[00:01] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - do you want the new SSH plugin building in vinagre?
[00:02] <seb128> chrisccoulson, does it has extra build-depends or potential issues?
[00:02] <chrisccoulson> it has an extra build-dep on libvte
[00:02] <seb128> seems ok
[00:02] <chrisccoulson> cool, i'll build it for now then
[00:03] <chrisccoulson> we can always turn it off again if it causes any issues
[00:03] <seb128> right
[00:22] <seb128> asac__,
[00:22] <seb128> $ usr/lib/xulrunner-`xulrunner --gre-version`
[00:22] <seb128> bash: usr/lib/xulrunner-1.9.0.13: No such file or directory
[00:23] <seb128> asac__, ^ is that normal?
[00:23] <seb128> I'm on current karmic, it should use xulrunner-1.9.1 no?
[00:35] <asac__> seb128: yes.
[00:35] <asac__> its a bug
[00:35] <asac__> i gave you the wrong template i think
[00:35] <asac__> xulrunner-1.9.1 is better
[00:36] <seb128> wrong template?
[00:36] <asac__> wrong command
[00:36] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - vinagre is done now too:)
[00:36] <asac__> usr/lib/xulrunner-`xulrunner-1.9.1 --gre-version`
[00:36] <asac__> you could figure the 1.9.1 during build ... but for now hard code it i would think
[00:36] <seb128> asac__, shouldn't "xulrunner --gre-version" default to 1.9.1 now?
[00:36] <seb128> chrisccoulson, cool
[00:36] <asac__> seb128: it should. but its a bloody alternative
[00:37] <seb128> ok so the command is right but the alternative is buggy
[00:37] <seb128> thanks
[00:37] <asac__> well. i dont want an alterantive there actually
[00:37] <asac__> but not yet sure what i really want
[00:38] <asac__> at best we could get rid of that unversioned thing in the main binary and only ship one in -dev file
[00:38] <seb128> seems I'm not the only one to dislike alternatives ;-)
[00:38] <asac__> yeah. the concept is inheritently broken for user centric desktops ;)
[00:38] <asac__> at least not without a great UI ;)
[08:44] <slomo> seb128: hi :) you might want to sync gnonlin from debian/unstable and the new gst-plugins-{good,bad} pre-releases from debian/experimental
[08:45] <seb128> slomo, hey ok thanks
[09:03] <chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
[09:03] <seb128> hello chrisccoulson
[09:04] <chrisccoulson> hey seb128 - how are you?
[09:04] <seb128> good! you?
[09:04] <seb128> I just sponsored your g-c-c update
[09:05] <seb128> now time to get a coffee ;-)
[09:05] <chrisccoulson> yeah, not too bad. quite tired, but i'm sure i will wake up more when i've finished this coffee!"
[09:05] <chrisccoulson> thanks:)
[09:32] <didrocks> hey seb128 o/
[09:33] <seb128> lut didrocks
[09:35] <mac_v> seb128: hi... when is gnome 2.28 expected? is it for karmic or later?
[09:36] <seb128> mac_v, new to ubuntu? ;-)
[09:36] <seb128> mac_v, Ubuntu since warty ships after stable GNOME and with the newer version
[09:36] <seb128> ie expect 2.28.1 in karmic
[09:37] <mac_v> seb128: hehe... i was actually having a doubt ... didnt know the policy exactly :(
[09:37] <seb128> you would expect us to ship with unstable versions?
[09:37] <seb128> ie 2.27?
[09:37] <seb128> anyway yes we will have 2.28
[09:41] <mac_v> seb128: oh! just realized how stupid my question was! i actually wanted to ask when! but rather asked about the OS :/
[09:42] <seb128> mac_v, GNOME 2.28.1 is oct 22
[09:42] <seb128> and karmic is oct 29
[09:43] <mac_v> ah... ok , thanx.. karmic i knew :)
[09:44] <seb128> mac_v, we should have GNOME 2.28 in beta and 2.28.1 in karmic
[10:10] <chrisccoulson> yay! i got a git account in gnome now:)
[10:12] <seb128> chrisccoulson, waouh, that was quick, well done
[10:12] <seb128> who advocated you?
