[02:47] <manakfula> Hello everyone, I have a couple quick questions about edubuntu
[02:47] <manakfula> I'm familiar with ubuntu so it's nothing really technical
[02:48] <manakfula> and I apologize if I get disconnected, my wireless sucks...I'll be back if that happens
[02:49] <manakfula> does edubuntu come with a spanish distribution or spanish language option at the time of installation?
[02:49] <manakfula> (im not sure if that whole message went through or not I only see part of it)
[02:50] <manakfula> I'll retype it incase it didn't...does it come with a spanish disto or installation option?
[02:51] <manakfula> or just the spanish learning/tutor program?
[02:55] <Manakfula> sorry about that told you my wireless sucks
[02:55] <Manakfula> so is anyone here or is the room just idle?
[11:20] <davew> Am trying to use the profile editor in 9.04 but there is a bug in it. Actually this is one feature that I need as I am using LTSP with 30 clients. Anyone got any ideas
[11:21] <alkisg> davew: sbalneav is trying to fix the bugs and hopes it'll be ready for 9.10. There's a new version at his PPA that works for some people.
[11:22] <davew> Have tried the sbalneav fix and it didn't work for me - are you saying it doesn't work for everybody ?
[11:23] <alkisg> Yup. I don't know the last ubuntu version that sabayon worked in, maybe it was back in gutsy or something...
[11:23] <alkisg> davew: what exactly do you want to lock with sabayon? Maybe there are ways to do it with gconf...
[11:24] <davew> Oh dear I'm in trouble. Without this I don't know what I can do !!!
[11:25] <davew> Do you know when 9.10 which I presume is the next version is out ?
[11:26] <alkisg> 9 = 2009, 10 = 10th month = october
[11:28] <davew> Understood - I am in trouble ! I understand that Sabayon has not worked for about 12 months, is that true ?
[11:29] <alkisg> Well, I bet it's working right now for people that have older ubuntu versions...
[11:30] <alkisg> But yeah, I don't think it has worked in the recent ubuntu releases
[11:32] <davew> O.K. Thanks for that I will have to strip out 9.04 and put in something older or another distro which has similar features. Thanks for your help I have been trying to get some information for several days. Cheers .
[11:32] <alkisg> davew: but again, it may be possible to lock down your desktop for your clients with gconf-editor
[11:33] <davew> Will this allow me to do it globally  for say a particular group ?
[11:34] <alkisg> Hmmm kind of. Global locking is global, not per group. But you could copy the settings on all members of a group.
[11:35] <davew> O.K.  I'll have a look - thanks again .
[11:35] <alkisg> Bye
[16:54] <mss> hello ... I have been facing the hardy release DHCP issue seen by others such as :
[16:54] <mss> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/edubuntu-users/2008-December/004911.html
[16:54] <mss> above
[16:54] <mss> Today I captured some logs from my system, turning on one client at a time ...and logs show how slow things get ..
[16:55] <mss> where can I upload so experts can take a look ?
[16:56] <mss> I have captured daemon and kern logs among others
[18:05] <mss> hi alkisg
[18:06] <alkisg> Hello mss, hi all
[18:06] <mss> we spoke a few days ago about the hardy DHCP problem :
[18:06] <mss> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/edubuntu-users/2008-December/004911.html
[18:06] <mss> I have daemon, kern and other logs showing the problem
[18:07] <mss> I booted clients one at a time ....the first two boot fast .. the next few start slowing down ...
[18:08] <alkisg> mss, it seems like your case is a dhcp server problem, but then again, I'm not sure, e.g. "slowing down"? Aquiring a dhcp lease should only take some msec...
[18:09] <mss> yes .. I understand that ....but it has now been seen by several folks that this DHCP "slowing down" problem exists ...
[18:09] <mss> in some cases ....
[18:10] <alkisg> Any links for bug reports?
[18:11] <alkisg> mss: an easy thing to try would be another dhcp server, e.g. dnsmasq
[18:11] <alkisg> This way you would be sure if it is or not a dhcp3-server - related problem
[18:13] <mss> I could try that ..but am not clear on exactly how to set up a different dhcp server ... other folks who have moved to a different dhcp server, fould it works fine .
[18:13] <alkisg> mss: also, try to post in #ltsp-discuss, you may have additional chances for an answer there...
[18:13] <mss> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/edubuntu-users/2008-December/004914.html
[18:14] <mss> looks like nobody has filed a bug yet ...
[18:14] <alkisg> "We figured that as the box got busy serving up the tftp kernels the dhcp would start to fail/timeout." I haven't heard of anyone having this problem, though...
