[00:00] <BUGabundo> you run a tracking on chromium?
[00:00] <BUGabundo> what's that realtime search thingy?
[00:00]  * BUGabundo google real time search engine
[00:00] <BUGabundo> http://venturebeat.com/2009/06/20/who-rules-real-time-search-a-look-at-9-contenders/
[00:00] <BUGabundo> grreee
[00:00] <BUGabundo> bad google
[00:01] <BUGabundo> 2nd hit http://collecta.com/
[00:06]  * BUGabundo echo sleep > /etc/mode && /home/BUGabundo reload
[00:07] <fta> BUGabundo, you should really learn some shell
[00:07] <BUGabundo> its a joke
[00:07] <BUGabundo> come on!!!
[00:08] <BUGabundo> its not even meant to work
[00:08] <BUGabundo> just to say gudd night
[00:08] <BUGabundo> grrr
[00:08] <BUGabundo> some day I'll have to install a spellchecker on this brain of mine
[00:36] <micahg> asac: are you still here?
[00:46] <asac> micahg: for a minute or so ... yes
[00:46] <micahg> ok, first, I rejected a bug to pacakge FF3.6a1
[00:46] <asac> micahg: wishlist bug?
[00:46] <micahg> second, I just saw that mozilla wants to release ff3.6 in quick order
[00:47] <micahg> Well, is there any chance we'd consider packaging individual pre-releases
[00:47] <micahg> I would think that time would be better spent elsewhere
[00:47] <asac> not sure what you mean by that
[00:47] <micahg> as we have the dailies
[00:48] <micahg> packaging 3.6a1 in an official repo
[00:48] <micahg> ?
[00:48] <asac> not a1
[00:48] <asac> micahg: so for official archive we usually start on late alphas
[00:48] <asac> like 5 or 6 in the past
[00:48] <asac> or even early betas
[00:48] <asac> we want to create a milestone ppa though
[00:48] <asac> that would fit in there imo
[00:48] <asac> milestone/backports ppa
[00:48] <micahg> should I reopen the request?
[00:49] <asac> micahg: a general wishlist bug "3.6aX in the archive can be kept open
[00:49] <asac> at best give us the bug id so we can alread add it to changelog
[00:49] <micahg> ok, I'll just open as packaging ff3.6
[00:49] <asac> yeah
[00:50] <micahg> second
[00:50] <asac> micahg: and xul 1.9.2 ;)
[00:50] <micahg> separate bug?
[00:50] <micahg> or same?
[00:52] <micahg> bug 410959
[00:53] <micahg> should xul192 be a separate bug?
[00:54] <asac> not sure. i think most will look for ffox bug so it should be fine
[00:54] <micahg> ok
[00:54] <micahg> so just add xul192 to it?
[00:54] <micahg> or jsut leave it
[00:54] <asac> micahg: at best link our .head branch to it so noone wastes time and does a package ;)
[00:54] <asac> micahg: add both branches
[00:56] <micahg> This one? https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~mozillateam/firefox/firefox-3.2.head
[00:56] <asac> yes
[00:56] <asac> we should rename it at some point
[00:58] <micahg> Is this the head for xulrunner?  lp:~mozillateam/xulrunner/xulrunner-1.9.2.head
[00:58] <asac> http://benjamin.smedbergs.us/blog/2009-08-07/pyxpcom-welcome-todd-whitema/
[00:58] <asac> micahg: yes
[01:00] <micahg> ok
[01:00] <micahg> last issue for the night
[01:00] <micahg> mozilla was talking about releasing 3.6 quickly
[01:00] <asac> from what i know they try to aim for 9 month cycles since 3.0
[01:00] <asac> 3.5 took 12 month though
[01:00] <micahg> would it follow that 3.5 support will only be 6-9 months after 3.6 release?
[01:01] <asac> i guess they will not extend their support timeframe unfortunately
[01:01] <asac> so yes.
[01:01] <micahg> so, maybe we should include ff 3.6 in universe in karmic
[01:01] <micahg> that way it'll have a browser for its entire life
[01:02] <asac> problem is that we cant really make it the default so this wouldnt help much
[01:02] <fta> asac, we should do something to make the bot abort if the tarball is not for the right branch.. like foo-1.2 version 1.3a1pre
[01:02] <asac> fta: yeah
[01:03] <asac> otherwise we are doomed when they bump version i guess
[01:03] <micahg> well, for hardy was ff3 default or ff2?
[01:03] <asac> we have now moz-version --compare in mozilla-devscripts. we could use that to test/declare upper/lower version bounds
[01:03] <asac> either manualyl maintained or auto generated from changelog upstream version
[01:03] <fta> ...
[01:06] <asac> micahg: for hardy ff3
[01:07] <micahg> ah
[01:07] <fta> maybe abort in MOZCLIENT_POSTCOCMD and propagate the failure.. not sure the rest will follow though..
[01:07] <micahg> well, what happens to jaunty after january?
[01:07] <micahg> default browser loses support
[01:07] <asac> micahg: backports
[01:08] <asac> micahg: what happens to hardy-jaunty after january
[01:08] <micahg> ok, but at least ff3.5 is in the repos and will have support at least though 2010
[01:08] <micahg> that's why I'm wondering about ff3.6
[01:08] <asac> not in hardy
[01:08] <micahg> yeah
[01:08] <asac> the universe package are not a valid support option
[01:09] <asac> the problem is xulrunner ... which has rdepends
[01:09] <asac> it would be quite an effort to backport all rdepends to new xulrunner
[01:09] <asac> but might be the best way indeed ;)
[01:09] <fta> maybe we'll have chromium by then ;)
[01:09] <asac> not so sure yet if i want to do that
[01:10] <fta> !info firefox dapper
[01:10] <asac> fta: it doesnt matter. rdepends is the problem
[01:10] <fta> we still have that, so why not 3.0
[01:10] <asac> did i say something different?
[01:10] <micahg> fta: dapper isn't receving desktop support
[01:10] <asac> i will backport patches until i die ;)
[01:11] <fta> i really wonder how many users are still using that...
[01:11] <asac> fta: its EOL now.
[01:11] <asac> (dapper)
[01:11] <micahg> asac: can we add a note about FF EOL like debian does?
[01:11] <asac> only server is still supported
[01:11] <fta> the desktop
[01:11] <asac> micahg: no
[01:11] <asac> micahg: debian surrenders ... which is not something we can do
[01:11] <micahg> lol
[01:12] <asac> actually we supported in debian for full stable
[01:12] <asac> just not for oldstable
[01:12] <asac> because we have no folks that are willing to maintain oldstable long enough
[01:12] <micahg> so you intend to backport fixes to 3.0.x until karmic is EOL?
[01:12] <asac> and i tried as best as i could, but my time is also finite
[01:12] <micahg> I know
[01:13] <asac> micahg: until hardy is EOL
[01:13] <asac> not sure what comes first
[01:13] <micahg> same time :)
[01:13] <micahg> 4/11
[01:13] <asac> 3.0 will ride along with that
[01:13] <asac> so yeah
[01:13] <asac> good luck for karmic then
[01:13] <asac> i think its 12 month backports
[01:13] <asac> should be doable
[01:13] <asac> 3.5 branch is not that much different
[01:13] <asac> i expect most issues to popup in tracemonkey ... which dont need to be backported in most cases
[01:14] <asac> as 3.0 has no tracemonkey
[01:14] <asac> the layout stuff etc. is hopefully similar enough to make backports possible
[01:15] <micahg> ok, so only CVE's would be backported?
