| nhandler | #startmeeting | 00:10 |
|---|---|---|
| MootBot | Meeting started at 18:10. The chair is nhandler. | 00:10 |
| MootBot | Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE] | 00:10 |
| nhandler | [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Meetings | 00:10 |
| MootBot | LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Meetings | 00:10 |
| nhandler | [TOPIC] Issuing the quiz to Padawans | 00:11 |
| MootBot | New Topic: Issuing the quiz to Padawans | 00:11 |
| nhandler | Rocket2DMn: Do you want to discuss this? Or should we defer it until bodhi is around? | 00:11 |
| Rocket2DMn | nhandler, we need to wait for bodhi on that one | 00:11 |
| nhandler | [AGREED] Wait to discuss Issuing the quiz to Padawans until bodhizazen is present | 00:12 |
| MootBot | AGREED received: Wait to discuss Issuing the quiz to Padawans until bodhizazen is present | 00:12 |
| nhandler | [TOPIC AOT] | 00:12 |
| nhandler | [TOPIC] AOT | 00:12 |
| MootBot | New Topic: AOT | 00:12 |
| nhandler | Any other Topics to discuss? | 00:12 |
| yvan300 | why are we the only ones participating? | 00:13 |
| starcraftman | Don't really have anything to add.... | 00:13 |
| pleia2 | I'm here, nothing to add :) | 00:13 |
| y_lee | yeah same here | 00:14 |
| popey | me too | 00:14 |
| swoody | +1 | 00:14 |
| Rocket2DMn | I't pretty typical for late summer to be slow | 00:14 |
| yvan300 | ok | 00:14 |
| nhandler | If there are no other topics to discuss, I would like to give a status update about some outstanding actions that I have been working on | 00:15 |
| nhandler | [TOPIC] Status update on outstanding actions | 00:15 |
| MootBot | New Topic: Status update on outstanding actions | 00:15 |
| nhandler | The ##beginners-classroom channel has now been dropped. All classroom sessions should take place in #ubuntu-beginners | 00:15 |
| yvan300 | nhandler: what do you mean? | 00:15 |
| nhandler | yvan300: About what? | 00:16 |
| pleia2 | nhandler: wow, not in -classroom anymore? | 00:16 |
| pleia2 | er #ubuntu-classroom | 00:16 |
| popey | thats surprising | 00:16 |
| yvan300 | nhandler: outstanding actions topic | 00:16 |
| nhandler | pleia2: That is what I meant, sorry | 00:16 |
| pleia2 | oh good :) | 00:16 |
| popey | :) | 00:16 |
| popey | back to sleep pleia2 :) | 00:16 |
| popey | (and I) | 00:16 |
| pleia2 | hehe | 00:16 |
| starcraftman | oh ok, sounds fine then. | 00:16 |
| nhandler | Thanks for catching that pleia2 | 00:16 |
| pleia2 | np | 00:17 |
| nhandler | yvan300: Outstanding actions are items from previous meeting that people were assigned to take care of | 00:17 |
| yvan300 | nhandler: link | 00:17 |
| nhandler | yvan300: Meeting logs are here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Meetings and the Team Reports are here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/TeamReports | 00:17 |
| nhandler | [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Meetings | 00:18 |
| MootBot | LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Meetings | 00:18 |
| nhandler | [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/TeamReports | 00:18 |
| MootBot | LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/TeamReports | 00:18 |
| nhandler | I have also made some progress on the new mailing lists. An RT request has been filed, and it has been assigned to the appropriate owner. I will continue to follow up with this to ensure the list gets created | 00:19 |
| nhandler | [ACTION] nhandler to follow up on new mailing list creation | 00:19 |
| MootBot | ACTION received: nhandler to follow up on new mailing list creation | 00:19 |
| Rocket2DMn | cool | 00:20 |
| nhandler | Since yvan300 has to go, lets do his membership vote | 00:20 |
| nhandler | [TOPIC] yvan300 membership | 00:20 |
| MootBot | New Topic: yvan300 membership | 00:20 |
| nhandler | yvan300: Care to say a few words about yourself? | 00:20 |
| yvan300 | well, i'm yvan pierre, a young lad who loves programming and helping others | 00:21 |
| nhandler | yvan300: What have you been doing with the Beginners Team? | 00:22 |
| yvan300 | well since i began back in feburary, i spent my time getting to know the team, getting ck linked and helping other whenever i can in ubuntu-beginners-help | 00:22 |
| yvan300 | i also became a part of ubuntu-beginners-ynu so that i can become a better, more polite person over the internet :P | 00:24 |
| nhandler | Anyone else have anything to say, or sould we vote? | 00:24 |
| Rocket2DMn | bring on the vote! | 00:25 |
| swoody | +1 Rocket2DMn | 00:25 |
| nhandler | [VOTE] Should yvan300 become a member of the Ubuntu Beginners Team? | 00:25 |
| MootBot | Please vote on: Should yvan300 become a member of the Ubuntu Beginners Team?. | 00:25 |
| MootBot | Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to MootBot | 00:25 |
| MootBot | E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #ubuntu-meeting | 00:25 |
