[00:00] Yeah, that's a pretty bizarre patch - bizarre that it was ever reauired. [00:00] reauired? [00:00] oh [00:00] Bah. fat fingers. [00:00] s/a/q [00:01] heh [00:01] maybe 3.5 fixed it [00:02] ah, here's a multiline patch comment [00:02] http://patches.ubuntu.com/e/eclipse/extracted/eclipse-public-applypatch.dpatch [00:02] and a fairly lengthy patch [00:03] pwnguin, that patch kinda makes it hard to shift the feeling i've always had about eclipse === asac__ is now known as asac [00:04] which is? [00:04] "bleh" [00:04] just never did anything for me [00:04] i dont see where C# would improve that [00:04] So really my first steps are 0) Remind myself how I partitioned my drive. 0.1) Figure out if I can re-partition an encrypted drive and how. 0.2) Do it. 1) Install Karmic as a dual boot. 2) apt-get source eclipse. 3) Build it just to prove I can. 4) Start looking at / discussing the patches. [00:04] we used "JEdit" in the undergrad days ^_^ [00:05] directhex: That was my editor of choice before I picked up Eclipse. [00:05] our intro to programming course was in Java [00:05] and the mandatory editor was BlueJay [00:06] I think the first language I was formally taught was Pascal. [00:06] Then VB, then C I think. [00:06] pwnguin, well, monodevelop 2.0, the current stable release, with integrated debugging and gui designer, is packaged and working. eclipse is much more mature and has loads more developers. i don't really see the "excuse" for dreadful flaws like not having a working plugin API (i.e. needing to public-ize your app just to get an important plugin running) [00:07] i wish MD supported "real" Java though, not just IKVM [00:07] Ironically, pointers in C never made sense to me until I started learning Java, which doesn't even have explicit pointers in the language. [00:07] directhex: i think you fail to understand [00:07] pwnguin, entirely possible [00:07] the main purpose of eclipse today is to serve the people who would otherwise be stuck with crappy vendor IDEs for embedded systems [00:08] check out the sponsors list [00:08] mmmmmmokay, sounds a bit weird, but okay [00:08] C and C++ developers need an IDE [00:08] every embedded system ive worked with came with a terrible IDE for a custom toolchain [00:10] sure, it works with Java and lots of academics like open source and java [00:11] I thought the point of Eclipse was so that Java application server vendors didn't have to bother to write their own IDE - just a plugin that connects it to their app server's management interface. :) [00:12] But then I only really do server-side Java, so my view is distorted. [00:13] I've not really used CDT in anger. [00:13] places like Nokia, motorola, ARM, QNX, ericsen, freescale, lynuxworks [00:13] the JDT is well done [00:13] the custom compiler is fast and the IDE uses some nice tricks for fast lookups [00:15] personally, the last thing I used eclipse for, was, I think, either a BIRT 2.0 to 3.0 grammar converter, or perhaps a PHP website [00:15] I like the JDT. I'd like to be able to make more use of the J2EE perspective, but it seems to require that your project(s) be organised a certain way, which ours isn't. [00:16] BIRT is amazing. i spent a month on it, and I have no idea what it does or what it's for [00:16] I quite like PyDev, although it can be a bit slow. [00:17] I've seen BIRT mentioned, but I'm the same - no idea as to its purpose. [00:18] like i said, i wrote a parser and translator for it, and i still have no idea what it's purpose is [00:18] In fact we don't make use of even a small percentage of what Eclipse can do. [00:18] when the new eclipse came out, i took a look at it and they mentioned BIRT again; turns out i guess its like an open source crystal reports [00:18] Ah, right [00:19] business something something something [00:19] Now you put it like that, possibly business intelligence reporting tool or something. [00:19] i think you got it [00:20] there's a line in Stephenson's Snow Crash [00:20] about someone who works for a place as a programmer, who has no idea what it is the program actually does [00:20] after that project, i now understand that it is indeed possible [00:21] * jayteeuk whistles innocently. [00:21] also, i may have either proved the chinese room, or disproved my own intelligence [00:22] So I have to ask, what prompted your post about Eclipse? [00:22] anyways, step 5 on your list: ask for details on what needs to be done from doko [00:22] jayteeuk: i have friends who need something like it [00:22] it occasionally works [00:22] "I have this friend..." :-P [00:22] his name is Dave [00:23] plus, it would really help