[18:15] <alkisg> You may try dnsmasq like this:
[18:15] <alkisg> sudo invoke-rc.d dhcp3-server stop
[18:15] <alkisg> sudo apt-get install dnsmasq
[18:15] <alkisg> create an /etc/dnsmasq.d/ltsp.conf file with:
[18:16] <alkisg> port=0 # this makes dnsmasq *not* function as a dns server
[18:16] <alkisg> dhcp-range=10.160.31.100,10.160.31.120,8h  # change with your specific range
[18:16] <alkisg> sudo invoke-rc.d dnsmasq restart
[18:16] <mss> The logs I captured show exactly htis problem .
[18:16] <alkisg> [18:17] <mss> thanks .. I will try dnsmasq like you sugested ..
[18:17] <alkisg> mss: do you have a small log part that shows that the server gets a dhcp_discover, and doesn't answer with a dhcp_offer?
[18:18] <alkisg> If so, you should definately file a bug against dhcp3-server...
[18:18] <mss> yes ...I have the logs ... it answers .. but very slowly .. let me pul it up for you ...
[18:20] <mss> here's the first client .
[18:20] <mss> Aug  9 12:48:54 coco dhcpd: DHCPDISCOVER from 00:1e:0b:39:fa:d1 via eth1
[18:20] <mss> Aug  9 12:48:55 coco dhcpd: DHCPOFFER on 192.168.0.245 to 00:1e:0b:39:fa:d1 via eth1
[18:20] <mss> Aug  9 12:48:57 coco dhcpd: DHCPREQUEST for 192.168.0.245 (192.168.0.254) from 00:1e:0b:39:fa:d1 via eth1
[18:20] <mss> Aug  9 12:48:57 coco dhcpd: DHCPACK on 192.168.0.245 to 00:1e:0b:39:fa:d1 via eth1
[18:21] <alkisg> The client needed 2 seconds to process the offer and request it? !!!
[18:21] <mss> here's the next client by which time things start to slow down
[18:21] <mss> Aug  9 13:02:44 coco dhcpd: DHCPDISCOVER from 00:1e:0b:39:fa:ef via eth1
[18:21] <mss> Aug  9 13:03:09 coco dhcpd: DHCPOFFER on 192.168.0.247 to 00:1e:0b:39:fa:ef via eth1
[18:21] <mss> Aug  9 13:03:34 coco dhcpd: DHCPREQUEST for 192.168.0.247 (192.168.0.254) from 00:1e:0b:39:fa:ef via eth1
[18:21] <mss> Aug  9 13:03:59 coco dhcpd: DHCPACK on 192.168.0.247 to 00:1e:0b:39:fa:ef via eth1
[18:22] <alkisg> Yeah that *doesn't* look like a dhcp problem to me, but a network problem
[18:22] <alkisg> If it was a server problem, the client wouldn't need (34-09) seconds to process the offer and send a request
[18:23] <mss> the strange thing is ....even before the DHCPDISCOVER shows up in the log ... I can see the client has already acquired the address and on its way ..
[18:23] <mss> but the DHCPACK shows up much later in the log ..
[18:24] <alkisg> There are 2 dhcp requests for each client, did you know that?
[18:24] <alkisg> One during the pxe boot, and one later *after* the kernel boots
[18:24] <mss> yes .... I showed only the first of each client
[18:25] <alkisg> Ah... well then I still don't see this as a dhcp server problem
[18:25] <alkisg> If a client is booted and you try to operate it when other clients boot, does it function correctly, or is it very very slow?
[18:25] <alkisg> E.g. having both full duplex and half duplex clients on the same switch can bring down the network speed to a crawl...
[18:26] <mss> well....the first three- four clients boot....
[18:26] <mss> then the rest do not get any response  in time before the client times out ..
[18:27] <mss> all clients are identical .. hp5135s
[18:27] <alkisg> ok, but during this "clients do not get any response" phase, if you try to sit down on a client a work on it, does it work fine, or is it slow? If it were slow, this would suggest a network problem...
[18:28] <mss> the clients that are up seem to work fine ....
[18:28] <alkisg> Can you upload a full log file somewhere?
[18:28] <mss> yes ..have all the logs
[18:29] <mss> can I email ... only 400k
[18:29] <alkisg> OK... my nickname at gmail dot com
[18:30] <alkisg> also, what NICs do the clients have?
[18:35] <mss> clients ? no idea, but I know other have been using these clients fine ....
[18:36] <alkisg> With the same distro?
[18:36] <alkisg> (and version)?
[18:36] <mss> sent email - it is a zip file of all logs
[18:36] <mss> yes ...
[18:37] <mss> I believe Asmo Koskinen asmo.koskinen at arkki.info  is using them ..