| nhandler | +0 | 00:25 |
| MootBot | Abstention received from nhandler. 0 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 0 | 00:25 |
| swoody | +1 | 00:25 |
| MootBot | +1 received from swoody. 1 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 1 | 00:25 |
| tim_sharitt | +1 | 00:25 |
| Rocket2DMn | +1 | 00:26 |
| MootBot | +1 received from tim_sharitt. 2 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 2 | 00:26 |
| MootBot | +1 received from Rocket2DMn. 3 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 3 | 00:26 |
| y_lee | +1 | 00:26 |
| MootBot | +1 received from y_lee. 4 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 4 | 00:26 |
| starcraftman | +1 | 00:26 |
| MootBot | +1 received from starcraftman. 5 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 5 | 00:26 |
| nhandler | Any more votes? | 00:27 |
| pleia2 | +1 | 00:28 |
| MootBot | +1 received from pleia2. 6 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 6 | 00:28 |
| nhandler | [ENDVOTE] | 00:28 |
| MootBot | Final result is 6 for, 0 against. 1 abstained. Total: 6 | 00:28 |
| nhandler | Congrats and welcome to the team yvan300 ! | 00:28 |
| yvan300 | nhandler: well met , and thanks everyone :D | 00:28 |
| Rocket2DMn | welcome yvan300 , good to have you on board | 00:28 |
| * starcraftman gives yvan300 his own personalized stuffed squirrel with nut gun as present! | 00:28 | |
| y_lee | congrats yvan300 | 00:28 |
| yvan300 | thank you Rocket2DMn y_lee and tkanks for the squirrel starcraftman :P | 00:29 |
| nhandler | yvan300: You have been added to ~ubuntu-beginners on Launchpad. Be sure to subscribe to the mailing list. You will get voice in #ubuntu-beginners once someone with +f shows up. You are also entitled to a VoteBot factoid. | 00:30 |
| starcraftman | yvan300: your welcome, welcome aboard and have fun. | 00:30 |
| nhandler | [AGREED] yvan300 to join the Ubuntu Beginners Team | 00:30 |
| MootBot | AGREED received: yvan300 to join the Ubuntu Beginners Team | 00:30 |
| starcraftman | now if only bodhi magically appeared, like when I mention Rocket2DMn.... | 00:30 |
| nhandler | So, anything else to discuss tonight? | 00:31 |
| yvan300 | nhandler: ok, i'm gonna check it out now, but anyway i have to go , may be back later, nite team :P | 00:31 |
| swoody | bye yvan300 and welcome again :) | 00:31 |
| nhandler | Good night yvan300, and congratulations! | 00:31 |
| * Rocket2DMn appears | 00:31 | |
| yvan300 | o/ | 00:31 |
| starcraftman | Rocket2DMn: hehe, ya can't appear if ya didn't dissapear first.... then its not magic! | 00:32 |
| nhandler | Are there any FGs that have anything to share with the team? | 00:32 |
| nhandler | Last call for anyone with topics to discuss. Otherwise, we will end this meeting. | 00:34 |
| Rocket2DMn | i think thats it, thanks for hosting nhandler | 00:35 |
| swoody | o/ | 00:35 |
| nhandler | Go ahead swoody | 00:35 |
| swoody | was there something we needed bodhi here for? Are we going to restart the meeting if he does come online? | 00:35 |
| nhandler | swoody: Rocket2DMn's agenda item needed bodhi. We will not restart the meeting though if he shows up later. We will just defer the item until the next meeting | 00:36 |
| swoody | ok sounds good :) | 00:36 |
| starcraftman | LOL! | 00:37 |
| nhandler | Ah, here is bodhi_zazen now ;) | 00:37 |
| swoody | haha | 00:37 |
| nhandler | Rocket2DMn: Want to do your agenda item? | 00:37 |
| Rocket2DMn | ah, he mad eit | 00:37 |
| Rocket2DMn | sure | 00:37 |
| nhandler | [TOPIC] Issuing the quiz to Padawans | 00:37 |
| MootBot | New Topic: Issuing the quiz to Padawans | 00:37 |
| bodhi_zazen | 'lo all | 00:38 |
| bodhi_zazen | can't stay long =) | 00:38 |
| Rocket2DMn | I think the general consensus is that BT members want padawans to continue to be given the ritual quiz | 00:38 |
| Rocket2DMn | if bodhi_zazen wants to share his list of questions with some others authorized to give the quiz, that would take some burden off of him | 00:39 |
| bodhi_zazen | orly ? | 00:39 |
| nhandler | By "authorized", who did you have in mind Rocket2DMn ? | 00:39 |
| Rocket2DMn | idk nhandler , whoever bodhi_zazen wants. It doesn't have to be the council | 00:40 |
| starcraftman | Well I'd have an opinion if I actually saw the quiz. In general, I've never thought quizes to be that essential though, usually its not hard to tell when people meet set requirements for membership. | 00:42 |
| bodhi_zazen | well, I think the current process of mentoring is best | 00:42 |
| Rocket2DMn | starcraftman, it's just sort of a rite of passage :) | 00:43 |
| bodhi_zazen | I think it would be ideal if members would help the new ones integrate into the team | 00:43 |
| swoody | +1 bodhi_zazen | 00:43 |
| Rocket2DMn | agreed bodhi_zazen , but it would still be good to use the quiz to see how much people actually know | 00:43 |