[10:13] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - not sure. i selected the maintainer of g-s-d to vouch for me, but i'm not sure if there is more than one maintainer, and who advocated me
[10:14] <chrisccoulson> yeah, that was pretty quick. i only applied last night before i went to bed!
[10:19] <seb128> I keep telling pitti to apply too
[10:19] <seb128> he was not sure he submitted enough patches
[10:19] <seb128> I will get him to apply when he's back
[10:19] <chrisccoulson> yeah, he should definately apply. i'm sure he's submitted quite a lot more than me ;)
[10:20] <seb128> he ported a good bunch of gvfs to gudev
[10:20] <seb128> and sent quite some patches over years
[10:22] <chrisccoulson> yeah, he does a lot of work:)
[10:23] <chrisccoulson> bratsche - i just saw your email on d-d-l about signalling when the session is ready. i have some ideas for that, and I'll send them to the list when I get the chance (and can communicate them in a way that makes sense to everyone)
[10:24] <chrisccoulson> s/some ideas/an idea
[10:30] <seb128> chrisccoulson, cool
[10:30] <seb128> chrisccoulson, did you do one of the other updates yesterday?
[10:31] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - not yet. brasero is next on my list
[10:31] <seb128> ok
[10:31] <chrisccoulson> there was also vino as well wasn't there?
[10:31] <seb128> no, vinagre
[10:31] <seb128> I did vino
[10:31] <chrisccoulson> cool:)
[12:20] <garymc> Hi im running ubuntu 9.04 ltsp, im connected through thin client. Now I installed Latest flash plugin from adobe site and every time i use Firefox to view youtube vids the firfox browser closes or disapears after 30 seconds
[12:20] <garymc> Anyone know whats wrong?
[12:22] <seb128> garymc, the adobe code is probably crashing
[12:22] <garymc> how can i fix this?
[12:22] <seb128> nothing we can do about complain to adobe
[12:22] <seb128> it's closed source
[12:22] <garymc> right should i uninstall it and install a differtn one?
[12:23] <Tm_T> I assume we cannot recommend gnash as replacement?
[12:23] <seb128> not sure what we can recommend
[12:23] <seb128> but complain to adobe that their code is crashing
[12:23] <seb128> or stop using flash
[12:55] <artir> can xsplash be ran at this moment?
[12:55] <seb128> yes
[12:56] <fredp> btw, has anybody blogged about xsplash yet?
[12:56] <seb128> not that I know but it's still rough on the edges
[12:57] <fredp> ok, thanks for the info.
[12:57] <seb128> you're welcome
[12:57] <seb128> they are trying to get that somewhat working before blogging I think
[13:07] <chrisccoulson> mpt - how should disk failure notifications be handled in g-d-u? they currently show a notification icon, plus a fallback notification with Ok/Cancel buttons
[13:07] <chrisccoulson> (sorry if you've already discussed this before)
[13:07] <mpt> chrisccoulson, do you know which package is responsible for the notifications?
[13:08] <chrisccoulson> gnome-disk-utility
[13:09] <mpt> chrisccoulson, please add a bullet point to <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NotifyOSD#gnome-disk-utility> with the text, or a screenshot, or both, of the notification
[13:09] <chrisccoulson> mpt - will do:)
[13:10] <mpt> chrisccoulson, if you're keen to patch it now, let me know, and I'll take a look at it ASAP
[13:10] <seb128> chrisccoulson, one annoying thing is that you get that at every login
[13:11] <chrisccoulson> mpt / seb128 - i can probably look at it, although not straight away. i could perhaps implement something similar to the low disk space warning, where you have the option to never warn again?
[13:12] <seb128> well especially that what can you do when you got that out of ack and change disks
[13:12] <mpt> chrisccoulson, seb128: Why would you want it to not warn you?
[13:12] <seb128> because I know the disk has an issue
[13:12] <mpt> What does "out of ack" mean?
[13:12] <seb128> well it told me the disk shows some issues, I know about it
[13:12] <artir> seb128: I've installed the xsplash 0.3 in karmic and the boot is the same as in usplash: ubuntu logo and progress bar
[13:13] <seb128> does I need to have an icon in the notification area until end of times?
