=== asac_ is now known as asac [00:10] FIREFOX_3_6a1_RELEASE [00:10] shiu [00:10] don't yelll [00:10] too much noise already [00:10] :p [00:10] it's a tag, not my fault [00:18] fta: let me know if you're still getting crazy audio anomalies w/ openarena and the latest alsa-plugins + pulseaudio [00:18] LOL [00:18] still that? [00:20] if you're volunteering to fix it, BUGabundo, ... :-) [00:20] no no [00:20] I want to keep what we have working [00:20] :p [00:31] dtchen, i do, i loose audio after a few second, and before that, it's jerky [00:31] fta: even on _current_ karmic? [00:31] dtchen, i can't play video in ff 3.5/3.6 either, it starts without sound, then freezes after a few seconds [00:32] dtchen, yes, current karmic [00:32] ugh [00:32] fta: after reboot? [00:32] yes [00:32] ok [00:54] fta: i'll work on the userspace cuse -> oss part and ask for testing sometime next week [00:55] dtchen, ok [00:55] there're entirely too few hours in a day [01:02] i know the feeling [01:51] done for tonight [01:51] bye [03:50] Hi there... is there anyone here who can answer a few questions about some firefox-3.5 issues? [03:50] I previously raised some issues on a Launchpad bug, but was directed here instead. [03:58] sure [04:02] mirzmaster: ?? [04:02] actually micah, we may have talked before, and I think you asked me to ask in channel [04:02] but in any case, I was wondering about the "shiretoko" branding. [04:02] sounds familiar :) [04:02] yes? [04:03] Why? :) [04:03] It'll be gone for Karmic [04:03] !ff35 [04:03] Firefox 3.5 Final is available for Jaunty by installing the package firefox-3.5 and firefox-3.5-gnome-support | FF3.5 is referred to as Shiretoko in your UI, see http://is.gd/1reB3 for an explanation | Hardy & Intrepid: http://is.gd/1jkNY [04:05] okay, so the distinguishing btwn ff3 & 3.5 is understandable. [04:05] Another question: Why shared extensions, searchplugins folders... etc.? [04:05] That actually makes shiretoko somewhat "broken". [04:06] what do you mean? [04:06] ubuntu has a princple of one copy of libraries on a system [04:06] so shared extensions fit in [04:06] Right... except extensions in Firefox can be specific to particular versions. [04:07] yes, but Firefox will flag what is not compatible [04:07] In the case of ff3.5, the dictionaries and searchplugins are shared with ff3. [04:07] this results in ff3.5 using the theme from ff3 [04:07] well, they are provided by ff3 [04:07] this will be fixed for karmic [04:07] it's also using the google plugin for ff3 (old logo) [04:07] bug 383404 [04:07] Launchpad bug 383404 in notify-osd "networkmanager + libnotify + available wireless networks = bad usability" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/383404 [04:07] hmm [04:07] bug 383424 [04:07] Launchpad bug 383424 in intltool "Support for custom file formats" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/383424 [04:07] ugh [04:08] mm... wrong bug? :) [04:08] bug 383484 [04:08] Launchpad bug 383484 in firefox-3.5 "search engine plugins missing in firefox-3.5 packages" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/383484 [04:08] bug 390077 [04:08] Launchpad bug 390077 in firefox "The Google's favicon in Firefox (Search Box) needs an update" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/390077 [04:08] those 2 are what you're looking for [04:09] you can subscribe to find out when they are fixed [04:09] In the meantime, I have difficulty recommending ff35 for use to family/friends. They don't know what "shiretoko" is, and if they look at the add-ons manager they see bunches of disabled addons (dictionaries included). [04:09] well, there's no need ot really use it before karmic [04:10] it'll be supported at least until Jaunry [04:10] January [04:10] i think the need is for the user to determine! [04:10] sure [04:10] but you're determining it's not good [04:10] ff3.5 in jaunty has been a preview [04:11] I believe ff35 should either conflict with ff3 or not share extensions/addons for a better user experience. [04:11] True, it is a preview. [04:11] nah [04:11] the extensions that work with 3.5 will work [04:11] like flash [04:11] the ones that won't wont [04:12] Right, but i could end up upgrading an