[01:16] <asac> in the past i backported all sg:* bugs fixed upstream
[01:16] <micahg> I'm just wondering if I should be marking stuff Won't Fix for ff3.0
[01:16] <asac> not all get a MFSA/CVEs, but most
[01:16] <asac> of course MFSA/CVE bugs have priority
[01:16] <micahg> what is sg:*?
[01:16] <asac> micahg: everything except security group bugs or top crashers are wont fix in 3.0
[01:16] <asac> (and packaging bugs)
[01:17] <micahg> ok, I'll keep marking them then ;)
[01:17] <asac> micahg: please ask reports to add firefox 3.5 task on their own if they dont see it
[01:17] <asac> in that way we might loose some bugs that just sit there for nothing ;)
[01:17] <asac> i mean for low/undecided and maybe medium bugs
[01:18]  * micahg usually adds it...is that not right?
[01:18] <asac> if you touch bugs you can add it
[01:18] <asac> but dont go through the list and add it everywhere... its a good time to let users confirm it
[01:18] <micahg> ok, I usually add it if it's already upstream
[01:18] <asac> yes. upstreawmed bugs should be moved too
[01:19] <micahg> I'll do that...ping user for update
[01:19] <micahg> I hope next weekend to do more triage
[01:19] <micahg> I hope this is the last Sunday I have to work for a while
[01:29] <fta> scons: *** [/build/buildd/chromium-browser-3.0.198.0~svn20090809r22888/build-tree/src/sconsbuild/Release/lib/libskia.a] /build/buildd/chromium-browser-3.0.198.0~svn20090809r22888/build-tree/src/sconsbuild/Release/.sconsign.dblite: No such file or directory
[01:29] <fta> hmm
[01:30] <fta> so system scons is not good enough in intrepid
[01:31] <fta> bugzilla is broken
[01:31] <fta> "Repairs in Progress"
[01:32] <maco> duh-RAM-a!
[01:44] <asac> yeah
[01:46] <asac> lots of other sites too
[01:46] <asac> MDC for instance is down
[01:46] <asac> https://developer.mozilla.org/en/GRE
[03:48] <bjsnider> firefox 3.5 cannot use the URW Chancery L font
[03:49] <bjsnider> http://www.codestyle.org/servlets/FontSampler?class=URWChanceryL&font=URW%20Chancery%20L&compare=normal
[03:49] <bjsnider> it can use that font on mac
[03:50] <micahg> why not?
[03:50] <micahg> looks fine to me
[03:50] <bjsnider> really? it's a script font. you're seeing that on that page?
[03:51] <micahg> oh maybe not then
[03:51] <micahg> it would need to be installed on teh system
[03:51] <bjsnider> it's showing you a default font
[03:51] <bjsnider> it's instaleld in ubuntu by default. you've got it
[03:51] <micahg> it looks different
[03:51] <bjsnider> try that page in ff 3
[03:51] <bjsnider> or any other browser
[03:52] <micahg> It shows me that font family as being nrendered
[03:53] <bjsnider> as being what?
[03:53] <micahg> ah, I see
[03:53] <micahg> hmmm
[03:54] <micahg> in Firebug
[03:54] <micahg> ok, I'd say open a bug
[03:54] <bjsnider> no, i can't do that yet
[03:55] <bjsnider> guhhh
[03:55] <micahg> why not?
[03:55] <bjsnider> i have to test all of the other fonts too
[03:55] <bjsnider> how can i trust it?
[03:55] <bjsnider> if it broke this one why didn't it break any others?
[03:55] <micahg> ok, well, when you are done, please open a bug report in firefox-3.5 and I will check upstream
[03:57] <micahg> the common fonts page shwos discrepencies
[03:57] <bjsnider> huh?
[03:57] <micahg> http://www.codestyle.org/css/font-family/sampler-UnixResults.shtml
[03:58] <micahg> between ff3 and ff3.5
[03:59] <bjsnider> oh crap
[03:59] <bjsnider> how many, do you suppose?
[04:00] <micahg> looks like quite a few
[04:00] <bjsnider> guhhhhh
[04:00] <micahg> most are unnoticable unless you are specifically looking for it
[04:01] <bjsnider> i'm having trouble coming up with this bug report title: "font rendering is all effed up in FF 3.5"
[04:01] <micahg> non standard fonts aren't rendering correctly?
[04:02] <bjsnider> i dunno
[05:50] <Jeffrey04> I attempted to update my firefox-3.5 this morning and it seems like firefox.desktop would be updated after the update is completed, is it intended?
[05:51] <Jeffrey04> apt refused to overwrite firefox.desktop saying something like it belongs to firefox-3.0 (???)
[05:52] <Jeffrey04> i then uninstalled firefox-3.5 and revert back to firefox-3.0 for now (using hardy 64bit)
[05:53] <micahg> Jeffrey04: is someone helping you?
[05:53] <Jeffrey04> no, I don't know where I can report this
[05:53] <micahg> ok
[05:53] <micahg> can you start over
[05:53] <micahg> sorry
[05:54] <micahg> what is the problem?
[05:54] <Jeffrey04> I ran apt-get upgrade this morning
[05:54] <Jeffrey04> and then updated firefox-3.5
[05:54] <micahg> oh hardy?
[05:54] <micahg> *on
[05:54] <Jeffrey04> but the upgrade failed saying that firefox-3.5-branding cannot overwrite firefox.desktop
[05:54] <Jeffrey04> yea, hardy 64bit
[05:55] <micahg> from where did you get a firefox-3.5 package?
[05:55] <Jeffrey04> ubuntu-mozilla-daily ppa
[05:55] <micahg> ah
[05:55] <Jeffrey04> not sure what causes the problem and i uninstalled firefox-3.5 for now
[05:56] <Jeffrey04> just  being curious whether the overwritting of firefox.desktop is intended??!
[05:56] <micahg> well, they're getting ready to switch branding for Karmic
[05:57] <Jeffrey04> :D
[05:57] <micahg> if you look at the changelog, it seems like they are indeed changing/breaking stuff
[05:57] <micahg> fta was talking about this earlier I think
[05:58] <Jeffrey04> iC
[05:59] <Jeffrey04> thanks for the information
[05:59]  * micahg is checking the logs now
[06:00] <micahg> ok, so it seems that it will be fixed in the next few days
[06:01] <micahg> Jeffrey04: still there?