[13:13] <chrisccoulson> i think the issue is that smart "failures" can indicate things like old-age and that the disk may fail in the future, and may not mean that the disk has already failed
[13:13] <mpt> seb128, well, it probably shouldn't be using the notification area to start with ;-)
[13:13] <chrisccoulson> so you might not want to see the notification every time you log in
[13:13] <seb128> artir, that's expected, it should only show before gdm and to desktop then
[13:13] <seb128> mpt, well my point is that I know about the issue now
[13:13] <seb128> mpt, no need to keep telling me at each login
[13:14] <mpt> I dislike "Don't warn me about this again" checkboxes in general because (a) it suggests the warning shouldn't have been an alert in the first place and (b) if you check it by accident, it's not obvious how to turn it back on again
[13:14] <seb128> I want a "I know the disk has an issue but it works and I don't want to replace it now" button ;-)
[13:15] <chrisccoulson> i think the idea is that the alert allows the user to make a choice. they can either choose to replace their disk, or choose to ignore it (like in seb's case ;)), so the warning is valid, even if there is an option to not warn again
[13:16] <seb128> what choice?
[13:17] <seb128> the details about the issue are lacking too
[13:18] <chrisccoulson> yeah. i have to admit, i've not seen the notification yet - but there is already a bug report about it
[13:18] <mpt> Remind me again if I haven't replaced this disk in: [2 weeks    :^]
[13:19] <chrisccoulson> mpt - that's a possibility
[13:19] <seb128> that makes sense
[13:22] <bratsche> chrisccoulson: Cool, thanks!
[13:22] <seb128> hey bratsche
[13:22] <seb128> chrisccoulson, the thing is that even if want to replace the disk it's likely you don't have one handy
[13:23] <seb128> ie need to order one, etc
[13:23] <seb128> no point to show the warning every day until you receive it
[13:23] <bratsche> Morning seb128!
[13:24] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - true. it's good that we have a warning now though. i had a disk fail on me last year with no warning. it just died and i couldn't boot anymore ;)
[13:28] <mpt> ( Buy Another Disk Online... )
[13:28] <mpt> $_$
[13:29] <seb128> ;-)
[13:31] <chrisccoulson> mpt - or (Request RMA...)
[13:31] <chrisccoulson> no $$ there though;)
[13:31] <mpt> What's RMA?
[13:31] <chrisccoulson> "return merchandise authorization"
[13:31] <mpt> oh, so not the Rubber Manufacturers Association
[13:32] <chrisccoulson> it's a process manufacturers use for you to return goods directly to them that failed under warranty
[13:32] <chrisccoulson> which is common for hard disks now, seeing as they have such long warranty periods
[13:32] <chrisccoulson> "Rubber Manufacturers Association" - lol ;)
[13:32] <mpt> Can a hard disk tell you programmatically when its warranty expires?
[13:33] <chrisccoulson> mpt - i don't think so. you have to submit the serial number to the manufacturer, and they then tell you the manufacture date
[13:33] <chrisccoulson> that's what i did with my disk anyway
[13:34] <chrisccoulson> they then send you a new one, and you then send the failed one back in the box that they sent you the new disk in
[13:34] <chrisccoulson> it's quite an efficient process:)
[13:34] <seb128> I should check when I bought this disk
[13:34] <seb128> it's around 3 years ago
[13:35] <seb128> maybe it's still under warranty
[13:35] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - most newer drives come with 5 years now. but 3 years used to be the norm
[13:35] <chrisccoulson> my disks are only slightly older than yours probably, and they only had 3 year warranty
[13:35] <chrisccoulson> they've just expired now :(
[13:37] <chrisccoulson> right, i have to go and do some work now
[13:37] <seb128> have fun
[13:37]  * seb128 goes to take coffee
[13:37] <chrisccoulson> heh, "fun" is the wrong word ;)
[13:38] <chrisccoulson> i can think of more appropriate ones
[14:41] <seb128> re
[14:42] <Laney> wb
[14:42] <seb128> mpt, if there is no user doing autologin and you start gdmsetup should the combo be empty or select a random user?