| bodhi_zazen | if that is happening the quiz is almost unnecessary, as it really does not add much | 00:43 |
| swoody | I think a mentor would have a much better feel about a new candidate than a quiz could give us | 00:44 |
| starcraftman | bodhi_zazen: I'm wiht you on mentoring being more important, as I mentioned in the UA meeting I think it could be improved a bit. | 00:44 |
| nhandler | Rocket2DMn: The quiz rarely ended up testing knowledge. It almost always tested personality. Although, we could change that | 00:44 |
| bodhi_zazen | some members (mentors) have been kind enough to review posts on the forms, review wiki pages, etc | 00:44 |
| Rocket2DMn | nhandler, equally important :) | 00:44 |
| bodhi_zazen | If the mentoring program can not be revised we need to re consider much, the whole membership process, re-writing wiki pages , etc | 00:45 |
| bodhi_zazen | so it is not a small decision | 00:45 |
| Rocket2DMn | ok, well i didnt mean for this to be a discussion about the whole membership process | 00:47 |
| Rocket2DMn | I dont think the quiz and Padawan system are mutually exclusive, I think the system works great | 00:47 |
| Rocket2DMn | I just didnt want the quiz to fall by the wayside, as it's been tradition for as long as I've been around | 00:48 |
| bodhi_zazen | I thought we decided to abandon the quiz | 00:48 |
| bodhi_zazen | If not, it is easy to do | 00:48 |
| starcraftman | Rocket2DMn: Well nobody gave to me. | 00:49 |
| nhandler | bodhi_zazen: We dropped it as a requirement for membership | 00:49 |
| bodhi_zazen | I can post the questions if you would like | 00:49 |
| bodhi_zazen | who would like to dish it out ? | 00:49 |
| nhandler | Should it be another individual? Or a team/FG ? | 00:49 |
| bodhi_zazen | that's pretty much abandoning it nhandler =) | 00:49 |
| bodhi_zazen | nhandler: before we go there we would need to decide to bring the quiz back | 00:50 |
| Rocket2DMn | starcraftman, i know, but we're all well aware about your skill level | 00:51 |
| nhandler | [VOTE] Should we revive the quiz? | 00:51 |
| MootBot | Please vote on: Should we revive the quiz?. | 00:51 |
| MootBot | Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to MootBot | 00:51 |
| MootBot | E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #ubuntu-meeting | 00:51 |
| Rocket2DMn | +1 | 00:51 |
| MootBot | +1 received from Rocket2DMn. 1 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 1 | 00:51 |
| bodhi_zazen | 0 | 00:51 |
| nhandler | bodhi_zazen: +0 | 00:52 |
| bodhi_zazen | +0 | 00:52 |
| MootBot | Abstention received from bodhi_zazen. 1 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 1 | 00:52 |
| nhandler | +1 | 00:52 |
| MootBot | +1 received from nhandler. 2 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 2 | 00:52 |
| y_lee | +1 | 00:52 |
| MootBot | +1 received from y_lee. 3 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 3 | 00:52 |
| starcraftman | +0 | 00:52 |
| MootBot | Abstention received from starcraftman. 3 for, 0 against. 2 have abstained. Count is now 3 | 00:52 |
| swoody | +1 | 00:52 |
| MootBot | +1 received from swoody. 4 for, 0 against. 2 have abstained. Count is now 4 | 00:52 |
| Snova | +0 | 00:52 |
| MootBot | Abstention received from Snova. 4 for, 0 against. 3 have abstained. Count is now 4 | 00:52 |
| nhandler | Any more votes? | 00:53 |
| bodhi_zazen | No clear direction there, a trend =) | 00:54 |
| nhandler | [ENDVOTE] | 00:54 |
| MootBot | Final result is 4 for, 0 against. 3 abstained. Total: 4 | 00:54 |
| bodhi_zazen | masters can let me know when people are ready for a little quiz then | 00:54 |
| bodhi_zazen | anyone interested in administering the quiz, let me know | 00:55 |
| nhandler | Maybe we could discuss this on the mailing list? | 00:55 |
| bodhi_zazen | I would probably like to watch one or two =) | 00:55 |
| bodhi_zazen | mailing list is all but dead =) | 00:55 |
| bodhi_zazen | almost no one uses it for "discussion" | 00:55 |
| nhandler | Then send something to it and make it active ;) | 00:55 |
| starcraftman | hehe | 00:55 |
| nhandler | The few discussions we have had got pretty good responses | 00:55 |
| nhandler | People are just hesitant to start them | 00:55 |
| bodhi_zazen | If you like | 00:56 |
| Snova | I have a few things I would say, but nothing I can say immediately; I shall probably post something later. | 00:56 |
| bodhi_zazen | I am going to have to run | 00:56 |
| Rocket2DMn | mailing lists dont have to be extremely active to be useful :) | 00:56 |
| starcraftman | later bodhi_zazen | 00:56 |
| Rocket2DMn | thanks bodhi_zazen , see you later | 00:56 |
| bodhi_zazen | My only issue is to see they mentoring program revitalized | 00:56 |
| bodhi_zazen | I think that is much more important, really | 00:57 |
| starcraftman | bodhi_zazen: agreed. | 00:57 |