[06:01] <Jeffrey04> yes
[06:01] <micahg> ok
[06:01] <micahg> yeah, so they caught it today
[06:01] <Jeffrey04> was reading through the changelog
[06:02] <micahg> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2009/08/09/%23ubuntu-mozillateam.txt about 4PM
[06:02] <micahg> 4:30PM
[06:02] <micahg> oops
[06:02] <micahg> 5:30PM
[06:05] <Jeffrey04> OK :D guess I just wait and reinstall after a few days :)
[06:05] <Jeffrey04> i spend most of the time under google-chrome (unless I'm doing javascript) though
[06:06] <Jeffrey04> thanks for the help @micahg
[06:06] <micahg> no problem Jeffrey04
[06:07] <micahg> the team is still working on a more permanent solution for FF3.5 on hardy
[06:07] <Jeffrey04> yea,
[10:13] <asac> fta: so i think we need to add firefox 3 top dailies (and milestone) ppa to properly ship a firefox-3.0.desktop thing
[10:22] <sebner> asac: bahh, mozilla didn't fix the flash-fullscreen bug yes (not even with 3.5.2) :(
[10:28] <asac> Err http://ubuntu.intergenia.de karmic Release.gpg Something wicked happened resolving 'ubuntu.intergenia.de:http' (-11)
[10:28] <asac> hmm. /me unable to setup chroot as it seems
[10:37] <asac> 11:36 < lool> Ah now I find it in https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/thunderbird-3.0 I had checked thundebird3
[10:37] <asac> 11:36 < asac> oh. so launchpad creates packages pages for ppa things now?`
[10:37] <asac> 11:36 < asac> interesting
[10:37] <asac> 11:36 < asac> one even can file bugs
[10:37] <asac> 11:37 < asac> i guess that answers the question: "where to file bugs against those packages not yet in ubuntu for real"
[10:37] <asac> fta: ^^
[10:37] <asac> sebner: sorry for that ;) ... but isnt that a flash problem
[10:44] <asac> fta: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/chromium-browser
[10:44] <asac> ;)
[10:44] <asac> bugs
[10:45] <sladen> btw, there's some (maybe related) issue with  bug #406352
[10:49] <asac> sladen: not sure how we can address that in the packaging (except when doing the full migration)
[10:49] <asac> migration==transition
[10:51] <asac> not sure why you have firefox.desktop if firefox-3.0 is removed (unless you run dailies, where we migrated firefox 3.5 to default now)
[10:52] <asac> hmm ... so probably -branding package is left over
[10:52] <asac> after removal
[10:55] <asac> not sure if i like circular dependencies
[10:55] <asac> but i guess that would be needed here
[10:56] <asac> hmm. firefox-3.0-branding depends on firefox-3.0 ... so that shouldnt be a problem
[10:56] <sebner> asac: the fix is for xulrunner so I blame mozilla .. ok,  flash. We always can blame flash too \o/
[10:57] <asac> ack ;)
[11:01] <sladen> looking through gconftool-2 -R /   some things hardcode   "firefox"  some  "firefox %s"  and some  "firefox.desktop"
[11:02] <sladen> but I guess the only alternative would be to have those  hardcoded to  /usr/bin/default-distro-browser   and have the packages dpkg-divert that
[11:05] <asac> i think those are bugs from gnome-panel etc.
[11:05] <asac> some get a full copy of .desktop and some get a reference to .desktop
[11:06] <asac> in any case. the default transition will make this work
[11:06] <asac> before that we dont really support uninstalling firefox-3.0
[11:08] <sladen> asac: right, elephant in the room time.  are you just counting the total hits to  :hsw1kx-3zxg  :jhy8zj-qv39  :getzo5-xcfi
[11:08] <sladen> asac: if so, what's the fourth one?
[11:08] <asac> sladen: the start.ubuntu.com/9.10 code
[11:09] <sladen> asac: ah, of course
[11:09] <asac> sladen: btw, i didnt want to merge all multisearch bug into a single huge one ... ;)
[11:09] <asac> thats why we used the "multisearch" tag
[11:09] <asac> but doesnt matter ;) ... now all subscribers are on that bug :)
[11:10] <sladen> asac: yeah... I merged them because, AFAICT, the only way to pacify the various technical breakages, is not to use CSE
[11:10] <asac> sladen: well. but still they are individual issues
[11:10] <sladen> asac: what are Mozilla doing;  is their returned page also a CSE, or is it a "special" with Google?
[11:10] <asac> of course you can always create a "fix all" and merge in there, but that doesnt make it easier
[11:11] <asac> sladen: they have a special page
[11:12] <sladen> asac: so the situation is either that Canonical either need to also get a special arranged, or need to drop CSE
[11:12] <asac> thats one opinion. yes.
[11:12] <asac> there are various compromises though
[11:12] <sladen> what do you have in mind?
[11:12] <asac> of course having special page would be the perfect fix
[11:13] <asac> i think the most annoying things are:
[11:13] <asac> 1. awesomebar does not have feeling lucky
[11:13] <asac> 2. chrome changes google searchplugin
[11:13] <asac> 3. newtab not configurable
[11:13] <sladen> is that special page (or rather /lack/ of obviously non-standard page) done on the by the User-Agent, or just via the partner = {firefox,firefox-a} partner ID
[11:14] <asac> one way would be to drop 1. and 3. and make 2. an "ubuntu search" plugin living next to the real google one
[11:15] <asac> sladen: the cse page happens because of the action url we are using
[11:15] <asac> custom search has a different path than the real google search
[11:15] <sladen> the /cse
[11:15] <asac> yes.
[11:15] <asac> but its odd. you can add a few of our arguments to the real google search and get something in the middle ;)
[11:15] <sladen> can the real Google search not just be fed with the changed partner-id
[11:16] <asac> http://www.google.com/coop/cse/
[11:16] <asac> sladen: that doesnt work. otherwise noone would probably use custom search ;)
[11:17] <sladen> it works for Mozilla
[11:17] <asac> yeah. they are lucky ;)
[11:17] <sladen> see, that page is higlighting three bullet points, of which none are actually a desired outcome
[11:18] <sladen> the only one that is really desired is revenue shared  (and maybe some numbers)
[11:18] <asac> sladen: not sure what you mean ... which page are you referring to?
[11:21] <sladen> http://www.google.com/coop/cse/ "Include one or more websites, or specific webpages" (not required)  "Host the search box and results on your own website" (not, except for start.ubuntu)  "Customize the look and feel of the results to match your site" (negatively desired)
[11:21] <asac> sladen: we dont host the results in a search box, but direct to google
[11:22] <asac> also we dont really customize it much ... what you see is basically the default.
[11:22] <asac> everyone can create a cse account and suggest how to do that better
[11:22] <sladen> okay, in that case, all *three* are *not* desired :)
[11:22] <asac> so (an unrelated) in-box approach can be found here: http://people.canonical.com/~kirkland/search.html
[11:22] <sladen> Google's front page is the peak of usability---virtually anything done to it has negative impact
[11:23] <sladen> and, Google's results page is the peak of usability---virtually anything done to it has negative impact
[11:23] <sladen> be it (consults list) being in my local language, handling stock quotes, providng a list to gmail, providing a link to images
[11:25] <sladen> asac: kirkland's use of CSE is a valid one;  restricting to a subset of webpages
[11:26] <sladen> asac: at the moment, the geeks are peeved, and the grannies are complaining "Google doesn't work on Ubuntu"
[11:26] <asac> we repeated that we are aware that the current solution is sub-optimal. And one reason of this experiment was to get a detailed list of issues, so we can mitigate them if possible and balance them when with the win that would come out of the various options for the ubuntu project
[11:27] <sladen> *blink*.  But can you expand various options?
[11:27] <asac> so there are a few potential outcome of this:
[11:27] <asac> 1. we get special page -> best
[11:28] <asac> 2. we address as many issues as possible in a fashion that we think is the most diligent one (like what i suggested above)
[11:29] <sladen> I'm still slightly lost as to why a special page is (ever) going to be better than the Google default
[11:29] <asac> 3. we drop all this
[11:30] <asac> sladen: there are also benefits for the project that are not insignificant. we need to balance them with the loss of usability carefully.