[14:42] <mpt> seb128, it should default to yourself, I think
[14:43] <seb128> mpt, and on the login screen if opened there? (ie gdm user)
[14:43] <mpt> If you have both permission and desire to turn on that setting, you're probably wanting to set it to log in as yourself rather than anyone else
[14:43] <Laney> The polkit combo should default to the current user if he has permission too imo
[14:44] <mpt> seb128, is it possible to open the window from there? If so, why?
[14:44] <seb128> mpt, I think it was part of the design spec, being able to set options from the login screen menu
[14:44] <seb128> but let's ignore that for know if you think that's not a good idea
[14:45] <mpt> seb128, ok, for that case I suggest the alphabetically first account
[14:45] <seb128> we didn't add it to the login screen yet
[14:45] <seb128> mpt, ok thanks
[14:45] <seb128> Laney, thanks too
[14:45] <mpt> option menus shouldn't default to being empty, it looks weird
[14:45] <mpt> (and it suggests empty is a valid choice when it isn't)
[14:48] <seb128> right makes sense
[14:49] <dobey> seb128: hey. can you explain the replaces thing a bit more? it doesn't make sense to me to have a package that Replaces: itself
[14:51] <seb128> dobey, I probably did a typo in names
[14:51] <seb128> dobey, if you move files from binary binary to binary-other you need to use Replaces on the old one
[14:52] <jcastro> seb128, I see you got the fspot release you wanted!
[14:52] <seb128> to tell to dpkg that binaries which are in binary are going to be overwritten by binary-other
[14:52] <seb128> jcastro, ;-)
[14:52] <dobey> seb128: oh ok
[14:52] <Laney> where's the bug for alt-f2 (etc) not working?
[14:53] <Laney> jcastro: did you have something to do with this release? :O
[14:53] <seb128> dobey, that's because you don't have a fixed upgrade order, the new package could be unpacked before the other upgrade and trigger a "try to overwritte files from other package"
[14:53] <seb128> Laney, gnome-panel I think
[14:53] <Laney> bgo or lp?
[14:53] <seb128> lp for sure
[14:54] <seb128> maybe bgo too
[14:54] <Laney> alright
[14:54] <jcastro> Laney, no, I was just lamenting the old fspot we've been carrying forever
[14:54] <seb128> bug #398826
[14:54] <dobey> seb128: right. and << is the correct syntax for "less than"?
[14:54] <Laney> thanks
[14:54] <seb128> dobey, yes, it's either << or <=
[14:54] <seb128> ie no "<"
[14:54] <dobey> seb128: ok
[14:55] <seb128> Laney, there is an upstream task
[14:55] <dobey> seb128: should I add a Conflicts: for it too?
[14:55] <Laney> it's not necessarily solid colour
[14:55] <Laney> I have "background image" and it's broken too
[14:55] <seb128> dobey, no
[14:55] <dobey> ok
[14:55] <seb128> dobey, conflicts is when you want to other one to be removed
[14:56] <seb128> dobey, but it's usually not a good idea to copy conffiles around
[14:56] <seb128> ie are you sure it makes sense in the python binary?
[14:56] <seb128> Laney, yeah, I've a box with this issue too
[14:56] <seb128> Laney, it's subtle apparently, could be something else in the config
[14:56] <seb128> or 2 different issues
[14:56] <seb128> but it does happen on transparent backgrounds
[14:57] <seb128> and some time on non transparents too ...
