[00:02] We'll wait a few minutes for bodhi [00:03] Rocket2DMn: k, no worries, No one else booked meeting after us. [00:03] Rocket2DMn: While we are waiting, can I ask you a question about the quizzes? [00:03] yeah drs305 [00:04] Has there ever been discussion about when a quiz is given (i.e. scheduled vs spru of the moment)? [00:04] * spur ( I hate sprus) [00:04] no, it's always just been spur of the moment (i.e. whenever bodhi got to it) === asac_ is now known as asac [00:08] #startmeeting [00:08] Meeting started at 18:08. The chair is Rocket2DMn. [00:08] Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE] [00:08] Ok, bodhi hasn't shown up, so we'll start without him [00:08] let's just run down the focus groups, hopefully he'll be here for the main agenda [00:09] Development FG? I don't see paultag [00:09] Education FG? I don't see any leads for them either [00:09] IRC? [00:10] Nobody's around in August... [00:10] Launchpad? Security? Stalking? [00:10] jgoguen, YNU FG? [00:10] i think its dev [00:10] guess this is gonna be a quiet meeting... [00:10] Rocket2DMn: Not much to say ATM. We've got a bunch of users, thinking about a meeting soon :) [00:11] cool jgoguen , don't wait to set one up, summer is starting to wind down for people [00:11] Rocket2DMn: We were thinking soon, next week or so [00:12] Sounds good [00:12] [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Meetings [00:12] LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Meetings [00:12] let's start with the main agenda then [00:13] [TOPIC] Folding@Home and the #ubuntu-folding channel [00:13] New Topic: Folding@Home and the #ubuntu-folding channel [00:13] swoody, you're up [00:13] Thanks Rocket2DMn, I'll make this short for everyone :) [00:13] I just wanted to make a brief annoucement to everyone here about the Folding@Home project. [00:13] For those of you who don't know what Folding@Home is, it's a distributed computing project that was started by Stanford University. [00:14] F@H uses your computer's spare processing power to assist researchers in folding proteins. [00:14] The work that's being done by the F@H project is giving scientists a better understanding of how certain diseases develop, and can lead to cures for diseases such as Parkinson's, Huntington's, Alzheimers, and cancer amoung many others. [00:14] I feel that it's a very worthy project, and I also believe that this project ties in greatly with Ubuntu's philosiphy of giving back to the greater community. [00:15] For some more info on the project or to find out how you can help out, plese drop by our channel at #ubuntu-folding, or check out: [00:15] [LINK] https://help.ubuntu.com/community/FoldingAtHome [00:15] LINK received: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/FoldingAtHome [00:16] and if there's no questions..... [00:16] Is there just one Ubuntu team now? [00:16] drs305: ah, yes! The multiple teams that used to be are now united under Tem Ubuntu :) [00:17] Team Ubuntu** [00:17] ty [00:17] Only thing ya might want to add swoody is mentioning origami installer, very handy. [00:18] yes, thank you starcraftman :) [00:18] There are a number of ways to install the F@H client on your computer. Most of them are very simple (2 commands [00:18] ) and very painless :) [00:19] Anyone want to toss out anything else, or have any questions? [00:19] can you give us the commands? [00:20] to install origami it's simply 'sudo apt-get install origami'... [00:21] then to set it up would be "sudo origami install [-t TEAMNUMBER -u FOLDINGUSER ]" [00:21] For more information on the origami installer (including more advanced options see: [00:21] [LINK] https://help.ubuntu.com/community/FoldingAtHome/origami [00:21] LINK received: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/FoldingAtHome/origami [00:21] ah, thank you starcraftman :) [00:22] and that should be about it then :) [00:22] swoody: no problem, always here to help. [00:22] Cool project swoody , thank you for sharing [00:22] Again, if anyone has any questions, please feel free