Ubuntu's viability in certain large embedded nagivation firms [00:25] finally, because im an idiot and haven't tried monodevelop for anything besides mono [00:25] directhex: can i debug C++ with monodevelop? [00:25] I just want to see Eclipse shipped by default in Ubuntu because I like it and don't have an inclination to try anything else at the moment. [00:26] when I was a TA for undergraduate operating systems, we showed students DDD [00:26] pwnguin, i haven't tested it extensively, but there's [00:26] C++ support and GDB integration, so presumably some combination of the two [00:26] let's give it a try [00:26] this is a suboptimal debugger; something else would help alleviate the torture that class becomes [00:28] man, it's 30 minutes to quittin time [00:28] I don't know DDD. I've only used GDB and Java's debugger. [00:28] DDD is an old graphical frontend to gdb [00:28] D'oh, another late night for me. [00:29] I think I used something called xgdb once? [00:29] pwnguin, seems helluva buggy, but it broke on a breakpoint and highlighted the right line, so that's something [00:29] jayteeuk: once you're comfortable with building eclipse and whatnot, I'll see about who you should talk to [00:29] directhex: heh [00:30] pwnguin, the only debugger people mention around me at work is DDT [00:30] pwnguin, in my spare time, i also use mdb [00:30] pwnguin: Thanks. I'll let it grow organically - baby steps, get the thing working first! [00:31] directhex: it doesn't help that nachOS uses a user library to do thread switching [00:31] instead of libpthread [00:32] I'll have to brief my wife on which environment to select when Flash player overheats my CPU and shuts down the laptop again. :) [00:32] i donno why, but all flashplayer videos seem to peg at 100 percent [00:33] download the flv and give it to totem, runs fine [00:33] but given that firefox does the same thing to .ogg [00:33] im blaming the web [00:33] pwnguin, short version: adobe are chimps [00:34] Don't hold back now. [00:35] well, after my last attempt at thinking it through failed so hard i mistook YUV for CMYK [00:35] i'm refraining from further idiocy [00:36] directhex: fyi, that patch was applied in 2006 [00:37] pwnguin, i should bloody hope it was applied in 2001!# [00:37] ? [00:37] Right, well... it's heading quickly towards 1am, and I have to be up for work in just over 6 hours... I guess I'm not going to get a dual boot sorted now. [00:38] if other people have a suggestion that's faster, by all means [00:38] i won't be offended [00:40] I hadn't actually thought about it, but it seems the best option to me. [00:41] I hadn't even considered that I'd need to be running Karmic actually, but when you mentioned it my thoughts were "VM, probably too slow. chroot, didn't enjoy that experience." [00:42] well, if your end goal is depending on external libraries [00:43] you dont want to be running karmic on jaunty :) [00:43] Hahah, no. Obvious now it's been pointed out! [00:43] I suspect I'll be submitting patches to a lot more packages than just eclipse. [00:44] good to hear! [00:45] Through necessity - my (admittedly limited) understanding is that at least some of the external packages we want to depend on need this OSGi work doing to them. [00:46] That's another thing for me to learn. :) [00:47] This should be a lot of fun and very beneficial for my career. [00:49] With luck and some hard work, I'd like to use it to support an application for Ubuntu membership. [01:00] pwnguin: Thanks for all the help, hopefully I'll 'see' you again tomorrow. [01:00] directhex: Thanks for the conversation - hope Mono works out for you. ;) [01:14] What's wrong with "libghc6-agda-dev (<< ${source:Upstream-Version}.1~),"? [02:27] * lajjr rebooting [04:24] does anyone feel like doing a REVU on http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/a2jmidid [06:23] Hello, should I subscribe u-u-s to LP 402874 ? [06:23] Launchpad bug 402874 in sl-modem "Candidate revision sl-modem_2.9.11~20090222-1ubuntu1" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/402874 [06:27] there is no fix attached to this bug, I just said that I'm not sure wether it should be a sync or merge and explain the situation [07:07] This package REVU only needs one more advocation http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/xwax Anyone have a second? === WelshDragon is now known as Fluffles [08:39] Hey wgrant! You might be able to answer a packaging question that I've got at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/pocketsphinx ? If you've time, could you take a look? [08:39] I'm just keen to know if I can check a