[11:30] <sladen> asac: expand benefits
[11:31] <sladen> revenue and numbers?
[11:31] <asac> like what rick and me already mentioned in the bug
[11:31] <asac> from my blog: "will help to fund more talented developers"
[11:32] <asac> we are not really interested in the numbers
[11:32] <asac> and those would be hard to defer from it anyway afaik
[11:33] <sladen> yeah, your method of statistics gathering is sub-optimal anyway   (no control group, and impacted behaviour)
[11:34] <sladen> has a fortnight of deployment delivered any meaningful results yet?
[11:34] <asac> sladen: we dont need accurate numbers to get an idea
[11:34] <sladen> is extending the experimental likely to massively altered the results?
[11:35] <asac> we really just look at the generic numbers to understand the importance etc.
[11:35] <sladen> asac: no, but is something is changed (I'm feeling lucky) then you'll get a notch on the first use;  maybe the second, but not by the time somebody has changed their preferences, or switched to another method (eg. doing searches via Pidgin, to quote above)
[11:36] <sladen> and as of a fortnight of deployment what do the "generic numbers" show?
[11:37] <asac> i dont know about final numbers. we wanted to wrap up next week
[11:38] <sladen> presumebly somebody has frequenctly checked the numbers to see that the experiement is actually working
[11:39] <asac> no we verified it once after starting it
[11:39] <asac> that was a day or two afterwards iirc
[11:39] <asac> not sure if someone monitored the data eagerly ;) ... could be.
[11:39] <asac> sladen: what would you want to know about those numbers?
[11:40] <asac> absolute numbers are really meaningless
[11:41] <sladen> asac: not really, I'd like to know if the observed ratios have been useful
[11:46] <asac> yes ... otherwise we wouldn't have kept it in for the full alpha
[11:48] <sladen> is the intention to keep this going for one alpha, or for two?
[11:49] <sladen> s/is/was/
[11:49] <asac> ~1 alpha
[11:51] <asac> seems we will miss the alpha release though. i am currently working on ffox 3.5 by default and also have a to fix knetworkmanager to work somehow
[11:51] <asac> so next week is idea of starting to work on this
[11:51] <asac> and wrapping up etc.
[11:52] <asac> also a few are on holiday this week, so not really best time to drive things in any direction
[11:52] <sladen> asac: if it's a time thing;  I think there are volunteers who will upload a clean version
[11:52] <asac> as i said. its not decided what exactly to do
[11:52] <asac> we just know that something will be done ;)
[11:53] <sladen> who needs to make that decision (if it's not you)
[11:54] <asac> more than one person
[11:54] <asac> not all are available atm. that blocks it for now
[11:54] <asac> anyway. have to work now ;)
[11:55] <asac> from what I see now on CD there won't be multisearch. its shipped as part of 3.0 package and 3.5 will be on CD unless i have no time to work
[11:56] <sladen> okay, so it's only in the 3.0  upload
[11:56] <sladen> I can mark the 3.5 stuff as invalid?
[11:57] <asac> sladen: i would say yes. folks see it in firefox-3.5 if they have 3.0 installed though
[11:57] <asac> sladen: at best keep it open
[11:57] <asac> otherwise folks will rant and bitch about it
[11:57] <asac> i we will close the bugs when things get done
[12:02] <asac> how can i see if a package is in "auto-installed" mode?
[12:30] <sladen> asac: apt-mark
[12:36] <asac> thx
[12:37] <sladen> asac: grep -A1 firefox /var/lib/apt/extended_states
[12:37] <asac> ah extended states
[12:37] <asac> great
[12:37] <asac> thx
[13:08] <gnomefreak> ok that was odd, firefox-3.5 asked if i wanted to import my 3.6 settings
[13:09] <asac> gnomefreak: 3.6? sure it wasnt 3.0?
[13:09] <asac> gnomefreak: what did you select?
[13:09] <asac> decide later?
[13:11] <gnomefreak> asac: decide later. i think it was 3.6 but im still sleeping
[13:13] <asac> gnomefreak: can you stop and start it again?
[13:13] <asac> gnomefreak: and read if its 3.0 ;)
[13:13] <asac> then select decide later :)
[13:15] <gnomefreak> asac: ok 1 sec, can you please explain comments in bug 18995
[13:15] <gnomefreak> checking now
[13:16] <asac> gnomefreak: open with dialog is not user friendly. thats known
[13:16] <gnomefreak> asac: comments on why we dont patch it i mean
[13:16] <asac> because we dont have the proper code
[13:16] <asac> the one suggested istn good enough afaik
[13:16] <asac> if there is any suggested at all there
[13:17] <gnomefreak> asac: the ones we gave is not good enough to certain people
[13:17] <gnomefreak> comparing the start page to this issue
[13:17] <asac> not sure what you mean
[13:17] <gnomefreak> i did not get the dialog agian. do i need to restart system?
[13:18] <asac> gnomefreak: ensure that no process is running
[13:18] <asac> maybe its a bug
[13:19] <asac> gnomefreak: try to re-login
[13:19] <asac> if it doesnt re pop up its a bug
[13:19] <asac> file one and ping fta about it ;)
[13:20] <gnomefreak> asac: here are 3 of the many comments. this is after telling them we are waiting for upstream to do it due to major code changes  http://paste.ubuntu.com/250803/
[13:20] <gnomefreak> asac: ill be right back going to try to get it to pop-up
[13:23] <gnomefreak> gnomefreak@Development:~$ ps aux | grep firefox-3.5
[13:23] <gnomefreak> 1000      4370  0.0  0.2   1856   576 pts/1    S+   08:23   0:00 grep firefox-3.5
[13:23] <gnomefreak> be back in a few
[13:31] <gnomefreak> asac: is there a config setting i can change to get the dialog back about importing settings
[13:39] <asac> gnomefreak: i already checked it. it works... you probably hit the wrong button
[13:41] <gnomefreak> asac: i was thinking that as well after i restarted and it didnt come up
[13:44] <asac> gnomefreak: ls -l /home/gnomefreak/.mozilla/
[13:44] <asac> what do you get there?
[13:45] <gnomefreak> asac: http://paste.ubuntu.com/250813/
[13:47] <asac> gnomefreak: stop all running firefox
[13:47] <asac> then mv firefox.3.0-replaced
[13:48] <asac> then mv firefox.3.0-replaced firefox.3.0
[13:48] <asac> err
[13:48] <asac> then mv firefox.3.0-replaced firefox-3.0
[13:48] <asac> ;)
[13:48] <asac> next time you start it should ask again
[13:49] <gnomefreak> asac: ok thanks i try
[13:52] <gnomefreak> ~/.mozilla$ mv firefox-3.0/ firefox.3.0  did not work
[13:53] <asac> gnomefreak: type exactly what i wrote dude :)
[13:53] <asac> mv firefox.3.0-replaced firefox-3.0
[13:53] <gnomefreak> asac: that didnt work either
[13:54] <gnomefreak> gnomefreak@Development:~/.mozilla$ mv firefox.3.0-replaced/ firefox-3.0  was first
[13:55] <asac> then dont bother
[13:56] <gnomefreak> has the transition to 3.5 been done?