to drop by #ubuntu-folding [00:22] ty Rocket2DMn :) [00:23] [TOPIC] Remove Beginners Team Calendar [00:23] New Topic: Remove Beginners Team Calendar [00:23] ill run this on both of my computers [00:23] I can talk about this Rocket2DMn [00:23] floor is yours nhandler [00:23] Pretty much, we started using a separate calendar due to the closed nature of the old fridge (and because we had meetings in #ubuntuforums-beginners) [00:23] Now, we use #ubuntu-meeting and the Fridge for our main meetings [00:24] I see it as a waste of time duplicating this on our own calendar that not many people subscribe to [00:24] If there are no objections, I would like to go ahead and get the BT calendar deleted [00:24] nhandler, let's get bodhi's final approval on that before we shut it down [00:25] Rocket2DMn: Of course. But I would like to get a vote at this meeting as well [00:25] is there really any work that goes into it? i dont see any reason why we cant just leave it there for people, such as myself who do use it [00:25] I also use it, perhaps we should just remove it from the wiki page? [00:25] superbenny: Might I ask why you use that instead of the normal Fridge calendar? [00:25] gcal it sends email reminders [00:26] Rocket2DMn: The Fridge is a gcal now [00:26] no idea, that was just the one on the wiki. also, is the fridge cal only bt items? [00:26] link? [00:26] superbenny: No, it has items for all Ubuntu teams [00:26] as of right now, I'm not really involved in much outside of the BT. [00:26] [link] http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendar [00:26] LINK received: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendar [00:26] Long as the fgs and main teem meetings are all consolidated into the fridge calendar I'm fine with it, means no duplication like I get now. [00:26] so it just keeps useless events off of my calendar [00:27] starcraftman: Most FG don't even use the BT calendar. However, I think it would be fine to have them use the Fridge calendar [00:27] now, if there is someone who sits there and devotes more than 10 minutes to it, then its reasonable to delete it, but as far as i'm aware, its just an auto-repeating event every other tuesday [00:28] nhandler, can you schedule events on the fridge calendar that aren't held in this channel? [00:28] in which case, no harm can come from leaving it as-is [00:28] superbenny: As of a few weeks ago, it is auto-repeating. I have no issue leaving it like that. However, I have no plans on correcting it for the few instances we get off schedule (which happen around US holidays and such) [00:28] Rocket2DMn: Yes [00:28] +1 if that is the case superbenny [00:28] Rocket2DMn: For example, we use it for classroom sessions that are in #ubuntu-classroom [00:29] The Doc Team has also used it for meetings in #ubuntu-doc [00:29] ok, shall we put it to a vote then? [00:29] Sure [00:30] are we voting to close it down, or just to remove it from the wiki page? [00:30] Rocket2DMn: I would make the vote to "stop using it". We would start referencing the Fridge on the wiki, and I (and other people) would stop updating the BT calendar [00:31] sounds good to me. [00:31] [VOTE] Stop using the BT Google Calendar and only use The Fridge instead? [00:31] Please vote on: Stop using the BT Google Calendar and only use The Fridge instead?. [00:31] Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to MootBot [00:31] E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #ubuntu-meeting [00:31] +1 [00:31] +1 received from nhandler. 1 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 1 [00:31] +1 [00:31] +1 received from andrew_46. 2 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 2 [00:31] 0 [00:31] +1 [00:31] +1 received from swoody. 3 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 3 [00:31] +1 [00:31] +1 received from starcraftman. 4 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 4 [00:31] +1 [00:31] Rocket2DMn: +0 [00:31] +1 received from Raidsong. 5 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 5 [00:31] +1 [00:31] +1 received from superbenny. 