| bodhi_zazen | IMO the quiz is secondary | 00:57 |
| Rocket2DMn | agreed | 00:57 |
| nhandler | Would someone like to take the action to start some discussion about this topic on the ML ? | 00:57 |
| Rocket2DMn | is it needed nhandler ? | 00:57 |
| Rocket2DMn | i can if you want | 00:57 |
| nhandler | I think we should get some more discussion on this topic | 00:57 |
| nhandler | Thanks Rocket2DMn | 00:58 |
| nhandler | [ACTION] Rocket2DMn to start discussion on mailing list about quiz/mentoring program | 00:58 |
| MootBot | ACTION received: Rocket2DMn to start discussion on mailing list about quiz/mentoring program | 00:58 |
| nhandler | Anything else to talk about, or can we end the meeting? | 00:58 |
| starcraftman | nhandler: I'll add too later, I just remembered an idea I had at UA meeting. Sometime, wanna relax a bit first.... | 00:58 |
| nhandler | Ok, thanks for coming everyone. The next meeting will take place on Tuesday, September 8, 2009 at 23:00 UTC in #ubuntu-meeting | 01:00 |
| nhandler | [ENDMEETING] | 01:00 |
| nhandler | #ENDMEETING | 01:00 |
| MootBot | Meeting finished at 19:00. | 01:00 |
| starcraftman | thanks for chairing nhandler, appreciated of course :) | 01:00 |
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| robbiew | #startmeeting | 16:00 |
| MootBot | Meeting started at 10:00. The chair is robbiew. | 16:00 |
| MootBot | Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE] | 16:00 |
| * slangasek waves | 16:00 | |
| james_w | hi | 16:00 |
| al-maisan | hello | 16:00 |
| liw | yo | 16:00 |
| * mvo waves | 16:00 | |
| evand | hi | 16:01 |
| robbiew | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/FoundationsTeam/Meetings/2009/0826#Agenda | 16:02 |
| MootBot | LINK received: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/FoundationsTeam/Meetings/2009/0826#Agenda | 16:02 |
| robbiew | cjwatson: Keybuk: around? | 16:02 |
| Keybuk | yup | 16:03 |
| cjwatson | hi | 16:04 |
| robbiew | [TOPIC] Karmic Feature Freeze Exceptions | 16:04 |
| MootBot | New Topic: Karmic Feature Freeze Exceptions | 16:04 |
| robbiew | who needs'em? | 16:04 |
| mvo | I will need one for app-center | 16:04 |
| mvo | eh, software-store | 16:04 |
| Keybuk | do I need them if I set the spec for beta in the first place? :) | 16:04 |
| mvo | (thats the new name) | 16:04 |
| robbiew | mvo: heh...no hyphen (-) | 16:05 |
| robbiew | Keybuk: uh, I believe so | 16:05 |
| mvo | and maybe for compiz, there is rumor of a new upstream release (0.8.4) | 16:05 |
| robbiew | mvo: why are you still doing compiz? | 16:05 |
| Keybuk | robbiew: then I'll file bugs like last time ;-) | 16:05 |
| cjwatson | I uploaded an initial version of cloud installer support to the archive today; it's quite incomplete in some ways, specifically it doesn't yet generate the preseed file for the node. However, it does have the basic avahi stuff in place | 16:05 |
| robbiew | Keybuk: ack | 16:05 |
| mvo | robbiew: don't ask | 16:05 |
| robbiew | cjwatson: okay | 16:06 |
| robbiew | mvo: hmmm | 16:06 |
| * robbiew will take compiz stuff offline | 16:06 | |
| cjwatson | on GRUB2, I'm still working with upstream on some of the backward compat details (specifically making sure that it doesn't completely break people who forgot to run grub-install after update-grub); it's looking very promising though, and if the remaining bits are considered a feature I'd like an exception for them | 16:06 |
| james_w | might need one to get the last of the new launchpadlib in place, blocked on python-oauth being suitable for main | 16:06 |
| james_w | plus, bzr | 16:07 |
| mvo | robbiew: seriously, there is some stuff in git that looks pretty useful, fixes and the infamouse crasher that has so many dupes that it makes LP timeout :) | 16:07 |
| cjwatson | upstream would like us to get the grub 1.97 release into karmic if at all possible; I'll upload a fresh snapshot before feature freeze, and from then on it should be primarily bug fixes | 16:07 |
| cjwatson | a current snapshot will have some basic auth support, which I know is a requirement from some quarters | 16:07 |
| robbiew | mvo: sure...I just think the desktop team should handle it...but I'm fine with you helping, if it doesn't impact other work ;) | 16:07 |
| mvo | *cough* | 16:07 |
| robbiew | james_w: ack | 16:07 |
| robbiew | cjwatson: okay...thnx | 16:08 |
| slangasek | cjwatson: are we going to be pulling in grub2 by default on upgrade to karmic? I thought that was planned at UDS, but would've expected it to land by now if so | 16:08 |
| cjwatson | slangasek: I thought we explicitly decided against that | 16:09 |
| slangasek | hmm, not what I had remembered :) | 16:09 |
| slangasek | but ok | 16:09 |
| james_w | I also have the MIR and seed changes for kerneloops to complete once it's out of binary NEW | 16:09 |
| cjwatson | the spec is fairly explicit about this | 16:09 |
