=== matsubara is now known as matsubara-dinner === matsubara-dinner is now known as matsubara === matsubara is now known as matsubara-afk === mrevell is now known as mrevell-lunch === mrevell-lunch is now known as mrevell === matsubara-afk is now known as matsubara === maxb_ is now known as maxb [15:00] #startmeeting [15:00] Meeting started at 09:00. The chair is bac. [15:00] Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE] [15:00] hello everyone and welcome to the AMEU reviewer's meeting. [15:00] who is here today? team leads will you help me round up your folks who may be tardy? [15:00] me, me me! [15:00] me [15:00] ni! [15:00] me [15:00] ich [15:00] me [15:00] hey [15:01] me [15:01] soyuz non-vacationing/non-seconded team members all correct and present SAH [15:01] me [15:01] sinzui, EdwinGrubbs, salgado: registry team ping [15:01] Code's here. [15:01] sorry sinzu [15:01] i [15:01] o [15:01] u [15:02] me! [15:02] me [15:02] thanks bigjools [15:02] me [15:02] me [15:02] henninge: any more bug folks? [15:02] bac: o7 [15:03] will flacoste be joining us? [15:03] i am [15:03] me [15:03] bac: you mean translations? danilos? [15:03] welcome back flacoste! [15:03] henninge: yeah, that's what i meant. sorry. [15:03] allenap: any of your cohorts around? [15:04] bac: I've just pinged them all... let's see.. [15:04] me [15:04] me [15:04] ok, ok, me too [15:04] :) [15:04] welcome special guest kfogel [15:04] [TOPIC] agenda [15:04] New Topic: agenda [15:04] * jtv applauds kfogel [15:04] * Roll call [15:04] * Apologies: None [15:04] * Action items [15:04] * Mentoring update (leondardr/rockstar) [15:04] * Peanut gallery (anything not on the agenda) [15:04] thanks bac, jtv [15:05] [TOPIC] * Action items [15:05] * Karl to update wiki about sponsoring contributions and take RFC to the mailing list. [15:05] New Topic: * Action items [15:05] So, kfogel would like to know if that item is done or not. [15:05] I wasn't sure what the original spec was; I improvised. Thoughts, folks? [15:05] Thanks kfogel for taking care of that item. I read it and it looks good. [15:05] bac: thank you. [15:05] where is it? [15:05] Did anyone else get a chance to read karl's updates? [15:06] no, url? [15:06] (most of the material was there already, actually -- barry and I put it there long ago) [15:06] * kfogel finds urls... [15:06] https://dev.launchpad.net/FixBugs [15:06] okay, three: [15:06] https://dev.launchpad.net/Patches [15:06] https://dev.launchpad.net/FixBugs [15:06] https://dev.launchpad.net/Reviews [15:06] they interlink [15:07] kfogel: are these all new pages or just additions to existing ones? [15:07] the first two are directly linked from the top nav box on the home page [15:07] bac: FixBugs is a new page [15:07] bac: I updated Patches (and renamed it from PatchSubmission); I don't think I tweaked Reviews much. [15:08] i think this is a good start. [15:08] i think we should avoid using the word "patch", because it might confuse people that are familiar with diff/patch but not with dvcs [15:08] the process and our description on the wiki will evolve but i appreciate karl writing the first cut. [15:08] I'd like to know what's missing; my email to the list didn't get much reaction AFAICT. [15:09] Happy to add more (also happy for people to edit directly, of course!). [15:09] intellectronica: do you have a suggested wording? [15:09] bac: branch [15:09] intellectronica: I didn't quite understand: how will "patch" confuse people in that situation? [15:09] or changeset, if you want to talk about it in the abstract [15:10] "change" ? [15:10] kfogel: they might think that we want them to produce a patch file, rather than a bzr branch [15:10] So I thought the idea was that when you wanted to fix a bug, for example, you found a sponsor and they guided you through the process, starting with some facimile of a pre-implementation call. [15:10] intellectronica: ah. One way might be to simply explain at the top of the Patches page that the end result is a bzr branch, not an actual patch file. [15:10] I think "patch" might still be the term of art for changes. [15:11] kfogel: yeah, i guess just stressing that might be enough [15:11] abentley: if that's the idea, I'd like to suggest that we be more lightweight. It's certainly okay to do that, but people should also feel free to do more lightweight process... [15:11] The name "Patches" doesn't explain whether they can get patches on that page or learn how to submit patches. [15:12] EdwinGrubbs: yeah, i think i prefer the old name PatchSubmission [15:12] EdwinGrubbs, bac: I can revert, easy enough. [15:12] I try to refer to submitting a "change", rather than a patch. Even that's broken, though, because we deal in branches, and branches represent a state, not a change. [15:13] so ACTION items so far: rename back to PatchSubmission; explain at top of page that 'patch' means 'branch'. I do think sticking with the accepted term for patches would be a good idea. It's what everyone uses, even when they're not trading actual patch files. [15:13] abentley: +1 i think change or changeset are good terms which are much less ambiguous [15:13] intellectronica: bzr doesn't have changesets, so I don't think that's a good term to use. [15:14] "improvement"? [15:14] abentley: we could call it revision, which is what bzr actually has, no? [15:14] intellectronica: But multiple revisions are often submitted. [15:14] intellectronica: changeset is a technical term in VC; also, having tried to use it with lots of people, I find I often have to explain it. Many people already know "patch"; those few who don't, once they understand it, will be permanently enabled across the software ecosystem. [15:15] anyway, this turning into a theological discussion. sorry for starting. continue on the list? [15:15] Let's reinforce the existing term, not try to promote a new term. (This is an old debate and an old effort, and it hasn't succeeded in dethroning "patch" yet, IMHO.) [15:15] heh [15:15] I'm not sure people really get tripped up over thinking "patch" literally means a patch. The generic use of the term seems common to me. [15:15] intellectronica: yes, good idea. [15:15] okay, let's go with the two ACTION items above. Any others so far? [15:15] thanks again to karl. please follow up to his email if you have further discussion. [15:16] [TOPIC] * Mentoring update (leondardr/rockstar) [15:16] New Topic: * Mentoring update (leondardr/rockstar) [15:16] rockstar: you have the floor [15:16] leonardr has done an amazing job as a manatee since day one. His reviews are insightful and exploratory. I'm happy to announce his graduation. [15:16] yay [15:16] Congratulations leonardr [15:16] whee [15:17] congratulations leonard. [15:17] congrats leonardr ! [15:17] with his graduation we are mentat-free, i believe. [15:17] leonardr++ [15:17] have we reached the goal of every developer being a reviewer? [15:18] I believe so. [15:19] excellent. i think that plan was hatched in our MIT sprint. congratulations everyone. [15:19] and barry isn't here to join the fun! [15:19] congratulations leonard [15:19] [TOPIC] * Peanut gallery (anything not on the agenda) [15:19] New Topic: * Peanut gallery (anything not on the agenda) [15:20] does anyone have another topic to discuss? [15:21] thanks for coming everyone. please do read the new wiki pages in detail and offer feedback. [15:21] #endmeeting [15:21] Meeting finished at 09:21. [15:21] bac: thank you! [15:21] thank you bac! [15:22] thanks bac === salgado is now known as salgado-lunch === gary_poster is now known as gary-lunch === salgado-lunch is now known as salgado === gary-lunch is now known as gary_poster === danilos is now known as danilo-afk === leonardr is now known as leonardr-afk === leonardr-afk is now known as leonardr === EdwinGrubbs is now known as Edwin-lunch === salgado is now known as salgado-afk === Edwin-lunch is now known as EdwinGrubbs