package in pbuilder that is dependent on another as-yet unpublished package (ie. can you pass it in to pbuilder somehow) [08:40] I'd do a 'pbuilder login' [08:40] I saw you can pass in extra dependencies, but that seems to be just other published packages that are not normally in the pbuilder default env. [08:40] That gives you a shell. [08:40] Oh? [08:40] Ah OK, I'll try that, thanks! [08:40] Then you can install the dependencies, and debuild -b [08:41] Perfect... btw, wgrant are you motu (ie. can I pester you to do a review occasionally?) [08:41] noodles775: I am, so sure. [08:41] good morning [08:41] Thanks! [08:41] Morning geser [08:42] Morning geser. [08:46] noodles775: The other option is to set up a local apt repository for your pbuilder, and configure pbuilder to bindmount it into the chroot [08:47] I use a shell script like lp:~maxb/+junk/apt-generate/ to generate the Packages / Release etc. files [08:48] noodles775: hi, were you seeking me the other day? [08:48] maxb: OK... thanks. I'll try just logging in first - as a one-off solution it seems simpler. But if I need to do this more often I'll try the local apt repo. Thanks! [08:48] lifeless: Hi! I just wasn't sure how to go about getting a review, but geser has taken a look for me (for sphinxbase). [08:50] ok cool [08:51] I saw your mail; just a little swamped - bzr2.0 soon and there are still some major regressions in the new format [edge cases, but important ones] [08:52] lifeless: Yes, I realised after sending the email that it was probably a really bad time :) Hope it all goes well! [08:56] thanks [09:34] david_mentre: hi [09:57] Can I ask someone about uploading packages to REVU? [09:57] I've uploaded my package with dput successfully but it doesn't show up on http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/ [09:59] gaspa: hello andrea [10:00] Anyone? [10:03] mschering: it usually takes 5mins to be scanned I think [10:04] I've been waiting much longer [10:04] Hmmm... can you paste the command and output of dput that you ran (at pastebin.ubuntu.com)? [10:05] wgrant: Do I really need to manually install all dependencies? I think I'm doing something wrong: [10:05] http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/224184/ [10:06] just pasted: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/224185/ [10:07] mschering: it's a new package then? [10:08] yes [10:08] noodles775: Maybe try /usr/lib/pbuilder/pbuilder-satisfydepends-gdebi [10:09] david_mentre: sync has been acked. we should wait a little, now. [10:10] mschering: Let me look at REVU for you. [10:11] mschering: You need to upload the _source.changes, not the _i386.changes. [10:11] mschering: Make you sure call debuild with -S. [10:12] Ah ok [10:12] It's a web app and it's actually always a source package [10:12] I'll try again with -S [10:12] Not in Debian terms. [10:13] OK thanks for the help. I'll try again. [10:13] gaspa: well, the ocaml packages are still in http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive//sync-blacklist.txt [10:14] david_mentre: yeah, we should wait a little for an archive-admin to remove it from the blacklist. [10:46] Hello, should I subscribe u-u-s to LP 402874 ? [10:46] Launchpad bug 402874 in sl-modem "Candidate revision sl-modem_2.9.11~20090222-1ubuntu1" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/402874 [10:46] there is no fix attached to this bug, I just said that I'm not sure wether it should be a sync or merge and explain the situation [10:58] coolbhavi: When creating a merged package, you should use 'debuild -v -S -sa' That way even the Debian changes appear in the .changes file. [10:58] yes slytherin [10:58] I do [10:59] coolbhavi: You didn't do it for pbuilder. [10:59] slytherin, okay maybe I missed [11:00] it's the uploader who has to do that [11:00] Laney, okay [11:00] so unless you're a core-dev, it wasn't your fault [11:01] okay [11:01] coolbhavi: *phew* :-) [11:02] mok0, hi [11:03] mok0, I do 5 a day when I am in term holidays :) othertime I dont have time to contribute [11:04] Ahh, my mistake. I assumed coolbhavi is MOTU. [11:04] slytherin, not yet [11:05] slytherin, busy with final year in studies .. ll apply later [11:05] it's in main anyway [11:05] Laney: yup, just checked that. [11:08] slytherin, pbuilder was sponsored by mvo === yofel_ is now known as yofel [11:29] wgrant: I think I must be misunderstanding how pbuilder-satisfydepends-gdebi works... I assumed that it would use /var/cache/pbuilder/apt-cache for the dependencies? [11:29] http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/224235/ [11:30] noodles775: No, apt won't know about