[14:57] <seb128> blame it on vuntz ;-)
[14:57] <Laney> seems like a strange thing to interact with
[14:57] <Laney> fun bug
[14:59] <dobey> seb128: yes, as the files are loaded by the python modules, and anyone else writing a tool that used those modules, but didn't actually require the binaries in ubuntuone-client, would end up having their scripts fail too
[15:00] <dobey> seb128: unless we need to make a new -common package or something i guess
[15:01] <garymc>  Anyone wanna help me create launchers that all users will have on their desktops in UBUNTU 9.04 LTSP
[15:01] <garymc> I want a launcher all will see each time they log in
[15:02] <seb128> garymc, add it to the Desktop dir for each user
[15:02] <seb128> dobey, hum ok, let's have it in the python package for now
[15:11] <garymc> seb128 is there a way I can make it appear on all users desktops with out having to do that
[15:11] <garymc> im sure there is
[15:12] <seb128> garymc, patch nautilus code
[15:12] <dobey> seb128: cool, updated/pushed the branch for bug #412181
[15:12] <seb128> dobey, ok thanks
[15:12] <dobey> garymc: have a script in /etc/profile.d that copies the file over each time they log in
[15:24] <chrisccoulson1> bratsche - your e-mail thread on d-d-l has gone way off topic now :(
[15:25] <chrisccoulson1> everyones gone on to discussing if nautilus should do media handling :-/
[15:29] <bratsche> chrisccoulson1: Yeah I know. :/
[15:31] <chrisccoulson1> hopefully someone will pst something on-topic soon ;)
[15:31] <chrisccoulson1> right, bbiab - need to move to another desk
[15:49] <Laney> bah
[15:49] <Laney> indicator applet isn't notifying me of IMs
[15:50]  * Laney puts pidgin icon back
[15:51] <garymc> anyone wanna talk me through adding a launcher for a web page, that will appear on all of my users desktops automaticly?
[15:54] <chrisccoulson> garymc - you probably want #ubuntu for support
[16:34] <lool> seb128: Just FYI the gtk+2.0 uploads break installability for a while on armel so they'd best be avoided during freeze when we're trying to get images to build   ;)
[16:35] <seb128> lool, as said before that was now or in 3 weeks
[16:35] <seb128> lool, I don't want to update a new gtk on friday before vacs
[16:35] <seb128> and most of desktop team is away in the next weeks
[16:35] <seb128> sorry about that
[16:35] <lool> Alpha 4 armel image is today or is not at all   ;)
[16:36] <lool> It's ok, we will deal with it now; just something to avoid  :-/
[16:37] <seb128> lool, as said I would not do it usually
[16:37] <seb128> but client side decoration is quite buggy
[16:37] <seb128> and that was either having karmic buggy for 3 extra weeks
[16:37] <seb128> or trying to squeeze it now
[16:37] <lool> k
[16:37] <seb128> I took a shoot at the second one
[16:48] <mdz> is there a karmic bug report open about the screen blanking unexpectedly?
[16:48] <mdz> ah, bug 397839
[16:52] <seb128> mdz, tricky bug
[16:56] <kenvandine> mdz, yeah that is an annoying bug
[16:57] <mdz> kenvandine: indeed, though I'm not sure it deserves Critical importance
[16:57] <kenvandine> true
[19:35] <cody-somerville> Hi
[19:35] <cody-somerville> Can I get someone to review https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~cody-somerville/gnome-screensaver/drop-gpm-to-suggest/+merge/10047 ?
[19:42] <blue0488> I am using a i7 cpu and I am unable to get the cpu temp from lm-sensors
[19:47] <mac_v> blue0488: #ubuntu for help
[19:48] <blue0488> yeah I am in there
[20:04] <chrisccoulson> bratsche - i emailed d-d-l now
[20:05] <bratsche> Thanks.
[20:05] <chrisccoulson> but i just noticed my suggestion is a bit similar to something someone else already touched on in that thread, but it sort of got "lost in the noise"
[20:06] <bratsche> chrisccoulson: Trying to talk to people on #gnome-hackers as well, but mostly I get responses like, "It would be better to just figure out why things are slow than to hide the slowness".
[20:06] <bratsche> And I'm like, "Yeah I know.. but that's not a short-term project that I can just do right now." :)
[20:07] <chrisccoulson> yeah, its something that someone somewhere must be capable of solving. and it's not just about slowness - desktop loading is hideously ugly, and that won't be solved by loading it faster
[20:08] <chrisccoulson> i'll let you read my suggestion anyway:)
[20:08] <bratsche> Cool, thanks.
[20:09] <seb128> cody-somerville, hi, that's a correct recommends
[20:09] <seb128> cody-somerville, ie suggest would be wrong
[20:10] <cody-somerville> Why is it correct?
[20:11] <seb128> because the capplet has a button to do gpm config
[20:11] <cody-somerville> right but if gpm isn't installed then it doesn't show it
[20:11] <bratsche> chrisccoulson: Very cool, thanks.  Reading now.
[20:12] <seb128> cody-somerville, need to think about it, debian explicitly added the recommends
[20:12] <seb128> anyway we are frozen for alpha now
[20:13]  * cody-somerville is trying to get the Xubuntu ISOs to size.