extension to a version for ff35, and then when i switch back to ff3, it's gone. [04:12] nope [04:12] wiat, you're right [04:12] it should still work with 3 [04:12] installed in profile folder [04:12] unless it's just in the profile for ff3.4 [04:12] ff3.5 [04:12] true [04:12] so the user experience isn't horrible... just confusing. :) [04:13] well, only if the user isn't familiar with firefox [04:13] the same thing would happen on windows if you have extensions that aren't compatible [04:13] I consider myself an advanced user, and even I was perplexed about the ff3 theme in ff35... i thought the package didn't install correctly. I kept looking at the build date for a clue. [04:14] well, you stumbled on a nother bug :) [04:15] bug 396786 [04:15] Launchpad bug 396786 in firefox-3.5 "Default theme missing in Firefox 3.5" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/396786 [04:15] There's also the dictionaries... which i think is pretty bad. [04:15] dictionaries are separate actually [04:15] really? [04:15] yep in myspell and hunspell packages [04:16] why does 35 think they are "not compatible"? [04:17] which ones? [04:17] ah you mean the language packs? [04:17] yeah [04:17] i guess that's separate from dictionaries. [04:17] bug 407180 [04:17] Launchpad bug 407180 in firefox-3.5 "Firefox 3.5 needs language packs" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/407180 [04:17] A preview, indeed! :) [04:18] https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-karmic-firefox-3.5 [04:20] I sounds like the resolution for all these bugs is simply to wait for karmic. Is that inaccurate? [04:20] that's correct for the most part :) [04:21] we will probably get some of the fixes that are specific to the firefox packages in jaunty [04:21] But none related to the shared library strategy? [04:21] what's wrong with shared libraries? [04:22] Just that firefox doesn't seem to have been designed with shared libraries in mind. And really these aren't libraries as much as version-specific modules/addons. [04:22] They're not meant for cross-version shared use. [04:22] sure they are [04:22] we went through that already [04:22] there's a min and max version for addons [04:23] the jaunty addons, most of them only have 3.0.* versions [04:23] some might have 3.5.* [04:23] but the extensions will work on both like flash [04:24] right... so sure things won't *break*, but that's to the credit of the robust addons architecture. But i hardly think that was the intention when Mozilla was designing the plugin system... that addons be shared across multiple versions of firefox. [04:25] and of course, i'm only referring to the dictionaries, extensions, plugins, searchplugins folder in /usr/lib/firefox-3.5 [04:25] not the profile-specific ones. [04:26] true, but it does work [04:26] firefox ships it's own gtk libs and others as well [04:26] but debian/ubuntu have 1 set of shared libs for apps [04:26] it's a lot easier to maintain [04:27] Is it really a debian/ubuntu maintenance issue to manage those non-profile specific firefox addons? [04:27] of course [04:27] anything system installed falls under the policy [04:28] that's why we're having so much trouble getting songbird into the repos [04:29] Well, I can understand xulrunner being shared. It was designed to be a shared runtime. But addons, extensions and themes seem to have not been designed like so. [04:29] In the mozilla platform world, those are not shared components. [04:30] imho, they shouldn't be in the lib location at all... but just because they are, doesn't mean they were designed to conform to the debian philosophy. [04:30] there are separate versions of xulrunner [04:30] what harm does it cause? [04:31] user experience harm. Now we have a 35 preview in jaunty, that while not broken, definitely appears to be a haphazard release. It doesn't make sense for end-users, and it sounds like 30 and 35 can never really co-exist in jaunty due to a will to shoehorn mozilla into the debian philosophy. [04:32] like i said, sure it doesn't break... but not breaking isn't wonderful enough for end users. [04:32] sure i can tell friends/family to wait for karmic, but meanwhile they wonder why windows users