| slangasek | (we spent an awful lot of time in that session spec'ing out how to make the upgrade flawless) | 16:09 |
| cjwatson | the upgrade is relatively smooth, and that's a useful feature, but I don't think that implies that we should inflict it on everyone | 16:10 |
| robbiew | +1 | 16:10 |
| robbiew | imho, it's a bit dangerous to simply force folks | 16:10 |
| cjwatson | Kickstart: preseedable LVM-on-RAID is done and will land today as soon as the sync is available from Debian, and that's by far the most useful bit; I'm fighting with adding RAID support to Kickstart as well, and think I should have that done by FF | 16:11 |
| cjwatson | I would like to defer iSCSI support in Kickstart, sorry | 16:11 |
| slangasek | I may be biased having dealt with update-grub, but I disagree there :) | 16:12 |
| robbiew | cjwatson: no problem on the deferal | 16:12 |
| cjwatson | I know update-grub is horrible, but it basically works for several million people | 16:12 |
| robbiew | is there a way to ask people during a dist upgrade if they want to keep grub or switch to grub2? | 16:13 |
| cjwatson | I'd like to consider that in karmic+1 | 16:13 |
| james_w | oh yeah, slangasek feature freeze is midnight tonight, is that correct? | 16:13 |
| cjwatson | the only way would really be extra UI in update-manager | 16:13 |
| robbiew | ok | 16:13 |
| slangasek | james_w: yes | 16:14 |
| james_w | cool | 16:14 |
| evand | one debconf question closer to becoming Debian :) | 16:14 |
| cjwatson | well, or maybe have grub legacy depend on grub2 and ask a debconf question | 16:14 |
| cjwatson | but honestly I'd rather not muck about with it now | 16:14 |
| robbiew | I'm just thinking that the boot experience work relies heavily on grub2 being installed | 16:14 |
| mvo | python-packaging> other than some talk with debian I have not put a lot of work into it, there is some proposal work on the debian side, I hope we can use that. in the meantime we should change the crritial stuff to use DH_PYCENTRAL=include-links | 16:15 |
| cjwatson | it's much more of a priority for that to work perfectly on fresh installs, isn't it? | 16:15 |
| cjwatson | maybe computer-janitor could offer to switch things over ...? | 16:15 |
| slangasek | priorities> agreed, certainly | 16:15 |
| robbiew | yep...not worried about it...just making a note | 16:15 |
| robbiew | we can simply include something in the release notes about it | 16:15 |
| slangasek | I was just confused becuase the spec didn't match how I remembered the outcome of the session | 16:15 |
| robbiew | cjwatson: hmm...that's a good idea | 16:16 |
| robbiew | liw: ? | 16:16 |
| liw | cjwatson, janitor suggesting grub2 if grub is installed: that should work fine | 16:16 |
| robbiew | slangasek: stay off the drugs | 16:16 |
| robbiew | lol | 16:16 |
| cjwatson | if I misremembered the session while writing the notes, well, that's possible and if so I'm sorry - but at this point it's an error that was left to stand for several months, and so (as you say) it really ought to have landed by now already | 16:16 |
| liw | cjwatson, it'd be easy to do, if it's enough to just install the grub2 package -- is that enough? | 16:16 |
| cjwatson | liw: there's a post-reboot step, which is a little non-trivial | 16:17 |
| cjwatson | you install grub2 (actually grub-pc), do a test reboot which chainloads through grub to grub2, and if that worked you run upgrade-from-grub-legacy | 16:17 |
| robbiew | evand: before I forget, will you need an FFE for the Migration Assistant stuff? | 16:17 |
| liw | cjwatson, hm, then it's not so easy, but let's discuss that later | 16:17 |
| cjwatson | ideally, the last ought to be hooked up to a notification or something | 16:17 |
| evand | robbiew: I'm actually keen to defer that. I don't think it's feasible to get it in reasonable enough shape, and get it tested by release, while making sure my others specs don't suffer as a result. | 16:18 |
| mvo | sounds like we want a post-upgrade hook for this | 16:18 |
| robbiew | [ACTION] liw and cjwatson to discuss possibility of moving users to grub2 via computer janitor | 16:18 |
| MootBot | ACTION received: liw and cjwatson to discuss possibility of moving users to grub2 via computer janitor | 16:18 |
| robbiew | evand: no problem...deferred! ;) | 16:19 |
| robbiew | [ACTION] robbiew to defer Migration Assistant | 16:19 |
| MootBot | ACTION received: robbiew to defer Migration Assistant | 16:19 |
| evand | everything else is in good shape and either in place or awaiting archive processing. | 16:19 |
| robbiew | cool | 16:19 |
| robbiew | slangasek: Multiarch Support....I feel a deferral coming :P | 16:20 |
| slangasek | "ask again later" | 16:20 |
| robbiew | lol | 16:20 |
| Keybuk | slangasek: but it's FF today! :D | 16:20 |
| mterry | :) | 16:20 |