6 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 6 [00:31] +0 [00:31] Abstention received from Rocket2DMn. 6 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 6 [00:32] any more votes? [00:32] +0 [00:32] Abstention received from duanedes1gn. 6 for, 0 against. 2 have abstained. Count is now 6 [00:32] [ENDVOTE] [00:32] Final result is 6 for, 0 against. 2 abstained. Total: 6 [00:33] [AGREED] Stop using BT Google Calendar. Use Fridge instead. [00:33] AGREED received: Stop using BT Google Calendar. Use Fridge instead. [00:33] Just as a note, only BT members should be participating in these votes [00:33] nhandler, you want the action to double check with bodhi and remove it from wiki? [00:33] Rocket2DMn: That is fine [00:34] [ACTION] nhandler to check removal of GCal and remove from wiki [00:34] ACTION received: nhandler to check removal of GCal and remove from wiki [00:34] I'll postpone the next agenda item since bodhi isn't here [00:34] [TOPIC] Drop ##beginners-classroom [00:34] New Topic: Drop ##beginners-classroom [00:34] nhandler, you're up again [00:35] We stopped using ##beginners-classroom in favor of #ubuntu-classroom a while ago [00:35] This is why we did not create a #ubuntu-beginners-classroom when we renamed the team [00:35] As a result, I see no reason to keep this unused channel open, and I propose dropping it [00:36] How do we go about removing it? [00:36] is it just a matter of not referencing it on the wiki anymore? [00:36] Rocket2DMn: Bodhi would do a /msg ChanServ drop ##beginners-classroom [00:36] Rocket2DMn: I'm not even sure if it is referenced still on the wiki [00:36] [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/FocusGroups [00:36] LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/FocusGroups [00:36] it's still listed there [00:37] nhandler: The channel hasn't been used for anything recently? [00:37] swoody: Correct [00:37] We moved to #ubuntu-classroom [00:37] ok, does anybody want to voice any objections? [00:37] nhandler: Ah, I don't forsee any objections then :) [00:38] I got nothing. [00:38] nor do i... [00:38] ok, I don't think we need to vote on that [00:38] that's really a FG decision [00:38] I'll talk to bodhi and get it dropped then [00:39] * nhandler -> dinner [00:39] [ACTION] nhandler to talk to bodhi - remove ##beginners-classroom [00:39] ACTION received: nhandler to talk to bodhi - remove ##beginners-classroom [00:39] [TOPIC] Other [00:39] New Topic: Other [00:39] does anybody have anything else at all they want to discuss? The floor is open. [00:40] Nope. [00:40] Nothing here [00:40] nope [00:40] Okie dokie then, there aren't any padawan nominations, so I think we're finished [00:41] Guess so. [00:41] nobody has any last minute nominations right? [00:41] cool [00:41] Ok, thanks for coming everybody [00:41] #endmeeting [00:41] Meeting finished at 18:41. [00:41] no Rocket2DMn, thank YOU [00:42] now back to watching Star Wars like a true nerd [00:42] Battlestar galactica here [00:42] Yay, BSG, good choice andrew_46 [00:43] hehe...i guess ill just fiddle with my ipod touch... === Ursinha is now known as Ursinha-afk === nellery_ is now known as nellery === [1]superbenny is now known as superbenny === The_Toxic_Mite_ is now known as The_Toxic_Mite === fader|away is now known as fader_ === The_Toxic_Mite_ is now known as The_Toxic_Mite === fader|away is now known as fader_ === jMyles_ is now known as jMyles === fader_ is now known as freenode === freenode is now known as Guest10239 === Guest10239 is now known as fader_ [15:56] * james_w waves [16:00] hi [16:00] * robbiew waves [16:00] #startmeeting [16:00] Meeting started at 10:00. The chair is robbiew. [16:00] Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE] [16:01] Hello! [16:01] hey [16:01] [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FoundationsTeam/Meetings/2009/0812#Agenda [16:01] LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FoundationsTeam/Meetings/2009/0812#Agenda [16:02] morning [16:02] evand: james_w: around? [16:02] me [16:02] hi [16:03] hi [16:04] sorry for the late Agenda...took longer to pull together than I thought :/ [16:04] cjwatson: around? [16:04] hi [16:04] cool [16:04] [TOPIC] Alpha 4 Deliverables [16:04] New Topic: Alpha 4 Deliverables [16:05] looked through the list, and I'm thinking some will be Alpha 5/6 deliverables :P [16:05] or we simply drop them [16:05] unfortunately yes [16:05] cjwatson: cloud setup has a legitimate excuse ;) [16:05] cloud is essential so I don't think we have the luxury of dropping it, but it will be a5 [16:06] okay [16:06] I consider grub2 as done...but there is some work we need to do to help the DX team deliver [16:06] on Boot Experience [16:06] grub2 is only done by a generous interpretation, but you'll be pleased to hear that I just got the zero-delay stuff working [16:06] about fifteen minutes before this meeting [16:06] awesome [16:07] I'm sure sabdfl will be happy as well ;) [16:07] I'll push it out to a5, it's safe for that [16:07] whatever gave you that idea? ;) [16:07] cjwatson: well done [16:07] cjwatson: I assume you need a few days off to recover from writing ia32 assembler? :p [16:07] heh [16:07] fortunately I was just applying somebody else's ia32 assembler [16:08] although by an amazing coincidence I'm off next week [16:08] nice [16:08] yeah...both cjwatson and Keybuk out on the same week [16:09] * Keybuk is around in cases of emergency, I'm only painting [16:09] heh [16:09] Keybuk, house? paintings? [16:09] not much of a holiday then [16:09] * robbiew assumes house [16:09] based on twitter updates [16:09] I'm at home as well [16:10] cjwatson: do you think we can get the blinking cursor removed? [16:10] in grub2 [16:10] as well as the random text stuff that pops up? [16:10] the text is doable, it's on my list - the cursor is actually after grub2 and may involve connivance with the kernel and probably even userspace (to put it back at the end of boot) [16:11] cjwatson: getty already conveniently resets the tty [16:11] ah, that helps [16:11] I was trying to arrange for grub2 to do all the screen setup, but unfortunately that doesn't actually work with Linux the way it is [16:11] see https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/kernel-team/2009-August/006773.html for the gory details [16:12] right, I imagine that would be hard since you'd need GRUB to initialise GL pipelines and shit ;) [16:12] nah [16:12] resets to the *same resolution* once KMS comes up won't be all that hard [16:12] it's just a matter of having some way to display text in the early stages in case everything goes south [16:13] which involves bringing up vesafb, then tearing it down again later [16:13] right, this sounds bad [16:13] I don't think it matters _when_ we set the resolution of the display [16:13] just that we only do it once [16:13] so I'm not sure how much I can do on that in practice, but it's easy to turn the cursor off *somewhere* I'm sure - definitely on my list [16:14] well, GRUB already turns it off [16:14] it's just that it turns it back on again [16:14] cjwatson: ack...thnx [16:14] GRUB turns it off...then kernel turns it back on [16:14] correct? [16:14] are you sure it's GRUB that turns it back on - or if so, if it didn't, wouldn't Linux do so too? it resets the screen itself [16:14] if it's GRUB I will deal with that, anyway [16:15] right, who knows [16:15] ideally nothing would clear the screen until gdm does ;) [16:15] or ?splash [16:15] I mean [16:15] moving the clear screen around in grub is part of fixing the early text [16:15] moving to oblivion in the case that the menu isn't going to be displayed [16:16] at the moment it clears the screen before it knows whether it wants to display the menu or not, so that needs to be rearranged somewhat [16:16] it's all doable anyway, I'm getting the hang of grub :) [16:16] nice ;)...okay need to press on...full agenda today :/ [16:17] slangasek : Multiarch support? Alpha 5..6..defer? [16:18] robbiew: alpha4 was always a fuzzy target IMHO; I wouldn't want to cut it from the release