are using 35 now, but ubuntu users have to deal with a "preview". [04:32] it's broken because things are missing from 35, not because of problems with the library storage [04:33] we have bugs open for the issues and will address them [04:35] Just looking at the google search icon issue alone... this clearly isn't a problem of something missing in 35. The image binary data is in a shared location while clearly 35 was designed to have a different icon than 30 [04:36] the problem is that we think that a search plugin is a "shared library" [04:36] no, that's not the case actually [04:36] that's not a matter of a shared lib [04:36] sorry, am i mistaken? [04:36] and there is a bug open for it as I pointed out above [04:36] the search plugins are only provided by 3.0 at this point [04:36] it was never updated [04:37] so, were they provided by 3.5, the shared location would not be linked in /usr/lib/firefox-3.5? [04:37] well [04:37] a sac is still debating whether or not the search plugins should be shared or not [04:38] the goal is to have all these things fixed for karmic [04:38] and what we can we'll apply to jaunty as well [04:39] hmm [04:39] well, i do applaud the effort. ubuntu is already great thanks to ppl like you. [04:40] * micahg just triages bugs... :) [04:40] please, if you notice anything missing, please bring it up [04:41] we each do what we can. :) [04:42] please, I hope you can bring my concerns before other stakeholders and decision-makers. At the end of the day, I'd like to see true ff3 and ff35 co-existance on jaunty. :) [04:42] well, as soon as the work is done, I can poke for it to be applied to jaunty as well [04:42] thank you! [04:42] i appreciate your time! [04:43] have a good night (depending on where you are) :) [04:43] and feel free to come back and ask if we forget :) [04:43] thanks! [04:43] * micahg is in Chicago [08:57] hola [09:03] hola [09:10] e-jat: hi. help me ... which translation did you represent/try to drive? [09:42] asac: png [09:42] ping [09:45] gandi: yeah. [09:45] hey [09:45] how's it going? [09:45] morning ;) [09:47] asac: do you work on that upstreaming stuff? [09:54] gandi: yes [09:54] gandi: but progress is regularly disrupted :/ [09:55] gandi: if you have someone young and eager with scripting skills send him to me :/ [09:55] asac: hmm, I'll ask pike :) [09:58] jtv: for a while folks claim that we can export translation diffs nowadays ... what is true and what is a tale about it? [09:59] asac: not really "diffs" but there's an option to export just the translations that are different from upstream. [09:59] e.g. like .po files for just the changed strings [09:59] asac: it's hard-coded gettext. [09:59] asac: just take a look at an export page and you should see the option. [09:59] asac: although I couldn't swear that it's on all download pages; it may be only the per-pofile ones. [10:00] jtv: there are two use cases for that: a) upstreaming improvements and b) identifying languages we need to specifically QA and talk to the group at [10:00] asac: it was meant for the former, but if it works for more, great. :) [10:00] jtv: for b) we would at best have a feature to export all changed strings for all languages at once (or scripted) [10:00] asac: well, go play with it. :-) [10:00] jtv: david planella says it would be too hard for him to export all languages manually [10:01] hmm [10:01] jtv: so can i export for multiple languages at once or not? [10:01] asac: I don't know off the top of my head; try it! [10:01] (yes, i will play with it ... just wanted to give him input how we could QA things) [10:01] hmm [10:01] ok [10:01] thanks [10:02] asac: btw I don't know what would happen if you enabled automatic exports to a bzr branch on an XPI project, so better not try that for a while. :-) [10:03] asac: Malay .. [10:03] asac: mighty asac .. how to eliminate this horrible ubuntu/google default search engine thing? [10:03] e-jat: ok thanks. thats what i thought! [10:04] * asac remembers now [10:04] sebner: tools -> addons -> disable multisearch [10:05] asac: there will be a translation sprint when at global jam soon . we planning for the jam .. [10:05] asac: you are my hero \o/ , don't forget to tell the