that. [11:30] noodles775: You'll have to install the unavailable deps manually first. [11:31] you can use a hook to make built debs available to pbuilder [11:32] http://paste.ubuntu.com/224244/ [11:33] save that as in your pbuilder hooks directory as D10_use_result and make it executable [11:33] then call pbuilder with "--bindmounts /var/cache/pbuilder/result/" [11:34] Thanks james_w [11:34] or configure bindmounts in pbuilderrc [11:34] yep, I've got bindmounts configured to mount the results directory. === zorael_ is now known as Zorael [11:40] Hi MOTUs. Could you, please, take a look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/libcobertura-java . I need this package for netbeans update. [11:53] juli_: I will take a look. I didn't find time yesterday to deal with svn adapter [11:53] :-( [12:10] juli_: done [12:11] :( [12:12] need to merge cdbs for a new package [12:14] debhelper now builds for several python version [12:14] dh_auto_{build|install} I mean [12:14] ooh [12:14] james_w: and it supports ant build system now [12:15] but that's in experimental [12:15] actually both of those additions are in experimental [12:17] btw, with javahelper 0.20, you can do: dh --with javahelper === noodles775 is now known as noodles-afk === dyfet` is now known as dyfet [13:07] Laney: if you manage to merge it, please also address bug 401953 [13:07] Launchpad bug 401953 in cdbs "cdbs creates empty bogus directories if Python files are not installed in /usr/lib/python*" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/401953 [13:08] slytherin, thank you! I'll correct the package. [13:08] AnAnt: yeah, I played with it a bit last night, very nice job. It needs some attention on *.install files, though [13:12] DktrKranz: what are you talking about ? [13:13] DktrKranz: does the bug happen in debian too? [13:13] AnAnt: support for several python versions in dh7 [13:13] oh [13:14] Laney: no, it's Py2.6-related [13:14] DktrKranz: so, what attention do you mean ? [13:15] AnAnt: files are stored under debian/tmp, so you have to provide some debian/*.install files to actually move files in the right binary package [13:16] DktrKranz: can't you do dh_auto_install -p ? [13:16] DktrKranz: to avoid installing in debian/tmp [13:17] AnAnt: I usually do some override, with dh_auto_install -- --root=somewhere [13:18] but if you have tiny rules, you have to either adjust it or provide .install files [13:18] -- ? [13:18] -- passes the rest of the line as option to dh_auto_install [13:19] which it passes to setup.py, in case of distutils packages === dyfet` is now known as dyfet [13:20] * hyperair thinks liferea has *big* issues with being responsive [13:23] bah, i removed apport once. how did it appear on my system again? [13:23] * hyperair growls at apport [13:25] * apport retraces hyperair [13:27] yeah that's what i seriously hate. [13:41] ScottK: ping === dyfet`` is now known as dyfet [13:55] wgrant: if you get a chance, I think the following is ready for review: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/pocketsphinx === noodles-afk is now known as noodles [14:05] Heya folks [14:07] Hi bddebian. [14:08] Heya iulian [14:13] rgreening: Pong. [14:15] bddebian: Did you verify if you are still a MOTU. :-) [14:16] slytherin: No :( === dyfet` is now known as dyfet [16:46] gaspa: merging ghc6 === Zorael is now known as Zorael^nb [16:49] Laney: \o/ [16:53] Uploading ghc6_6.10.4-1ubuntu1_source.changes: done. [16:53] Successfully uploaded packages. [16:54] once this is published, sync haddock, then reupload with the b-d-i back in [16:54] then the world is broken and we get to rebuild everything again [16:55] * DktrKranz likes broken stuff [16:56] Laney: did you manage to get that recap webpage somewhere? [16:58] DktrKranz: No it kept giving blank output and I don't know enough OCaml to fix it [16:58] but kaol has written a NMUtool that we should be able to hack into working [16:59] Laney: that would help a lot, I managed a bit of haskell transitions, and sequence is the key [16:59] indeed [17:01] The good news is with the Alpha 3 freeze on now the buildds should be pretty free. [17:03] out for a few hours [17:03] I'll upload the last bits when I get back [17:03] bye === ember_ is now known as ember === Quintasan_ is now known as Quintasan [18:50] Hi.. [18:51] what is "debuild" command [18:56] folks...what is debuild command in Ubuntu packaging? [18:58] man debuild (install devscripts if needed) [19:02] geser: when i do "apt-get install devscripts", it starts doenloading the scripts but on the telnet window(from where I gave the apt-get command) opens a terminal whose