| slangasek | there's still slow progress; I don't have a sense yet of whether it's going to come together in time, because development is so bursty | 16:21 |
| robbiew | I think we gave it a week (or two) past FF | 16:21 |
| slangasek | I have a bit that I'm working on for dpkg right now which I hope to get to guillem today/tomorrow | 16:21 |
| robbiew | so I'll keep asking ;) | 16:21 |
| slangasek | yeah :) | 16:21 |
| slangasek | but the bit I'm working on is a relatively small piece | 16:21 |
| robbiew | mvo: is there anything waiting on us for the Distribution Upgrade Testing work by the QA team? | 16:21 |
| slangasek | we're still missing, um... the database changes to handle multiple arch packages, and the dep resolver changes to DTRT with multiarch packages | 16:22 |
| mvo | robbiew: I'm not aware of anythin | 16:22 |
| mvo | g | 16:22 |
| robbiew | mvo: cool | 16:22 |
| robbiew | Keybuk: have you even looked at the RAM /tmpfs stuff? :P | 16:23 |
| Keybuk | robbiew: yes | 16:23 |
| robbiew | oh..cool | 16:23 |
| Keybuk | and I uncovered pretty serious bugs in the kernel's virtual memory system | 16:23 |
| Keybuk | that made me want to go away and hide | 16:23 |
| robbiew | lol | 16:23 |
| Keybuk | it looks like they'll be fixed for .32 or .33 or so | 16:24 |
| Keybuk | RAM /tmpfs depends on growable swap, which depends on swapfiles, etc. | 16:24 |
| cjwatson | what were the bugs? | 16:24 |
| Keybuk | it turns out that the kernel has some major issues when it nears the top of available virtual memory | 16:24 |
| Keybuk | cjwatson: kernel refuses to sacrifice any page cache | 16:24 |
| robbiew | translation: deferred! | 16:24 |
| robbiew | lol | 16:24 |
| Keybuk | kernel refuses to swap contents of tmpfs | 16:24 |
| robbiew | Keybuk: do you have bug numbers for the kernel stuff? | 16:25 |
| Keybuk | if you have a swap file, kernel goes into a loop of paging things in and out of it | 16:25 |
| Keybuk | if you don't have a swap file, kernel OOMs just about every process | 16:25 |
| Keybuk | and for luck, it often PANICs | 16:25 |
| cjwatson | oh, lovely | 16:25 |
| Keybuk | robbiew: lkml posts | 16:25 |
| cjwatson | yeah, I'm in no rush to tickle that kind of bug | 16:25 |
| robbiew | Keybuk: cool...I'll go and look...or you can send me a pointer ;) | 16:26 |
| Keybuk | robbiew: will dig up the discussion | 16:27 |
| robbiew | thank you sir! | 16:27 |
| robbiew | [TOPIC] Archive Admin help | 16:27 |
| MootBot | New Topic: Archive Admin help | 16:27 |
| robbiew | so there was a bit of a backlog for some Eucalyptus related work | 16:28 |
| robbiew | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EucalyptusInMainSpec/Packages | 16:28 |
| robbiew | thanks to james_w for helping | 16:28 |
| robbiew | I'm just bringing it up for those with the AA "power" and who have some time to help | 16:29 |
| cjwatson | I think my eucalyptus-related time is better used completing the installer work | 16:29 |
| cjwatson | though I'm happy to do small reactive things on request | 16:29 |
| robbiew | cjwatson: +100 | 16:29 |
| cjwatson | one man, 100 votes | 16:30 |
| slangasek | AA - I'm confused, wasn't the backlog on the MIR side? | 16:30 |
| slangasek | or are those sorted and we're on to component mismatches? | 16:30 |
| cjwatson | the MIR team asked for some archive admins to help out with the reviews | 16:30 |
| cjwatson | particularly for those packages that didn't come from Debian | 16:31 |
| slangasek | oh | 16:31 |
| robbiew | [TOPIC] Sponsorship Queue | 16:32 |
| MootBot | New Topic: Sponsorship Queue | 16:32 |
| robbiew | everyone's favorite! | 16:32 |
| * mterry relaxes | 16:32 | |
| dholbach | more sponsoring ... please! | 16:33 |
| dholbach | and please add yourselves to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/CodeReviews | 16:33 |
| dholbach | thanks | 16:33 |
| mterry | :) dholbach has an IRC alert for 'sponsorship' | 16:33 |
| robbiew | lol | 16:33 |
| slangasek | I think it's just 'sposn' | 16:33 |
| dholbach | mterry: coincidence :) | 16:33 |
| slangasek | 'spons' | 16:33 |
| robbiew | mdz watches the numbers like a hawk | 16:33 |
| robbiew | which translates to emails to me...and you all get the rest | 16:34 |
| liw | in a normal company we would say it flows downwards -- in Ubuntu, it's a floodfill algorithm? | 16:35 |
| robbiew | heh | 16:35 |
| robbiew | in a "normal" company, we would say the $#!t rolls downwards ;) | 16:36 |
| Keybuk | for the record, I actually tried to do some sponsorship this week | 16:36 |
| robbiew | whoa! | 16:36 |
| Keybuk | but cjwatson had STOLEN the opportunity | 16:36 |
| robbiew | sure....sure ;) | 16:36 |
| Keybuk | clearly he has too much free time on his hands ;) | 16:36 |
| robbiew | [TOPIC] Good News | 16:36 |
| MootBot | New Topic: Good News | 16:36 |
| cjwatson | so pick a different package :) | 16:37 |
| Keybuk | it was a package I was bug contact for and *everything* :D | 16:37 |