[20:13] <seb128> talk to slangasek he was unhappy about other uploads before today
[20:13] <cody-somerville> Note that although I think it should be a suggests, I'd be happy if it was a recommends: g-p-m | xfce4-power-manager
[20:14] <seb128> ie I'm not going to upload anything else today
[20:14] <seb128> or at least not without slangasek approval
[20:14] <chrisccoulson> no hurry for the brasero update then seb128?
[20:14] <seb128> chrisccoulson, not at all
[20:15] <chrisccoulson> i will maybe relax for an hour or so then :)
[20:15] <seb128> yeah, you should enjoy your evening
[20:15] <seb128> you do enough ;-)
[20:15] <chrisccoulson> heh, i don't do as much as some people ;)
[20:16] <seb128> some people who are paid to work there though
[20:19] <cody-somerville> seb128, Steve said okay.
[20:20] <seb128> cody-somerville,ok, I've to go now but if you find a sponsor feel free to get it uploaded
[20:48] <mdz> I'm having some weird problems with flash content in karmic, the flash applets aren't responding to clicks at all
[20:48] <mdz> anyone else seeing this?
[20:48] <mdz> tried downgrading flash, switching back to firefox-3.0, nothing helped
[21:01] <mdz> installing the native 64-bit flash plugin does, though.  perhaps nspluginwrapper is to blame.
[21:01] <mdz> now to get audio working...
[21:17]  * chrisccoulson must get around to upgrading his main desktop to karmic next week
[21:25] <seb128> chrisccoulson, not running karmic yet?
[21:25] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - in a VM only at the moment, so gnome-shell love for me yet ;)
[21:25] <seb128> +no?
[21:26] <chrisccoulson> yeah, thats what i meant ;)
[21:26] <chrisccoulson> i've not found the time to upgrade my desktop yet - i want to do a full reinstall really because i'm going to change the configuration of my disks quite a bit this time
[21:41] <chrisccoulson> hmmm, i get lots of flicker between GDM and my desktop now
[21:41] <chrisccoulson> is that expected with xsplash?
[21:50] <Ng> heh, interesting bug. can't import pictures from a new camera if there's one already plugged in
[21:50] <dashua> chrisccoulson, There is some flicker, but not too much.
[21:51] <dashua> Somewhat of a fade, but the flicker hampers what is being done.
[21:51] <chrisccoulson> dashua - i don't see any fade
[21:52] <chrisccoulson> only flicker ;)
[21:52] <chrisccoulson> and quite jerky too
[21:52] <dashua> There is a hint of a fade but the warty-final wallpaper has a weird transition from GDM to the desktop and then to my selected wallpaper
[21:53] <dashua> Yeah jerky and out of focus.
[22:20] <seb128> re
[22:21] <seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, did you notice that your deprecated applets are still in the add to panel dialog?
[22:21] <seb128> with a "(deprecated)" label
[22:21] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - i didn't notice that
[22:21] <chrisccoulson> one second
[22:21] <seb128> chrisccoulson, can you look if you get the issue too?
[22:21] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i see it too
[22:22] <chrisccoulson> it also happens with the mixer applet too
[22:22] <seb128> I wrote "you" but that's probably no you
[22:22] <seb128> either an issue with the patch to silent cleaning
[22:22] <seb128> or a bug in upstream code
[22:22] <chrisccoulson> i wonder how to stop that? we still effectively install an applet (but a null one), to ensure that the config is clean. but that applet still has a title
[22:23] <chrisccoulson> that dialog is part of gnome-panel isn't it?
[22:23] <seb128> yes
[22:23] <chrisccoulson> i wonder if we need to patch that to hide deprecated applets? or if there is a nicer way to do it
[22:23] <seb128> not sure, maybe vuntz knows
[22:23] <superm1> i just uploaded lp:~superm1/gnome-screensaver/xfce-alternative for cody-somerville to fix that gnome-screensaver bit as mentioned a little bit ago.  can one of you guys in ~ubuntu-desktop merge it?
[22:23] <seb128> superm1, can't you do it?
[22:24] <superm1> i'm not part of ~ubuntu-desktop am i?