[13:56] <asac> in daily its half done
[13:57] <asac> working on finishing it
[13:58] <gnomefreak> asac: ok cool thanks
[14:26] <sladen> asac: can you review  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Multisearch  please
[14:27] <sladen> asac: if you can give a non-cagey answer about who's calling the shots, then I can include that too
[14:28] <asac> sladen: add my blog post to the quicklinks ...
[14:29] <asac> sladen: i think the removal section reads like there isa  commitment to remove everything, which isnt necessarily true. its just that we will start to decide what to do based on the results and address issues
[14:30] <sladen> asac: -> Edit + fixage :)
[14:32] <sladen> asac: where is your blog post;   /last http   doesn't show it in the scrollback
[14:32] <asac> i wont submit content to it. it could be interpreted as signing everything off ... we already have all the content required imo
[14:32] <asac> http://www.asoftsite.org/s9y/archives/162-What-is-this-Multisearch-thing-in-my-Firefox-about.html
[14:32] <gnomefreak> asac: i thought you stated a few weeks ago we were removing multisearch
[14:32] <sladen> asac: mmm, I don't think there would be 76 comments on an LWN article if the answers I'm attempted to gathered had been published beforehand
[14:32] <asac> gnomefreak: yes. it will not be in final release in its current form
[14:33] <sladen> asac: I'm doing the clean-up work now that should ideally have been done before this stuff was even shipped to users
[14:33] <gnomefreak> ok can we add that to wiki or blog
[14:34] <asac> sladen: people dont read. thats the main problem
[14:34] <asac> we should have announced it before, but even then people would have had the same stories et al
[14:34] <sladen> asac: who do I need to get to sign-off that you may contribute to the wiki?
[14:38] <asac> i dont think the wiki page gives much more info than what we have. folks just dont read, but jump into bugs and rant without checking. bringing up more official content won't help i think. e.g. post that link somewhere and in the end there will only be more misunderstandings in the world - like i said in my blog: its quite emotional because it touches users primary daily workflow.
[14:39] <asac> and because the bug is so long they dont even read the documents linked from it
[14:39] <sladen> which is the reason not to be storing documentation in bug reports...
[14:39] <asac> we made a blog post for this.
[14:40] <sladen> now, having written some _documentation_ (not blog posts, not bug tracker comments), I'd like it to be the best possible
[14:40] <sladen> I would like it to be as good as a man page is expected to be
[14:40] <asac> sladen: yeah. i commented already.
[14:41] <asac> dont speak for others (e.g. like why you merged the bugs)
[14:41] <asac> link to the blog post which is the official content source. you can also link to rick spencers more contentfull comment in the bug
[14:42] <asac> "For the moment these have all been duped to the same bug report because they are all related to the CSE page and the author of this wiki page thinks that they are probably only fixable by avoiding the use of CSE."
[14:43] <sladen> I've add "Paul Sladen has duped ..."
[14:43] <asac> also tell them to use the multisearch tag if they want to be recognized and dont dupe into the main bug
[14:43] <asac> otherwise they might be missed
[14:43] <asac> we will check the duped bugs and see which one we can fork out when closing the main bug (or keeping it open)
[14:45] <sladen> got both of these two
[14:45] <asac> sladen: besides from that it looks ok to me
[14:45] <sladen> can you give me a better statement/clarity for wording the Removal sub-heading
[14:46] <sladen> I wrote the current on the basis of  "11:37 < asac> i dont know about final numbers. we wanted to wrap up next week" and "11:55 < asac> from what I see now on CD there won't be multisearch. its shipped as part of 3.0 package and 3.5 will be on CD unless i have no time ..."
[14:46] <asac> sladen: Removal -> Multisearch extension will not exist in its current form in final ubuntu release; until that happens you can disable it in tools -> addons
[14:47] <asac> + what to do/not to do in karmic will get reviewed shortly after alpha 4 release
[14:48] <asac> sladen: "As it stands, the upstream Mozilla code needs more work:
[14:48] <asac> 1.
[14:48] <asac> "
[14:48] <asac> that reads wrong.
[14:48] <asac> the list below are not upstream problem, but main issues of multisearch
[14:49] <asac> "try to cut"
[14:49] <asac> we dont try to trick users doing more clicks
[14:49] <asac> (also Longer term)
[14:49] <asac> i guess i dont understand that section
[14:50] <gnomefreak> one of these days ill fix the profile patch and test build 2.1 again but today is most likely not going to happen
[14:51] <gnomefreak> IMHO we need to remove it all together this will make everyone happy (or a major abount of people
[14:51] <gnomefreak> happy)
[14:52] <sladen> asac: it's a high-level example of why any of these UI work is being done
[14:53] <sladen> ...knowing that having an address under the cursor likely means wanting a mapping search result
[14:54] <sladen> and wanting to give a more specific example than just a line of vague "improve the UI somehow" bullshit
[14:55] <asac> "cut out even more clicks for when searching" ... this will make folks bitch about us trying to maximize revenue rather than explain that we need to decide in which area to put effort in.
[14:55] <asac> also i wouldnt mention "porn" on that page ... most likely folks will start to be offended by that word too ;)
[14:56] <sladen> yeah, I've tried really hard to not mention the revenue thing until the bottom
[14:57] <sladen> "don't worry about searching for Microsoft Windows, or Mac OS from ubuntu"
[14:57] <asac> something like that ;)
[15:04] <sladen> gnomefreak: have you spotted anything (constructive) in the wiki page that could be tweaked?
[15:05] <asac> sladen: conflict on page ;)
[15:06] <sladen> meh
[15:06] <sladen> fixing
[15:06] <asac> did you conflict with your own?
[15:07] <sladen> nope, somebody else (Popey) seems to have been watching the wiki changelogs just a bit closely
[15:11] <gnomefreak> sladen: ill look again
[15:17] <gnomefreak> sladen: under removal:The multisearch plugin will not exist form in the final should either read will not exist in ..... or will notr exist in current form ...
[15:19] <sladen> okay got that, and the removed "(see previous sentence)" since we had a back track on that
[15:19] <gnomefreak> k
[15:20] <sladen> asac: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Multisearch?action=diff&rev2=9&rev1=3
[15:20] <asac> sladen: i am going to late-lunch/dinner ... will be back in 1h
[15:20] <asac> " Blog upsdate"
[15:20] <asac> -> typo
[15:21] <sladen> done
[15:24] <gnomefreak> sladen: in rRevenue you might want to show diff between free and Free as people might not understand free=license Free=no money
[15:25]  * gnomefreak wonders if we shouldnt have it as an installible extension rather than forced on users
[15:28] <sladen> gnomefreak: popcon is probably a best-practice example of anonymousised statistics gathering---people *love* helping with that
[15:28] <gnomefreak> true
[15:29] <sladen> gnomefreak: because they actively choose to;  because it doesn't change behaviour, or affect workflow;  because the results of publically shared for the good of all;  because it is statistically viable (a well designed experiment)
[15:30]  * gnomefreak really didnt see SM2.1 in my day but simple fix and build will be it if fails agian another day it will wait
[15:30] <gnomefreak> sladen: its not running in popcon is it?
[15:30] <sladen> gnomefreak: which/what isn't running in popcon?
[15:31] <gnomefreak> sladen: multisearch gathered info
[15:31] <sladen> gnomefreak: popcon is an on-going, well-through out, well-designed statistics gathering exercise that helps improve Debian and Ubuntu
[15:32] <gnomefreak> sladen: i know popcon and i keep it disabled
[15:32] <sladen> gnomefreak: if you know how useful it was, would you tick the box?