| robbiew | Keybuk "tried" to do some sponsorship this week! | 16:37 |
| cjwatson | which, automake1.10? | 16:37 |
| Keybuk | aye | 16:37 |
| al-maisan | My first bzr-builddeb branch landed :) | 16:37 |
| robbiew | whoohoo! | 16:37 |
| cjwatson | I was doing sponsorship in my calendar-reserved hour for sponsorship ;-) | 16:37 |
| * robbiew is REALLY close to an Austin, TX Platform sprint :P | 16:38 | |
| evand | speaking of events, do we have a definite location for UDS yet? | 16:38 |
| robbiew | that's probably only good news to me :D | 16:38 |
| robbiew | eh hem | 16:38 |
| cjwatson | the last two times I went to Austin, Global Bad Stuff happened | 16:38 |
| Keybuk | evand: "definitely not anywhere but one particular place, but not definitely there" :) | 16:38 |
| cjwatson | so, you know, pay up on those insurance premiums | 16:38 |
| evand | lol | 16:38 |
| evand | what happened? | 16:39 |
| slangasek | good news: ucf should be a little less painful now | 16:39 |
| cjwatson | the first was 9-16 September 2001 | 16:39 |
| liw | slangasek, oh? | 16:39 |
| cjwatson | the second was when Bush gave his ultimatum to Iraq | 16:39 |
| mvo | slangasek: wehhh - that is great news | 16:39 |
| mterry | cjwatson, stay away | 16:39 |
| slangasek | Keybuk: have you sponsored the bug that's in the sponsorship queue and has been assigned to you since March? :) | 16:39 |
| Keybuk | slangasek: there's a bug assigned to me? :) | 16:39 |
| slangasek | liw: three-way-merge failure: debconf prompt, then drop back to menu, instead of exit !0 | 16:40 |
| slangasek | Keybuk: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/acpid/+bug/285531 | 16:40 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 285531 in acpid "acpid initscript speedup" [Wishlist,Triaged] | 16:40 |
| cjwatson | your last comment is " | 16:40 |
| cjwatson | Sorry, missed this one being assigned to me - will look in karmic | 16:40 |
| * mvo hugs slangasek | 16:40 | |
| cjwatson | " | 16:40 |
| robbiew | FEEL THE LOVE! | 16:40 |
| Keybuk | slangasek: nope ;-) | 16:40 |
| * slangasek snorts | 16:40 | |
| slangasek | Keybuk: oh, "nope" you haven't sponsored it, rather than "nope" it's not assigned to you... ok :) | 16:41 |
| Keybuk | wow, I can actually view my LP bugs page today | 16:41 |
| liw | slangasek, that _is_ good news | 16:41 |
| cjwatson | slangasek: ucf> that's excellent | 16:41 |
| Keybuk | it's been doing TIMEOUT ERROR! for days | 16:41 |
| cjwatson | ucf is still used for grub2, btw, just not for the whole configuration file | 16:41 |
| Keybuk | do we even still use acpid? :) | 16:41 |
| liw | my best attempt at good news is that I have looked at C++ code and I am not entirely crazxze5rqw34wvqw345234 | 16:41 |
| slangasek | yeah, there were lots of other bug reports about this bit of ucf badness happening with other packages | 16:42 |
| cjwatson | acpid is no longer installed by default, but it was installed by default up to jaunty | 16:42 |
| slangasek | Keybuk: sadly, until we can completely rid ourselves of acpi-support, yes | 16:42 |
| slangasek | cjwatson: no, acpi-support still pulls it in | 16:42 |
| cjwatson | or is it still? | 16:42 |
| slangasek | it's just not seeded | 16:42 |
| cjwatson | bah | 16:42 |
| cjwatson | the installer no longer has explicit code to separately install it by default, then :-) | 16:42 |
| slangasek | right :) | 16:42 |
| robbiew | [TOPIC] AOB | 16:43 |
| MootBot | New Topic: AOB | 16:43 |
| robbiew | cjwatson: could you hit "submit" on your objectives...so I can avoid HR nastygrams :P | 16:43 |
| cjwatson | oh, sorry, I forgot that was on me | 16:44 |
| robbiew | no worries | 16:44 |
| cjwatson | wilco | 16:44 |
| robbiew | anything else? | 16:44 |
| robbiew | once.... | 16:44 |
| robbiew | twice.... | 16:44 |
| robbiew | #endmeeting | 16:44 |
| MootBot | Meeting finished at 10:44. | 16:45 |
| robbiew | thanks! | 16:45 |
| james_w | thanks all | 16:45 |
| Keybuk | cjwatson: you *so* wouldn't say "wilco" there :-) | 16:45 |
| al-maisan | Thank you! | 16:45 |
| mvo | thanks | 16:45 |
| slangasek | thanks, all | 16:45 |
| evand | thanks | 16:45 |
| liw | thanks | 16:46 |
| cjwatson | Keybuk: roger that | 16:47 |
| * Keybuk sighs and hands cjwatson a copy of http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/cap413.pdf | 16:48 | |
| cjwatson | simply means "will comply", no? | 16:48 |
| Keybuk | yeah, but when given an instruction you read back the instruction | 16:49 |
| Keybuk | <me> "G-VT holding alpha, ready for departure" | 16:49 |
| Keybuk | <tower> "G-VT take off at your discretion" | 16:49 |
| Keybuk | <me> "take off G-VT" | 16:49 |
| Keybuk | etc. | 16:49 |
| Keybuk | and I'm just being a tiring geek pedant for amusment purposes ;-) | 16:50 |
| Keybuk | wilco is more for replying to suggestions or requests | 16:51 |
| marjo | #startmeeting | 18:00 |