[22:24] <chrisccoulson> ubuntu-core-dev is isn't it?
[22:24] <seb128> superm1, all main uploades should be able to commit there
[22:24] <seb128> uploaders
[22:24] <superm1> seb128, oh awesome :) will do then
[22:24] <seb128> superm1, thanks
[22:25] <mclasen> chriscoulson: I forget the details, but we have a gnome-applets patch that does that for a few applets
[22:25] <mclasen> (replace by nullapplet _and_ make it not show up in add dialog)
[22:26] <chrisccoulson> mclasen - i would be interested to have a look at that:)
[22:26] <mclasen> if only I knew the url offhand...
[22:26] <mclasen> http://cvs.fedoraproject.org/viewvc/rpms/gnome-applets/ I guess
[22:26] <chrisccoulson> i added a patch recently to deprecate some more applets, as we don't really need them anymore, but there is still the issue that they show up
[22:26] <chrisccoulson> thanks, i'll have a look
[22:27] <chrisccoulson> mclasen - do you think modemlights and battstatus should be deprecated in the upstream tarball now?
[22:27] <chrisccoulson> those are the 2 more we just got rid of
[22:28] <mclasen> really, they are all quite useless...
[22:28] <kklimonda> are there some bugs in gnome-power-manager or in idle detection code? Mine doesn't seem to put screen offline, also gnome-screensaver never starts..
[22:28] <chrisccoulson> yeah, i agree. i see you've already made battstatus a null applet in fedora too
[22:29] <chrisccoulson> kklimonda - i've seen some users mention that
[22:29] <chrisccoulson> is gnome-screensaver even running? i'm sure i've seen it working ok here...
[22:30] <kklimonda> yes
[22:30] <chrisccoulson> but i'm not 100% sure
[22:30] <chrisccoulson> hmmm
[22:30] <kklimonda> also I have configured gnome-power-manager to put my display to sleep after 30 minutes but It stayed on all night
[22:31] <superm1> kklimonda, last mention i heard was it's actually an X bug
[22:31] <kklimonda> I'll run screensaver with --debug tonight, maybe I'll get something useful
[22:32] <superm1> i subscribed to it this morning myself to keep an eye on it:  bug 397839
[22:33] <kklimonda> superm1: it's another issue which I also experience - maybe they are somehow connected though..
[22:33] <chrisccoulson> superm1 - isn't that the opposite issue? ;)
[22:35] <superm1> chrisccoulson, well the thing is this blanking isn't synonymous with the screensaver coming on.  it's completely independent
[22:35] <superm1> but i see what you mean :)
[22:38] <kklimonda> btw, is there some short xsplash description I could use when people are asking about it? :)
[22:38] <kklimonda> is it supposed to replace usplash?
[22:38] <seb128> kklimonda, the issue could be bug #407491
[22:39] <seb128> kklimonda, sort of, it's an xorg splash and used for after login too
[22:40] <chrisccoulson> i don't understand how the g-p-m idle detection stuff works
[22:41] <chrisccoulson> it gets idle status from gnome-sessions presence API
[22:41] <chrisccoulson> or at least it seems too
[22:41] <chrisccoulson> so it could be a g-p-m, g-session or g-screensaver issue ;)
[22:41] <chrisccoulson> or all 3
[22:42] <kklimonda> seb128: hmm.. but default settings are to put display to sleep after 30 minutes (at least on my computer) so it shouldn't be an issue.
[22:42] <seb128> ok so I don't know
[22:42] <seb128> the one looking after gpm is pitti
[22:42] <seb128> and he's on holidays
[22:43] <Nafallo> seb128: thank god we don't have this maintainer upload lockin Debian has ;-)
[22:43] <seb128> Nafallo, the issue is not an upload one there but a debug one
[22:43] <kklimonda> Nafallo: well, they don't have a 6 month release cycle we do.. :)
[22:43] <seb128> Nafallo, want to debug? ;-)
[22:44] <Nafallo> seb128: I just failed at debugging netbook-launcher. think you're asking the wrong guy ;-)
[22:50] <chrisccoulson> i wish i had a laptop here :( i'd spend all night debugging this then ;)
[22:50] <chrisccoulson> and it would all be fixed by the time you wake up in the morning!