[15:33] <sladen> s/useful//; it's subjective word
[15:33] <gnomefreak> sladen: if there was a good reason but as i understand it doesnt collect anything from PPA packages
[15:34] <sladen> gnomefreak: PPA packages aren't in the main archives, so would not be in the selection of packages that a normal user who find and install
[15:35] <gnomefreak> sladen: than it wouldnt help for me. most of things i use daily/weekly are in PPA
[15:35] <sladen> gnomefreak: btw, if you have a 3.5 install there, could you take a screenshot, zoom in and see if  bug #404955  is there for you
[15:35] <sladen> gnomefreak: I found the height="36" hardcode in the plugin source, but haven't found the "37" yet
[15:35] <gnomefreak> sladen: i cant try but my eyes arent so great since i just had surgery
[15:36] <sladen> Applications->Graphics->Gimp  File->Create->Screenshot
[15:37] <sladen> Take screenshot of Entire Windows;   Delay = 10 seconds   [OK]
[15:37] <sladen> flick around to Firefox, wait for the big '+' mouse pointer and click
[15:38] <sladen> you should then be able to zoom in
[15:38] <gnomefreak> sladen: 3.5 here seems fine. ill test
[15:38] <gnomefreak> its unlikely i will know for a while. system is lagging bad due to build
[15:38] <gnomefreak> opening gimp now though
[15:39] <sladen> oooh, Loic has confirmed it
[15:40] <gnomefreak> thats what he said but they are only testing on 3.0 AFAIK
[15:41] <gnomefreak> gimp just died i have to check later
[15:41] <sladen> never mind, it's one of those things which would take <15 seconds if the machine was working and not short of RAM
[15:42] <gnomefreak> ok sorry i have been just trying to get 2.1 built and pushed to PPA since im way behind
[16:03] <fta> asac, http://paste.ubuntu.com/250877/
[16:04] <fta> asac, https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~fta/+junk/ppa-scripts
[16:25] <asac> fta: looks good
[16:25] <asac> fta: maybe the rules itself could prevent such a build too?
[16:26] <asac> moz-version --compare would work too i think. but if thats more comfortable its good :)
[16:26] <fta> maybe, but i preferred to add that there as a safe guard
[16:26] <asac> yeah
[16:30] <fta> grr, i need a better cdbs for chromium
[16:32] <asac> fta: what features?
[16:32] <fta> better lzma support
[16:32] <fta> per package DEB_DH_BUILDDEB_ARGS
[16:32] <asac> are those two features requested?
[16:33] <asac> doesnt sound that difficult to do
[16:33] <fta> it's not
[16:33] <fta> but it's not there
[16:34] <fta> i can just put more of cdbs into the package, but it's a shame
[16:34] <fta> if i clone debhelper.mk, i'm not sure it will work well with backports
[16:35] <asac> fta: we should try harder to get it upstreamed
[16:35] <fta> won't help backports, it's always the same song
[16:35] <asac> you can put updated cdbs in daily ppa .. or a dependent ppa
[16:39] <fta> asac, not sure you saw my little experiments with lzma: http://paste.ubuntu.com/248183/
[16:41] <asac> no but looks good ... though i was told by ogra that we shouldnt use lzma unless we want to occupy armel builders for days :/
[16:46] <fta> lzma -2 seems (slightly) better and faster than bzip2
[16:46] <fta> not worth the cdbs changes though..
[16:49] <fta> i was thinking of going with -4 as a compromise, but it means another cdbs change, and maybe tar or dpkg, as there's no way to pass that -4 to lzma..
[16:55] <fta> lol, we should drop or update /usr/share/bug/firefox-3.*/presubj
[17:02] <micahg> asac: any advice we can give people that a new profile fixes their problem about getting the data out of the old profile?
[17:04] <asac> micahg: they should figure which extension breaks it
[17:04] <asac> also they might have old flash in profile plugins/ directory
[17:07] <micahg> bug 411158
[17:13] <micahg> Is it safe to export bookmarks and other settings from the current profile?
[17:35] <sladen> fta: I thought -policy still disallowed lzma sources
[17:46] <fta> sladen, where? which policy? debian?
[17:48] <fta> our openoffice is compressed with lzma
[17:51] <asac> sladen: its a nested tarball layout
[17:51] <asac> sladen: i have never seen a policy that restricts what you do in the nested part
[17:51] <asac> the orig.tar.gz is still gz
[17:52] <fta> ooo compresses the debs too
[17:52] <fta> iirc, gcc too
[17:54] <asac> yeah i think it was done in the hope that it helps
[17:54] <asac> but in the end it didnt as the livecd can only do gz compression
[17:56] <fta> asac, ooo is not on the cd?
[17:56] <asac> it is. but lzma didnt help for that ;)
[17:56] <asac> just saying that there were big hopes in lzma debs
[17:56] <asac> but because of livecd it doesnt matter
[17:56] <asac> it helps for download/alternate CD though
[17:57] <asac> no question asked
[17:57] <asac> but its not the main product we have unfortunately
[17:57] <fta> with lzma:
[17:57] <fta> # chromium-browser_3.0.196.0~svn20090729r21952-0ubuntu1~ucd2_amd64.deb  (9.7 MiB)
[17:57] <fta> # chromium-browser_3.0.196.0~svn20090729r21952-0ubuntu1~ucd2_i386.deb (9.7 MiB)
[17:57] <fta> # chromium-browser_3.0.196.0~svn20090729r21952-0ubuntu1~ucd2_lpia.deb (8.4 MiB)
[17:57] <fta> without lzma:
[17:57] <fta> # chromium-browser_3.0.197.0~svn20090731r22152-0ubuntu1~ucd1_amd64.deb  (17.7 MiB)
[17:57] <fta> # chromium-browser_3.0.197.0~svn20090731r22152-0ubuntu1~ucd1_i386.deb (17.7 MiB)
[17:57] <fta> # chromium-browser_3.0.197.0~svn20090731r22152-0ubuntu1~ucd1_lpia.deb (15.5 MiB)
[17:57] <asac> yes
[17:59] <fta> i don't understand then. if lzma is not usable for the livecd, why is it still used for oo?
[18:00] <fta> #  chromium-browser-dbg_3.0.196.0~svn20090729r21952-0ubuntu1~ucd2_amd64.deb  (64.1 MiB)
[18:00] <fta> #  chromium-browser-dbg_3.0.197.0~svn20090731r22152-0ubuntu1~ucd1_amd64.deb  (114.2 MiB)
[18:00] <asac> fta: because it reduces .deb sizes
[18:00] <fta> those are the 2 debs i want to compress
[18:00] <asac> which is good on its own
[18:01] <asac> fta: whats the unpack time difference for the -dbg packages?
[18:01] <asac> (and the pack time delta)
[18:01] <fta> unpack time is the same
[18:03] <fta> i mean, same as bzip2
[18:03] <asac> sladen: for me my 5 steps always worked: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=505732#c9
[18:03] <asac> damn. we need a testcase
[18:03] <asac> thats a bad bad bug
[18:04] <asac> even feels security related
[18:04] <fta> http://en.opensuse.org/LZMA
[18:04] <asac> websites triggering caret browsing? ouch!