archive admins to remove that thing from the archive :P [10:43] fta: hardy ia32libs didnt have nss/nspr? [10:44] fta: can you update your chromium-ia32libs package (if that has nss/nspr) ... or did you already do that? [10:47] hi. The daily built yesterday failed. Anyone is fixing that? [10:48] If not, I'm going to take a look inside it. [10:49] I mean xulrunner. [11:01] paulliu_asuna, ask asac :) [11:10] paulliu_asuna: hi. thanks [11:10] paulliu_asuna: i removed the patch that failed from trunk ... but i couldnt check if there are any follow up patches that failed [11:10] asac, anyway the ubutfox thing is really bad [11:10] asac: hi. Just a simple hunk failed. [11:11] asac, it would be nice to have a normal startup page [11:11] asac, and not that one [11:11] paulliu_asuna: yeah. but it failed to often causing too much work and i dropped a rational for dropping it in the changelog [11:11] paulliu_asuna: but me and fta would be more than happy to have more eyes on dailies in future [11:11] there will still be patches that fail frequently [11:11] asac: ok. Thank you..:) [11:12] paulliu_asuna: yo could check if the current patches now apply ... [11:12] so we know that today dailies work well [11:12] asac: I fix that hunk and things are working well now. [11:12] paulliu_asuna: yeah. thats the _gre_... patch right? [11:13] asac: yes. bzXXX_gre_extension_plugin_support.patch [11:13] yeah so lets keep that removed and see if there are any regressions. it was never upstreamed and upstream signalled that they dont want it that way [11:13] so its good that i finally removed it (and i fought with myself for a while) [11:14] paulliu_asuna: can you check if all patches apply with that one removed? [11:14] paulliu_asuna: so in future, just drop a note here if you start to work on dailies and suggests merge when done [11:14] asac: ok. wait. [11:14] yeah i am here ;) [11:14] andv: the search thing is NOT IN ubufox [11:15] please dont spread that false claim [11:15] asac, I removed it and it disappeared [11:15] its a separate extension like i described in my blog posted [11:15] the extension is called "multisearch" [11:15] ubufox only sets the homepage default [11:15] asac, couldnt find it on my add/remove menu [11:15] but it does that for ages [11:16] asac: bz467751_att351167_sysplugin_xre_part.patch failed if totally removed that patch [11:16] asac, I removed ubufox and now everything looks cleaner [11:16] asac, it's a bit faster as well [11:17] asac, I gonna keep this all in extension installed [11:17] it's a nice ext to have [11:18] asac: Do you need the refreshed _reg_.patch?? I can send it to you. [11:18] andv: i wont argue based on such vague claims. what is cleaner, etc. [11:19] paulliu_asuna: if its the one i just removed then no. [11:19] asac: ah, then we have to refresh bz467751_att351167_sysplugin_xre_part.patch [11:19] asac, yeah, don't get angry now, it was just my opinion [11:20] andv: i dont get angry, but saying "erything looks cleaner" is just not true. ubufox doesnt change anything in the ui [11:20] only thing it adds is one menu entry in tools -> addons [11:20] so you are definitly just wrong and confuse things here [11:21] asac, looks cleaner for the fast it has no more that homepage [11:21] * fact [11:21] but has an homepage you can choose [11:21] from preferences menu [11:21] then dont say: "everything looks cleaner" ... say: "mozilla default homepage looks better than ubuntu startpage" [11:21] yep, that's it [11:21] ok [11:21] thats a valid opinion [11:21] and that's what a lot of guys said on that bug report [11:22] I saw some days ago [11:22] that's why you made that post on your blog [11:22] I guess [11:22] but thats not going to change. and ndisabling ubufox is not the right answer. just change the homepage for you ;) [11:22] andv: no. the blog post is about the chrome search and awesomebar search and newtab [11:22] oh ok [11:22] andv: and that is shipped in multisearch extension [11:22] the homepage has been like that since gutsy [11:23] maybe I was used to change it [11:23] yeah [11:23] asac: do you need the refreshed bz467751_att351167_sysplugin_xre_part.patch?? I've done it. [11:23] but the current ubuntu start page