until we absolutely have to, and Guillem is actively working on the dpkg bits now [16:18] cool [16:18] how about I make it Beta? [16:18] ok [16:18] or is that too late [16:18] it's a little late for the package manager to land; so alpha-6 is probably better [16:19] ok [16:19] noted [16:19] and the Power Management Cleanup work? [16:19] I recall mterry working on that [16:19] robbiew, I did some work at the beginning of the cycle, but haven't since. I thought slangasek was doing the keybinding work [16:20] there are a few more power management cleanup bits we can expect to accomplish this cycle, but nothing earth-moving [16:20] since there are still architecture bits missing before we can kill acpi-support completely [16:21] so should we just say Alpha 6 as the deadline to cleanup whatever possible? [16:21] sounds good [16:22] k [16:23] evand: Encrypted Swap...is that done? [16:23] Encrypted swap is just waiting on kirkland to review a patch I have for ecryptfs (he's on vacation). Migration Assistant is turning out to be much more involved than I had initially anticipated, and I'm going to have to defer it to alpha 5/6. [16:24] no worries [16:24] let's put the swap at Alpha 5 [16:24] as for the assistant work....it's okay to defer if you don't think it will happen this cycle [16:24] * robbiew knows it's work evand REALLY wanted to do though [16:25] so I'm fine with Alpha 6....and then reassess deferment then [16:25] ah, that removes quite a bit of stress over it, actually. I'll keep at it full-bore, but noted. [16:26] thanks [16:26] no worries [16:27] * robbiew will need to talk to mvo about the Install updates on Shutdown work (possibly deferrable) and the Robust Python work [16:27] mano [16:27] oh, sorry [16:28] [TOPIC] Missing Milestones [16:28] New Topic: Missing Milestones [16:29] I was under the impression we are already using eglibc in karmic and we only need to take care of fixing any bugs that are found -- was I optimistic? [16:29] liw: I think you're right [16:29] we are using eglibc, yes [16:29] I'll split archive-reorganization into two specs to reflect reality [16:29] cjwatson: cool...thnx [16:29] then they can get a milestone apiece [16:30] liw: at this point, I'm not sure how much a blueprint is needed...since eglibc is already in [16:30] robust python: I believe that Steve, Matthias, and I agreed in Dublin that we would just robustify the individual packages that are deep in dep trees and causing problems, rather than changing the entire stack [16:30] lsb-release comes to mind right now [16:30] but I'd like to confirm that with mvo when we gets back [16:30] s/we/he/ [16:30] robbiew, ok, if you decide it's needed, prod me again [16:30] ack [16:31] liw: no worries...no need to waste time on unnecessary "paperwork" ;) [16:31] slangasek: what did we decide to do about the copyright licenses in packages? [16:31] * robbiew cannot remember :/ [16:32] zsync: I'm waiting for mvo to return (he's really popular now), to get help with the apt part of the implementation (zsync for Packages files); I'm setting up prototypes for using debdelta so we can use either debdelta's own upgrade stuff, or integrate it to apt [16:32] robbiew: I'm to get the DEP text into a respectable state (which it isn't currently), and we're to start using it this cycle [16:32] slangasek, \o/ [16:33] who's actually going to update the packages? liw? [16:33] mterry gets grunt work? [16:33] :P [16:33] uh, what? :) [16:33] robbiew: once it's blessed, we all can update packages as we go [16:33] ah...okay [16:34] I'm good with that [16:34] liw: ack on the Zsync stuff...thnx [16:34] Easier for people that are familiar with the package to know correct copyright lines [16:34] indeed [16:34] nice deflection mterry ;) [16:34] copyrights: starting with packages which maintain in Ubuntu and don't inherit from Debian, presumably, to restrict deltas [16:34] :) [16:34] right [16:35] robbiew, zsync milestone: I doubt before feature-freeze, but I'll provide an apt in a PPA for those who want to use it [16:35] liw: what was decided about the pre-unpacking during downloads? do we run away screaming from that? [16:35] pre-unpacking .debs while more are downloaded: I'm going to talk to mvo about that, too; basically, the only sensible way seems to be to have apt download in instalaltion order and install things in smaller batches whenever it has enough packages (while continuing to download in the background) [16:37] liw: ack [16:37] * robbiew needs to clone mvo :P [16:37] You could always cut him in half and see if he regenerates like a starfish [16:37] I thought that's why he was on leave? [16:38] heh [16:38] [TOPIC] Sponsorship Queue [16:38] New Topic: Sponsorship Queue [16:38] oh, cloning is asexual, my bad [16:39] well...with the Sprint and DebConf....didn't expect much activity there [16:39] * Keybuk wonders whether wanting to clone co-workers counts as asexual harassment [16:39] moving on... [16:39] [TOPIC] Missing Objectives [16:39] New Topic: Missing Objectives [16:39] eh hem [16:40] I put mine in the system because I found it would let me log on again [16:40] ah..okay [16:40] would be nice if the system let ME know :/ [16:40] I can transfer to email if you would like [16:40] I'd recommend at least keeping an email copy [16:40] since the system sucks :P [16:40] good idea :-) === zul_ is now known as zul [16:41] slangasek: evand: also in the "system"? or in the works [16:41] heh [16:41] in the mail^W works :( [16:41] in the works [16:42] no worries [16:42] [TOPIC] Good News [16:42] New Topic: Good News [16:42] robbiew: do we need to put them in the system ourselves if we've sent them to you? [16:42] Keybuk: I think I entered yours, but I need you to hit the "submit" button [16:43] what do you know? it seems to have forgotten them [16:43] heh [16:43] a bit of good news: if this meeting doesn't extend too much, I will be able to celebrate an anniversary [16:43] * ogra wants such a topic in his team meetings !! [16:43] liw: \o/ [16:43] robbiew: there aren't any in there [16:43] is that a hint ;) [16:43] * james_w managed to write C code without getting segfaults [16:43] robbiew, 1 :) [16:44] james_w, \o/ [16:44] james_w, you just use the wrong arch, try again on armel :) [16:44] heh [16:44] Keybuk: odd...I see the ones I put in [16:44] dumb tool [16:44] Keybuk: could you put them in and submit then? [16:45] james_w: I can see yours [16:45] ah [16:45] robbiew: done, they promptly vanished again ;) but now I have no Submit button [16:45] good, I can't find the button to let me put some more in :-) [16:46] * robbiew processed Keybuk and james_w objectives ;) [16:47] is there anyone on the team with C knowledge that would sanity check a patch for me? [16:47] sure [16:47] Keybuk: thanks, I'll put it in a mail [16:47] don't trust Keybuk, though, if he suggests preprocessor magic [16:47] * robbiew knows C...but hasn't written code in a few years :/ [16:48] [TOPIC] AOB [16:48] New Topic: AOB [16:48] * robbiew reminds folks to book travel for LinuxCon and Plumbers [16:48] my booking is with my travel agent [16:48] must be nice to have one of those :/ [16:49] hhe [16:49] robbiew, um, not all of us, I assume? [16:49] no [16:49] lol [16:49] just those who are going [16:49] *phew* [16:49] #endmeeting [16:49] Meeting finished at 10:49. [16:49] 10min early...woohoo! [16:49] :P [16:49] thanks! :) [16:49] * slangasek reserves his seat on the MAX [16:50] thanks all [16:50] thanks. :) [16:50] thank you! === The_Toxic_Mite_ is now known as The_Toxic_Mite === imlad|away is now known as imlad [17:58] hello [17:58] hi! [17:58] hola ! [17:58] * fader_ waves. [17:58] heelo [17:58] meh long day hello [17:59] very long day [18:01] welcome everyone! [18:01] let's start ... [18:02] #startmeeting [18:02] Meeting started at 12:02. The chair is heno. [18:02] Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE] [18:02] agenda as always: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/Meetings [18:03] hope everyone had uneventful travels back from Dublin [18:03] [TOPIC] UbuntuBugDay highlights -- pedro [18:03]