[18:04] <sladen> hold down any of the up/down/pageup/pagedown keys whilst the page is loading
[18:04] <asac> sladen: i mean ... didnt my instructions work?
[18:05] <asac> its just loading. wait till subscriberts are loaded ...  click on it ... press up or down -> caret
[18:06] <sladen> asac: upstream were still in disbelief, so I reproduce in various other ways
[18:06] <asac> ah ok
[18:06] <sladen> reproduced
[18:06] <asac> sladen: its important to be logged in
[18:07] <sladen> of course, I don't expect anyone to bother reading all the bug comments, nobody does :-P
[18:07] <asac> lol
[18:09] <sladen> you're right, I can't reproduce it without being logged in
[18:11] <sladen> 0
[18:15] <fta> looking at my apt cache, there are plenty of lzma debs already.. libgl1-mesa* libglu1-mesa* libqt4-* mesa-utils* openjdk*
[18:21] <fta> asac, your fault: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/30118421/buildlog_ubuntu-jaunty-amd64.firefox-3.6_3.6~a2~hg20090810r31282%2Bnobinonly-0ubuntu1~umd1~jaunty_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[18:23] <asac> yes. i excepted somethign like that
[18:23]  * asac checks
[18:24] <asac> hmm. i removed the hunk that is supposed to create the versioned thing
[18:24] <sladen> asac: is me001 Mozilla Extension ?
[18:25] <sladen> fta: are you confusing LZMA debs (allowed) with LZMA sources (not allowed, IIRC)
[18:25] <asac> sladen: mozilla experiment
[18:25] <asac> but dont put too much thoughts into that one
[18:25] <asac> ;)
[18:26] <fta> sladen, no i'm not. i want both. http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~chromium-team/chromium-browser/chromium-browser.head/annotate/head%3A/debian/rules#L17
[18:28] <asac> sladen: he is using lzma tarballs in orig.tar.gz ... which should be allowed as its nothing the packaging system itself sees
[18:28] <asac> fta: hmm isnt the firefox-3.6 binary in pkglibdir packaged by packages-static?
[18:28] <asac> why is there no patch?
[18:29] <asac> e.g. now we produce dist/bin/firefox
[18:29] <asac> but it seems it doesnt get installed
[18:29] <asac> oh its probably sedded ;)
[18:30] <fta> it was fine before your last commits
[18:30] <fta> sladen, $ tar ztvf chromium-browser_3.0.198.0~svn20090810r22916.orig.tar.gz
[18:30] <fta> drwxr-xr-x fta/fta           0 2009-08-10 17:06 chromium-browser-3.0.198.0~svn20090810r22916/
[18:30] <fta> -rw-r--r-- fta/fta    79205786 2009-08-10 17:06 chromium-browser-3.0.198.0~svn20090810r22916/chromium-browser-3.0.198.0~svn20090810r22916-source.tar.lzma
[18:30] <asac> or not
[18:30] <fta> (embedded tarballs)
[18:30] <asac> fta: i know it was fine before my commit
[18:30] <fta> i need to run, back in ~1h
[19:53] <james_w> hey asac
[19:53] <james_w> I've just updated and firefox is throwing all sorts of errors, but it hasn't given me the internal restart notification yet
[19:53] <james_w> I've got the external one, and the file is present on disk to instruct it to prompt me, but nothing
[19:53] <james_w> any clues on how to debug?
[19:59] <asac> james_w: ffox 3.5?
[19:59] <james_w> nope, not yet
[20:00] <asac> in general the problem is well understood
[20:00] <asac> its just that the real fix is hard
[20:00] <asac> even with the internal mechanism you might end up in a busted situation
[20:01] <asac> e.g. if you do something within the 10 second delay the update check has
[20:02] <asac> james_w: so as long as killing all firefox processes helps i wouldnt bother for now
[20:02] <james_w> well yeah, but you've told me before that the fix for losing all my tabs when I restart manually is to wait for the internal notification
[20:03] <james_w> so I try and do that now, but more often than not I don't get it
[20:03] <bdrung> asac: are there any remaining topic for -devscripts (except moz-version -> debian version string policy)?
[20:06] <BUGabundo> boas
[20:19] <asac> james_w: hmm. ok.
[20:20] <asac> let me search for something
[20:24] <asac> http://mxr.mozilla.org/mozilla1.9.1/source/content/xul/document/src/nsXULPrototypeCache.cpp
[20:26] <BUGabundo> asac: 3G broken still
[20:26] <BUGabundo> with MM downgrage
[20:26] <BUGabundo> got a link for NM ?
[20:26] <asac> saw that
[20:26] <asac> no
[20:26] <asac> its in trunk ppa
[20:26] <asac> obsolete/superseded again
[20:26] <asac> take the latest from july
[20:26] <asac> also what do you get in syslog?
[20:28] <asac> http://mxr.mozilla.org/mozilla1.9.1/source/xpcom/io/nsFastLoadService.cpp
[20:51] <fta> asac, any idea how i can detect at build time that i'm not doing the arch-indep debs?
[20:52] <asac> fta: by using a -indep target to hook things up?
[20:52] <fta> hmm....
[20:52] <BUGabundo> asac: I need help again!
[20:53] <fta> asac, it's for http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~chromium-team/chromium-browser/chromium-browser.head/annotate/head%3A/debian/rules#L226
[20:53] <BUGabundo> I can't find the superseed package
[20:53] <BUGabundo> :(
[20:53] <fta> BUGabundo, which ones?
[20:53] <BUGabundo> kamirc 64bits
[20:53] <fta> of?
[20:54] <BUGabundo> NM
[20:54] <fta> ppa?
[20:54] <BUGabundo> trunk
[20:54] <BUGabundo> 0.8
[20:55] <fta> https://edge.launchpad.net/~network-manager/+archive/ppa?field.name_filter=&field.status_filter=superseded&field.series_filter=karmic ?
[20:55] <fta> oh 0.8
[20:55] <fta> it's not in that ppa
[20:55] <asac> its in trunk ppa
[20:55] <asac> but now in real archive
[20:56] <fta> https://edge.launchpad.net/~network-manager/+archive/trunk?field.name_filter=&field.status_filter=superseded&field.series_filter=karmic
[20:56] <BUGabundo> I'm lost
[20:56] <BUGabundo> with all this PPA changes
[20:56] <BUGabundo> and how LP puts stuff
[20:56] <BUGabundo> even google sometiems doens help
[20:57] <BUGabundo>                                          network-manager -  0.8~a~git.20090702t164632.9c8e600-0ubuntu1~nmt1
[20:57] <fta> https://edge.launchpad.net/~network-manager/+archive/trunk/+sourcepub/663554/+listing-archive-extra
[20:57] <BUGabundo> nm and applet too right asac»
[20:57] <fta> or https://edge.launchpad.net/~network-manager/+archive/trunk/+sourcepub/660031/+listing-archive-extra
[20:58] <BUGabundo> asac: baisicly applet just keeps going around
[20:58] <BUGabundo> I can't lock an IP
[20:58] <fta> oh, the debs are gone, too old
[20:58] <asac> fta: that code is in the binary-install/$(DEBIAN_NAME) package
[20:58] <asac> feels like its always arch
[20:58] <asac> just use the binary-install/$(indep_package_name):: ?