bckground is blue in color...and it asks us to accept... [19:02] but how do we do this? [19:04] how do we handle the problem that I have??? [19:17] kamalnandan: I'll take a stab and say that Tab might cycle through your dialog choices? [19:23] dcraven..thanks for your reply... [19:23] folks..bye for today..its 12 am now [19:23] byw === noodles is now known as noodles775 === ejat is now known as e-jat [19:43] ScottK: ping [19:45] ScottK: what are your thoughts on combinging two src tgz into one (tac-plus + webui)? I believe they should be packaged together, but upstream has them seperate (I think for dev purpose, but they go hand in hand... one no good without the other). [19:46] ScottK: so I was thinking on repacking to jion into one so it can be managed easier. I'd still generate two debs with proper suggest/recommend. Otherwise, it would be two seperate source uploads [19:47] ScottK: I believe the author still has it separate as 1) no distro has it packaged and 2) he has an older webui some were using. [19:48] ScottK: the other reason I wanted to join was to create a meta package to install the daemon + webui, which most users would install (it seems cleaner as one src tgz then) [19:48] ScottK-desktop: ^ [20:25] rgreening: You can combine them, but generally, I don't think it's a good idea. [20:25] It can be painful from a maintainability perspective. [20:25] ScottK: generally, I'd agree. In this case, I [20:26] am working with auther to get the src together into svn or something... [20:26] so, it'll be easier to maintain going forward... [20:38] ScottK: I just proposed my idea to the auther. I hope he agrees so that the next release can be a single tgz (or at the very least distribute 3 src files (individual and a combined). [20:38] rgreening: If so, then combining now isn't a big deal. [20:39] exactly. I explained the reasons for doing it... he seemed agreeable to my other suggestions and 3 patches. so... [20:39] ScottK: I think he's pretty much a lone developer/supported for this package. Any help I guess is really welcome :) [20:40] Hi. I have 5 patches in a packages managed by cdbs and simple-patchsys, and one patch is not applied. Any idea why this could happen? [20:40] fabrice_sp: What's the name of the patch file? [20:42] python2.6-fix.patch seems to be split at build time between python2.6.patch that is not applied and a python2.6-fix.patch that is applied [20:44] pfff: forget it: the patch python2.6.patch is patched within python2.6-fix.patch [20:44] I think debian didn't adopted well my original patch [20:44] ScottK, ^ === bastiao__ is now known as k0p [22:08] Is it possible for me to get mentored to packaged both Code Igniter and Kohana, both php frameworks? [22:08] I've been very interested in doing so for both projects, especially because they will have very little dependencies, so I figured they'd be good projects to learn how to package [22:26] brettalton: if you're interested in a getting a mentor see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Mentoring === vorian is now known as heHATEme [23:21] I see ghc6 6.10.4-1ubuntu1 was uploaded. Anyone coordinating the transition? [23:25] The funny thing is that just yesterday I rebuilt some packages that had never made the 6.10.3 transition... Guess their un-installable again.. [23:29] fta, is this gwibber package of yours functional? i can't get it to do anything useful [23:30] directhex, which one? [23:30] 0.9.1~bzr255-0ubuntu1~fta1 [23:30] old [23:30] really? [23:31] gwibber | 1.2.0~bzr349-0ubuntu1~daily1 | http://ppa.launchpad.net karmic/main Packages [23:31] gwibber | 1.2.0~bzr346-0ubuntu2 | http://archive.ubuntu.com karmic/universe Packages [23:31] deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/fta/ppa/ubuntu jaunty main #fta PPA [23:31] ? [23:32] directhex, did you read the header of my ppa in the last 6 months? [23:32] fta, i don't make a habit of it [23:32] and LP's down [23:33] it's the only communication vector for PPAs i'm afraid [23:33] https://edge.launchpad.net/~gwibber-daily/+archive/ppa [23:33] so something like deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/gwibber-daily/ppa/ubuntu karmic main [23:34] i should really SRU gtwitter to fix the twitpocalypse [23:34] upstream is unable to create proper releases, so dailies are probably the best things you can run [23:34] esp. as the identi.ca api is such a fast moving target [23:50] kirkland: ping [23:51] awe: yo [23:52] if i'm looking at a merge, and the only change between the ubuntu version & debian, is an updated Standards-Version in the control file, should that be punted in favor of a sync?