is better than the hardy one [11:23] yep, that's true [11:24] but for a wider use of the google search thing I prefer keeping it at normal stage [11:24] so without modifications [11:24] e.g changing where I have to search (ubuntu or web) [11:24] I'm lazy [11:24] :D [11:24] yes. all those things are discusesd in the bugs about multisearch [11:25] the bug tag we use is "multisearch" ... just search for such bugs and add your input there [11:25] ok [11:25] anyway asac didnt want to offend you or your work, just wanted to express my opinion about this search thing [11:26] which seems bad for me but could be good for someone else [11:26] just different opinions [11:26] thats ok. its just that this has been discussed for so long so i am tired of talkking about it atm [11:26] just check the bugs and read the blog entry [11:26] first time I approach this argument sorry [11:27] there is all info you need [11:27] no problem [11:27] and anyway my answer to this is changing what is needed for my needs [11:27] and that's all [11:27] I won't bug anyone to have things changed [11:28] the great thing here is I can add / remove everything I may want, so np [11:29] k [11:31] asac: http://nopaste.com/p/acYb9ePMl [11:37] ok this is odd. asac is there an issue with setting default browser in thunderbird to our daily build firefox-3.5? [11:42] i know i have seen this bug before i just find it anymore [12:12] anyone running Jaunty that can test a bug for me [12:13] paulliu_asuna: ok, so the right way to do that is to bump the changelog version to the version that failed and comit that and then request a merge [12:13] paulliu_asuna: after doing a few of those, we can probably give you access to the branches directly [12:13] let me know if you can do that [12:14] paulliu_asuna: you can check bzr log to see how to make new snapshot and document it [12:14] also add yourself to the changelog like the other folks that are in there already [12:14] paulliu_asuna: after requesting merge you can poke me and fta to merge it in [12:14] hopefully we are responsive enough [12:18] asac: ok. I'll do that. [12:19] someone please test bug 409964 and comment on it. thanks [12:19] Launchpad bug 409964 in firefox-3.0 "Firefox cannot connect with server of pandanda.com" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/409964 [12:21] great [12:29] fta: can you get the profile migration stuff done for the 3.5 default thing? [12:29] e.g. basically what we did for 2.0 etc. [12:29] in hardy [12:29] i would more comfortable if you could do it as you basically own that script [12:30] i plan to upload it on monday [12:31] * asac does some NM testing ... bbiw [12:40] bdmurray: can you make awe a bugcontrol member please ? [12:41] for NM stuff etc. it would be really helpful [12:41] thanks [12:41] bdmurray: launchpad.net/~awe [12:51] asac: yes, done [12:59] thx [13:13] armin76: you know the sparc failure because of solaris symbols ... .was that fixed upstream on trunk? [13:13] do you have a patch? [13:20] jdstrand, any luck reviewing that new package? [13:33] asac: kazehakase is crashing. version 0.5.4-2.1ubuntu3 is that the one you uploaded? [13:39] not a whole lot of info from apport. asac here is the bug i filed bug 410271 [13:39] Bug 410271 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/410271 is private [14:09] what happend to the python xpcom interface in xulrunner-1.9.1? [14:14] Error: uncaught exception: [Exception... "Component returned failure code: 0x804b000a (NS_ERROR_MALFORMED_URI) [nsIIOService.newURI]" nsresult: "0x804b000a (NS_ERROR_MALFORMED_URI)" location: "JS frame :: file:///usr/lib/firefox-3.6a1pre/components/nsSessionStore.js :: sss_deserializeHistoryEntry :: line 2111" data: no] [14:14] Error: uncaught exception: [Exception... "Component returned failure code: 0x80570016 (NS_ERROR_XPC_GS_RETURNED_FAILURE) [nsIJSCID.getService]" nsresult: "0x80570016 (NS_ERROR_XPC_GS_RETURNED_FAILURE)" location: "JS frame :: chrome://browser/content/safebrowsing/sb-loader.js :: anonymous :: line 48" data: no] [14:15] 3.6 is seriously broken, i wondered why they just released 3.6a1 in that state, it was far better up to a week ago [14:15] -ed [14:16] andv: not yet, I've