[20:58] <BUGabundo>        network-manager-gnome_0.8~a~git.20090701t182005.3bec17d-0ubuntu1~nmt1_amd64.deb          (802.8 KiB)
[20:59] <fta> asac, it works fine for the builders, and for my local i386 builds, but not amd64
[20:59] <fta> local builds do the arch indep by default, whatever the arch
[21:00] <asac> fta: well. that is true, but you are still using a arch dependent rule to hook it up
[21:00] <asac> indep doesnt mean that arch is never run
[21:00] <asac> its just that indep packages are only installed on archs that build all packages
[21:01] <asac> fta: what exactly are the symptoms
[21:01] <asac> not sure i understand
[21:01] <fta> that's why is mentioned "We assume we're *not* doing the "Architecture: all" packages", i knew that the assumption was weak
[21:01] <fta> it's the -l10n package (indep) & compare
[21:02] <fta> i want to do something when i'm *not* doing an arch indep build
[21:03] <BUGabundo> asac: http://paste.ubuntu.com/251015/
[21:03] <BUGabundo> something didn't go that well :(
[21:05] <asac> fta: ok i think i undestand the problem now ;)
[21:06] <BUGabundo> asac: come on... a tiny bit of your help here
[21:07] <asac> fta: touch a file in common-configure-indep and only do the removal if that file does not exist
[21:07] <asac> in the post-install thing
[21:07] <asac> or wait
[21:07] <asac> thats one option that would work i am sure ;)
[21:08] <BUGabundo> dinner
[21:12] <asac> fta: i think that might make sense.
[21:12] <asac> dont see any env from here that is set
[21:13] <asac> you can touch file in common-binary-indep:: or binary-indep:: even
[21:16] <asac> BUGabundo: dont install the -dev packages
[21:21] <sladen> fta: it would be good if you could double-check/run the LZMA source thing past cjwatson;  an .orig.tar.lzma isn't allowed and "hiding" the LZMA inside that seems to be just getting around that
[21:36] <BUGabundo> ahh
[21:36] <BUGabundo> ok asac
[21:36] <fta> sladen, i don't call that hiding, we've been using embedded bz2 tarballs for a very long time, it really helps speed things up for huge source tarballs
[21:36] <BUGabundo> asac: fixed now
[21:38] <fta> sladen, i can discuss that with Colin for sure but i really don't see how it could be a problem. deb lzma is another topic, but with the extra precautions i used, it should not be a problem either
[21:41] <sladen> fta: I presume it's something to do that a base-level machine/infrastructure must always be able to installl---but that's a presumption
[21:43] <sladen> fta: deb LZMA *is* fine for non-base package through
[21:45] <fta> sladen, we're not doing base here ;)
[21:46] <fta> i pre-depend on lzma so i'm sure my debs will be properly unpacked
[21:55] <fta> BUGabundo, http://www.sofaraway.org/ubuntu/tmp/chromium-popcon-5.png  google is catching up
[21:56] <BUGabundo> again?
[21:56] <BUGabundo> at least u failed your last predition
[21:56] <fta> yep
[21:57] <fta> BUGabundo, you're not denting/blogging enough ;)
[21:57] <BUGabundo> ahahahhahahahha
[21:57] <BUGabundo> about chroumium?
[21:57] <BUGabundo> I'll start
[21:57] <BUGabundo> and point you to it too
[21:57] <BUGabundo> ahaha
[21:57] <BUGabundo> poor fta
[21:58]  * BUGabundo ducks
[22:01] <fta> lol
[22:03] <BUGabundo> fta: is it possible to add other Dicionaries to Chrome/Chromium
[22:04] <BUGabundo> ?
[22:10] <fta> BUGabundo, well, it's supposed to download the dicts from upstream, it's not the same format as our hunspell, but it's not ready
[22:11] <BUGabundo> ohh ok
[22:11] <BUGabundo> I miss the PT dics
[22:47] <BUGabundo> asac: it works
[22:47] <BUGabundo> I now have 3G back
[22:54] <e-jat> BUGabundo: u update the NM ?
[22:54] <BUGabundo> downgraded it
[22:54] <BUGabundo> :)
[22:55] <e-jat> from ? to ?
[22:56] <BUGabundo> NM$ ls | pastebinit
[22:56] <BUGabundo> http://paste.ubuntu.com/251062/
[22:56] <BUGabundo> to this
[22:57] <BUGabundo> why e-jat?
[22:57] <BUGabundo> you also having trouble?
[22:58] <e-jat> http://pastebin.com/f5ee56a40
[22:59] <e-jat> im in kubuntu .. using kppp to dial my 3g :(
[22:59] <e-jat> havent try in gnome yet
[23:02]  * e-jat checking the git .. yours or mine use the latest ..
[23:03] <BUGabundo> fta: funny chromium new bug
[23:03] <BUGabundo> mouse middle click
[23:03] <BUGabundo> send the entire window to background
[23:03] <e-jat> BUGabundo: u revert back dont u ?
[23:03] <BUGabundo> I did
[23:03] <e-jat> ic..
[23:04] <e-jat> BUGabundo: yeah .. the middle click :)
[23:04] <BUGabundo> funny right?
[23:04] <e-jat> paste then goes to background ..
[23:04] <fta> hm, not for me
[23:04] <BUGabundo> I didn't say past
[23:04] <BUGabundo> I just said Window
[23:05] <fta> i'm tracking this bug: http://code.google.com/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=11612  but it's not the same
[23:07]  * BUGabundo look
[23:07] <BUGabundo> nope
[23:08] <BUGabundo> not the same thing
[23:08] <BUGabundo> this is to open new tabs
[23:08] <e-jat> BUGabundo: file the bug :)
[23:08] <e-jat> if it is a bug ..
[23:08] <fta> check for existing bugs 1st
[23:08] <BUGabundo> oohhh kewl
[23:09] <BUGabundo> its a window changer
[23:09] <BUGabundo> LOLOL
[23:09] <BUGabundo> its a _feature_
[23:09] <BUGabundo> DOH
[23:09] <BUGabundo> a very bad one if you ask me
[23:09] <e-jat> BUGabundo: ?
[23:09] <BUGabundo> minimez all window
[23:09] <e-jat> shortcut key ?
[23:09] <BUGabundo> open just two C wind
[23:09] <BUGabundo> and middle click a few times
[23:09] <BUGabundo> it will change amoung the two
[23:11] <e-jat> u r right :)
[23:12] <BUGabundo> I'm always right
[23:12] <BUGabundo> memorize that!
[23:14] <fta> compiz?
[23:14] <BUGabundo> I wish I knew if any of this addons is the cause for my gmail killing FF 3.6
[23:14] <BUGabundo> http://paste.ubuntu.com/251069/
[23:14] <fta> because it doesn't do that for me (metacity)
[23:15] <BUGabundo> I have compiz
[23:15] <micahg> BUGabundo: new noscript is out
[23:16] <BUGabundo> again?
[23:16] <micahg> yep, 1.9.8
[23:16] <BUGabundo> that's like every two days now
[23:19] <BUGabundo> micahg: let me see if tmp as a new build too
[23:20] <BUGabundo> those guys are way behing 3.6 compatibilty
[23:20] <BUGabundo> several features are now on 3.6 core
[23:20] <BUGabundo> so it totally messes up the addon
[23:20] <BUGabundo> I can't use ctrl+tab now :(
[23:47] <fta> asac, did you fix 3.6?