| MootBot | Meeting started at 12:00. The chair is marjo. | 18:00 |
| MootBot | Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE] | 18:00 |
| marjo | Hi folks! | 18:00 |
| pedro_ | hello everybody! | 18:00 |
| davmor2 | hello | 18:00 |
| marjo | Agenda | 18:00 |
| marjo | Ubuntu Bug Day - Pedor | 18:00 |
| marjo | Pedro | 18:01 |
| marjo | SRU testing - sbeattie | 18:01 |
| bdmurray | Hi | 18:01 |
| * fader waves | 18:01 | |
| sbeattie | Hey | 18:01 |
| pedro_ | I have a short announcement too, forgot to add it to the agenda | 18:01 |
| marjo | OK | 18:01 |
| marjo | [TOPIC] Ubuntu Bug Day - Pedro | 18:02 |
| MootBot | New Topic: Ubuntu Bug Day - Pedro | 18:02 |
| pedro_ | Last week we celebrated a bug day based on Rhythmbox: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBugDay/20090820 | 18:02 |
| pedro_ | ~53 bugs were triaged , thanks a lot to Kamus and Scifly for their work | 18:03 |
| pedro_ | and continuing with the multimedia apps | 18:03 |
| pedro_ | Tomorrow we are going to have a bug day based on Totem: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBugDay/20090827 | 18:04 |
| pedro_ | so again if you have some time during the day please join us and help your lovely Ubuntu project ;-) | 18:04 |
| bdmurray | pedro_: speaking of totem have you seen many symptom based bug reports come in? | 18:05 |
| pedro_ | bdmurray, mm nop | 18:06 |
| marjo | anything else Pedro? | 18:07 |
| davmor2 | bdmurray: to be fair though I've found totem in karmic to be pretty stable. | 18:07 |
| pedro_ | marjo, nope that's all from me | 18:07 |
| bdmurray | dang! ;-) | 18:07 |
| marjo | [TOPIC] SRU testing - sbeattie | 18:07 |
| MootBot | New Topic: SRU testing - sbeattie | 18:07 |
| sbeattie | SRU activity over the past week has been pretty light, probably due to vacations and the rush for karmic's feature freeze. | 18:08 |
| sbeattie | SRU Activity for the past week (since 2009-08-19): | 18:08 |
| sbeattie | * jaunty: 4 new -proposed packages (gitosis, packagekit-gnome, tzdata, zabbix), 1 pushed to -updates (tzdata) | 18:08 |
| sbeattie | * intrepid: 1 new -proposed package (tzdata), also pushed to updates, kernel for intrepid-proposed is pending | 18:08 |
| sbeattie | * hardy: 5 new -proposed packages (compiz-fusion-bcop, ganeti, linux, tzdata, zabbix), 1 pushed to -updates (tzdata) | 18:08 |
| sbeattie | * dapper: 1 new -proposed package (langpack-locales), also pushed to -updates (same timezone issue as tzdata packages) | 18:08 |
| sbeattie | Thanks to sothis, Benjamin Geer, and Tico for testing SRU fixes this week. | 18:08 |
| sbeattie | As always, help in testing out SRU fixes in the various -proposed pockets would be appreciated. | 18:09 |
| marjo | Thx sbeattie; anything else? | 18:09 |
| sbeattie | That's it on the SRU front. | 18:10 |
| marjo | pedro: you had an announcement to make? | 18:10 |
| pedro_ | ah yes just a quick one | 18:10 |
| pedro_ | this Friday - August 28th Daniel T Chen (dtchen) is going to give a talk about How to Triage Sounds Bugs on Ubuntu | 18:11 |
| bdmurray | great! | 18:11 |
| davmor2 | pedro_: where? | 18:11 |
| pedro_ | time? 2200 UTC at #ubuntu-classroom | 18:11 |
| pedro_ | http://blog.qa.ubuntu.com/node/64 | 18:12 |
| MootBot | LINK received: http://blog.qa.ubuntu.com/node/64 | 18:12 |
| pedro_ | i know that a few people is suffering audio issues with Karmic, so it might be worth to go there and learn more about the audio stack | 18:12 |
| pedro_ | and what the developers are looking in order to fix those bugs, etc | 18:12 |
| marjo | thx Pedro; anything else | 18:12 |
| Daviey | #ubuntu-classroom | 18:13 |
| pedro_ | marjo, that was it :-) | 18:13 |
| marjo | [TOPIC] Any other topics from anyone? | 18:13 |
| MootBot | New Topic: Any other topics from anyone? | 18:13 |
| bdmurray | I wanted to mention something | 18:13 |
| marjo | ok | 18:14 |
| bdmurray | I added a script to ubuntu bugpatterns called search bugs which allows you to run a pattern against a package bug list | 18:14 |
| bdmurray | This is useful for cleaning up duplicates after the pattern has been written | 18:14 |
| pedro_ | great! | 18:15 |
| marjo | thx bdmurray; anything else? | 18:15 |
| bdmurray | I've done quite a few but there are a few duplicates of some of the kernel patterns that could use some cleanup. | 18:15 |
| bdmurray | marjo: that's all | 18:16 |
| sbeattie | bdmurray: awesome, that sounds quite useful. | 18:16 |
| marjo | any other new topics? | 18:16 |
| marjo | ok folks, if no other topics, we're done | 18:17 |
| marjo | thx for attending & see you next time! | 18:17 |
| marjo | #endmeeting | 18:17 |
| MootBot | Meeting finished at 12:17. | 18:17 |
| pedro_ | thanks! | 18:17 |
| davmor2 | thanks bye | 18:17 |
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| trinium | 1 | 19:44 |
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