been working on several security updates [14:20] jdstrand, ok [14:20] ;) [14:21] asac, which branch? [14:42] does thunderbird not adhere to the default browser set by alternatives? [14:42] why is the python xpcom module installed to a private path in xulrunner-1.9 and completely missing in xulrunner-1.9.1? [14:44] fta: one sec [14:44] sunbird: https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~gnomefreak/sunbird/ubuntu-0.x.9.10 .... orig is in his ppa [14:45] seamonkey: https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~gnomefreak/seamonkey/seamonkey-1.1.x.dev [14:45] asac, hm, no, the ff 3.5 profile [14:45] orig is probably in ppa too [14:45] hehe [14:45] fta: ok [14:45] fta: 3.1.head [14:45] ok [14:45] you can also add the firefox meta package there if you want [14:46] not sure if we had a firefox-gnome-support meta thing [14:46] asac, [Fri 07 01:01] FIREFOX_3_6a1_RELEASE [14:46] seems like it ... so that too would be great [14:46] fta: yeah [14:46] read about it ... they seem to make a branch for 3.6 now [14:48] asac, ? 3.7? [14:48] fta: not so sure ... they are just talking about it [14:48] we will see... i dont see a branch yet. but i guess its a mozilla-1.9.2 ... and the final ffox version is unknown [14:48] fta: oh also: official branding for 3.1.head ;) [14:49] but at best not for dailies [14:49] unless upstream uses official for dailies, but afaik they dont [14:56] asac, er.. 3.5 as default, you mean drop the profile patches, offer to migrate the profile, right? but what about hardy..jaunty? [15:09] fta: i thought we discussed its ok to make ffox 3.5 default for all dailies [15:10] i felt happy with that decision [15:10] is there anything i am missing? [15:10] just people running both 3.0 and 3.5 at the same time (for addons) [15:10] fta: and yes. drop profile patches, offer migration profile ... and make branding official for real releases [15:11] fta: from what i know the profiles are similar enough that you can switch back and forth [15:11] fta: and extensions would get disabled/enabled automatically [15:11] fta: if you want we can make a temporary .head.stable branch used for the stable dailies and see if we get bugs on the profile back and forth thing [15:12] actually i would like that. but wouldnt wnat to ask for that if its too much work on your behalf [15:12] in the end i definitly want all dailies to come from same branch [15:12] i'm just concerned about the "at the same time" part of my sentence [15:13] fta: you can decide. if you want we can do the head.stable approach and see if we get some kind of complains like that in karmic [15:13] btw. nm trunk landed ;) [15:13] are you using the bot at all? [15:16] fta: we have prepared the branches to be usable now i think [15:16] i dropped the ball to setup it on my own. if you want that i can do that again, but i hoped you can run it for me ;) [15:16] fta: you dont need to adjust any patches ... its me and now tony that will do all the work ;) [15:17] ok [15:17] fta: i will cleanup the teams so noone not contributing is in there [15:17] and let you know [15:17] do you support LOCAL_BRANCH ? [15:17] ok have to talk with someone [15:17] fta: is that preferred? [15:17] fta: that should be easy. we have GIT_URL =? [15:18] we could map that to LOCAL_BREANCH if thats set [15:18] no, LOCAL_BRANCH is a local directory, so you can just update instead of co/branch/clone [15:19] so LOCAL_BRANCH also should do the update of that branch? [15:19] you have to create it, look at v8 [15:19] not only use a local git tree to produce tarballs? [15:19] fta: ok. i will chec that [15:19] NM branches are not that big though, but we will do it [15:29] http://code.google.com/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=15973 [15:42] asac, http://paste.ubuntu.com/249259/ [15:48] asac, er.. http://paste.ubuntu.com/249262/ === ejat is now known as e-jat [16:18] asac, what about /usr/bin ? [16:59] asac, hm, it doesn't work. [17:00] asac, if you start /usr/lib/firefox-3.5.2/firefox and update some addons, it restarts 3.0.x [17:02] asac, current state of the patch: http://paste.ubuntu.com/249296/ [17:18] fta: sorry had no connection because of knetworkmanager brekage [17:18]