
| thumper | I'm abstaining because I really don't care | 23:38 |
| thumper | as long as people are consistent and it is documented | 23:38 |
| jml | maybe sorting like: sorted(__all__, key=lambda name: sum(map(ord(name)))) | 23:39 |
| barry | ok. and jml votes for insensitive. mwhudson is silent :) | 23:39 |
| jml | barry, what was the public vote? | 23:39 |
| barry | jml: it was almost exactly tied. abentley threw it to the supreme court by changing his vote :) | 23:39 |
| thumper | barry: mwhudson said he had to step away for a few minutes | 23:40 |
| * mwhudson reappears | 23:40 | |
| jml | barry, so I guess you lean to sensitive sorting because of sort-lines | 23:40 |
| barry | jml: yeah | 23:40 |
| thumper | mwhudson: just in tie for a vote on case sensitivity of import orderings :) | 23:40 |
| jml | I'll give you what you want, if I can change to... | 23:40 |
| jml | from foo import ( | 23:40 |
| jml | bar, | 23:40 |
| thumper | s/tie/time/ | 23:40 |
| jml | baz, | 23:40 |
| jml | ) | 23:40 |
| thumper | I vote for jml's one | 23:41 |
| thumper | less conflicts on merging | 23:41 |
| mwhudson | thumper: sadly i don't care | 23:41 |
| barry | jml: you mean, one import per line always? | 23:41 |
| thumper | barry: yeah baby, yeah! | 23:41 |
| barry | jml: M-x py-sort-imports :) | 23:41 |
| mwhudson | tbh | 23:42 |
| mwhudson | with flymake keeping unnecessary imports out | 23:42 |
| mwhudson | i just mentally skip over import blocks | 23:42 |
| * jml agrees | 23:42 | |
| thumper | mwhudson: me too | 23:42 |
| jml | the whole point is avoiding conflicts, in my mind. | 23:42 |
| mwhudson | it could be formatted in one line using ; for all i care | 23:42 |
| thumper | I tend to skip over them in reviews too | 23:42 |
| mwhudson | so i think i agree with jml then | 23:43 |
| barry | i've been in import unspaghetti mode today so i can't ignore them. it's like being hungry when you go food shopping. all the poptarts and chef boyardee is screaming out to me | 23:43 |
| barry | i hear you about the conflicts | 23:43 |
| mwhudson | barry: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/launchpad-registry/+bug/402845 ? | 23:44 |
| ubottu | Ubuntu bug 402845 in launchpad-registry "./bin/py -c 'from lp.registry.model import person' fails due to circular import" [Undecided,Triaged] | 23:44 |
| thumper | barry: one import per line - true case insensitive sort | 23:44 |
| barry | thumper: gotcha | 23:44 |
| mwhudson | i believe the 'rope' library has support for automatically managing import sections | 23:44 |
| mwhudson | but i've never got it working | 23:44 |
| barry | okay, enough with the trivial stuff. that is all i have for the summary. what's on y'alls mind these days? | 23:45 |
| thumper | the code review UI :) | 23:45 |
| jml | barry, not much of import, but two crazy ideas that someone else might like to take up. | 23:46 |
| barry | thumper: tell me how you will increase its awesomeness | 23:46 |
| barry | jml: let's here it | 23:46 |
| jml | barry, I'd really love to see a graph of 'branches waiting review' over time, and a graph of 'branches approved to land' over time. | 23:46 |
| thumper | barry: love to, but now is not the time | 23:46 |
| mwhudson | jml: globally, or for launchpad? | 23:47 |
| jml | barry, I'd also love to see a distribution chart of time between submitting & landing. | 23:47 |
| jml | mwhudson, just Launchpad itself. | 23:47 |
| mwhudson | k | 23:47 |
| thumper | jml: we have date created, date reviewd, date merged :) | 23:47 |
| jml | thumper, *nod* | 23:48 |
| jml | I know it's all possible. | 23:48 |
| thumper | I'd be nice to have the graphs on LP actually | 23:48 |
| thumper | for any project | 23:48 |
| jml | I just haven't had the opportunity to do it, and I've had the idea for months | 23:48 |
| * thumper thinks about this... | 23:48 | |
| jml | so I'm putting it out there for others :) | 23:48 |
| jml | that's it. | 23:49 |
| jml | barry, ^ | 23:50 |
| barry | jml: thanks | 23:50 |
| barry | it would be cool | 23:50 |
| barry | mwhudson, thumper anything else? | 23:50 |
| mwhudson | nope | 23:50 |
| thumper | nope | 23:50 |
| barry | #endmeeting | 23:50 |
| MootBot | Meeting finished at 17:50. | 23:50 |
| barry | thank you guys! | 23:50 |
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