[18:37] <mss> saw him mention in one of his posts
[18:37] <mss> 8.04.10 .. last updated 12 days ago with all current (at that time ) updates
[18:38] <mss> client has 128 MB ram ... shoud that be an issue ?
[18:39] <alkisg> No
[18:40] <alkisg> ...but even with the first client, there are problems: http://alkisg.pastebin.com/d2b2bbb97
[18:40] <alkisg> Even though the client gets a dhcp_ack, it requests the same IP again
[18:40] <mss> I thought that was the kernel
[18:40] <alkisg> There are 3 acks tehre
[18:41] <alkisg> 1 = pxe, 2 = kernel, 3 = problem
[18:41] <mss> every client does this twice ....
[18:49] <mss> but there are only 2 DISC/OFFER s
[18:49] <mss> you are saying the last pair of lines REQUEST/ACK is a problem ?
[18:50] <alkisg> I'm saying that it seems to ignore the "12:49:16 coco dhcpd: DHCPACK"
[18:50] <alkisg> So, if it doesn't get the first ack, it seems like a network problem exists even with 1 client
[18:52] <mss> or if the dhcp server is slow and it gets two reqs one after the other ... is it possible it is responding to both ?
[18:53] <alkisg> Hmmmm though I had send a patch last year for ipconfig that had to do with DHCPNAKs, maybe it didn't make it for 8.04 and that bug is still there
[18:54] <alkisg> http://www.zytor.com/pipermail/klibc/2008-June/002311.html
[19:02] <mss> it says your patch was applied :-)
[19:02] <alkisg> Yeah I know, but I don't know if it make it for hardy
[19:02] <alkisg> I think it's only fixed in 8.10 and 9.04...
[19:02] <mss> thought it should have at least made it to 8.04.10
[19:03] <alkisg> But anyway mss I don't think that ipconfig is your main problem here
[19:04] <alkisg> I mean, in the second client dhcp takes dozens of seconds!!!
[19:04] <mss> I will try the dnsmasq and see how it goes ... I have the ltsp setup at a remote location ( no internet) .. so I can take the dnsmasq.deb file and install .. correct ?
[19:04] <mss> yes ... and then it gets wors ....
[19:04] <alkisg> I think you'll need 2 debs, dnsmasq.deb and dnsmasq-base.deb
[19:04] <alkisg> But do try this:
[19:05] <alkisg> 1. Boot 4-5 clients (as many as they boot)
[19:05] <alkisg> 2. Try to work on one of them. Does it work ok?
[19:05] <mss> but when I left the system alone for a few hours and came back and booted a client .. the first one again came up fast and fine ... then the second one slowed .. and the process repeated ...
[19:05] <alkisg> Ah
[19:05] <mss> it is in the logs ...
[19:06] <alkisg> 3. After a while, open another client and see if it boots fast <== you just answered that
[19:06] <mss> after 14:xx . I came back at 17:xx
[19:06] <alkisg> You don't even have dhcpd.conf in the logs, though...
[19:06] <mss> in the logs
[19:06] <alkisg> Nor /etc/network/interfaceds
[19:07] <mss> dhcpd conf standard as edubuntu requires .. done during installation .. nothing special
[19:07] <mss> attached ifconfig .. if it helps
[19:07] <alkisg> I wonder if it's a tftp problem, i.e. the whole network slows down when the clients get the kernel via tftp
[19:08] <mss> possible ... could you take a loo at kern logs ... it just keeps going on for a client log after the login screen is presented on the clinet ..is that a problem ?
[19:09] <mss> but each client should take no more than 10 secs to get the image
[19:09] <mss> on a FE LAN
[19:10] <alkisg> Yeah, unless there's a problem :) (which is the only thing certain here :))
[19:10] <alkisg> I've seen tftp needing half an hour to server a kernel in problematic cases...
[19:11] <alkisg> *serve
[19:11] <mss> :-)
[19:11] <mss> if the PHY is messed up and retransmissions happen .. I guess it can happen
[19:11] <alkisg> How difficult would it be to try out 9.04? E.g. in a different partition?
[19:12] <alkisg> The installation takes < 30 mins...
[19:12] <mss> I am trying to set up a different system in a couple of days .. I can try 9.04 on that
[19:12] <mss> is it a LTS release ?
[19:13] <alkisg> No, but it was released a year later than 8.04, so they'll be supported for about the same time (only 6 months difference)
[19:14] <mss> so .. I will try both the dnsmasq and the 9.04 and let you know in a day or two ...
[19:15] <mss> thanks for your help
[19:15] <alkisg> mss, ps:
[19:15] <alkisg>  /usr/share/doc/ltsp-server/examples/dhcpd-dnsmasq <== example file for dnsmasq config
[19:15]  * alkisg gotta go... bye all
[19:16] <mss> thanks