[22:50] <chrisccoulson> lol
[22:50] <seb128_> ;-)
[22:51] <chrisccoulson> thats probably a little over-optimistic
[22:54] <kklimonda> :D
[22:55] <chrisccoulson> i bet pitti could have it debugged and fixed in 45minutes ;)
[22:56] <seb128_> I don't think pitti knows the specific about screen blanking
[22:56] <seb128_> he's rather looking at suspend, etc issue usually
[22:56] <seb128_> but yeah maybe ;-)
[22:57] <davmor2> will the shutdown restart stuff find it's way back into fusa?
[23:00] <chrisccoulson> mclasen - is this the one which fixes the deprecated applets showing in the dialog?
[23:00] <chrisccoulson> http://cvs.fedoraproject.org/viewvc/rpms/gnome-applets/devel/gnome-applets-no-mixer-icon.patch?view=markup
[23:01] <chrisccoulson> i suppose i could edit the server file on my system and try it actually ;)
[23:04] <chrisccoulson> it fixes it:)
[23:10] <chrisccoulson> seb128_ i just pushed a change to the gnome-applets branch to hide those applets
[23:10] <chrisccoulson> probably not worth an upload on its own though
[23:10] <seb128_> chrisccoulson, thanks
[23:11] <seb128_> not during freeze in any case
[23:11] <chrisccoulson> but its there ready for the next update;)
[23:13] <chrisccoulson> seb128_ - i see fedora deprecated sticky notes too
[23:13] <chrisccoulson> we probably wouldn't be popular with users if we did that though would we?
[23:13] <seb128_> no
[23:13] <chrisccoulson> with all the mono discussions that keep happening ;)
[23:13] <kklimonda> heh
[23:14] <seb128_> quite some people seem to prefer it to tomboy or gnotes
[23:14] <seb128_> well there is gnotes now
[23:14] <chrisccoulson> i haven't tried gnotes yet
[23:14] <chrisccoulson> tomboy seems to work ok here
[23:14] <kklimonda> well, sticky notes are minimalistic and actually look like sticky notes.. on the other hand tomboy looks bloated..
[23:15] <chrisccoulson> wierd. on my system, sticky notes uses over 10MB
[23:15] <chrisccoulson> and tomboy only 8.8
[23:16] <chrisccoulson> sticky notes is bloated ;)
[23:17] <kklimonda> chrisccoulson: I was actually thinking about design but indeed the amount of ram that sticky notes are using is weird..
[23:17] <kklimonda> maybe they are written in python? :}
[23:17] <chrisccoulson> sticknotes is all C i think
[23:17] <kklimonda> yup
[23:18] <kklimonda> they were there way before python has become a resolution to all our problems :/
[23:18] <chrisccoulson> i don't like python very much
[23:19] <chrisccoulson> but thats probably because i don't know how to write it ;)
[23:19] <seb128_> python is great
[23:19] <chrisccoulson> i only know C :(
[23:19] <chrisccoulson> i need to find some time to learn it really ;)
[23:19] <seb128_> python is easy to learn and make lot of small hacking fun
[23:19] <kklimonda> seb128_: it's great for all those small scripts etc.
[23:19] <seb128_> yes, it's not made to write desktop applications
[23:20] <kklimonda> seb128_: but I hate seeing yet another applet/daemon taking over 20-30mb of ram..
[23:20] <seb128_> right, it's not good for services
[23:20] <chrisccoulson> i'm currently working on some old products at work where the software was written in assembler ;)
[23:20] <seb128_> but for ie update-manager works great
[23:22] <kklimonda> I wonder if Vala will get some friction in gnome community..
[23:22] <chrisccoulson> kklimonda - it's already used a fair bit in tracker
[23:22] <kklimonda> chrisccoulson: that's because vala's developer works on tracker too..
[23:23] <chrisccoulson> yes ;)
[23:28]  * davmor2 likes the new disc management tool :)
[23:29] <kklimonda> hmm? pi.. py.. palimrest?
[23:31] <chrisccoulson> hmmm, i don't think gnome-session is setting the session idle
[23:31] <chrisccoulson> ah, but that shouldn't matter for blanking the display